View Full Version : madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)
i have a sony Tv here and it is really bilinear with 120 hz this is not a joke well maybe from sony.
the 60 HZ 1080->2160 is decent but far from a really good scaler.
mclingo
1st July 2021, 17:15
i'm with SamuriHL, i think we'll see V1.0 at some point, I think MADSHI would understand the massive disappointment to us all for all our support if we dont see this, most of us are also happy to pay for it should that be the only option.
We'll just have to see what happens and continue to enjoy what we have, and what we've had for years completely free of charge :)
oldpainlesskodi
1st July 2021, 17:34
^ What he said.
SoySauceWDF
2nd July 2021, 01:23
I've got a weird issue using madvr that's been happening for a while. If I pause or sometimes randomly during playback, the render queue drops to 3-4/8 and I start getting dropped frames. It fills up if I backup a little bit and start playing again. I've messed with queue sizes, vsync, present frames in advance, etc, almost every setting I could think of.
Running windowed with D3D11, output in sdr bt.2020 and 10 bit, display set to 12 bit. Happened on both my 2080 ti and 3090, latest drivers. Wondering if its an issue with nvidia outputting 12 bit?
ryrynz
2nd July 2021, 02:58
Well the easiest way to test is by simply outputting to 8-Bit instead yeah?
No there's no problems with outputting 12-bit with your GPU, if there was you would've seen a post about it.
If it's randomly dropping the queue down it's either an app that's interfering with it or it's your config in which case, reset, revert, restore etc.
SoySauceWDF
2nd July 2021, 03:12
It seems to stop doing in when its set to D3D9 but I'd like to run D3D11 so I can output 12 bit. Does it using DXVA2 copyback as well. I've done multiple windows clean installs and used the default settings and have tested multiple settings. Don't know what app could be interfering, any common ones? Kind of a head scratcher
ryrynz
2nd July 2021, 08:19
Would recommend booting without anything programs loading in startup and also changing you power profiles with your graphics card and PC just to test that the system isn't moving into lower power states for whatever reason. Short of that I really don't know, but I would be logging everything I can in the system to figure out what's triggering it. Might be a tough one to nail down.
tp4tissue
2nd July 2021, 14:00
We're all very confident Madvr as a paid software pack will have a wide market.
As a $2000-3000 device, It's a tough sell.
Upscaling just isn't that important.
Tonemapping, we're getting brighter and better devices every year that do their own tonemapping, this solution is better overall as the devices are aware of the impact of its own ABL. Once we hit a steady 1000 nit on devices, which is already possible just too expensive on LMCL, tonemapping itself becomes niche. Those 4000nit dolby pulsars arn't getting that much use, The panasonic 1000nit lmcl builds are much more widely used grading monitors.
3DLut, I love madvr's implementation to death, but high end TVs support this.
Where is the niche for Envy. The Sony/Epson, all of their expensive projector units will also improve on internal tonemapping year over year.
_Projectors_ in general going the way of the dodo.
_Oleds_ getting BIGGER and CHEAPER all the time.
_LCDs_ Already hitting 1500nits
_LMCL_ Most promising short term solution @ ~500nits
_Samsung QNED_ Self Emmisive. Spanks Oled in sustained output, <in active development, allegedly screen burn proof.>
Madvr's PRIMARY societal role has been to leverage the average ghetto boxes of the PC-masses and turning them into very capable, high-Quality video players.
Going the ENVY route, madshi is taking a path away from his BIGGEST FAN BASE, the people MOST LIKELY and WILLING to PAY HIM MONEY.
Compared to Madvr's existing success reaching the eyes and imagination of world wide active users, Envy is going from an ocean to a drop.
Then there's the point of sale dilemmas. It usually takes a salesmen to sell a $3000 box. These guys take a cut, you have consumer education, friction upon friction.
Meanwhile, we the madvr Fanbase, madshi doesn't have to prove anything to us, we know this stuff is legit, Take my money, we want m0ar madvr.
I even setup madvr for my grandma. That's how much koolaid I am downing. .
tp4tissue
2nd July 2021, 14:17
@ Soysaucewdf,
You have to TEST 10 bit VISUALLY, don't just turn it on and assume it works, it may not work, it may actually be worse (Some LG oleds).
