madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[toki]

https://pasteboard.co/IaK4q6j.pngThe above comment, is that for my version? 43' doesn't have Full UHD Color I don't think.

Edit: looking at the picture, and I've noticed it with another movie too, is that it flips in the middle of prensentation. Goes from correct coloring and so on to washed out looking like in the picture.

[huhn]

you are upscaling 2160 to 2679 why?

[Warner306]

To simplify things, set the GPU to 8-bits at 60 Hz and don't worry about 12-bits. It won't lower image quality or create banding.

Given the peak brightness of your display, I would convert HDR to SDR with pixel shaders. Set madVR to BT.709 and either 2.20 or 2.40, whichever gives you the better HDR picture. The gamma setting won't impact SDR content.

[toki]

edit: it's me doing pan & scan - scale to 16x9

now if someone could help me with the gpu spike. It went from like 61% to 97/98% after upgrading to the 4k tv. is that normal?

[huhn]

that's part of the player. so sorry no help i can do blindly even if i know the player it would be limited.

[jbnpaul]

edit: it's me doing pan & scan - scale to 16x9

now if someone could help me with the gpu spike. It went from like 61% to 97/98% after upgrading to the 4k tv. is that normal?



Did you move from hd to 4k?
If you were running 4k previously did anything else change? Bit depth, frame rate, hdr etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[toki]

Did you move from hd to 4k?
If you were running 4k previously did anything else change? Bit depth, frame rate, hdr etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I went from a 1080 tv to a 4k tv. The only thing that changed was the nvidia control panel. It started with RGB/Full/30Hz when I first plugged it in. Then I switched it to 60Hz. It will only do ycbcr 4.2.2 Limited at 60Hz. I can't choose anything else at 60Hz. Nothing else changed. I have tried Clear Action on/off, film mode on/off game low latency on/off. I have changed chroma upscaling/checked everything in trade quality for performance and so on. Nothing is really getting the gpu spike down. Also, I did find Full UHD Colors under a different section. It's on now.

[toki]

ok, screwing around with it some more shows me that if I run mpc-hc with controls still up, not going into full screen, gpu usage is at about 76%, full screen gives me 97/98%. I swear this can't be right for a 1660ti. Everybody said these would be good because of the extra vram, but this has all given me kind of a headache so far.

[huhn]

edit: it's me doing pan & scan - scale to 16x9

now if someone could help me with the gpu spike. It went from like 61% to 97/98% after upgrading to the 4k tv. is that normal?

then don't do that and it should be fine.

[Asmodian]

It sounds like you need to change your settings, madVR can bring pretty much any card to 98% usage when upscaling 4K. Both the number of input pixels and number of output pixels matter when scaling so doing 2160 -> 2679 is going to be very hard. Downscaling or especially not scaling at all is much faster. If you are watching 4K going from downscaling to upscaling, when switching to full screen, is going require very different settings.

[jkauff]

ok, screwing around with it some more shows me that if I run mpc-hc with controls still up, not going into full screen, gpu usage is at about 76%, full screen gives me 97/98%. I swear this can't be right for a 1660ti.
Are you playing UHD movies? These use the HEVC/H.265 codec to highly compress the video, which puts a huge strain on the CPU if you're using software decoding.

The 1660ti has a dedicated video processing chip for encoding/decoding HEVC. Go into your LAV Video settings and choose hardware decoding. From the dropdown list, choose "NVENC". Once you do that, your CPU usage should drop way down.

As far as GPU usage goes, you shouldn't need to do any scaling for 4K UHD movies. With no scaling to do, madVR will not tax your GPU to the degree you're seeing. If you're upscaling 1080p movies with NGU, make sure you're ONLY doubling (not quadrupling then downscaling) and play around with the strength settings. Your GPU should do at least NGU High for luma upscaling with no problem.

[toki]

well, taking scale to 16x9 drops down gpu from 98% to 76%, but the video still stutters and I really want to be able to watch these movies in full screen.

Also, the CPU barely has any load on it, it's all on the gpu side.

[jkauff]

Then I think you must be doing unnecessary scaling, either up or down or both. My GTX 1080 doubles 1080p to 4K fullscreen with much lower usage than you're getting--50% on average. I don't have any UHD movies, so I can't give you a comparison there.

[toki]

I just tested with dsplayer and it has dropped gpu usage massively. I'm only getting 40% tops using it instead of mpc-hc

Edit: I also wanted to add that I haven't completely set up dsplayer again. I just tried to run it with fresh install and it dropped cpu usage by almost half. Will still have to see as I continue to set it up proper.

