madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[x7007]

Ok so I stand corrected, not everyone with rtx needs FSE. I have tried with the latest drivers as well and am absolutely sure I need it for my setup. I get stuttering even with default madvr settings and matching refresh rates (i just cant tolerate unmatched). Have even tried a full windows reinstall. I am quite sure there are a few other users who have had the same problem and have solved it with FSE.

I dont need FSE for the exact same setup but the 2080 ti swapped out with a 1080.

For what its worth, my primary PC:
Intel 9900k, asus maximus xi code, 64gb ram, asus strix 2080 ti oc edition, samsung 970 evo, bunch of 10tb hdds. Sony 75" z9d as the primary display for madvr. Not sure what else could be relevant.
Your TV or Monitor could be the issue.. I had issue with Philips 7007 TV when using 60 Hz, 59 Hz worked fine.

[ryrynz]

@madshi
Can we expect something big before Christmas?
What about the new algorithm?

Was expecting something some weeks back but madshi started another round of HDR improvements with new test builds, so I think next month maybe..
He's not known to do things concurrently so I think a stable will be out when he's finished this batch of HDR development.
Madshi also said to me that the new algo is basically on hold / in development with no ETA, don't hold your breath with that one.

try the screen shoot function it can do up to 800%.

Cheers, didn't make the connection between those options and what I wanted.

[austinminton]

@austinminton

don't forget the nvidia power setting there is a problem on windows 10 with windowed mode that can results in a stuttering mess on dual or more monitor setup where the refreshrate doesn't match on all screens(composition rate mismatches) this varies heavily by the used windows version. a way to test it is using overlay rendering which usually ignores such issues similar to FSE.

I do have a pc monitor + tv setup and have "adaptive" set on power setting in nvidia control panel.

here are the results of my tests on the 2080 ti. I am using default settings with refresh rate matching at 4k:

1) only tv hooked up - Stutter
2) only tv hooked up with overlay enabled - Stutter
3) tv + pc monitor hooked up with overlay enabled, display to tv - Stutter
4) only tv hooked up with FSE - No Stutter
5) tv + monitor hooked up, display to tv with FSE - No stutter

The stutter is so obvious that I can instantly tell if FSE is enabled by looking at the video.

Here are some other quotes with the same problem, so definitely not just with my setup

OM*G! Boys! FSE gives me smooth playback on the RTX 2080. THANK YOU SO MUCH! 👻😄

Yes, I am using 2080 and get stuttering also even through CPU/GPU utilization is low and rendering time is low. I was getting no stuttering with 1060. Only thing that prevents stuttering for me is enabling full screen exclusive mode.

Well I will now lay this to rest, I definitely need FSE to avoid the stuttering. Not a problem really as everything works fine with it on my setup.

Its obviously not true for every rtx card, but its there for a few atleast.

[ryrynz]

I wouldn't expect the card to be the point of difference here, would expect something else related to your system. Did you use DDU when installing the RTX?

[austinminton]

Did a fresh windows install on a new partition. If I pull out the 2080ti and put back my old 1080 the stuttering stops.

[XMonarchY]

Make sure you didn't force VSync off in the driver

Thanks! I set it back to App-Preference and all the tearing disappeared in both modes!

[70MM]

Question please...
1. If I set my video card 1080Ti to 24Hz I never get any dropped or repeated frames on ripped BDs, madvr will display "no dropped or repeated frames 4/5 days"
2. If I set the video card to 23.97 I get one repeated frame every 4/5 minutes, never any dropped frames.

Is a repeated frame every 4/5 minutes something one sees on the screen or not? I would think a repeated frame is better than a dropped frame...

Thoughts on this please guys, is it better to run on 1. or 2.?
Personally without looking at the madvr stats I cant tell any differance between either way visually...

[huhn]

if 24 hz give you superior stats(there are soem moves with 24 hz) use it and yes it is clearly visible.

[70MM]

if 24 hz give you superior stats(there are soem moves with 24 hz) use it and yes it is clearly visible. Great thank you very much for that hunn, Ive always wondered whats best!:)

[Klaus1189]

Dropped frame is a „jump“ in playback, one frame is not presented. You can clearly see that.
Repeated frame is a „pause“ in playback, one frame is repeated and presented twice. You can also see this clearly.
Both look terrible to me. Nothing is better here, both are visible.