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1928929#post1928929
SoySauceWDF
2nd July 2021, 16:17
I've tested it on my Epson 5050UB and 10/12 bit works fine, at least to my eyes. I watched a movie in Fullscreen Exclusive last night and it didn't have any render queue issues, so might be a window overlay problem with windows/nvidia/something else. Just had 2 presentation glitches at the very start but was smooth from then on so might just stick with FSE
ashlar42
2nd July 2021, 17:06
Do I assume correctly that to avoid "glitches" it's not recommended to set 1 frame to be rendered in advance and not more? Is there anything else to do? I've pretty much solved the custom refresh thing (at least with madVR, in Kodi for some reasons it's avoiding the custom refresh rates in HDR, while accepting them in SDR) and I don't want no stinking glitches in my media viewing! :-D
FSE can lower presentation issues but this is usually issue with a different program interfering with madVR
galneon
3rd July 2021, 05:24
Getting a C1 tomorrow so it looks like I need to move to the timed betas... Is the beta closed or am I missing a really obvious link?
http://madshi.net/madVRhdrMeasure134.zip
galneon
3rd July 2021, 07:40
Thank you. :)
ashlar42
3rd July 2021, 16:53
FSE can lower presentation issues but this is usually issue with a different program interfering with madVRSuch as? This is a dedicated HTPC machine, so I don't think there's a lot going on "behind the scenes". If you have anything in mind, please share it, as it could help me looking in the right direction.
Thanks in advance!
i don't know the name but programs to lower blue light output.
el Filou
3rd July 2021, 19:45
In Windows Task Manager, Details tab, add the GPU column and sort by its usage and watch it during playback (you can move the colum to the leftmost position and put TM in the lower right corner) to see if another process uses the GPU from time to time.
Maybe also use something like GPU-Z to check if there's not something wrong with clocks/GPU utilization.
ashlar42
4th July 2021, 00:18
i don't know the name but programs to lower blue light output.f.lux I don't have installed on the HTPC. But I'll check for the similar function in Windows 10... also good suggestion on checking task manager. I'll try that as well.
C1/CX owners how does your motion options at lowest/closest to 100% frame blending look compared to madVR's Smooth Motion? Are we almost there near MadVR quality yet?
Cinema Screen in conjunction with TruMotion Cinematic Movement is satisfactory in my limited experience (I've had the C1 for just a couple of weeks).
wushantao
4th July 2021, 01:01
http://madshi.net/madVRhdrMeasure134.zip
http://madshi.net/madVRhdrMeasure135.zip
135 is out:D
ryrynz
4th July 2021, 01:09
Getting a C1 tomorrow so it looks like I need to move to the timed betas
Why do you think you need to use the betas?
Cinema Screen in conjunction with TruMotion Cinematic Movement is satisfactory in my limited experience (I've had the C1 for just a couple of weeks).
Nice. How's the upscaling?
galneon
4th July 2021, 10:41
Why do you think you need to use the betas?
Because I read several months ago that the betas mostly relate to HDR and I wanted to be safe rather than sorry. Now that I have an HDR display and have enabled pass-through HDR, I'm not certain the tone-mapping updates apply to me in any way, and it's possible the betas don't benefit me at all--but I nonetheless 'upgraded' from x.17. If you can enlighten me, I'd be happy to learn from you as I've read your posts for several years and I'm sure you're more informed than I am...
I just haven't paid attention closely enough to know for certain either way as I am only in the market for new equipment when I'm willing to spend the money--an event that only comes after so many years. ;)
el Filou
4th July 2021, 13:09
The betas won't change anything for you if you use passthrough, they're only useful if you use tonemapping.
With recent LGs there is a way to avoid the TV doing any tonemapping and have only madVR do it, but you've got to really know what you're doing (there are threads at AVS Forum for that), if not passthrough is the safest option.
galneon
4th July 2021, 19:33
Thanks!
ashlar42
4th July 2021, 23:32
Nice. How's the upscaling?So, regarding motion... the settings I mentioned work fine for 95-99% of the times. There's "glimpses" of SOE that I catch for a second or so, because I'm currently constantly on the lookout for them. But nothing jarring, nothing that stands out unnaturally, to be honest. I think it's a satisfactory experience. And I was expecting worse.
Upscaling of TV broadcast material is ok. For movie/tv sources I always use madVR and I don't have the time to test by outputting native resolution and having the TV do the upscaling. Moreover, comparing without being able to do a side by side risks being pointless (unless TV upscaling quality is really crap, which I don't imagine to be).
