madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[namaiki]

It's probably because I got a weak GPU. If I play video at 1280x720 screen resolution, there generally isn't much change for flushes.


But yeah, most of my stuff is 23.976 or 29.97.

[madshi]

@leeperry, I'm still waiting for a log from you about that synchronized frame judder stuff. Can you reproduce it (sometimes smooth playback, sometimes non-smooth playback after seeking) with the debug build? If so, can you please create a log for me, by doing this:

(1) start playback (it must be smooth) and wait 5 seconds
(2) seek until you get non-smooth playback
(3) let playback run non-smooth for 5 seconds
(4) DON'T seek another time and DON'T switch between windowed <-> FS mode
(5) quit the media player

The log only helps if (1) is smooth and after some seeking (2) isn't. (4) is important, so that I know that the end of the log shows the non-smooth situation.

I started the clip, double-clicked to full, double-clicked to windowed, paused once the lag was gone and closed MPC-HC

I started the clip, skipped to a random part in the movie, double-clicked to full, double-clicked to windowed, paused once the lag was gone and closed MPC-HC
They seem to be useful. But I can see a "Pause" and "Run" before the going back to windowed mode! Maybe double clicking internally pauses video for a short time? This is probably causing the problem, I'll have to research that. At least I can see some weird things madVR is doing in the log. Try using the key shortcut for switching between windowed <-> FS. That way the problem will probably be gone for you.

I loose a few frames when I open a mkv.Normal ?
Nothing to worry about, as long as it's only during opening.

Now the big problem is the dvds.Very little work :black screen but sound and I can't recover= I have to kill the zp process.
Madshi,I have to say that I have 100 % success with the Haali renderer.
Other pbs same symptoms and full success with the Haali renderer:
-divx in .avi doesn't work,
-avc in .m2ts doesn't work (But mpeg2 and vc1 using the Ms WMP11 decoder in .m2ts works and the quality is plain fantastic !)
What's you splitter for zp,Madshi and wich version of zp are you using,please ?
I'm using various splitter and decoder versions, depending on with which configuration people are reporting problems. It makes more sense if you tell me exactly what setup (splitter, decoder, media player) you're using and if you upload a few short samples. I need to be able to reproduce the problems, otherwise fixing them will be difficult.

[leeperry]

(1) start playback (it must be smooth) and wait 5 seconds
(2) seek until you get non-smooth playback
(3) let playback run non-smooth for 5 seconds
(4) DON'T seek another time and DON'T switch between windowed <-> FS mode
(5) quit the media player

The log only helps if (1) is smooth and after some seeking (2) isn't. (4) is important, so that I know that the end of the log shows the non-smooth situation.
Your wish is my command: http://www.mediafire.com/file/mniqolkoi0m/madVR%20-%20log.rar

[madshi]

Your wish is my command
Great log! It helped me find one important bug. I hope that the next build will fix this problem once and for all... :)

[6233638]

Smoothness is very subjective, and the humain brain is a poor measuring tool :rolleyes: ...yet, I can't seem to be able to detect a diff between having all flush disabled or set to "flush and loop"(the latter slightly increases the CPU load, though). I think they're all equally smooth, I'm only forced to enable the "texture upload" thingie otherwise going FS>windowed is extremely laggy(this time it's not placebo!).
I see +30% CPU from my settings to loop on all. More than a slight increase.

I only see a change in smoothness using loop on all when using resampling my gpu cant handle.

FS>Windowed seems to take either three frames or v-sync intervals for me.
1) Blank
2) Stretched image
3) Aspect ratio fix

Windowed>FS takes two
1) Stretched image
2) Aspect ratio fix

Can everybody please test whether the flush option "Before present" does any good? If not, maybe I can at least remove that one.
If stats are right with 'after last step' set to sleep (sounded like they were) then present times are:

dont: 0.16ms
flush: 0.26ms
sleep: 1.33ms
loop: 0.56ms

Sleep reduces rendering time slightly but rendering + present total is higher than dont. Others are the same/worse for render.

