madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[pie1394]

That sample works fine for me, but strangely, madVR displays some frame drops when downscaling that. The rendering times should actually be fast enough, and I have yet to do some extensive testing, but it appears to only happen for interlaced content (thee card should be fast enough, at least rendering times indicate that).

If your display adapter's driver uses the stream processor to perform per-pixel-adaptive DXVA deinterlacing, it often needs huge computation power. The frame-rate-doubling means the GPU's deinterlacing loading is even higher and the video frames sent to madVR are also doubled.

Without the advanced deintlacing job loading, my old-school GTX260+ is still quite capable of using madVR Jinc3+AR to scale contents to 1920x1080 at 60 fps.

With it, GTX260+ only can afford HDTV 1920x1080i60 4:2:0 to 1920x1080p60 with madVR Jinc3+AR since madVR 0.85. In this version, madshi optimizes the 2x zooming factor's performance. It lets the GTX260+ to afford adaptive deinterlacing, no Luma scaling, and Chroma Jinc3+AR scaling at 60 fps. About all other cases requiring Luma scaling, this GPU's only affordable choice is to use Luma Lanczos3+AR / Jinc3-wo-AR and Chroma Jinc3+AR.

[ryrynz]

Perhaps once we get closer to the 1.0 release, there will be a "clean-up" of the options available, and some of these will be removed. It's hard to remove options though, because there will inevitably be someone that complains.

Yeah, perhaps these less popular algorithms (perhaps other settings like queues) could be hidden by default and exposed with an advanced option.

[Jong]

Yeah, perhaps these less popular algorithms (perhaps other settings like queues) could be hidden by default and exposed with an advanced option.I'd argue that provided MadVR made an effort to set the best, safe default scaling for each GPU then everything is an advanced option and shouldn't be needed by the average user. Not saying of course all our options should be removed, just I don't see the need for 2 levels of what would both be advanced settings.

[DarkSpace]

If your display adapter's driver uses the stream processor to perform per-pixel-adaptive DXVA deinterlacing, it often needs huge computation power. The frame-rate-doubling means the GPU's deinterlacing loading is even higher and the video frames sent to madVR are also doubled.

I don't know about the hardware side, whether it uses the Stream Processor to deinterlace or not, but maybe my response to 6233638 gives you information about that?


Something to be careful of, is that this source changes between film and video mode, so if you are forcing one or the other, you could potentially run into framerate problems caused by that. DXVA Native tends to not handle deinterlacing as well as DXVA Copy-Back, CUVID, or Software Decoding either in my experience.

It's also broadcast material, so be sure to have the "only look at pixels in the frame center" option enabled.

That said, madVR is not reporting any dropped frames here when playing back this file, whether downsampling or not, or forcing film/video.

Perhaps deinterlacing 1080i content while downsampling is simply too much for your card, despite what the render times report. Are you using custom flush settings?

P.S. It would be useful for you to mention the hardware you are running on when reporting performance issues. (or add it to your signature)

Thank you for the reply, I had indeed not checked the "Look only at pixels in the frame center" option.

My graphics card is an AMD Radeon HD 6970M and my upscaling settings are Jinc 3 AR (Chroma and Image). I use Catmull-Rom AR in Linear Light for downscaling, and my flush setting are at the standard values for both Windowed and Fullscreen Exclusive Mode (flush; flush & wait (sleep); dont flush; dont's flush), and I left the deinterlacing settings at Auto.

I'm using Software Decoding, so that also shouldn't be a problem, going by what you mentioned about DXVA Decoding. However, I now have verified that something very strange is going on here:
After reading your response, I tested downscaling that video in FSE Mode, and it played fluently aside from the drop frames that directly followed the change in the scaling factor. Also, using madVR's IVTC mode, downscaling works without problems in both Windowed and FSE Mode.
Now what's strange is that the dropped frames only start to accumulate in the OSD after I display it. That is to say, I open the video with OSD disabled and then press CTRL-J to display it. At this moment, the Backbuffer Queue changes from a briefly displayed 7-8/8 to 0-8/8 and dropped and repeated frames start showing up in the OSD. I can perfectly reproduce this by disabling thee OSD and re-enabling it, even without closing and re-opening the video.

This appears to be a cosmetical issue, going by the fact that in FSE Mode, the Present Queue soon stabilizes at 15-16/16 and stays this way, regardless of OSD display. If needed, I can upload a Debug Log, but I'm not sure if it is important for madshi to fix it now if it's purely cosmetical.

