madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[Guest]

The 680 doesn't even look like it's top of the line Why do you say that?

[SamuriHL]

You paid like $380 for that top of the line card, right? The 680 doesn't even look like it's top of the line, and the actually top of the line 7970 came out at $550. Crazy bastards those guys, I can't afford any of the current cards, and I'm not paying the 7800 prices as they currently are!

I paid more as I got it day 1. As soon as they were in stock on newegg I pulled the trigger. The one bad part of being on the bleeding edge. Hence i can wait a month or two to buy a 680. As for the "doesn't look like it's top of the line" comment I have to highly disagree with you on that one. It's a most impressive looking card. Lower heat profile and less power consumption than the previous cards. AMD's pricing is a joke. They were just this week forced to reduce the price on all their cards. That 7970 is down to 449 USD now. I agree the prices are ridiculously insane, but, then, I look at the price of something like a PS3 when they first came out and think to myself that a top of the line video card will provide more value in the end. Even if I wanted a 680 right now, however, I can't get one. No one's got them in stock and I'll be damned if I'm going to pay a "premium" to get one.

[Andy o]

I was under the impression that GK100 was gonna be top dog, but from a quick google can't find more than rumors before GK104 came out. Code names are confusing enough. I didn't mean it from a performance standpoint. I agree it's impressive, and if I gamed a lot I would probably wait for GTX660, but again, HDMI audio me no likey.

[SamuriHL]

Yea, the code names are nuts. The 680 right now beat the pants off the 7970 which is why AMD had to reduce the price. For madVR, the 680 is beyond overkill. :D I have no problem with that. LOL! (Well, maybe with 4k content it's not overkill...I don't know). But that will be enough for me. PCI3 won't hurt. :)

(P.S. I know the 7970 vs 680 is really close. I was being sarcastic with the "beat the pants off" comment....I hope no one takes it seriously)

[Andy o]

My plan is this year to get a IVB laptop with either a GTX660m or 650m GDDR5 because of Optimus, but keep a 7000 series in the aging Yorkfield HTPC. If I was gaming, I'd go to the NV camp probably, unless AMD severely adjust their 7800 prices.

[SamuriHL]

I want an IVB laptop myself but I don't know if I can afford one this year or not. We'll see. I need a new TV, as well, and since I just poured so much money into rebuilding my HTPC's both plans may have to wait. My dual core VAIO with a 3450 ain't getting any younger. :D (Although, to be fair, it does work with madVR....barely)

[Mangix]

madVR behaves more like a game then a video renderer, so your comparison is somewhat flawed. :)

except that nvidia focuses a LOT on things like FXAA, TXAA, and various texture optimizations that have no relevance to madVR. probably why some things are broken with the new drivers.

[cyberbeing]

Possible wishful thinking that along the way, NVIDIA actually fixed the issue which initially prompted madshi to make 'use a separate device for presentation' the default?

I can't even remember what that option was for at this point. Was that for the 'multi-display issue', the 'madVR can't read refresh rate in fullscreen exclusive' issue, or something else entirely?

[DragonQ]

Good choice! I recommend that you be careful to get one with the VP5 engine. Right now that means 520 or 680. The 680 is cutting edge right now. I've updated DG tools to support it, but I don't know if that is the case for the other CUVID-enabled tools.
The 680 is massively overkill for an HTPC and the 520 isn't powerful enough for high quality MadVR (from what I read in late 2011, things may be different now since MadVR keeps improving). It's one of the reasons why I got a GT 430 instead. It was cheap though so if it ever stops coping with any material I throw at it, I can upgrade easily enough.

[nevcairiel]

The 520 isnt even powerful enough for full quality deinterlacing with EVR, so no, its not fast enough. :p

Rumors say that in June there will be a mid-end GPU of the 600 series.

[G_M_C]

I cant help myself from wondering why i read about many problems with Nvidia cards, opposed to AMD cards. Is it because many more peope use Nv, or is it because users with AMD cards have less problems ?

