madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[panetesan2k6]

a point not the hole.

Showing your desktop (or Windows File Explorer) on the TV, go back to "normal" (no "PC") and take a look at how dramatically the picture's altered. And then think how your movies are going to be altered the same way.

[madshi]

at least for the material I view (YMMV), MPDN has eclipsed madVR's quality on my system by quite a noticeable margin.
I highly doubt that - unless it's a matter of GPU power (or lack thereof). NNEDI3 is still better than NEDI+SuperRes, but might need more GPU power. And every other algorithm I've compared, madVR produces the same or sometimes noticeably better quality than MPDN. Anyway, if you want to do a quality comparison, or just want to advertise MPDN, please start a new thread. I don't want either of that in this thread. Thanks. And btw, it's generally not very polite to post something like "xxx is better than yyy" in the yyy thread.

[fredgido]

Is it known that forcing 3d settings on AMD CCC degrades image quality and makes the player crash a lot when seeking? Is it my card only? HD5850

Btw Chroma doubling is giving me no image, I think it used to work for me some weeks ago. I don't use it much anyway.

[bcec]

The 950 will not be fast enough to do NNEDI3 1080p to 4K at all so it should not get hot but why not simply turn off NNEDI3 doubling? :confused:

Mmm, oh that sucks. But still, if all I am going to do is Jinc3AR, 970 is probably a waste. I tried doing Jinc3AR with it, but it would still get quite hot (though not as bad as NNEDI3).

[huhn]

Showing your desktop (or Windows File Explorer) on the TV, go back to "normal" (no "PC") and take a look at how dramatically the picture's altered. And then think how your movies are going to be altered the same way.

I know what happens and I don't buy TV that can't do 4:4:4 at all refresh rates.
but madVR is way more than a chroma resizer!

[StinDaWg]

Showing your desktop (or Windows File Explorer) on the TV, go back to "normal" (no "PC") and take a look at how dramatically the picture's altered. And then think how your movies are going to be altered the same way.
Movies are 4:2:0, so it won't matter. I have a Samsung plasma, and the picture quality of blu-rays are excellent in Movie (non pc) mode.

[panetesan2k6]

Movies are 4:2:0, so it won't matter. I have a Samsung plasma, and the picture quality of blu-rays are excellent in Movie (non pc) mode.

Of course they are. The blu ray player is already working in YCbCr 4:2:0 and sending this to your TV as it is expected (by your TV) to do.

Maybe I got the technical discussion all wrong, but I guess that there is no point in MadVR upsampling chroma to RGB 4:4:4 if your TV is gonna mess with this and convert it back to YCBCr 4:2:0.

I just don't see the point in this, but as I said, maybe I got it wrong.

[Anima123]

Recently I bought a game book, Alienware with a nVidia 880M video card.

It looks like I still underestimated the horsepower that madVR demands, for my instance, madVR cannot even handle 720p to 1080p upscaling with 32 neurons NNEDI3, with advanced dithering options off (ordered dithering used) and put almost all tradeoff options on.

I can be enjoying 576p to 1080p with 32 neurons NNEDI3 now, thanks to my new game book. The video quality is just impeccable.

Is there possible for madVR to have a not-so-resource-demanding algorithm with lesser quality than NNEDI3?

[nevcairiel]

Is there possible for madVR to have a not-so-resource-demanding algorithm with lesser quality than NNEDI3?

You mean like all the algorithms it already has? Jinc? Lanczos? Spline? :d

[Anima123]

You mean like all the algorithms it already has? Jinc? Lanczos? Spline? :d

Or, something else that's in madshi's mind.

[huhn]

Of course they are. The blu ray player is already working in YCbCr 4:2:0 and sending this to your TV as it is expected (by your TV) to do.

Maybe I got the technical discussion all wrong, but I guess that there is no point in MadVR upsampling chroma to RGB 4:4:4 if your TV is gonna mess with this and convert it back to YCBCr 4:2:0.

I just don't see the point in this, but as I said, maybe I got it wrong.

