madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[thighhighs]

I'd like to get rid of the new "linear light" option for AdaptiveSharpen, so please everybody who uses/likes AdaptiveSharpen try the "linear light" option and let me know if you prefer it checked or unchecked.
I like new AdaptiveSharpen, i use it now :thanks:
I tested LL vs NO-LL, all sources SD upscaled to 1080p with NGU-AA, AR, NO-AB. My preferences is LL unchecked for anime, because sharpness looks more accurate overal, dark lines looks more thin and sometimes the image has less sharpened artifacts (rare). But for movies i prefer LL checked, because edges looks more natural for me.
Anyway, differences with low strength, like default 0.5, not too big for me.
p\s: sr for bad eng

[fluidz]

Has anybody seen playback issues, such as stuttering with MalwareBytes Ransomware protection enabled?

[Oguignant]

Hi, I have a couple of questions about creating a HDR 3LUT with Calman ... I apologize if it is not the appropriate forum!

- In Calman I must choose Colorspace: BT.2020 HDR & Gamma: ST 2084 HDR (PQ)?

- In madTPG there are a couple of options that I do not know to choose. What should I choose? My TV is LG OLED 2017, I think it has 1,000 nits.

https://i.imgur.com/KMBrZpih.png

[Oguignant]

the latest release v0.92.7 works HDR with the last driver of Nvidia?

[Neo-XP]

Interesting. Do you have a good screenshot for that?


Source / With LL / Without LL :

https://s1.postimg.org/6j2ruyubbv/Source.png (https://postimg.org/image/6j2ruyubbv/) https://s1.postimg.org/2ankl55cu3/With_LL.png (https://postimg.org/image/2ankl55cu3/) https://s1.postimg.org/7m2h5ur02j/Without_LL.png (https://postimg.org/image/7m2h5ur02j/)

The differences with LL on and off :

https://s1.postimg.org/9gqt3yaeff/Differences.png (https://postimg.org/image/9gqt3yaeff/)


So you consider strength 1 useful?


Yes, it already removes a lot of compression artifacts at strength 1 for me without the "don't reduce texture details" option checked. With the "don't reduce texture details" option checked, it does not do much.
At 2 it is too strong, it removes a little more compression artifacts, but smoothen the entire image, even with the "don't reduce texture details" option checked.


Hmmmm... I can't manage to reproduce your test results. The ugly artifacts on the chin are pretty much the same with RCA@2 for me, regardless of whether the option is enabled or disabled. I think your good looking screenshot must have had either a higher RCA setting, or a combination of RCA + RRN? Can you double check?


Yes, I double checked and the results are the same with the same image or others.

Source / Checked / Unchecked :

https://s1.postimg.org/52ywzqgcln/Source.png (https://postimg.org/image/52ywzqgcln/) https://s1.postimg.org/1ftdc7jp8r/Checked.png (https://postimg.org/image/1ftdc7jp8r/) https://s1.postimg.org/18q5gry6yj/Unchecked.png (https://postimg.org/image/18q5gry6yj/)

And the differences with the option on and off (the unprocessed artifacts) :

https://s1.postimg.org/5zxolp04cr/Differences.png (https://postimg.org/image/5zxolp04cr/)

Too bad this algorithm can not be used in a "set it and leave it" configuration (like the debanding one).
However, I think it would be very difficult to detect if the source really needs this algorithm before using it.

[austinminton]

I basically compared:

- Nvidia 10/12 bit, madVR 10 bit

to

- Nvidia full RGB 8 bit, madVR 8 bit


Perfect, thanks for your response. This is exactly the test I did as well. I just tried on RGB though. I would recommend looking in the tv settings as well, mine has something called smooth gradation which does ruin the grayscale.

Overall i prefer 12-bit in the nvidia panel with madvr at 10-bit.

[Werewolfy]

madVR v0.92.7 released


3) 1 doesn't do anything so it can be removed. But there's a BIG difference between strength 2 and 3. 2 does very little and 3 removes almost all the noise and a lot of details. Is it possible to have one or two steps between 2 and 3?

4) I find 1 pretty good actually. It removes a lot of compression artifacts without damaging the picture when "don't reduce texture detail" is unchecked. It's my new default setting for SD videos so please keep it.

5) I really don't like this new option. There's more compression artifacts and the details are not more well preserved.
Between strength 1 on and off, I prefer when it's off for the reasons mentioned above.
Between strength 1 without this option and 2 with it, I definitelty prefer 1 without it. The picture is less blurry.

[Blackwalker]

hi all, i'm new with MPC-HC and sorry for my english :D!

my HTPC:

I5 760 socket 1156
6 gb DDR ram 1600
motherboard ASUS P7H55D-M PRO
GPU EVGA 1050 FTW 2GB GDDR5
SSD 256 evo

my tv:
LG 65B6V

i always used mpc-hc+madvr but playing 4k video "the film goes to shots", "is not smooth"...
I mean:

- if i install and use Madvr i didnt see the 4k video go fluid, ....the video stops and starts again
- same using lav filters

I was looking for a guide to set correctly or if someone is so kind to tell me the correct settings to see a 4k HDR video on a 4k HDR tv!

what I have to set in with Madvr or lav filters? help pls :(

thx all :thanks:

[ryrynz]

"The next build will have a tweaked AdaptiveSharpen algorithm, which sharpens grain a bit less than the current build. Maybe you will like that version more? Please let me know...