I asked this question because i have a simple AMD HD5770, and it performs perfectly. I can switch to full-screen on the secondary (my Plasma), bitstream HD audio etc. etc. and keep using my primary for work at the same time. I have never had problems with refreshrates/frequencies/full-screen problems or what not.

Maybe it's because i do decoding on the CPU (a c2q 9650 EE, which is downclocked atm). ?

[nevcairiel]

My system with an NVIDIA card also runs just fine, some people are just unlucky, have odd configurations or don't have the patience to fiddle with the madVR options. :)
Granted, with NVIDIA you might need to change more options to get playback working properly, but i can always claim that the defaults are just tailored for AMD. :p

[SamuriHL]

Yea, having 2 HTPC's in the house, one with nVidia and one with AMD, I can say that configuration is pretty different. However, that said, once you configure it, it just works. nVidia driver updates sometimes introduce problems, but, you can always go back to a known stable driver if it's really broken. The same can be said of AMD from time to time. Pick your poison as they both have benefits and drawbacks.

[DragonQ]

madshi, I have a TS file that MadVR refuses to deinterlace unless I force it on (with CTRL + ALT + SHIFT + D). MediaInfo reckons the file is progressive but it reckons that about a lot of files that are actually interlaced so I don't know whether that's relevant or not. I have "if in doubt, activate deinterlacing" on.

If I name the file "blah [1080i].ts" and use automatic deinterlacing, it's set to "off". If I name the file "blah 50i [1080i].ts" and use automatic deinterlacing, it's set to "on" but no deinterlacing actually happens. :/

Any ideas?

[jakmal]

I just posted this in the LAV Filters thread, but thought it would get noticed here more (apologies if that is not the practice in this forum):

Has anyone tried using madVR on mobile NVIDIA GPUs? If so, do you notice a loss in performance compared to a similarly spec-ed desktop GPU?

For example, a GT 540M vs a GT 430 / 440 using the same DDR3 memory with a software configuration using LAV Video Decoder (CUVID) in MPC-HC is the sort of environment that I am looking at.

[Pat357]

Has anyone tried using madVR on mobile NVIDIA GPUs? If so, do you notice a loss in performance compared to a similarly spec-ed desktop GPU?

For example, a GT 540M vs a GT 430 / 440 using the same DDR3 memory with a software configuration using LAV Video Decoder (CUVID) in MPC-HC is the sort of environment that I am looking at.
Have you already compare the key-numbers from GPU-Z for example ?
I think stuff like Pixel-fillrate, Texture fillrate, bus width en bandwidth could give some indication.
Of course gpu-clock, memory-clock and shader-clock matter a lot for MadVR.

For indication, my GTX-570 gives :
Bus width : 320 bit
Bandwidth : 152 GB/s
Memory : DDR5 1900 Mhz
GPU clock : 820 Mhz (732 standard), shaders 1640Mhz (1464 standard)
Has 40 ROPs / 480 Shaders

[vivan]

I have acer 3830TG with nVidia GT 540M. I haven't compared it to the desktops GPU's - since my desktop is much faster.
But I have abouth 13.60 ms rendering time of 1080p video on 1366x768 display - so it's enough for 60 fps video. But I'm not using CUVID - VP4 is too slow for 1080p@60fps.

As for GPU-Z: http://gpuz.techpowerup.com/12/04/20/98v.png

[nevcairiel]

VP4 is too slow for 1080p@60fps.
Actually, VP4 is plenty fast for 60 fps, average framerate should be over 70 on a typical 1080p file.

Might be a memory bottleneck on a mobile system, it'll probably have slower RAM to limit the thermal properties.

[vivan]

Average - maybe, but I have lowest ~50 fps on some files. I'm used to QS perfomance :)

[chros]

And here is mine, a Geforce 9600M GT in a MSI GX620 (almost 4 years old config) :)
http://gpuz.techpowerup.com/12/04/20/em3.png

[RBG]

But I'm not using CUVID - VP4 is too slow for 1080p@60fps.

