BD Rebuilder Beta - Bug Reports Only

[Lathe]

Thanks guys for the answers. I still am as confused as hell, but I'm THINKING that there must be some 'flag' or something that needs to be set going from the MKV which does play properly at 4:3 to the BDMV folder, when it then will display as stretched to fill the screen. What I should do is try to run it through BDRB and see what it does...

[jdobbs]

Any idea on the 3:2 aspect ratio issue?That just means that no ratio was used during the VFR-->CFR reencode and 1:1 is assumed. No big deal, as the aspect information is kept separately (720x480=3:2). Pseudo-BD structures are meant only as an in-between, and they also aren't very efficiently encoded (translated --> near-lossless and very big) to be quicker. But I can add the ratio information to the VFR-->CFR encode easy enough.

I'm going to look at the timecodes more closely to see where the anomalies are.

[jdobbs]

That just means that no ratio was used during the VFR-->CFR reencode and 1:1 is assumed. No big deal, as the aspect information is kept separately (720x480=3:2). Pseudo-BD structures are meant only as an in-between, and they also aren't very efficiently encoded (translated --> near-lossless and very big) to be quicker. But I can add the ratio information to the VFR-->CFR encode easy enough.

I'm going to look at the timecodes more closely to see where the anomalies are.Well... it just get's weirder when you look at it. Since the original rate was 23.976 there should be a little less than 42 milliseconds between pictures. But it appears to alternate between 33-34ms interval for one picture, followed by a 50ms interval for the next. That would average out right... but I've never seen anything like that. Then the last two frames have an interval of 0ms. I had my code count the frames... and the total seems right.

[MrVideo]

Mediainfo reports a time of 1:24
VideoReDo reports 2532 frames of 1:24:14
And then there is:
DGMPGIndexFileNV15 DGIndexNV 2051 X32
c:\Program Files (x86)\dgavcdecnv\

e:\\VTS_02_1.track_224.m2v 45388328
[...]
SIZ 720 x 480
FPS 30000 / 1001
CODED 2028
PLAYBACK 2535
100.00% FILM
ORDER 1
That times out as well. 2028 coded frames is 23.976 fps, or 2028 x 1.25 = 2535, the 29.97 frame rate. The M2V file was created by using TSMuxer to demux the VOB file.

No idea why the timecodes are messed up with this file and the other six files from the other project. I'm guessing that if I tear apart other DVDs that I have, I will end up with the same timecode mess.

[jdobbs]

Mediainfo reports a time of 1:24
VideoReDo reports 2532 frames of 1:24:14
And then there is:
DGMPGIndexFileNV15 DGIndexNV 2051 X32
c:\Program Files (x86)\dgavcdecnv\

e:\\VTS_02_1.track_224.m2v 45388328
[...]
SIZ 720 x 480
FPS 30000 / 1001
CODED 2028
PLAYBACK 2535
100.00% FILM
ORDER 1
That times out as well. 2028 coded frames is 23.976 fps, or 2028 x 1.25 = 2535, the 29.97 frame rate. The M2V file was created by using TSMuxer to demux the VOB file.

No idea why the timecodes are messed up with this file and the other six files from the other project. I'm guessing that if I tear apart other DVDs that I have, I will end up with the same timecode mess.Well... after looking at the code and doing some testing, I can tell you that the timecodes aren't the only problem. My routine for handling 720x480/576 VFR conversion had some other issues as well. I'm working on it and will fix it for the next release.

[Mark_Venture]

Sure. What kind of audio are you using, AAC or AC3?

But... I'm not sure if it will keep the HDR, I'll have to check the code. I'm not sure I considered ALTERNATE when I added that code. It also has to use FFMPEG as the frame server (to keep HDR).
AC3 is preferred.

I have no problem changing settings

[MrVideo]

Well... after looking at the code and doing some testing, I can tell you that the timecodes aren't the only problem. My routine for handling 720x480/576 VFR conversion had some other issues as well. I'm working on it and will fix it for the next release.
Thanks for the update.