It's much better! At low AS strengths it's hard to tell much of a difference between GL and LL, although as Neo-XP's screenshots have shown earlier GL becomes sharper the higher AS goes.
That ain't the only thing, lines are thinner too using GL. Will have to see if I prefer a lower setting with GL or a higher one with LL.

Love the don't reduce texture detail option, this with RCA at around 1 or 2 is an absolute must for most low res content. WIN!

Does anything think RCA 11 and 12 are actually worthwhile? It's like taking a fresh print and pouring water over it. Could those settings actually ever improve anything? :scared:
Also I reckon don't bother with using RCA on chroma unless you're using high strengths.. it seems to do basically nothing at lower values and seems kinda questionable overall, would be interested in seeing anything where this option actually makes a difference worth ticking it.


1) I'd like to get rid of the new "linear light" option


Actually I thought low strengths wouldn't make a difference but I've seen otherwise. Not impressed with what LL provides here, softer and noisier.
BTW, NGU sharp with low AS looks better IMO than using NGU standard with a 0.2 increase on AS for anyone that's interested in knowing what to decide here, finer details get the NGU treatment which really helps.
I think it's better to use a sharper scaler first and go from there if you require more sharpness.



2) Would be extra nice if you could also compare the new AdaptiveSharpen to the old one (v0.92.4 and older).


Slightly sharper in some areas and slightly softer in others, but visually looks rather similar to the 92.4 version, I'm happy with it, with this being the latest "corrected version" I'm for that recent code change bacondither added to AS, made a big difference even with low strengths.


3) "reduce random noise" has new strength levels from 1-12. The very lowest setting doesn't seem to do much, if anything at all. Does anybody find it useful?


Won't use it.


4) I've added a new lowest "reduce compression artifacts" strength, the other strength settings got moved up one. But to be honest, the new lowest strength 1 doesn't seem to do much, so I'm not sure if it's really useful. What do you think?


I like 1, please keep.


5)I think I'm going to switch to the "don't reduce texture detail" algo variant and remove the option in the next build, but wanted to give you the chance to compare first.

Switch away IMO. Thanks for the great enhancements, I miss these sorts of updates. My GTX 960 is hitting ~30ms with some profiles.. gonna need to update soon I think..

[leeperry]

Yes please keep the current RCA@1 and you can enforce "don't reduce texture detail" if you like because who would want to do that on purpose anyway?

:thanks:

[mzso]

Could it be possible that you download the 32bit PDB files instead of the 64bit ones? Just a wild guess. Maybe you could try 32bit MPC?


Same as before, unfortunately.

Nope. I checked. Hard to mix up since the filenames are different for 32bit.

I uploaded #12-13 (https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0ByfdfPvnoDuzWDUySEFpdUQ3aVk), but I can't say it looks different to before.

[Blackwalker]

hi all, i'm new with MPC-HC and sorry for my english :D!

my HTPC:

I5 760 socket 1156
6 gb DDR ram 1600
motherboard ASUS P7H55D-M PRO
GPU EVGA 1050 FTW 2GB GDDR5
SSD 256 evo

my tv:
LG 65B6V

i always used mpc-hc+madvr but playing 4k video "the film goes to shots", "is not smooth"...
I mean:

- if i install and use Madvr i didnt see the 4k video go fluid, ....the video stops and starts again
- same using lav filters

I was looking for a guide to set correctly or if someone is so kind to tell me the correct settings to see a 4k HDR video on a 4k HDR tv!

what I have to set in with Madvr or lav filters? help pls :(

thx all :thanks:

suggestions? :script:

[huhn]

can you make a screen of the madVR OSD (control + j).
can you check the Vram usages in a tool like GPU-z in playback.
did you select a hardware decoder in lavfilter?

and be patience this is not your personal support thread.

[Blackwalker]

can you make a screen of the madVR OSD (control + j).
can you check the Vram usages in a tool like GPU-z in playback.
did you select a hardware decoder in lavfilter?

and be patience this is not your personal support thread.

I never thought it, sorry.
when home i'll do a sceen of madvr OSD and all you suggest,
thx huhn :)

hummm....hardware decoder in lavfilter? you mean in the mpc-hc , video decoder?
i'ìll do a screenshot too.


Later and thx again

[rivera]

Dear madshi, thanks a lot for feedback!


50Hz mode being always marked as "active" seems *very* strange, no other user has reported this before. What happens if you change refresh rates through the OS display control panel instead of using the Nvidia control panel?
Double checked it - same result, 60Hz is selected in "Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Display\Screen Resolution\Monitor", 50Hz is marked as "active" in madVR settings.

