madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[endpoint122]

hi i use madvr with Media Player Classic - Home Cinema

so i use ffdshow subtitles and it really bad

so i used resize & aspect from ffdshow to 1920 x 1080

the sub be white and good but the video become slow
some times in movie

why ???

[mark0077]

madshi, can I request that frame repeats be displayed in the Ctrl-J stats. It'll help people, well at least me, see when something is wrong with my display rate versus movie rate. I often get 0 dropped frames and 0 delayed frames yet have skippy playback, of course due to repeating frames.. :)

[Dstruct]

hi i use madvr with Media Player Classic - Home Cinema

so i use ffdshow subtitles and it really bad

so i used resize & aspect from ffdshow to 1920 x 1080

the sub be white and good but the video become slow
some times in movie

why ???

Resizing algorithm could be too slow (especially at higher framerates). Try lower quality ones ...

[Hypernova]

@iwens: Do you have any issue with 23.976 fps? I read from the review that SB can't do it.

[dansrfe]

hi i use madvr with Media Player Classic - Home Cinema

so i use ffdshow subtitles and it really bad

so i used resize & aspect from ffdshow to 1920 x 1080

the sub be white and good but the video become slow
some times in movie

why ???

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=157872 ;)

[Mark_A_W]

Thank u for the suggestions if i wan't to maintain the same hqv score as the sandybridge (for bluray playback in tmt5 ) i minimal will need a passive low profile 5670 any suggestions more then welcome :)

How much power will the card pull, meaning if i go for the 5670 how much gpu load can i suspect by up converting from pal to 1080p. As my passive psu has not a lot of headroom left.

And if i wan't to offload the scaling to the cpu what is the best (meaning best video quality solution ) for instance ffdshow spline or is there something better and what will be the downside to the madvr solution, bare with me i am pretty new in the htpc world. My pch c200 didn't need this much attention :)


Um...I think you are just making life difficult for yourself with passive PSU's and anaemic onboard video.

In my experience, to guarantee smooth playback (scaling issues aside), sailing close to the wind on either CPU or GPU utilisation is a recipe for disappointment.

Massive overkill really helps. A real quad core, and beefy gaming card are the go. You need headroom.

I just moved my PC to the next room, and ran the cabling through the wall. Noise is not a problem.

If you want silent, stick with Powerdvd and DXVA.

I know madshi has a silent PC, and I think it limits even him.

[Mark_A_W]

HD5xxxx series work with last Pwstrip version.

Check
http://forums.entechtaiwan.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=0olagjh21jef71leij8s8i6690&topic=7103.0

http://forums.entechtaiwan.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=0olagjh21jef71leij8s8i6690&topic=7103.msg29359#msg29359

Adu

Thanks!

Something to think about.

[nevcairiel]

If you want silent, stick with Powerdvd and DXVA.

I have a GTS 450 (Gigabyte model with their custom silent cooler) coupled with a Phenom II x4 955 and a Scythe Big Shuriken low-profile cooler, and its really not audible at all (only noise i hear is the HDD spinning up when turning it on, once thats done - nothing), and has loads of power to spare for video rendering.

You can pretty much get any mid-range system silent, only the really high-end GPUs tend to be noisy (and thats really total overkill)

[iwens]

@iwens: Do you have any issue with 23.976 fps? I read from the review that SB can't do it.

Well this isn't a issue yet as my plasma tv doesn't support 24p so i set it to 60hz i am told whenu disable uac u can get pretty close 23.973 it's not perfect but pretty close.

[EpsilonX]

To all MadVR users who use FFDShow and MadVR...
Kinda need your help...
It's about the Macrovision error...
Here's the link to my post in FFDShow's thread...

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1476944#post1476944

[hdboy]

Um...I think you are just making life difficult for yourself with passive PSU's and anaemic onboard video.

In my experience, to guarantee smooth playback (scaling issues aside), sailing close to the wind on either CPU or GPU utilisation is a recipe for disappointment.

Massive overkill really helps. A real quad core, and beefy gaming card are the go. You need headroom.

I just moved my PC to the next room, and ran the cabling through the wall. Noise is not a problem.

If you want silent, stick with Powerdvd and DXVA.

I know madshi has a silent PC, and I think it limits even him.

I do okay with my fanless GT430 and a rather old athlon X2, for everything up to decrypted bluray. I do have to use exclusive mode, though.

[fairchild]

To all MadVR users who use FFDShow and MadVR...
Kinda need your help...
It's about the Macrovision error...
Here's the link to my post in FFDShow's thread...

