madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[madshi]

it already does internally
Interesting! :)

FWIW, have you updated to the latest version of the subtitle interface header? I had added a new parameter ("context") to the Request/DeliverFrame methods.

One argument against using the subtitle interface for the menus is that madVR currently only supports one subtitle provider. So once xy-vsfilter supports the new interface, madVR users would have to choose between xy-vsfilter subtitles and LAV DVD menus. So I guess it's better to keep things as they are for now. Of course I could add support for multiple providers, but I'm not sure how much sense that really makes. The better solution might be to add multiple input pins, to match EVR's behaviour. But that's *A LOT* of extra work, so it won't come soon...

[Prinz]

madVR v0.84.4 released

http://madshi.net/madVR.zip


The Link is still 0.84.3 here.

[nevcairiel]

Where do you get other subtitles on a DVD? The DVD Navigator doesnt care if its menus or subtitles, it all has to go directly to the decoder, xy-vsfilter cannot be inserted here.
I suppose you could have external subtitles somewhere, but for DVD discs, is that common?

[madshi]

The Link is still 0.84.3 here.
My fault. Should be fixed now.

Where do you get other subtitles on a DVD? The DVD Navigator doesnt care if its menus or subtitles, it all has to go directly to the decoder, xy-vsfilter cannot be inserted here.
I suppose you could have external subtitles somewhere, but for DVD discs, is that common?
Good question. I suppose external subs could be possible, but then, you'd probably use a reencode for that? I don't really know...

[Prinz]

QUESTION: Which video decoder is used when playing DVDs with EVR *without* AnyDVD?

LAV and Cyberlink powerdvd 10 decoders tested. Both work with EVR, but not with madvr.

[madshi]

Hmmmm... Who is responsible then for the DVD decryption? Does the splitter do it? The video decoder? Or somebody else?

[nevcairiel]

I would've figured the open source things to fail, but at least Cyberlink to work.
From what i know about how the decryption works, the decoder should do it, but i really don't know the details.

[madshi]

But then how can LAV Video Decoder work with EVR without AnyDVD? You don't decrypt in LAV Video Decoder, do you?

[nevcairiel]

There is some decryption code in LAV based on DeCSS, however i don't think its ever called, i just did a quick check, and the encryption marker in the bitstream is not set when EVR is used.
I "inherited" that code from MPC-HC more or less =p

[madshi]

Weird, I wonder if anybody still alive today knows how decryption is supposed to work inside of MPC-HC... :)

[nevcairiel]

Its possible the player keys hardcoded in there are just all invalid/blacklisted by now =p

[Prinz]

That is the Error I get with Zoomplayer without anydvd:

Key exchange for DVD copy protection failed

[madshi]

Its possible the player keys hardcoded in there are just all invalid/blacklisted by now =p
Yeah, but then why does LAV Video Decoder work fine with encrypted DVDs when using EVR? EVR just gets raw video, it can't have much to do with the actual decryption.

That is the Error I get with Zoomplayer without anydvd:

Key exchange for DVD copy protection failed
Hmmm... But why does that depend on the renderer being used? Isn't the key exchange done by the splitter or decoder?

[nevcairiel]

Yeah, but then why does LAV Video Decoder work fine with encrypted DVDs when using EVR? EVR just gets raw video, it can't have much to do with the actual decryption

My guess is that there is some communication between the DVD Navigator and EVR which makes the DVD Navigator consider the playback chain "safe", and so it decrypts the data before it gets to the decoder.

However, it doesn't trust madVR, and stuff is still encrypted.

[madshi]

Yeah, that would be a logical explanation.

[Prinz]

I tried Graphstudionext:

Works:
http://i46.tinypic.com/348o7ex.jpg

Doesn't work(black window):
http://i48.tinypic.com/2ywh0nr.jpg

[madshi]

Interesting. So it definitely has nothing to do with MPC-HC. Seems that really the DVD Navigator decrypts, when using EVR. At least that's the most probable explanation right now...