Correct me if I am wrong.

[70MM]

I really dont know how this has anything to do with dropped or repeated frames but this is my observation during testing and I still dont understand the result.
1. If I set JRiver to bitstream playing at 24 or 23.97 on the video card 1080Ti I get repeated frames on the stats of madvr.
2. If I set JRiver to PCM playing at 24 or 23.97 on the video card, I get no repeated or dropped frames on the stats for madvr, shows zero dropped/repeated frames for 4/5 days.

Again something I just dont understand why...

[huhn]

jriver has a resample function that matches the speed of the audio with the video thsi doesn't work with bitstreaming.

[70MM]

jriver has a resample function that matches the speed of the audio with the video thsi doesn't work with bitstreaming.
Yes I use the video clock in JR with PCM as it doesnt work with bitstreaming. So this is the reason that 1 & 2 above show differances between frames dropped/replaced vs no frames dropped/replaced?

So in this instance with madvr, using PCM in JR is much better than bitstreaming in JR, as we dont get dropped or replaced frames and video playback is much smoother and always in sync. :)

[SamuriHL]

Yes. PCM is much easier to keep in sync without dropped frames. The only real downside in this day and age is the loss of DTS:X and ATMOS. If all you're doing is DTS HD MA and TrueHD, decoding to PCM will be quite perfect and eliminate the frame drop problems as you've seen.

[NoSauce]

@actarusfleed

you are using DXVA native which results in blackbar detection isn't working.

the next problem is you are using different tools to fix your issue. not saying it can't fix your issues but you should only choice one.

but as soon as you are getting blackbar detection working either the nvidia cropping or the madVR masking should give you the results you are looking for.

if your projector have lens memory the madVR way give you more resolution.

I'm using DXVA2 (copy-back). Does this result in blackbar detection not working as well?

I don't know what would explain everything being fine on my laptop monitor in FSE mode and have black bars on the side for my external monitor. Here is my original query:

When I enter Full Screen Exclusive (FSE) mode on my external monitor there are extra black bars on the sides that squishes the video horizontally. This does not happen in Windowed mode. This does not happen on my non-external, laptop monitor whether it's FSE or windowed. Any suggestions? Thanks!

[PrayForMojo]

any reason why this is happening with this particular 1080p/hdr10/h265 file in DXVA copy back mode?
video displays fine in dxva native and cuvid modes (gtx 970).

dxva copyback works fine with other types of videos. this is the only file i've come across so far that's exhibiting this issue.

any suggestions?

https://i.imgur.com/HzVCVDs.png

[sneaker_ger]

1. If it happens only in DXVA copy-back the problem is unrelated to madvr
2. No one knows if there's anything special about "this particular 1080p/hdr10/h265 file" because you didn't upload it.

[chros]

I created 1 custom mode for 23p with madvr (the rest of the modes are fine on my system), all work fine.
- the interesting part is that it created a 24p entry in nvidia control panel not 23p. Is this right this way?
-- it still can properly switch to 23p and 24p ONLY if the mode is different at the beginning of playback (e.g. 60p)
- but if the mode of the display is set e.g. to 23p "manually" then madVR can't switch to the custom "23p" mode. Is this correct as well?

The 2nd one normally isn't an issue since at the end of the playback when the player closes, mnadvr switches back to the original mode (e.g. 60p).
But if I set "After playback: Sleep" in MPC-BE then madvr can't switch the mode back, and next time when I turn on the TV I have to manually set it back to 60p (since it's still in the custom 23p mode).
Is there any workaround for this?
Thanks!

Is this the correct way to work? Anybody? :)

[huhn]

I'm using DXVA2 (copy-back). Does this result in blackbar detection not working as well?

I don't know what would explain everything being fine on my laptop monitor in FSE mode and have black bars on the side for my external monitor. Here is my original query:

When I enter Full Screen Exclusive (FSE) mode on my external monitor there are extra black bars on the sides that squishes the video horizontally. This does not happen in Windowed mode. This does not happen on my non-external, laptop monitor whether it's FSE or windowed. Any suggestions? Thanks!

blackbar detection works with copyback.

for the other problem can you make a screen of the OSD(control+j)?

