madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[QBhd]

Is there a current favorite GPU for using madVR at "maximum" that is also quiet (doesn't have to be silent) and has a reasonable TDP? Priority is excellent 23.976p/24p on a Sony TV that supports 1080p/24p. Thanks.

My AMD R9 270X is super quiet in my enclosure (HAF 932)

https://www.asus.com/ca-en/Graphics_Cards/R9270XDC2T2GD5/

It's more than enough to get madVR going and still be quiet. Just be sure to use the 13.12 drivers though, they are still king!

QB

[MSL_DK]

Just be sure to use the 13.12 drivers though, they are still king!

QB

Why is that? In what way?

[a8213711]

What's the worst upscaling in terms of quality?
I want to use it to compare it with the one I use now (chroma and image up: lanczos 3 taps + AR).
For the moment I used bilinear + bilinear and these are the result with 2 different file:
http://www.mediafire.com/view/uebjbagjb9vnnf2/a%2C 1.png
http://www.mediafire.com/view/1asqfiruye3v7j2/a%2C 2.png
http://www.mediafire.com/view/1z9v92xqg20vtje/b%2C 1.png
http://www.mediafire.com/view/rzwfq7gatuzrdbw/b%2C 2.png
(used Win8's win+stamp because the screenshots in MPC have the resolution of the file instead of the output, don't even know if it's normal)
Maybe I have too much trade-off? Because the difference is barely visible (do you want to guess which one uses lanczos? :D)
Tradeoff I have: http://i.imgur.com/PLb5LCM.jpg
By the way these are the settings that were already checked right after a clean install...I suppose madVR has some pre-built profile for specific hardware, and I didn't changed them.

[nevcairiel]

Nearest Neighbour is the worst quality.

[meetajhu]

any chance to see madvr work with MPC 64bit?

Madshi has already stated before there are no plans for x64 builds currently until the x86 one becomes stable.

[madshi]

When I playing AVSHD 709 disk debug OSD say limited range
Weird. Ok, one more thought: Is it possible that your media player has color or saturation controls set to non-neutral values?

It may not be madVR's fault, but I've definitely had sync issues without the "delay playback" options enabled.
I have not tested it recently, but it seemed to mainly occur when going from windowed to fullscreen where the refresh rate changes.
I have madVR set to only change when entering full-screen, and use smooth motion when running in a window at 60Hz.

I tried disabling the option again back when I got a GTX970 because I really like how much more responsive it is when you're not waiting for 128 frames to queue up, but I ran into sync problems again.
I was never able to figure out if there was a specific delay or if it only happened some of the time with certain formats for example, but any time I don't have the "delay playback" options enabled, I end up running into sync issues that are corrected by re-enabling it.
As far as I see, there's no technical reason why you should have sync problems without delay, but no sync problems with delay. Actually the delay option is quite "hacky". So if there's a problem, I would have thought it more likely that the delay problem causes a problem. Anyway, after a couple of seconds there should be no difference between delay on/off, so I'm really confused as to where those problems could be coming from. You have the same problems regardless of rendering mode (FSE vs. windowed vs. overlay, "new" presentation path vs. "old")? I think the issue is worth looking into, at least if you can reliably reproduce it.

Submitted a crash dump not long ago via MadVR, 0.87.14 is crashing in MPC-BE when subtitles are set to XYSubfilter upon playback of a file with subtitles, 0.87.13 doesn't crash.
Yeah, will try to fix that for the next build.

Hi, I 'd linke to know if this madVR can fix my issue.
Monitor. 60Hz (unpossible to change this value!).
In both interlaced and progressive files I am unable to read the credits at the end, crawl.
These credits are increditbly :eek: fast. Some displays show such credits better than others. You'll get the best results with a display which is able to interpolate intermediate frames. But then I wonder if those algorithms are able to handle such quickly moving credits. Don't really know. Your best bet is to make sure you're playing the movies at the correct refresh rate. If you do that, you can only hope that your display handles them well. If all else fails, you could try playing with SVP. That might help with these credits. But I wouldn't put too much weight on the credits alone. I wouldn't really activate motion interpolation just for those. If you like the look of motion interpolation / SVP, then it's quite alright to use it, of course.

Edit: After making the chart I again thought it would make more sense to use chroma upscaling instead of image upscaling to scale up the chroma when only doubling luma. It is, at least, easier to explain.

