madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[cork_OS]

I'd rather see improvements to NGU, and sweet additions like antialiasing, temporal denoising, line darkening and Avisynth scripts with automatic profiling.
Do want!

[ryrynz]

When the average madVR user starts using Avisynth processing filters and madshi adds inbuilt madVR configs for them for ease of use, things are gonna go nuts.
Just using the GPU won't sometimes be enough, we're already seeing the best cards taxed to the limit with UHD content, this will allow people to get the most from their systems combined processing power.

[thighhighs]

I think for more power need SLI\CF support. Sometimes someone ask about it. madshi say on avsforum, he can implement multi-gpu support, but it very low in priority list. So...

Regarding avisynth, some video players like potplayer (and kmp mb, idk), support avs scripts. You can configure player profiles based on source fps, resolution, fourCC and more.
sr for bad eng

[d3rd3vil]

Like just about everything open standard will prevail, HDR10+ will drop Dolby Vision into near obscurity.
I'd rather see improvements to NGU, and sweet additions like antialiasing, temporal denoising, line darkening and Avisynth scripts with automatic profiling.

Thats pure speculation from top to bottom for next year. Almost no TV even has HDR10+ support and there are no movies with it, nothing. It might and probably will fight Dolby Vision but who knows. And if there is no DV support for PC software there wont be for HDR10+ unless its a lot easier to implement only god knows why. But it would be nice to somehow passthrough DV to the DV capable tvs. On the other hand is that even possible to activate the tvs mediaplayer or DV engine via PC?

[AngelGraves13]

Thats pure speculation from top to bottom for next year. Almost no TV even has HDR10+ support and there are no movies with it, nothing. It might and probably will fight Dolby Vision but who knows. And if there is no DV support for PC software there wont be for HDR10+ unless its a lot easier to implement only god knows why. But it would be nice to somehow passthrough DV to the DV capable tvs. On the other hand is that even possible to activate the tvs mediaplayer or DV engine via PC?

Passthrough should work...but I haven't tried it myself as I don't have a TV that supports DV.

[VAMET]

Dear Friends

What is the best player, which is working with madVR (from recommended list) in your opinion?

Sincerely

[nussman]

What is the best player, which is working with madVR (from recommended list) in your opinion?

:readrule:

[BetA13]

id say MPC-HC and Potplayer..i prefeer MPC-HC...

[rancorx2]

hi,
does anyone know how to avoid the video from freezing after pausing for a while and then trying to resume it?

doesn't happen on evr but whenever i pause a video when madvr is the renderer, playback does not resume or takes a few minutes for the video to continue, the audio plays but not the video straight away, most of the time i have to close mpc and reopen the video.

[el Filou]

I'd rather see improvements to NGU, and sweet additions like antialiasing, temporal denoising, line darkening and Avisynth scripts with automatic profiling.Also D3D11VA deinterlacing? Pretty pleaaase? :o :)

[plasma]

So I upgraded from win 10 home to win 10 pro and now I have huge performance issues. Not sure if it is cause by madvr or some other component. If I enable svp+madvr it stutters with like 1 fps altho gpu and cpu are working properly. If I disable svp it is smooth (aka 24 fps) but render times per frame are still very high. If I use my mouse scroll to change loudness the framerate tanks again just because of the small volume overlay I assume.

Have already reinstalled mpc-hc.

It is not cause by gpu or cpu power settings or anything similar and with madvr I have not enabled anything just bicubic, so this is not the reason.

[Asmodian]

Have you reinstalled your GPU drivers too? How do you know it isn’t gpu power settings, already on adaptive?

[takenori]

i know peoples here probably using tvs as their main display,
but is there any viable 4khdr monitor thats already on the market, preferrably uinder 1500usd? and how does it performs in terms of movie and video playback compared to tvs?
i want to use madvr features fully

[ryrynz]

https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2017/4/21/15384614/dell-ultrasharp-up2718q-monitor-4k-hdr-hdr10 might be worth a look.

[GCRaistlin]

Which version of AMD driver is currently the best for madVR / Win8.1 / HD7850?
I don't know.

I mean is there any known issue like http://bugs.madshi.net/view.php?id=431?

[chros]

I started to fool around with UHD BD encodes (x265 10bit HDR10) on my 3dlut calibrated SD setup (see my signature below) and I realized that I don't understand a lot of things about how it works. (Please bear with me, I don't have the necessary hardware to play with them, and I didn't find any useful article about this.)

