madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[nijiko]

Long time no use madVR, recently updated to 90.21, and found there are many color noises over the screen. OS is XP, and AMD card. Bug?

[Telion]

madVR v0.90.21 released
madshi, just wondering: how come such seemingly not so big changes lead to almost doubling of the filter's file size?

[octal9]

MPC-HC nightly 1.7.10.234

*edit* to clarify, the sound continues playing it's just the video freezes up and the player becomes unresponsive.having similar problem with gtx 950 with latest nvidia drivers and latest versions of mpc-hc (same poor performance using latest mpc-be nightly) - using any nnedi3 settings causes dropped frames - is nvidia still bad at handling opencl as in the past?

[duedel]

https://i.imgur.com/E7PnBW2.png

I wonder why I'm dropping frames left and right with this configuration.
Footage is completely unwatchable, and I don't know why the performance takes such a hit, while my CPU and GPU aren't working to capacity.

Do you have an idea?

[mikecks]

MPC-HC Nightly 1.7.10.236 was made available on 06 June, try that? :). If you use the nightlies, might as well use the latest.

The freeze issue sounds like a driver problem, I would suggest just try using Super-XBR upscaling instead :), I believe it's a bit lighter on the GPU. You should balance the settings based on the content being played as well. Have you tried not using image doubling, and using:
Chroma upscaling:
super-xbr (sharpness: 150)
activate anti-ringing checked, activate SuperRes filter, strength 1

Image upscaling:
Jinc
activate anti-ringing filter, scale in sigmoidal light

(image downscaling have jinc, anti-ringing relaxed, scale in linear light, 25 percent anti-bloating)

Upscaling refinement:
SuperRes 1, linear light, anti-rining.

Under processing --> Image enhancements
thin edges (say, 2.5 strenth)
enhance detail (say, 1.5 strength)
AdaptiveSharpen at 1.0
anti-bloating at 25 percent
anti-ringing enabled.

I think you'll like that output. You can try playing around with the image enhancement stuff like different strength for enhance detail and thin edges. It isn't a solution to the issue of it crashing with NNEDI being used, but there are other options now that are much more GPU load friendly and produce excellent results, such as the settings I suggested.

Thanks for the advice, but I found the solution to my problem.

I was using nvidia cuvid in the lav filters. I switched this to DXVA (copy-back) and then I was able to use NNEDI3 correctly. The issue of my pc becoming an oven is another matter all together. Thanks all.

[XMonarchY]

Could someone please point me to a guide on how to calibrate for HDR modes using hardware controls and madVR? Is it even possible with i1Display Pro? This is for LG OLED55C6P TV. I also need to figure out how to enable 4:4:4 RGB direct pass-through mode (also known as PC Mode) for games. There IS Gaming Mode - is that the true 4:4:4 PC mode? Any info on this TV would be greatly appreciated!

[cyberscott]

[QUOTE=

I wonder why I'm dropping frames left and right with this configuration.
Footage is completely unwatchable, and I don't know why the performance takes such a hit, while my CPU and GPU aren't working to capacity.

Do you have an idea?[/QUOTE]
I've seen the exact thing with my 4K Samsung TV when playing video content at 60hz through madvr. My fix was simple, I simply set madvr to play at 59Hz and it worked perfectly.

[fedpul]

https://i.imgur.com/E7PnBW2.png

I wonder why I'm dropping frames left and right with this configuration.
Footage is completely unwatchable, and I don't know why the performance takes such a hit, while my CPU and GPU aren't working to capacity.

Do you have an idea?

Hi, your rendering time is above frame interval.

For 60Hz you need to be below 16.67ms.

[duedel]

I've seen the exact thing with my 4K Samsung TV when playing video content at 60hz through madvr. My fix was simple, I simply set madvr to play at 59Hz and it worked perfectly.

Thanks, didn't work for me sadly.

Hi, your rendering time is above frame interval.

For 60Hz you need to be below 16.67ms.

Yeah, looks like it. Time to fiddle with the madvr settings again, I guess ;)

[Asmodian]

I wonder why I'm dropping frames left and right with this configuration.
Footage is completely unwatchable, and I don't know why the performance takes such a hit, while my CPU and GPU aren't working to capacity.

Do you have an idea?

fedpul is correct. I would recommend targeting something even lower, like 14.5ms or less, for the average rendering stat.

