madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[mrmojo666]

Hi, its worth getting some info about what PC and kit you have onto your SIG mate.
ok, i hope i can describe it in 200 chars

i can0t see my sig in this post, can you ?

[Klaus1189]

As stated, I am and always have used LAV Filters and yes of course, they are all set to preferred. They are updated and replaced into the MPC-HC LAV Filter x64 install folder as well. Fwiw, I have always used 5 players for testing and usage over the years and have a fair idea of the basics for all of them. Everything I use is the latest release preferring its nightly except nVidia GPU drivers which continue to be flawed since v.385.28.

Do you have another computer to test? Don't get me wrong, I want to help.

[mclingo]

MADSHI, the AMD RX 23hz SDR saturation bug, as i'm not the only one is there anything at all you could suggest I could look at changing to help you diagnose this, do you have any idea what it might be or anything I could ask AMD to have a look at?

[brazen1]

No, I have no other test beds, just my trusty HTPC. But, I can tell you, I'm not the only one with this bug. Have you recreated the problem?

[SamuriHL]

It seems not to work yet even if i set tv-level(16-235).
I've uninstalled madVR 0.92.16 version.Reinstalled old madVR0.92.14 version.All is normal as usual.
Thank you very much.

That's very weird. I've no idea what's causing it in your case cause I had an issue with HDR with the new nVidia driver (the 4xx driver) and going back to 399 works with v0.92.16 no problem.

[Klaus1189]

Have you recreated the problem?

I can not reproduce, if you mean that?

[brazen1]

Meaning - are you experiencing the same problem using the same hardware and software versions of everything? Latest madVR, Windows, nVidia, MPC players, LAV, x64 etc. Or, are you using older versions of things and different hardware such as AMD vs nVidia? You have nothing in your signature to help identify your environment.

[mclingo]

ok, i hope i can describe it in 200 chars

i can0t see my sig in this post, can you ?


no i cant see anything, took me a minute to work out how to do it, didnt realise mine was too long so nothing was appearing.

[mrmojo666]

no i cant see anything, took me a minute to work out how to do it, didnt realise mine was too long so nothing was appearing.

i can see your signature, but even it let me save mine it is not appearing :(

EDIT: i see my signature now, do you ?

[mclingo]

i can see your signature, but even it let me save mine it is not appearing :(

EDIT: i see my signature now, do you ?

I can see it now !:o

[Klaus1189]

Meaning - are you experiencing the same problem using the same hardware and software versions of everything? Latest madVR, Windows, nVidia, MPC players, LAV, x64 etc. Or, are you using older versions of things and different hardware such as AMD vs nVidia? You have nothing in your signature to help identify your environment.

I only have an very old 660 in another computer, does that help you? According to Nvidia driver tool it supports also the newest 411.xx driver.

[interpolation]

is it possible any of the RTX series features can be used to enhance madvr? any plans for this by the developer?

Utilization of tensor cores, even if not for their originally intended purpose of Ray tracing?

utilization of the new DLSS antialiasing/upscaling/super sampling?

utilization of the new NVlink bridge which apparently has much better memory bandwidth sharing than the previous SLI link. could potentially allow the program to run better than before with multiple GPU's?

Thank you.

[nevcairiel]

The Tensor Cores are the most likely to be used for video processing. If madshi has plans to do that, only he can say!

[Thunderbolt8]

whats the reason for an option to use NGU with some added grain for taking screenshots? or why is this the default choice?is anyone able to answer this question, please?

[huhn]

the answer would be "to add grain" and because madshi thinks this is useful. i personally agree with but i can see why people don't agree with the default settings.

[omarank]

This is very useful info added to the OSD. There is one minor thing though. If I use keyboard shortcut to disable the 3DLUT, the OSD still lists it indicating an active 3DLUT.
Ok, thanks, will get that fixed.
Fixed. Thanks!

The HDR improvements are really superb. It will be great if you could add the true GPU mode info in OSD for AMD GPUs as well. And in that info, is it possible to show IT Content Type/ Content Type reported to the display?

