madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[Siso]

On my machine win 10, nvidia card - if I set frames in advance from 1-3, I don't get presentation glitches at all, but if I right click to see some menu in the player madvr flashes...If I set the frames in advance to 8 which is the default, madvr doesn't flash, it makes presentation glitches...

[mclingo]

I can confirm that restarting windows explorer does put it back in 10 bit on my system, running latest MADVR win11 24H2, RX 7800xt - to be honest i hadnt even noticed it was doing that

[NeonPhoenix]

Hey guys, I use HDR movie file to tone map it using pixel shaders and watch it in SDR but the image is so dark for some reason. May I get some help please?

Random online streaming site: https://i.imgur.com/AOi2nuU.jpeg
MPC-HC + MadVR with the settings below: https://i.imgur.com/qwDXiLD.jpeg
Settings: https://i.imgur.com/BKenptC.png
MPC-HC + MadVR with HDR enabled: https://i.imgur.com/uAUp98p.jpeg

My display's brightness is 400 nits.

[mclingo]

Try setting the peak luminance in hdr settings to a very low value my tv is only a 400 knits and I've got it set to 150 and its plenty bright, You might have it set too high.

[VergiL]

Hmmm? Fwiw, I use W11 24H2 including all latest updates as of 3/11/25. Also, latest Nvidia driver 572.70. HDR and SDR both report 10bit in the madVR OSD and several other places I've confirmed. Full screen exclusive and Full screen windowed modes both report 10bit. The same is true when I use Kodi VideoPlayer (Windows API), MPC-BE/HC with madVR renderer (Nvidia API), or with MPC-Video Renderer (Windows API). Refresh rates are matched and/or doubled. I've done no workarounds or anything.
Weird...

[NeonPhoenix]

Try setting the peak luminance in hdr settings to a very low value my tv is only a 400 knits and I've got it set to 150 and its plenty bright, You might have it set too high.

Am I not supposed to enter the real value there? I don't want to fix it that way. I tried setting it to even 50 and it still looks darker than HDR.

[huhn]

what told you it is 400?

[clsid]

Start by resetting madvr settings to defaults. Then only change the target nits value. Do not randomly copy (tonemapping) settings from other people.

[huhn]

i played a bit around with presentmon there is no other surface accessing the windows/display beside DWM and the player at all times.

but i found out how to trigger the issue it's by starting another 3d application also just flip in that case. which forces madVR from independent flip to flip.

it will not use 10 bit again even if it returns to independent flip

there is sometimes a second DWM entry when madVR/player is not in focus and as long as that is around 10 bit is disabled again madVR changes to flip.

so not much to learn from at all
https://i.postimg.cc/tyH6FyKr/broken-state.png
https://i.postimg.cc/Lmjg0WF9/fixed.png

the fixed state will immediately break again if tabbed out.

[NeonPhoenix]

what told you it is 400?

Every specification & review site & video

[NeonPhoenix]

Start by resetting madvr settings to defaults. Then only change the target nits value. Do not randomly copy (tonemapping) settings from other people.

I tried exactly what you said, but it did not fix my problem. I also tried reinstalling MadVR and trying other versions, happens in all of them.

[huhn]

that's worthless you have to match these tested setting first.
it does not matter if someone tests a screen and reaches 400 nits if you don't run it at these settings.

[VergiL]

i played a bit around with presentmon there is no other surface accessing the windows/display beside DWM and the player at all times.

but i found out how to trigger the issue it's by starting another 3d application also just flip in that case. which forces madVR from independent flip to flip.

it will not use 10 bit again even if it returns to independent flip

there is sometimes a second DWM entry when madVR/player is not in focus and as long as that is around 10 bit is disabled again madVR changes to flip.

so not much to learn from at all
https://i.postimg.cc/tyH6FyKr/broken-state.png
https://i.postimg.cc/Lmjg0WF9/fixed.png

the fixed state will immediately break again if tabbed out.

Can you please summarize in simpler words what you mean? Is it the fault of another 3D application ?

[huhn]

nothing concrete.

[NeonPhoenix]

that's worthless you have to match these tested setting first.
it does not matter if someone tests a screen and reaches 400 nits if you don't run it at these settings.

Sorry but I couldn't understand you

[mclingo]

These are my settings in For HDR, I don't Output in HDR Mode I get a better picture when I turn up to SDR my tv also has a small bug where hdr doesn't actually work properly unless you've got Dynamic contrast turned on which looks garbage.

I have Not changed very much, I have mainly tinkered with Dynamic paint luminance and dynamic target nits to get the brightest picture I can without destroying detail in bright areas.