[Alexkral]

any reason why this is happening with this particular 1080p/hdr10/h265 file in DXVA copy back mode?


I had this kind of artifacts with old drivers, but it was with all HDR videos and only in CUVID mode.

This is weird, it says NV12 8 bit and below HDR unknown properties (?!)

[amayra]

madVR currently always renders in D3D9. So if you tell it to use D3D11 for presentation, it has to use 2 different D3D devices (one v9 and one v11) and the devices have to share their textures. This works well for AMD and Nvidia, but the Intel driver doesn't seem to like it very much. I'm not sure what MPDN does internally, maybe it also renders with D3D11, then it doesn't have to do the texture sharing.

In some future version I'm going to switch to D3D11 everywhere, then I don't have to share textures, anymore, which will probably improve the situation for Intel GPU users. However, this will mean losing compatability to XP and Vista.

if you stop share textures than that mean you will remove D3D9 renders but Direct3D 11 runs on Windows Vista with problem ?
anyway i think is time to Ditch windows xp support like ffmpeg and mpc-hc/be did

[PrayForMojo]

I had this kind of artifacts with old drivers, but it was with all HDR videos and only in CUVID mode.

This is weird, it says NV12 8 bit and below HDR unknown properties (?!)

got the latest drivers for the 970 from nvidia.com

here is a screenshot with dxva native:
https://i.imgur.com/AXaJq8p.png


i'm going to guess it's the way this particular video is encoded. guessing dxva copy back doesn't like something about it. everything else i've tried including 4k hdr10 hevc stuff works great.

[KrazyLurt]

got the latest drivers for the 970 from nvidia.com

here is a screenshot with dxva native:
https://i.imgur.com/AXaJq8p.png


i'm going to guess it's the way this particular video is encoded. guessing dxva copy back doesn't like something about it. everything else i've tried including 4k hdr10 hevc stuff works great.
I guess you are using PotPLayer.
Is Built-In Video Transform Filter Settings set to "disable" and all the boxes underneath Built-In Audio Transform Filter Settings unchecked? If not, try that.

[Warner306]

It could be something to do with the lack of HDR metadata, "unknown properties."

[direxx]

Hi,

I have discovered an extremely strange bug in conjunction with MadVR. When playing low-res 25p content (SD quality) in exclusive mode I am getting weird audio dropouts through HDMI. This happens especially with NGU upscalers.

My setup:


Asus Radeon RX 480 8G -> HDMI 2.0 -> Denon AVR -> TV
Intel i7-4790K
Full 4K chain


This is what's happening:


I am playing back a 720x404 file (25p), upscaled to 4K → either in Kodi DSplayer or MPC-BE, it does not matter
My MadVR "DVD" profile is activated, which does NGU Soft (High) Upscaling and some post processing
MadVR plays in exclusive mode
The Audio (Dolby Digital 2.0) is bitstreamed to my AVR


I am getting very frequent audio dropouts. The bummer is that if I use some low-end scaling algorithms such as Jinc in MadVR I am not getting any audio dropouts. With NGU (medium) these dropouts are not that frequent and my GPU load is very low. Apparently this only happens with 25p content. When switching from MadVR to another renderer this also does not happen any more.

Random thoughts about this:


It's not the cable. Gaming at 4K@60Hz is working completely fine. The audio also drops out in 1080p.
I have already upgraded LAV filters to the latest version. I have also tried to disable AC3 bitsteaming, but the audio also drops out with PCM (and various other LAV audio settings).
I have tried various versions of the Radeon driver. Right now I am at 18.12.2. I have disabled HDCP for the HDMI display.
This only happens with MadVR. Kodi default player is not affected, neither is MPC-BE with "Enhanced Renderer".
In MadVR windowed mode everything is fine (no dropouts).


Does anyone have any idea what this could be? :confused: This is super strange and I cannot imagine what's going on here. Maybe a faulty GPU or a faulty driver? MadVR issue maybe?

[mclingo]

Hi,

I have discovered an extremely strange bug in conjunction with MadVR. When playing low-res 25p content (SD quality) in exclusive mode I am getting weird audio dropouts through HDMI. This happens especially with NGU u?

just doesnt sound like your system is handling what is quite a large upscale + processing, what are your rendering times in MADVR, are they sub 30ms?, do you also get frame drops / repeats?