Most likely 540M itself is too slow for 1080p60, at least I haven't encountered any 1080p60 videos that couldn't achieve 60 fps mark min. on my 470gtx.

[jakmal]

That was a false alarm, guys :) The 540M is quite OK for everything except that 1080p60 results in 1 or 2 dropped frames over the course of a 3 minute clip. [ CUVID + EVR is fully OK, no dropped frames ]

The issue was that I was trying out in full screen exclusive mode. After I reverted to full screen windowed mode, things started looking up and I got performance similar to the GT430.

Apparently, FS exclusive performing worse than windowed is an issue reported by many NV owners to madshi :)

[nevcairiel]

Apparently, FS exclusive performing worse than windowed is an issue reported by many NV owners to madshi :)

Its not an issue with madVR itself, just with your configuration of the same.

madVR is not a product that can be assumed to be working flawlessly "out of the box".
Sadly, alot of people don't realize this and rather complain. The default configuration seems to be more appropriate for AMD at this time, but it is certainly possible to get flawless playback on NVIDIA.
That said, if windowed mode works flawlessly for you, no reason to use FSE.

[DragonQ]

Actually, VP4 is plenty fast for 60 fps, average framerate should be over 70 on a typical 1080p file.
Agreed, 1080p/60 works fine on my GT 430 with EVR. Haven't tried it with MadVR though. I think the AnandTech article says it should work up to 30-40 Mbps but I don't know what their configuration was.

I do know that my GTS 250 (VP2 IIRC) cannot handle 1080p/60 though.

[mindbomb]

That was a false alarm, guys :) The 540M is quite OK for everything except that 1080p60 results in 1 or 2 dropped frames over the course of a 3 minute clip. [ CUVID + EVR is fully OK, no dropped frames ]

The issue was that I was trying out in full screen exclusive mode. After I reverted to full screen windowed mode, things started looking up and I got performance similar to the GT430.

Apparently, FS exclusive performing worse than windowed is an issue reported by many NV owners to madshi :)

wait, but the gt 430 had no problems in full screen exclusive?

[Andy o]

IIRC madshi had to add those tweaks in order to cater to NV drivers or whatever was causing the glitches.

[pirlouy]

That said, if windowed mode works flawlessly for you, no reason to use FSE.
That's what Madshi says now too.
But I remember in the past he said D3D resolved several problems and then recommended D3D (exclusive).

D3D only improves tearing and smoothness or is it doing something else ?

[nevcairiel]

That's what Madshi says now too.
But I remember in the past he said D3D resolved several problems and then recommended D3D (exclusive).

D3D only improves tearing and smoothness or is it doing something else ?

If it works for you, what problems are there to resolve?
Also, if you use Aero, there is no tearing.

[CruNcher]

its mostly about latency but a stable system with Vista/Win 7 (NT 6) these days should have 0 problems anymore in Windowed mode, though for these small latency increase you get a ton of pros with Aero :) and in Win 8 latency has been further decreased which was absolute necessary due to ultra fast touch responsiveness needed :)

[n3w813]

To Nvidia owners (maybe specifically GT430)...

What are your current settings for....

General Settings
Windowed Mode Settings

I'm having a hard time getting the MadVR not to drop frames. :(

[pirlouy]

If it works for you, what problems are there to resolve?
For noobs like me, I don't see differences between Overlay Mixer and MadVR. I just follow what guys say is the best. I'm not even sure to see a difference between 24Hz and 60 (3:2 pulldown).
A guy like me does not know if it really works...

So I just ask what in theory are other advantages of D3D (except tearing and smoothness).


Also, if you use Aero, there is no tearing.
Does Aero Sync worth D3D from MadVR ?
On my desktop, I often have laggy scroll on browser, until I move a window. So I'm not sure about Aero VSync quality...

[namaiki]

To Nvidia owners (maybe specifically GT430)...

What are your current settings for....

General Settings
Windowed Mode Settings

I'm having a hard time getting the MadVR not to drop frames. :(

I'm using default settings except "present several frames in advance" disabled. Well, I changed luma upscale to spline, but that's personal preference.