[iakoboss7]

just installed v0.92.16 and for the first time ever in full screen i can see the windows taskbar. this has never ever happened before in the 3 years i use madvr with mpc-hc.

anyone facing the same problem?

[Chouonsoku]

Is there currently a way to take advantage of madVR's tonemapping while also switching the display into it's HDR mode? I have an LG C7 and have been trying to compare the passthrough image output to madVR's tonemapping but only the "HDR to SDR" option results in a proper image, but also leaves the display in SDR mode which limits my peak brightness significantly. The "process HDR content by using pixel shader math" setting was what I expected would give me the results I'm looking for but it makes the image very red. I've included an album with some potato quality images below, final image is just using passthrough.

https://imgur.com/a/H8QpKjk

[aufkrawall]

just installed v0.92.16 and for the first time ever in full screen i can see the windows taskbar. this has never ever happened before in the 3 years i use madvr with mpc-hc.

anyone facing the same problem?
I can reproduce this by 100% when I put the player in Windows' tiled window arrangement.
But it's obviously a Windows bug, as it also happens with VLC and mpv. Some of those things Microsoft never cares to fix...

[iakoboss7]

I can reproduce this by 100% when I put the player in Windows' tiled window arrangement.
But it's obviously a Windows bug, as it also happens with VLC and mpv. Some of those things Microsoft never cares to fix...

do you know how to fix it?

this is a first for me (didnt even happen with v0.92.15 )

[mclingo]

getting HDMI loss / black screen all over the place coming out of movies, this is something that only used to happen coming out of 3D movies, now its happening in eveyrthing, mainly in KODI DS, only change i've made on my PC is MADVR update, however i've reverted back and they remain so its broke something on my HTPC, gutted.


edit - might have fixed this with a KODI DS install straight over the top, could be unrelated to MADVR.

[Warner306]

is anyone able to answer this question, please?

Better art? Upscaled images generally look more pleasing with some grain. That could be part of it.

[Warner306]

Is there currently a way to take advantage of madVR's tonemapping while also switching the display into it's HDR mode? I have an LG C7 and have been trying to compare the passthrough image output to madVR's tonemapping but only the "HDR to SDR" option results in a proper image, but also leaves the display in SDR mode which limits my peak brightness significantly. The "process HDR content by using pixel shader math" setting was what I expected would give me the results I'm looking for but it makes the image very red. I've included an album with some potato quality images below, final image is just using passthrough.

https://imgur.com/a/H8QpKjk

madshi could maybe improve this. I know there is a new Panasonic Blu-ray player that gets along well with this setting with many displays. I have seen several examples where tone mapping the image before the display results in an image with more highlight detail with any display that clips too much at the top.

The tone mapping was optimized for HDR -> SDR, so I don't know if it was tested that much with a PQ output. You are probably compressing reference white (100 nits) too much at 400 nits. It would likely work better if you could find a higher value that only compresses the top of the curve to better match the bottom of the PQ curve enforced by the LG. Your display must be brighter than 400 nits in HDR mode.

[Magik Mark]

Hi!

Just curious. How did you display the detailed rendering in ms? ctrl J doesn't show this

Thanks

i guess i have the same problem...

i see just the normal OSD stuff nothing new..
made a clean madvr install.

tested on 2 monitors, one with DVI - and one with VGA..(yes one monitor still has VGA)

and this is what i see:

https://i.imgur.com/YcBfP7R.png

dont mind my shaders down there..haha


Is there a screenshot somewhere to see how its supposed to look?

greetz

[Wolfberry]

ShowRenderSteps: Displays every shader pass in the OSD with the rendering time for each one. Can slow down the overall rendering time due to needing to flush the GPU and wait for the rendering to succeed after every shader pass but this effect is very minor in recent versions. Only active when the OSD is being displayed.


Create a empty folder named "ShowRenderSteps" in the madVR folder and you will get a more detailed OSD.