[jdobbs]

I've updated the first post of this thread with a link to the latest version of BD-RB (v0.60.03). Changes for this release:- Updated ALTERNATE encoding so that HDR
information is kept when encoding UHD
with HEVC settings.
- Fixed an error in which particularly odd
variable framerate sources might result
in incorrect framerates during import.
- Fixed an error in which conversion from
VFR to CFR of 720x480/576 sources during
import results in incorrect aspect ratio.
- Added HEVC/No resize ALTERNATE presets to
the default list for UHD output.
- Corrected the x: function in filtering so
it correctly finds and executes external
filters when ALTERNATE titles are added to
a batch filter via "Add multiple playlists
to queue".
- Fixed an error introduced in v0.60.02 that
forced AVISYNTH mode rather than FFMPEG
for frame serving when testing UHD backups.
- Other minor corrections and cosmetic fixes.

[Lathe]

I've updated the first post of this thread with a link to the latest version of BD-RB (v0.60.03). Changes for this release:- Updated ALTERNATE encoding so that HDR
information is kept when encoding UHD
with HEVC settings.
- Fixed an error in which particularly odd
variable framerate sources might result
in incorrect framerates during import.
- Fixed an error in which conversion from
VFR to CFR of 720x480/576 sources during
import results in incorrect aspect ratio.
- Added HEVC/No resize ALTERNATE presets to
the default list for UHD output.
- Corrected the x: function in filtering so
it correctly finds and executes external
filters when ALTERNATE titles are added to
a batch filter via "Add multiple playlists
to queue".
- Fixed an error introduced in v0.60.02 that
forced AVISYNTH mode rather than FFMPEG
for frame serving when testing UHD backups.
- Other minor corrections and cosmetic fixes.

Thank you! http://lathe-of-heaven.com/respect.gif

[MrVideo]

Changes for this release:- Fixed an error in which particularly odd
variable framerate sources might result
in incorrect framerates during import.
- Fixed an error in which conversion from
VFR to CFR of 720x480/576 sources during
import results in incorrect aspect ratio.

Using the same test file that I sent you resulted in one of the items being fixed. The VFR->CFR resulted in 23.976 fps, but the aspect ratio was still 3:2.

If VFR is forced off, the frame rate is still 19.181.

[jdobbs]

Using the same test file that I sent you resulted in one of the items being fixed. The VFR->CFR resulted in 23.976 fps, but the aspect ratio was still 3:2.

If VFR is forced off, the frame rate is still 19.181. Weird. I tested it with the source you sent me and it seemed to work fine, although it did do a VFR to CFR conversion. I actually force the aspect ratio in the VFR-CFR reencode... how could it still be 3:2???

I may have to rethink this thing for 720x480 sources with pulldown. I just imported a movie from a DVD, output it to an MKV and then tried importing the MKV. I got the same alternating timecode intervals in that one too. It must be related to the pulldown somehow -- though I can't see how the spacing would look like that???

I may have to look for that pattern, and assume pulldown. But first I need to do a little more research.

I'll let this one run and see if I can repeat the framerate issue.

[MrVideo]

Weird. I tested it with the source you sent me and it seemed to work fine, although it did do a VFR to CFR conversion. I actually force the aspect ratio in the VFR-CFR reencode... how could it still be 3:2???
I took the VOB file, used TSMuxer to create a TS file and ran that through the latest version. I then looked at the M2TS file with Media info. I played it with VLC and yep, 3:2.
I may have to look for that pattern, and assume pulldown. But first I need to do a little more research.
Mediainfo says that it is 2:3 pulldown. No need to look for it, since mediainfo provides that info.

[jdobbs]

I took the VOB file, used TSMuxer to create a TS file and ran that through the latest version. I then looked at the M2TS file with Media info. I played it with VLC and yep, 3:2.

Mediainfo says that it is 2:3 pulldown. No need to look for it, since mediainfo provides that info.Yeah... but MEDIAINFO is also telling me it is variable framerate. One doesn't necessarily exclude the other.