HDMI 1.4 and older can't send 4:2:0 only 4:2:2 and above.

and i have to agree leaving a TV at 4:2:2 is negative for picture quality.

madVR is capable of:

3D LUT color correction
IVTC
madVR is reading meta data like colorspaces and make use of these
smooth motion
proper dithering
input support for a ton of colorspaces and proper handling.
lots more...

[a8213711]

Can someone play this file and tell me what Hz do you get?
https://www.mediafire.com/?zy5s2d6qf13i66d
I have in madVR (among the others display modes) 1080p60 and 1080p59 and 1080p50, and this way it set to 59.94Hz, and if I delete 1080p59 it set to 60Hz.
What do you get? Thank you.

[huhn]

I tested it with MPC-BE and these display modes: 1080p23, 1080p24, 1080p50, 1080p59, 1080p60

the file switches to 50 hz with madVR IVTC the same with deinterlacing.

the file is PsF 2:2 so madVR IVTC is the better choice.

[digitech]

is it better to have the hdmi cable connected directly to my projector for the best madvr video quality instead of connected it to my av receiver and then to my projector? I ask this because even if i disable any kind of video process in the hdmi video in my denon 2808CI i still find the direct connection to my projector to be superior (at least at my eyes) anyone has had experience with this or advice, btw theres an article about this kind of behavior: http://www.cepro.com/article/maintaining_hdmi_switching_and_signal_path_integrity/K330

[shaolin95]

is it better to have the hdmi cable connected directly to my projector for the best madvr video quality instead of connected it to my av receiver and then to my projector? I ask this because even if i disable any kind of video process in the hdmi video in my denon 2808CI i still find the direct connection to my projector to be superior (at least at my eyes) anyone has had experience with this or advice, btw theres an article about this kind of behavior: http://www.cepro.com/article/maintaining_hdmi_switching_and_signal_path_integrity/K330

Well, I may be annal about it but I avoid any type of extra connections, adapters etc. So my HTPC is connected directly to the Projector. After all there is NO chance an extra connection will improve anything so best case scenario it has no effect or worst case it degrades the IQ, so I rather not take the risk since we are here using all this HTPC stuff because we want to squeeze every single drop of IQ we can get.

[Asmodian]

I would not be surprised to learn an av receiver does a color space conversion, it might turn off processing but it could still convert everything it receives into YUV 4:2:2 as a universally compatible format to keep the TV from switching modes or similar.

I have experienced a similar issue with a wireless video system (where it is more understandable).

MadVR exposes a lot of the less than ideal techniques AV equipment uses. They are too used to being able to mess with the image without bothering people.

[digitech]

which way you recommend to route audio to an av receiver if the main hdmi cable is ocuppied connected to the proyector

[huhn]

try

GPU -> AVR -> TV
GPU -> TV

at the same time.
you can use your iGPU for this too.

[ryrynz]

Recently I bought a game book, Alienware with a nVidia 880M video card.

It looks like I still underestimated the horsepower that madVR demands, for my instance, madVR cannot even handle 720p to 1080p upscaling with 32 neurons NNEDI3, with advanced dithering options off (ordered dithering used) and put almost all tradeoff options on.

I can be enjoying 576p to 1080p with 32 neurons NNEDI3 now, thanks to my new game book. The video quality is just impeccable.

Is there possible for madVR to have a not-so-resource-demanding algorithm with lesser quality than NNEDI3?

Are you certain your using the 880? check with a GPU monitor (GPU-Z or similar) Because I wanted to check performance of the GTX 850 at work vs your results, I fired up MPC and MadVR and I couldn't get the 850 to work with madVR at all.. entering the registry key, changing the file name, setting the 850 to preferred, hell even disabling the integrated HD 5500, nothing took. I either had the HD 5500 rendering or I had a black screen, surely there's a way to get Optimus systems working properly...

[digitech]

try

GPU -> AVR -> TV
GPU -> TV

at the same time.
you can use your iGPU for this too.

ok,i have an nvidia 760 dedicated GPU which has dvi-i, dvi-d, displayport and HDMI video outputs, i guess i need to use the dvi-d port to hdmi cable to connect to my projector (my optoma only has hdmi and vga inputs) and the hdmi output to the av receiver to get multichannel audio with the benefits of HDMi, is this my best option for correct video playback and audio?