[madshi]

@madshi : no chance to undestand why madvr's HDR switching is so weak with amd cards ? and why it changes driver by driver even the SO manual switch works with all amd drivers.
If it changes driver by driver then it's *very* unlikely to be my fault. Complain to AMD, please, not to me... ;)

It probably wasn't expected to
No, it wasn't.

Congrats on your latest HDR conversion improvements, madshi. I think you really nailed it down with it, just looks fantastic. The new highlight detail reconstruction also really does wonders, without destroying too much.
Glad to hear you like it!

The images of UHD HDR movies look very very dark with the new madVR0.92.16 version,hardly see anything in 'process HDR content by using pixel shader math' mode on my TV set。On the contrary once when I choose the 'passthrough HDR content to the dispay' mode.the images go immediately very very clear.Wondering what's going on?
Is there currently a way to take advantage of madVR's tonemapping while also switching the display into it's HDR mode? I have an LG C7 and have been trying to compare the passthrough image output to madVR's tonemapping but only the "HDR to SDR" option results in a proper image, but also leaves the display in SDR mode which limits my peak brightness significantly. The "process HDR content by using pixel shader math" setting was what I expected would give me the results I'm looking for but it makes the image very red. I've included an album with some potato quality images below, final image is just using passthrough.

https://imgur.com/a/H8QpKjk
To be honest, I haven't really tested "process HDR content by using pixel shader math" in a long while, I didn't think (m)any users were using it. I'll check if I can reproduce the problem(s) here.

Is there a specific reason why you're not simply using "convert HDR content to SDR by using pixel shader math"? The "process" option has the potential problem that although madVR already did all of the tone mapping work, the TV might double process (= damage) it.

MADSHI, the AMD RX 23hz SDR saturation bug, as i'm not the only one is there anything at all you could suggest I could look at changing to help you diagnose this, do you have any idea what it might be or anything I could ask AMD to have a look at?
From what I remember, you said it only occured in very specific situations, e.g. using D3D11, but not when using D3D9 etc. So why don't you simply use settings that make the problem go away, like using D3D9? As I said before, it's *very* unlikely to be a bug in madVR. So I'm hesitant spending a lot of my precious development time on that, when I could use the same time to do other things.

It will be great if you could add the true GPU mode info in OSD for AMD GPUs as well.
Maybe, but not planned soon. I did it for Nvidia because I had to access the private Nvidia API for the new "report BT.2020 to display" option, anyway. Unfortunately AMD's private API doesn't support this "report BT.2020 to display" functionality, as a result I didn't have much motivation to spend several hours just to add some information to the OSD.

And in that info, is it possible to show IT Content Type/ Content Type reported to the display?
The Nvidia API is buggy there.

[suanm]

That's very weird. I've no idea what's causing it in your case cause I had an issue with HDR with the new nVidia driver (the 4xx driver) and going back to 399 works with v0.92.16 no problem.

I don't understand what results in so dark images with the new madVR0.92.16,either.Thank you all the same.Restart the old madVR0.92.14,All seems so normal as usual.
By the way I don't know if most of HDR fans here will have the same problem

[SamuriHL]

I don't understand what results in so dark images with the new madVR0.92.16,either.Thank you all the same.Restart the old madVR0.92.14,All seems so normal as usual.
By the way I don't know if most of HDR fans here will have the same problem

In my particular case, HDR would show on the TV as being active but in reality it wasn't. If I activated the Windows HDR/WCG setting before starting the player, then it'd play. This ended up being a driver issue with the new 4xx nVidia driver rather than an issue with madvr. Once I downgraded the driver back to 399 I've had no further issue with HDR in any of the madvr versions.

Is your image truly switching on HDR and is dark or is it not truly activating HDR?

[suanm]

@madshi
First of all thank you,master ,for your reply.
second My TV set has HDR feature. So i don't think i will use any feature of HDR conversion to SDR.The purpose of using the feature 'process HDR content by using pixel shader math' is to improve image quality of HDR movies.Thank you again,master

[suanm]

In my particular case, HDR would show on the TV as being active but in reality it wasn't. If I activated the Windows HDR/WCG setting before starting the player, then it'd play. This ended up being a driver issue with the new 4xx nVidia driver rather than an issue with madvr. Once I downgraded the driver back to 399 I've had no further issue with HDR in any of the madvr versions.