Are you using ordered dithering? Random dithering is a tiny bit faster. You might need to turn off AR.

edit: maybe bicubic 125+AR instead of lanczos 3+AR for luma downscaling?

[burfadel]

Your GPU is basically working flat out, the GPU core load on the monitoring app on the right of the screen shows this. There are a lot of other settings that sap performance, you need to go through the processing, scaling algorithms, and rendering tabs and choose settings that are a little more appropriate for your needs.

[duedel]

fedpul is correct. I would recommend targeting something even lower, like 14.5ms or less, for the average rendering stat.

Are you using ordered dithering? Random dithering is a tiny bit faster. You might need to turn off AR.

edit: maybe bicubic 125+AR instead of lanczos 3+AR for luma downscaling?

I was now able to push rendering time down, it 's working now, thanks!

Your GPU is basically working flat out, the GPU core load on the monitoring app on the right of the screen shows this. There are a lot of other settings that sap performance, you need to go through the processing, scaling algorithms, and rendering tabs and choose settings that are a little more appropriate for your needs.

Yeah, I guess I've been a bit too relentless with my 960 :(

[Georgel]

Has anyone had the chance to try madVR with GTX 1080 and see if it works with most presets on high for 4K resolution?

[crazydane]

I upgraded my video card from a GTX 970 to a GTX 1070 (FE).

At the same time I did a clean install of Windows 10. Only other installed programs are:

Emby Theater (includes MadVR)
Chrome
VLC
Latest nVidia driver

After configuring Emby to use MadVR, and maxing out the quality settings (more or less), I get a VIDEO_SCHEDULER_INTERNAL_ERROR BSD as soon as I attempt to launch a title from within Emby Theater.

If I switch Emby over to use EVR+ for playback, there is no issue. VLC will also playback any title with no issue.

I didn't have this issue with my GTX 970 and MadVR, this only started with the GTX 1070.

I also tried switching to the Windows 10 slow ring preview, but it didn't make a difference either.

My source files are untouched BRD ripped to MKV that I'm bitstreaming to an AVR and then onto a 4k TV.

Like I said, it works perfectly if I switch Emby Theater to use the EVR+ player, and it also worked perfectly using MadVR with my GTX 970.

Any ideas?

[burfadel]

Probably a driver issue with the new GPU architecture.

[crazydane]

Well, that's what I thought. But the guys over on the nVidia GeForce forum are telling me they don't think it is a nVidia driver issue at all.

MadVR is the only app that gives me the BSD. Admittedly, I don't have much else installed to test with.

I suppose I can install some benchmarks like Heaven, Valley, Firestrike 3D,etc ,or Handbrake to see if I get the same error, but I suspect not and I'd rather keep the apps installed on this HTPC as lean as possible.

[aufkrawall]

Bsod should always be driver's fault, not application's.

[Werewolfy]

A sample would be useful, and maybe an easy way to reproduce the exact artifact you mean. E.g. first frame, with screenshots of how it looks with/without deringing on your PC. When I tried with your BMP/JPG, I couldn't really see much difference with deringing on/off, IIRC. The difference I saw here was much smaller than what your screenshots showed.


I uploaded a sample. On the 90.19 version this artifact happened a lot of time during all this sample but now (90.20 version) it happens at only one moment so it's already a big improvement. You can find this scene easily, I attached some pictures with the sample, just look at the timer.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/8dfoi1o3tud3c85/Deringing+artifact.rar

[crazydane]

Bsod should always be driver's fault, not application's.
Are there any logs or system events that I can gather and send to nVidia regarding this?

[fedpul]

Are there any logs or system events that I can gather and send to nVidia regarding this?
Hi, I think you can try checking Event Viewer, at least that is what I do in Windows 7 when I am checking strange behaviours. Hope it helps.

Enviado desde mi MI 4LTE mediante Tapatalk

[aufkrawall]

Are there any logs or system events that I can gather and send to nVidia regarding this?
Yes, in your Windows folder you should find a memory.dmp file which is a crash dump of the kernel (be sure Windows was able to write it completely).
I would report this in the Nvidia forums in the driver thread and upload the compressed (7z) dump on a fast sharehoster like Mega or Mediafire to link it.
You may need to bump this a few times to get a response and maybe they will ask you to upload it somewhere else because they blocked the chosen sharehoster etc...
Additionally, I'd also fill the driver bugreport form:
http://surveys.nvidia.com/index.jsp?pi=6e7ea6bb4a02641fa8f07694a40f8ac6

[Uoppi]

Does triple/double EXPANDED actually mean blacks extend lower (-) and whites extend higher (+), i.e. the range is expanded both in the bottom AND the top?

