madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[Childofbodom]

beta 208

OK I managed to find it on AVS forum somewhere.
But do you mean the glitches are gone (and frame stuttering on Win11 24H2) or just that the presenation glitch counter in the stats window (ctrl + J) has been removed. In the changelog it status that there are only minor changes to HDR settings, no big renedering updates.

The latter wouldnt solve the actual issue ofcourse ;)

[ttnuagmada]

just a different API that's it.
it is usually preferred not to use HDR toggled on in windows with madVR and let the other API take over.

please don't use this "logic" for a lack of a better word for other software or games where this is different. Microsoft wants user to use windows HDR for HDR.

Do windows HDR tone mapping settings override MadVR or vice-versa? I've always turned windows HDR off and let MadVR handle it, but I've been doing more gaming recently and having to turn it on and off everytime I switch back and forth between games and movie watching is getting a bit old.

[huhn]

OK I managed to find it on AVS forum somewhere.
But do you mean the glitches are gone (and frame stuttering on Win11 24H2) or just that the presenation glitch counter in the stats window (ctrl + J) has been removed. In the changelog it status that there are only minor changes to HDR settings, no big renedering updates.

The latter wouldnt solve the actual issue ofcourse ;)

i can only assume.
and my assumsion is that the gliches displayed are not worth it or wrong so sending user down the wrong path.
or this is a bug.

Do windows HDR tone mapping settings override MadVR or vice-versa? I've always turned windows HDR off and let MadVR handle it, but I've been doing more gaming recently and having to turn it on and off everytime I switch back and forth between games and movie watching is getting a bit old.
i can tell you windows will do what ever it wants with SDR. it clearly affects madVR.
with HDR i peronally never tested it.

[mclingo]

so.. i've had to come back to MADVR as kodi has its own problems. So this stuttering issue i've been having, i'm on 23h2 and i'm stilll getting it, I also tried disabling GP scheduling, starting to wonder if I have the same problem as everyone else or a different one, my spec:

Edition Windows 11 Pro
Version 23H2
Installed on ‎15/‎11/‎2023
OS build 22631.4602
Experience Windows Feature Experience Pack 1000.22700.1055.0
ryzen 5700g - 48 gb ram / AMD RX7800XT

The issue for me is everything appears to play ok, it shows no frame skips for days+ but i'm getting dropped repeat frames, only in the single figures usually but its enough to drive me nuts, expecially on panning scenes.

[toki]

on the newest windows 11 build it seems turning off fast boot is working so far. No stutters for minute now. Will report back if I start to notice it coming back

[mclingo]

is this 24H2, i'm just beeing offered this update, should I avoid it?

[huhn]

if you want to use madVR properly you should avoid win 11.

[mclingo]

They could just as well break Windows 10 as well, I'm hoping somebody will find a proper workaround for these issues or at least get to the bottom of them and have madshi do a bug fix. Breath will not be held though...

[huhn]

this is extremely unlikely win 10 is a dead os the os itself will not break only driver support and new hardware will.

while win 11 does massive changes to DWM and other major stuff (for good reason btw.).

[mclingo]

If my HTPC was offline I probably would go back to Windows 10 but it's also a gaming machine and server so I need to have it fairly up to date so I'm stuck with Windows 11 for now.

[Sunspark]

Isn't it an option to install LTSC? It will receive updates until 2032.

[Amuat]

Is it almost certainly in the video file itself that quite often the image suddenly looks much more grainy for a while, or can it feasibly be an inconsistency in rendering either from the software renderer or monitor? I don't use any sharpening nor noise reduction options in either one, just the regular scaling.

[Sunspark]

Try with other player to verify.

[Amuat]

Try with other player to verify.

Is it not possible that certain scenes are for some reason harder to handle, so repeating them with the same or another renderer/player might not necessarily even rule out the software option? I was just curious if anyone here happens to know if this is possible at least in theory, instead of making a tentative inductive inference by repeating those type of scenes countless times.

[Sunspark]

Grainy scenes that go in and out can be if you're streaming over wifi.. likewise the encoding. If you're not streaming, if it looks the same in the other player, then it's the encoding of the file.

[Amuat]

Grainy scenes that go in and out can be if you're streaming over wifi.. likewise the encoding. If you're not streaming, if it looks the same in the other player, then it's the encoding of the file.

Not streaming. So you are not ruling out the player, but you are ruling out monitor's own processing outright?

[Sunspark]

Yes, because I don't have my monitor processing anything other than image scaling. If the file is a download, it's possible they encoded it from a stream that wasn't great.