Edit: The "Use separate device for presentation" and "Use separate device for DXVA processing" options don't make a difference, it seems (I tried all combinations of checked/unchecked and the result stayed the same in Windowed Mode - I didn't look at the stats or FSE Mode because those didn't exhibit the weirdness to begin with).

[konakona]

I don't know about the hardware side, whether it uses the Stream Processor to deinterlace or not, but maybe my response to 6233638 gives you information about that?




Thank you for the reply, I had indeed not checked the "Look only at pixels in the frame center" option.

My graphics card is an AMD Radeon HD 6970M and my upscaling settings are Jinc 3 AR (Chroma and Image). I use Catmull-Rom AR in Linear Light for downscaling, and my flush setting are at the standard values for both Windowed and Fullscreen Exclusive Mode (flush; flush & wait (sleep); dont flush; dont's flush), and I left the deinterlacing settings at Auto."

Could anyone tell me what exacly does "Look only at pixels in the frame center do",and what can i gain by changing flush options?

[pankov]

Please try this ... TS sample (https://hotfile.com/dl/185596632/ddef693/ayaka_MSSL12.ts.html)

Make sure the DXVA deinterlacing is activated, and output is 1920x1080p60.

I expect GTX560Ti / GTX660 are both capable of handling such content with per-pixel-adaptive deinterlacing and madVR Jinc3+AR up-scaling at 60 fps.

The old-school GTX260+ is just not fast enough. It needs to use Lanczos3+AR on Luma for such contents.
Can anybody with GTX650Ti try it and share if this card is powerful enough to handle this clip with Jinc3 AR for Image/Luma and Chroma upscaling?
I'm trying to decide on a new card and the GTX660 is a bit out of my budget ... I can probably stretch to expected GTX660SE but not sure what will be the price for it.

[Heuer]

I have a MSI GTX 650Ti and am running Jinc 3 AR without problems.

[pankov]

Heuer,
I just want to confirm that you did try the sample in the post that I quoted above and not something else, right?

[michkrol]

I'm using Intel HD 4000 GPU with madVR set to use DXVA2 up-/downscaling, MPC-HC player and LAVFilters.
It works great with majority of files, but I've encountered a small bug when playing a little unusual file - h264, 10bit, 4:4:4 - there's a green line on the left border when using DXVA scaling, sometimes it crashes when starting playback. Doesn't happen with madVR's own scaling algorithms.
After playing with the settings, it seems to only happen when madVR does DXVA scaling, while receiving a 4:4:4 "colour format" (Y410/v410/YV24/Y416). Doesn't happen when LAVFilters output other formats (RGB32, RGB24, etc.).

Here's a small sample to hopefully reproduce this:
http://www.mediafire.com/?rldysfl9qf2d5fm

[Heuer]

Heuer,
I just want to confirm that you did try the sample in the post that I quoted above and not something else, right?
No I have not tried that specific sample but I am just downloading it, will give it a go and report back.

[secvensor]

madvr don't support SLI!!!

[Heuer]

Heuer,
I just want to confirm that you did try the sample in the post that I quoted above and not something else, right?
Just tried that clip. 701 dropped frames in the first 5 seconds with a lot of stuttering and then played perfectly to end with no more dropped frames. Average rendering time was 16.03ms

[yahyoh]

guys what do u think about my setting :D

using Lanczos 3 taps for chroma up scaling + image up scaling

i have shitty GPU i can't even enable AR :( cuz the frames will drop like hell :o

Jinc drops most of the frames with or without AR :D

[Jong]

If you can I would enable AR for luma and drop chroma upscaling back to Bicubic-75.

[yahyoh]

If you can I would enable AR for luma and drop chroma upscaling back to Bicubic-75.

ok i just test it its working with 30fps - 25 FPS or less

but its drops frames with 720p @60FPS :( on full screen
i bet it will drop more frames with 1080p @60FPS :o

edit: its working fine ( LOL i did it first wrong i changed chroma to Bicubic + AR and i left luma on Lanczos ) :o

edit 2 : tested 1080p @60FPS and it seems worked fine without frame drops but i had to disable DXVA in LAV filters :)

[Jong]

Actually I was suggesting that Lanczos-3 plus AR for luma and bicubic-75, with or without AR, might work, but that's without knowing how bad your GPU is!