[huhn]

ok,i have an nvidia 760 dedicated GPU which has dvi-i, dvi-d, displayport and HDMI video outputs, i guess i need to use the dvi-d port to hdmi cable to connect to my projector (my optoma only has hdmi and vga inputs) and the hdmi output to the av receiver to get multichannel audio with the benefits of HDMi, is this my best option for correct video playback and audio?

this is the best I come up with.
I don't use an AVR but this should work.

if you have a hdmi to DVI adapter you can use this adapter and a DVI cable for your projector by putting this adapter in your projector. this adapter was shipped with my GTX 760 and I used this my self for a short time. the connection is treated like a HDMI connection.

you may didn't need to connect your AVR with an end device to work with your PC but this was need 2 years ago.

[skryabin]

I'm trying to create a "quiet" e not too stressing config for my GTX770
I don't like if the card becames too hot and my screen resolution is "only" 1920x1080, the target is use no more than 40% of my gpu when 3d clock is engaged.

Reading Renethx charts and this thread I've come up to this conclusion: I need multiple profiles to adapt gpu power for each kind of file.

Low/high deband, smooth motion and ordered dithering (no trade quality options ticked)


if (srcHeight <= 360) "360"
else if (srcHeight <= 480) "480"
els if (srcHeight <= 720) "720"
else "1080"


Profile 1080 (based on LEVEL 3 renethx)
NO LUMA DOUBLING
JINC3AR chroma up (or BC75AR?)
JINC3AR image up
CRARLL downscaling

Profile 720 (based on level 4)
LUMA DOUBLING 16N (32 seems too much, my gpu is almost at 50% utilization)
BC75AR chroma up
LANCZ3AR image up
CRARLL downscaling

Profile 480 (level 5)
LUMA DOUBLING 32N
BC75AR chroma up
LANCZ3AR image up
CTARLL downscaling

Profile 360 (level 5 with increased neurons)
LUMA DOUBLING 64N
BC75AR chroma up
LANCZ3AR image up
CTARLL downscaling

Anyway I don't have too much SD material, I'm concentrating more on 1080 and 720 profiles.
Do you see anything wrong with my setup? I know my card can go a little higher, but I want to keep the things cool and quiet .

PS: any advice for material with framerate over 30fps? maybe I need a couple more profiles for that...

[fairchild]

I'm trying to create a "quiet" e not too stressing config for my GTX770

I do the following which requires not even using profiles. I set NNEDI3 to only activate only if scaling factor is 2.0x (or bigger) with 32 neruons. This makes it so it will only ever be activated on 960x540 resolution or lower (exactly half of my default resolution of 1920x1080) which is kinda optimal IMO. Some people seem to see a difference in image quality when using NNEDI3 with 720p on a 1080p display for instance, but I don't, so ultimately it's up to you and your eyes with your display devices.

These are my settings which I use. (my display is calibrated with a spectrometer so I do care about having an optimal picture in my display)

calibration: this display is already calibrated (BT.709 + pure power curve 2.20)

disable desktop composition
disable deinterlacing (will use YADIF in LAV)
disable ALL trade quality for performance options
using ordered dithering (use colored noise)

display modes: 1080p23,1080p24,1080p50,1080p60

chroma upscaling: bicubic 75 (AR)
image doubling: double NNEDI3 - 32 neurons (2x) (only activates when watching 960x540 or less)
image upscaling: bicubic75 (AR)
image downscaling: catmull-rom (AR+LL)

[oddball]

I'm trying to help my brother get 4K video playback with MadVR to his new 4K UHD TV. However playing back any content at 4k (UHD 3840x2160) resolution with Full Screen Exclusive mode enabled = a blank screen. Without FSE he does not get smooth, windowed playback. 1080 and 1440 resolutions work fine. We tried resetting to defaults. No joy. We are using the latest nightly build of MPC-HC and lLatest Madvr. Sending output via HDMI 1.4 @ 30Hz (Sources can be either 1080P or 2160 it matters not). Hardware is Sapphire R7 260X 1GB (Not for gaming so does not have to be super ppowerful), LG 59UB820V display and Onkyo X-SR333 receiver (passthru).