Is your image truly switching on HDR and is dark or is it not truly activating HDR?
Surely。the HDR feature is activated although the HDR image is so dark.I've installed 411.xx driver.but it doesn't work yet

[huhn]

The Nvidia API is buggy there.

bugged in term of not working at all or something like nonsense reports?

if it is not utterly broken and reports "something" i would like to test it on a couple of screen of cause only if you still have a version with it lying around.

[Chouonsoku]

Is there a specific reason why you're not simply using "convert HDR content to SDR by using pixel shader math"? The "process" option has the potential problem that although madVR already did all of the tone mapping work, the TV might double process (= damage) it.

It's like I said in my post, processing via HDR -> SDR means my TV stays in SDR mode which has a lower peak brightness than the HDR mode. It also means I have to change my SDR mode picture settings on the TV for the HDR content (Bt.2020) and then back again when I'm playing SDR content (Rec.709) instead of being able to have separate SDR and HDR picture modes like I do with the passthrough option. I could be understanding this wrong, but I had to change a lot of settings to make the HDR tonemapped to SDR image look right on playback compared to how I've had the settings for my SDR content.

What is the "send HDR metadata to display" box for in this mode, by the way? I kind of assumed it was meant to submit the "new" HDR metadata that madVR maybe generates from using it's tonemapping algorithm to the TV. A lot of this was just my assumption that this mode was to put the TV into HDR mode. I'll play with the SDR conversion method and putting Windows into HDR manually via display settings. My goal was essentially to replace LG's tonemapping method with the one in madVR for HDR display. I had not considered the TV might doing a second process like you describe.

madshi could maybe improve this. I know there is a new Panasonic Blu-ray player that gets along well with this setting with many displays. I have seen several examples where tone mapping the image before the display results in an image with more highlight detail with any display that clips too much at the top.

The tone mapping was optimized for HDR -> SDR, so I don't know if it was tested that much with a PQ output. You are probably compressing reference white (100 nits) too much at 400 nits. It would likely work better if you could find a higher value that only compresses the top of the curve to better match the bottom of the PQ curve enforced by the LG. Your display must be brighter than 400 nits in HDR mode.

Increasing the nits doesn't fix the super strong red hue, but they have to be that low to avoid the intense black crush that also happens with the HDR process setting. It was also set to 150 / 400 to make it easier to see the red problem in the photos.

[magic144]

Playing back 720p HD mkv, run into new issue since (including) madVR version 0.92.15 (WASN'T present with 0.92.14 and reverting still works).

When I engage vobsub (idx/sub) subtitles via XySubFilter in Zoom Player, video freezes though audio continues. I don't get any subs. In fact the freezing only occurs at the point when the next sub would have appeared. It's non recoverable - have to restart player to restart video.
VobSub filter still works.
Plain text (SRT) subs still work in either sub filter.

Using AMD RX460 with Adrenalin 18.9.2 (latest) driver. Output is direct HDMI to Samsung monitor, 1920x1080 resolution.

Sub filters previously installed (as pair) via ZP Install Centre - reported as 3.1.0.747 via that installer.
VSFilter.dll (VobSub) shows 3.0.0.306
XySubFilter.dll (XySubFilter) shows 3.1.0.747
LAV Decoders 0.72.0 (video using DXVA2 copy-back)
Zoom Player is MAX v14.4b1 (latest, ZP is a 32-bit app)

----

UPDATE: same issue occurs on different PC w/ same software setup, but with older AMD Radeon HD5670
(again, reverting to madVR 0.92.14 works)
UPDATE2 (2018-09-21): issue confirmed in BOTH full-screen and windowed playback
UPDATE3 (2018-09-23): issue confirmed using LAV in BOTH (none) and DXVA2 (copy-back) acceleration (or not) modes
UPDATE4 (2018-09-23): issue confirmed on laptop w/ same software setup, but uses Intel HD GPU

[mrmojo666]

@madshi, i'm not complaining with you, neither finger pointing. i'm just wondering if maybe it's possible to fine tuning something madvr side to make HDR auto switch more reliable.