[yahyoh]

Actually I was suggesting that Lanczos-3 plus AR for luma and bicubic-75, with or without AR, might work, but that's without knowing how bad your GPU is!

i tried to enable AR for chroma and its start to drop frames with 720p or 1080p @60 FPS

BTW i have AMD 5470m :o

[Sheytan]

A word a caution: make sure the display doesn't lie to you. For example I can send my laptop's screen basically anything from 30 Hz to 80 Hz or so, but its actual refresh rate is still 60 Hz and it's dropping/duplicating frames internally to compensate. Suffice to say, the result is pretty much unwatchable.

Is there anyway to fix that

When i used my HD6970 (HDMI) i had no problem with the display rates

And now i use trifire (6990 + 6970) and use a DVI-HDMI Adapter and 23hz shows as 32hz in madvr and 60hz as 80 :(

sorry for my bad english

[Dodgexander]

madshi, this option says (Vista and newer), can it be any use on xp64 ?

I have "stuck window" bug too on xp64 with nvidia and I can say that its usually Chrome or Firefox who gets stuck like that here and I think I fixed Firefox by disabling hardware acceleration in it, but Chrome still gets stuck especially if Google Dictionary (by Google) 3.0.15 extension is used in it...

I guess the answer would be to not use exclusive mode if you can afford too?

If not, try looking in the adjust windows performance settings, I think they were still around for xp and you may find the same, that disabling any opening closing window animations does the trick.

[Dodgexander]

http://aluminas.net/images/6724c0.png

Whats the difference between setting YCbCr and RGB and which should be used with MadVR?

[6233638]

Could anyone tell me what exacly does "Look only at pixels in the frame center do",and what can i gain by changing flush options?It uses the center of the frame to detect what type of deinterlacing should be used, rather than the entire frame. With broadcast content, you may have static logos in the corner that are a different type from the main picture (film/video type) and may confuse the deinterlacer.

I would not recommend changing the flush options, I was wondering if you had.

Just tried that clip. 701 dropped frames in the first 5 seconds with a lot of stuttering and then played perfectly to end with no more dropped frames. Average rendering time was 16.03msDo you have the "delay playback start until render queue is full" option disabled? 701 dropped frames is a lot.
I just get a single repeated frame on the stats when I start playback.

I do get about 30-40 dropped and 2-4 repeated frames every time I switch between windowed and fullscreen exclusive mode though - that's one aspect that I wish madVR handled smoother.

In fact I wouldn't mind being able to set a custom delay for entering fullscreen mode if it has to change the refresh rate to compensate for the re-sync time of my display. (every display is different)

madshi, this option says (Vista and newer), can it be any use on xp64 ?Windows XP doesn't have Aero ("desktop composition") so it probably won't do anything.

http://aluminas.net/images/6724c0.png

Whats the difference between setting YCbCr and RGB and which should be used with MadVR?With YCbCr the video card is converting its RGB output to YCC. Usually video cards do not perform this conversion with a lot of precision.

If your display supports it, you should use the Full RGB option.

I have "stuck window" bug too on xp64 with nvidia and I can say that its usually Chrome or Firefox who gets stuck like that here and I think I fixed Firefox by disabling hardware acceleration in it, but Chrome still gets stuck especially if Google Dictionary (by Google) 3.0.15 extension is used in it...It sounds like XP64 is the problem, if other software is also experiencing this.

[chuuey]

By stuck window on xp64 what do you mean? Maybe it's related to my stuck player with black screen on it ;) While same machine on Win7 runs everything perfectly ;)

[Dodgexander]

By stuck window on xp64 what do you mean? Maybe it's related to my stuck player with black screen on it ;) While same machine on Win7 runs everything perfectly ;)

Asfaik it only applies to multi-monitor systems. Until just posted I thought it was only on systems with Aero, so perhaps someone who has the problem on xp can post a screenshot?

If your secondary monitor is getting a black screen, thats a different, unrelated bug.

[Dodgexander]

So what are the benefits to having a YCbCr output? Does Madvr only output to RGB?

Don't a few Blu Ray titles have YCbCr?

[DragonQ]

Broadcast TV, DVDs and BDs are all YCbCr (most digital compression formats are). However, I don't think it's possible to output decoded video without a conversion to RGB, so outputting YCbCr just means you're doing YCbCr -> RGB -> YCbCr. Displays are natively RGB so outputting RGB should mean only one conversion (YCbCr -> RGB) but that's assuming the TV doesn't do any more conversions itself (not guaranteed).