Tested the rest after this, numbers are not exact (scene changes, but each 'set' had the same scene) but roughly correct to what I see from giving it some time to settle. 'After last step' always set to sleep:

After render steps:
dont: 21.5/0.16
flush: 20.8/0.17
sleep: 21.8/0.16
loop: 21.3/0.17

After backbuffer:
dont: 21.8/0.16
flush: 20.8/0.17
sleep: 20.9/0.17
loop: 19.5/0.17

After present:
dont: 21.2/0.17
flush: 21.1/0.26
sleep: 19.5/3.1
loop: 19.2/2.2


I will not use loop because of the big CPU increase, even if it means better times on something. So my recommended settings are now:

flush
sleep
flush
dont
dont

'After last step' might perform better set to something other than sleep but the stats break and I don't need more speed.


Update: using a resampler the GPU cant handle, 'after render steps' is better on dont rather than flush or present time goes in the 3+ ms range instead of 0.17ms. Flush is better when the GPU can cope though.

[leeperry]

Great log! It helped me find one important bug. I hope that the next build will fix this problem once and for all... :)
Goodness gracious, awesome news! Sometimes seeking gives exactly that...jerky playback, even though Reclock's running...you're forced to reseek. But some other times, playback starts fine and it becomes likes this after 45/60 mins :(

It was more or less possible to overcome this issue by playing around w/ HR's jitter, but this was a major PITA...plus HR is nowhere near as smooth as mVR.

tbh this problem has more or less disgusted me of watching movies on my DLP pj....I was eagerly hoping for a D3D FS exclusive mode in mVR. If you could make this issue vanish for good(in windowed mode would be the icing on the cake :eek:), I'd be eternally grateful http://forum-images.hardware.fr/images/perso/mzarella.gif

[pie1394]

Tried madVR 0.17 again under Win7 + Aero ON + 23.976 fps, and the tearing issue is gone. Yet I don't like it because the hidden task bar still shows some white lines on top of video. With EVR-sync D3D Exclusive mode, these are hidden.

Turn off Aero, and the tearing comes back again near bottom side at 23.976 Hz. Sometimes it is probably near the middle at 59.94 Hz if my eyes didn't watch it wrong. EVR-sync mode uses an interesting approach as it was discussed previously, and there is no tearing issue at 23.976 Hz for FILM contents.

So it looks like D3D Exclusive mode is still a better solution to deal with various issues.

[namaiki]

pie1394, you had tearing with Aero disabled. What were your flush settings?

[JarrettH]

Yeah a single click pauses the clip. alt+enter is the shortcut

So even though the lag is due to pausing it makes it look like it's part of the switching transition.

[madshi]

Goodness gracious, awesome news! Sometimes seeking gives exactly that...jerky playback, even though Reclock's running...you're forced to reseek. But some other times, playback starts fine and it becomes likes this after 45/60 mins :(

It was more or less possible to overcome this issue by playing around w/ HR's jitter, but this was a major PITA...plus HR is nowhere near as smooth as mVR.

tbh this problem has more or less disgusted me of watching movies on my DLP pj....I was eagerly hoping for a D3D FS exclusive mode in mVR. If you could make this issue vanish for good(in windowed mode would be the icing on the cake :eek:), I'd be eternally grateful http://forum-images.hardware.fr/images/perso/mzarella.gif
Well, I think it will be fixed in the next build. At least one bug responsible for the problem. Maybe there are more bugs. If so, just create another log for me with the next build. I'm sure we'll get this fixed soon.

So it looks like D3D Exclusive mode is still a better solution to deal with various issues.
I've always said that exclusive mode is the best solution. It's just that I want to get windowed mode right first, before I move on to work on exclusive mode.

[JarrettH]

The seek bar (timer) has considerable lag...speeds up and slows down, doesn't seem to know where I am in the clip precisely. Wonder if that is related to anything.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=F3DBBK8S

That one I seeked somewhere, used alt+enter to full and alt+enter again to window and closed (no pauses)

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=V7RYCCJN

I did the same thing here (smaller log file)

It doesn't consistently do this with alt+enter, just seems to have a lot of cases of just ok switching or much worse

[STaRGaZeR]

madshi, have you considered adding support for RGB32 input? I ask this because the only way of displaying subs in madVR is using ffdshow or VSFilter, and in YV12 they work fine but the borders look like crap because of the chroma downsampling needed. You'd ask why use madVR then, well, because of the very good vsync it has ;)

Couple of things I've noticed:

- madVR doesn't react to real time resolution changes.
- Windowed - fullscreen switching, it's slow and weird looking.
- Pause/resume or seek can completely destroy smoothness, from perfectly smooth before pausing, to something similar to 3:2 pulldown after resuming playback. Another pause/resume/seek fixes it.

