madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted) [Archive] - Page 1012

oldpainlesskodi

2nd May 2018, 09:10

Same here with my 1080 and latest drivers. 1803 did hose my custom refresh rates, but I expected that since it also happens whenever I update the Nvidia drivers.

The odd thing is though if I use Custom Resolution Utility, I can set a custom refresh rate for 23.976 and still get 12bit, but not if I use MadVr to set the custom refresh rate.

K

ryrynz

2nd May 2018, 09:47

Same here with my 1080 and latest drivers. 1803 did hose my custom refresh rates, but I expected that since it also happens whenever I update the Nvidia drivers.

Nvidia custom resolutions? Drivers are buggy AGAIN, most of the latest ones bork custom resolutions. I even tried 397.40 and failed to stick so back to 385.28 I go. Nvidia suck at software.

huhn

2nd May 2018, 09:56

Ok I lowered the queue sizes down to 8, and yes that helped. I only dropped 3 frames when I opened the file now. But as you see in this image, the render queue and present queue is still very low. Something is wrong or has changed.

did you change other presentation settings like flush settings?

try the old back buffer presentation by disabling "present several frames in advance".

nevcairiel

2nd May 2018, 10:03

Nvidia custom resolutions? Drivers are buggy AGAIN, most of the latest ones bork custom resolutions. I even tried 397.40 and failed to stick so back to 385.28 I go. Nvidia suck at software.

Do you honestly believe they change something about custom resolutions in every new driver that breaks it in new and fancy ways? Because I'm pretty sure they don't, because its likely a feature they just don't care about whatsoever. Its probably just not fully understood under which conditions it works right now, making you believe it breaks with different drivers again and again.

Betroz

2nd May 2018, 10:13

did you change other presentation settings like flush settings?

try the old back buffer presentation by disabling "present several frames in advance".

I disabled "present several frames in advance" now, and it didn't help. The queues still go very low.

My point is that the 1803 update changed something. What I do not know. The fact that I can't use the same MadVr settings now that worked before kind of proves that. And as I said, I did a clean install aswell.

Could it be that BIOS and OS fixes for Meltdown and Spectre vulnerabilities is the culpit here?

oldpainlesskodi

2nd May 2018, 10:31

Do you honestly believe they change something about custom resolutions in every new driver that breaks it in new and fancy ways? Because I'm pretty sure they don't, because its likely a feature they just don't care about whatsoever. Its probably just not fully understood under which conditions it works right now, making you believe it breaks with different drivers again and again.

It's worse that that - I've been pulling my hair out over image quality/colour depth/full vs limited.

All I can say is i think there is a long standing bug that has been reported on the Nvidia forums (i've only just found out), that if you use Nvidia Colour Settings, both full and limited range are borked, and regardless of what setting I use on my display its wrong.

However, I have used CRU to create a custom 23.976 at 12bit, then choose Use Default Colour Settings, and Voila, perfect render chain at Full>Full>Full RGB at 12bit with one repeated frame every several hours (which will do me).

I really don't know who to kick - me or Nvidia!

I have disabled all Windows Updates, and certainly Nvidia (sticking with 397.40), as now I am extremely happy, at last.

huhn

2nd May 2018, 10:36

I disabled "present several frames in advance" now, and it didn't help. The queues still go very low.

My point is that the 1803 update changed something. What I do not know. The fact that I can't use the same MadVr settings now that worked before kind of proves that. And as I said, I did a clean install aswell.

Could it be that BIOS and OS fixes for Meltdown and Spectre vulnerabilities is the culpit here?

these are for CPU not GPUs...

and they do nothing for normal user and most important are part of older windows updates.

Asmodian

2nd May 2018, 10:41

Betroz

2nd May 2018, 10:52

these are for CPU not GPUs...

I know, but the CPU feeds data to the GPU...

Maybe Madshi knows if Microsoft did any changes to Direct3D with the 1803 build.

Betroz

2nd May 2018, 10:54

I notice my composition rate is 23.976 while your's is 23.970. That is odd. :p

Yes but I don't think that is why my render queues go so low :p

ryrynz

2nd May 2018, 11:25

its likely a feature they just don't care about whatsoever.

That's pretty much exactly what I believe actually :D

svengun

2nd May 2018, 12:13

That doesn't seem right, I also have the BIOS and OS fixes for Meltdown and Spectre.

Did you turn the Windows game bar/game mode off again?

