madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[madshi]

So it's not madVR specific, right? Then it's OT (out of topic) in this thread.

madVR currently does not report which GPU it uses.

[Dogway]

So it's not madVR specific, right? Then it's OT (out of topic) in this thread.

madVR currently does not report which GPU it uses.

Yes, sir "offtopic". Bad day huh? :)
Take it easy

[Braum]

You can try v0.88.19. But if you get good playback with "present a frame for every VSync", then by all means use it!

This whole problem seems to be related to DXVA scaling. You could also try using a madVR scaler instead of DXVA.


I use it but I thought it was a madvr bug so I wanted to report it ^^

Thank you for your answer !

I keep using DXVA/DXVA because after some testing I found it to be the most natural processing (in my case ofc).

Source : Bluray 1920x1080

Monitor : 1680x1050

Zoom : 400 %

Same frame each time ofc

Chroma upscaling/Image downscaling

http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/911925704.png

http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/512542742.png

http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/808068681.png

http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/750738963.png

[Siso]

Still the Overlay mode combined with dxva2 native with dxva chroma, luma and downscalling, gives me weird sized window, in fullscreen is ok, but the player crashes after I press the stop button - mpc-be latest beta 501...No problems in 0.88.17

[James Freeman]

madVR v0.88.19 released

Some more bugfixes.

Thank you.
When 1.0 rolls out, I'll be first to buy!

[nevcairiel]

* when running in a debugger, keyboard hook is not set, anymore
Some more bugfixes.

And how am I supposed to debug now why madVR sometimes doesn't get keyboard events from JRMC? :(

[XMonarchY]

Did you carry out this test on an Eizo Foris FG2421 (as listed in your sig)? If so then the FG2421 has 8-bit MVA panel and it utilizes its FRC stage to create a pallet of 1 billion colors. I'm not sure how adjusting dithering as if it were a 10 (or 12?) bit panel affects color accuracy. I looked into the FG2421 as a 2nd display based on favorable reviews regarding calibration results. In the end I passed in part due to the lack of true 10-bit.

No, I tested this on my TV that allows 12bit color depth via NVidia CP. I will test some more, but its a bit difficult to test toggling something on and off using Exclusive mode...

[ashlar42]

Does madVR report 10bit output mode? If so, it must be the GPU drivers which do these weird things. All madVR can do it output 10bit to D3D11. The rest is up to the GPU driver.Yes, it does output 10bit. And I tried experimenting with the 16bit png file, from the other thread... it seems that 10bit is working even if the TV doesn't report 36bit input. I mean, the gradient changes and there is no dithering set in madVR, output in Nvidia control panel is set to 12 bit (it's either that or 8 bit). So I guess Nvidia is not dithering, madVR is not dithering... the gradient changes when in 10bit FSE mode... I'd say it works. My beloved Kuro is getting old in the tooth... I should change it but there's no satisfying alternative so far :(

[madshi]

Still the Overlay mode combined with dxva2 native with dxva chroma, luma and downscalling, gives me weird sized window, in fullscreen is ok, but the player crashes after I press the stop button - mpc-be latest beta 501...No problems in 0.88.17
I've confused by the words "Still" and then "No problems in 0.88.17". The "Still" suggests the problem was there before and is "still" there. But then that contradacts "No problems in 0.88.17". Also, generally not enough information. GPU? OS? Does it occur with any video or just some? Do you get a madVR crash box? If so, I'd like to see the crash report.

When 1.0 rolls out, I'll be first to buy!
Thanks!

And how am I supposed to debug now why madVR sometimes doesn't get keyboard events from JRMC? :(
Option 1) You could use an older build. Option 2) I could create a special build for you, when you are ready to debug that.

Of course I could also simply revert the change. But I think it's a "good" change. I've noticed many times that when trying to debug a media player with madVR running, the first key press freeze for several seconds, before MSVC++ continues to run. This is quite annoying. I *think* this problem should be gone with the change I did.

[nevcairiel]

But I think it's a "good" change. I've noticed many times that when trying to debug a media player with madVR running, the first key press freeze for several seconds, before MSVC++ continues to run. This is quite annoying. I *think* this problem should be gone with the change I did.

That was madVR?
Somehow it felt like I always get that, and I don't think I always used madVR. But maybe I'm wrong..