[SirSwede]

Question:

Does either Hibernation or Sleep Mode affect the madVR (or any picture settings for that matter) - when madVR is not running (probably should be added) - on a Windows 7 Home Premium desktop PC?

:thanks:

[huhn]

no it doesn't affect it.

[Betroz]

With the average render stats at around ~30ms, but the max stats can ramp up to ~44ms, what can the cause of this be? I tried to lower my settings, so that the average stats is around ~25ms, but the same thing happens. Only now the max stats is ~39ms. Too taxing for the GPU or is it something else?

Also I don't get dropped frames, but I do get a few stutters here and there. Highly annoying!

[direxx]

just doesnt sound like your system is handling what is quite a large upscale + processing, what are your rendering times in MADVR, are they sub 30ms?, do you also get frame drops / repeats?

Hi,

my rendering times are usually around 20ms and I don't get any frame drops (or maybe one per hour). As I said especially with NGU medium upscaling my GPU load is also only medium in that particular scenario (CPU is almost idle). Since the rendering times are also fine I don't think it comes from the GPU being too weak for my settings.

Any other ideas?

[Damien147]

Let me ask again:p
In target peak nits(tone map HDR...)we put display's peak nits or the calibrated one if there is?

[SamuriHL]

There's probably going to be some debate on this one. LOL Some people are using very complex sets of rules to change the target peak nit based on the content. The general idea is that the target peak nits is what your display can actually display. If you've calibrated your peak nits on the display then you should probably use that. Anything above the target will be tone mapped.

[janos666]

Is there a debug OSD for madTPG (similar to Ctrl+J for madVR) or on option to dump some detailed log to a file? I would like to check the output bit-depth in exclusive mode (while using madTPG with CalMAN).

[ryrynz]

Only now the max stats is ~39ms. Too taxing for the GPU or is it something else?


Around 40 is too high to avoid frame drops in my experience, I keep under 38ms as a rule for 24fps. Drop back a touch one other setting and you should be fine.

[Betroz]

Around 40 is too high to avoid frame drops in my experience, I keep under 38ms as a rule for 24fps. Drop back a touch one other setting and you should be fine.

Yes but my point was that there was no frame drops. "Only" a few stutters here and there (much like stutter in games). Btw the average render stats is just fine. I was just wondering why the max stats jump so high up from the average.

[KoKlusz]

Let me ask again:p
In target peak nits(tone map HDR...)we put display's peak nits or the calibrated one if there is?

Simplest answer is:

If you are using "Output video in HDR format" target value should be slightly below point in which your display enables tonemapping

If not, then use value as high as possible that doesn't dim the image to much to your liking.

[ryrynz]

Yes but my point was that there was no frame drops. "Only" a few stutters here and there.

Cut back on some settings and see if it still does it, first step in troubleshooting is to narrow things down. Wouldn't hurt to monitor the GPU as well.

[SirSwede]

Question:

Does either Hibernation or Sleep Mode affect the madVR (or any picture settings for that matter) - when madVR is not running (probably should be added) - on a Windows 7 Home Premium desktop PC?

:thanks:

no it doesn't affect it.

MadVR settings only, or any picture settings whatsoever?

[actarusfleed]

Hi Guys,
I own a win 10 htpc with nvidia gtx 970. Latest lav filters and madvr.
I've perfect playback with uhd hdr@24fps files.

With uhd hdr@60fps files it is massively not fluid.

I've set madvr to call 2160p60 resolution when a 60fps playback starts.

I also activated a roule to lower madvr scaling and rendering filters.

Attached the settings.

Rendering times is very low but the reproduction is still not fluid.

Any idea?

Thank u all
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181225/0bd8b3fa5e2b7c83304bb22ca8c62d22.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181225/59d0cd28347e5d0126b2f0492758ccb9.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181225/2d1da36bab623f0b91c085ad18ab58da.jpg

[huhn]

a 970 doesn't have a HEVC decoder it may be barely able to do 24 with is very bad hybrd "decoder" but that's not a great result and please don't disabled dithering.

MadVR settings only, or any picture settings whatsoever?

there is nothing supposed to change that counts for every program at least if it get's restarted.

[Damien147]

@SamuriHL
@KoKlusz

Ok,thank you both.

