madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[Kranium]

@madashi in the latest build nnedi3 is not working.even if nnedi3 is selected in chroma upscaling or image doubling,it is showing JINC3.
But super-xbr is working.please look into it.

I was using 0.89.5 from here (http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1740753&postcount=33243) and my NNEDI3 also stopped working, even if I selected all NNEDI256 settings I was just seeing JINC>JINC>JINC in the OSD with 12ms render times. My guess is it might have been that new Windows10 November update that broke it(?). I updated to the new v0.89.17 and new NVIDIA drivers and all seems well now, NNEDI3 working and GPU usage back to space heater levels :) .


*edit*

Forgot to mention I also updated my version of MPC-HC to 1.7.10 at that time as well.

[aufkrawall]

It was broken because Nvidia removed an OpenCL extension which was used for NNEDI3, so madshi had to use a different one with newer madVR versions.

[trip_let]

I'm in the market for a new (well, potentially old and used to save money) graphics card. Does anybody off the top of their heads remember what if any current issues exist with madVR, Win10, and Nvidia vs. AMD with respect to feature support and/or performance? I know the Nvidia issue in recent drivers with the OpenCL interop to use NNEDI3 was just resolved. Thanks.

[Kranium]

It was broken because Nvidia removed an OpenCL extension which was used for NNEDI3, so madshi had to use a different one with newer madVR versions.

I had been using the correct Nvidia drivers to work around that issue until I think v0.89.3 had the new dx11 open cl interop where NNEDI3 worked with then current drivers. NNEDI3 was working for me up until at least 5-6 days ago when I was playing with other options in madVR. This is why I think it might have happened with the new win10 update since I only did that 2-3 days ago and hadn't watched much to notice it was missing.

[aufkrawall]

Ah, yes. The build upgrade uninstalled the OpenCL/cuda driver, I lost driver profile settings as well.

[adhara]

Hi,

What are the best settings with a Nvidia 960 video card ?

Currently, this what I use (outptut is set to 3840 x 2160 pixels (UHD TV) on the Nvidia control panel).

Jinc AR (chroma/luma upscale)
Catmull Rom AR LL (image downscaling)

Thx

PS: Why we can't choose "taps" anymore with the Jinc algorythm ?

[har3inger]

Jinc taps were removed because most people thought 3 tap was strictly better than 4 tap, and there wasn't a reason to choose 4 over 3.

[Ver Greeneyes]

Jinc taps were removed because most people thought 3 tap was strictly better than 4 tap, and there wasn't a reason to choose 4 over 3.That, and other people were choosing 8 because more is better, right? When in fact the quality was equivalent at best, while slowing things down a lot.

[Warner306]

Hi,

What are the best settings with a Nvidia 960 video card ?

Currently, this what I use (outptut is set to 3840 x 2160 pixels (UHD TV) on the Nvidia control panel).

Jinc AR (chroma/luma upscale)
Catmull Rom AR LL (image downscaling)

Thx

PS: Why we can't choose "taps" anymore with the Jinc algorythm ?

I would add image doubling. super-xbr or low values of NNEDI3 luma doubling would improve the image further.

You could also add SuperRes from upscaling refinement to make the image sharper. SuperRes + enhance detail is another possibility.

[ryrynz]

I had been using the correct Nvidia drivers to work around that issue until I think v0.89.3 had the new dx11 open cl interop where NNEDI3 worked with then current drivers. NNEDI3 was working for me up until at least 5-6 days ago when I was playing with other options in madVR. This is why I think it might have happened with the new win10 update since I only did that 2-3 days ago and hadn't watched much to notice it was missing.
Reinstall your drivers with a clean install. I had to do this recently after updating cos NNEDI3 broke again but strangely only the 64bit version.

[everlast4291987]

I have a 4K TV that can do Chroma Sampling
8bit @ YCbCR 4:2:0, 4:2:2, 4:4:4 & RGB 4:4:4
10bit & 12bit @ YCbCr 4:2:0, 4:2:2
I'm just wondering what I should use. I mostly have 8bit movies though I do have some 10 bit Animes. I have a GTX 980ti for anyone wondering. Any benefit to changing 8Bit 4:4:4 to 12bit 4:2:2?

[Shiandow]

I have a 4K TV that can do Chroma Sampling
8bit @ YCbCR 4:2:0, 4:2:2, 4:4:4 & RGB 4:4:4
10bit & 12bit @ YCbCr 4:2:0, 4:2:2
I'm just wondering what I should use. I mostly have 8bit movies though I do have some 10 bit Animes. I have a GTX 980ti for anyone wondering. Any benefit to changing 8Bit 4:4:4 to 12bit 4:2:2?

I'd go for the 8 bit RGB 4:4:4. If you use ordered dithering or error diffusion then seeing the difference between 8 bit and 12 bit is nearly impossible. The difference between 4:4:4 and 4:2:2 is a lot easier to see if you know where to look.