[Ver Greeneyes]

Does triple/double EXPANDED actually mean blacks extend lower (-) and whites extend higher (+), i.e. the range is expanded both in the bottom AND the top?
Yes. It just applies the 16-235 -> 0-255 expansion twice or three times (which is sometimes needed). For more fine-grained control, adjust "source black level" and "source white level" (they're not bound to any key combination by default, I used Ctrl+Alt+Shift+WASD).

[70MM]

Rendering question...
Does rendering speed change as a movie is playing?
I can see it changing from average stats of 10.86ms up to 27.80ms then it goes back down to 10.86ish.

The max stats always run a small amount higher than the average.

After 7 mins into the BD rip Im seeing 3 dropped frames and 4 presentation glitches.

[Uoppi]

Yes. It just applies the 16-235 -> 0-255 expansion twice or three times (which is sometimes needed). For more fine-grained control, adjust "source black level" and "source white level" (they're not bound to any key combination by default, I used Ctrl+Alt+Shift+WASD).

Thanks for the explanation!

So now I think I finally got it: using a positive value for the "whitelevel" tag together with an identical negative value for "blacklevel" does essentially the same thing as double/triple expansion, correct?

(Just asking because, like I wrote before, I need to use blacklevel and whitelevel tags to "simulate" double or triple expanded mode. Something in my setup prevents double/triple expanded mode from having any effect on black and white levels. The calibration on my setup is fine but I have a few washed out encodes that need finetuning via tags.)

[Ver Greeneyes]

So now I think I finally got it: using a positive value for the "whitelevel" tag together with an identical negative value for "blacklevel" does essentially the same thing as double/triple expansion, correct?Yes, though the adjustments are much smaller (I'm guessing -16 black level and +16 white level will match a single expansion).

Something in my setup prevents double/triple expanded mode from having any effect on black and white levels.Err, are you sure? You're pressing Ctrl+Alt+Shift+I until it says "source levels: TV - triple expanded" and it's not doing anything? That sounds really odd, and I'm not sure adjusting the black and white levels separately will work any better if that's the case.

Could it be the destination levels that are messed up? Ctrl+Alt+Shift+Y lets you switch between PC levels and TV levels. Or maybe something on another level is preventing it from sending anything below 16 or above 235 to your screen.

[TheElix]

What can be the cause of madVR not detecting HDR? I have the latest nightly of LAV filters installed and activated 0.68.1-14-git (checked in active filters). Internal MPC-HC filters are disabled. HDR processing is activated in madVR (version 0.90.21).
https://yadi.sk/i/pmku7EfqsdsoJ

[huhn]

there is no meta data. so either the file is broken or the data isn't delivered.

[TheElix]

there is no meta data. so either the file is broken or the data isn't delivered.
This isn't the case because I've tried files that were working before.

[huhn]

that's one of these broken LG files.

[TheElix]

that's one of these broken LG files.Okay, as I've said I tried files that were working before on my setup:

LifeUntouched_HDR1000_PQ_P3_4K.mp4
https://yadi.sk/i/ZsCtVkX9seEns

Life_of_ Pi_draft_Ultra-HD_HDR.mp4
https://yadi.sk/i/qtUNuA1XseEwY

[huhn]

what's the filter list?

NV12 is more than strange.

[TheElix]

what's the filter list?

NV12 is more than strange.Filter list: https://yadi.sk/i/d8CdjvfqseJp7
Thanks for helping. :)

Some madVR settings: https://yadi.sk/i/GqF_pYwNseLET

[huhn]

open a HDR file in MPC-HC that is not from LG and play it.

go to play -> filter -> click copy filters list to clip board.

paste it here please.

example:

Filters currently loaded:
- Default DirectSound Device
- madVR
- Audio Switcher
- LAV Video Decoder
- LAV Audio Decoder
- LAV Splitter Source (internal)

[TheElix]

open a HDR file in MPC-HC that is not from LG and play it.

go to play -> filter -> click copy filters list to clip board.

paste it here please.

example:

Filters currently loaded:
- Default DirectSound Device
- madVR
- Audio Switcher
- LAV Video Decoder
- LAV Audio Decoder
- LAV Splitter Source (internal)You question led me to try turning off ffdshow raw video filter. Now the problem is fixed.:thanks:

I think if I play a little bit here I'll be able to get it working correctly (for example, manually set output space: https://yadi.sk/i/s-1TM09pseQEX)

[huhn]

madVR is missing all meta data not only colorspace.

try it without ffdshow and any other filter..