Also, could you comment this issue too:One more mystery:
1. 59Hz mode is also present in Nvidia Control Panel, but is "missing" in "custom modes" window.
2. Open this mode, then press "Apply" button.
3. A message "the mode was successfully added" pops up.
4. But even after restarting the Windows this 59Hz mode is still "missing".

madVR 0.92.7
Win7x64
GTX 960 (Nvidia driver 387.92)
Panasonic PR65VT60
EDID:Monitor
Model name............... Panasonic-TV
Manufacturer............. Sony
Plug and Play ID......... SNY5203
Serial number............ n/a
Manufacture date......... 2013, ISO week 41
Filter driver............ None
-------------------------
EDID revision............ 1.3
Input signal type........ Digital
Color bit depth.......... Undefined
Display type............. RGB color
Screen size.............. 1280 x 720 mm (57.8 in)
Power management......... Not supported
Extension blocs.......... 1 (CEA-EXT)
-------------------------
DDC/CI................... Not supported

Color characteristics
Default color space...... Non-sRGB
Display gamma............ 2.20
Red chromaticity......... Rx 0.640 - Ry 0.345
Green chromaticity....... Gx 0.291 - Gy 0.635
Blue chromaticity........ Bx 0.163 - By 0.093
White point (default).... Wx 0.288 - Wy 0.296
Additional descriptors... None

Timing characteristics
Horizontal scan range.... 15-68kHz
Vertical scan range...... 23-61Hz
Video bandwidth.......... 150MHz
CVT standard............. Not supported
GTF standard............. Not supported
Additional descriptors... None
Preferred timing......... Yes
Native/preferred timing.. 1920x1080p at 50Hz (16:9)
Modeline............... "1920x1080" 148.500 1920 2448 2492 2640 1080 1084 1089 1125 +hsync +vsync
Detailed timing #1....... 1920x1080p at 60Hz (16:9)
Modeline............... "1920x1080" 148.500 1920 2008 2052 2200 1080 1084 1089 1125 +hsync +vsync

Standard timings supported
640 x 480p at 60Hz - IBM VGA

EIA/CEA-861 Information
Revision number.......... 3
IT underscan............. Supported
Basic audio.............. Supported
YCbCr 4:4:4.............. Supported
YCbCr 4:2:2.............. Supported
Native formats........... 4
Detailed timing #1....... 1920x1080i at 50Hz (16:9)
Modeline............... "1920x1080" 74.250 1920 2448 2492 2640 1080 1084 1094 1124 interlace +hsync +vsync
Detailed timing #2....... 1920x1080i at 60Hz (16:9)
Modeline............... "1920x1080" 74.250 1920 2008 2052 2200 1080 1084 1094 1124 interlace +hsync +vsync

CE video identifiers (VICs) - timing/formats supported
1920 x 1080p at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1) [Native]
1920 x 1080p at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1) [Native]
1920 x 1080i at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1920 x 1080i at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1920 x 1080p at 24Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1920 x 1080p at 25Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1920 x 1080p at 30Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1280 x 720p at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1280 x 720p at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
720 x 576p at 50Hz - EDTV (16:9, 64:45)
720 x 480p at 60Hz - EDTV (16:9, 32:27)
NB: NTSC refresh rate = (Hz*1000)/1001

CE audio data (formats supported)
LPCM 2-channel, 16-bit at 32/44/48 kHz

CE vendor specific data (VSDB)
IEEE registration number. 0x000C03
CEC physical address..... 1.1.0.0
Supports AI (ACP, ISRC).. Yes
Supports 48bpp........... No
Supports 36bpp........... Yes
Supports 30bpp........... Yes
Supports YCbCr 4:4:4..... Yes
Supports dual-link DVI... No
Maximum TMDS clock....... 190MHz
Audio/video latency (p).. n/a
Audio/video latency (i).. n/a
HDMI video capabilities.. Yes
EDID screen size......... Correct aspect ratio, but approximate size
3D structures supported.. Frame packing, Top-and-bottom, Side-by-side w. horizontal sub-sampling
3D formats supported..... Mandatory formats plus some primary VICs
1920 x 1080i at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1920 x 1080i at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1920 x 1080p at 24Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1280 x 720p at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
1280 x 720p at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)
NB: NTSC refresh rate = (Hz*1000)/1001
Data payload............. 030C001100B8262FC80A0141019C060800161800

CE video capability data
CE scan behavior......... Supports overscan and underscan
IT scan behavior......... Always underscanned
PT scan behavior......... Not supported
RGB quantization range... Selectable (via AVI YQ)
YCC quantization range... Not supported

CE colorimetry data
xvYCC709 support......... Yes
xvYCC601 support......... Yes
sYCC601 support.......... Yes
AdobeYCC601 support...... Yes
AdobeRGB support......... Yes
Metadata profile flags... 0x01

Report information
Date generated........... 16.10.2017
Software revision........ 2.90.0.1020
Data source.............. Real-time 0x0072
Operating system......... 6.1.7601.2.Service Pack 1

Raw data
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[Jtacdf]

I like the latest adaptive sharpen with 0.92.7. Previous two iterations was not usable imo with anime content as it always produce ringing and aliasing on the line art. It's now very refined to the point where it can be used.