[MrVideo]

From what we have seen, these two values have been working out: frame rate (23.976) and scan order (2:3 pulldown). At least for the test video when VOB converted to TS. The other is frame rate (variable), original frame rate (23.976) and scan order (2:3 pulldown). It seems that a variable frame is a false positive, even when the timecodes are all over the place. It sends one down the wrong rabbit hole.

As a side note, one of the DVDFab produced MKV files also resulted in a 3:2 aspect ratio when a VFR->CFR was done on it.

Oh, and it all comes down to what you said... DVDs can't have variable frame rate videos. It must either be 29.97 or 23.976 w/ 2:3 pulldown, because analog TVs only support 29.97 interlace video. Of course, that is moot with today's digital monitors/TVs.

IMHO, it was stupid that we kept the 29.97 frame rate when converting to digital broadcasting. I do not think there is an analog TV that wouldn't have been able to handle true 30 fps interlace video. But, that is moot too. That ship has sailed.

[jdobbs]

I figured out the 19.181 fps thing. When you mux a stream with 2:3 pulldown into the pseudo BD structure with TSMUXER the framerate has to be set to 29.97, not 23.976. If pulldown results in a 23.976 framerate, then it is assumed the underlying progressive rate must be 19.181. Duh...

[Glarioo]

Mediainfo: vbv-maxrate=35000 / vbv-bufsize=30000
Isn't that too low for a mkv uhd output?
TWEAK_ALTERNATE=--vbv-maxrate 50000 --vbv-bufsize 50000 in BDREBUILDER.INI has no effect, it stays at 35000/30000.

[jdobbs]

Mediainfo: vbv-maxrate=35000 / vbv-bufsize=30000
Isn't that too low for a mkv uhd output?
TWEAK_ALTERNATE=--vbv-maxrate 50000 --vbv-bufsize 50000 in BDREBUILDER.INI has no effect, it stays at 35000/30000.Yeah, maybe, depending on the chosen bitrate. I did most of my testing using a CRF in the low 20's -- and it was plenty for that. I'll take a look at it.

[Glarioo]

Yeah, maybe, depending on the chosen bitrate. I did most of my testing using a CRF in the low 20's -- and it was plenty for that. I'll take a look at it.

Thanks.
I did not "choose" the bitrate, BD Rebuilder did that ;)
I chose Alternate Movie-Only output - MKV Container, HEVC, NO_RESIZE, Intact Audio. Constant Rate Factor Output (CRF) was set to 17.

[MrVideo]

I figured out the 19.181 fps thing. When you mux a stream with 2:3 pulldown into the pseudo BD structure with TSMUXER the framerate has to be set to 29.97, not 23.976. If pulldown results in a 23.976 framerate, then it is assumed the underlying progressive rate must be 19.181. Duh...
That is a good one. I did notice with the GUI that if you remove pulldown, it changes the framerate to 23.976. But if you unselect remove pulldown, it doesn't set the framerate back to 29.97. If I would have continued, I would have discovered the 19.181 thing. Nice find.

[jdobbs]

That is a good one. I did notice with the GUI that if you remove pulldown, it changes the framerate to 23.976. But if you unselect remove pulldown, it doesn't set the framerate back to 29.97. If I would have continued, I would have discovered the 19.181 thing. Nice find.Yeah, I noticed that in TSMUXERs GUI, if you check the delete pulldown box, and then uncheck it -- it doesn't set things back, and can even cause a buffer error during it's attempt to mux.

[MrVideo]

AIUI, work on TSMuxer is no longer being done, so that bug will never get fixed.

[jdobbs]

AIUI, work on TSMuxer is no longer being done, so that bug will never get fixed.Yeah. Luckily I don't use the GUI, so I can set the parameters myself.

[jdobbs]

I have updated the first post of this thread with a link to the latest release of BD-RB (v0.60.04). Changes for this release:- Corrected issues with file import of MPEG2
sources that contain 2:3 pulldown flags.
- Added IMPORT_NO_PULLDOWN as a new hidden
option. When set it will remove pulldown
flags from MPEG-2 sources during import of
files or DVDs.
- Added two new hidden options. UHD_MAXRATE
sets the maximum bitrate for UHD encodes
and UHD_VBV_BUFFER sets the buffer size.
See HIDDENOPTS.TXT for more information.
- Other minor corrections and cosmetic fixes.