Anyway, the hotkey issue with madVR and JRMC is something I definitely want to look at soon'ish, but I can just use an older version, sure.

[sneaker_ger]

Does it still occur with v0.88.19?
Yes.

Does unchecking the "use a separate device for presentation" option help?
It already was unticked. I have now tested with ticked and unticked but it does not make a difference.

http://217.160.126.132/madVR%200.88.19_back_forth.7z

[Siso]

I've confused by the words "Still" and then "No problems in 0.88.17". The "Still" suggests the problem was there before and is "still" there. But then that contradacts "No problems in 0.88.17". Also, generally not enough information. GPU? OS? Does it occur with any video or just some? Do you get a madVR crash box? If so, I'd like to see the crash report.

With version 0.88.17 no problem, with versions 0.88.18 and 0.88.19 I have the problem. GTX 550 TI 353.30, win 7 64 ultimate. The problem only happens in Overlay mode (with builds 0.88.18, 0.88.19).Works fine in D3D9 windowed and fullscreen mode, also works in D3D11 modes.

[James Freeman]

Confirmed.
There is a problem with Overlay mode.

When there is any GUI text from mpc-hc like (Volume, Chapter, etc...) the downscaling is messed up; it looks like it stretched to 100% from the downscaled window.
As soon as the text is gone the downscaling works properly again.

[dansrfe]

Just curious, is Windows 10 capable of overlay mode with madVR?

[huhn]

dx9 overlay mode works on windows 10. just tested with nvidia 353.50 and windows 10 10240

[Ceremony]

I recently switch from stock Kodi to Kodi with DSPlayer, so that i can use madVR on my media center pc (AMD APU A10-7850K).

For some reason though, the GPU clock is stuck at its lowest speed. In my case 351MHz. It should however go up to 900MHz. I cannot use Jinc for upsampling, image doubling and any other advanced and demanding features... Anyone got a solution for this?

[Warner306]

I recently switch from stock Kodi to Kodi with DSPlayer, so that i can use madVR on my media center pc (AMD APU A10-7850K).

For some reason though, the GPU clock is stuck at its lowest speed. In my case 351MHz. It should however go up to 900MHz. I cannot use Jinc for upsampling, image doubling and any other advanced and demanding features... Anyone got a solution for this?

Wait for the next build of DSPlayer. It requires updates for the latest versions of madVR. It should be available within the next week.

[Ceremony]

Wait for the next build of DSPlayer. It requires updates for the latest versions of madVR. It should be available within the next week.I don't think this is a DSPlayer issue actually. I just tried the latest madVR with MPC and I am running into the exact same issue: Stuck at a low frequency.

[THX-UltraII]

but even with madVR in these programs. madVR still can't do frame packed 3d.
Madshi, do you have any plans to integrate madVR in a 3D frame-packed support tool like PowerDVD?

[6233638]

Well I know that you're not taking feature requests, but I left things running overnight to generate a 3DLUT for my TV using CalMAN, which has noticeably improved color reproduction.
Unfortunately the way this is done is to oversaturate the display to get the gamut as wide as possible (color at 70/100) and then have the LUT correct the resulting errors.

Because I have to oversaturate the display for this, I have it set to a separate mode on my TV.
On this TV, there is a button to toggle between the PC/Movie modes, so it's easy enough to switch.
However this means that I can no longer watch videos in windowed mode (where I am less concerned about accuracy) because the LUT is greatly reducing the saturation of most colors since it is expecting the display to be at 70/100 in Movie mode rather than the 50/100 it is at in PC mode. It may not sound like a lot, but that's a big difference.

So it would be nice to either:

Have a preference which only enables 3DLUTs in full-screen mode.
Allow for profile support in the devices section of the madVR settings.

The latter would have many other uses.
For example, I have certain videos where I would want to enable different gamma settings, and it would be nice to use the very flexible profiling system to automate this.

[Dogway]

I've confused by the words "Still" and then "No problems in 0.88.17". The "Still" suggests the problem was there before and is "still" there.

Man, you surely had a bad day :) aside of programming it would be nice to learn some language comprehension, it would avoid the typical over-the-top harshness so common in today forums.