[Sunset1982]

AMD guys, better stay away from driver 18.9.2! Can't use D3D11 10bit mode in madvr with latest 18.9.2. Reverted back to 18.8.2 and it works again.

[Klaus1189]

AMD guys, better stay away from driver 18.9.2! Can't use D3D11 10bit mode in madvr with latest 18.9.2. Reverted back to 18.8.2 and it works again.

Working fine here.

EDIT: What doesn't work for you exactly?

[Sunset1982]

Working fine here.

EDIT: What doesn't work for you exactly?


the 10bit windowed mode in D3D11... only works with 8bit with latest drivers

[Crimson Wolf]

@Sunset1982 Even with nvidia, windowed mode is 8bit "D3D11 windowed (8 bit)", but as soon as you full screen it, it turns into "D3D11 fullscreen windowed (10bit)". Is this not the expected behavior?

[aufkrawall]

For what it's worth: I still had the render queue not filling correctly issue with 0.92.16, it only worked in FSE. However, it seems to have disappeared after a Windows restart. Maybe you want to keep an eye out on this.

Edit: The CPU load with HDR pixel shader conversion is also a bit high, especially with highlight reconstruction.

[mrmojo666]

Wooowoo!! I've started to try all possible combinations of amd driver setting. And finally i managed to have back hdr autoswitch with 18.9.2. i have to set desktop at 12 bit. We will see with future drivers updates if it keep working.

As usual madshi was right.

https://preview.ibb.co/jHrF7K/IMG_20180921_141355.jpg (https://ibb.co/mxAmEz)

[iakoboss7]

do you know how to fix it?

this is a first for me (didnt even happen with v0.92.15 )

just installed v0.92.16 and for the first time ever in full screen i can see the windows taskbar. this has never ever happened before in the 3 years i use madvr with mpc-hc.

anyone facing the same problem?

ok after a restart it fixed itself!

[blu3wh0]

I'm probably going to continue using HDR pass-through as that seems the only way to utilize the higher brightness levels of my LG B7. HDR to SDR looks very good now for tone-mapping, but the brightness in SDR holds it back. I also utilize the dynamic tone-mapping on the TV to bring it closer to how it would look like in Dolby Vision. Are there any plans to add dynamic tone-mapping (if even possible) for HDR pixel processing to HDR output? Also, I didn't notice it in the profile variables, can display bitdepth output be added as a parameter? I'm currently using display refresh rate to decide between 8/10 bit output from madVR.

[Warner306]

Increasing the nits doesn't fix the super strong red hue, but they have to be that low to avoid the intense black crush that also happens with the HDR process setting. It was also set to 150 / 400 to make it easier to see the red problem in the photos.

It sounds bugged if you are getting crushed blacks at higher target nits. It should be the same.

Part of the problem is that madVR may send a value to the display that is supposed to be shown at an exact nits and the display's tone mapping curve may be designed to show the same PQ value at a different brightness. I'm not sure how the Panasonic "HDR Optimizer" gets around this. It only seems to impact the top of curve in the screenshots I've seen. I would think this feature would only work well for displays that closely follow the PQ curve and roll-off.

Edit: I looked at a review of the Panansonic pre-tone mapping feature that also used an LG C7 and it was tone mapping the result to a preset of 1,000 nits. So it was actually above the brightness of the display when the reviewer was glowing about its effectiveness.

I don't know how sending a signal with an altered brightness response is tone mapped by a display expecting a standard brightness response from a standard PQ source.