If you need any other info let me know.

[asubert]

Hi there,

I re install my HTPC on windows 8.1. I am running a ati hd6570 with the last drivers.

I am not able to activate the exclusive full screen mode. I check in madvr config and it is activated, but when i launch mpc-be, video start in windowed mode (sometimes old path, sometimes new path). I have no idea how to troubleshoot this issue.

[Asmodian]

When you go full screen it switches into full screen exclusive after a moment. It does not mean "make it full screen exclusively" it means "when full screen the image is exclusively madVR". You will notice a slight flicker as it switches modes.

It would be a mpc-be setting to launch into full screen.

Sorry if I misunderstood you. :o

[skryabin]

I do the following which requires not even using profiles. I set NNEDI3 to only activate only if scaling factor is 2.0x (or bigger) with 32 neruons. This makes it so it will only ever be activated on 960x540 resolution or lower (exactly half of my default resolution of 1920x1080) which is kinda optimal IMO. Some people seem to see a difference in image quality when using NNEDI3 with 720p on a 1080p display for instance, but I don't, so ultimately it's up to you and your eyes with your display devices.


The 2x options is something I was considering too, but I think that sometimes the "doubling" is made only in one direction, only the one where the 2x criteria is matched and not in the other... I don't know if it's a good thing and when it can happen (maybe in source with different aspect ratios than 16:9). Please correct me if I'm wrong.
I still prefer a profile where I can set to "always" double whenever my condition is met, I have much more control and can scale better with my gpu power.

[oddball]

So any idea why I can't get 4K to display anything with FSE enabled? 1080 and 1440 work. Just not 3840x2160. With FSE unticked it plays but smoothness is pants. EVR also works but would prefer MadVR.

Would it have anything to do with his card only being 1GB?

[nevcairiel]

1GB is probably too small for 4K. You can try reducing the number of buffers to an absolute minimum to save memory, but every single frame buffer on the GPU is going to use around 70 MB, maybe more depending on how madVR is setting them up, so with 15 buffers spread over 3 queues, you are already maxed out (upload, render, backbuffer/present). Note that only render and present are at the full size, and upload at the original image size, so memory usage may vary. In any case, try reducing GPU buffers to a minimum.

[oddball]

1GB is probably too small for 4K. You can try reducing the number of buffers to an absolute minimum to save memory, but every single frame buffer on the GPU is going to use around 70 MB, maybe more depending on how madVR is setting them up, so with 15 buffers spread over 3 queues, you are already maxed out (upload, render, backbuffer/present). Note that only render and present are at the full size, and upload at the original image size, so memory usage may vary. In any case, try reducing GPU buffers to a minimum.

Big Buck Bunny 3840x2160P@60Hz uses 626MB dedicated and 351MB dynamic so I doubt it's that. Also EVR would not work surely. So it must be something else.

[nevcairiel]

EVR uses a surprisingly low amount of buffers, generally only 3-5, so its memory usage would be way low. In any case, try reducing the buffers more and see what happens instead of just dismissing it. :)

[oddball]

4096x1716 clips are being spat out at 1080 too. Do I need to put 1716p29 etc in the display modes? Also how does MadVR differentiate between 4096x2160 and 3840x2160 for display mode switching???

[fhoech]

@madshi, I can't seem to get madVR_GetSelected3dlut(*thr3dlut) to return the selected 3D LUT (the thr3dlut parameter passed in is always 0 after the call, and the call itself returns zero/false as well). This with madTPG running and connection established (local, same machine). madVR_SetSelected3dlut() seems to have no effect as well.

[madshi]

@madshi, I can't seem to get madVR_GetSelected3dlut(*thr3dlut) to return the selected 3D LUT (the thr3dlut parameter passed in is always 0 after the call, and the call itself returns zero/false as well). This with madTPG running and connection established (local, same machine). madVR_SetSelected3dlut() seems to have no effect as well.
I have to admit that I didn't fully test this specific bit of API functionality very much. You do have multiple different 3dluts stored in the various 3dlut slots in the madVR calibration settings dialog? Only then Get/SetSelected3dlut() can have any effect, of course.