To give you some ontopic insights, let me list some further advises for the renderer:
-as I said add selecteable GPU renderer.
-less is more, get rid of placebo junk like all of the "upscaling refinement", one good sharpener is better than 4.
-Add a dumb "denoiser", I would never use one but I guess there are people that use the TV's denoiser so it's easy to add one better.
-Also get rid of ringing fest Jinc, and all the bicubic based (add "b" and "c" boxes for anyone to fill as replacement)
-remove deinterlacing, software deinterlacing is never going to replace offline deinterlacing. Better let TV deinterlace real-time.
-Profile groups for displays (asked (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1721646#post1721646) before)
-Make a guide (what Ordered Dither, what Error Diffusion algo?, process chain?, adaptive sharpen?). hint: a thread is not a guide.

[KhR0N1K]

Man, you surely had a bad day :) aside of programming it would be nice to learn some language comprehension, it would avoid the typical over-the-top harshness so common in today forums.

To give you some ontopic insights, let me list some further advises for the renderer:
-as I said add selecteable GPU renderer.
-less is more, get rid of placebo junk like all of the "upscaling refinement", one good sharpener is better than 4.
-Add a dumb "denoiser", I would never use one but I guess there are people that use the TV's denoiser so it's easy to add one better.
-Also get rid of ringing fest Jinc, and all the bicubic based (add "b" and "c" boxes for anyone to fill as replacement)
-remove deinterlacing, software deinterlacing is never going to replace offline deinterlacing. Better let TV deinterlace real-time.
-Profile groups for displays (asked (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1721646#post1721646) before)
-Make a guide (what Ordered Dither, what Error Diffusion algo?, process chain?, adaptive sharpen?). hint: a thread is not a guide.

i do not agree.

[MSL_DK]

Man, you surely had a bad day :) aside of programming it would be nice to learn some language comprehension, it would avoid the typical over-the-top harshness so common in today forums.

What are you talking about!!! madshi is known for an absolutely friendly tone. More than you!

[Ver Greeneyes]

...That was the most condescending drivel I've read in a while.

[James Freeman]

Careful Dogway you are pushing it, and in his own home. :rolleyes:

[Dogway]

okey okey, looks like my appreciations are not welcome here (for some unexplained reasons -right KhR0N1K (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1730453#post1730453)?, right Ver Greeneyes (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1730455#post1730455)?, right madshi (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1730325#post1730325)?-) nonetheless it's my ONTOPIC opinion, so please, everyone, stay ontopic.

[Ver Greeneyes]

If you don't think your post sounded condescending, you should learn some language comprehension. But sure, I'll stop feeding the troll.

[aufkrawall]

i do not agree.
What a pure trolling. I suggest to completely ignore him.

Well, hopefully a more constructive opinion:
In image doubling, maybe it should be named "double luma axis resolution" etc.?
E.g. in games rendering, you usually refer to the total amount of pixels when having a multiplicator. Of course you can define doubling the one way or the other, but giving a hint that it's meant for each axis sounds like a compromise to me that should make fans of both types content.
Maybe it would reduce confusion, as image doubling options are probably not easy to understand when you are new to madVR.

[Akeno]

Hi everyone,

This is my first time posting on the forums but I've been following this thread and reading threads on the forum for a few months. First off, thank you so much for all of your work madashi. You and the other developers on this forum helped awaken my interest in film and home theater playback.

With that out of the way, I have a few questions regarding madVR:

How much does the monitor affect visual changes in rendering?
I've played around with most, if not all, of the options in madVR but I can barely see a difference in some options. e.g. I see almost no difference between bilinear and jinc chroma upsampling or error diffusion and no dithering unless I lower the bit depth to something ridiculous. I mainly use a 15" laptop IPS display so I don't think it's the WORST choice out there but I just can't see a difference even staring closely.

Will smooth motion work well with 23.976>60hz conversions or should I let reclock speed up video to 24fps and let smooth motion blend it to 60?

SuperRes options are adjustable numerically rather than listed in presets.
Updated to 88.18 but the madVR config remains unchanged. Not that it really matters. With NNEDI3, I saw absolutely no difference in SuperRes off and SuperRes 10pass 1.0 strength. It was more noticeable when using jinc or nedi.