[MrVideo]

Changes for this release:- Corrected issues with file import of MPEG2
sources that contain 2:3 pulldown flags.
- Added IMPORT_NO_PULLDOWN as a new hidden
option. When set it will remove pulldown
flags from MPEG-2 sources during import of
files or DVDs.
Great. Thanks.

[Glarioo]

I have updated the first post of this thread with a link to the latest release of BD-RB (v0.60.04). Changes for this release:
- Added two new hidden options. UHD_MAXRATE
sets the maximum bitrate for UHD encodes
and UHD_VBV_BUFFER sets the buffer size.
See HIDDENOPTS.TXT for more information.
- Other minor corrections and cosmetic fixes.[/code]

Thank you! I Will try it when I get home.

[jdobbs]

Thank you! I Will try it when I get home.I also changed the default for UHD to 50000/50000. There are two maximums listed for a 50GB UHD M2TS, the lower of the two is a maximum of 64Mbs for all streams in a single M2TS (audio/video/graphics). So 50Mbs leaves about 14Mbs for overhead/audio/graphics.

[MrVideo]

- Added IMPORT_NO_PULLDOWN as a new hidden
option. When set it will remove pulldown
flags from MPEG-2 sources during import of
files or DVDs.
Wouldn't a better description be:
removes pulldown flags during import of MPEG2/DVD, keeping the original 23.976 frame rate
The reason is that IVTC is not really being done. Doing IVTC implies that the 29.97 fps video is sent thru a filter, like AVISynth, to extract the 23.976 frames and recode those frames. Removing the 2:3 pulldown flags doesn't do any recoding, thereby keeping the original MPEG-2 quality.

Just a thought.

A side note: I started working on another project and discovered some material was marked as variable frame rate 29.97. And there was material that was marked as variable frame rate 23.976 w/ 2:3 pulldown. All on the same DVD. Can't seem to make up their minds. :D

[MrVideo]

After three DVD files were imported, I then did the backup. Only the third M2TS file was wrapped into an MKV file, the first two M2TS files were ignored. Why is that?

[Sharc]

Wouldn't a better description be:
removes pulldown flags during import of MPEG2/DVD, keeping the original 23.976 frame rate
The reason is that IVTC is not really being done. Doing IVTC implies that the 29.97 fps video is sent thru a filter, like AVISynth, to extract the 23.976 frames and recode those frames. Removing the 2:3 pulldown flags doesn't do any recoding, thereby keeping the original MPEG-2 quality.

Just a thought.

A side note: I started working on another project and discovered some material was marked as variable frame rate 29.97. And there was material that was marked as variable frame rate 23.976 w/ 2:3 pulldown. All on the same DVD. Can't seem to make up their minds. :D

IVTC applies to hard-telecined material only which is different from soft-telecining based on flags.

[jdobbs]

After three DVD files were imported, I then did the backup. Only the third M2TS file was wrapped into an MKV file, the first two M2TS files were ignored. Why is that?It does one at a time. You have to choose which playlist to output to MKV.

When you import more than one at a time, do this:

1. Import multiple files. It creates a pseudo-structure with multiple menu entries. Let it finish importing.

2. From the mode menu, select the ALTERNATE method to be used (output format)

3. Go to the "Batch" tab.

3. Right-click on the queue area.

4. Select "Add multiple playlists to Queue"

5. From the list, choose the playlist(s) you want to output in the format you selected in step 2.

6. Push the "Batch Backup" button.

That way you can create multiple MKVs. I've imported as many as a hundred in a batch (multiple seasons of as series, for example).

[Mark_Venture]

UHD... smaller file size that I thought...

Wow... First off A+ @jdobbs for adding UHD to MKV support.