Ideally I could set a second chroma scaling option in image doubling, including NNEDI3, similar to the chroma scaling settings page. :D
Well, the "chroma upscaling" section is only for getting from 4:2:0 or 4:2:2 sources to 4:4:4. Once we're at 4:4:4, everything else is considered "image" instead of "chroma". I understand that it's slightly confusing that when using doubling, I'm using the "image upscaling" algorithm for upscaling chroma. But that's just because NNEDI3 is so damn slow than it doesn't make sense to use it on the chroma channels. So the whole concept of going from RGB to YCbCr and scaling Y separately from CbCr is just due to NNEDI3's slow speed. I still consider the whole operation to be "image upscaling", even if madVR applies different algorithms to Y and CbCr in that situation. But I do understand the potential for confusion.

Of course I could add even more settings to allow the user to choose just another algorithm for CbCr upscaling when using NNEDI3 for Y. But really, there are already more than enough options there. Adding even more might make it more logical, but also more complex.

Well, news on the OpenCL front for Nvidia, 349.72 is coming, primarily for Windows 10 with the new WDDM 2.0 driver model support, DirectX 12 and, surpisingly, OpenCL 1.2.
Oh, that would be cool!

Madshi could you edit the change log as well?
I don't find any "Strg" in changelog.txt?

I have a problem that I can't see or track my mouse movements in FSE mode.
There is no typical mouse "arrow" visible any more as soon as FSE is enabled.
When moving my mouse blindly, I see the typical MadVR FSE time-bar, and clicking starts seeking.
So this part seems to work, but I can't choose to what time I seek because the mouse is completely invisible.
Strange, nobody else seems to have this problem. Could you try different media players, or maybe a different MPC-HC build to check if that might make a difference?

Is there a current favorite GPU for using madVR at "maximum" that is also quiet (doesn't have to be silent) and has a reasonable TDP? Priority is excellent 23.976p/24p on a Sony TV that supports 1080p/24p. Thanks.
No GPU today can run NNEDI3 at 256 neurons for 1080p -> 4K upscaling. It will probably a while before that's possible. But it's probably also not necessary. The increase in image quality when doubling neuron count is there, but not very high. And the cost doubles every time.

So what am I saying? The key thing is that you need to make up your mind what you understand as "maximum" settings. (Note: I don't really want an answer to the following questions). Which scaling algorithms do you want to use? When using NNEDI3, how many neurons do you want to use? And do you only watch 24fps movies? Or also 60i/p content? Which resolution does your display have? And which resolution your movies? Only with all that information we could maybe provide you with good advice. But even then, I personally wouldn't really know which GPU to recommend. There are pros and cons for most of today's GPUs. E.g. the 750 (Ti) is a nice GPU, but has no HEVC decoders and not as fast as the 960. The 960 is nice, and has HEVC decoders, but is not as fast as the 970/980. The 970/980 are quite fast, but they don't support HEVC hardware decoding. AMD also has nice GPUs which have their own list of pros and cons. So which should I recommend? I've no idea.

There will be a 64 bit version of madvr?

With HEVC decoding, 64 bit is really important...
any chance to see madvr work with MPC 64bit?
madshi has said one day there may be a 64-bit madVR but not soon.
Madshi has already stated before there are no plans for x64 builds currently until the x86 one becomes stable.
Well, I said that at a time when there was no big benefit using x64. Recently priority has changed a bit because the x64 HEVC decoder is clearly faster than the x86 decoder. So what does that mean? I don't know, but x64 support has at least moved up a bit in my priority list.

[MS-DOS]

x64 support has at least moved up a bit in my priority list.

Wish I could add a few more bits there =) Currently, the lack of 64 bit madVR is the only reason why I'm still using the 32 bit versions of MPC, LAV and some other stuff.

[Asmodian]

Well, the "chroma upscaling" section is only for getting from 4:2:0 or 4:2:2 sources to 4:4:4. Once we're at 4:4:4, everything else is considered "image" instead of "chroma". I understand that it's slightly confusing that when using doubling, I'm using the "image upscaling" algorithm for upscaling chroma. But that's just because NNEDI3 is so damn slow than it doesn't make sense to use it on the chroma channels. So the whole concept of going from RGB to YCbCr and scaling Y separately from CbCr is just due to NNEDI3's slow speed. I still consider the whole operation to be "image upscaling", even if madVR applies different algorithms to Y and CbCr in that situation. But I do understand the potential for confusion.

After a better understanding of what is going on I am more comfortable with the way it is now.

It does take a little explaining but it makes sense to keep all the algorithms the same after passing the first conversion to RGB. They would have to be the same if not using image doubling. If you listened to me I would probably come back and ask for a way to use the alternative chroma scaling even when not using image doubling. :rolleyes:

Well, I said that at a time when there was no big benefit using x64. Recently priority has changed a bit because the x64 HEVC decoder is clearly faster than the x86 decoder. So what does that mean? I don't know, but x64 support has at least moved up a bit in my priority list.