[Prinz]

Copyright Protection

Copyright protection for DVD is provided by encrypting sectors on a disc and then decrypting those sectors before decoding them. Microsoft supports both software and hardware decrypters by way of the DVD navigator/splitter, which oversees the authentication sequence between the decoders and the DVD-ROM drives in a computer. The key exchange sequence is implemented through properties sent to the DVD decoder minidriver's input pins.


http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/hardware/ff558763%28v=vs.85%29.aspx

[iSunrise]

madshi, thanks a lot for that quick fix and the new build, DVD playback is now working perfectly fine in MPC-HC, too (with AnyDVD).

Going to test some of my recorded amiga game videos with Jinc now.

[Fullmetal Encoder]

madVR v0.84.4 released

http://madshi.net/madVR.zip

* fixed: DVD playback often resulted in Macrovision errors
* improved Jinc AR algorithm for clean computer type images/videos
* added support for new subtitle interface (e.g. for future xy-vsfilter build)
Please note that madVR does not (yet?) support an extra input pin for subtitles and DVD menus. So if you want to have DVD menus fully working, you have to use a decoder which blends them on top of the video frames (e.g. LAV Video Decoder).

WOW! Amazing! Thank you very much. I've NEVER been able to get madVR and LAV working together on DVD content before. Long ago I used to see the macrovision error when trying and more recently was fed a black screen with the MPC-HC logo in the center until this update which fixes it all quite nicely. This is all on my unencrypted DVD content. After a while I was starting to think I'd never see the day when I could use madVR on DVDs without some kind of hack.

[Pat357]

No, the files 1080p HD. I watch HD in 99% of the cases.
Except the sample you posted (!) : it's 1280 x 546 and encoded as HD (BT.709 matrix & primaries).
IMO, this is a bad encoded file.

require me to change the colorspace in madVR to 0-255 which doesn't make sense, as my TV doesn't support full range.
This will "partially" undo the harm done by the bad encoding as MadVR will stretch the 16-235 to 0-255.
This will cause the values outside the 16-235 band to be cut off.

Have you tried playing with the matrix & primaries BT.601, setting source range to full ?

[JarrettH]

Oooook...

Restored MS DVD Navigator, AnyDVD off (DVD: Copy-Protect Fail...this happened with the next three DVDs I tried)

http://depositfiles.com/files/cb2mxxejt

Restored MS DVD Navigator, AnyDVD on (works)

http://depositfiles.com/files/rkqzgotzq

Menus are kind of hit and miss though.

Were my logs a dud too? :D

[6233638]

madVR v0.84.4 released

http://madshi.net/madVR.zip

* fixed: DVD playback often resulted in Macrovision errors
* improved Jinc AR algorithm for clean computer type images/videos
* added support for new subtitle interface (e.g. for future xy-vsfilter build)
Please note that madVR does not (yet?) support an extra input pin for subtitles and DVD menus. So if you want to have DVD menus fully working, you have to use a decoder which blends them on top of the video frames (e.g. LAV Video Decoder).You have no idea how happy this has made me! :D

I'm sorry to have been bugging you about this every so often, but I'm glad that it's now fixed!

I can confirm that it's also working on Windows 8 without AnyDVD, at least with the discs that I have tried so far. (I normally have AnyDVD enabled though)

Some discs do just seem to start on a black screen, but selecting a title manually seems to fix that.

I have one or two discs that will crash at the menus, but I don't think that's madVR's fault. (unfortunately this disc also has 25 titles)

Seeking works fine, using the old XP qdvd.dll would cause the player to become unresponsive.

[Pat357]

I can confirm that it's also working on Windows 8 without AnyDVD, at least with the discs that I have tried so far. (I normally have AnyDVD enabled though)

Back on Win8 ? After a few switches from Win7 - Win8 -Win7 -Win8 you seem to become faster at it ! :D

BTW, were these "real physical" discs with copy protection ?

So far, on Win7 we need AnyDVD or similar to view normal commercial disks because of the CP.