[Dodgexander]

Broadcast TV, DVDs and BDs are all YCbCr (most digital compression formats are). However, I don't think it's possible to output decoded video without a conversion to RGB, so outputting YCbCr just means you're doing YCbCr -> RGB -> YCbCr. Displays are natively RGB so outputting RGB should mean only one conversion (YCbCr -> RGB) but that's assuming the TV doesn't do any more conversions itself (not guaranteed).

How can you tell what video input or output your display supports?

I thought this kind of thing was suppose to be integrated into the EDID?

So every piece of software, even commercial blu ray, converts to RGB?

[ThurstonX]

How can you tell what video input or output your display supports?

I thought this kind of thing was suppose to be integrated into the EDID?

So every piece of software, even commercial blu ray, converts to RGB?
Anecdotally, I can tell you the only way to get a decent pic on my LED LCD TV is to have Catalyst Control Center set to Full RGB. I then tell madVR that my display expects YCbCr. Works perfectly for videos. If I don't set madVR to that, blacks are crushed.

On my HTPC with a CableCARD for US TV signals using Windows 7 Media Center, anything other than Full RGB produces washed out colors.

Both PCs connect via HDMI.

I'd trust your eyes. Just run a few tests with various media (files, DVDs, TV as applicable) and see what looks best.

HTH.

[dlb76]

I guess the answer would be to not use exclusive mode if you can afford too?
It sounds like XP64 is the problem, if other software is also experiencing this.
I just disabled hardware acceleration for Chrome too. Think its all happening because of 2 or more apps trying to use GPU's hardware acceleration same time or something like that.

If not, try looking in the adjust windows performance settings, I think they were still around for xp and you may find the same, that disabling any opening closing window animations does the trick.
I have this option (http://i46.tinypic.com/2jdgena.jpg) disabled on XP64.

[Dodgexander]

Anecdotally, I can tell you the only way to get a decent pic on my LED LCD TV is to have Catalyst Control Center set to Full RGB. I then tell madVR that my display expects YCbCr. Works perfectly for videos. If I don't set madVR to that, blacks are crushed.


You mean set Mad VR to accept 0-255?

Can't see where to specify it to accept specifically YCbCr rather than just the colour range 0-255.

I just disabled hardware acceleration for Chrome too. Think its all happening because of 2 or more apps trying to use GPU's hardware acceleration same time or something like that.

I have this option (http://i46.tinypic.com/2jdgena.jpg) disabled on XP64.

Could be, I am often using flash, but even disabling hardware acceleration for it, the problem still happens. If you are disabling all those options and it still exists I'm not sure what to suggest other than to fiddle round with different settings/disable exclusive mode.

One thing you could test is fullscreen exclusive mode with EVR (set in mpc output), apparently if you exhibit the same bug as me (which i'm not sure you do) then this also triggers it.

[ThurstonX]

You mean set Mad VR to accept 0-255?

Can't see where to specify it to accept specifically YCbCr rather than just the colour range 0-255.
I was referring to the madVR setting under:

devices | [device] | properties | the display expects the following RGB output levels:

For my TV I set it to "TV levels (16-235)". OTOH, for my laptop I set it to "PC levels (0-255)". If I set it for PC levels when feeding my TV (with CCC set to Full RGB), then blacks get crushed.

[Prinz]

And with this "Stuck Window" Bug the tray notifications also don't work correctly, even after leaving Exclusive Mode. Sometimes I get the tray notification an hour or so after leaving the Exclusive Mode. And the "Stuck Window" Bug happens also with all Apps on my PC for example: Taskmanager. I don't think that it has something to do with Browser, Flash, ...

Since the tray notifications also use a FadeIn/Out Animation, same bug I think.

[dansrfe]

Even though it isn't technically correct information from the file itself but would it be appropriate for madVR to flag the stream as 23.976 fps (when IVTCing) for Reclock? It already does so for soft-flagged 29.970 MPEG-2 streams and it works well.

[dlb76]

Could be, I am often using flash, but even disabling hardware acceleration for it, the problem still happens. If you are disabling all those options and it still exists I'm not sure what to suggest other than to fiddle round with different settings/disable exclusive mode.