I prefer linear light for sharpening to be unchecked. It seems to produce slightly softer and noisier result.

I cannot tell the difference from "don't reduce texture detail " on/off. If it does something better, I suggest to leave it on by default.

[clsid]

Fair enough. I could assume 85% of the file is video. But what's the next step? What exact bitrates should I treat as which quality level? The codec would need to be involved, but also the video resolution and framerate, chroma subsampling etc. And bitrate requirements don't scale linear with video resolution. So judging which bitrate is "high enough" for a specific quality level seems pretty hard to me.

Anyway willing to do the leg work? Which means create an exact "formula" which outputs a quality level, based on:

- codec
- resolution
- frame rate
- chroma subsampling
- bitrateHaving the estimated bitrate available as a parameter would be a start. You are right, estimating the quality level would require a considerable amount of feedback. So perhaps better to revisit this idea once the dust has settled and the new algos have been tested more thoroughly.

[asmo42]

madVR v0.92.7 released


1)
2)
I don't usually use sharpeners and just tried the new AS briefly.
3) "reduce random noise" has new strength levels from 1-12. The very lowest setting doesn't seem to do much, if anything at all. Does anybody find it useful? If nobody says he wants to keep it, I'll drop it in the next build. I think strength level 2 will probably be the best starting point?
I have to be honest I don't think I'll use this algorithm at all. As was discussed above it seem to either do almost nothing or massively blur the whole image. At least now what we have the RCA option which seem to take care of pretty much everything I don't see much use for this?
4) I've added a new lowest "reduce compression artifacts" strength, the other strength settings got moved up one. But to be honest, the new lowest strength 1 doesn't seem to do much, so I'm not sure if it's really useful. What do you think?
I personally probably won't use the 1 setting. If the video has such slight artifacts that 1 is enough I probably won't bother with it at all. For stuff where it really makes a huge difference like 1,5Mbit mp4 videos it seem to need strength 3-4. That said since others seem to use it I certainly wouldn't mind having it. If you want to reduce the number of settings I think removing the highest is a better option.

5) There's a new option called "don't reduce texture detail", which activates a slightly modified "reduce compression artifacts" algorithm. The original algo included some random noise reduction over the whole video frame. The modified algo tries to do noise reduction only near edges. The difference is not overly dramatic, though. Which option do you like more? I think I'm going to switch to the "don't reduce texture detail" algo variant and remove the option in the next build, but wanted to give you the chance to compare first.
My conclusion is that I generally prefer the old way i.e. the box unchecked. I don't see a huge difference in detail with it on or off. However it seems to get a lot less effective at removing artifacts. Honestly to me this option seem to almost work like a better less destructive version of RRN. So I find it useful and would be sad to see it go.

Overall very impressed with this new artifact removal! I mostly watch stuff that is of good enough quality that it won't be needed but it happens occasionally and it really works magic there. Only issue is that this really seem like an option you can't just set and forget or maybe even profile but needs to be adjusted on a per video basis.

Great work once again Madshi!

[oudo86]

I am currently using MadVR 32bit on Windows 10 64bit with Potplayer 64bit.

Should I be using the 64bit version of MadVR?

[mzso]

I am currently using MadVR 32bit on Windows 10 64bit with Potplayer 64bit.

Should I be using the 64bit version of MadVR?

You can't use 32 bit madVR with a 64 bit player, it's impossible.
MadVR includes both in one package. So If your player is using madVR it's using the appropriate version.

[oudo86]

You can't use 32 bit madVR with a 64 bit player, it's impossible.
MadVR includes both in one package. So If your player is using madVR it's using the appropriate version.

oh yes, of course. I don't know why I got so confused on that.

Thanks.

[omw2h]

I quite like the new updated AdaptiveSharpen, less ringing and less posterization as the old, grain not being as visible now and no fattening of dark lines.
Previous AS had less tolerance where the line is drawn witch is a good optiont to have in anime, did not crisper edges and the grain stayed where it belongs.

(as far as i have compared, i don't want to misrepresent)

Just different pros and cons for the end result... still wish for the previous one for anime though.

[JarrettH]

Are these new filters for poor sources or artifacts/blocking due to low bitrate? The development these last ~10 pages has been interesting, but I prefer just a touch of low debanding in place of potentially removing detail.

[ryrynz]

Not just poor quality sources, the vast majority of online/broadcast content out there benefit from these algorithms.



I cannot tell the difference from "don't reduce texture detail " on/off. If it does something better, I suggest to leave it on by default.

You need the right content.. I was looking at a 720 episode of The Orville and it was easily visible.

You're always going to lose detail when enabling these things, everyone has their own trade off limits. Don't think I'll ever use RCA over 2, but then I prefer high quality sources to start with.

[nevcairiel]

Not just poor quality sources, the vast majority of online/broadcast content out there benefit from these algorithms.