[crotecun]

madVR v0.84.4 released

http://madshi.net/madVR.zip

* fixed: DVD playback often resulted in Macrovision errors
* improved Jinc AR algorithm for clean computer type images/videos
* added support for new subtitle interface (e.g. for future xy-vsfilter build)
Please note that madVR does not (yet?) support an extra input pin for subtitles and DVD menus. So if you want to have DVD menus fully working, you have to use a decoder which blends them on top of the video frames (e.g. LAV Video Decoder).

Yay, :thanks: for the update!

The scaling algorithms UI bug still exists by the way, just thought I'd give a heads-up.

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1595909#post1595909

[6233638]

Back on Win8 ? After a few switches from Win7 - Win8 -Win7 -Win8 you seem to become faster at it ! :DI installed Windows 7 to another drive just for testing DVD playback. (I did go from Windows 7 to the Windows 8 Preview, disliked that enough to go back Windows 7, and then went back to Windows 8 upon its release)

With Start8 installed to bypass most of the Metro UI stuff (I don't like it on a desktop PC, which is why I removed the preview early) and now that DVD playback is working, I haven't experienced any more issues holding me back from using Windows 8 full time now, and it brings a number of useful improvements to the desktop for me.

BTW, were these "real physical" discs with copy protection ?

So far, on Win7 we need AnyDVD or similar to view normal commercial disks because of the CP.I was testing discs that had been ripped to .iso with AnyDVD (but it was set to not remove copy protection)

Testing physical discs with AnyDVD disabled is giving me:
DVD: Invalid Disc Region, and DVD: Copy-Protect Fail

Enabling AnyDVD allows the discs to play.
Sorry for getting your hopes up.

Looks like the "keep protection" setting only applies to Blu-rays. (I wasn't too concerned about whether or not it removed the protection of DVDs when ripping them)

[ryrynz]

Madshi, Jinc 3 with AR appears to produce a sharper image than Jinc 4 with AR (has always been the case) The sharpness bar graph might need revision.
Thanks for the new version BTW, I like the new AR algorithm.

[dukey]

There was a reason effort was put into making an open source DVD navigator ............

[madshi]

Were my logs a dud too? :D
They were more or less helpful, but they didn't contain what I hoped I would find there...

Seeking works fine, using the old XP qdvd.dll would cause the player to become unresponsive.
I've looked into the XP seeking problem, but it seems to be an MPC-HC bug, from what I can see.

The scaling algorithms UI bug still exists by the way, just thought I'd give a heads-up.
Yeah, didn't find the time to fix that yet.

Madshi, Jinc 3 with AR appears to produce a sharper image than Jinc 4 with AR (has always been the case) The sharpness bar graph might need revision.
In my test images it looks like Jinc4 might be ever so slightly sharper than Jinc3. Maybe it depends on the test material...

[madshi]

madVR v0.84.5 released

http://madshi.net/madVR.zip

* improved rendering behaviour with DVD menus and still images
There has been some confusion in some forums, so let me sum up the current state of madVR DVD support:

Basically madVR can now play DVDs just fine now with the MS DVD Navigator (or any other navigator). The Macrovision problem should be gone for good. However, there are 2 limitations compared to VMR/EVR:

(1) Your DVDs *must* be decrypted if you want to play them with madVR, e.g. by AnyDVD.
(2) You need to use a video decoder which is able to draw the DVD menu stuff on top of the video frames. E.g. LAV Video Decoder does that. You can also use other video decoders but then part of the DVD menus might not be fully drawn.

If you run into "DVD Copy-Protect Fail" (MPC-HC) or "Key exchange for DVD copy protection failed" (ZP) complaints, then you simply forgot to decrypt the DVD.

I'm still talking to Microsoft about why EVR can play encrypted DVDs and madVR cannot, but it seems to me they don't know, either. Or maybe they just don't feel like looking at the DVD Navigator source code, I don't know. At least I don't have high hopes they will find a solution for madVR. But they're trying, so let's wait and see...