The HDR10 mandatory layer plays just as well, and if you don't have a 12bits display or content handling ICtCp (which UHD Bluray doesn't) the differences are minimal.
...
Given the excellent quality of MadVR's dithering, I suspect the PQ difference from the higher bit depth (especially from a 1080p layer) would be close to nil. And dynamic metadata makes a bigger difference on low-end displays (those with a limited native contrast).

1. Data
Picture data is stored as bt.2020 (???) 10bit 4:2:0, or just or DCI-P3 in a bt.2020 container (???), resulting in a washed out picture.
- Wait, what????! Washed out picture?
- so, how does a true red become some greyish color when it's stored?
- I thought we have a truly increased color space compared to bt.709. Is it similar cheating as with those old anamorphic DVDs? :)
How does the static HDR10 metadata look like?
- is it stored in the beginning of the hevc video data?
- is it just couple of properties (bytes) about the mastering attributes and picture levels and "that's it"?

2. Processing
Splitter and decoder pass data to renderer (MadVR) for further processing:
- that probably happens in the "limited washed out pictures" world
- then either passthrough or HDR processing happens (for SD displays)
-- what does bt.2020 -> DCI-P3 means in OSD?

3. Displaying via passtrhough
Let's suppose that I understand how to calibrate an HDR display (that I don't :) ). Comparing to SD displays, how does the device behave with HDR10? (TVs, projectors)
- does it automatically increase/decrease "brightness" during playback? If so, can the device do it only for certain region or just the whole display? (especially if the questions about HDR10 in point 1. are true :) )
-- e.g. my SD display is set to ~120 nits, while can it happen that HDR display operates for a long time on 400nits????? If this is true (again) how can you calibrate it at all??? :)

The optional Dolby Vision layer is 1080p only, and the only thing it adds is 12bits over 10bits as well as dynamic metadata.
Really? Only 1080p of 12bit data? (I assume 4:2:0, again) That's definitely sound like cheating! :)

I think this amount of question is enough for starters :) Thanks!

[nevcairiel]

1. Data
Picture data is stored as bt.2020 (???) 10bit 4:2:0, or just or DCI-P3 in a bt.2020 container (???), resulting in a washed out picture.
- Wait, what????! Washed out picture?
- so, how does a true red become some greyish color when it's stored?
- I thought we have a truly increased color space compared to bt.709. Is it similar cheating as with those old anamorphic DVDs? :)


Its stored as BT.2020, 10-bit 4:2:0. The actually used colorspace could be smaller, and usually is in fact DCI-P3 for now. The HDR metadata tells you this.
The more important part about HDR however is that its stored using a different transfer function (ie. how to convert it to RGB), called PQ (Perceptual Quantizer, standardized as SMPTE ST 2084), and if you use the wrong one it looks washed out - for example, if a renderer doesn't support HDR, or the info has gone missing.

There is no "cheating", it just looks washed out when its being mis-interpreted by the renderer. You can't look at a YCbCr image without some sort of processing, and if you do that processing wrong, it won't make much sense.


How does the static HDR10 metadata look like?
- is it stored in the beginning of the hevc video data?
- is it just couple of properties (bytes) about the mastering attributes and picture levels and "that's it"?

The HDR10 metadata is stored with every HEVC CVS (coded video sequence, what most people call "GOP"), so its repeated regularly in the bitstream. In a file format like MPEG-TS, as used on Blu-ray, this is important, because there are no global headers at the beginning of the file, or anything like that.

It doesn't contain a whole lot. It contains the color volume (ie. it specifies that the mastering was done in DCI-P3, for example), the white point, and the min/max luminance of the mastering display.


2. Processing
Splitter and decoder pass data to renderer (MadVR) for further processing:
- that probably happens in the "limited washed out pictures" world
- then either passthrough or HDR processing happens (for SD displays)
-- what does bt.2020 -> DCI-P3 means in OSD?

As explained above, there is no "washed out picture" :)

The data is passed as untouched YCbCr to madVR, which then converts it to RGB. Either for pass-through, or conversion to SDR.
BT.2020 -> DCI-P3 means that its using a BT.2020 container with DCI-P3 color volume, as described above.

[Test]

Hello,

i bought a Nvidia 1050Ti for my 4k Beamer and madvr. But as i see, this card is not fast enough for this job. In this thread, the 1060 is recommended, but is this card really fast enough for high settings (also for 1080p and 720p upscaling to 4k)?

Thank you!