Edit Edit: it's definitely madVR. As soon as I switched to madvr profile it went right back to 97%

[Warner306]

Post the settings you are using, either in screenshots or in a list. It's either the driver for the 1660 Ti or something you have checked in the control panel.

Are you at least outputting to the correct resolution?

[toki]

it's the beta build of madvr doing it. I went from last public build, giving me 59% to last beta build giving me 97/98% I'm just going to start fresh with madVR. Since it's a new tv, just going to try and setup everything fresh and take it step by step.

[ryrynz]

That'll likely be the new tone-mapping settings which you don't require.

[toki]

now I have a problem of video stuttering when trying to pass through metadata with passthrough.

[Charky]

it's the beta build of madvr doing it. I went from last public build, giving me 59% to last beta build giving me 97/98% I'm just going to start fresh with madVR. Since it's a new tv, just going to try and setup everything fresh and take it step by step.
Well if everything's fine with it just use the last public build...

[Damien147]

Do I still get calibrated picture with hdr to sdr 3dlut or it's just for tone mapping?

[huhn]

if you use an HDR-SDR 3D LUT it is only used for HDR nothing else is corrected and it replaces madVR tonemapping.

[tp4tissue]

Do I still get calibrated picture with hdr to sdr 3dlut or it's just for tone mapping?

This is not what you want.

Set your tv its widest gamut SDR mode.

Use that with madvr's dynamic tonemapping.



HDR only specifies the data spec, the actual Dynamic range in both HDR / SDR on the SAME tv is more/less the same.

[Damien147]

A bit confused.I have a BT.709 display and I am like this (https://imgur.com/a/I1Gwzpu).
Is it suggested to create a gamma 2.2 BT.2020 3dlut(removing hdr to sdr 3dlut obviously) and put it in the calibration tab leaving madvr to do the tone mapping or am I doing the same thing?

[Alexkral]

Here's a very interesting conversation about 3DLUTs in madVR.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/1471169-madvr-argyllcms-156.html#post55172290

[toki]

this is being so finicky. I got it to 59%, I tinkered around checking different movies, that's all, just checking different movies, then I stop it for a second and when I go to check it again it's back up to 90%. I didn't even do anything with it.

Edit: I checked task manager and it's bringing up like 4 instances of madvrcontrolpanel. I click all but one and it goes back down in gpu usage.

[tp4tissue]

A bit confused.I have a BT.709 display and I am like this (https://imgur.com/a/I1Gwzpu).
Is it suggested to create a gamma 2.2 BT.2020 3dlut(removing hdr to sdr 3dlut obviously) and put it in the calibration tab leaving madvr to do the tone mapping or am I doing the same thing?


NO,

Put tv in its Widest gamut mode, @ whatever brightness you like, or the highest.

Then, run dispcal 3d lut for SDR, Source DCI-P3, 2.2gamma, relative, 98% black output offset. absolute colorimetric w/ white point scaling

Leave black point correction alone unless using plasma/oled/CRT.


Put that into the dci-p3 slot in madvr calibrations, under the SDR section.

In HDR section, set to use pixel shader for dynamic, And it will just use that lut after tonemapping..


It is recommended you watch hdr tonemapped movies in near pitch black conditions, room around 5-10cd. Because the relative lut makes it very dark.

If you use rec 1886 lut which is absolute tone, it will brighten black detail for a bright room, However it won't look very HDR-y because the contrast seems gone.


I also don't recommend using 100% black output offset, because it's just a little too much crush. I've compared dark images extensively against my CRT, 98% brings out just the right amount of detail, without eating into the contrast.

[tp4tissue]

this is being so finicky. I got it to 59%, I tinkered around checking different movies, that's all, just checking different movies, then I stop it for a second and when I go to check it again it's back up to 90%. I didn't even do anything with it.

Edit: I checked task manager and it's bringing up like 4 instances of madvrcontrolpanel. I click all but one and it goes back down in gpu usage.

It shouldn't change that much unless your gpu was clocking up and down.

What is your entire movie chain detailed hardware spec and software .

[Asmodian]

this is being so finicky. I got it to 59%, I tinkered around checking different movies, that's all, just checking different movies, then I stop it for a second and when I go to check it again it's back up to 90%. I didn't even do anything with it.

Edit: I checked task manager and it's bringing up like 4 instances of madvrcontrolpanel. I click all but one and it goes back down in gpu usage.

You should check madVR's OSD to see what is different when you see lower/higher GPU usage. You do have your "Power management mode" set to adaptive in the Nvidia Control Panel?