Previous versions of madVR had a slight increase in render times with d3d11 enabled but the current version actually lowered render times by a few milliseconds.
Not really sure what d3d9 and d3d11 are but I also wouldn't expect performance to change when updating versions.


Sorry for the laundry list of questions but I'm really appreciative of everything on this forum.

[baii]

Hi everyone,

This is my first time posting on the forums but I've been following this thread and reading threads on the forum for a few months. First off, thank you so much for all of your work madashi. You and the other developers on this forum helped awaken my interest in film and home theater playback.

With that out of the way, I have a few questions regarding madVR:

How much does the monitor affect visual changes in rendering?
I've played around with most, if not all, of the options in madVR but I can barely see a difference in some options. e.g. I see almost no difference between bilinear and jinc chroma upsampling or error diffusion and no dithering unless I lower the bit depth to something ridiculous. I mainly use a 15" laptop IPS display so I don't think it's the WORST choice out there but I just can't see a difference even staring closely.

Will smooth motion work well with 23.976>60hz conversions or should I let reclock speed up video to 24fps and let smooth motion blend it to 60?

SuperRes options are adjustable numerically rather than listed in presets.
Updated to 88.18 but the madVR config remains unchanged. Not that it really matters. With NNEDI3, I saw absolutely no difference in SuperRes off and SuperRes 10pass 1.0 strength. It was more noticeable when using jinc or nedi.

Previous versions of madVR had a slight increase in render times with d3d11 enabled but the current version actually lowered render times by a few milliseconds.
Not really sure what d3d9 and d3d11 are but I also wouldn't expect performance to change when updating versions.


Sorry for the laundry list of questions but I'm really appreciative of everything on this forum.

1. chroma upscaling is known to have little effect on real life material.
2. edit: nvm thought you said SVP, that wont make a difference.
3. people are working on it
4. does not matter ~~

most of the stuff go back to "judge with your own eye".

[Ver Greeneyes]

Previous versions of madVR had a slight increase in render times with d3d11 enabled but the current version actually lowered render times by a few milliseconds.
Not really sure what d3d9 and d3d11 are but I also wouldn't expect performance to change when updating versions.A difference in rendering time between d3d9 and d3d11 is somewhat surprising, but the different path may be putting your GPU in a different power state, or it might be an artifact of how rendering times are measured. Unless you can confirm that d3d11 allows you to use settings where you'd be dropping frames with d3d9, I wouldn't pay too much attention to rendering times.

[Akeno]

1. chroma upscaling is known to have little effect on real life material.
2. edit: nvm thought you said SVP, that wont make a difference.
3. people are working on it
4. does not matter ~~

most of the stuff go back to "judge with your own eye".

1. I've tried it out with CG and anime material as well but even then I can't see a difference.
2. So I can keep reclock set to original speed?
4. Considering the render times are noticeably different, I would think that it does matter. My question was more about why they would be slightly different though rather than should I set d3d11 on or off.

Judging things for myself is good advice but I always go mad whenever I see people write about how they can notice huge differences in various options while I can't see any. Gives off the feeling that my eyes are broken.

A difference in rendering time between d3d9 and d3d11 is somewhat surprising, but the different path may be putting your GPU in a different power state, or it might be an artifact of how rendering times are measured. Unless you can confirm that d3d11 allows you to use settings where you'd be dropping frames with d3d9, I wouldn't pay too much attention to rendering times.

It does make the difference between dropping frames every few seconds with 30fps material using NNEDI3 16neurons. d3d11 gives me a few milliseconds of buffer room to prevent that.
On the note of GPU paths: This might have to do with an optimus issue but plugging in my laptop to my TV results in extremely high render times unless I restart my system. Despite render times being higher than the frame interval though, there are no visible dropped frames nor does madVR report dropped frames or presentation glitches.

[har3inger]

These are mostly my opinions, but I think the gist is mirrored by many others in this thread:

1. A good number of IPS displays are not true 8 bit and use static dither built into the logic of the display to "upscale" from 6 bit to 8 bit. Sometimes it'll look better if you set the display bitdepth for dithering to the true (6 bit, if applicable) depth of your monitor, sometimes it looks better at 8, and this depends entirely on your own configuration. You may need to test this empirically on your end. Usually you want to feed a monitor 8 bit info (even if it's 6 bit) because the dither levels decided by madvr may be different from your monitor, which can cause way more noise than necessary. Unless you know for sure your monitor supports 10 bit color or higher (almost nothing does in a laptop), don't go higher than 8 bit.