:thanks: for the response. :D

[bytheway]

No GPU today can run NNEDI3 at 256 neurons for 1080p -> 4K upscaling. It will probably a while before that's possible. But it's probably also not necessary. The increase in image quality when doubling neuron count is there, but not very high. And the cost doubles every time.



So what am I saying? The key thing is that you need to make up your mind what you understand as "maximum" settings. (Note: I don't really want an answer to the following questions). Which scaling algorithms do you want to use? When using NNEDI3, how many neurons do you want to use? And do you only watch 24fps movies? Or also 60i/p content? Which resolution does your display have? And which resolution your movies? Only with all that information we could maybe provide you with good advice. But even then, I personally wouldn't really know which GPU to recommend. There are pros and cons for most of today's GPUs. E.g. the 750 (Ti) is a nice GPU, but has no HEVC decoders and not as fast as the 960. The 960 is nice, and has HEVC decoders, but is not as fast as the 970/980. The 970/980 are quite fast, but they don't support HEVC hardware decoding. AMD also has nice GPUs which have their own list of pros and cons. So which should I recommend? I've no idea.


Thanks, to clarify, I'm mostly interested in Blu Ray image quality (most are 1080p24) on a 1080p TV (no 4k) and second priority would be Australian TV which is 576i50, 720p25 and 1080i50. For Blu Ray I would like to be able to match the latest Oppo Blu Ray player. Any recommendations for a GPU and CPU for this? If it has low TDP that's a bonus. Thanks again.

[bytheway]

My AMD R9 270X is super quiet in my enclosure (HAF 932)



https://www.asus.com/ca-en/Graphics_Cards/R9270XDC2T2GD5/



It's more than enough to get madVR going and still be quiet. Just be sure to use the 13.12 drivers though, they are still king!



QB


Are these level cards along with the GTX 960/970 overkill if not gaming or are they precisely the way to get the best video quality with madVR? Does madVR get used for gaming? (I don't play games)

[ryrynz]

I don't find any "Strg" in changelog.txt?


Ah, didn't check the actual changelog, assumed it was the same as the original 0.62 post which wasn't updated and still references Strg. Also the changelog on videohelp still references strg for 0.62 and 0.63, I'll get them to change it.

[huhn]

Are these level cards along with the GTX 960/970 overkill if not gaming or are they precisely the way to get the best video quality with madVR? Does madVR get used for gaming? (I don't play games)

this has nothing to do with gaming.

some scaler in madVR can be so demanding that even a GTX 980 can't handle them.

it is simply up to what you want to use and what YOU think looks best to your eyes using your TV. a r7 250 can already be the best choice for you.

[MistahBonzai]

Just something to think about here..we're at a turning point where 4K starts to go mainstream in video cards. If considering tying the video card/PC into a '4k HT setup' sooner or later don't overlook 4K compatibility issues. Current cards support HDMI 1.4 which will do 3820x2160/60 but at up to 4:2:0. HDMI 2.0 has the BW to support that at 4:4:4 10-bit.

The first cards with native HDMI 2.0 appear to be in the AMD R 300 series - due to ship within a few months - with Nvidia to follow latter on. The other 'features' to look for are hdcp 2.2 and native HEVC H.265. Of course this is all predicated using a model of the very latest generation of 4K TV panels.

As it stands today deciding later on that this would be doable by getting the appropriate 'adapter' will not be easy (if possible).

[MistahBonzai]

Wish I could add a few more bits there =) Currently, the lack of 64 bit madVR is the only reason why I'm still using the 32 bit versions of MPC, LAV and some other stuff.

I've been farting around with the 10bit h265 Astra.SES.Demo.HEVC.mp4 file. The 64-bit MPC-HC/LAV version plays it fine while it's a slide show with the latest 32-bit version. The difference on my i7-3770 3.4 GHz is like 50% CPU w/64-bit and 100%/slide show (dropping better than half the frames) with 32-bit (both using EVR(CP).

[ryrynz]

x64 support has at least moved up a bit in my priority list.

I would hope it's near the top, for many users it most certainly is of the highest priority. It's usually good to plan forward a bit.

[leonccyiu]

Just something to think about here..we're at a turning point where 4K starts to go mainstream in video cards. If considering tying the video card/PC into a '4k HT setup' sooner or later don't overlook 4K compatibility issues. Current cards support HDMI 1.4 which will do 3820x2160/60 but at up to 4:2:0. HDMI 2.0 has the BW to support that at 4:4:4 10-bit.