If a source benefits from compression artifact removal, isn't it then by default poor quality? :)

[ryrynz]

I suspect his definition of poor quality was lower quality than the content that would stand to gain benefits, but yes.. Cheeky.

[ryrynz]

BTW you haven't weighed in on RCA yet Nev..

[x7007]

When I use Dithering - Error Diffusion
Should I need to select Use Colored noise ? because I don't remember if when choosing Ordered DIthering then I need to deselect them or select them , also the change dither for every frame, but this gives more noise, is that helpful ?

[ryrynz]

Trust your eyes, it's all personal preference. Most tend not to select colored noise I believe, changing dither every frame is useful if you can see the pattern.

[Anima123]

While applying RCA with strength 1 on a good 720p source, I found that 'don't reduce texture detail' off is doing a better job than on. It seems that this option might be good for cartoon materials, but not good for real-life videos.

[x7007]

Trust your eyes, it's all personal preference. Most tend not to select colored noise I believe, changing dither every frame is useful if you can see the pattern.


I still can't see any differences between Error 1 and 2 , and also the other 2 options ... so I can't be sure. I don't know which scene I will see it clearly , if I had a movie or some part I could see the differences then it would be easy, but I don't even know what to look for.

[ryrynz]

Dithering expresses itself IMO as a kind of haze over the picture, certain panels and settings may expose some options to be more visible than others. This (https://wiki.mikejung.biz/Error_Diffusion_Dithering) may help you choose.

[huhn]

jpg and not even the same frame.

this "guide"...

[x7007]

Dithering expresses itself IMO as a kind of haze over the picture, certain panels and settings may expose some options to be more visible than others. This (https://wiki.mikejung.biz/Error_Diffusion_Dithering) may help you choose.
jpg and not even the same frame.
this "guide"...
What you guys choose for LG OLED55C6 ? I mean it's suppose to be one of the Error and my guess with the 2 options selected because the panel doesn't have any issues with those things, as my guess it shouldn't.

[kalston]

jpg and not even the same frame.

this "guide"...

Yeah I like the idea behind this wiki but the picture comparisons are ridiculous.

Just make keyboard shortcuts for different profiles with different settings in madvr, pause playback and then switch between them. Or take lossless screenshots so you can easily zoom in/ put them side by side.

[Blackwalker]

I never thought it, sorry.
when home i'll do a sceen of madvr OSD and all you suggest,
thx huhn :)

hummm....hardware decoder in lavfilter? you mean in the mpc-hc , video decoder?
i'ìll do a screenshot too.


Later and thx again


here some screenshots:

mpc-hc settings:

https://imgur.com/a/M3cXU
https://imgur.com/a/e6koI

madvr settings:

https://imgur.com/a/dY2xT
https://imgur.com/a/FuGXa
https://imgur.com/a/TEHOg
https://imgur.com/a/HCybZ
https://imgur.com/a/sBbxF
https://imgur.com/a/pi2tb
https://imgur.com/a/VXJi6
https://imgur.com/a/GNavv
https://imgur.com/a/K7PdV
https://imgur.com/a/zAMHd
https://imgur.com/a/zAMHd
https://imgur.com/a/IAmK2
https://imgur.com/a/h6xv4


Cpu and ram usage with DXVA Copy-back on lav filters:

https://imgur.com/a/zf2rC

Cpu ,ram usage and info with DXVA native on lav filters:

https://imgur.com/a/eL6OE
https://imgur.com/a/MU3Cz


GPU usage and info with DXVA Copy-back on lav filters:
https://imgur.com/a/I9YeN

GPU usage and info with DXVA native on lav filters:

https://imgur.com/a/82E1V


Sorry but i try to put link on "image" options with no success!

[ryrynz]

jpg and not even the same frame.

this "guide"...

Hey I said it might help, not that it was perfect :P

What you guys choose for LG OLED55C6 ?

Earth to Asmodian..

[madshi]

General support:

Thanks. I'm not using any 3rd party software like f.lux.

Here's the OSD screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/s2tMJWk.png

Edit: It might be a RAM-related issue. I noticed that RAM only ever increases while playing a video. That explains why restarting the video player fixes the problem temporarily. I'm not sure what to try next, though...

Edit2: Resetting madVR to default settings did seem to alleviate the issue (I was able to play a 20 minute video with no frame drops) but if the issue is RAM-related, then that may just be because the default settings are less RAM intensive.

Edit3: For chroma upscaling, I had been using Recon-soft with SuperRes 3. Turning off SuperRes seems to fix the issue -- I need to do more testing to see if this is a true fix or not.
RAM being an issue would explain why it only happens after a while of smooth playback. SuperRes doesn't sound to me as if it would explain higher RAM usage, though. Are we talking CPU RAM or GPU VRAM, btw?

JRiver latest 32-bit version. I haven't tried any other player yet (I have paid for it, so there shouldn't be any bug). :)
It's an important question to figure out if it's a bug in madVR or in the media player, because depending on that different developers are responsible for fixing the bug. I can't fix bugs in JRiver. So please try a different player. I don't want you to switch from JRiver to another player, but trying a different player is the best way to test if the bug is in madVR or in JRiver.