[djsolidsnake86]

madshi have you found how fix the stuttering when open a file and go to fullscreen?
no one experienced this? i'm on windows 10, with 2 monitors cloned

[Asmodian]

I'd go for the 8 bit RGB 4:4:4. If you use ordered dithering or error diffusion then seeing the difference between 8 bit and 12 bit is nearly impossible. The difference between 4:4:4 and 4:2:2 is a lot easier to see if you know where to look.

I strongly agree!

[Siso]

Is it me or the latest madvr versions take screenshots in 16-235 instead of 0-255? EVR cp is ok.

[nlnl]

madshi

Argh. Ok, can you create another log with the next madVR build? I've added some more logging output, maybe it helps me finding out what's going on there.

That is another log. Thanks!
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7a6LffuxvKUSjJMWU1pQ0QtR3c/view?usp=sharing

[huhn]

Is it me or the latest madvr versions take screenshots in 16-235 instead of 0-255? EVR cp is ok.

did a short test and it's working fine for me.

Os is windows 10 build 1511 ,nvidia gtx 980 and latest nvidia driver version 358.91 .NNEDI3 was working on madvr 0.89.16. but in 0.89.17 NNEDI3 is not enabled.It goes to JINC

this is looking fine to me and is works fine for me too with these driver and OS.

[firewater]

I think of MPC-HC as the perfect player in every possible way, but there's literally one thing about it that I dislike, and not only I dislike it, I hate it. I can't stand the seekbar, it's the only thing I have enabled on the UI because it's the only thing that I need, but the thing sticks out like a sore thumb. Looking at it makes me irritable. I tried MPC-BE just for this change, and it's slightly better, but still looks very 2003 design wise (gradient and such).

I like the fullscreen exclusive seekbar of madvr because it only appears in fullscreen mode, but I also dislike the purple color, the font, and background (ideally I would love to only have the time and the bar without background). My question is, any chance you could add an option in the future to modify this bar via images or something like that?

[dansrfe]

What exactly does enhance detail do?

[Asmodian]

What exactly does enhance detail do?

Heh, I too would like to know. ;)

[e-t172]

What do you mean? It enhances, of course. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhF_56SxrGk)

[huhn]

it enhances mostly things like "noise" it makes small "stuff" more noticeable.

on an anime you enhance mostly compression artefact's.

[JarrettH]

What do you mean? It enhances, of course. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhF_56SxrGk)

Hahahaha ;):D

[Warner306]

What exactly does enhance detail do?

It is not that bad. At settings of 1.0 or less, I find it enhances details like people's faces more than grain and artifacts. It is definitely an enhancement if you find the image is too flat. I have been experimenting with this shader with SuperRes and I'm not certain if I like it or not, but it does give the entire image a lift, rather than just the edges of objects.

[Nullack]

When using the current madVR on a 4K UHD display with high DPI say 300%, the madVR CTRL J renderer stats are too small to read.

[Warner306]

When using the current madVR on a 4K UHD display with high DPI say 300%, the madVR CTRL J renderer stats are too small to read.

It has always been this way to keep the stats from covering the image. And the amount of information in this panel necessitates small writing. But I can agree they are hard to read.

[x7007]

madshi have you found how fix the stuttering when open a file and go to fullscreen?
no one experienced this? i'm on windows 10, with 2 monitors cloned

What stuttering do you mean ? I had stuttering fixed it using PreRender 3 in Nvidia Control Panel and Madvr PreRender 4

[Warner306]

Is there any benefit to using thin edges with sharpen edges? I am wondering if the two cancel each other out.

[ryrynz]

Is there any benefit to using thin edges with sharpen edges? I am wondering if the two cancel each other out.

There's no cancelling, they all work together. Thinning and edge sharpening work very well together, just don't go too high.

[aufkrawall]

Yep. I just wouldn't use it together with SuperRes with a strength of 3 for high scaling factors, this will make aliasing a problem for thin sctructures.
Instead, a strength of 2 for SR and a higher sharpen edges value looks better to me.

I must say that SR + a low enhance detail strength really looks nice for filmed content.

[truexfan81]

Yep. I just wouldn't use it together with SuperRes with a strength of 3 for high scaling factors, this will make aliasing a problem for thin sctructures.
Instead, a strength of 2 for SR and a higher sharpen edges value looks better to me.

I must say that SR + a low enhance detail strength really looks nice for filmed content.

not sure what the new algos are running, but the only one i can use with my gtx650 is enhance detail, all the others turn it into a slideshow.

[aufkrawall]

It should be faster than Adaptive Sharpen with your GPU though:
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1746712&postcount=34265
However, Adaptive Sharpen isn't very cheap either, so it might be normal that you are quite limited with these shaders.

[truexfan81]

It should be faster than Adaptive Sharpen with your GPU though:
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1746712&postcount=34265
However, Adaptive Sharpen isn't very cheap either, so it might be normal that you are quite limited with these shaders.

yeah on mine its the other way around lol i can use adaptive sharpen easily

[aufkrawall]

Hm, that's weird. Maybe the GPU load was so low during madshi's benchmark with AS that it downclocked and so the rendering times are misleading.

[truexfan81]

Hm, that's weird. Maybe the GPU load was so low during madshi's benchmark with AS that it downclocked and so the rendering times are misleading.

possibly, i use dxva2-cb so i have mine set to stay at full power 24/7

[madshi]

You sure you're on v0.89.17? Maybe still running v0.89.16?