The first cards with native HDMI 2.0 appear to be in the AMD R 300 series - due to ship within a few months - with Nvidia to follow latter on. The other 'features' to look for are hdcp 2.2 and native HEVC H.265. Of course this is all predicated using a model of the very latest generation of 4K TV panels.

As it stands today deciding later on that this would be doable by getting the appropriate 'adapter' will not be easy (if possible).

Are you sure HDMI 2 has the Bandwidth to support 4:4:4 10-bit? I thought the maximum was 4:2:2 10/12bit or 4:4:4 8-bit.

Do the Nvidia GTX 9 series not have native HDMI 2 support?
I look forward to seeing if the AMD R 300 series also include VP9 decode support, if they move to a 20nm process and if they perform much better than the existing cards as there are more stream processors.

I'd be grateful if Nvidia GTX 960/970/980 users could post some of their nnedi3 benchmarks. bcec has already done so with his 960 on avsforum, he had a render time of 35ms with nnedi3@32 with lanczos3ar so 30p content is only possible with 16 neurons.

It was reported earlier that AMD cards perform better than their nvidia equivalents for nnedi3 die to their stronger compute and opencl performance, it seems while nvidia have closed the gap, AMD still have the lead.

[makz]

Weird. Ok, one more thought: Is it possible that your media player has color or saturation controls set to non-neutral values?
In MPC-HC and MadVR neutral values.

[ryrynz]

I'd be grateful if Nvidia GTX 960/970/980 users could post some of their nnedi3 benchmarks. bcec has already done so with his 960 on avsforum, he had a render time of 35ms with nnedi3@32 with lanczos3ar so 30p content is only possible with 16 neurons.


The post leonccyiu refers to is here (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/26-home-theater-computers/1477339-so-you-ve-built-your-htpc-now-what-next-how-get-ultimate-picture-sound-quality-your-htpc-madvr-svp-xbmc-mediabrowser-jriver-30.html#post31842353) and is a 1080P to 2160P upscale @ 24FPS. More results here. (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/26-home-theater-computers/1477339-so-you-ve-built-your-htpc-now-what-next-how-get-ultimate-picture-sound-quality-your-htpc-madvr-svp-xbmc-mediabrowser-jriver-30.html#post31949593)

[a8213711]

Is there a way to enlarge the font of the output of ctrl+j?

[Stereodude]

I'd be grateful if Nvidia GTX 960/970/980 users could post some of their nnedi3 benchmarks. bcec has already done so with his 960 on avsforum, he had a render time of 35ms with nnedi3@32 with lanczos3ar so 30p content is only possible with 16 neurons.

It was reported earlier that AMD cards perform better than their nvidia equivalents for nnedi3 die to their stronger compute and opencl performance, it seems while nvidia have closed the gap, AMD still have the lead.
I'd say AMD is still way out front. Assuming bcec's numbers aren't messed up a GTX 960 is only marginally more capable at NNEDI3 than a R7 260x. 28ms vs. 31.1ms (Renethx) for the same settings scaling 1080p to UHD.

The GTX 960 is way more expensive than the 260x and has a higher TDP.

[tobindac]

I can't see any differences between the images in this page (beyond the first image being on another renderer): http://wiki.mikejung.biz/MadVR_Chroma_Upscaling_720p_Image_Quality

Can someone guide me on what I should be looking for exactly?

[MistahBonzai]

Are you sure HDMI 2 has the Bandwidth to support 4:4:4 10-bit? I thought the maximum was 4:2:2 10/12bit or 4:4:4 8-bit.
I stand corrected. 2160p 4:4:4 10 bit is a nogo. 4:4:4 8 bit is limited to 50 HRz. More info at the HDMI site (http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_2_0/hdmi_2_0_faq.aspx#146).
Do the Nvidia GTX 9 series not have native HDMI 2 support? According to what I can find, no they don't. The AMD 300 series should be the first. Folks in the gaming community are using HDMI 1.4 at 60HRz with 4:2:0.
I look forward to seeing if the AMD R 300 series also include VP9 decode support, if they move to a 20nm process and if they perform much better than the existing cards as there are more stream processors. From what I can gather in the AMD R9 300 series rumors (http://videocardz.com/amd/radeon-rx-300/radeon-r9-390x) is that not all models will be based on 20nm. Some may be rehashed versions of older architecture.

I'd be grateful if Nvidia GTX 960/970/980 users could post some of their nnedi3 benchmarks. bcec has already done so with his 960 on avsforum, he had a render time of 35ms with nnedi3@32 with lanczos3ar so 30p content is only possible with 16 neurons.