My tv is a 10 year old OLEDTV so I doubt very much it's still the 400 to 450 nits it was out of the factory which might be why I have to pump the brightness in hdr settings, However I always watch tv in a dark room so hdr is plenty bright and I get a good colourful dynamic picture.

https://1drv.ms/i/c/6240949ef769c50b/EWW9nixzmdNDo6OUxTjXqhQBpla0VZATK947A7cRFH7u9w?e=graCxR

[mclingo]

Are there any known issues with error diffusion two on mpc or mpcbe players because I can't get them to play properly unless I disable this And use error diffusion one instead, Both load with a black screen and when I look at the movie it's paused if I unpause it it kind of starts to play after about 10 to 15 seconds, There are no issues at all with kodiBG, It's no big deal because I can't tell the difference between the two anyway was just wondering.

[huhn]

These are my settings in For HDR, I don't Output in HDR Mode I get a better picture when I turn up to SDR my tv also has a small bug where hdr doesn't actually work properly unless you've got Dynamic contrast turned on which looks garbage.

I have Not changed very much, I have mainly tinkered with Dynamic paint luminance and dynamic target nits to get the brightest picture I can without destroying detail in bright areas.

My tv is a 10 year old OLEDTV so I doubt very much it's still the 400 to 450 nits it was out of the factory which might be why I have to pump the brightness in hdr settings, However I always watch tv in a dark room so hdr is plenty bright and I get a good colourful dynamic picture.

https://1drv.ms/i/c/6240949ef769c50b/EWW9nixzmdNDo6OUxTjXqhQBpla0VZATK947A7cRFH7u9w?e=graCxR

a new EF9800 can do up to 366 nits in SDR that means brightness and contrast at 100. and 400 with the same settings in HDR.

Are there any known issues with error diffusion two on mpc or mpcbe players because I can't get them to play properly unless I disable this And use error diffusion one instead, Both load with a black screen and when I look at the movie it's paused if I unpause it it kind of starts to play after about 10 to 15 seconds, There are no issues at all with kodiBG, It's no big deal because I can't tell the difference between the two anyway was just wondering.
AMD bug.
trust me don't use ED in general...

[mclingo]

ok ta

[Sunspark]

I agree with huhn re: ED. I can see the difference between ordered and ED, but I think ordered looks better to me and the fact it uses less CPU is a plus.

And in anycase, dithering is more important when you reduce the bit depth of an image as opposed to increasing it.

[huhn]

the 10 bit bug should be fixed in an upcoming new version or two.
not anytime soon but it will be looked at when time allows it.

[mclingo]

good to know, thanks Huhn.

[Amuat]

Have to say that when you finally get the settings right, madVR looks significantly better than MPCVR (did some comparing while watching BBC's The Planets), even though there's quite a lot of talk that the latter has simply superseded the former. Also the convenience with display modes and profiles and such is very nice. Sadly the performance is just not that smooth, at least for me. I regularly get dropped and repeated frames and also presentation glitches. Practically none of that on MPCVR. It's not a case of latency as I'm well below vsync/frame, something like half on average. Am I still missing something, or is it just inevitable with the latest Windows and Nvidia updates? I guess those flushing settings don't need to be changed after all as no one comments on them?

Speaking of profiles, can someone find a more exclusive trigger for my camera footage profile than MP4 filetype that I currently use from this MediaInfo sheet (https://pastebin.com/9rjU9Vnt)?

[mclingo]

I think if you want perfect playback in MADVR these days you have to go back to windows 8/10, I think we'll just have to live with it, i've not played a movie without issues for a long time now since i moved to windows 11, I dont think MADSHI has much interest in dealing with these issues as I doubt they are also happening on the ENVY hardware.

[Sunspark]

It's not a big deal. Just put a 64 gig partition on your drive and you can boot between multiple Windows versions on the same drive.

[mclingo]

Having to reboot my machine every time I wanna watch something is not something I'm interested in, I'll have to live with it for now.

[Sunspark]

Then switch back to W10, because you guys are having too many problems with 11 and it's not going to get fixed anytime soon if you want to use the madvr renderer.

[mclingo]

I think If any of us were going to Go through the rigmarole of wiping the machine and reinstalling everything, all games all apps all tweaks, re adding all accounts, Reinstalling vpn and all settings plus a million other things I can't think of right now, to switch back to Windows 10 we would have done it by now.... it's not going to happen.

[Sunspark]

I don't think it's a big deal to re-boot into a second partition, but if it is, then you need to move on to using another renderer with better support for 11. mpcvr, mpv and vlc all have hdr support.