Also, "madvrcontrolpanel"? Do you mean "mad* home cinema control"? I only ever see one of those, what is bringing them up?

[huhn]

A bit confused.I have a BT.709 display and I am like this (https://imgur.com/a/I1Gwzpu).
Is it suggested to create a gamma 2.2 BT.2020 3dlut(removing hdr to sdr 3dlut obviously) and put it in the calibration tab leaving madvr to do the tone mapping or am I doing the same thing?

that setup is fine if you don't want to use madVR tonemapping but displaycals and if your device is BT 709.

[tp4tissue]

Here's a very interesting conversation about 3DLUTs in madVR.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/1471169-madvr-argyllcms-156.html#post55172290

HAHAHA, reading it now, FLo FLo (fhoech) unleashed Fury upon incompetant user iSeries

[Damien147]

that setup is fine if you don't want to use madVR tonemapping but displaycals and if your device is BT 709.

The whole point is to have calibrated sdr,hdr + what's needed for hdr to be displayed on bt.709 display.To conclude shall I stay with how I am or gamma 2.2 bt.2020 in calibration tab is better for me?

[toki]

You should check madVR's OSD to see what is different when you see lower/higher GPU usage. You do have your "Power management mode" set to adaptive in the Nvidia Control Panel?

Also, "madvrcontrolpanel"? Do you mean "mad* home cinema control"? I only ever see one of those, what is bringing them up?

It was home cinema control. I'm not sure what was bringing them up. I have madVR preferred in mpc-hc. Another thing that is bothering now is the HDR and calibration. It looks cloudy to me and I really want to calibrate it, but 1: I'm not exactly sure how and 2: I'm worried that it's going to ruin the tone mapping. I would really just like madVR takeover and do it. If anyone could guide me on how to calibrate HDR, that would be great. I've been reading not to mess with brightness/contrast/backlight, but it really needs it.

[huhn]

The whole point is to have calibrated sdr,hdr + what's needed for hdr to be displayed on bt.709 display.To conclude shall I stay with how I am or gamma 2.2 bt.2020 in calibration tab is better for me?

it just depends if you want madVR tone mapping or not.
madVR tonemapping is nearly for sure better but cost a lot of performance.

if you are using madVR tone mapping things get more complicated.
@tp4tissue
can you stop things like this please...

[Alexkral]

It was home cinema control. I'm not sure what was bringing them up. I have madVR preferred in mpc-hc. Another thing that is bothering now is the HDR and calibration. It looks cloudy to me and I really want to calibrate it, but 1: I'm not exactly sure how and 2: I'm worried that it's going to ruin the tone mapping. I would really just like madVR takeover and do it. If anyone could guide me on how to calibrate HDR, that would be great. I've been reading not to mess with brightness/contrast/backlight, but it really needs it.

https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1865828#post1865828

[Damien147]

it just depends if you want madVR tone mapping or not.
madVR tonemapping is nearly for sure better but cost a lot of performance.

if you are using madVR tone mapping things get more complicated.
@tp4tissue
can you stop things like this please...

I don't have a particular preference.Are both solutions giving the same result with difference in tone mapping quality or are there more benefits with madvr tone mapping(and the gamma 2.2 bt.2020 in calibration tab)?
I am looking for what to do to achieve calibrated picture to conclude + what's needed for hdr to be displayed on a bt.709 display.

[toki]

https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1865828#post1865828thnak you very much

[huhn]

I don't have a particular preference.Are both solutions giving the same result with difference in tone mapping quality or are there more benefits with madvr tone mapping(and the gamma 2.2 bt.2020 in calibration tab)?
I am looking for what to do to achieve calibrated picture to conclude + what's needed for hdr to be displayed on a bt.709 display.

both give you a calibrated image but the results will be different there isn't a clear spec for HDR-> SDR conversation.

[Damien147]

Ok,then I am staying with how I am I guess.Thank you and all.

[Alexkral]

Still I think there's a reasonable doubt about possible clipping when the source profile of the 3DLUT is BT.2020. This is from madshi 11-24-2017:

Gamut:

madVR doesn't convert the gamut, unless the 3DLUT (SDR or HDR, doesn't matter) expects a different gamut than the source provides. E.g. if your 3DLUT is BT.2020 and the video is also BT.2020 then madVR doesn't do any gamut processing. However, if your 3DLUT was made for BT.709 videos, but the video is BT.2020, then madVR will convert gamut from BT.2020 to BT.709. Basically madVR makes sure that the 3DLUT receives the pixels in the format it expects.