It was reported earlier that AMD cards perform better than their nvidia equivalents for nnedi3 die to their stronger compute and opencl performance, it seems while nvidia have closed the gap, AMD still have the lead. Having only a HD 7850 I bake in nnedi3 and SVP on my CPU with AVISynth and leave the 7850 for madVR to apply the icing.

[nevcairiel]

NVIDIA GTX 980, 970 and 960 have full HDMI 2.0 support.
The 960 is also the first GPU with a full HEVC/H265 hardware decoder, both 8 and 10 bit.

[Warner306]

Just out of curiosity, could someone provide me with the specs and/or graphics card models that can do the following:

Input Resolutions: 720p, 1080p
Output Resolution: 3840 x 2160 (4K)

Desired Settings:

Chroma: Jinc3 + AR
Image: Jinc3 + AR
Luma Doubling: NNEDI364 at 2x scaling factor or greater
Artifact Removal - Debanding: Low/Medium
Dithering: Error Diffusion 1

Smooth Motion is disabled.

What card(s) are capable of these settings (if any)?

[bytheway]

In the mobile sector, which new GPUs should I be on the lookout for? I can get a laptop but not a desktop for work and was thinking of using the laptop for video, price is irrelevant, so which laptops with which cards that are coming out this year would be top of your list?

[Asmodian]

Not Optimus, something about Optimus does not work well with madVR. Personally I would simply get the best Intel iGPU I could. An HD 5100 or if you can wait a bit an HD 6100, for example. Or, as a much faster option, a non-Optimus system with a 980M but it might be hard to pass that off as a work laptop.

[StinDaWg]

Well, news on the OpenCL front for Nvidia, 349.72 is coming, primarily for Windows 10 with the new WDDM 2.0 driver model support, DirectX 12 and, surpisingly, OpenCL 1.2.

http://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1247418-wddm-20-nv-driver-released-via-wu/

OpenCL 1.2

Added OpenCl 1.2


From the wikipedia page of OpenCL 1.2:
DirectX functionality: DX9 media surface sharing allows for efficient sharing between OpenCL and DX9 or DXVA media surfaces. Equally, for DX11, seamless sharing between OpenCL and DX11 surfaces is enabled.

I can confirm via GPU Caps Viewer on Windows 10 with this driver that the driver supports OpenCL 1.2.

Does this mean the use OpenCL to process DXVA NV12 (Intel, AMD) option is now supported for Nvidia too? Or are we still waiting on something else on the Nvidia side?
Does this mean that Nvidia NNEDI3 performance is about to get better for Windows 10 users?

[bytheway]

Not Optimus, something about Optimus does not work well with madVR. Personally I would simply get the best Intel iGPU I could. An HD 5100 or if you can wait a bit an HD 6100, for example. Or, as a much faster option, a non-Optimus system with a 980M but it might be hard to pass that off as a work laptop.


Great advice, thanks. How can you tell if Optimus is utilised? Can it be disabled?

If you want iGPU, what about AMD APU Carrizo that is coming out this year? Apparently it does h.265 4k quite well based on a demo unit. Do AMD APUs play well with madVR?

[Razoola]

I have a GTX970 gaming by MSI and it does 4k at 4:4:4 60hz just fine.

[michkrol]

I can't see any differences between the images in this page (beyond the first image being on another renderer): http://wiki.mikejung.biz/MadVR_Chroma_Upscaling_720p_Image_Quality

Can someone guide me on what I should be looking for exactly?
The page you linked shows different chroma scaling algorithms, so the difference is hard to spot. Easiest to spot difference with red details on black or blue background or similar. If you don't know what chroma upscaling is, read here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chroma_subsampling for a really basic explanation (there are dozens of sites with better explanations).

Actually you should look for a different comparison. There's a long list of things wrong with this one, below some of them.
Images are saved as JPEG, which means due to lossy compression you get (slightly) different image than originally displayed.
The page comparing image scaling algorithms has unscaled (or scaled at close to 100%) images attached, so you can't really see any difference.
Images for comparison should be taken from exactly the same frame (time-wise) of the movie, otherwise they are pretty useless. Some objects can be more or less detailed after scaling, because they are more or less detailed in the source, because (in different frame) the camera changes focus, lighting changes, object begins to move, etc.

It's also always best to check the different setting for yourself - you might not spot any difference depending on your display, resolution, distance from the screen, room lighting, etc.
Great advice, thanks. How can you tell if Optimus is utilised? Can it be disabled?
Optimus is used in almost all newer notebooks with Intel's CPUs and Nvidia's GPUs. For some strange reason, it usually cannot be properly disabled for media playback, hence it's not recommended.
I suggest you read this thread 170937 to see a list of potential problems.