Other than that, great work as always.

Info:
* ATI 5850, Cats 10.5
* Windows Vista x64 SP2
* 1680x1050 at 119,8746...Hz , 23,976fps material
* Aero on
* Single monitor

[janos666]

madshi, have you considered adding support for RGB32 input? I ask this because the only way of displaying subs in madVR is using ffdshow or VSFilter, and in YV12 they work fine but the borders look like crap because of the chroma downsampling needed. You'd ask why use madVR then, well, because of the very good vsync it has ;)

Couple of things I've noticed:

- madVR doesn't react to real time resolution changes.
- Windowed - fullscreen switching, it's slow and weird looking.

I use FFDShow's subtitle renderer and I don't have any problem with 720p or 1080p sources.
Of course, there could be a problem with low resolution videos on big screens (like 1920x1200 here), but I do not usually watch SD materials anymore. I think RGB32 output won't help in this situation.
I ran into this problem once but text was readable after some tweaking (with Spline64 resize, Lanczos will create ghost images around the fonts). I had to change the Outline and Shadow settings.
My usual settings are 1 and 2 for HD materials, but I set them to 1 and 0 for SD sources (and I use gradient shadows). And I had to use bigger font size for SD than I usually prefer (which is small, my guests always blame about that and they request much bigger fonts...).
And the last thing. I set the subtitle position to the center of the screen. (The other blame factor but I never move it away. I would not like to drag my eyes and randomly miss the movie picture or the subtitle. And a small subtitle won't cover too much of the picture...)
Give it a try.

Why do you want to change resolution on LCD display? They should always work at their native resolution and it won't harm anything if you keep it at 120Hz all the time.
Window-Fullscreen is weird, yes. But nothing to worry about. I would request many other changes/improvements/fixes before these things. (Sorry, I do not want to provoke you, just...)

[Hypernova]

Subtitle is very important to me, but as long as madshi still say "subtitle pin is part of the plan", then I don't think RGB input will be needed much.

[starlight2]

Hello, i5 and use a PC with integrated graphics. I tried to
install madvr with MPC HC but I get the message that
my graphics card does not support non power of two textures
I can not use Madvr? There 's some solution?
Thank you

[namaiki]

starlight2: Are you using the latest MadVR? (v0.17) Also, what is the model of the integrated graphics processor that you have?

[STaRGaZeR]

I use FFDShow's subtitle renderer and I don't have any problem with 720p or 1080p sources.
Of course, there could be a problem with low resolution videos on big screens (like 1920x1200 here), but I do not usually watch SD materials anymore. I think RGB32 output won't help in this situation.
I ran into this problem once but text was readable after some tweaking (with Spline64 resize, Lanczos will create ghost images around the fonts). I had to change the Outline and Shadow settings.
My usual settings are 1 and 2 for HD materials, but I set them to 1 and 0 for SD sources (and I use gradient shadows). And I had to use bigger font size for SD than I usually prefer (which is small, my guests always blame about that and they request much bigger fonts...).
And the last thing. I set the subtitle position to the center of the screen. (The other blame factor but I never move it away. I would not like to drag my eyes and randomly miss the movie picture or the subtitle. And a small subtitle won't cover too much of the picture...)
Give it a try.

Why do you want to change resolution on LCD display? They should always work at their native resolution and it won't harm anything if you keep it at 120Hz all the time.
Window-Fullscreen is weird, yes. But nothing to worry about. I would request many other changes/improvements/fixes before these things. (Sorry, I do not want to provoke you, just...)

This is VSFilter and madVR, bicubic60 for everything (YV12):

http://thumbnails25.imagebam.com/8365/78870283649578.gif (http://www.imagebam.com/image/78870283649578)

This is VSFilter and EVR (RGB32):

http://thumbnails32.imagebam.com/8365/ad27c483649581.gif (http://www.imagebam.com/image/ad27c483649581)

Corner case, but you get the idea. This is zoomed on a 720p source, quite visible without zoom too. Black and white subs, no problem since there's no chroma there. As soon as you introduce colors things get out of hand real fast because of the chroma subsampling needed for YV12.