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1476944#post1476944

I just tested this with the rev3751 ICL12 from XvidVideo.ru and with MadVR, the DVD won't even load, I just get a black screen. I generally just switch renderers to EVR-CP and I can play DVD's.

Also just downloaded and installed the latest ffdshow_rev3757_20110209_xvidvideo-ru_x86_icl12 and still same issue.

[Hypernova]

Well this isn't a issue yet as my plasma tv doesn't support 24p so i set it to 60hz i am told whenu disable uac u can get pretty close 23.973 it's not perfect but pretty close.

:thanks:

[iwens]

Well i followed the guide and let ffdshow upscale, my cpu load is below 20 % even when upscaling a low divx 480x270 4 times to 1920x1080 with the ffdshow spline filter.

The result is pretty good, i know i probably loose a bit of quality because of the lower quality up scalers in ffdshow but for now i can live with that.

[dansrfe]

Well i followed the guide and let ffdshow upscale, my cpu load is below 20 % even when upscaling a low divx 480x270 4 times to 1920x1080 with the ffdshow spline filter.

The result is pretty good, i know i probably loose a bit of quality because of the lower quality up scalers in ffdshow but for now i can live with that.

Spline resizing is not lower quality. In fact it is pretty much equivalent to what madVR does from the higher-end resizers. AutoResize makes this job even easier and has other features as well.

[EpsilonX]

I just tested this with the rev3751 ICL12 from XvidVideo.ru and with MadVR, the DVD won't even load, I just get a black screen. I generally just switch renderers to EVR-CP and I can play DVD's.

Also just downloaded and installed the latest ffdshow_rev3757_20110209_xvidvideo-ru_x86_icl12 and still same issue.

I just tested rev3757 from XvidVideo.ru and it also works fine...
The black screen..?
I got it around 3/10 times... :p

[namaiki]

I just tested rev3757 from XvidVideo.ru and it also works fine...
The black screen..?
I got it around 3/10 times... :p

Is madVR loading for sure? Not a fallback video renderer like VMR7?

[EpsilonX]

Is madVR loading for sure? Not a fallback video renderer like VMR7?

Yup... :D

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/7459/16263048.th.jpg (http://img196.imageshack.us/i/16263048.jpg/)

[namaiki]

Does Zoom Player have it's own DVD Navigator, or does it use the MS one like MPC-HC?

[EpsilonX]

Does Zoom Player have it's own DVD Navigator, or does it use the MS one like MPC-HC?

Microsoft's DVD Navigator...
There are others, but it won't connect...
ZP also state that the Microsoft's DVD Navigator is HIGHLY recommended... :rolleyes:

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/164/zp2pq.th.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/zp2pq.jpg/)

[Hypernova]

Well i followed the guide and let ffdshow upscale, my cpu load is below 20 % even when upscaling a low divx 480x270 4 times to 1920x1080 with the ffdshow spline filter.

The result is pretty good, i know i probably loose a bit of quality because of the lower quality up scalers in ffdshow but for now i can live with that.

As dansrfe said, the resizer isn't the issue. One of madVR strong point is avoiding any screwed up from GPU/driver since madVR tell GPU "This is a game running, don't do any video conversion on it."

[dansrfe]

Exactly. Also I'm starting to see some rough transitions when doing exclusive <-> windowed. The audio will cut out for a second then go to windowed for example. madVR's ability to tell the GPU to scale using Spline in a "game" mode is a very clever use of the GPU. All that we need is madVR to support subtitle rendering and fix some exclusive <-> windowed kinks out of it then I'm sure a lot more people will be happy. But as of now, using some automatic resizer in ffdshow (like AutoResize: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=157872 ) is the only way we can get everything we want from madVR and will be the only way people with weaker gpu's can utilize high-quality resizing.

[aduwind]

I just tested rev3757 from XvidVideo.ru and it also works fine...
The black screen..?
I got it around 3/10 times... :p

It seems to work here !!! - Tested with several titles
MPC-HC 15.1.2190
Win7 64 Ultra
FFdshow 3757 -Mpeg2 libavcodec


Activated filters during DVD playback:
DVD Navigator
FFDSHOW VIDEO
FFDSHOW AUDIO
MADVRENDER
DIRECTSOUND

Adu

[jmone]

Which complied version of 3757 did you use? There are three listed at http://www.xvidvideo.ru/ffdshow-tryouts-project-x86-x64/ffdshow-tryouts-project-svn-3757-x86-x64.html
Thanks
Nathan

[fairchild]

The only way I've gotten MadVR to work with DVD's on Win7 64-bit is using AnyDVD. This removes the CSS protection (or most other protections), and allows the DVD to play through the renderer.