I did a few with 60.02, 3 and 4... using Alt Movie Only, CRF=20, Encoder+better(fast), "MKV Container, HEVC, NO_RESIZE, Intact Audio"

With i8700k cpu, it takes anywhere from 7-9hrs depending on the movie. HDR flags remain intact per media info. Playing the files via SPMC 16.7.4 on my FireTV Cube with my Sony XBR 4K TV, the TV reports HDR and colors look right (good).

I'm surprised at the file size. Its smaller than I expected. For example, Valerian And the City of a Thousand Planets compressed from 70gig down to 13gig. (70gig was using MakeMKV to rip to MKV file without compression/etc.)

While I managed to watch a few other 4K converts I did, and they looked better than internet streaming (UHD via VUDU) of the same titles, Valerian just finished over night so I didn't get to watch it yet. I can't wait to get a chance to see how good it looks after compressing like this.

[jdobbs]

UHD... smaller file size that I thought...

Wow... First off A+ @jdobbs for adding UHD to MKV support.

I did a few with 60.02, 3 and 4... using Alt Movie Only, CRF=20, Encoder+better(fast), "MKV Container, HEVC, NO_RESIZE, Intact Audio"

With i8700k cpu, it takes anywhere from 7-9hrs depending on the movie. HDR flags remain intact per media info. Playing the files via SPMC 16.7.4 on my FireTV Cube with my Sony XBR 4K TV, the TV reports HDR and colors look right (good).

I'm surprised at the file size. Its smaller than I expected. For example, Valerian And the City of a Thousand Planets compressed from 70gig down to 13gig. (70gig was using MakeMKV to rip to MKV file without compression/etc.)

While I managed to watch a few other 4K converts I did, and they looked better than internet streaming (UHD via VUDU) of the same titles, Valerian just finished over night so I didn't get to watch it yet. I can't wait to get a chance to see how good it looks after compressing like this.Actually I was surprised in my testing also. The UHD with a fixed CRF was shrinking much smaller than I had expected. But the quality was outstanding. It's just one more example of how superior X265 is to most HEVC encoders. It also shows how much wasted space is used on the original UHD discs (probably just to make them harder to copy).

Now... if I can find a way to get past that annoying audio sync issue when using TSMUXER to create UHD-BDs, I'll feel better. Interestingly, the higher the bitrate used the worse the sync issue gets. If I output several UHD movies to a single UHD disc (low bitrate as a result of a CRF of 23 or so) it seems to sync ok. I have to believe the whole issue is related to some X265 setting, although I have failed to find it. If I create a UHD disc from an untouched HEVC file (original, not reencoded) the bitrate doesn't seem to matter and the mux via TSMUXER followed by my UHD corrections works perfectly.

[MrVideo]

That way you can create multiple MKVs.
Thanks for the how-to instructions.

[AmigaFuture]

I have 5 pieces of 720x480 16:9 MPEG-2 video that I've added to a Blu-ray. But, when played on my Samsung BD player, it believes that the videos are 4:3.

When did your hardware start developing human repetitive patterns of thought (Believe)?

[AmigaFuture]

Yes it will via "Import DVD".

No, it won't...since I reported about Stargate DVDs.. Twice.. But I haven't checked it yet with the newest update..

Update: I now see there have been 2 Updates released. Woohoo! I'll check them soon. Pardon the reply..

[jdobbs]

No, it won't...since I reported about Stargate DVDs.. Twice.. But I haven't checked it yet with the newest update..

Update: I now see there have been 2 Updates released. Woohoo! I'll check them soon. Pardon the reply..??? I've imported more DVDs than I can count and I've never had an issue. The MPEG2 issues that are fixed in recent updates are related to file imports.

[MrVideo]

When did your hardware start developing human repetitive patterns of thought (Believe)?
It is called A.I. :eek:

[AmigaFuture]

It is called A.I. :eek:

A.I., and not even "Big Blue" are close to being Human. A.I. is based on complex code that people feed it (Keyboard, USB, some kind of physical connection). It will never think for itself. A.I. is based on Computer code. Not any way around it. Unless you're thinking there is some kind of External Port to us other than the 3rd eye? Which would mean the "UnSeen" but sensed by many. Okay, but A.I. will never say it has Past-Lives knowledge until it starts to clone itself. Every A.I. is New even to every new programmed A.I. People aren't. Complex and very fun subject.