Pixel shader math is done in ICtCp and when the result is converted to RGB, some colors may fall out of gamut. When madVR converts the gamut, it maps those colors back in gamut, but in this case it could simply clip them, or let the 3DLUT clip them, which would make them look oversaturated.

I guess it maps them back in gamut anyway, but maybe using a source DCI-P3 3DLUT is safer.

[huhn]

very easy to test but i don't see a reason to do gamut mapping twice.

[Alexkral]

Well I think it's not that easy when you don't know the MaxCLL that madVR is using, clipping could be happening for whatever other reason.

[grendelrt]

So I noticed that when I have FSE enabled on Windows 10, I am getting a mismatched composition rate to display rate, 60hz instead of 24hz. Should composition rate even be showing in FSE? If I turn off FSE I get 24hz/24hz. Any inherit disadvantages to leaving FSE off? I do use MadVR for SDR and HDR tonemapping.

[huhn]

the FSE used in win 10 isn't exclusive anymore it should be there but that how FSE now works. FSE avoids bugs like sending 10 bit to the GPU driver when the GPU has to send 8 bit where it will produce banding (powered by nvidia).
there is a way to get a more "FSE" FSE on win 10 but you should be fine with WFS which can easily get a composition rate mismatch too.

Well I think it's not that easy when you don't know the MaxCLL that madVR is using, clipping could be happening for whatever other reason.

HDR-SDR 3D LUT are created for this. this may matter for tone mapping which isn't used here.

[grendelrt]

the FSE used in win 10 isn't exclusive anymore it should be there but that how FSE now works. FSE avoids bugs like sending 10 bit to the GPU driver when the GPU has to send 8 bit where it will produce banding (powered by nvidia).
there is a way to get a more "FSE" FSE on win 10 but you should be fine with WFS which can easily get a composition rate mismatch too.



HDR-SDR 3D LUT are created for this. this may matter for tone mapping which isn't used here.
Thanks for the reply, sorry I may be misunderstanding this part, are you saying it can be an issue when dithering from 10bit source to 8bit output?

[huhn]

the GPU driver doesn't dither in this case it does in FSE.

it's not a good idea to send the GPU 10 bit (madVR 10 bit output) when the GPU send 8 it to the display anyway.

a 10 or 8 bit source have nothing to do with that and shouldn't affect your choice if you send 10 bit to the display or not it's way more complicated this topic but in short you are fine with 8 bit anyway.

[grendelrt]

the GPU driver doesn't dither in this case it does in FSE.

it's not a good idea to send the GPU 10 bit (madVR 10 bit output) when the GPU send 8 it to the display anyway.

a 10 or 8 bit source have nothing to do with that and shouldn't affect your choice if you send 10 bit to the display or not it's way more complicated this topic but in short you are fine with 8 bit anyway.

I am currently sending 8bit to display due to the 12bit bug with JVC projectors, whenever that gets fixed (hopefully) I might go back to 12bit output.

[huhn]

then make sure you are not outputting 10 bit with madVR ever.

[Cowboydude99]

Hi. What am I doing wrong here!? :)

if (srcWidth == 1920) "1080p"
else if (srcWidth == 720) "720p"
else if (fps > 30) and (srcWidth == 2160) "4K60"
else "4K"


It seems that if the screen size is 2160, it always plays the "4K" profile. If I remove the 2160 on line 3, then it works normally...

[huhn]

why don't you take a more well known working solution?
you should either start from the top or the bottom not in the middle of something.

else if (srcWidth == 720) "720p"
that will not trigger on a 720p movie and using "==" means it's only true if it is the same value.

same for 2160 which file has a screen width of 2160? 1920, 1280, 3840 are common.

just take the example from madshi here and change it to your needs.
if (srcWidth <= 1050) and (srcHeight <= 768) and (deintFps < 31) "SD 24fps"
else if (srcWidth <= 1050) and (srcHeight <= 768) "SD 60fps"
else if (deintFps < 31) "HD 24fps"
else

[Asmodian]

if (srcWidth == 1920) "1080p"
else if (srcWidth == 720) "720p"
else if (fps > 30) and (srcWidth == 2160) "4K60"
else "4K"

I suggest:

if (srcHeight <= 720) "720p"
else if (srcHeight <= 1080) "1080p"
else if (fps < 31) and (srcHeight <= 2160) "4K"
else "4K60"

And as huhn mentioned, you should start at the smallest or largest resolution. I prefer starting at the smallest.