madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted) [Archive] - Page 1107

tp4tissue

13th March 2019, 00:22

You have the GPU not using "Optimal Power" in 3D Settings? Don't use FSE. Do you have a Gsync or Freesync display? Also make sure Windows 10's Focus Assist is completely disabled, including the other options on that config page, even though they don't seem like they would cause problems they do seem to.

Windowed Overlay is also something to try.

Sorry if you already tried those. :o

Do we have a table of On-Off features for optimal Madvr performance ?

So we WANT -optimal power- ?

and

DO NOT Want -focus assist-

Asmodian

13th March 2019, 00:41

No, we DO NOT want Optimal Power or Focus Assist, both cause hitching without the average rendering times being too high. :p

ryrynz

13th March 2019, 01:23

We should really get these basic and often posted troubleshooting answers stickied.. Could just create a registry file to make it easy for these to be set also.

tp4tissue

13th March 2019, 03:39

No, we DO NOT want Optimal Power or Focus Assist, both cause hitching without the average rendering times being too high. :p

GDI, so we want prefer maximum performance ?:scared:

We should really get these basic and often posted troubleshooting answers stickied.. Could just create a registry file to make it easy for these to be set also.

Or just u know, like the driver recommendation thread.

ryrynz

13th March 2019, 04:04

GDI, so we want prefer maximum performance ?:scared:

No, Adaptive is the preferred option.

Asmodian

13th March 2019, 05:15

I like adaptive myself, it clocks all the way down pretty fast, but not so fast as to ever disturb madVR. :)

However, anything besides Optimal Power works fine.

x7007

13th March 2019, 08:06

Is 419.17 bugged again with 10bit HDR ? it only uses 8 bit windowed mode and Full Screen does newest driver fix it ? 419.35 ?

madjock

13th March 2019, 10:09

Is 419.17 bugged again with 10bit HDR ? it only uses 8 bit windowed mode and Full Screen does newest driver fix it ? 419.35 ?

Looking back on your posts the majority seem to be about newer drivers and HDR.

If you do not need the newer drivers for Games etc. stay with whats working, and also drivers after 398.11 are sending the wrong HDR metadata either way.

https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1865444#post1865444

https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=176013

austinminton

13th March 2019, 10:22

I always run full screen exclusive on this system since it only has one display and watching is all I will be doing on it.

Not sure what you mean here, its a setting under rendering->general settings. You can enable it even when using multiple monitors. I had gone through the whole cycle of fresh windows, old/new versions of drivers/madvr/lav, adaptive power in nvidia, turning off game mode+focus assist etc etc. The only thing that fixed it for me was fullscreen exclusive mode. Been using it for about 6 months now without any significant issues.

austinminton

13th March 2019, 10:33

Is 419.17 bugged again with 10bit HDR ? it only uses 8 bit windowed mode and Full Screen does newest driver fix it ? 419.35 ?

Works fine for me on 419.35 (and 419.17). I use default color settings on nvidia cp. It goes into 8bit hdr if its 4k@60, otherwise goes into 12bit which I have confirmed with my receiver.

In fact everything related to bit depth is working well for me now. For normal 1080p23, 2160p23 files I get 12bit output and 4k@60 (for normal desktop usage) I get 8bit.

chros

13th March 2019, 10:37

Does the user snowknight have the vega 56 or 64 ?
I don't know, I couldn't find it.

austinminton

13th March 2019, 10:47

I tried also almost everything. Sometimes FSE works, sometimes not (I don't know why!)
![/U]

When you experience stuttering, press Ctrl+J to see if FSE is even enabled. Sometimes fse fails when I try to use other windows on my pc monitor and something is playing on the TV. As soon as FSE fails, the stuttering returns on my setup.

Nicog

13th March 2019, 11:08

When you experience stuttering, press Ctrl+J to see if FSE is even enabled. Sometimes fse fails when I try to use other windows on my pc monitor and something is playing on the TV. As soon as FSE fails, the stuttering returns on my setup.

Hi, thanks for your help but this I already checked - and impossible to miss it as I use a videoprojector (JVC X7900), which is really painful to use in FSE...

I tried also all what Asmodian suggested - without any success. But I just tried separatly - I have to try also all together.

austinminton

13th March 2019, 11:38

Yes I agree. Since it was an incremental process and FSE finally fixed it for me, I might be ignoring the other fixes that helped me resolve the problem. So here goes from memory, just to summarize on what I had to do for my 2080ti (after upgrading from a 1080).

Fresh Windows 1809, fully updated, with game mode and Focus assist off (including all focus assist settings off, not just the main one).
Nvidia latest (now 419.35), adaptive power, default color space (rgb full works too without stuttering). Using Freesync on my PC screen without issues on displayport. TV connected on hdmi.
Madvr even default settings needs FSE.
Lav dxva2 copyback
I also had to disable my onboard realtek audio in bios and uninstall its drivers, otherwise i was getting spikes in madvr processing occasionally.