[Mark_A_W]

The only way I've gotten MadVR to work with DVD's on Win7 64-bit is using AnyDVD. This removes the CSS protection (or most other protections), and allows the DVD to play through the renderer.


?

I'm 99% certain I get Macrovision failure with W7 x64 and madVR with Anydvd.

I can check again, but it bit me the other day.

[robpdotcom]

?

I'm 99% certain I get Macrovision failure with W7 x64 and madVR with Anydvd.

I do, and ffdshow rev 3757 doesn't fix it for me either.

[EpsilonX]

It seems to work here !!! - Tested with several titles
MPC-HC 15.1.2190
Win7 64 Ultra
FFdshow 3757 -Mpeg2 libavcodec


Activated filters during DVD playback:
DVD Navigator
FFDSHOW VIDEO
FFDSHOW AUDIO
MADVRENDER
DIRECTSOUND

Adu

Are you using ZoomPlayer or MPC-HC..?
You wrote MPC-HC, but even though I can play DVD with FFDShow+MadVR+ZP...
FFDShow+MadVR+MPC-HC, Macrovision failed... :confused:

?

I'm 99% certain I get Macrovision failure with W7 x64 and madVR with Anydvd.

I can check again, but it bit me the other day.

I do, and ffdshow rev 3757 doesn't fix it for me either.

MPC-HC or ZP..?

Additional things that I found...
ZP's DVD setting have this "Internal Audio DSP" thing...

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/164/zp2pq.th.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/zp2pq.jpg/)

This is disabled by default...
However, when I enable it then Macrovision error...
Since I got a macrovision error in FFDShow+MPC-HC, I try DScaler+MPC-HC which also threw an error...
Then I try to disable MPC-HC "Audio Switcher"...
Still error with FFDShow+MPC-HC, however DScaler+MPC-HC now works :rolleyes: (though it render the menu as black screen)...

So...

FFDShow+MadVR+ZP (Audio DSP disabled) = SUCCESS
FFDShow+MadVR+ZP (Audio DSP enabled) = MACROVISION ERROR

FFDShow+MadVR+MPC-HC = MACROVISION ERROR
DScaler+MadVR+MPC-HC = MACROVISION ERROR

FFDShow+MadVR+MPC-HC (Audio Switcher disabled) = MACROVISION ERROR :confused:
DScaler+MadVR+MPC-HC (Audio Switcher disabled) = SUCCESS (Black screen in Menu)

*
Windows 7 Ultimate 32-bit
FFDShow rev3757 ICL12 XvidVideo.ru
DScaler IVTC

MadVR didn't like audio switcher/DSP..? :rolleyes:
And maybe different way ZP and MPC-HC handles stuff that cause "FFDShow+MadVR+MPC-HC (Audio Switcher disabled)" to fail..?

[Mark_A_W]

I'm using ZP, but I'm using Ffdshow 3611 - I will upgrade.

[robpdotcom]

MPC-HC or ZP..?

MPC-HC. I said it wasn't working, then I read:


FFDShow+MadVR+MPC-HC = MACROVISION ERROR
DScaler+MadVR+MPC-HC = MACROVISION ERROR

FFDShow+MadVR+MPC-HC (Audio Switcher disabled) = MACROVISION ERROR :confused:
DScaler+MadVR+MPC-HC (Audio Switcher disabled) = SUCCESS (Black screen in Menu)

I have the same results with MPC-HC, plus

DScaler+MadVR+MPC-HC+any of the following filters:

ffdshow raw video filter
ffdshow video decoder (MPEG2 disabled, raw video enabled)
DirectVOBSub auto loading (set to "Always Load")

Any of those 3 filters will give full menu support, with or without MPC-HC's Audio Switcher.

Funny, I can also use ffshow raw video filter or DirectVOBSub (Always Load) to play WMC Recorded TV (.wtv) in MPC-HC. Without the raw video filter or DirectVOBSub (Always Load), I get a black screen with .wtv files.

EDIT: I also need AnyDVD running, otherwise I get a "DVD Copy Protect Fail" message.

[mark0077]

Are any of you using the non microsoft dvd navigators recently posted on these forums. They allow me to use madVR, or any other renderer with dvds without any macrovision errors.

[robpdotcom]

Are any of you using the non microsoft dvd navigators recently posted on these forums. They allow me to use madVR, or any other renderer with dvds without any macrovision errors.

No, but can you give an example? I'd rather not be tied to a specific ffdshow version.