I mean disabling all hardware acceleration for all browsers (not flash, but composition, canvas, webgl and so on) seems fixing it, while flash still have hardware acceleration enabled.

tray notifications also don't work correctly
I never seen any tray notifications related to madvr, but I was always wondering what is this flickering of some yellow boxes about in the tray near time clock, all the time right after I close mpc-hc! :sly:

[Qaq]

If I set it for PC levels when feeding my TV (with CCC set to Full RGB), then blacks get crushed.I have to set my TV's HDMI input to "PC" to get RGB input, but level is limited by default, so I change it to full by switching Black level from Low (16-235) to High (0-255).

[Qaq]

Displays are natively RGB so outputting RGB should mean only one conversion (YCbCr -> RGB) but that's assuming the TV doesn't do any more conversions itself (not guaranteed).
You're right, most TVs have crappy RGB support (for example, Panasonic still downsample RGB 4:4:4 to 4:2:2) and I hope some day madVR will provide HQ YCC output in protected (PVP) mode to pass it through crappy video drivers untouched.

[6233638]

You're right, most TVs have crappy RGB support (for example, Panasonic still downsample RGB 4:4:4 to 4:2:2) and I hope some day madVR will provide HQ YCC output in protected (PVP) mode to pass it through crappy video drivers untouched.But don't they process everything in 4:2:2? I would be very surprised if they passed 4:4:4 and not RGB.

Usually RGB is your best chance, and often only if you enable PC or Game mode, if the display has that option.

[cyberbeing]

The higher end Panasonic Plasma models with 1080p Pure Direct enabled can process YCbCr as 4:4:4, but RGB is still converted to 4:2:2.

[Qaq]

But don't they process everything in 4:2:2? I would be very surprised if they passed 4:4:4 and not RGB.

Usually RGB is your best chance, and often only if you enable PC or Game mode, if the display has that option.
See my post with reference link on AVS: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1412227/i-need-a-new-hdtv/120#post_22097218

I hoped they will pay attention to RGB support in 2013 but they decided to get rest instead )

[nevcairiel]

My Sony TV has a mode that allows full 4:4:4 with RGB, and seems to pass all the tests people made up for 4:4:4 support, however it disables its 24p cinema processing then (which makes the video smoother without the "artificial" feel of full interpolation), and i rather have that.
With video content, 4:2:2 is already much better then 4:2:0, and even if i loose some detail in chroma again, its not *that* obvious, while losing the 24p cinema mode is quite obvious (to me - which is what counts :p)

[Qaq]

IMHO, without RGB 4:4:4 full support all the talks about HQ chroma processing have no sence.

[nevcairiel]

IMHO, without RGB 4:4:4 full support all the talks about HQ chroma processing have no sence.

Converting 4:2:0 to 4:2:2 already doubles the chroma resolution, so there is that. :p
People always talk as if 4:2:2 is the worst thing ever, but its already twice as much chroma information as 4:2:0, and converting to that as good as possible is still better then doing a crap job at it.

[Qaq]

People always talk as if 4:2:2 is the worst thing ever, but its already twice as much chroma information as 4:2:0, and converting to that as good as possible is still better then doing a crap job at it.
I never said 4:2:2 is the worst thing ever, but I'm afraid downsampling 4:4:4 to 4:2:2 by some "black box" is. Do we still speaking of HQ processing, BTW?
I got your point btw. "HQ chroma processing" is really no big deal, correct? C'mon, tell us the truth )

[glc650]

My Sony TV has a mode that allows full 4:4:4 with RGB...Which Sony do you have?

[DragonQ]

IMHO, without RGB 4:4:4 full support all the talks about HQ chroma processing have no sence.
PC monitors support full RGB 4:4:4 (unless it's a cheap TN panel with 6-bit colour channels and dithering).

[pankov]

Just tried that clip. 701 dropped frames in the first 5 seconds with a lot of stuttering and then played perfectly to end with no more dropped frames. Average rendering time was 16.03ms
Thanks
I guess it changed power states and when it was in the P0 it was enough to handle. Just barely but enough.
Can you check with GPU-Z if I'm correct?
If I'm not asking too much can you also check the GPU and Memory controller load and share your results?

[Qaq]

PC monitors support full RGB 4:4:4 (unless it's a cheap TN panel with 6-bit colour channels and dithering).
Yeah, ppl with PC monitors pass color tests with better results than TV's ppl, but PC monitor is not an option for video anyway because of contrast, size etc.

[Dodgexander]

I was referring to the madVR setting under:

devices | [device] | properties | the display expects the following RGB output levels:

For my TV I set it to "TV levels (16-235)". OTOH, for my laptop I set it to "PC levels (0-255)". If I set it for PC levels when feeding my TV (with CCC set to Full RGB), then blacks get crushed.