EDIT:
I have a GTX970 gaming by MSI and it does 4k at 4:4:4 60hz just fine.
For completeness sake, could you share more details, like your display model, operating system and driver's version?

[Razoola]

For completeness sake, could you share more details, like your display model, operating system and driver's version?

Nothing much to report really, Win7 x64, GTX 970 as already stated. Using the latest driver 347.52, Samsung 8200 4k TV and a 5m HDMI cable.

Can do both 4k resolutions at 4:4:4 no problem. I never had an issue with it apart from an early incompatibility issue in the first couple of drivers that supported the 900 series.

Raz

[MistahBonzai]

NVIDIA GTX 980, 970 and 960 have full HDMI 2.0 support.
The 960 is also the first GPU with a full HEVC/H265 hardware decoder, both 8 and 10 bit. Thanks for the clarification..and you, if anyone, should know this for a fact (based on your latest LAV release). I had ASSuMEd, based on the article that promoted AMD as being the 1st to release formal HDMI 2.0 support on the upcoming R9 3xx, that NVIDIA was still offering HDMI 1.4 with the 4:2:0 driver hack to achieve '4K' @60fps. The issue is that vendors (video adapter, TV and the like) fail to clearly state how they support '4K' and on which ports. 30/60fps? 4:4:4/4:2:0? HDCP 2.2? 8/10/12 (ports and panels)? As it stands now the consumer could inadvertently make some very costly compatibility mistakes - even after verifying that everything is '4K' compatible.

[Asmodian]

Great advice, thanks. How can you tell if Optimus is utilised? Can it be disabled?

It cannot be disabled and they tend to advertise they are Optimus, anything with both iGPU and dGPU is a bad ides for madVR.

Do AMD APUs play well with madVR?

I assume they are fine, it is only the dGPU + iGPU laptops that have issues (the ones with AMD dGPUs have issues too) but I haven't heard any reports one way or the other for AMD's APUs.

Thanks for the clarification..and you, if anyone, should know this for a fact (based on your latest LAV release). I had ASSuMEd, based on the article that promoted AMD as being the 1st to release formal HDMI 2.0 support on the upcoming R9 3xx, that NVIDIA was still offering HDMI 1.4 with the 4:2:0 driver hack to achieve '4K' @60fps. The issue is that vendors (video adapter, TV and the like) fail to clearly state how they support '4K' and on which ports. 30/60fps? 4:4:4/4:2:0? HDCP 2.2? 8/10/12 (ports and panels)? As it stands now the consumer could inadvertently make some very costly compatibility mistakes - even after verifying that everything is '4K' compatible.

It is easy to test, after the purchase, using the chroma test image (http://madshi.net/madVR/ChromaRes.png).

The GTX 980, etc. list HDMI 2.0 on their specs page (http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-980/specifications).

[StinDaWg]

Can someone refresh my memory on why force film mode deinterlacing doesn't work with dxva2 decoding? My cpu isn't the greatest, and it struggles with high bitrate files as well as H.265 or 4K. If I use dxva2 I can play these but I can't use force film mode. If I go the opposite way I can play 1080i29 correctly at 23hz, but I can't have both. This is going to get increasingly frustrating as more and more 4K and H.265 content is available.

Is this just the way it's always going to be?

[Qaq]

@Stin
IVTC by madVR is incompatible (yet?) with DXVA native. If your CPU is SSE4 capable you can try DXVA copy back *direct* mode with last LAV Video version.

[StinDaWg]

Will IVTC work with nvidia cuvid decoding? I currently have an AMD card, but might get a GTX 960 soon.

Edit: I tried dxva copyback and IVTC does work. Cool. :sly:

[Qaq]

Sure. Anything but DXVA native.

[StinDaWg]

Sure. Anything but DXVA native.
Does anyone know if Nvidia's GTX 960 H.265 decoder works with dxva copyback and cuvid? I saw a review where they were using it with dxva2, but haven't seen if it's compatible with the other modes. If it can work with either while also doing IVTC with madVR, that's all I need to be future-proofed.

[Qaq]

Does anyone know if Nvidia's GTX 960 H.265 decoder works with dxva copyback and cuvid?I guess those guys should know best: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=171219

[Asmodian]

Does anyone know if Nvidia's GTX 960 H.265 decoder works with dxva copyback and cuvid? I saw a review where they were using it with dxva2, but haven't seen if it's compatible with the other modes. If it can work with either while also doing IVTC with madVR, that's all I need to be future-proofed.

I assume the GTX 960's HVEC decoder works with DXVA copyback and CUVID. Why wouldn't it?

This makes me think it might be limited to 8-bit output though.
The NVIDIA GTX 960 is the only card which supports 10-bit decoding so far.
The DXVA2 Processor Devices support P010 input on NVIDIA mostly, but not output, so you can deinterlace it .. but only to NV12.