[Rectal Prolapse]

Just an FYI to NVIDIA users - I got frustrated at the state of NVIDIA drivers lately - I have a Geforce 1080, and I wanted to use a driver that is reasonably new, but still be able to play some games. I settled on the 399.24 drivers, but had one massive roadblock: I am unable to create a 23.976 hz custom resolution. The 399.24 driver "helpfully" tweaked the default resolution settings to get closer to 23.976, but it ends up being 23.9774 or so as reported by MadVR, on my Sony 1080p projector (HW40). This means a frame repeat every 20 minutes or so. Unacceptable, as I was able to achieve 23.97617 by decreasing the total vertical pixel to 1124 instead of the default 1125, which I cannot do anymore with 399.24!

Then I read a post in the CRU thread ( https://www.monitortests.com/forum/Thread-Custom-Resolution-Utility-CRU?page=70 ) that he created 48 hz resolutions.

So I decided to try it and it worked - I can get 47.9517 hz, which is very good. Nearly exactly double 23.976! I hope that those of you with the same problem can try this on their displays - with luck it will be supported!

Screenshot of my NVIDIA Custom Resolution dialog box:
https://i.imgur.com/Ik78bgt.png

There is one caveat though - MadVR doesn't know to switch to 1080p24 when presented with video that is 24.000hz. It always selects my new 47.952 hz resolution! Madshi, any way to fix this?

If not, a workaround would be to just manually change MadVR's display mode string and restart the player, or create a program to check the source framerate and switch to an alternative MadVR configuration before the player is launched.

[danann]

Is there a way to stop madVR from drawing new frames when paused?
I tend to keep many players open, and the GPU/CPU usage starts to add up significantly. It's an issue on laptops, especially.

Thanks

[Asmodian]

Make an empty folder called "DontRenderAfterStop" in the madVR directory.

However it doesn't stop forever, so it may not work for your use case.

[Asmodian]

I've perfect playback with uhd hdr@24fps files.

With uhd hdr@60fps files it is massively not fluid.


Did you capture that screenshot of the madVR OSD with the video paused? It looks like it was and we need to see the unpaused OSD to give useful advice.

Also, make sure Focus Assist is completely off, all the options in the focus assist settings page should be off.

[Xorp]

Are the cheaper NUCs with Radeon 540s (2GB) any good for madVR NGU? Specifically the BOXNUC8I3CYSM1 w/ Core i3-8121U.

[NoSauce]

blackbar detection works with copyback.

for the other problem can you make a screen of the OSD(control+j)?

FSE mode seems to be acting a little finicky on my monitor. It either doesn't enter FSE or enters it without the problem that I posted about (black bars on the side squishing the image horizontally), which is good. The issue may be file-type/encoding specific. I'll be sure to take a scrnshot of the OSD when I see the problem again. Although I don't think scrnshots work on FSE mode. I probably have to take a picture using my phone. Thank you for your reply.

[chros]

With uhd hdr@60fps files it is massively not fluid.
On the first pic in OSD: you play 60.00Hz content on 59.94Hz! That's why you get drops :)

created 48 hz resolutions.
So I decided to try it and it worked - I can get 47.9517 hz, which is very good.

There is one caveat though - MadVR doesn't know to switch to 1080p24 when presented with video that is 24.000hz.
What exact values do you have in madVR for display resolutions switching?

[Warner306]

Are the cheaper NUCs with Radeon 540s (2GB) any good for madVR NGU? Specifically the BOXNUC8I3CYSM1 w/ Core i3-8121U.

Not if you are upscaling to 4K and not in general. NGU is a neural network scaler that requires a lot of processing power. It is much better suited for a gaming GPU.

[mclingo]

Hi, i've been experimenting with my ATI RX 580 (can be bought for as little as £125 now ) to see how far I can push it to keep it under 60 degress and therefore have my fan stay at zero RPM's. I'm finding that I can generally use NGU sharp medium for upscale and chroma and still stay under 60 degrees for all material, if I use NGU high it can pop over the top now oand again so i'm probably going to stick with medium.

My question is, all my material is now 1080p or higher, is there any genuinely noticeable differences to the eye when deploying high quality scaling / choma with this higher quality material, I just cant see any difference at all between high or low for 1080p/4k stuff.