LenniePaz
5th July 2021, 16:51
I have a couple settings questions, that I'm not sure about. I'm using MadVR for tone mapping.
1. Based on this info, "The colour depth the Epson 5050UB now supports includes 4:4:4 in 8-bit, 4:2:2 in 8/10/12 bit, and 4:2:0 in 8/10/12 bit at 60Hz. In 24Hz it supports both 4:4:4 and 4:2:2 in 8/10/12 bit resolution", should I set the Nvidia Control Panel to 8 bit or 12 bit, and should I use Full or Limited?
2. I have 2 profiles set up. One for SDR, and the other for HDR. The guy who calibrated my Epson, did SDR in BT.709, and HDR in BT.2020. Where it asks how the display was calibrated, should I put BT.709 in the SDR profile, and BT.2020 in the HDR profile? If using BT.2020 for the HDR profile, should I put a checkmark in "report BT.2020 to display"?
3. Should I put a checkmark in "enable gamma processing"?
Thanks!
Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
1. depends on your device 8 is often just the save choice.
2. if you have an nvdiia card and you are tone mapping yes send bt 2020 and this display is calibrated to BT 2020 should be correct.
3. no only matter if you want to change the gamma.
LenniePaz
5th July 2021, 21:47
1. depends on your device 8 is often just the save choice.
2. if you have an nvdiia card and you are tone mapping yes send bt 2020 and this display is calibrated to BT 2020 should be correct.
3. no only matter if you want to change the gamma.Can it screw the colors up if I set it to 12 bit, instead of 8?
Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
bit deep has nothing todo with color as long as your device isn't buggy no it can't.
LenniePaz
5th July 2021, 22:16
bit deep has nothing todo with color as long as your device isn't buggy no it can't.So I may as well just set it to 12 bit then?
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tp4tissue
5th July 2021, 22:19
Use 8bit 444, there's no reason to go down to 422 for 10bit. 444 is way more visually impactful than 10bit, and that's assuming the device actually does 10bit properly.
The only thing 10bit is visually useful for is smooth gradients, which don't come up often in movies. Whereas 444 flat out gives you better texture detail, and this is across the board.
I don't know how that device behaves for color but it shouldn't clamp saturation based on bit-depth, unless it's suppose to be kicking into an sdr/hdr mode.
LenniePaz
6th July 2021, 01:42
The Nvidia control panel only has a choice of 8 bit or 12 bit for some reason, so I'll just use 8. Where do I choose 4:4:4 for 8 bit though?
Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
ng4ever
6th July 2021, 01:46
Does anyone think madVR will work in Windows 11 ok ?
ashlar42
6th July 2021, 16:08
Not strictly madVR related, but this thing happens with Kodi DSPlayer using madVR... I repost from Kodi forums, hoping that with so many video enthusiasts here my chances of a solution might increase.
I want my Kodi GUI at 60Hz. I start from my desktop at 60Hz. Kodi starts at 60Hz. When I play something it switches refresh rate correctly. I stop the video. I exit Kodi. As soon as the process is terminated (Kodi.exe, I mean), the screen switches to 50Hz.
Anything comes to mind as to why this could be happening? If I don't use the refresh rate functionality, it doesn't happen.
I have tried launching in portable mode, same thing. This happens both with Kodi 19 and Kodi 17.6 DSPlayer (which switches through madVR). So I'd be inclined to say it's not strictly Kodi dependent. But if I play back a video with MPC-HC, it switches refresh rate correctly but when I exit the player nothing happens, it goes back to 60Hz and stays that way.
jkauff
6th July 2021, 20:22
What does Windows say the default resolution of your monitor is? What does your graphics card say it is? What does Kodi say it is? I suspect there's a discrepancy there somewhere.
ashlar42
6th July 2021, 21:01
What does Windows say the default resolution of your monitor is? What does your graphics card say it is? What does Kodi say it is? I suspect there's a discrepancy there somewhere.
Is there a “default” resolution in Windows? Where do you see that? Same for the GPU… if there is one, I guess it’s 2160p60, that’s how drivers set up the resolution when newly installed.