Anyway, if that's alright with you, can we do the follow up via email (http://madshi.net) (see top of the page)?

[huhn]

4096x1716 clips are being spat out at 1080 too. Do I need to put 1716p29 etc in the display modes? Also how does MadVR differentiate between 4096x2160 and 3840x2160 for display mode switching???

by using 4096x2160p29 and 3840x2160p29. if your screens native resolution is 4096x2160 you should only use these modes.

[oddball]

4 buffers, Jinc, anti-ringing @29.970FPS (short test Chinmei clip) works with 0 dropped frames using FSE mode, so yeah looks like you were right on the money with that.

60FPS is a no go and is too much of a strain on this card.

Clips that are 4096x1716 @ 24FPS are being displayed at 1080 only.

Any ideas on how to get it to scale to 3840x2160?

[asubert]

When you go full screen it switches into full screen exclusive after a moment. It does not mean "make it full screen exclusively" it means "when full screen the image is exclusively madVR". You will notice a slight flicker as it switches modes.

It would be a mpc-be setting to launch into full screen.

Sorry if I misunderstood you. :o

My video is starting in full screen, it is not an issue. But it is not starting in exclusive mode. When i use alt+j, it show me i am in windowed mode, not exclusive. Also the blue seek bar of the exclusive mode is not there in mpc.

[oddball]

I've just realized that the Big Buck Bunny @60FPS will drop lots of frames because it's being spat out at 30Hz.

[oddball]

@Madshi

I still have an issue with display mode switching. If I put in for instance '1080p60, 2160p30' (p30 because 60FPS is being put out at 30Hz on the AMD Sapphire R7 260X anyhow) MadVR switches to 1080p @ 30Hz. I wanted it to switch to 2160p @ 30Hz so the TV was doing the scaling and not MadVR. By taking out all 1080p modes MadVR does the scaling (which is not a bad thing but not what I was attempting to do). Bug or something else?

[jdl]

My video is starting in full screen, it is not an issue. But it is not starting in exclusive mode. When i use alt+j, it show me i am in windowed mode, not exclusive. Also the blue seek bar of the exclusive mode is not there in mpc.

I see the same thing. If I pause the video, sometimes it will switch to exclusive mode.

[angedelo]

Hi,

I would like to know if there is already a solution for my problem.
I have some 2D & 3D 1080p24hz mkv.
For the 2D & 3D movies, no problem madVR change the refresh rate of my projector to 24hz.
My problem is that I need to force my projector for half SBS & half TopBottom 3D mkv at 50hz to play these 24hz files in 3D correctly. So it would be great to force the refresh rate of my display with condition, like a tag in the filename, autodetect the format of the mkv...
I have already looking in scripting madVR with profile group, but the refresh rate can only be set up under the devices panel. This panel cant be scripted.

Anyway, thanks for this great piece of software. (& sorry for bag english)

[StinDaWg]

I'm trying to play a 1080i29.97 file with avisynth to do IVTC, since madVR film mode does not decimate all videos correctly. I have a G1620 (2700 passmark) and I'm getting 100% cpu usage and dropped frames. Does it really take this much cpu to run avisynth filters in real time?

This is the script I'm using...

LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files (x86)\Haali\MatroskaSplitter\avss.dll")
dss2("D:\Videos\video.ts")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files (x86)\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\TIVTC.dll")
tfm().tdecimate()

[huhn]

looks like it does. i guess it's the software decoding not the script.
how do get audio with this script?
and more important why do you ask about avisynth issue in the madVR thread.?

[michkrol]

(...)
My problem is that I need to force my projector for half SBS & half TopBottom 3D mkv at 50hz to play these 24hz files in 3D correctly. So it would be great to force the refresh rate of my display with condition, like a tag in the filename, autodetect the format of the mkv...
(...)
You can put refreshrate=50 into the file or folder name (if you have multiple files like that) to force madvr to switch to 50hz refresh rate.
Keep in mind you need to have this mode listed in madvr's device settings and have mode switching enabled.
I'm trying to play a 1080i29.97 file with avisynth to do IVTC, since madVR film mode does not decimate all videos correctly. I have a G1620 (2700 passmark) and I'm getting 100% cpu usage and dropped frames. Does it really take this much cpu to run avisynth filters in real time?
(...)