Why do you want to change resolution on LCD display? They should always work at their native resolution and it won't harm anything if you keep it at 120Hz all the time.
Window-Fullscreen is weird, yes. But nothing to worry about. I would request many other changes/improvements/fixes before these things. (Sorry, I do not want to provoke you, just...)

I mean real time video resolution change, not screen resolution :p
And yes, I agree, but weird things need to be noted even if they're not important. In my case, it annoys the hell out of me.

Subtitle is very important to me, but as long as madshi still say "subtitle pin is part of the plan", then I don't think RGB input will be needed much.

Even if you achieve perfect subtitle rendering, YV12 only still has the problem of, well, only allowing YV12 content to be played with madVR. The vast majority is YV12, but it's not the only one.

[starlight2]

namaiki now I can not see what version
I installed, but 'I installed the week
ago, and when 'was released 0:17? the processor is i5 650.
Thank you very much

[pirlouy]

I tested all "flush" options one by one (I mean I let "don't flush" for all except the one I am testing), but I always have tearing when playing on 23 or 24Hz. Not a lot, just a line of 2% at bottom. But I have no tearing at all with overlay mixer.

[janos666]

I can see the pictures but I still don't feel it a a problem. You can use white text (with a little black outline and a small shadow if you wish). It will be easily readable. And I recommend Spline64 anyway. Your VGA can handle that easily and it is much better for subtitles (and for the whole movie picture in my opinion) than SoftCubic.
SoftCubic80 makes the picture softer to hide the compression artifacts (and makes the text blurred) but Spline64 will give you more details (of course, fake, but good illusion) without ringing (sharp subtitles).

[Hypernova]

Even if you achieve perfect subtitle rendering, YV12 only still has the problem of, well, only allowing YV12 content to be played with madVR. The vast majority is YV12, but it's not the only one.

Yes, but I think madshi made a point in the beginning that he made madVR accept YV12 only for a reason (which I don't totally understand). So if subtitle doesn't make much of a problem, I don't think he'll change it.

[6233638]

Corner case, but you get the idea. This is zoomed on a 720p source, quite visible without zoom too. Black and white subs, no problem since there's no chroma there. As soon as you introduce colors things get out of hand real fast because of the chroma subsampling needed for YV12.The whole point of madVR is that it does a really good job with chroma upsampling and the RGB conversion with 16-bit precision. What is the point if you use something else to do the upsampling and conversion to RGB32?

Also, when are subtitles ever colored like that?

[janos666]

Also, when are subtitles ever colored like that?

You can use any custom font types and colors if you wish. And some subtitle formats have the possibility to save attributes like color (for example, you will see different colors for different voices - No, I never watch any movie with this functionality. And you can override it...).

[STaRGaZeR]

I can see the pictures but I still don't feel it a a problem. You can use white text (with a little black outline and a small shadow if you wish). It will be easily readable. And I recommend Spline64 anyway. Your VGA can handle that easily and it is much better for subtitles (and for the whole movie picture in my opinion) than SoftCubic.
SoftCubic80 makes the picture softer to hide the compression artifacts (and makes the text blurred) but Spline64 will give you more details (of course, fake, but good illusion) without ringing (sharp subtitles).

MadVR is all about quality. Quality is severely lacking here. This is not caused by the resizers or madVR itself, it's caused by the inherent limitations of subsampled chroma planes. It's as important as getting the best chroma upsampling IMO, because it's much more visible. Yes, I know how to circunvent this, but I don't really want to say no to quality colored subs if I don't want to. Nobody should. We already have at least 2 good subtitle filters, we only need an RGB input pin to madVR so they can look as good as they do with any other renderer, at least until madshi has time to work on the subtitle pin and renderer.

About spline, it's just personal preference. I like bicubic more than anything else.

Yes, but I think madshi made a point in the beginning that he made madVR accept YV12 only for a reason (which I don't totally understand). So if subtitle doesn't make much of a problem, I don't think he'll change it.

I know, but I want to hear what he has to say about this. No RGB fraps videos, no true YUY2 samples, no way of getting quality subs, and similar things. Really a pity.

The whole point of madVR is that it does a really good job with chroma upsampling and the RGB conversion with 16-bit precision. What is the point if you use something else to do the upsampling and conversion to RGB32?