[omarank]

I was adjusting levels of some badly encoded videos. I found that there is no change in black level when I go from black level -8 to -9 using shortcut key. From -9 onwards again the levels change properly. Similarly there is no change in white level when going from -6 to -7. This is seemingly a bug. Shall I post it in the bug tracker? Or I am missing something here?

[huhn]

this works fine for me.

[truexfan81]

You sure you're on v0.89.17? Maybe still running v0.89.16?

v0.89.17 according to the settings SS attached

[aufkrawall]

possibly, i use dxva2-cb so i have mine set to stay at full power 24/7
DXVA2 CB doesn't let the GPU stay in maximum clock state, CUVID does (but that doesn't mean it would be faster).

[truexfan81]

DXVA2 CB doesn't let the GPU stay in maximum clock state, CUVID does (but that doesn't mean it would be faster).

didn't say that was how i did it, i have a profile in the nvidia control panel for mpc-hc, so as soon as mpc-hc launches, it goes to full power.

could be the old driver i'm running? 353? i'm installing 359 now, hopefully that helps

[Warner306]

v0.89.17 according to the settings SS attached

I am able to run sharpen edges on a GTS 450. Try switching to Ordered dithering.

[truexfan81]

I am able to run sharpen edges on a GTS 450. Try switching to Ordered dithering.

already using Ordered dithering

edit even with latest driver, its the same, cannot use the new algos, gpu usage jumps from 45% up to 100% as soon as i activate any of them. Adaptive Sharpen does not have that problem.

[omarank]

this works fine for me.
Can you try this and confirm if it works for you:

1. Play a 0% white video clip (you may even use the black borders of a blu ray movie for this test)
2. Force “Source levels: PC” using shortcut keys
3. Now set Black level -16 using shortcut key

If you get the final Black level as 0 then sure it works for you. I get the final level as 1 (and this is due to no change in Black level when going from -8 to -9).

[huhn]

every step looks totally different but -16 isn't even close to reference black 16. i can still see bar 11 and a little bit of bar 10.

using using AVS bt 709 1-black clipping with PC levels

[Georgel]

Hello!

I have been a long time reader, and I own an Acer Laptop, with a i7-4th generation and a gtx860m video card.

Nvidia drivers are a mess, I jst reinstalled windows and I get crashes with every time I open madVR (using MPC HC + internal LAV + madvr).

After the first crash, everything works fine, but I cannot save profiles from NVinspector, to make MPC-HC use madvr, meaning I have to set the behaviour every time I restart.

Also, about edge thinning, the algorythm is superb, I can watch even SD videos in FHD and they don't have aliasing anymore, and look sharp, but edge thinning enabled in both post processing and upscaling refinement and set to 4 in both creates some artifacts. More exactly, it will make some places thicker, and create some waving. It is especially visible with Anime materials, it is not visible (until now) with movies.

Anyone knows how I can solve this problem?

[ryrynz]

Anyone knows how I can solve this problem?

Don't set it to 4. I suspect madshi might look at some of the maximum values in the next version or two.

[Georgel]

Don't set it to 4. I suspect madshi might look at some of the maximum values in the next version or two.

I am more concerned on what settings to set on my NVinspector, and how to remedy my video driver problems, because I am fine with 99% videos even with edge thinning set to 4. (I thought that the algorythms could be a little more optimized, as I can run fallout4 on fullhd, most settings to max, but I am unable to run more than jinc on chroma upsampling, and 4Xedge thinning, and still I get ocasional frame drops on video playback.

I watch some videos got from amvnews.ru, and some of them are probably badly encoded, and this is what causes the frame drops, so no big sweat, but Optimus really breaks my fun , erasing my settings, and making me have to re-set settings through Nvidia Inspector every single time I restart..


Also , I became curious on what the differences between NEEDI3 and jinc chroma upsampling are? I mean, I am unable to see any, but anyone has any examples?

[YxP]

Georgel,

If you get crashes, you might want to disable any overclocking for starters. Also, there is no need to max out madvr settings, bigger is not necessarily better. Especially on sharpening algos. For example, I'd consider any picture destroyed at strength 4. There are chroma upscaling comparisons somewhere in this thread, but I can't find them right now so you just have to take my word - chroma upscaling is less important than luma and if you can run jinc for chroma you are totally fine and maybe even that is an overkill. I use bilateral.

Did quick google search and found this page, maybe it will give you some sense how big or small of an effect chroma upscaling has http://wiki.mikejung.biz/MadVR_Chroma_Upscaling_1080p_Image_Quality

[aufkrawall]

Did quick google search and found this page, maybe it will give you some sense how big or small of an effect chroma upscaling has http://wiki.mikejung.biz/MadVR_Chroma_Upscaling_1080p_Image_Quality
It is uncontroversial that chroma scaling hardly has an effect on 99% of filmed content.
However, the difference can be quite noticeable with artifical content like found in news broadcasts (sometimes they can appear in some way in movies), emblems, cartoons or video game captures.