Kodi always starts at desktop resolution/refresh.
oldpainlesskodi
6th July 2021, 21:10
I found with DSplayer, I have to let kodi do the refresh rate switch, otherwise I get that same problem you have described - just my experience.
hannes69
6th July 2021, 22:29
Is there a “default” resolution in Windows? Where do you see that?
A display device 'tells' this to the GPU driver and the OS in its EDID.
You can read the EDID with e.g. EDIDViewer and there you'll see a 'preferred' timing mentioned.
This is the one that is used when installing a new driver.
ashlar42
7th July 2021, 00:23
Solved it! In Kodi System/Display settings, under resolution, there were two 3840x2160p resolutions. One for 50Hz and one for 60Hz. For some reason, the 50 Hz one got chosen. And that was messing things up.
Oldpainlesskodi, I have madVR handling refresh switch and it works correctly (now).
LenniePaz
7th July 2021, 00:46
Solved it! In Kodi System/Display settings, under resolution, there were two 3840x2160p resolutions. One for 50Hz and one for 60Hz. For some reason, the 50 Hz one got chosen. And that was messing things up.
Oldpainlesskodi, I have madVR handling refresh switch and it works correctly (now).I'm using Kodi with DSPlayer too. Have you noticed when you start a video, that you get a black screen for 5 seconds, but you do get audio?
Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
oldpainlesskodi
7th July 2021, 07:37
@ashlar42 - seems that was my issue too. Thanks.
ashlar42
7th July 2021, 11:08
I'm using Kodi with DSPlayer too. Have you noticed when you start a video, that you get a black screen for 5 seconds, but you do get audio?
That depends on how quick your TV is in switching refresh rate, I suppose. Regular Kodi has an option to delay the start of playback to accomodate that. I don't remember if that worked for DSPlayer with madVR or not. The new TV I'm using is almost instantaneous in switching, so I haven't thought about that.
@ashlar42 - seems that was my issue too. Thanks.Oh, wow! Glad to have been of help.
Sorry all for the semi-offtopic, btw.
ashlar42
7th July 2021, 14:47
One question I have. I ended up going back to old, trusty Reclock (thanks to redfox for making it Win10 compatible). I forgot how easy it is to get perfectly smooth results with it.
Since that exists only in 32 bit, am I missing something in madVR by not using the x64 build? Or in LAV filters, if you know something...
Everything seems to be working perfectly but I might be missing something.
HillieSan
7th July 2021, 15:22
Why did you install reclock? Didn’t madvr work for fine after a fresh install? It worked fine for me.
@ashlar42
Reclock is a good audio renderer, I've been using it for years. I don't think you will miss something at 32 bit.
nevcairiel
7th July 2021, 16:51
32-bit will be limiting you sooner or later. Software decoders are significantly slower on 32-bit, and hardware decoding won't engage for very high resolutions due to memory limits (> 4K, I believe, its driver-controlled). It might work today, but it does not have a future.
32-bit will be limiting you sooner or later. Software decoders are significantly slower on 32-bit, and hardware decoding won't engage for very high resolutions due to memory limits (> 4K, I believe, its driver-controlled). It might work today, but it does not have a future.
Some of us are still using reclock, and that is why we stick to 32 bit, the other 64 bit alternatives are not so good.
ashlar42
7th July 2021, 17:19
Why did you install reclock? Didn’t madvr work for fine after a fresh install? It worked fine for me.I installed Reclock not to have to worry about precise refresh rates. I hate dropped/repeated frames. I always notice them when watching video content. And I wasn’t managing to keep 10 bit when creating custom resolutions.
32-bit will be limiting you sooner or later. Software decoders are significantly slower on 32-bit, and hardware decoding won't engage for very high resolutions due to memory limits (> 4K, I believe, its driver-controlled). It might work today, but it does not have a future.Sure, but I just bought a 4K TV, won’t care for 8K content for a long while (if ever). If I don’t miss anything up to 4K HDR content, I’m not missing anything. Having said this, I have checked, a RTX 3070 supports VP11 which includes "maximum resolution of up to 8192 x 8192 pixels (8k resolution) for all HEVC and VP9 profiles", up to and including Main 4:4:4 12. I think I'm covered on that front.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia_PureVideo#The_eleventh_generation_PureVideo_HD
Michael2907
7th July 2021, 18:11
Jemand hier mit einem JVC N7?
Gesendet von meinem SM-N960F mit Tapatalk
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