I am on 1803, 397.31, madVR v0.92.14 both 64 and 32 bit. MPC-HC and Zoom Player. Skylake X.
http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd496/asmodian3/madVR1803_zpstggaxvuw.png

edit: I notice my composition rate is 23.976 while your's is 23.970. That is odd. :p

Hi Asmodian,

how do you get the (extra) detailed rendering stats ?

in your view , it looks like they unfold to show more , i don't see an option for that , neither in Options explained page

TIA, Sven

strumf666

2nd May 2018, 12:17

Here you go:
Hidden Options
An empty folder or file in the madVR program directory with a specific name will trigger a hidden option, these are options you probably do not want to use.

BilinearSuperRes: Use a lower quality, but faster, mode for SuperRes.
DisableHdrBrightnessTweak: Disables raising the brightness of shadows which normally occurs when 'this display's peak luminance capability' is set to 120 or 180 nits.
DontRenderAfterStop: Stops madVR from rendering for 7 seconds after playback is stopped or paused. It may stop black screen flashing during seeks and play rate changes with specific players.
force full range input: Forces madVR to treat all input as full range.
KeepLastFrameOnStop: Prevents a black screen when stopping playback.
ShowBlackBars: Draws a green rectangle around the active video area, as detected by zoom control.
ShowRenderSteps: Displays every shader pass in the OSD with the rendering time for each one. Can slow down the overall rendering time due to needing to flush the GPU and wait for the rendering to succeed after every shader pass but this effect is very minor in recent versions. Only active when the OSD is being displayed.
YCbCr: Outputs YCbCr data instead of RGB, as if it was RGB.

huhn

2nd May 2018, 12:18

it is in the option explained thread and it should not be used by default. as you can easily see it is no bug free at all.

you need to go to the madVR folder and create an empty folder called: ShowRenderSteps

just to give oyu an idea this was slowing down render with NGU in past and not only a little bit so don't use this regularly there has to be a good reason this is not a normal option.

svengun

2nd May 2018, 12:40

khanmein

2nd May 2018, 16:08

No it is not that. As I said, same settings as before 1803 update...

Edit : The frames are not only dropping in the beginning, they are dropping during the entire episode.

I'm using a GTX 1070 so far the only issue I had is freeze whenever enable automatic full screen exclusive mode during full screen. Literally, no dropping frames, except I'm dragging the seek bar.

FDisk80

2nd May 2018, 16:28

Betroz

2nd May 2018, 18:07

ultrahd_hdr

2nd May 2018, 18:52

as soon as you install windows 1803 a message popups advising you to fix your blurry screen,once you hit fix/apply you lose your current nvidia drivers,this is happening with 397.31,anyone else experiencing the same?

Crimson Wolf

2nd May 2018, 19:58

So no others here with the same issue with MadVr and Win10 1803 with low queues and dropped frames? I'm considering buying a Win 8.1 OEM lisence in order to have something that work and won't be broken with an OS update...

Actually, I can confirm this as well, but only when my GPU is pushed. For example: watching 720p60 to 1080p screen using

chroma NGU sharp (high)
luma NGU sharp (high) < SSim1D100 LL AR
chroma > Bicubic60 AR

Upload queue is fine, but render queue 2-3/8, present queue 0-2/6. Avg stats: rendering 9.16ms

If I lower it to NGU sharp (medium), queues goes back to normal. Avg stats: rendering 5.83ms.

Before the 1803 update, everything worked fine. If I overclock my GPU, the render queue is 'slightly' better, but still not normal. I tried DDU and clean install the drivers. I have not yet tried a fresh windows install.

Only thing I tried so far is turning off all the "Focus Assist" options, as I heard it makes alt-tabbing from a game to a browser can take a few seconds if ON.

Asmodian

2nd May 2018, 20:05

I don't remember seeing that when I upgraded either of my computers. Were you using something other than 100% scaling?

just to give oyu an idea this was slowing down render with NGU in past and not only a little bit so don't use this regularly there has to be a good reason this is not a normal option.

This has been fixed in new versions, it changes rendering times only when the OSD is open and it slows them down only a very small amount. I like using it to know what processing steps are enabled. :p

Still, I also do not recommend it for everyone.

Crimson Wolf

2nd May 2018, 21:13

I use MSI afterburner to monitor my GPU > remoteserver > android app. Anyway, non-overclocked GTX 980 using 720p60 > 1080p upscaling (1.5x) then reduce using SSIM1D:

GPU : 75%
Power : 99% (I've increased the max to 125% power limit)
tons of frame drops

When I overclock:

GPU : 69%
Power : 104%
frame drops when render queue goes to 0-2 instead of 1-3 momentarily

NGU Sharp (med) + no-overclock:

GPU : 56%
Power : 71%
no frame drops and all queues normal

I tried changing some RCA settings and dithering settings to increase load from NGU Sharp (med), and the queue problems seems to trigger at around >75% GPU load and >90% Power load.