Chroma quality differences in live-action film are going to be very hard to distinguish on any monitor unless you are trained well in what to look for. The best way to visualize differences is to try to find pure colors (red is best) on pure black background. Credit rolls and opening logo scenes are best for this. Otherwise, you can set chroma to nearest neighbor and look for the heavily aliased areas to identify places in the image where a chroma upscaler makes a lot of difference. As a sort of related tidbit, since it's hard to tell the difference between chroma upscalers, many people like to get some performance back by setting the upscaling to bicubic 75 AR.

2. Smooth motion should works just fine with 23.976->60. At least, it does for me. However, if you're able to test with reclock on and off already, it won't hurt to try and see what you like better. IIRC, reclock does cost a noticeable chunk of computation time, so it may be worth it to skip it and use some more obviously visible madvr features if you're bottlenecked by your laptop hardware.

3. I have no idea how the math of the current SuperRes algorithm works, and it's still very much in testing. IIRC madshi said that he'll be replacing those numerical entries with presets at some point in the future.

4. D3D9 and D3D11 are the same as the DX9 and DX11 that you see for games. They can enable new features, but by themselves shouldn't cause any differences in an image result. D3D11 needs a newer GPU (which you probably have if you have an IPS screen laptop) and enables 10 bit output. Otherwise, it really doesn't matter if you use D3D9 or D3D11. Go with whichever one runs faster unless you need 10 bit output for a 10bit or higher screen.

Edit: RE: your TV plugging issue: Probably some sort of OSD bug, where madvr gets confused about the stats when dealing with switchable graphics. If you don't see frame stuttering or weird jumping, it really shouldn't matter what the stats say. TBH, madvr support for laptops and switchable graphics isn't quite perfect (intel + AMD in laptops has been reported to not work with openCL or nnedi3) so just report whatever bugs you see and move on.

[Akeno]

Thanks for the information, har3inger. I didn't know about the display bitdepth. Is it true even though the iGPU settings state that the monitor is 32bit?

For chroma upscaling, is this true even for CG or anime material? I personally can't see any difference even with extremely colorful and simple anime material unless I push it up to something like 4x zoom.

Regarding smooth motion: a personal preference, but I prefer to use smooth motion with a 60hz display rather than switching the refresh rate to 24hz. The judder is just too obvious at 24hz and smooth motion alleviates it slightly. I suppose an alternative would be to use SVP but I don't know how resource intensive it would be.

[James Freeman]

D3D9:
http://www.mediafire.com/convkey/100a/kszbaduns6srajszg.jpg
D3D11:
http://www.mediafire.com/convkey/68ae/dnpks1rexsl7yn8zg.jpg

*Sorry for the huge pics.
Shouldn't they shrink like on some other forums?

As you can see, I have a 30% faster rendering time with d3d11, if d3d9 is the base.
Or a 44% slow down with d3d9, if d3d11 is the base.
This is in P8 state (GTX660, 324MHz both gpu and memory clocks).
D3D11 definitely got faster in the last few releases.

When the GPU is in P2 state or full clock speeds, the rendering times are less than 4ms on both.
d3d9= 3.7ms
d3d11= 3.4ms

[Ver Greeneyes]

Interesting! Well, I'm certainly not going to complain.

[Ceremony]

Again, can someone help me with my AMD APU issue: The GPU clock does not increase while running madVR, thus I cannot higher quality scalers such as Jinc or resolution doubling:
http://i.imgur.com/zauGcIZ.png

[har3inger]

Thanks for the information, har3inger. I didn't know about the display bitdepth. Is it true even though the iGPU settings state that the monitor is 32bit?

For chroma upscaling, is this true even for CG or anime material? I personally can't see any difference even with extremely colorful and simple anime material unless I push it up to something like 4x zoom.

Regarding smooth motion: a personal preference, but I prefer to use smooth motion with a 60hz display rather than switching the refresh rate to 24hz. The judder is just too obvious at 24hz and smooth motion alleviates it slightly. I suppose an alternative would be to use SVP but I don't know how resource intensive it would be.