[Prinz]

There must be a check for the Renderer in the DVD Navigator. If I select Null as Renderer in MPC-HC the same thing happens:

- With anydvd active it plays (audio only of course)

- without anydvd the same error message: DVD Copy-Protect Fail

All MS Renders (Overlay,VMR7,VMR9,EVR) work with and without anydvd.

[leeperry]

:thanks: for the new build! but DVD's had always worked in PotP IME anyway ^^

I'm still talking to Microsoft about why EVR can play encrypted DVDs and madVR cannot
Good to hear that m$ doesn't play deaf with you, right after nvidia clearly stating in their drivers changelog that some fixes were meant to help with mVR.....I guess both companies came to realize that your killer VR does sell OS licences and GPU's :)

Anyway, I just spent an hour messing around with chroma/luma upscales, and to my eyes the most "3D" picture is still softcubic50 AR for chroma + Jinc3 AR for luma(I forgot to try Jinc4 but my 8800GS is barely fast enough for Jinc3 anyway). I've never been too fund of mixing the luma/chroma noises together and I've always enjoyed the cleanest luma possible on top of a reasonably soft chroma(sc50 seems to be the sweet spot indeed). Several ppl on HCFR also swear by:
ss=2
spline144resize(round(ss*last.width),round(ss*last.height))
but it looked utterly noisy: 8bit Avisynth/ffdshow processing is a lost cause, end of story. It's astounding to think that so much effort has gone through this app, and yet in 2012 it's still limited to 8bit output(apart from some kludgy hacks) when the first rule in DSP is to never use the same bit-depth for input and output(16int audio input>64fp processing>24int output) :o

for luma, Lanczos3 AR looks "computer'ish" to death, Spline3 AR seems to slightly add some EE(ringing?) and Jinc3 AR gives the most natural and 3D'ish picture, yay! :cool:

All this said, I can't quite resist that ref 660 board for 170€ shipped anymore as I can't even upscale 960*540 to 1080p(as I initially thought), so bring the pain :p

I'll have to rerun an Argyll calibration with the new board, so I'll make sure to test how the "disable gamma ramps" mVR option behaves with a 1.0 gamma 3x1D CLUT and report back.

[Pat357]

Anyway, I just spent an hour messing around with chroma/luma upscales, and to my eyes the most "3D" picture is still softcubic50 AR for chroma + Jinc3 AR for luma.
Was the AR for softcubic50 - chroma really needed ?
The softcubic algo doesn't really cause additional ringing (at least, to me). What I find a minus about SC50, is the occasional color-desaturation.
You could try SC50 again, but without AR : might save you from needing a new GPU at all ! :D

8bit Avisynth/ffdshow processing is a lost cause, end of story. It's astounding to think that so much effort has gone through this app, and yet in 2012 it's still limited to 8bit output(apart from some kludgy hacks)
Goodbye Avisynth,...... WELCOME Vapoursynth !!

when the first rule in DSP is to never use the same bit-depth for input and output
That's the 3rd rule, not the first ! :p
There is nothing wrong with bit-depth input = output, but it's the processing in between that should be done at a higher bit-depth + do a proper dithering !

[cyberbeing]

10-bit & 16-bit formats seem like they need to be blacklisted from enabling madVR deinterlacing.

[Pat357]

10-bit & 16-bit formats seem like they need to be blacklisted from enabling madVR deinterlacing.
You mean you can't let MadVR deinterlace 8-bit content if any >8 bit format in LAVvideo is enabled ?
What kind of content was it ?
It's obvious that >8 bit content can't be deinterlaced as MadVR uses "standard DVXA2" to do the deinterlacing.

As long as you keep all formats checked in LAVvideo, the deinterlacing of 8 bit content should work ; if not there must be a bug.:p

I don't know how >8bit formats with interlacing are handled, but maybe an idea for Madshi would be :
to refuse all >8 bit formats if deinterlacing is asked for, or automatic (flags) or manual (<ctrl>+<alt>+<shift>+d or other key).
This way LAV or any other decoder has to stick to to 8 bit formats. (Not even sure how LAV would act if for ex. NV12+YV12 are disabled with interlaced content)
or
for formats >8bit, disable de-interlacing and show the "still interlaced" content (user will notice this and can react accordingly)

This makes me also think again about the order of the color formats in LAV-video : IIRC if NV12 and YV12 are disabled, the next formats are P016, P010. I guess this will obviously give problems with interlaced content.
Would it bring anything to put YUY2 before P016 and P010 in this case ? (interlaced content).