[nevcairiel]

HDR will not work with any intermediate filter between LAV and madVR.

[adhara]

Hi guys,

I need your opinion about doing the good choice for a graphic card (I own a GTX 970).
I heard Geforce 1070/1080 are coming...

Is there any advantage moving to them (except for HEVC hw decoding) ?

1 - Due to HDMI 2.0 limitation, 2160p50 or 60 with RGB 444 at 10 bits is not possible
2 - Even if 10 bits option is available in the Nvidia Control Panel, this options seems working only for pro cards (quadro)

"Pro" cards is 10-bit OpenGL, however consumer cards can do 10-bit through Direct3D.

NVIDIA Geforce graphics cards have offered 10-bit per color out to a full screen Direct X surface since the Geforce 200 series GPUs. Due to the way most applications use traditional Windows API functions to create the application UI and viewport display, this method is not used for professional applications such as Adobe Premiere Pro and Adobe Photoshop. These programs use OpenGL 10-bit per color buffers which require an NVIDIA Quadro GPU with DisplayPort connector. A small number of monitors support 10-bit per color with Quadro graphics cards over DVI.

Looks like only ATI cards would produce a good 10 bits outptut.

You confirm these ?
From your point of view, what is the best and the bad between;

2160p60 - RGB 444 - 8 bpc
2160p60 - RGB 422 - 10 bpc
2160p60 - RGB 420 - 10 bpc


Maybe I should wait for the new ATI cards coming at the end of the month.
Is ATI do a better job than Nvidia for MadVr/Lav stuff ?

regards.

[Uoppi]

Yes, though the adjustments are much smaller (I'm guessing -16 black level and +16 white level will match a single expansion).

Yeah, my mistake initially was that I only corrected the black level and so the whites looked a little off.

Err, are you sure? You're pressing Ctrl+Alt+Shift+I until it says "source levels: TV - triple expanded" and it's not doing anything? That sounds really odd, and I'm not sure adjusting the black and white levels separately will work any better if that's the case.

Could it be the destination levels that are messed up? Ctrl+Alt+Shift+Y lets you switch between PC levels and TV levels. Or maybe something on another level is preventing it from sending anything below 16 or above 235 to your screen.

Definitely odd for sure, and madshi already commented on it also.

The modes can be changed but the range looks identical to the eye throughout all the toggle-able settings. I've also tried all sorts of configuration combinations (all full RGB in the chain, all limited, mixing full & limited etc.) The "blacklevel" tag does work however so I'm able to circumvent the issue.

Luckily, the black level is properly calibrated on my system so I only face problems if I need to make tweaks for some subpar encodes (though I'm not considering this much of an issue anymore because I can use the level tags to expand).

[Ver Greeneyes]

Is there any advantage moving to them (except for HEVC hw decoding) ?In games benchmarks, the cards seem to offer about a 70-80% speedup over their predecessors. Whether the same holds for madVR I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me.

2 - Even if 10 bits option is available in the Nvidia Control Panel, this options seems working only for pro cards (quadro)I don't think the control panel option matters. madVR can only do 10-bit output in fullscreen exclusive mode, but that should work just fine on these cards.

From your point of view, what is the best and the bad between;

2160p60 - RGB 444 - 8 bpc
2160p60 - RGB 422 - 10 bpc
2160p60 - RGB 420 - 10 bpcI'd take 8-bit color with madVR's dithering and no further processing over 10-bit color with half the chroma resolution - but I don't actually have a 10-bit color setup, so that's just looking at it on paper.

Maybe I should wait for the new ATI cards coming at the end of the month.As far as I know the AMD RX 480 is aiming for performance on par with the GTX 970 at a much lower price point. Their high end offerings will come later this year.

[adhara]

...
I'd take 8-bit color with madVR's dithering and no further processing over 10-bit color with half the chroma resolution - but I don't actually have a 10-bit color setup, so that's just looking at it on paper.


MadVr dithering should not have any effect if graphic card outptut is set to 8 bpc (the GC will downgrade the signal to 8 bpc before sending it to the display).
My display is 10 bpc compliant.

[huhn]

dithering is used to lower bit deep and madVR is working in high bit deep. of cause double processing should be avoided.

and "every" TV is 12 bit compliant.