But for your joke.. I Git Yaz...Havin' Fun N'all. :)

[jdobbs]

I know, I know, I have to revisit the DVDs.. I'll get there.Then I'd appreciate it if you didn't post comments about DVD import not working -- like this:No, it won't...since I reported about Stargate DVDs.. Twice.....especially about a function that has been working correctly for years. If you had a problem, I'm guessing it is something related to those particular DVDs... although I don't recall your specific bug report.

In the meantime I have some clueless-noob over on VIDEOHELP posting a review lambasting BD-RB for not working correctly in outputting UHD-BDs -- even through I've posted very clearly in the logs and this thread that it still has issues (including the one he complained about) and is meant to be experimental. That's exactly why I didn't post any updates for so long -- and now I wish I hadn't. In fact, I now have to consider walking away from it again. It seems that no matter how clear I am -- people fail to read or understand. I should have just disabled it rather than try to get help looking at it (after a long period of banging my head against the wall alone).

When you are doing work for free, just to provide a service to others... you have the right to at least expect a little common courtesy and appreciation for your labors.

If I sound pissed... it's because I am.

[Ch3vr0n]

Well there's a solution to that. Pull the UHD code and go back to non-UHD version for the general user, and only build an UHD version for yourself until you find it working correctly. And if you link to that specific review, i'm sure there's plenty users here that will post a reply telling him that uhd support is experimental and BDRB works just fine.

[jdobbs]

Well there's a solution to that. Pull the UHD code and go back to non-UHD version for the general user, and only build an UHD version for yourself until you find it working correctly. And if you link to that specific review, i'm sure there's plenty users here that will post a reply telling him that uhd support is experimental and BDRB works just fine.If I do that it will likely never work. The whole reason for releasing it was so I could get other eyes looking at it. I think a year is long enough for me trying to figure it out alone.

I'm just going to disable UHD-BD output by default with a popup "no can do" message. I'll then add a hidden option that will enable it so I can get some help from those who are well informed. I'll keep the UHD ALTERNATE output enabled.

[gonca]

I'm just going to disable UHD-BD output by default with a popup "no can do" message. I'll then add a hidden option that will enable it so I can get some help from those who are well informed. I'll keep the UHD ALTERNATE output enabled.
How about a point form list of the problems you are encountering so some of us can test various settings on each item.
This might help since we can then focus on one item at a time
PS
Make the message actually say "NO CAN DO"

[gonca]

Ran a couple of quick tests on the UHD stuff
Imported a full disc with quick re-author
I also cut a 5 minute section (original disc) of the main M2TS and remuxed as MKV with MKVToolNix
I ran an Import on both of these and they play fine, although with a 10 second delay on the audio.
According to mediainfo both audio tracks have a 10 sec delay where the originals had 83 ms and 0
No encoding took place, so this 10 sec delay is being added in the remux (I could be wrong)

[MrVideo]

In the meantime I have some clueless-noob over on VIDEOHELP posting a review lambasting BD-RB for not working correctly in outputting UHD-BDs
Did you post over there, pointing out the error of his ways?

[MrVideo]

How about a point form list of the problems ...
What is a "point form list?"

[gonca]

What is a "point form list?"

a)
b)
etc, or
1)
2)
etc, or
---
---
etc

How is the DVD thing going?

[MrVideo]

a)
b)
etc, or
1)
2)
etc, or
---
---
etc
Must be a Canadian thing to call it that. :D

[gonca]

Just for MrVideo
https://www.google.com/search?q=point+form+list&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b

[MrVideo]

Just for MrVideo
https://www.google.com/search?q=point+form+list&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b
Never heard of lists of that type called that.

[Max1984]

I m try to UHD TO BD25 with menu encoding to.. menu /sub/video all fine. just sync in audio . plzz tell me best audio setting & how to fix it. thanx ..