Another way to look at this is : if the user disables certain formats, he should know the consequences and not come to cry that the deinterlacing is not working anymore !
For me, this is OK ;)

[6233638]

Basically madVR can now play DVDs just fine now with the MS DVD Navigator (or any other navigator). The Macrovision problem should be gone for good. However, there are 2 limitations compared to VMR/EVR:

(1) Your DVDs *must* be decrypted if you want to play them with madVR, e.g. by AnyDVD.
(2) You need to use a video decoder which is able to draw the DVD menu stuff on top of the video frames. E.g. LAV Video Decoder does that. You can also use other video decoders but then part of the DVD menus might not be fully drawn.

If you run into "DVD Copy-Protect Fail" (MPC-HC) or "Key exchange for DVD copy protection failed" (ZP) complaints, then you simply forgot to decrypt the DVD.

I'm still talking to Microsoft about why EVR can play encrypted DVDs and madVR cannot, but it seems to me they don't know, either. Or maybe they just don't feel like looking at the DVD Navigator source code, I don't know. At least I don't have high hopes they will find a solution for madVR. But they're trying, so let's wait and see...DVD menus are working much better now, I haven't run into any problems so far.

Hopefully you will get a solution back from Microsoft, but at least it's possible to play DVDs in madVR with the system DVD Navigator at all now.


Now that DVD playback is working, I've been going back through my collection, and a number of discs start with a "video" type intro showing the distributer logo before the menus start, so I switched madVR from forcing film mode to auto detection. It never seems to detect anything other than "video" for PAL content now. (I haven't tried anything NTSC yet, the majority of my discs are PAL)

Here's a sample that shows obvious problems with video deinterlacing:
http://www.freefilehosting.net/vts011demuxed


:thanks: for the new build! but DVD's had always worked in PotP IME anyway ^^Doesn't PotPlayer call home to Korea though?

Anyway, I just spent an hour messing around with chroma/luma upscales, and to my eyes the most "3D" picture is still softcubic50 AR for chroma + Jinc3 AR for luma(I forgot to try Jinc4 but my 8800GS is barely fast enough for Jinc3 anyway). I've never been too fund of mixing the luma/chroma noises together and I've always enjoyed the cleanest luma possible on top of a reasonably soft chroma(sc50 seems to be the sweet spot indeed).You should avoid using the anti-ringing filter with SoftCubic, it is very damaging to image quality. (but almost anything you do to Chroma can be difficult to see if you are not using the right test material)

I would still argue against using SoftCubic at all for Chroma.
It is a measurably bad choice, as it reduces the brightness of, or desaturates Chroma.

I'll have to rerun an Argyll calibration with the new board, so I'll make sure to test how the "disable gamma ramps" mVR option behaves with a 1.0 gamma 3x1D CLUT and report back.I suggest using ICC profiles in Windows and using madVR's 3DLUT for video calibration.

[cyberbeing]

Yes, I mean that madVR automatically enables deinterlacing on flagged interlaced high-bitdepth content, which isn't supported.

I ran into this problem when attempting to test YUY2 & AYUV/YV24 DVD subtitle quality out of LAV Video 0.52.0.
Though there would be nothing preventing someone from encoding native high-bitdepth interlaced video and run into similar problems with madVR automatic deinterlacing.