[EpsilonX]

I have the same results with MPC-HC, plus

DScaler+MadVR+MPC-HC+any of the following filters:

ffdshow raw video filter
ffdshow video decoder (MPEG2 disabled, raw video enabled)
DirectVOBSub auto loading (set to "Always Load")

Any of those 3 filters will give full menu support, with or without MPC-HC's Audio Switcher.

Yeah forgot to test that...
Previously I was using DScaler+MadVR+ZP+FFDShow RAW... :rolleyes:

Are any of you using the non microsoft dvd navigators recently posted on these forums. They allow me to use madVR, or any other renderer with dvds without any macrovision errors.

No, but can you give an example? I'd rather not be tied to a specific ffdshow version.

dslibdvdnav..?

http://sourceforge.net/projects/dslibdvdnav

Read bout it, haven't try it... :p
Gonna give it a go tonight...

[mark0077]

Well theres one which involves replacing a qdvd.dll file, this is the one I used and voila dvds work with madVR :D I got confused myself with that and the dslibdvdnav one, but qdvd.dll was the one that worked for me. Didn't like the idea of using the dslibdvdnav one as it was using an oldish mpc-hc exe version and I would have preferred the latest and greatest mpc-hc :)

Will be good to have a push towards having the opensource dvd navigator moved into mpc-hc though, even as a non default optional dvd navigator... Any movement on that tetsuo55?

[QQ]

does madvr do any kind of vsync optimizations to fix tearing?

also, what does exclusive mode do?

[EpsilonX]

Well theres one which involves replacing a qdvd.dll file, this is the one I used and voila dvds work with madVR :D I got confused myself with that and the dslibdvdnav one, but qdvd.dll was the one that worked for me. Didn't like the idea of using the dslibdvdnav one as it was using an oldish mpc-hc exe version and I would have preferred the latest and greatest mpc-hc :)

Will be good to have a push towards having the opensource dvd navigator moved into mpc-hc though, even as a non default optional dvd navigator... Any movement on that tetsuo55?

Oh the qdvd.dl approach...
As I am using ZoomPlayer, and since it worked just fine with XvidVideo.ru's FFDShow, I'm good for now... :rolleyes:
Altough don't know why other build cant work... :confused:

[aduwind]

which complied version of 3757 did you use? There are three listed at http://www.xvidvideo.ru/ffdshow-tryouts-project-x86-x64/ffdshow-tryouts-project-svn-3757-x86-x64.html
thanks
nathan

icl12

[fairchild]

?

I'm 99% certain I get Macrovision failure with W7 x64 and madVR with Anydvd.

I can check again, but it bit me the other day.

I dunno, I've tested with 3 discs so far, and all play perfectly. Without AnyDVD, I just get a black screen. All the filters seem to load but just a black screen (DVD navigator, MadVR, ffdshow video and audio, reclock).

I tested the following DVD's: Avatar, Matrix, M:I-2.

I have about 50 other DVD's but I don't plan to test them all with this method. :)

I'm using 3757 ffdshow ICL12 version, potplayer 1.5.26695, latest reclock, latest madvr etc.

I looked in my system32 folders and the qdvd.dll version I have is 6.6.7600.16385

And again, if I just select EVR-CP I can play all DVD's perfectly as well without AnyDVD, but then I lose MadVR's FSE mode to get rid of the annoying tearing I get with Aero-Off.

[dansrfe]

For anyone that wants DVD's to work with madVR in Windows 7:

Here's qdvd.dll: http://www.sendspace.com/file/xyixyb

Replace the qdvd.dll in your system32 and syswow64 directories. You will have to take ownership of those dlls in order to modify/delete them.

[Plutotype]

Hi everyone,
I just bought RME Babyface audio card for music production, but at blu-ray playback in MPC-HC, the card has sound dropouts, cracklings etc..Please look at this picture:
http://postimage.org/image/1z3clus78/

I have HD5670 Sapphire Ultimate, 11.1. Catalyst.

This "bad" red latency issue is not present with EVR CP, also with DXVA enabled or not. The DPC latency check then gives only "good" low green bars. But as you can see, with madvr the latency goes up very badly and i get this crackles and dropouts at the playback. The solution is to increase the buffer size (latency) to maxiumum at 48kHz - 2048 samples. I have not watched a full movie at this setting, but higher buffer sometimes can solve the issue but overally can not, the audio playback will be affected.