[TheDarkTemplar]

madVR has been showing an error saying it encountered a problem every fifth time or so that I first open and quickly full-screen a video. While the video is usually still playing fine when this pop-up shows up, I usually click "close the application" and relaunch the video just to make sure everything is okay. I attached a crash log from the last time it happened.

[Stereodude]

madshi, how about providing a boolean variable for smoothmotion that can be used in the profile rules?

[RamGuy]

I'm getting the Intel NUC 5i5RYK with Intel Core i5-5250U "Broadwell" + Intel HD 6000 which I will combine with 1866MHz @ CL10 RAM (sadly no one is able to get it to boot with 2133MHz so 1866MHz seems to be the limit. Sad as these Intel iGPU seems to scale quite a lot with higher memory frequencies).

I'm having a hard time deciding whether to go with a embedded solution like OpenELEC, a linux route with Kodibuntu or going "all out" and run Windows 8.1 + Windows Media Centre with Mediabrowser Classic.

Going the Mediabrowser route will provide a more flexible approach in terms for image quality. Then I could push into LAV with MadVR but how capable do you expect the Intel HD 6000 to be in terms of MadVR scaling and algorithms? The playback will mostly consist of pure BluRay rips packed into MKV's. So mostly VC-1 and h264 20-35 mbps video + DTS:HD Master Audio / Dolby True HD audio at 23.796 FPS.

[baii]

Which TV you have/ plan to have?

Sent from my 306SH

[RamGuy]

It will be used towards my Pioneer LX 5090H through my Yamaha RX-V3900 AV-reciever.

[mandarinka]

I'm getting the Intel NUC 5i5RYK with Intel Core i5-5250U "Broadwell" + Intel HD 6000 which I will combine with 1866MHz @ CL10 RAM (sadly no one is able to get it to boot with 2133MHz so 1866MHz seems to be the limit. Sad as these Intel iGPU seems to scale quite a lot with higher memory frequencies).

I'm having a hard time deciding whether to go with a embedded solution like OpenELEC, a linux route with Kodibuntu or going "all out" and run Windows 8.1 + Windows Media Centre with Mediabrowser Classic.

Going the Mediabrowser route will provide a more flexible approach in terms for image quality. Then I could push into LAV with MadVR but how capable do you expect the Intel HD 6000 to be in terms of MadVR scaling and algorithms? The playback will mostly consist of pure BluRay rips packed into MKV's. So mostly VC-1 and h264 20-35 mbps video + DTS:HD Master Audio / Dolby True HD audio at 23.796 FPS.

If you are not in a hurry, there is going to be a NUC with i7-5557U and Iris 6100. The memory subsystem is same but it should have more GPU power because it is a 28W chip.
http://www.fanlesstech.com/2015/02/exclusive-i7-broadwell-nuc-to-feature.html

[Warner306]

I'm getting the Intel NUC 5i5RYK with Intel Core i5-5250U "Broadwell" + Intel HD 6000 which I will combine with 1866MHz @ CL10 RAM (sadly no one is able to get it to boot with 2133MHz so 1866MHz seems to be the limit. Sad as these Intel iGPU seems to scale quite a lot with higher memory frequencies).

I'm having a hard time deciding whether to go with a embedded solution like OpenELEC, a linux route with Kodibuntu or going "all out" and run Windows 8.1 + Windows Media Centre with Mediabrowser Classic.

Going the Mediabrowser route will provide a more flexible approach in terms for image quality. Then I could push into LAV with MadVR but how capable do you expect the Intel HD 6000 to be in terms of MadVR scaling and algorithms? The playback will mostly consist of pure BluRay rips packed into MKV's. So mostly VC-1 and h264 20-35 mbps video + DTS:HD Master Audio / Dolby True HD audio at 23.796 FPS.

If you desire image quality and madVR, then I would recommend Kodi + MPC over Media Browser. madVR performance in Media Browser Theater is poor. While both Media Browser Classic and Kodi can make use of madVR via external players. Either frontend is a great solution, but I prefer Kodi.

As extra incentive, I wrote a how-to-guide on how to do this painlessly in Kodi: HOW TO - Launch MPC-HC/MPC-BE with madVR as an External Player (http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=209596).

I find this combination easy to live with if you have a good remote.

[RamGuy]

If you desire image quality and madVR, then I would recommend Kodi + MPC over Media Browser. madVR performance in Media Browser Theater is poor. While both Media Browser Classic and Kodi can make use of madVR via external players. Either frontend is a great solution, but I prefer Kodi.