But those are RGB inputs, not YCbCr. I take it you meant in your earlier post you set CCC too Full RGB along with MadVR, because asfaik theres no way to get Mad Vr to accept YCbCr.

And with this "Stuck Window" Bug the tray notifications also don't work correctly, even after leaving Exclusive Mode. Sometimes I get the tray notification an hour or so after leaving the Exclusive Mode. And the "Stuck Window" Bug happens also with all Apps on my PC for example: Taskmanager. I don't think that it has something to do with Browser, Flash, ...

Since the tray notifications also use a FadeIn/Out Animation, same bug I think.

I'm sorry to say it, but on windows 7 I do not get the problem with tray notifications, only with the stuck windows. And the stuck windows problem goes away once I disable the opening/closing animation.

I am guessing if you're on XP(and this isn't directed to you Prinz, but the XP users with the similar problem) and having the problem with stuck windows its a different kind of bug, perhaps as noted related to programs using hardware acceleration.

I only used flash as example, because it uses hardware acceleration, but perhaps more what is effecting it for you guys is the animations these programs have with dxva is enabled when closing/opening.

Perhaps changing some advance settings around in mad vr can diminish this problem for you?

On the subject of YCbCr 4:4:4, aren't Blu Rays and DVDs (& HD-DVDs) encoded in YCbCr?

Does this mean, (mad vr aside) that all pc software converts:

DVD & HDDVD YCbCr 4:2:0 too RGB
Blu Ray YCbCr 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 too RGB

And if you set your video driver to YCbCr:

DVD & HDDVD YCbCr 4:2:0 too RGB too (video driver)> YCbCr
Blu Ray YCbCr 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 too RGB too (video driver)> YCbCr

So this means on PC, there is no definitive solution, such as standalone blu ray players or even the PS3 to playback formats truly natively, providing of course your display supports it.

[nevcairiel]

So this means on PC, there is no definitive solution, such as standalone blu ray players or even the PS3 to playback formats truly natively, providing of course your display supports it.

Not even Blu-ray players can output it truely "natively", because Blu-rays are encoded as 4:2:0, and HDMI does not allow 4:2:0 transmission, but only 4:2:2, 4:4:4 or RGB.
Anyhow, your TV displays RGB, so at some point it needs to be converted, might as well be the PC. The only limitation here is that many TVs do their internal processing only in 4:2:2, so if you use any mode that does processing (most do), it'll use 4:2:2 as an intermediate step.

PS:
You get that wrong in your post, all commercial content is more or less 4:2:0, Blu-rays, (HD-)DVDs, Broadcasts .. only some satellite broadcasts use 4:2:2, but its not that common.

[Dodgexander]

Not even Blu-ray players can output it truely "natively", because Blu-rays are encoded as 4:2:0, and HDMI does not allow 4:2:0 transmission, but only 4:2:2, 4:4:4 or RGB.
Anyhow, your TV displays RGB, so at some point it needs to be converted, might as well be the PC. The only limitation here is that many TVs do their internal processing only in 4:2:2, so if you use any mode that does processing (most do), it'll use 4:2:2 as an intermediate step.

PS:
You get that wrong in your post, all commercial content is more or less 4:2:0, Blu-rays, (HD-)DVDs, Broadcasts .. only some satellite broadcasts use 4:2:2, but its not that common.

Thankyou, so what exactly is the point in 4:2:2 and 4:4:4 if blu rays don't use them, why have they been introduced?

For those confused like me, here is a good article to read (http://www.spearsandmunsil.com/articles/choosingacolorspace.html).

[Zarper]

Thankyou, so what exactly is the point in 4:2:2 and 4:4:4 if blu rays don't use them, why have they been introduced?

For those confused like me, here is a good article to read (http://www.spearsandmunsil.com/articles/choosingacolorspace.html).

YCC is created to compress the bitrate of the video. Because the human eye can see difference in light better then colours you separate them in to luma (Y) and chroma (C) channels and display the chroma channel in lower resolution.

4:4:4 is full resolution of both chroma and luma.
4:2:2 is full luma, full vertical chroma resolution, but only half horizontal chroma resolution.
4:2:0 is full luma and half chroma resolution.

Most videos are 4:2:0 to lower bitrate but the display have to upscale the signal to full resolution 4:4:4 to display it.