One thing that's strange is the Task Manager GPU load is always higher than MSI GPU load by about 6%.

EDIT: I was wrong, I can't trigger the queue problem with 23.976fps videos, only 60fps. I tried NGU sharp (very high) and GPU load 90%, power 104%, no queue problems. Could it be my CPU? 2500k @ 4.2 Ghz.

huhn

2nd May 2018, 21:40

This has been fixed in new versions, it changes rendering times only when the OSD is open and it slows them down only a very small amount. I like using it to know what processing steps are enabled. :p

i said it was an issue.

Marin85

2nd May 2018, 21:55

I recently updated my HTPC (Win10) to the new April 1803 build and now when I put my videos in full screen exclusive mode, I get around 4 seconds of black screen, then when the video appears there are a few hundred dropped frames within a few seconds, and then the video finally plays smooth as normal. While this is all happening, the audio is still playing back at normal speed without interruption. So basically when I enter FSE, it takes like ~8 seconds to finally start playing back normal with zero dropped frames.
...
edit: Apparently it's Win10's new 'focus assist' feature which mutes notifications when doing select activities. When I enter FSE it thinks I'm playing a game and turns focus assist on. I turned focus assist off when playing games and it's fine now.
Thanks! I was having the exactly same problem after updating to 1803, and that fixed it. I would've never figured out it was the darn focus assist.

Asmodian

2nd May 2018, 21:58

i said it was an issue.

I just wanted them to know performance isn't a big problem now but it is still not for those who simply want a set and forget configuration. :)

har3inger

2nd May 2018, 22:16

Ditto on the weird queue behavior and the FSE freezing mentioned. I upgraded 2 machines to 1803 and they're both like that now. One's a laptop on R9 270x, the other an RX480. One day prior, they were both fine.

I've noticed that on FSE the queues fill normally, but on non-FSE they never fill to full unless the GPU load is extremely small. However FSE is unusable because of significant stuttering on maximizing.

FDisk80

2nd May 2018, 22:18

as soon as you install Windows 1803 a message popups advising you to fix your blurry screen,once you hit fix/apply you lose your current nvidia drivers,this is happening with 397.31,anyone else experiencing the same?

That feature is not what is doing this. Every major Windows 10 update release overrides some of the the nvidia driver files.
I don't know why Microsoft thinks this is a good idea and why nvidia doesn't care that this is happening every damn time.
Anyway, short story even shorter you need to reinstall the nvidia drivers after every major update.

Betroz

2nd May 2018, 22:18

I reverted back to an older MadVr build here, version 0.92.4, and used NNEDI3 128 settings. My render and present queues are normal here, and that is with stats that is around ~30 ms too. I tested with SG-1 episodes again (480p) same as my previous screens. So... NGU problem with Win10 1803 build, or some other funky stuff?

omw2h

3rd May 2018, 00:02

In the latest Win10 there is a new power plan in Windows Power Settings called "Bitsum Highest performance" - might be worth checking our for those with issues using MadVr after upgrading.

They did add "Ultimate Performance" as they are calling it, if that is what you meant, it should only be present in Windows 10 Pro for Workstations as far as i know.
Fortunately there are simple ways to add it:
https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/107613-add-remove-ultimate-performance-power-plan-windows-10-a.html#option1

ryrynz

3rd May 2018, 00:24

I tried NGU sharp (very high) and GPU load 90%, power 104%, no queue problems. Could it be my CPU? 2500k @ 4.2 Ghz.

This is basic processor load stuff, It's not your CPU. Even if your GPU is running at ~90% load it can still be not fast enough to keep up with required frame times, NGU can be quite demanding.
Keep your GPU utilization down to whatever load level doesn't create frame drops and if that's under 90% load then so be it. Max load percentage is not a target.

ryrynz

3rd May 2018, 00:28

Anyone enabled Ultimate performance and seen any results making it worthwhile to add for HTPC?

Asmodian

3rd May 2018, 00:30

I have Windows 10 Pro for Workstations (1803) and I do have that option. I am not sure how much it changes though, I think it is only for minor latency improvements. Like disabling C1E in BIOS and similar tweaks. I don't notice anything compared to High Performance for HTPC.

nevcairiel

3rd May 2018, 00:34

It really makes no difference outside of pathological edge cases.