[mclingo]

AMD guys, better stay away from driver 18.9.2! Can't use D3D11 10bit mode in madvr with latest 18.9.2. Reverted back to 18.8.2 and it works again.

i've had all sorts of issues since the latest MADVR update, black screens HDMI loss mainly but also on occasion MADVR failing to load at all, I ended up going back to AMD 18.8.1 and MADVR v0.92.14

[Warner306]

i've had all sorts of issues since the latest MADVR update, black screens HDMI loss mainly but also on occasion MADVR failing to load at all, I ended up going back to AMD 18.8.1 and MADVR v0.92.14

You are still protesting a color change that was fixed by setting madVR to BT.2020? How exactly will this get this issue fixed?

I can’t understand why you are interested in this hobby when your PC breaks every month or so. I just play stuff almost every day and watch it. I don’t know why you seem to have so many issues.

You would have to narrow down the exact driver version and all of the exact settings to reproduce the issue and madshi would to have somehow reproduce the problem.

[Ver Greeneyes]

Hmm, on the latest madVR if I uncheck "use Direct3D 11 for presentation" and switch to non-FSE fullscreen mode, my screen flickers black. With D3D11 enabled everything is fine. That's on Windows 10 r1803 with a GeForce GTX 1080 and driver version 399.24 (heard people were having issues with the new 411 series so I haven't updated yet). I don't think v0.92.14 had this issue but I haven't checked yet.

[ashlar42]

madVR v0.92.15 releasedThanks madshi for your continued work on madVR. And thanks for reading 100 pages of comments. I can't imagine the nightmare it must have been.

[mclingo]

You are still protesting a color change that was fixed by setting madVR to BT.2020? How exactly will this get this issue fixed?

I can’t understand why you are interested in this hobby when your PC breaks every month or so. I just play stuff almost every day and watch it. I don’t know why you seem to have so many issues.

You would have to narrow down the exact driver version and all of the exact settings to reproduce the issue and madshi would to have somehow reproduce the problem.

EDIT - the colour sat issue which is fixed by calibrating for BT2020, no idea why this fixes it, that it does should tell whoever knows how MADVR and CALIBRATION works what is going on here, this is why its odd nobdy seems to be able to help with this.

watching movies is the hobby, how I get my machine stable isnt.

i've had some bad luck with hardware, i'm also pretty skint so everything I buy is used so that does lead to some extra issues.

However, if I just left my machine as is i'd have no issues as I have workarounds. Whenever a new driver or madvr release comes out I feel the need to test it to see if it cures either of my two issues which i've had for ages, the colour sat issue and the HDMI loss coming out of 3D movies.

You'd think simply rolling back would revert everything back to working again but this is rarely the case, I do usually manage to get back to working fairly quickly though.

I dont know what else I can give MADSHI to help with either issue to be honest, I've asked, perhaps if more people had the problem MADSHI could give it some time but it appears there is a small subset of people with similar hardware, setups and players.

I cant blame MADSHI for wanted to give both issues a low priority as there only seems to be me and maybe 1 or 2 other people with the colour sat issue, so few people play 3D MVC movies theses days this is an even smaller dwindling subset and so I doubt my black screen HDMI loss issue with ever be fixed.

Because i'm here a lot it probably seems like I have a lot of problems., I dont really, at the end of the day i have a fully working system and thoroughly enjoy using it on a daily basis.

[mrmarioman]

411.63 broke NV HDR for me. When starting an HDR video the TV flashes the HDR icon a few times but then returns to SDR mode. Went back to 399.24 and it's working again.
OS HDR still works with 411.63 though.

This is on Win10 1803, 1050Ti, LG Oled C8.

Anyone able to confirm the broken NV HDR with 411.63?

Same here with 411.63. The TV flashes the image in HDR for an instant, then goes back to SDR. But if I go full-screen the TV will go back to HDR mode. It seems that now it only works when the player is in full screen.
Another issue (but I think that's just me, my set up) is that the colors don't look right, they don't pop. That also happened before, but turning on and off HDR in madVR settings could fix it, now I can't figure it out :(

[mrmarioman]

Okay, just tried to play an HDR video enabling HDR in Windows, and with 'let madvr decide' option, and for the first time it works flawlessly! Must be something about the new Nvidia drivers, I think.