Cant think of anything else really.

x7007

13th March 2019, 13:32

Works fine for me on 419.35 (and 419.17). I use default color settings on nvidia cp. It goes into 8bit hdr if its 4k@60, otherwise goes into 12bit which I have confirmed with my receiver.

In fact everything related to bit depth is working well for me now. For normal 1080p23, 2160p23 files I get 12bit output and 4k@60 (for normal desktop usage) I get 8bit.

ye I am talking about 4K60 . it doesn't go to 10 bit like it suppose . if I choose YcbCr 4:2:2 10 bit then it works fine without randomly white dots.

austinminton

13th March 2019, 14:21

4k60 RGB (or ycbcr 4:4:4) cant go to 10bit due to hdmi 2.0 bandwidth limitations. Not very sure if displayport can do it. White dots does sound like a cable issue?

madjock

13th March 2019, 14:30

4k60 RGB (or ycbcr 4:4:4) cant go to 10bit due to hdmi 2.0 bandwidth limitations. Not very sure if displayport can do it. White dots does sound like a cable issue?

4K60 4:4:4 runs at 17.82Gbps, but only with the default 8-bit BT.709 color. That’s the same color gamut as 720p and 1080i/p. The whole point of HDR is to increase color volume, which it can’t do unless there’s first an increased color gamut. That means stepping up to BT.2020, which in turn means 10- or 12-bit deep color. The HDMI 2.0 spec also calls for a minimum 10-bit color with BT.2020.

Here's how it stands...

Main + 2 sides;
(Remember it has to be under 18Gbps…)

4K 60 4:4:4 (no HDR) = 17.82Gbps

4K 30 4:4:4 10b-HDR (no 60fps) = 11.14Gbps

4K 60 4:2:2 10b-HDR (no 4:4:4) = 17.82Gbps

Main + 3 sides;

4K 60 4:4:4 10b-HDR = 22.28Gbps

Manni

13th March 2019, 15:37

4K60 4:4:4 runs at 17.82Gbps, but only with the default 8-bit BT.709 color. That’s the same color gamut as 720p and 1080i/p. The whole point of HDR is to increase color volume, which it can’t do unless there’s first an increased color gamut. That means stepping up to BT.2020, which in turn means 10- or 12-bit deep color. The HDMI 2.0 spec also calls for a minimum 10-bit color with BT.2020.

4K60p 4:4:4 can only run in 8bits, so 12bits isn't an option for that.

The HDMI 2.0 specs doesn't call for 10bits with BT2020. I send RGB 8bits with BT2020 without any problem. The gamut used doesn't have any effect on the bandwidth. Bit depth does.

For the content, UHD Bluray specs call for 10bits if PQ Gamma (and usually BT2020) is used, but that's a content spec, not a HDMI spec for playback.

MadVR can tonemap and dither 10bits BT2020 content to 8bits BT2020 without any added banding (at least when using pixel shader tonemapping, I have checked this using passthrough). It's perfectly valid to do so and it does limit the necessary bandwidth to a max of 300Mhz at 4K60p with no visible loss of picture quality if using the correct settings in GPU/madVR, which can be useful in some situations.

It also impacts performance, as processing 12bits takes more resources than processing 8bits.

12bits causes a lot of issues with nVidia recent drivers, especially with madVR custom refresh rates and NV HDR switching, so using 8bits can also help with that.

tp4tissue

13th March 2019, 15:47

I like adaptive myself, it clocks all the way down pretty fast, but not so fast as to ever disturb madVR. :)

However, anything besides Optimal Power works fine.

Does setting it in global vs application specific make a difference ?

clsid

13th March 2019, 16:05

Application specific overrides the global setting. But in most cases this value is not set in application specific settings. You can see with Nvidia Profile Inspector tool.

tp4tissue

13th March 2019, 17:35

4K60p 4:4:4 can only run in 8bits, so 12bits isn't an option for that.
-SNip snip snip_

Has anyone quality assessed 444 8bit vs 422 10/12bit , which is better visually

Assssuming they got 10/12bit working of course. :D

Is the extra chroma more worthwhile than the m0ar bits

I understand ideally, we'd have displayport w/ 444-12

Manni

13th March 2019, 17:47

Frankly the bandwidth is only an issue with 60p content, so as I don't care about Billy Lynn I'd rather have 444 12bits for all my 23p content (99.99% of what I watch).

Unfortunately there is a bug with the JVCs, at 4K RGB 444 12bits the colorspace is forced internally to YCC422, even at 30p and below. This messes levels (when using video levels) as it requires PC levels to work, and possibly some bad things happen to chroma behind madVR's back. That's why I'm using 8bits at the moment (along with issues with calibration in 12bits). Hopefully they will fix this.