[Sunset1982]

Hello,

i bought a Nvidia 1050Ti for my 4k Beamer and madvr. But as i see, this card is not fast enough for this job. In this thread, the 1060 is recommended, but is this card really fast enough for high settings (also for 1080p and 720p upscaling to 4k)?

Thank you!

I would go for a 1070. I tested a 1060 and a 1070 before I decided to stay with the 1070. You just have a bit more room for higher settings or image prozessing (like adaptive sharpen or so)

[huhn]

and how do you define high settings?
a 1050 ti can run madVR with advanced settings so it is working as it should.

[Ver Greeneyes]

The main problem I ran into with 4k on my 1060 is that Smooth Motion takes a lot of juice when you apply it to (upscaled) 4k content. So make sure you turn off Smooth Motion unless you have a lot of untapped processing power.

[Sunset1982]

and how do you define high settings?
a 1050 ti can run madVR with advanced settings so it is working as it should.

depends. If you want to have enough resources for 60fps material, different resolution files with high quality upscaling settings like NGU "high" or "very high" luma and high chroma settings like NUG AA with different rendering options like noise reduction, sharpening and s.o. I would go for 1070. I am completely happy with it. With the 1060
I sometimes reached the limit and /or the card was getting very hot. With the 1070 the card stays relaxed and silent even with high quality settings.

[chros]

Its stored as BT.2020, 10-bit 4:2:0. The actually used colorspace could be smaller, and usually is in fact DCI-P3 for now. The HDR metadata tells you this: BT.2020 -> DCI-P3 means that its using a BT.2020 container with DCI-P3 color volume, as described above.
The more important part about HDR however is that its stored using a different transfer function (ie. how to convert it to RGB), called PQ (Perceptual Quantizer, standardized as SMPTE ST 2084), and if you use the wrong one it looks washed out - for example, if a renderer doesn't support HDR, or the info has gone missing. There is no "cheating", it just looks washed out when its being mis-interpreted by the renderer. You can't look at a YCbCr image without some sort of processing...

The HDR10 metadata is stored with every HEVC CVS (coded video sequence, what most people call "GOP"), so its repeated regularly in the bitstream. In a file format like MPEG-TS, as used on Blu-ray, this is important, because there are no global headers at the beginning of the file, or anything like that.
It doesn't contain a whole lot. It contains the color volume (ie. it specifies that the mastering was done in DCI-P3, for example), the white point, and the min/max luminance of the mastering display.
Thanks for the basics, nev.
Now I'm curious about the displaying part. :)

[x7007]

Many things fixed with 388.31 , get it now. FSE should work now. powerdvd16 17 3D is fixed , it's not blinking black every second but there is no 3D effect. so it's not 100% fixed. Also when trying to watch 3D movie for some reason PowerDVD think it's HDR and set to 12bit , that's when using the Default Color in NVCP . if changing it to NVidia color and 8 bit RGB then it stays 8 bit which is the correct for 3D bluray.





The data is passed as untouched YCbCr to madVR, which then converts it to RGB. Either for pass-through, or conversion to SDR.
BT.2020 -> DCI-P3 means that its using a BT.2020 container with DCI-P3 color volume, as described above.

For LG OLED55C6 TV should I choose Colour Gamut Normal/Auto or Wide for HDR movies ? because the Calibrators are saying to use Normal/Auto .

DCI-3 is for Dolby Vision or what does it mean ?

BT.2020 means it's HDR ?

are they both different or the same ? How would I know if I need to use Wide or Normal/Auto with the HDR movies I watch ?

[huhn]

For LG OLED55C6 TV should I choose Colour Gamut Normal/Auto or Wide for HDR movies ? because the Calibrators are saying to use Normal/Auto .
depends on your display calbration target my screne is in native gamut with a 3D LUT

DCI-3 is for Dolby Vision or what does it mean ?
it's a colorspace like BT 709 bt 601 or BT 2020.
BT.2020 means it's HDR ?
no BT 2020 cna be used on SDR too but in general it is HDR
are they both different or the same ? How would I know if I need to use Wide or Normal/Auto with the HDR movies I watch ?

this highly depends on your HDR settings and calibration setting can or mostly are different depending on the source.

how your TV deals with this well you have to figure that out by yourself. my guess is the gamut setting is ignore for HDR or different for HDR and SDR.