Uncheck NV12/YV12 and you get P010 with corrupted madVR deinterlacing.
Uncheck NV12/YV12/P010/P016 and you get Y216 with corrupted madVR deinterlacing.
Uncheck NV12/YV12/P010/P016/Y216/Y210/v210 and you'll finally get YUY2 which can be deinterlaced by madVR.
Uncheck NV12/YV12/P010/P016/Y216/Y210/v210/YUY2/RGB32/RGB24 and madVR will freeze when attempting to automatically enable deinterlacing on Y416.
Uncheck NV12/YV12/P010/P016/Y216/Y210/v210/YUY2/RGB32/RGB24/Y416/Y410/v410 and you'll get YV24 which can be deinterlaced by madVR.

madVR needs to come up with a solution for dealing with high-bitdepth video flagged as interlaced, that doesn't result in corrupted output or black screen freezing.
Blacklisting madVR deinterlacing from being enabled on high-bitdepth video would likely be the easiest solution.

[Anima123]

I am managing to buy a new gamer's laptop, there's one thing that I'd like to make sure before doing. Could you guys tell me which nVidia card is enough for video watching with the latest madVR with at least Jinc 3-tap plus AR for luma, 650M?

[Hypernova]

I am managing to buy a new gamer's laptop, there's one thing that I'd like to make sure before doing. Could you guys tell me which nVidia card is enough for video watching with the latest madVR with at least Jinc 3-tap plus AR for luma, 650M?

I don't know the answer, but here's some reference: Intel HD 4000 can barely do 720->1080 with Jinc3 in my exprerience. For ->1600p, I need to overclock it to the max and use bilinear for chroma and it will be a millisecond short of being able to keep up.

[JarrettH]

All DVD menus are working flawlessly and snappy since 0.84.5 :thanks:

[leeperry]

You could try SC50 again, but without AR : might save you from needing a new GPU at all
I believe I tried, but I'll retry and also give Jinc4 AR for luma a whirl.

PS: yes AR looks more "3D" to me, and Jinc4 AR might be noisier than 3 for luma but my GPU is too slow at this point.

Goodbye Avisynth,...... WELCOME Vapoursynth !!
as far as I can see, ffdshow has become a ghost ship so Vapoursynth support might very well never occur.

That's the 3rd rule, not the first ! :p
There is nothing wrong with bit-depth input = output, but it's the processing in between that should be done at a higher bit-depth + do a proper dithering !
Well, SmoothLevels() uses a higher precision for computing then dithers back to 8bit but it's noisy as hell in mVR when its output dithering is enabled and when disabled it's still noisy because it's being output in 8bit(you can also disable dithering in mVR itself, but the latter still looked better to my eyes on a LCD TV, after gamut mapping and all).

Ideally, we would need the whole ffdshow pipeline to work in 16bit....even mirroring in ffdshow is utterly noisy which is a major bummer because I used it a lot, but hopefully once PS script support is added to mVR I will find a script to do it in plain 32fp :)

Doesn't PotPlayer call home to Korea though?
Dunno, I've got a firewall up and I don't allow media players to connect to the internet. I couldn't live without its "seamless playback" feature anyway, that can open up to a thousand files(mixed containers allowed) in the same folder and you can roll them with a mouse click.

You should avoid using the anti-ringing filter with SoftCubic, it is very damaging to image quality. (but almost anything you do to Chroma can be difficult to see if you are not using the right test material).

I would still argue against using SoftCubic at all for Chroma.
It is a measurably bad choice, as it reduces the brightness of, or desaturates Chroma
Well, at the end of the day what I ultimately crave is that subjective 3D "pop effect" on real world material, not sneaky test patterns.....the aforementioned combination does exactly that on my rig and as you can see below everything's slightly oversaturated on my TV anyway.

I might consider using sc50ar for SD and something less soft for HD if madshi ever adds automatic rules based on resolution and frame rate.

I suggest using ICC profiles in Windows and using madVR's 3DLUT for video calibration.
Yep, Argyll can build LUT-based ICC files and that .ti3 parser app could supposedly merge .cal files & 3DLUT files....but can it do it inside a yRGB file reliably? And from what I briefly tested, the "disable gamma ramps" option in mVR might not be effective enough on my XP box to temporarily disable the windows CLUT. I will try to build a 1.0 gamma LUT based ICC profile and will report back. But I don't have the .net 4.5 bloatware installed required to use the parser app...I might build a W8 VM, though.