Can somebody please check on your setup or explain?
Here is the link to the DPC Latency checker:
http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

Thanks
Pluto

[leeperry]

Can somebody check at his setup
that's a "Firestone Bravo" USB transport on XPSP3 w/ CoreAVC CUDA & PotPlayer: http://thumbnails39.imagebam.com/11930/fa4fbc119294380.jpg (http://www.imagebam.com/image/fa4fbc119294380)

I never ever get a single audio glitch....actually this set up is utterly boring, coz everything works like a charmhttp://forum-images.hardware.fr/images/perso/5/puccavooz.gif

[pankov]

Well,
that's interesting.
Here is the comparison of EVR (first part) and madVR (second part) in ZoomPlayer playing a 1080p H264 mkv with everything same except the renderer.
http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/3573/dpclatencychecker.th.png (http://img833.imageshack.us/i/dpclatencychecker.png/)
As you can see there is a definite increase in latency when using madVR but hopefully for the moment it's not causing any problems.

[endpoint122]

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=157872 ;)

it's great
but with mkv it's so slow
save as resize from ffdshow

anyway to fix this in dvdrip it great but mkv slow


and when change madvr to evr custom
the slow gone but there problem come
cpu usage go in mkv from 30% to 80%

[cyberbeing]

@pankov
That is probably being caused by a graphics driver bug. Both ATI and NVIDIA occasionally have a string of buggy driver releases with high DPC load for no reason.
Run one of the DPC latency profiling tools. If on Windows Vista or 7, you can download the Windows Performance Toolkit and use xperf as described here: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/peterwie/archive/2008/10/06/measuring-dpc-time.aspx or you can use the older RATTV3.

http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/3479/evrdpc.pnghttp://img534.imageshack.us/img534/5734/madvrdpc.png
EVR on left, madVR on right.

[Mangix]

how do you guys achieve such low DPC latencies? The best I can do on my Windows 7 machine is around 150-200...

[dansrfe]

how do you guys achieve such low DPC latencies? The best I can do on my Windows 7 machine is around 150-200...

I second that...

[cyberbeing]

You get low DPC latency by using quality drivers and hardware. It's also worth mentioning that my screen-shots are from Windows XP, which in general has less driver-related DPC issues then Windows Vista or Windows 7.

Use a DPC latency profiling tool to identify what is casing the spikes. Try different hardware drivers and see if there are any hotfix updates for the Windows components causing DPC latency. That is about all you can do. If your hardware vendor has horrible DPC latency in all their drivers, next time you'll need to buy hardware which doesn't. Unfortunately, finding good hardware with good drivers isn't always easy.

The best I can do on my Windows 7 machine is around 150-200...
For comparison, my idle DPC latency on Windows XP is 7-10μs. You should at least be able to get your idle DPC latency down to ~50μs on Windows 7.

[vood007]

how do you guys achieve such low DPC latencies? The best I can do on my Windows 7 machine is around 150-200...

I guess he is using XP. The higher latency on Vista/7 comes from UMDF and some security features. On x64 WOW64 may add a bit too.

[Plutotype]

@pankov
That is probably being caused by a graphics driver bug. Both ATI and NVIDIA occasionally have a string of buggy driver releases with high DPC load for no reason.
Run one of the DPC latency profiling tools. If on Windows Vista or 7, you can download the Windows Performance Toolkit and use xperf as described here: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/peterwie/archive/2008/10/06/measuring-dpc-time.aspx or you can use the older RATTV3.

http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/3479/evrdpc.pnghttp://img534.imageshack.us/img534/5734/madvrdpc.png
EVR on left, madVR on right.

Hi,
Thanks for your input. The RME soundcard is performing well in any other setup except of madvr setup. I tried Catalyst 10.10e, 11.1,11.1a. Tried to disable all possible components, including disabling network, usb ports, optical drive, raid controller, integrated sound and HDMI audio...nothing helped. And as EVR CP in DXVA or non-DXVA worked well(nice low latency), its not about the new RME soundcard.

I know, that madvr needs more GPU resources than other renderers, but it can not cause such fundamental error in handling real-time audio and video streams. You mentioned, I should use quality hardware with quality drivers. Sapphire HD5670 with 11.1a drivers, RME soundcard with latest drivers, Gigabyte X58 UD5 MB with latest BIOS, i7 980x and latest versions of the playback software. What else could be wrong?:)

If its a GPU issue, the whole HD5XXX series is affected then. What card to use?

Thanks
Plutotype

[cyberbeing]

Did you run a DPC profiling tool yet? Without doing so, you won't be able to track down the cause with any certainty.

You mentioned, I should use quality hardware with quality drivers. If its a GPU issue, the whole HD5XXX series is affected then. What card to use?
I think you misunderstood me slightly. DPC latency issues are caused by drivers, not hardware.

You just need to have quality drivers with all your hardware. Hardware quality doesn't matter for DPC, but who wants to use junk hardware. Eww. ;)