I have problems with "3D" profile rule as well.
The first "if" should already take care of 3D, so you don't have to do all those "and (not 3D)" in the other "if"s. But that is just superfluous, it shouldn't stop it from working. So it seems to me that the "3D" test doesn't actually work. Can anybody confirm that? madVR does show "3D" in the Ctrl+J OSD, right?

Madshi, what is the order of artifact removal algorithms, if over one single options have been used?

Well, as the order of them might have impacts on the final quality of the processed image sequences, will you plan to open the setting order selection for us, or you have a way to determine which order is optimal in most cases?
I don't think choosing the order is necessary/useful for you. First is reduce compression artifacts, then reduce random noise, then debanding, and last deringing.

Hi, I have a couple of questions about creating a HDR 3LUT with Calman ... I apologize if it is not the appropriate forum!

- In Calman I must choose Colorspace: BT.2020 HDR & Gamma: ST 2084 HDR (PQ)?

- In madTPG there are a couple of options that I do not know to choose. What should I choose? My TV is LG OLED 2017, I think it has 1,000 nits.
I don't know what to choose in Calman, please ask in the Calman support forum about that. The madTPG options define which metadata is sent to the display. I don't actually know which data you should ideally use their. Again, this is more a question for calibration experts, which I am not.

the latest release v0.92.7 works HDR with the last driver of Nvidia?
Reports suggest not, unfortunately. I'd choose an older Nvidia driver.

3) 1 doesn't do anything so it can be removed. But there's a BIG difference between strength 2 and 3. 2 does very little and 3 removes almost all the noise and a lot of details. Is it possible to have one or two steps between 2 and 3?
Yes, I suppose I can add a setting between 2 and 3.

i always used mpc-hc+madvr but playing 4k video "the film goes to shots", "is not smooth"...
According to your screenshots, the only way the decoder is fast enough is to use "DXVA native". Is playback not smooth that way, either? The madVR OSD (Ctrl+J) does seem to suggest that the queues are properly filled, so it should play smoothly?

Nope. I checked. Hard to mix up since the filenames are different for 32bit.

I uploaded #12-13 (https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0ByfdfPvnoDuzWDUySEFpdUQ3aVk), but I can't say it looks different to before.
Actually, #12-13 now contain information for MPC-HC, which is useful! Still no information for LAV yet, though. Maybe you can make that work somehow, too?

Double checked it - same result, 60Hz is selected in "Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Display\Screen Resolution\Monitor", 50Hz is marked as "active" in madVR settings.
Also, could you comment this issue too
My best guess right now is that madVR has your displays somehow confused. Probably madVR is working with a different display than the one you're actually using. Do you have a dual-monitor setup? If so, which mode are you using (mirror, clone, extend, etc)?

Having the estimated bitrate available as a parameter would be a start. You are right, estimating the quality level would require a considerable amount of feedback. So perhaps better to revisit this idea once the dust has settled and the new algos have been tested more thoroughly.
Ok, will add that to my to do list.

I am currently using MadVR 32bit on Windows 10 64bit with Potplayer 64bit.

Should I be using the 64bit version of MadVR?
You can either use 32bit madVR+Potplayer, or 64bit madVR+Potplayer. Both is possible, but you can't mix. Software HEVC decoding is faster in 64bit. Otherwise there's not too much difference, I think.

[madshi]

AdaptiveSharpen:

1) unchecked,with linear light it reduce Sharpen effect.
Yes, it does, but you can counter by setting sharpness higher. But you prefer it unchecked, anyway?

2) New AdaptiveSharpen better than the old one, the old did ahuge sharpen edges with visible artifacts, so i never used it, but the new one do enhance detail very nice and sharpen it with no visible ringing in the same time.
K, thanks.

I like new AdaptiveSharpen, i use it now :thanks:
I tested LL vs NO-LL, all sources SD upscaled to 1080p with NGU-AA, AR, NO-AB. My preferences is LL unchecked for anime, because sharpness looks more accurate overal, dark lines looks more thin and sometimes the image has less sharpened artifacts (rare). But for movies i prefer LL checked, because edges looks more natural for me.
Anyway, differences with low strength, like default 0.5, not too big for me.
Argh. I really wanted you guys to pick either LL or not LL, because I want to get rid of the option.

Source / With LL / Without LL
Thanks. The main difference I see is the strength of sharpening, though. LL seems noticeably softer than GL. What happens if you adjust the sharpening strength to make the sharpened images look as near to each other as possible. Do you then still prefer LL over GL?

It's much better! At low AS strengths it's hard to tell much of a difference between GL and LL, although as Neo-XP's screenshots have shown earlier GL becomes sharper the higher AS goes.
That ain't the only thing, lines are thinner too using GL. Will have to see if I prefer a lower setting with GL or a higher one with LL.
Yeah, that would be good to know.

Slightly sharper in some areas and slightly softer in others, but visually looks rather similar to the 92.4 version, I'm happy with it, with this being the latest "corrected version" I'm for that recent code change bacondither added to AS, made a big difference even with low strengths.
FWIW, the new version is from igv, not from bacondither.