[Test]

depends. If you want to have enough resources for 60fps material, different resolution files with high quality upscaling settings like NGU "high" or "very high" luma and high chroma settings like NUG AA with different rendering options like noise reduction, sharpening and s.o. I would go for 1070. I am completely happy with it. With the 1060
I sometimes reached the limit and /or the card was getting very hot. With the 1070 the card stays relaxed and silent even with high quality settings.

This. I want to go f.e. NGU high with 720p and 1080p Content - also with 720p content with 50fps. Also the new setting "Noise Reduction" is not doable together with jink (chroma) + artifact removable settings. If i buy a new card, i want that all these options together should work smooth.
I´ve clocked my 1050Ti 230Mhz higher (card has no 6pin power plug) - so there is not more possible and the card is operating on the limit.

Will buy a 1070 i think. First i thought i´m waiting on Volta, but thats too long for me (no release date known).

Thank you very much guys - this helped a lot!

[Razoola]

Many things fixed with 388.31 , get it now. FSE should work now. powerdvd16 17 3D is fixed , it's not blinking black every second but there is no 3D effect. so it's not 100% fixed. Also when trying to watch 3D movie for some reason PowerDVD think it's HDR and set to 12bit , that's when using the Default Color in NVCP . if changing it to NVidia color and 8 bit RGB then it stays 8 bit which is the correct for 3D bluray.

Does this driver fix the issue with HDR not switching off after playback of a HDR movie?

[mrmarioman]

Does this driver fix the issue with HDR not switching off after playback of a HDR movie?

Nope, just tried. It still turns on Windows' HDR and everyrhing looks washed out.

[nsnhd]

This. I want to go f.e. NGU high with 720p and 1080p Content - also with 720p content with 50fps. Also the new setting "Noise Reduction" is not doable together with jink (chroma) + artifact removable settings. If i buy a new card, i want that all these options together should work smooth.
I´ve clocked my 1050Ti 230Mhz higher (card has no 6pin power plug) - so there is not more possible and the card is operating on the limit.

Will buy a 1070 i think. First i thought i´m waiting on Volta, but thats too long for me (no release date known).

Thank you very much guys - this helped a lot!

That's sad to hear since I also want to get a 1050ti and a 1070 is out of my price range. As luma should be given priority over chroma, if you let chroma at the minimum "bilinear", what the maximum luma upscaling the 1050ti can archive ? Is NGU sharp high possible with certain noise reduction settings by luma upscaling 720/1080p to 4k ?

[ryrynz]

1050Ti just ain't strong enough, just spend as much as you can afford, 1060 minimum.. or else trade offs galore.

[austonrush]

That's sad to hear since I also want to get a 1050ti and a 1070 is out of my price range. As luma should be given priority over chroma, if you let chroma at the minimum "bilinear", what the maximum luma upscaling the 1050ti can archive ? Is NGU sharp high possible with certain noise reduction settings by luma upscaling 720/1080p to 4k ?

Save up and get a 1070! you'll regret going lower, as you'll have to compromise on settings.

[Test]

As the two guys above correct said - the 1050Ti is too slow. I tried to put chroma on the lowest Setting (DXVA i think), but if you want to use some of the image enhancement-options, you have no chance with this card.

And if you get a compromise you have always to hope that the power and temperature target are not reached and if so the card is clocking down. Apart from that, the card is heating my whole case while using madvr - so at the end of a film, the card is getting louder and louder and hotter.

So it is f.e. not possible to use with 4k the Noise Reduction. And 60fps-Content like Streaming or Billy Lynn - there you have to add an additional Profil where everthing is on DXVA.

Its the same thing with 720p content. I´ve tried different settings to have a better picture with DVBViewer, but 720p50 upscaling to 4k => you can only usw low settings (in combination with 1 or 2 Image enhancement options) - but things like as i said noice reduction or reduce artefacts - no chance.

[ryrynz]

1050 Ti would be fine with Full HD screen, it's slightly faster than my 960 and I find that quite capable for the majority of my content. Most of the work goes into 480-720 resolution stuff but if you're using a >1080 res screen now you'll want to put more work into that resolution and that requires quite a bit more grunt. A 1060 on a full HD screen should give you the ability to do almost anything but with a 4K screen you'll only just get by and make compromises. Don't get the 1050 Ti, waste of time.

[yukinok25]

Hi madshi, I keep having crashes every time I move the seekbar back and forth, it started to happen from the 0.92.3/4 if I recall correctly.

When you have time, can you please check my crash report?:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/t7ahmp203kbw5fs/madVR+-+crash+report.txt

Thank you very much!