Download a high quality clean source like the big buck bunny video and see if you still have the problem. http://bbb3d.renderfarming.net/download.html

[flossy_cake]

MadVR is a directshow plugin, and directshow is a microsoft API technology that only runs on windows. Therefore, for future proofing we need some talented individuals to make a compatibility layer that runs inside the os-independent open source media player called MPV so that we can run a directshow plugin inside MPV, thus future proofing MadVR on all platforms going indefinitely into to the future.

[huhn]

just use mpv as it is.
getting directshow to work on linux is the least of the problem here.
and even if mpv would support directshow it will not make madVR work.

[Sunspark]

One player I found is mpc-qt (https://github.com/mpc-qt/mpc-qt), which is basically the mpc interface with an mpv backend. It's a work in progress primarily meant for linux but it does have a windows x64 executable.

It's worth taking a look for those who want a familiar GUI with mpv options.

[Amuat]

Why does the OSD say "D3D11 fullscreen windowed (8 bit)", when the video is 10 bit and monitor is on 12 bit? The very next line is "P010, 10 bit, 4:2:0 (DXVA11)".

[huhn]

why there are many reasons for that.

it usually means it can't enter 10 bit mode.
for example you are on win 8 which can't do 10 bit fullscreen windowed.

[cybertech]

* when the PC is locked (Windows Key + L) madVR now pauses playback
Is there a way to disable this feature? Using PotPlayer and DVBViewer with madVR video renderer and whenever I do a Winkey + L to lock screen, both apps live streaming video will pause. I would like to have both apps continue to play during lock screen. Using EVR video renderer no such issue but I will prefer using madVR video renderer. Thank you.

[Amuat]

why there are many reasons for that.

it usually means it can't enter 10 bit mode.
for example you are on win 8 which can't do 10 bit fullscreen windowed.

Using Win 11. So you mean to say that it's not misleading and I'm actually stuck with 8 bit? What can I do about this? I've just recently switched back to madVR because I really like the noise reduction options, but this must be fixed or I have to limit it to 8 bit videos only.

[huhn]

yes if madVR tells you it is rendering 8 bit it renders 8 bit. the first line is the most important. hell 8 bit SDR get'S more out of this then HDR because PQ doesn't care.

and it's just for dither noise floor it has no real effect the reason this can happen are also broad.

something is infront of it stuff like flux or overlays and so on this is not a bug as long as madVR is set to auto or 10 bit it will try top use it if possible.

disabled fullscreen optimisation and FSE are pretty sure fire way to make 10 bit work.
that's win 7 10 bit.

[VergiL]

Hi, for a few days D3D11 fullscreen windowed indicates 8bit instead of 10bit (probably due to a windows update). How to restore the 10 bit? Thanks

[renq]

Hi, for a few days D3D11 fullscreen windowed indicates 8bit instead of 10bit (probably due to a windows update). How to restore the 10 bit? Thanks

You didn't read the last 5 posts before posting, did you?

[VergiL]

You didn't read the last 5 posts before posting, did you?

Yes I read, but I don't understand why a simple Windows update could affect 10 bit? And especially how to return to 10 bit.

[Sunspark]

You can disable fullscreen optimizations in the player .exe's properties on the compatibility tab.

Fullscreen exclusive is a selectable renderer setting in madvr and others but you need to do the former first for it to work.

[VergiL]

You can disable fullscreen optimizations in the player .exe's properties on the compatibility tab.

Fullscreen exclusive is a selectable renderer setting in madvr and others but you need to do the former first for it to work.

Thanks but not working. When i reboot pc D3D11 is in 10bit but after a while the 8bit come back again...
Do you know if fullscreenwindowed 8bit changes anything concrete when watching a movie compared to 10bit? Thanks

[huhn]

it raises the dithering noise floor

[Amuat]

Not working for me either. Wasn't using FSE, and disabling optimizations didn't solve it. Neither did changing from 12 bit to 10 bit in NVidia CP.


it raises the dithering noise floor

It doesn't affect color gradients when the source is 10 bit? Doesn't true HDR require it?

[huhn]

no why would it?

[Amuat]

no why would it?

Did you answer both? I remember reading somewhere that HDR needs 10 bit, but this seems to be incorrect. But in regards to gradients, surely there is a massive difference in available spectrum between 8 and 10 bit? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't dithering about masking visible color banding with noise, whereas more bits (of course in the actual source material and not just artificially converted from 8 bit) actually corrects or at least improves the situation by providing more of those missing gradients?

[huhn]

that was for both.

it's completely made up source is ycbcr madVR always renders RGB as typical on a computer at that point you need "infinite" bit deep.