[Asmodian]

I guess those flushing settings don't need to be changed after all as no one comments on them?

I am getting good results on Windows 11 24H2 (26100.3476) with a 120 Hz display using:

DX9
2 frames presented in advance
flush
flush & wait (loop)
flush
flush & wait (sleep)

[mclingo]

Is this window mode or fse or both and how are you switching to DX9?

[VergiL]

I don't think it's a big deal to re-boot into a second partition, but if it is, then you need to move on to using another renderer with better support for 11. mpcvr, mpv and vlc all have hdr support.

Yes but does mpcvr equal madvr in upscaling and sharpening...

[huhn]

Is this window mode or fse or both and how are you switching to DX9?

you don't AMD need 10 bit for HDR when you use there API which DX9 can't do.

[Amuat]

I am getting good results on Windows 11 24H2 (26100.3476) with a 120 Hz display using:

DX9
2 frames presented in advance
flush
flush & wait (loop)
flush
flush & wait (sleep)

I hope this works with DX11 too, at least better than the default settings. Will give it a try, thank you!

I noticed today that there is something wrong with HDR on madVR. Don't know if this is yet another OS problem, but the contrast is somehow wrong. I'm using HDR passthrough, no tone mapping. Have still use for MPCVR after all it seems.

[VergiL]

The contrast is not good, but how?

[Amuat]

The contrast is not good, but how?

Something brought back a very hazy memory of some talk about not using auto-HDR but rather manually change to HDR before starting the video, and lo and behold, it looks right that way. MPCVR doesn't have this problem, but on madVR it looked flat. The movie was in B&W, but I guess the colors would have looked washed out too if there would've been any.

[VergiL]

The HDR must be managed by MadVR and not the OS (NV HDR and not OS HDR), I think this is a problem specific to your configuration.

[huhn]

The HDR must be managed by MadVR and not the OS (NV HDR and not OS HDR), I think this is a problem specific to your configuration.

shouldn't matter try this:
A question for all Madvr users.

Do you notice any difference when doing this on Windows 11?
Right-click on your player .exe > Properties > Compatibility > enable "Use Legacy ICC Color Management"

This fixes an issue with MPCVR where HDR is washed out in fullscreen on some systems. I am curious if it also helps/hurts when using Madvr. Then maybe I can enable it by default for MPC-HC.

i will create a icc correction for a display and do some SDR test to get something together.

[Amuat]

Really don't care if it is "a problem specific to [my] configuration", as I noticed yesterday something else with using OS HDR: 10 bit fullscreen actually works now! It even works with 8 bit SDR videos when it is on, though no need to use it for that content of course. Just interesting how it's fixed across the board by this method.

Legacy ICC Color Management did not fix the wonky HDR for me, but looks great with just using the OS HDR.

[VergiL]

Silly question: we agree that the upscaling refinement section is only active during doubling/upscaling, so there is no need to create 1080p and 2160p profiles?

[Amuat]

Silly question: we agree that the upscaling refinement section is only active during doubling/upscaling, so there is no need to create 1080p and 2160p profiles?

Upscaling refinement functions are most definitely active with 4k, have done constant fine-tuning with them for my 4k profiles (my monitor is 4k, just to be clear).

[huhn]

they are not but i'm not answer the same question in detail twice at two different places.

[ashlar42]

Has there been any news about madVR long term plans on HTPC? Or is it still at the "timed betas for the foreseeable future" stage?

[lvqcl]

madVR Envy (https://madvrenvy.com/)

[Amuat]

Apologies for my idiocy, don't know where my mind was when answering. I was actually thinking of compression artifacts. But does this mean that image and chroma upscaling options do not matter at all either when watching 4k videos with 4k monitor resolution? Unless supersampling of course.

[huhn]

chroma is always needed with streaming and disc content.
if nothing is scaled a scaler isn't needed. so for 2160p on a 2160p device with nothing else applied like cropping or what ever no refinement or scaling is used.

[ashlar42]

madVR Envy (https://madvrenvy.com/)
Was this supposed to be an answer for me?

[lvqcl]

Was this supposed to be an answer for me?
Yes. `

[ashlar42]

Yes. `

I see you like to be cryptic... so your take is that there are no long terms plans for the future of madVR HTPC? For a while there was an hypothesis of a paid for subscription plan or something.

[mclingo]

I don't think anybody actually knows any of the plans for MADVR From the software point of view, we are still just being used as guinea pigs and testers for Madvr Envy which is perfectly fine because it's still free. Obviously we'd all like to see some more development I personally would like to see Some more work done on smooth Motion to make it usable.