8 bit display == 32 bit in Windows display. The 8 bit means 8 bits per color channel, for RGB, totaling 24. There's also an alpha (transparency) channel that also has 8 bits, adding up to 32 bit color. Yeah, it's a weird naming convention.

The chroma differences are more obvious with crisp edges in anime or CG works, but again, hard to discern unless you know exactly where in an image to be looking. A lot of chroma information is well obscured by the luma channel, as it's supposed to be. Better scaling generally shouldn't give you more vivid colors, but more accurate edges between colors and more accurate saturation in thin or small bits of color. Go with a recommended algorithm like jinc3, bicubic75AR or super-xbr 100 if you're in doubt. :)

24 hz material (or 23.976, difference should be unnoticeable) on a proper 24 hz display should be perfect and theoretically better than 60fps and smooth motion. If you're seeing judder, something is not working like you're expecting in your setup. May as well just stick with smooth motion because it's so amazing. The only artifact smooth motion introduces is very slightly increased ghosting from motion in a scene/camera pans.

You'll find a lot of the answers to questions here basically come down to "I dunno, play around with the settings and pick something you like best. After all, you're the only one you're deciding settings for" :).

Again, can someone help me with my AMD APU issue: The GPU clock does not increase while running madVR, thus I cannot higher quality scalers such as Jinc or resolution doubling

Force GPU clocks to max for mpchc through CCC if you can. You might need to rename the mpchc executable to something else for this to work (I had to--ATI is stupid and locks certain applications to lower power states or iGPU and takes away user control). You can also try turning off hardware decoding (DXVA) in LAV filters. This tends to lock clocks for AMD gpus to lower clocks as well. In general, GPU power states are entirely controlled by your OS and GPU driver settings and how they handle your video player (NOT madVR, which runs inside the vid player). There's likely nothing madVR can do to force certain GPU power states, so unfortunately, don't expect support here if troubleshooting doesn't work.

[MS-DOS]

The GPU clock does not increase while running madVR,
It has nothing to do with MadVR. Disable DXVA in your video decoder and try again.

[Akeno]

8 bit display == 32 bit in Windows display. The 8 bit means 8 bits per color channel, for RGB, totaling 24. There's also an alpha (transparency) channel that also has 8 bits, adding up to 32 bit color. Yeah, it's a weird naming convention.

24 hz material (or 23.976, difference should be unnoticeable) on a proper 24 hz display should be perfect and theoretically better than 60fps and smooth motion. If you're seeing judder, something is not working like you're expecting in your setup. May as well just stick with smooth motion because it's so amazing. The only artifact smooth motion introduces is very slightly increased ghosting from motion in a scene/camera pans.

You'll find a lot of the answers to questions here basically come down to "I dunno, play around with the settings and pick something you like best. After all, you're the only one you're deciding settings for" .

Just so I'm clear, I have correctly assumed that my monitor is, in fact, a 8bit display based on the 32bit setting. If the settings said 24bit, the monitor would be a 6bit display and likewise 40bit would equate to a 10bit display, correct?

Unfortunately, my TV doesn't support any interpolation settings when connected to a computer. I'd like to try out the cineflow options on it like what another user has posted but oh well.

On a side note: What's the bilateral option? I remember madashi saying it works well on some content but horrible on others.

[Ceremony]

It has nothing to do with MadVR. Disable DXVA in your video decoder and try again.Using CPU decoding did nothing to counter the issue, improve performance, increase clockspeed or anything else along the lines. The issue persists.

However, it is still a madVR issue. I highly doubt madVR is at fault here, however, there clearly is a compatibility issue with my setup: madVR needs performance, desperately, but fails to reserve just that...

Bottom line: How do I fix this?

[huhn]

reinstall the driver and delete everything that can change or control the clock of your GPU there are so many possibilities.

after that try to rename your mpc-hc exe.

BTW. your screen shows a huge issue with the buggy and most likely windows 7 desktop composition.

[ryrynz]

BTW. your screen shows a huge issue with the buggy and most likely windows 7 desktop composition.

With Windows 10 basically weeks away just prepare for the upgrade and do a fresh install..

[e-t172]

Just so I'm clear, I have correctly assumed that my monitor is, in fact, a 8bit display based on the 32bit setting. If the settings said 24bit, the monitor would be a 6bit display and likewise 40bit would equate to a 10bit display, correct?