It's also still fairly annoying that there is no way to compensate for primaries/secondaries saturations whatsoever: http://thumbnails103.imagebam.com/21818/8149be218179235.jpg (http://www.imagebam.com/image/8149be218179235)

tritical said that it was a no-go, and yesgrey said he'd think about it....a 16bit 3DLUT would be the perfect place to do that, talk about wasted potential :p

[THX-UltraII]

I m going to use a Avisynth script called FineSharp. So I will need ffdshow RAW video 'all supported'. But I m already using LAV Video decoder. How do I config ffdshows output (checkboxes etc) so no extra conversion is done my ffdshow? Do I only checked the box 'YV12' tn the output settings? Or do I have to check all boxes? Or other boxes/option that I have to choose?

I think it is important to tell the exact 'chain' I m using now:

- Media Player Classic with madVR as output renderer with output setting in madVR PC Levels (0-255).

- using LAV video decoder with all the 'Output Formats' checked and 'RGB Output Levels' set to 'Untouched (as input)'

- HDMI Color Space Input of my display device: RGB

- HDMI Dynamic Range Input of my display device: 0-255


Thanks for input!

[madshi]

There must be a check for the Renderer in the DVD Navigator. If I select Null as Renderer in MPC-HC the same thing happens
Yeah, that might be. Or maybe the renderer must support a specific interface or behave in a specific way, but I don't know how.

10-bit & 16-bit formats seem like they need to be blacklisted from enabling madVR deinterlacing.
Yes, I already have that on my to do list.

DVD menus are working much better now, I haven't run into any problems so far.
All DVD menus are working flawlessly and snappy since 0.84.5 :thanks:
Thanks for the feedback, glad to hear that!

I believe I tried, but I'll retry and also give Jinc4 AR for luma a whirl.

PS: yes AR looks more "3D" to me, and Jinc4 AR might be noisier than 3 for luma but my GPU is too slow at this point.
He meant SoftCubic for chroma without AR, but Jinc with AR for image upscaling. It seems SoftCubic + AR sometimes results in artifacts.

I am managing to buy a new gamer's laptop, there's one thing that I'd like to make sure before doing. Could you guys tell me which nVidia card is enough for video watching with the latest madVR with at least Jinc 3-tap plus AR for luma, 650M?
The 650M is probably fast enough for 24fps, but if you want to use Jinc3 AR for 60fps content, too, it's probably too slow. But it might also depend on your display resolution and the movie resolution.

Now that DVD playback is working, I've been going back through my collection, and a number of discs start with a "video" type intro showing the distributer logo before the menus start, so I switched madVR from forcing film mode to auto detection. It never seems to detect anything other than "video" for PAL content now. (I haven't tried anything NTSC yet, the majority of my discs are PAL)
Automatic film vs. video detection is not really implemented in madVR yet. If you switch to "auto", madVR will always use DXVA2 deinterlacing. In theory DXVA2 is supposed to automatically detect film vs. video by itself and deinterlace accordingly. But:

Here's a sample that shows obvious problems with video deinterlacing
Thanks for the sample. Obviously DXVA2 fails to detect that this is movie content and thus deinterlaces incorrectly.

There's nothing I can do about this in a quick way. The only solution will be to implement full video vs. movie detection in madVR. But that's not an easy thing to do. It's a planned feature, but it's not very high on my priority list for now. So if DXVA2 deinterlacing fails for you, you'll have to manually switch madVR to film mode.

[madshi]

I m going to use a Avisynth script called FineSharp. So I will need ffdshow RAW video 'all supported'. But I m already using LAV Video decoder. How do I config ffdshows output (checkboxes etc) so no extra conversion is done my ffdshow?-In the Output settings only checked the box 'YV12'? Or check all boxes? Or other boxes?
I'm not an ffdshow expert, but I guess you should activate all checkboxes in both LAV and ffdshow. You can then afterwards double check whether the pin connections are correct (NV12 or YV12 everywhere).