Also, when are subtitles ever colored like that?

Because there's more in madVR than just high quality chroma upsampling, as I said in one of my previous posts.

Those subs are a corner case to clearly show the problem, as I said in one of my previous post too. I you want to use subs with any color in them, you'll see that between the body and the outline, between the outline and the shadow, between the outline and the video, etc.

[madshi]

The seek bar (timer) has considerable lag...speeds up and slows down, doesn't seem to know where I am in the clip precisely. Wonder if that is related to anything.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=F3DBBK8S

That one I seeked somewhere, used alt+enter to full and alt+enter again to window and closed (no pauses)

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=V7RYCCJN

I did the same thing here (smaller log file)

It doesn't consistently do this with alt+enter, just seems to have a lot of cases of just ok switching or much worse
Thanks. The hint with the seek bar was helpful. I'll see what I can do...

madshi, have you considered adding support for RGB32 input? I ask this because the only way of displaying subs in madVR is using ffdshow or VSFilter, and in YV12 they work fine but the borders look like crap because of the chroma downsampling needed.
If I generally accept RGB input then some decoders will send RGB instead of YV12, which is bad for quality, because decoders are usually rather bad at chroma upsampling and color conversion. That's the main reason why I only support YV12 input. That said, an extra input pin for subtitles is on my to do list and that should fix your issue with subtitle rendering quality.

You'd ask why use madVR then, well, because of the very good vsync it has ;) [...] 1680x1050 at 119,8746...Hz
Oh, another high refresh rate user? I'm surprised how many are out there! Does EVR-Custom/-Sync not work well for such high refresh rates?

madVR doesn't react to real time resolution changes.
Do you have a sample for me?

Pause/resume or seek can completely destroy smoothness, from perfectly smooth before pausing, to something similar to 3:2 pulldown after resuming playback. Another pause/resume/seek fixes it.
Will probably be fixed in the next build.

Hello, i5 and use a PC with integrated graphics.
Is that Intel integrated graphics? If so, please redownload the latest madVR version. It should work for you. However, Intel integrated graphics is really slow, so you may have to change the scaling algorithm to "bilinear" (right-click on video -> Filters -> madVR) or avoid scaling altogether.

I tested all "flush" options one by one (I mean I let "don't flush" for all except the one I am testing), but I always have tearing when playing on 23 or 24Hz. Not a lot, just a line of 2% at bottom. But I have no tearing at all with overlay mixer.
Not sure why you still have tearing. It seems to be gone for most other madVR users. Anyway, Aero and exclusive mode should both fix that.

[pirlouy]

In fact, we speak about Aero, but in fact, I think the only thing it does is activate V-Sync from drivers. But there are bugs and V-sync is sometimes disable without noticeable reason. So, if you use Direct3D, you'll be able to activate V-Sync by this method, and we'll be still able not to use Aero.

For tearing, I don't know, maybe it's the 5 meters wire. I don't think so, but to be honest, I don't see 3:2 effect whereas I see tearing, so I watch everything in 60Hz now. It's enough for my eyes.

[pirlouy]

Damn it. I've just seen big tearing in 60Hz (there's a line which go higher and higher and restart at bottom). I've tried to play with options, but no changes.
Strange, 'cause it does not act like this with 0.13; and even 0.17 yesterday... :/

[janos666]

Oh, another high refresh rate user? I'm surprised how many are out there! Does EVR-Custom/-Sync not work well for such high refresh rates?

It was said that "2010 will be the year of 3D". The smooth playback of 1080p24(/48) movies on PCs is a side effect of this hype. But I could not see any monitor with IPS or VA LCD panel and 1920x1200@120Hz support, only some horribly expensive TN+Film panels. You can have 3D and/or smooth video playback or correct colors for the same price. (I am not talking about HDTVs.) I hate the feeling of TNs, so i would wait some year with that pronouncement.