[Ver Greeneyes]

MadVr dithering should not have any effect if graphic card outptut is set to 8 bpc (the GC will downgrade the signal to 8 bpc before sending it to the display).
My display is 10 bpc compliant.Dithering will make 8 bpc look almost as good as 10 bpc without dithering (of course, 10 bpc with dithering is even better), so you can have it output 8 bpc without losing too much in quality.

[janos666]

Dithering will make 8 bpc look almost as good as 10 bpc without dithering (of course, 10 bpc with dithering is even better), so you can have it output 8 bpc without losing too much in quality.

Actually, 8 bit with decent dithering usually looks notably better than 10 bit without dither (at least while observing 16 bit gradient test patterns), although there might be side effects materializing in noise/patterns (which is an undesirable distortion even if it's rarely if ever detectable on usual contents with naked eyes).

I personally preferred 10 bit without dithering because I am a PDP (especially 9G Kuro) fan and these displays use a huge amount of dithering internally (especially the Panasonics can show disturbing amount of noise artifacts but the Pioneers aren't 'perfect' either) and I never liked the idea of possible "noise interference". I assumed 10 bit should be sufficient for watching processed 8 bit sources. But I recently turned dithering back on after I downloaded some 10 bit HDR demos.

--

And think 0.90.21 has a bug with it's new HDR handling. Even standard old Blu-Ray movies (1080p24 Rec709 8-bit AVC) look different based on where I set the peak luminance dropdown menu and this change persists even after I untick the HDR processing checkbox. :scared:

Although, HDR demos really look better with the new settings. :D

So, I think madVR might try to handle legacy material as HDR even when the madVR OSD itself tells me it's reportedly a 8-bit Rec709 content with no HDR metadata.

[chros]

And think 0.90.21 has a bug with it's new HDR handling. Even standard old Blu-Ray movies (1080p24 Rec709 8-bit AVC) look different based on where I set the peak luminance dropdown menu and this change persists even after I untick the HDR processing checkbox. :scared:
Indeed, good finding! It's a bug.

[aufkrawall]

As far as I know the AMD RX 480 is aiming for performance on par with the GTX 970 at a much lower price point. Their high end offerings will come later this year.
There are some contradictory leaks about the RX 480 around.
I'd really not order something now, pure waste of money, no matter how fast the card will be. :)
Hopefully it will "heal" the market a bit.
The 1070 should be fast enough for 1080p super-xbr doubling + SR2/3 + deband & smooth motion. Really tempting if you got a 4k display, but the price is really hefty too and the drivers might be no fun either yet.

[Siso]

Indeed, good finding! It's a bug.

The bug is only happening with 0.90.21, right? Not with 0.90.20?

[huhn]

it was reported a lot in the past weeks.

set HDR peak to 400 to work around it.

[AndreaMG]

Houston, we have a problem(that's with .19 BTW):

http://thumbnails116.imagebam.com/48648/3c0d65486479708.jpg (http://www.imagebam.com/image/3c0d65486479708) http://thumbnails115.imagebam.com/48648/423fd3486479709.jpg (http://www.imagebam.com/image/423fd3486479709)

Seems boiling down to FS(whatever E or W) + SSIM 2D + black bars detection as either going 1D or disabling the latter works fine, here's a MKV sample (https://mega.nz/#!Xxx0gaYQ!fShBxbO0z3Xi2xGgWSwfmxIgpeOAtXWEFGDlix9h4n0).

So I captured a big .TS file off DVB-T2 and only this music video in the sample gave that first problem but once I enable doubling they all go bananas like this in FS: http://thumbnails116.imagebam.com/48649/440f09486480480.jpg (http://www.imagebam.com/image/440f09486480480)

:thanks:

PS: Oh and I wish I could get black bars to never ever appear not even for a few secs as I'm not watching a movie but simply rolling music videos in big .TS captured files, am I missing an option here? :o

I continue to have the same issue even in the latest rev v0.90.21 which was supposed to fix this

[chros]

it was reported a lot in the past weeks.
set HDR peak to 400 to work around it.
I don't think that this bug was mentioned here before (that HDR setting modifies SDR content as well).
The bug is only happening with 0.90.21, right? Not with 0.90.20?
Probably, (I'm back to 0.90.17 ; that was the version that I used for a long time), you can easily test it: playback a SDR content then switch between the minimum and maximum values under HDR. The effect would be clearly visible.