No. It's impossible to tell if a display is truly 6-bit or 8-bit just by looking at control panel options (and in fact there is no such thing as "24-bit" in these options). In both cases 8-bit data is sent over the wire and the GPU has no idea if the display is going to display it directly as 8-bit or if it is going to apply some FRC/dithering first to feed a 6-bit panel. The only way to tell is to actually look at the specifications of the display (and prey they are correct).

Same thing for 10-bit: just because you're sending 10-bit data to a display does not mean the panel is truly 10-bit. In fact I'm not even sure such panels exist, I've only heard of 8-bit panels where the 10-bit signal goes through some FRC first.

[dansrfe]

No. It's impossible to tell if a display is truly 6-bit or 8-bit just by looking at control panel options (and in fact there is no such thing as "24-bit" in these options). In both cases 8-bit data is sent over the wire and the GPU has no idea if the display is going to display it directly as 8-bit or if it is going to apply some FRC/dithering first to feed a 6-bit panel. The only way to tell is to actually look at the specifications of the display (and prey they are correct).

Same thing for 10-bit: just because you're sending 10-bit data to a display does not mean the panel is truly 10-bit. In fact I'm not even sure such panels exist, I've only heard of 8-bit panels where the 10-bit signal goes through some FRC first.

But you can sort of eyeball gradient patterns on images in exclusive mode to check, right? Or is that unreliable too?

For the record, I did try the image test as the other thread on the topic suggested and although it suggests the screen is 10-bit with a 10-bit signal, I find it hard to believe since 10-bit screens are supposed to be crazy expensive and mine is not.

[Ver Greeneyes]

@madshi: I've noticed something interesting about D3D9 windowed mode: it seems to deal with repeated frames much worse than the new D3D11 path. I thought this was an artifact of livestreamer, but whenever a stream drops frames, the D3D9 path seems to show a much older frame (the oldest in the queue?), which looks very glitchy. The D3D11 path, on the other hand, just stutters a little, which is how I would expect it to look.

This behavior might only occur when the source is dropping frames, i.e. not when madVR's queues run empty because the system can't keep up. If the queues are empty it presumably just repeats the last frame it had. Is there an error in the logic here? Is it pulling up the wrong frame to repeat when the queues are filled up?

Edit: I think this behavior only happens when "present several frames in advance" is checked in the windowed mode settings. It seems to just stutter with that unchecked, like with the D3D11 path.

[Warner306]

After viewing some more content with image sharpening enabled, I have some more observations:

Image sharpening is very subjective compared to image upscaling. A subtle change in settings can go from being too sharp to just sharp enough. Others may disagree.
As a result of this subjectivity, I would suggest adding as many presets as possible. A Low, Med, High seems too restrictive. 1-10 would be much better, or, instead, a Beginner and Expert setting. It would be very challenging to get the settings just right for every display.
SuperRes is the most natural sharpener. It would be nice if this shader could be added to Image Enhancements somehow for consistency's sake.
If not, FineSharp, what I would consider the best sharpener in Image Enhancements, is in dire need of an anti-ringing filter.
This is my primary criticism of image sharpening; it seems almost useless in preserving the illusion of a natural image without some type of anti-ringing.

[James Freeman]

How do you think 50fps film on a 120Hz monitor with SmoothMotion will perform/look?
24fps on a 60Hz monitor ratio is 2.5, so 50fps on 120hz will be 2.4.

[Schwartz]

That's the reason I haven't touched sharpening either. I rather take a softer picture without extra artifacts. Remember ffdshow's xsharpen? Now that would be a filter I'd like to see some time in madVR. It was fairly lightweight and it even reduced artifacts.

[Dogway]

To answer Schwartz above, and despite troll "Ver Greeneyes" calling me troll (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1730462#post1730462), which goes to show who lacks language comprehension, I want to further dig on the sharpening method I discussed on my (apparently content void (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1730455#post1730455)) post.

If we are able to do smooth motion in real time, we are only one step away of doing motion guided sharpening, or in other words, motion compensated sharpening which will by all means enhance sharpness where it needs (static high freq) and thus not sharpening grain/artifacts, etc. As it is now we only have spatial sharpeners, save for SuperRes which we have no way to know what it really does.