[pankov]

madshi,
I have to agree with 6233638
I was thinking about requesting one more indicator in the OSD - "repeated frames". I'm not exactly sure if it's possible to have meaningful indicator showing the repeated frames having in mind all the possible variations of the display refresh rate but I guess if you are able to add such an indicator we'll be able to objectively measure the "smoothness" of the playback. After all if there are no dropped frames and no repeated frames we have perfect playback, right?
madshi, I guess you've simply missed my question among other but if it's not too stupid would you care to answer?
Am I understanding it correctly that if we have a missed/dropped or repeated frame we will see stutter? It will be great if we can measure it - "missed/dropped" frames in the last 5 seconds (didn't make it to the screen - to be shown) and "repeated" (or it's more accurate to say - missed vsync at which a new frame should have been presented) frames in the last 5 seconds (stayed too long on screen).

[STaRGaZeR]

If I generally accept RGB input then some decoders will send RGB instead of YV12, which is bad for quality, because decoders are usually rather bad at chroma upsampling and color conversion. That's the main reason why I only support YV12 input. That said, an extra input pin for subtitles is on my to do list and that should fix your issue with subtitle rendering quality.

I understand, but seriously, there isn't any other real solution to that "issue"? This renderer wants something more than YV12 ;)
BTW, even if you add that subtitle pin, you still have to put the subs on screen. Are you going to implement your own subtitle renderer?

Oh, another high refresh rate user? I'm surprised how many are out there! Does EVR-Custom/-Sync not work well for such high refresh rates?


It does, but when madVR works it's better. I'll probably switch when all the bugs and missing features are implemented.

Do you have a sample for me?


Just enable/disable the resize filter in ffdshow. For example, take a 1920x1080 movie and resize it to something bigger. madVR will only display the upper left 1920x1080 pixels.

[Mark_A_W]

I don't understand all this subtitle quality talk.


I'm running VS Filter, and the Avatar yellow subs (bluray converted to mkv), were perfect.


Subs work fine, they look the same as the original bluray.

Can someone explain the issue?

[janos666]

I don't understand all this subtitle quality talk.


I'm running VS Filter, and the Avatar yellow subs (bluray converted to mkv), were perfect.


Subs work fine, they look the same as the original bluray.

Can someone explain the issue?

He provided a sample image, you can see the problem. But I am on your side and I think that this is not a real problem and can be easily ignored with HD movies (while this is a real problem with SD sources, yes). And it is less noticeable with Spline64 resize (in case you use that) and white texts.

[STaRGaZeR]

I'm running VS Filter, and the Avatar yellow subs (bluray converted to mkv), were perfect.


Subs work fine, they look the same as the original bluray.

Screenshot?

[Keiyakusha]

Well, as madshi said he will add pin for subs, so don't think that I'm asking again about it, I just can't pass by:

Few facts about subtitles & vsfilter from my experience:
1) SD on big screen: looks not very good. doubling resolution - only if you have free cpu power to spare and not an option (I want madvr to do any kinds of scaling, nothing else)
2) HD on smaller screen/resolution: also can look not very good and takes more cpu power which is wasted because subs prepared for full video resolution. In case when subs overlayed with renderer we can control resolution in which subs are rendered (usually we want this to be set to "desktop"), we also can utilize black borders like on 16:10 screen with 16:9 video (not to mention with 2.35-2.4 aspect ratio)
3) we want to use a bit of postprocesing. to do so, we have to include decoder+ffdshow+vsfilter in the same graph. somehow this noticeably affects performance. sadly ffdshow subs are not perfect yet to completely replace vsfilter

[pie1394]

pie1394, you had tearing with Aero disabled. What were your flush settings?

If I don't remember it wrong, it does not matter how the flush settings are adjusted. To me I just feel 1920x1080@59.94Hz with Aero OFF is the only qualified one w/o obvious visual issues.

Luma: Lanczos4
Chroma: Spline64
after last step: flush
[others]: don't flush


ps: The GPU is GTX260+, and the output is 42" Plasma TV with 1080i display characteristics.

[namaiki]

If I don't remember it wrong, it does not matter how the flush settings are adjusted.

If you have both the top two flush settings as 'don't flush,' there will definitely be tearing, in my experience with Aero off.

Do you have tearing with MadVR's current defaults?





1) SD on big screen: looks not very good.

Also depends on the scaler used.

usually we want this to be set to "desktop"
IMO can also be annoying when the subs are scaled independently from the video and they *pop* out from the screen.

decoder+ffdshow+vsfilter
Which decoder are you currently using that isn't part of ffdshow?