I like the latest adaptive sharpen with 0.92.7. Previous two iterations was not usable imo with anime content as it always produce ringing and aliasing on the line art. It's now very refined to the point where it can be used.

I prefer linear light for sharpening to be unchecked. It seems to produce slightly softer and noisier result.
K, thanks.

I quite like the new updated AdaptiveSharpen, less ringing and less posterization as the old, grain not being as visible now and no fattening of dark lines.
Previous AS had less tolerance where the line is drawn witch is a good optiont to have in anime, did not crisper edges and the grain stayed where it belongs.

(as far as i have compared, i don't want to misrepresent)

Just different pros and cons for the end result... still wish for the previous one for anime though.
Just to be sure there are no misunderstandings: "the old" on is the one from v0.92.5+6, and "the previous one" is the one from v0.92.4? How much better do you still like the v0.92.4 version than the v0.92.7 version?

Conclusions:

First of all thanks for the detailed feedback, it's quite helpful!

Generally, it seems people prefer "linear light" unchecked for Anime content, but checked for filmed material? I'm not too happy with this distinction because I was hoping we could all agree on removing the "linear light" option and choosing a fixed value for it.

Would it maybe make sense to let you test a "half linear light" option which is right in the middle between linear light checked and unchecked? Maybe that would satisfy everyone?

[madshi]

Reduce compression artifacts:

5) as @Neo-XP notice, With the "don't reduce texture details" option checked, there are some compression artifacts left in the image that are not processed.
Yes, I've seen the same thing here. However, your example is a really extreme case and I found that adding some RRN seemed to fix the issue with this specific image.

it seem (don't reduce texture detail ) option save some texture detail in normal life content, and it give good result to the whole picture.
Yes, it sometimes helps preserving some texture detail.

Yes, it already removes a lot of compression artifacts at strength 1 for me without the "don't reduce texture details" option checked. With the "don't reduce texture details" option checked, it does not do much.
At 2 it is too strong, it removes a little more compression artifacts, but smoothen the entire image, even with the "don't reduce texture details" option checked.

Yes, I double checked and the results are the same with the same image or others.
Ok, of course we can't let Mila Kunis be uglified by compression artifacts!

4) I find 1 pretty good actually. It removes a lot of compression artifacts without damaging the picture when "don't reduce texture detail" is unchecked. It's my new default setting for SD videos so please keep it.

5) I really don't like this new option. There's more compression artifacts and the details are not more well preserved.
Between strength 1 on and off, I prefer when it's off for the reasons mentioned above.
Between strength 1 without this option and 2 with it, I definitelty prefer 1 without it. The picture is less blurry.
K, thanks.

Yes please keep the current RCA@1 and you can enforce "don't reduce texture detail" if you like because who would want to do that on purpose anyway?
The "don't reduce texture detail" option might not be properly named. That's what the option *tries* to do, but it also results in some compression artifacts not being reduced. So it has advantages and disadvantages.

Love the don't reduce texture detail option, this with RCA at around 1 or 2 is an absolute must for most low res content. WIN!
Switch away IMO.
I don't understand this one. First you seem to love the "don't reduce texture detail" option, then you say "switch away IMO". That seems to contradict each other?

Does anything think RCA 11 and 12 are actually worthwhile? It's like taking a fresh print and pouring water over it. Could those settings actually ever improve anything? :scared:
Try on these crazy images:

blockyMoon.png (http://madVR.com/doom9/stuff/blockyMoon.png), blockyVma.png (http://madVR.com/doom9/stuff/blockyVma.png)

Ok, so it's probably unlikely that whole videos are as blocky as that. So maybe RCA 11 + 12 will only be useful for VapourSynth/AviSynth guys to "fix" just a couple of frames.

I like 1, please keep.
Ok.

My conclusion is that I generally prefer the old way i.e. the box unchecked. I don't see a huge difference in detail with it on or off. However it seems to get a lot less effective at removing artifacts. Honestly to me this option seem to almost work like a better less destructive version of RRN. So I find it useful and would be sad to see it go.
K, thanks.

While applying RCA with strength 1 on a good 720p source, I found that 'don't reduce texture detail' off is doing a better job than on. It seems that this option might be good for cartoon materials, but not good for real-life videos.

Conclusions:

Once again thanks for the helpful feedback!

My impression is that strength 1 should stay, but pretty much everyone wants to use strength 1 with the option "don't reduce texture detail" *un*checked. That's fine.

At higher strengths, it seems some people like the "don't reduce texture detail" option, and some don't. That's really bad, though.

I'm sorry to say, but the option "don't reduce texture detail" is *not* going to stay, because it's not just a simple flag somewhere in the algorithm. It's basically a completely different algorithm. Same with all the various "strength" settings! And I don't have the resources to keep both algorithms available, at all the different strength settings, and then add a new quality/speed selector, as well.