Otherwise I'd rather use 444 12bits with all my 23p content and 444 8bits with 60p, given that the driver switches automatically, than limit all content to 422 and hobble madVR's chroma upscaling.

I'm sure others will have other preferences, for good reasons :)

All this will last until HDMI 2.1, but we'll probably have to wait a couple of years before we can upgrade the whole chain to that.

tp4tissue

13th March 2019, 21:39

Even when we get the ports, I bet they'll still screw up 10bit and we'll be stuck at 8..

hahahaha :D

Btw, manni, how are you setting up dispcal 3DLut to work with the Madvr HDR tonemapping mode, Or are you using the SDR lut.

Manni

13th March 2019, 22:36

Btw, manni, how are you setting up dispcal 3DLut to work with the Madvr HDR tonemapping mode, Or are you using the SDR lut.

I tonemap HDR with pixel shaders and use an SDR DCI-P3 baseline in the projector with a 3D LUT for that (P3 gamut, 2.2 power gamma target). Works great.

maxkill

13th March 2019, 23:14

I tonemap HDR with pixel shaders and use an SDR DCI-P3 baseline in the projector with a 3D LUT for that (P3 gamut, 2.2 power gamma target). Works great.
Give me your shader files please.

tp4tissue

14th March 2019, 01:18

I tonemap HDR with pixel shaders and use an SDR DCI-P3 baseline in the projector with a 3D LUT for that (P3 gamut, 2.2 power gamma target). Works great.

is this through hcfr or dispcal

Snowknight26

14th March 2019, 14:14

Does the user snowknight have the vega 56 or 64 ?
I don't know, I couldn't find it.

RX Vega 56.

tp4tissue

14th March 2019, 14:49

RX Vega 56.

Thx for nfo SnowK . :cool:

Manni

14th March 2019, 16:44

is this through hcfr or dispcal

At the moment it's a lightning LUT (101 points) generated in under 10 minutes by Calman Ultimate, as the projector is very linear and I get near reference results like this. When I need more, I will compare what I get with a larger LUT in Calman and in Lightspace (I own both).

But DisplayCAL should give very good results. In fact it gave me better results than Lightspace using the same profile created with Lightspace when I had issues with my rs500.

If DisplayCAL (well, Argyll) was able to support my BasiCColor Discus, I would happily use DisplayCAL to create my 3D LUTs. Florian definitely provides better support for madVR users than either of the other two companies. :)

I don't know about HCFR, I haven't used it in a long time as I don't think it supports the Discus either.

tp4tissue

14th March 2019, 17:26

Guys, If I choose 23hz RGB 12-bit output in nvidia.

Does that make madvr output levels in 0-4095 ?

huhn

14th March 2019, 17:54

as i said to you before this option currently has no effect on what madVR outputs.

12 bit is in general not on option maybe with DX13 maybe never.

nevcairiel

14th March 2019, 18:03

12 bit is in general not on option maybe with DX13 maybe never.

Introducing a new surface format doesn't really require anything. It could happen tomorrow. It would just need to be specified somewhere officially and implemented by the graphics drivers.
But since 12-bit content doesn't really exist, or game rendering would want it, its doubtful anyone cares.

huhn

14th March 2019, 18:46

isn't that a little bit different for presentation surfaces?

we need at least a windows update too didn't we?

nevcairiel

14th March 2019, 18:57

For optimal results, DWM would probably need to learn about it, not sure how dynamic it can use GPU compositing functions.

tp4tissue

15th March 2019, 15:03

Is there a way to switch to 12bit mode (nvidia) automatically when video launches ?

Mpchc seems to only change resolution and refresh

madjock

15th March 2019, 15:29

Is there a way to switch to 12bit mode (nvidia) automatically when video launches ?

Mpchc seems to only change resolution and refresh

The thing that works for me is using older drivers, creating a 23.976 custom resolution. Then select it and change it to 12bit, then it stays that way when the custom resolution is called up on Video start.

https://imgur.com/a/v0xjNNB

brazen1

15th March 2019, 15:41

Set 24Hz 12 bit in NCP. Then 60Hz 8 bit. When you play a 24Hz video, it will use 12 bit. If you use madVR to control refresh rates and resolution, it will auto switch desktop at 60Hz 8 bit and video at 24Hz 12 bit. Be aware the setting does not survive a reboot using any newer drivers. You have to reset it or use 385.28 which does retain the setting. 12 bit will most likely introduce banding and you are better off with 8 bit unless you have a rare true native 12 bit display. Most are 10 bit at best.

tp4tissue

15th March 2019, 16:28

The thing that works for me is using older drivers, creating a 23.976 custom resolution. Then select it and change it to 12bit, then it stays that way when the custom resolution is called up on Video start.

https://imgur.com/a/v0xjNNB

So, I'm on 417.71 right now. It won't even let me select 12 bit for the custom resolution I created. Is it limited by the TV ?