[cyberbeing]

Do you have a sample for me?Just enable/disable the resize filter in ffdshow. For example, take a 1920x1080 movie and resize it to something bigger. madVR will only display the upper left 1920x1080 pixels.

I can confirm this. madVR has always had this problem no matter what the video and display resolution is. If you upscale when madVR is playing back a video it only shows the upper left corner as STaRGaZeR says, and if you downscale it places reduced resolution in the center of the old frame size with black borders all around.

[Keiyakusha]

Also depends on the scaler used.

Agree, but I like sharp scalers...
EDIT: actually I changing scaler from time to time based on content (anime/film)
IMO can also be annoying when the subs are scaled independently from the video and they *pop* out from the screen.
Not sure what you mean here. If you mean case when they displayed on black borders outside of the video frame - this is feature and can be turned on or off (there is some 3rd state but not sure what it does) and not depends on resizing subtitles...
And independently on texture resolution, subs should maintain aspect ratio and be correctly placed (unless there is some bug that I don't know).

Which decoder are you currently using that isn't part of ffdshow?
CoreAVC. ffdshow is too slow for me. But even if I'll use ffdshow for decoding, it has the same problems as vsfilter (since we don't do scaling in ffdshow) + some drawbacks of the rendering engine. By the way even If I will do scaling in ffdshow, I need to pay attention for color coefficients (since I need to output yv12 for madvr) which means adding avisynth to the chain and which is I, simple user, don't want to be bothered with. Sadly ffdshow doesn't automatically corrects colors for me.

[Hypernova]

I think namaiki mean that if subtitle is scaled independently from the picture, it would sometimes look too sharp compare to the pircture. eg. If you have a SD content, but set the subtitle texture size to, say, 1080p, the sub will stand out from the picture. Personally I prefer it that way though. Subtitle is crucial in my anime watching, so it's ok for me that it's popping out.

[namaiki]

Yeah, what Hypernova wrote is what I meant, but I guess it's all preference.

Keiyakusha: you're doing other filtering with ffdshow or just subtitles?

[cyberlolo]

If you have both the top two flush settings as 'don't flush,' there will definitely be tearing, in my experience with Aero off.

I have all options set at "don't flush" and I have no tearing at all (Aero on).

Flushing can make things better (remove stuttering) and worse (reduce rendering resources). So it's hard to say which effect flushing will have for you. Would be nice if you could try the default flush settings.

I've tried the default settings and they made no difference to me. Everything is the same smooth and with no stuttering than if using "don't flush" in every option.

[namaiki]

I have all options set at "don't flush" and I have no tearing at all (Aero on).That's because you have aero on.

[iSeries]

@ namaiki - I have all options set to 'Don't flush' and I have no tearing with Aero OFF. This is with my TV at 23.976hz and playback of 23.976fps material.

[namaiki]

Then, I guess it depends on the setup. :P

For me, on my ~60Hz screen, I will experience tearing if I have both of the top two options set to don't flush.

[namaiki]

So, does anyone experience any adverse effects with the top two to flush?
or the top to flush loop?

[iSeries]

Yep, clearly there is no 'one size fits all' solution!

With the defaults (and other combinations) I was getting more dropped frames than setting them to 'Don't flush'.

[namaiki]

Yep, clearly there is no 'one size fits all' solution!

>_> I'd really like to think there is.

Are you sure there are more drops? ie not just at the start of video playback or after seeking?

[iSeries]

I've tested over and over. For example earlier today with the defaults and 30 mins of 'The Dark Knight' I got 8 dropped frames (obviously I reset the stats after playback) and I noticed every single one (no pausing or seeking). With all set to 'Don't flush' I got 0 dropped frames. I've tested and retested both this and the defaults with other movies. In fact, I played an hour of 'Up In The Air' last night and got 0 drops with 'Don't flush'.

[namaiki]

kk.. well I'm going to do retesting with all options with the next MadVR release anyways.

Also iSeries, what were your system specs again, and do you get any dropped frames with the OSD turned off? For me, I get plenty of drops/stutter with the OSD turned on, but it is close to perfect with the OSD turned off.

[iSeries]

Win 7 32bit, ATI 4550 (latest CCC), Aero off, with my TV as the secondary monitor. It was after watching with the defaults (and OSD off) that prompted me to do the testing, as normally I'm a 'defaults' kind of guy :)