[Gary.M]

Ditto

I'm using default settings except "present several frames in advance" disabled. Well, I changed luma upscale to spline, but that's personal preference.



Sent using Tapatalk

[DragonQ]

Here is a sample TS file (http://www.mediafire.com/?cd8jxvr8m66ta15) that contains a mixture of progressive (1080p/25) and interlaced (1080i/25) video. EVR correctly shows the progressive parts (00:00 - 00:16) as 1080p/25 and deinterlaces the interlaced parts (00:17 - 00:44) to 1080p/50. However, MadVR just treats the whole file as progressive and plays it all at 1080p/25, therefore the interlaced parts show combing.

I'm using LAV Splitter and LAV Video Decoder but since it works fine in EVR I'm assuming it's a MadVR bug!

[Gser]

Here is a sample TS file (http://www.mediafire.com/?cd8jxvr8m66ta15) that contains a mixture of progressive (1080p/25) and interlaced (1080i/25) video. EVR correctly shows the progressive parts (00:00 - 00:16) as 1080p/25 and deinterlaces the interlaced parts (00:17 - 00:44) to 1080p/50. However, MadVR just treats the whole file as progressive and plays it all at 1080p/25, therefore the interlaced parts show combing.

I'm using LAV Splitter and LAV Video Decoder but since it works fine in EVR I'm assuming it's a MadVR bug!

Its not a bug, MadVR just isn't designed for hybrid sources. For now just force deinterlacing or use EVR.

[DragonQ]

Oh OK. All Freeview HD broadcasts in the UK are MBAFF and switch between interlaced and progressive as appropriate, so this would be a useful feature to have! :)

[mr.duck]

In some future version of madVR with definable hotkey control, it should be possible for example to setup the D key to switch deinterlacing on/off.

Or tell LAV Video to YADIF it should work, without having to force it on in the LAV Video options (since it can read aspect ratio from stream, I guess it could handle mixed progressive/interlaced material OK too).

[DragonQ]

No offence but pressing D to switch mid-video isn't any better than pressing CTRL+ALT+SHIFT+D. If I'm watching something on my TV via an HTPC, I don't want to have to get the keyboard out every time there's an interlaced/progressive switch in the stream. Leaving interlacing on all the time is a better solution but isn't ideal either.

I've tried YADIF via LAV Video before but it has visible problems compared to hardware deinterlacing, unfortunately.

[Pat357]

I have acer 3830TG with nVidia GT 540M. I haven't compared it to the desktops GPU's - since my desktop is much faster.
But I have abouth 13.60 ms rendering time of 1080p video on 1366x768 display - so it's enough for 60 fps video. But I'm not using CUVID - VP4 is too slow for 1080p@60fps.

As for GPU-Z: http://gpuz.techpowerup.com/12/04/20/98v.png

Your memory bandwidth is extemely low : about 28.8 GB/s
My VP4 based GTX-570 has over 150 GB/s.
I guess your low bandwidth rather than "only VP4" might have to do with your problem to play 1080p60..

[Xello]

Is there anyone using GTX 680 with madVR and achieving glitch free playback? Just when i get one file playing smoothly, another file on the same settings will get frequent tearing / stutter / drop frames / presentation glitches, especially on 23/24hz mode. When i had the 580 i never had to touch a thing everything just worked :confused:

[obieobieobie]

Is there anyone using GTX 680 with madVR and achieving glitch free playback? Just when i get one file playing smoothly, another file on the same settings will get frequent tearing / stutter / drop frames / presentation glitches, especially on 23/24hz mode. When i had the 580 i never had to touch a thing everything just worked :confused:

Default settings, windowed mode and disabled "use a separate device for presentation". Works great with my GTX 680 and 301.24 drivers.

[Xello]

Default settings, windowed mode and disabled "use a separate device for presentation". Works great with my GTX 680 and 301.24 drivers.