More importantly for everyone having issues on 1803, make sure that the Game Bar is turned off, otherwise it'll inject itself in any 3D rendering.

BDFan

3rd May 2018, 02:05

So no others here with the same issue with MadVr and Win10 1803 with low queues and dropped frames?
I have the same problem.
Win10 1803.
http://www.hostpic.org/images/1805030632300114.jpg (http://www.hostpic.org/view.php?filename=1805030632300114.jpg)

Crimson Wolf

3rd May 2018, 02:12

This is basic processor load stuff, It's not your CPU. Even if your GPU is running at ~90% load it can still be not fast enough to keep up with required frame times, NGU can be quite demanding.
Keep your GPU utilization down to whatever load level doesn't create frame drops and if that's under 90% load then so be it. Max load percentage is not a target.

The problem is, it was fine before the 1803 update. I can actually put MORE load with 23.976fps videos than my 60fps videos, but can't trigger the queue problem.

ryrynz

3rd May 2018, 02:13

Well, not that it seems to affect my own results, but did you turn off Game Bar/Mode for testing like Nev suggested?

leeperry

3rd May 2018, 02:22

I might have missed it but a hotlkey for RCA would be really great please.

ryrynz

3rd May 2018, 02:33

That's there, under 'deblocking - toggle'

Crimson Wolf

3rd May 2018, 02:35

Well, not that it seems to affect my own results, but did you turn off Game Bar/Mode for testing like Nev suggested?

Yes. Only thing I didn't try is trying an older nvidia driver or older madvr. I can try in about 3hrs.

EDIT:

Previous drivers didn't help, previous madvr didn't help, BUT FSE fixes the queue problem for me for the 720p60 videos. Can anyone explain? Can people who are having low queues and dropped frames try FSE?

khanmein

3rd May 2018, 07:49

How to try when FSE mode caused freezing?

http://i63.tinypic.com/20j69om.png

BDFan

3rd May 2018, 07:50

Can people who are having low queues and dropped frames try FSE?
FSE Okey!

ryrynz

3rd May 2018, 07:56

Is this a problem with NGU Sharp? or does it extend to other resizers too?

Betroz

3rd May 2018, 08:10

I guess FSE means the fullscreen exclusive mode? Well I haven't used that for years, so that is not what is causing my queue problems. Regarding Game Bar, I disable most of what I consider bloat in Windows 10 after any reinstall or big update, like the new 1803. I like to tweak my systems, but I don't go overboard and disable lots of services like in the Black Viper guide I used in the past.

It's is not unreasonable to think that some of Microsofts tweaks to DirectX can cause problems for MadVr is it? I hope Madshi looks in to this when he comes back. Until that time I will use an older version of MadVr with NNEDI3 128 settings. I miss NGU Sharp already :p

Betroz

3rd May 2018, 08:16

Is this a problem with NGU Sharp? or does it extend to other resizers too?

I haven't tried all of them, but NGU Anti-alias has the same issue. I believe the problem lies with NGU and how what works, but I have no clue. I will use NNEDI3 128 for the time being.

Grimsdyke

3rd May 2018, 11:00

Fortunately no bigger problems for me with the Win10-1803-update !! The only thing that seem to be necessary for me now too is changing RGB settings.
Before the update I had RGB full everywhere but now the images are rendered way to dark. But setting RGB to '16-235' within MadVR the images are to bright.
So I am using 8 for blacks in MadVr RGB custom settings right now but have to test/compare more with other movies.

huhn

3rd May 2018, 11:40

levels are not working correctly is not a real issue?

not that i'm going to blame the windows update for that or driver just say...

jkauff

3rd May 2018, 12:03

levels are not working correctly is not a real issue?

not that i'm going to blame the windows update for that or driver just say...
I suspect this is a system problem. I'm using 1803, latest madVR, latest Nvidia drivers (GTX 1080), and am seeing none of these issues. Maybe the 1803 version is making heavier use of GPU resources than the previous version, leaving less for madVR.

x7007

3rd May 2018, 12:05

@x7007 What's wrong with your LG? Everything looks good.

It looks good , but you need to notice the different when enabling windows HDR it's not using 10 bit YcbCr 4:2:2 anymore . it is using 8 bit + Dithering and that's the different with the spring now.

@x7007 Could you please only capture (with Snipping Tool) the part of the screen with useful content instead of the whole screen showing mostly white background? It's much more comfortable when reading the thread. Thanks. ;)

I will do it next time sure.