[THX-UltraII]

Dank je voor je snelle reply ;)

http://ffdshow-tryout.sourceforge.net/wiki/video:output

ffdshow has some output settings. First one is the Primary Output Color Space. I can select Auto, YUV (YV12/YUY2/NV12) or RGB here. What do you think I have to choose here when I don t want ffdshow to do a extra video conversion?

Next there are the boxes that can be checked:
4:2:0 YUV YV12 8-bit
4:2:0 YUV NV12 8-bit
4:2:0 YUV P010 10-bit
4:2:0 YUV P016 16-bit
4:2:2 YUV YUY2 8-bit
4:2:2 YUV YUVY 8-bit
4:2:2 YUV P210 10-bit
4:2:2 YUV P216 16-bit
4:4:4 YUV AYUV 8-bit
4:4:4 YUV Y416 16-bit
RGB32 8-bit
RGB24 8-bit

Next there s the setting Set interlaced flag in output media type which is checked by default. Should I leave this checked? More information about this settings:
- Sends interlacing related information obtained from the input stream or ffdshow's internal decoders to the next filter.
- Some filters (like video renderers) will use this information to deinterlace the video if necessary.
- This is just for informing the downstream filters - the actual result will depend purely on the implementation of these filters.
- DVDs may be flagged as interlaced, but in most cases they were originally film (progressive) and just soft telecined. For such video, it is recommended to disable this setting.

And there also the TAB in ffdshow called RGB Conversion which has quite a few settings:
- YCbCr specification:
I can choose 'Auto', 'ITU-R BT.601' or 'BT.709' here. Which one should I use?

- High quality YV12 to RGB conversion:
This checkbox will instruct ffdshow to use a high quality conversion method. The conversion is done in 11-bit or higher and its performance can be improved significantly with multi-core CPUs. This feature requires a SSE2-capable CPU at the minimum.

Should I check this box?

- Dithering:
Dithering is an option to maintain the source's full visual quality when doing YCbCr → RGB conversion. Without dithering, RGB conversion can result in added banding. With “High quality YV12 to RGB conversion” enabled, ffdshow calculates in 11-bit or higher. If this option is checked, the result is dithered otherwise rounded to 8-bit. This increases RGB conversion's CPU usage by about 6%.

Should I check this box?

- Input Levels:
Auto
Standard (Y: 16-235, CbCr: 16-240)
Full Range (Y: 0-255, CbCr: 1-255)

Which one should I use?

- Output Levels:
RGB 0-255
RGB 16-235

Which one should I use?

Thanks!

[leeperry]

He meant SoftCubic for chroma without AR, but Jinc with AR for image upscaling. It seems SoftCubic + AR sometimes results in artifacts.
Yes, that's how I understood it and whatever chroma or luma both subjectively look more "3D" to me in 30fps when AR is enabled. Fast moving objects have less EE around them, due to the (far) less visible ringing so everything looks less "flat" and the highly sought after "pop effect" is very much there to my eyes :cool:

[madshi]

@THX-UltraII, for detailed ffdshow instructions please ask in the ffdshow thread. FWIW, most of those options have no effect if input and output are both YV12/NV12.

[Prinz]

Yeah, that might be. Or maybe the renderer must support a specific interface or behave in a specific way, but I don't know how.

The only thing that comes to mind why the renderer should report something, is that back in the analog TV-OUT days the renderer hat to check for analog Macrovision support on the TV-OUT and prevent the playback for protected DVD if the TV-OUT didn't have a Macrovision protection.

[cyberbeing]

DVD sub-menus become unresponsive when "Keep Aspect Ratio" is disabled in MPC-HC and the DVD sub-menu has a different aspect ratio then the root menu.

[THX-UltraII]

@THX-UltraII, for detailed ffdshow instructions please ask in the ffdshow thread. FWIW, most of those options have no effect if input and output are both YV12/NV12.

Ok, I ll ask over there.