[sat4all]

Hi Madshi,
Any plans for the near future, to move black bars detection from cpu to gpu. as now with hdr content copy-back decoding put too much load on the cpu. arround 70% in my case ''i5-7500T''.

kind regards

[Razoola]

Nope, just tried. It still turns on Windows' HDR and everyrhing looks washed out.

My issue is with it not turning off after playback ends and not things looking washed out.

[foozoor]

Hi Madshi,
Any plans for the near future, to move black bars detection from cpu to gpu. as now with hdr content copy-back decoding put too much load on the cpu. arround 70% in my case ''i5-7500T''.

kind regards

He's already mentioned it.
You'll have to wait and just stop using this feature for this type of videos.

[mrmarioman]

My issue is with it not turning off after playback ends and not things looking washed out.

If you have an Nvidia card it shouldn't turn on at all. That's not how it should work with Nvidia. And colors are wrong, at least for many people.

[Razoola]

If you have an Nvidia card it shouldn't turn on at all. That's not how it should work with Nvidia. And colors are wrong, at least for many people.

No, that was not my issue. It turned on fine when a HDR video starts, the problem is it does not turn off after the HDR video stops with the newer drivers. Quite a few people here with the same issue.

[njfoses]

New Nvidia driver 388.31 seems to be getting positive reviews from gamers in case anyone wants to test.

[ashlar42]

New Nvidia driver 388.31 seems to be getting positive reviews from gamers in case anyone wants to test.Let's hope it fixed what got us stuck with 385.xx

[oldpainlesskodi]

Let's hope it fixed what got us stuck with 385.xx

Nope - HDR still borked.

K

[jmonier]

1050Ti just ain't strong enough, just spend as much as you can afford, 1060 minimum.. or else trade offs galore.

Note that for 4k a 1060 6gb is needed. Memory usage on 4k seems to be just a little more than 3gb.

[nevcairiel]

Nope - HDR still borked.


Thats mostly Windows fault, stick to 8.1 and everything works perfectly, even with brand new drivers. :)

[nsnhd]

Note that for 4k a 1060 6gb is needed. Memory usage on 4k seems to be just a little more than 3gb.

Even if you reduce the CPU/GPU queue sizes ? It always a little more than 3gb or just in cases ? And with a 1060 3gb, does it hurt the performance (dropped frames) heavily or force you on setting compromises ?

[dvd1]

then 1050 will not assoluamente good, for my future 4k, but only for the fullhd?

[lunnar]

Let's hope it fixed what got us stuck with 385.xx

what exact version of the 385 drivers are you guys using ?

I am tired of manualy switching back HDR off in windows everytime I watch a movie.

I was about to re-install 378.46 as I know for a fact that these work quite well. But since I plan to play a recent game(ELEX) I will prefer to have more recent drivers.

[Epedemic]

Hi

If anyone is interested, i found a very new quadro driver in the 384/385 series (385.90 to be exact): http://www.nvidia.com/download/driverResults.aspx/126788/en-us

And modifying it with this guide: https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/nvidia-inf-driver-modding-guide.377158/ i managed to get it working , at least as well, as the other 385 drivers on my measly GT 1030 on my Win10 Fall Creators update setup, primarilly meant for playing 2160p HDR content. Hopefully it will have a little bit better performance and/or some bugs fixed.

That aside, i have a question: Can anyone point me in the direction of a guide/some settings for madVR/LAV for passing through 2160p/HDR content with as little GPU-taxing enhanchments and features as possible? The GT 1030 is *barely* able to play the content without dropping frames, but is VERY sensitive to any background activity on the PC. 60fps content especially will drop frames now and then. (I use Mediaportal 1.18 as my preferred player. Kodi DSPlayer seems a little better in performance, but is not really what i'm looking for, as i have a lot of stuff, especially TV, which is working much better on Mediaportal)

[ultrahd_hdr]

what exact version of the 385 drivers are you guys using ?

I am tired of manualy switching back HDR off in windows everytime I watch a movie.

I was about to re-install 378.46 as I know for a fact that these work quite well. But since I plan to play a recent game(ELEX) I will prefer to have more recent drivers.

I have 385.69 working smoothly on my machine.

[rancorx2]

hi,
does anyone know how to avoid the video from freezing after pausing for a while and then trying to resume it?

doesn't happen on evr but whenever i pause a video when madvr is the renderer, playback does not resume or takes a few minutes for the video to continue, the audio plays but not the video straight away, most of the time i have to close mpc and reopen the video.

does anyone know a solution?