As extra incentive, I wrote a how-to-guide on how to do this painlessly in Kodi: HOW TO - Launch MPC-HC/MPC-BE with madVR as an External Player (http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=209596).

I find this combination easy to live with if you have a good remote.

If I'm going for Mediabrowser it will be WMC + Mediabrowser Classic.. Mediabrowser Theater does not seem like a good idea, I would much rather have MPC-HC as external player.

Though I'm not entirely sure how that would work out towards my Plex server.

[RamGuy]

If you are not in a hurry, there is going to be a NUC with i7-5557U and Iris 6100. The memory subsystem is same but it should have more GPU power because it is a 28W chip.
http://www.fanlesstech.com/2015/02/exclusive-i7-broadwell-nuc-to-feature.html


This seems more like a "rumour" of sorts? When do you think this would be available? Considering I live in Norway and all NUC's seems to arrive a bit late compared to the global market I guess we are talking months? How much of a difference would it be between the Intel HD 6000 and Intel HD 6100? I guess the HD 6100 is still considered "Iris" like the HD 5100 compared to the HD 5000 so we are talking about a noticeable difference? And what about the price? I find the 5i5RYK to be quite steep for the hardware you actually get as it is.

Will this have much to say in terms of MadVR? Even my desktop with a GTX Titan is getting pushed to it's limits with NNEDI3 16 neurons and with double, and quadruple luma and chroma resolution with NNEDI3 16 neurons.


But how far would Intel HD Graphics with Intel QuickSync be able to go in the first place? Would the HD 6100 make much of a difference compared to the HD 6000 or would they both be too weak regardless so I have to settle for lower settings anyway? If the difference do not result in being able to push further on the scaling algorithms there isn't much point in going HD 6100 over HD 6000 if you ask me.



I will test out the Intel NUC 5i5RYK to measure it's capabilities. I do fancy it's small footprint, and silent operation and the built-in infrared is just perfect for a HTPC.

But it's far from cheap considering the ULV dual-core CPU, and the Intel HD 6000 graphics so I have also considered building a Mini-ITX computer and try to make it as silent as possible and toss something like a GTX 960 in there in order to make it capable to utilise more advanced MadVR scaling algorithms as well as supporting the "smooth motion frame rate conversion" which I have hared is quite demanding?

What is the current recommended graphics card for MadVR? Is there a noticeable difference between using Intel QuickSync, NVIDIA CUDA etc..? AMD is still forced to relay on DXVA-only?


Which brings me to another question. How much of an effect is this "Smooth Motion Frame Rate Conversion" supposed to have? I have read that it should give you this "HFR" aka "Soap-opera effect" just like SVP (Smooth Video Project) and like you see with Motion Flow and whatever it's called on modern televisions but enabling this option does not seem to do much on my desktop? It's not remotely close to the effect of SVP which do resemble "Motion Flow" and "HFR" but is crazy demanding on both CPU and GPU so I can't do anything else other than dedicate my entire system towards the video in order for SVP to not have slow downs, even with my Intel Core i7-3960X and GTX Titan...

[Asmodian]

Will this have much to say in terms of MadVR? Even my desktop with a GTX Titan is getting pushed to it's limits with NNEDI3 16 neurons and with double, and quadruple luma and chroma resolution with NNEDI3 16 neurons.

You are not going to be able to use NNEDI3 with an iGPU, not yet. As an aside why are you doubling chroma? Using my Titan, I prefer 128 neuron luma doubling over 16 neuron luma + chroma doubling + quadrupling.

What is the current recommended graphics card for MadVR? Is there a noticeable difference between using Intel QuickSync, NVIDIA CUDA etc..? AMD is still forced to relay on DXVA-only?

All vendors seem to do better with DXVA2 vs anything else (it uses the same hardware as QuickSync/CUDA but is more robust).

Which brings me to another question. How much of an effect is this "Smooth Motion Frame Rate Conversion" supposed to have? I have read that it should give you this "HFR" aka "Soap-opera effect" just like SVP (Smooth Video Project) and like you see with Motion Flow and whatever it's called on modern televisions but enabling this option does not seem to do much on my desktop?

That is not what smooth motion does. It does exact frame blending to perfectly display one frame rate on a display with a different refresh rate. This avoid the artifacts associated with SVP and the judder associated with mismatched frame rates, e.g. 24p @ 60 Hz.

It is more demanding if using an ED dithering technique because dithering is performed on more frames (assuming the display refresh rate is above the source frame rate).

I can use bicubic scaling with smooth motion to 60 Hz and ordered dithering on an HD 3000.

Maybe my MadVR Options Explained (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1709584#post1709584) would help?