So we need to come to a decision whether to have "don't reduce texture detail" enabled or disabled. *However*, I'm willing to compromise by turning "don't reduce texture detail" on or off, depending on the selected strength. So e.g. we could have it off for strength 1-3, and have it on for strengths 4-12, or something like that.

What do you guys think?

(As indicated above, strengths 11-12 might not be useful for madVR, but it will be useful for VapourSynth/AviSynth in the future, so I want to keep it.)

[huhn]

Sorry but i try to put link on "image" options with no success!

it's better this way a link for an image is perfect.

try to change the nvidia power setting to adaptive. nvidia control panel - manage 3D settings and try adaptive.

you can also check in GPU-Z if the PCIe speed is at least x16 2.(the question mark on the graphic card page) thsi may help with DXVA copyback.

your GPU-z screens shoots show that your Vram usages is close to 2GB in window mode if you get high rendertiems in fullscreen you can try to reduce the render queue to 6 and if you have to even to 4.

[Blackwalker]

According to your screenshots, the only way the decoder is fast enough is to use "DXVA native". Is playback not smooth that way, either? The madVR OSD (Ctrl+J) does seem to suggest that the queues are properly filled, so it should play smoothly?

it play better yes, but not so smoothly, maybe i have to ugrade cpu/motherboard and ram?


thx huhn:

it's better this way a link for an image is perfect.

try to change the nvidia power setting to adaptive. nvidia control panel - manage 3D settings and try adaptive.

you can also check in GPU-Z if the PCIe speed is at least x16 2.(the question mark on the graphic card page) thsi may help with DXVA copyback.

your GPU-z screens shoots show that your Vram usages is close to 2GB in window mode if you get high rendertiems in fullscreen you can try to reduce the render queue to 6 and if you have to even to 4.

thx a lot for your answer :):thanks::thanks::thanks:
i'll do more test later !!

[Q-the-STORM]

madshi's posts have become so long, they need titles, abstracts, results and acknowledgements...

[Werewolfy]

5) I'd like to add to my previous post that I was a little too much harsh with this new option. With low strengths it doesn't make sense to use it because it just misses some compression artifacts but with higher strengths it can be useful because it does help to retain some texture details that are otherwise blurred.

I'd suggest if you really want to remove the choice for this option to create low strength presets without it and high strength presets with it. If you think it's a good idea, let me know and I will do more.

Edit : your reply was not available when I began to post my reply. So I will do more tests based on that.

[mzso]

Actually, #12-13 now contain information for MPC-HC, which is useful! Still no information for LAV yet, though. Maybe you can make that work somehow, too?


Well, all I did was use the 32bit version...

Well, the last thing I can think of is to use external LAV. I managed to produce two hangs (https://drive.google.com/open?id=0ByfdfPvnoDuzWDUySEFpdUQ3aVk) (#14-15), which I added, but it was much harder now.

[ryrynz]

First you seem to love the "don't reduce texture detail" option, then you say "switch away IMO". That seems to contradict each other?


You said you were looking to remove the standard RCA version, so hence this is switching to the "not reduced texture detail" option as the default.


Ok, so it's probably unlikely that whole videos are as blocky as that. So maybe RCA 11 + 12 will only be useful for VapourSynth/AviSynth guys to "fix" just a couple of frames.



Using those strengths is more destructive than anything, trying to remove all block shapes when your entire frame is comprised of blocks I think is a bit foolish.

[omw2h]

AdaptiveSharpen:
Just to be sure there are no misunderstandings: "the old" on is the one from v0.92.5+6, and "the previous one" is the one from v0.92.4? How much better do you still like the v0.92.4 version than the v0.92.7 version?


Sorry, i did not catch the ambiguity. Just compared v0.92.7 to v0.92.4, old and previous are the same AS in v0.92.4 .
I find the new AS clearly better for movies and videos but worse for anime content of various quality. For that i wish the previous AS finds its way back. So how much better depends on the contenet.

[Dorohedoro]

Hi!

I'm having some serious horizontal tearing on the top of the screen (tv) but only if I choose a refresh rate over 60hz (72hz for example) is there any way to fix this? I have aero enabled (windows 7), maybe is my tv the one causing the problem?

Thanks in advance!

[gyulaipal]

Hello,

can MadVR be "forced" into thinking that a video is HDR (and apply the transfer function conversion accordingly)?

Maybe there is an (undocumented?) filename token, similarly as we can put the "primaries" and "matrix" tokens in the name to signal the BT2020 color space? These work nicely!

I have to route the video image through avisynth(plus) before I can project it on the screen. This is nicely working for SDR/Rec.709 but not for HDR.

Also, I am afraid avisynth(plus) can NOT pass the HDR MetaData to MadVR, so, detecting HDR based on MetaData seems to be impossible.

If there would be a way to "switch on" HDR->SDR conversion, it would save my life (I mean my projector's life :-)

Any help will be appreciated! :)

[xabregas]

You know what would be great? For Madvr to support audio rendering and some enthusiast start developing it by making it optimized for all the different audios out there. Im frustrated by having to change audio decoders and settings because the different audios are becoming worst every day.