I think the problem I'm having is somehow to do with deinterlacing, it's when i'm playing a 1080i file that i'm getting either frame drops in windowed mode or presentation glitches in exclusive, though i'm just using NV cuvid through lav video same as before. Playing with the GPU flush settings to see if it will change anything, though i'm not exactly sure what each one does.

Are 1080i files ok with you?

[obieobieobie]

I think the problem I'm having is somehow to do with deinterlacing, it's when i'm playing a 1080i file that i'm getting either frame drops in windowed mode or presentation glitches in exclusive, though i'm just using NV cuvid through lav video same as before. Playing with the GPU flush settings to see if it will change anything, though i'm not exactly sure what each one does.

Are 1080i files ok with you?

Sorry, I always deinterlace during encode.

[Hypernova]

Anandtech test madVR on Intel HD4000 (Ivy Bridge):http://www.anandtech.com/show/5773/intels-ivy-bridge-an-htpc-perspective/6

This looks pretty nice. I'm buying an IB (my current CPU is borrowed) so if I can use madVR only on iGPU that would be a nice plus.

[SamuriHL]

If only Intel would get their butt's in gear and release the damn CPU's! I've been waiting 2 weeks to buy the I7 3770k. I've got a mobo and ram sitting here not being overly useful. :) I can't WAIT to put that thing together.

[Rectal Prolapse]

I think the problem I'm having is somehow to do with deinterlacing, it's when i'm playing a 1080i file that i'm getting either frame drops in windowed mode or presentation glitches in exclusive, though i'm just using NV cuvid through lav video same as before. Playing with the GPU flush settings to see if it will change anything, though i'm not exactly sure what each one does.

Are 1080i files ok with you?

Yes, same thing here, except on an nvidia geforce 560! However, there is hope: If you are running the 301.24 beta drivers, try setting up MPC-HC in the NVIDIA 3D app settings to use Adaptive Vsync.

I just did a test with an HBO cap of Game of Thrones season 2 episodes, and it seems to work beautifully - no more presentation glitches and no dropped frames (well, after 15 minutes of testing at 59.940 hz as reported by madvr).

[Rectal Prolapse]

Here are some of the MadVR settings I am using:

http://i.imgur.com/xU7ud.png

http://i.imgur.com/m9V3T.png

http://i.imgur.com/sc19c.png

MPC-HC with LAV filters installed too.

NVIDIA Geforce 560 card, using HDMI audio bitstreaming.

Oh and I have YADIF deinterlacing enabled in LAV decoder especially for the game of thrones, with mpeg2 *UNCHECKED* in LAV Decoder (ie. NVIDIA CUVID is on but NOT used for mpeg2).

[Rectal Prolapse]

Here is a screenshot of my LAV decoder settings:

http://i.imgur.com/1fsdM.png

[aufkrawall]

You could give present 16 frames in advance a try with default settings otherwise.
Maybe try software decoding too so that you can be sure if it's either the decoder or (most likely) the renderer.

[kalston]

I can't get smooth playback on Planet Earth blu-ray Special features disc (Natural World: Desert Lions and Snow Leopards), it's 1080i 29.97fps.

I tried using LAV to do both the decoding (CUVID) and deinterlacing: madVR dropped a frame or two every now and then. When the drops occured I could see the decoder queue in madVR go from 15-16 to being completely empty for a brief instant.
With madVR doing the deinterlacing it's even worse, frames are dropped a bit more frequently and this time it's the backbuffer/presentation queue that goes empty.

I also tried enabling Reclock and the JRiver equivalent (which shouldn't be necessary since I'm getting good matching refresh rates) and it made zero difference.
I messed around with basically every setting in madVR but couldn't get anything that worked.

It's the first time I watch interlaced material btw. And turning off deinterlacing does get rid of the drops.
I can play things like 1080p60 or 4k@30fps just fine with 0 drops.
Win 7 64, i5 2500k@4.5ghz, GTX 275 (latest WHQL drivers), 8Gb RAM, LAV+madVR and JRiver MC17 or mpc-hc.

Edit: forcing film mode fixes the drops it seems