As already mentioned by huhn, this is wrong thread for avisynth support, but it is the right place if you want madvr to play these files correctly :)
Check out the bug tracker http://bugs.madshi.net/ and post a link to sample file which is played incorrectly in a similar bug report, like http://bugs.madshi.net/view.php?id=150 or http://bugs.madshi.net/view.php?id=201 depending on your exact problem.
Madshi is working on bug fixes when he has the time and it's easier for him to have everything in one place ;)

[StinDaWg]

^^ Ya, I already PM'd him sample files. He seems receptive to trying to fix it. :)

I was just curious if avisynth was such a hit, because someone with an i7 told me he was able to play these with only 10% cpu compared to 5% normally.

[angedelo]

You can put refreshrate=50 into the file or folder name (if you have multiple files like that) to force madvr to switch to 50hz refresh rate.
Keep in mind you need to have this mode listed in madvr's device settings and have mode switching enabled.

Thanks a lot, that's work great. :thanks:

[lagittaja]

Guys, I'm sorry if this is a known issue, tried browsing the thread back a "few" pages and doing some searches but couldn't find a definitive answer.

I'm running:
latest madVR
MPC-HC 1.7.7
LAV 0.63
GTX 670 w/ 347.25 (before had 347.09 which was the same)

If I enable NNEDI3 (chroma up or doubling or both) with any neuron level I get small green dots (or short lines) in vertical or horizontal lines dancing across the screen with any video I try.

Example madVR settings:
Chroma upscaling, NNEDI3 32 neurons
image doubling, use NNEDI3 to double luma+chroma, if 2x, 32 neurons
image upscaling, Jinc4+ARLL
image downscaling, Catmull-Rom+ARLL
smooth motion, only if there would be...
dithering, ED2
trade quality, none selected

Is this a known issue?
If so is it affected by drivers? Should I downgrade them to xxx.xx?
Or is it just nvidia being nvidia? Or does it only work with newer cards?

E: I'm so blind.. Missed BetA13 and Hprd's posts, I'll rollback to 344.75 and see what happens.
E2: And 344.75 works.

[bcec]

Is there a way to add delay to video within madVR based on a profile being used?

I am bitstreaming audio to my AVR. At the same time, I have two scaling profiles for madVR. One for using NNEDI3 for 1080p->2160p when fps < 26, and the other is Jinc3 for all other fps (madvr also auto changes the refresh rate for me). Turns out when using NNEDI3, my video is delayed about 100ms, so I add that delay to my AVR for audio so everything is in sync. But this causes out-of-sync audio for content upscaled using Jinc3 (because for Jinc3, I don't actually need to add any delay to my AVR).

Any ideas, how to solve this so I don't have to keep changing lip sync?

[Anima123]

I wonder why I couldn't get NNEDI3 run smoothly for 720p -> 1080p with my 880M, only less than 60% GPU load with dropped frames.

Any idea how can I utilize the full power of the video card? BTW, I already configured mpc-hc (changed to mpc-hc2.exe) to utilize the nVidia card with preferring performance, and 32 be the neuron numbers.

[Neeto]

Is there a way to add delay to video within madVR based on a profile being used?

I am bitstreaming audio to my AVR. At the same time, I have two scaling profiles for madVR. One for using NNEDI3 for 1080p->2160p when fps < 26, and the other is Jinc3 for all other fps (madvr also auto changes the refresh rate for me). Turns out when using NNEDI3, my video is delayed about 100ms, so I add that delay to my AVR for audio so everything is in sync. But this causes out-of-sync audio for content upscaled using Jinc3 (because for Jinc3, I don't actually need to add any delay to my AVR).

Any ideas, how to solve this so I don't have to keep changing lip sync?

Ditto that - except I'm using an internal Lynx card.
Thought I was going mad until other people watching start commenting on it.
The more I try to use the processing of GPU for lower resolution, the worse it gets. It's getting very tricky to balance the number of buffers that helps with not dropping frames and getting the lip sync to align across the different profiles... SIGH.....