10 bit are very helpful for encoding but for presentation it is only lowering the noise floor from dithering and that matters for SDR more then with HDR because PQ really doesn't care even 8 bit PQ the noise floor is so so small it does not really matter.

with SDR you may ever so slightly get better dark details with 10 bit because SDR a difference of 1 is quite big while a difference of 1 in PQ is nothing in term of brightness.

6 bit SDR dithered will not show banding. even taking an 8 bit source and rendering it at 10 bit will still lower the dithering noise floor you need to dither anyway.

and there is one report where an win 11 update make it break from gameDVR bar and it needs some reg stuff and so on disable.

so yeah 10 bit may not work for any application at the moment. good job Microsoft.

[Childofbodom]

Did you answer both? I remember reading somewhere that HDR needs 10 bit, but this seems to be incorrect. But in regards to gradients, surely there is a massive difference in available spectrum between 8 and 10 bit? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't dithering about masking visible color banding with noise, whereas more bits (of course in the actual source material and not just artificially converted from 8 bit) actually corrects or at least improves the situation by providing more of those missing gradients?

I am having the same issue that since yesterday MadVR only shows 8bit D3D11 FUllscreen windowed in OSD while I always was able to get 10 bit. Normally a reboot fixed it and it would jump back to 10 bit, but now it seems stuck at 8 permanently. (Win11 24H2)


In my perception the colors seem less vivid in 8 bit than 10 bit for HDR movies. Hope there is a fix somehere..

[clsid]

Someone found a possible workaround here:
https://www.avsforum.com/posts/63874132/

As usual Windows being buggy.

[Sunspark]

Even though it's been 4 years already of Win 11, it still feels too early. There is no reason people can't stay on 10 for years to come. Even if you care about patches, which I don't, you can still get all of the subscription patches by simply changing the tier you have. You can probably stay on 10 with extended patches for another decade (since IoT has regular support to 2032).

[VergiL]

Someone found a possible workaround here:
https://www.avsforum.com/posts/63874132/

As usual Windows being buggy.

The "solution" for the moment is to restart the PC before launching MPC or to restart Explorer (manually or by bat) each time MPC is launched...

[Aleksoid1978]

The "solution" for the moment is to restart the PC before launching MPC or to restart Explorer (manually or by bat) each time MPC is launched...

Looks like a madVR bug - since MPC VR has no problems with 10-bit output.

[huhn]

do you have the bug in the first place?

[Childofbodom]

The "solution" for the moment is to restart the PC before launching MPC or to restart Explorer (manually or by bat) each time MPC is launched...

Ok thnx will look into this!

Looks like a madVR bug - since MPC VR has no problems with 10-bit output.

I can indeed confirm that MPCVR does report out 10bit but unsure if it actually does or just reports it.

[Aleksoid1978]

I'm sure :)

[clsid]

Does it happen just with HDR and just with NVIDIA?
Madvr uses private NVIDIA API for HDR, while MPCVR uses standard Windows API.
So could be a driver regression.

[clsid]

A question for all Madvr users.

Do you notice any difference when doing this on Windows 11?
Right-click on your player .exe > Properties > Compatibility > enable "Use Legacy ICC Color Management"

This fixes an issue with MPCVR where HDR is washed out in fullscreen on some systems. I am curious if it also helps/hurts when using Madvr. Then maybe I can enable it by default for MPC-HC.

[huhn]

well time for this again:
http://bugs.madshi.net/my_view_page.php
be detailed about it and move on.

i have no HDR display connected to a win 11 pc and i will not install win 11 on my HTPC so i can't help here at all.

[VergiL]

Does it happen just with HDR and just with NVIDIA?
Madvr uses private NVIDIA API for HDR, while MPCVR uses standard Windows API.
So could be a driver regression.

I have an NVIDIA card but i have not updated the drivers since a lot and 10 bit work fine until few weeks. And the bug is on sdr too.

[huhn]

madVR can use the windows api too so that should be easy to check.

[brazen1]

Hmmm? Fwiw, I use W11 24H2 including all latest updates as of 3/11/25. Also, latest Nvidia driver 572.70. HDR and SDR both report 10bit in the madVR OSD and several other places I've confirmed. Full screen exclusive and Full screen windowed modes both report 10bit. The same is true when I use Kodi VideoPlayer (Windows API), MPC-BE/HC with madVR renderer (Nvidia API), or with MPC-Video Renderer (Windows API). Refresh rates are matched and/or doubled. I've done no workarounds or anything.

[Amuat]

You do need to use specific options for frames presented in advanced and the when and how shall the GPU be flushed.

Would someone be so kind as to present or point to the proper settings? Advanced frames are recommended to be set at 1 or 3 as I recall, I've been using the latter. In addition to the flushing settings, was there anything to be done in the NVidia CP (application specific or general) other than to turn on VSync (if that's even right)?