Because if I select the nvidia default 23hz 4k, it will let me switch between 8 bit and 12 bit rgb full

madjock

15th March 2019, 16:33

So, I'm on 417.71 right now. It won't even let me select 12 bit for the custom resolution I created. Is it limited by the TV ?

Because if I select the nvidia default 23hz 4k, it will let me switch between 8 bit and 12 bit rgb full

No its limited by the drivers mostly, I think I did get it working with other drivers, but due to HDR metadata issues with others, and these work for mostly everything and I don't play games, then its the best solution for me. (385.28).

Now what you actually get out of 12bit is another matter, but no banding that I can see on my setup.

Klaus1189

15th March 2019, 17:03

Because if I select the nvidia default 23hz 4k, it will let me switch between 8 bit and 12 bit rgb full

Do you use a HDMI 2.0 connection?

EDIT: Sorry I didn't got it that both are 23Hz.

Manni

15th March 2019, 18:27

So, I'm on 417.71 right now. It won't even let me select 12 bit for the custom resolution I created. Is it limited by the TV ?

Because if I select the nvidia default 23hz 4k, it will let me switch between 8 bit and 12 bit rgb full

You need to use CRU to create custom res that work at 12bits with recent drivers. Or use 385.28 if you want to use madVR's custom res at 8bits and 12bits.

fourbigkids

15th March 2019, 22:25

Hi all. I have just bought my first projector, 2018's JVC DLA X7900 (as it is known here in Australia). It is yet to be installed but, in the meantime, I am upgrading my HTPC and installing MPC-BE with MadVR to ensure the best video quality on what will now be a much larger screen than I am used to. I have thousands of DVDs and blu-rays that I have ripped to a NAS - so I have many video files in 480p, 576p, 720p and 1080p. The JVC has a kind of 'faux' 4K called e-shift, which, as I understand it offsets 2 1080p frames to make up 4K. Is it best to have MadVR just upscale the lower resolution files to 1080p, and possibly save on processing power (and heat/fan noise), leaving the frame doubling to the JVC or get MadVR to take all files to 4K. Whatever I do will need to be 'set and forget' as my wife is only interested in turning the system on and pressing play - not fiddling about. :-)

PC is Windows 10, Intel Core i5-8600, Gigabyte Z370N WIFI Motherboard, Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB DDR4-2666, with a Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2060 6GB Windforce OC Video Card.

Appreciate your advice. Cheers, Allan

XMonarchY

15th March 2019, 22:26

tp4tissue

16th March 2019, 00:04

ryrynz

16th March 2019, 01:17

You really did not need to quote his entire post. Since it was a simple answer you could've just said @fourbigkids and written your reply. Why are all ya'll so quote crazy?

fourbigkids

16th March 2019, 04:20

Hi @tp4tissue

As I understand it, you're suggesting that the JVC pixel shifting may be something we like or don't like depending on viewing distance (and probably screen size and throw distance I expect??). We'll be about 3m from a 96in screen and the throw distance is about 3.5m. Not big numbers. We'll have to check it out on installation. Thanks.

However, I am not sure I understand the bit about "downscaling 4K". 50% of our viewing comprises old movies, many from the 40's and 50's ripped from DVDs, so in 480p, 576p and 720p. What do you think I should be upscaling those to with MadVR? Or does it all depend on whether I like pixel shifting or not??

Cheers.

Allan

ryrynz

16th March 2019, 07:27

Hey Allen, since you're not displaying a true 4K video and the projector is also not displaying true 4K output, I think you'll find it's not worth the extra processing power to upscale large amounts with a demanding upscaler but you could quickly compare it and see how it looks. You may need to take screenshots to properly know what to look for. NGU standard and sharp should be your go to's depending on your sharpness set on the projector and done with post-processing within madVR.

RXP

16th March 2019, 10:31

Does anyone know if the LG C6 is fine for 12 bit output or should I just leave it at 8 or 10 bit?

jkauff

16th March 2019, 12:14

I am using the latest 419.35 drivers and in Windows 1607 there is no issue with remembering madVR-set custom resolution, but in Windows 1809, it stops working after a reboot, even though it seems as if it was saved (at least in madVR settings)... I have to delete it, reset GPU, re-create it, and reset GPU after every reboot...Many of us have got around that problem by using the CRU utility to create custom resolutions, then using madVR to optimize them. CRU apparently adds the custom settings at the OS level rather than the GPU level which protects them from driver-level changes.