BD Rebuilder Beta - Bug Reports Only

[jdobbs]

@MrVideo

I looked at the issue you reported about BD-RB performing a VFR reencode on non-VFR sources. If you have IMPORT_VFR_SCAN turned off (set to 0) -- the only way a scan will be performed is if MEDIAINFO reports the source's framerate as "Variable".

[Sharc]

@jdobbs
I reported a possible bug here (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1811223&postcount=26173). Could you already have a look whether this should be changed?

[jdobbs]

@jdobbs
I reported a possible bug here (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1811223&postcount=26173). Could you already have a look whether this should be changed?Can you send me a short clip that demonstrates the issue?

[Sharc]

Can you send me a short clip that demonstrates the issue?
Here a short 720x576i clip:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/6e2f8fyoo0q2syy/ULY2.zip

[worknstiff]

@ jdobbs; RE: Because it isn't compliant.

I just meant that in my case I was only re-sizing a 1080p MKV to a 720p MKV. The MKV was NEVER going to be used for a blue ray compilation It would be nice if the E-AC3 was just put aside untouched untill the 720p was created and then put back.

PS: The latest BD Rebuilder works great except for a few instances where the audio is detected after import as stereo for some reason. I just use eac3toGUI to covert it to AC3 and then run the MKV through BD Rebuilder for re-sizing.

[jdobbs]

Here a short 720x576i clip:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/6e2f8fyoo0q2syy/ULY2.zipGot it. Thanks.

[MrVideo]

Sorry... but allowing a non-compliant stream into a BD that BD-RB creates is just asking for trouble. I'm not going there.
That is very unfortunate. That now means I have to recode the audio and AC3 is not meant to be recoded. :(

[MrVideo]

@MrVideo

I looked at the issue you reported about BD-RB performing a VFR reencode on non-VFR sources. If you have IMPORT_VFR_SCAN turned off (set to 0) -- the only way a scan will be performed is if MEDIAINFO reports the source's framerate as "Variable".
Why doesn't no mean no?

I looked at the SD files with mediainfo and two of the four (on this particular disc) are indeed VFR. No idea why they encoded them that way, when a vast majority of the SD files are constant.

But, why did the process fail? And, why do they need to be changed to constant? If VFR is good enough for DVD, why isn't it good enough for BD? They played just fine on my Samsung player.

I had to use v20 in order to build a couple of discs.

[Lathe]

That is very unfortunate. That now means I have to recode the audio and AC3 is not meant to be recoded. :(

I don't know if this helps, but if you are concerned about 're-encoding' the track, couldn't you just convert it to some playable lossless format and mux that back in? That way wouldn't you retain the full quality of the original file?

[MrVideo]

I don't know if this helps, but if you are concerned about 're-encoding' the track, couldn't you just convert it to some playable lossless format and mux that back in? That way wouldn't you retain the full quality of the original file?
The only lossless format that BD allows is LPCM*. Right at this moment, I do not know of a lossless LPCM encoder (unless ffmpeg will do it).

*-Obviously there is Dolby TrueHD and DTS-MA, but those encoders are not free.

UPDATE: ffmpeg does indeed have a PCM audio option for doing Blu-ray PCM. But, as pointed out in the forum threads, LPCM is a bandwidth hog, leaving less room for video. That means less episodes per disc.

[Lathe]

The only lossless format that BD allows is LPCM*. Right at this moment, I do not know of a lossless LPCM encoder (unless ffmpeg will do it).

*-Obviously there is Dolby TrueHD and DTS-MA, but those encoders are not free.

UPDATE: ffmpeg does indeed have a PCM audio option for doing Blu-ray PCM. But, as pointed out in the forum threads, LPCM is a bandwidth hog, leaving less room for video. That means less episodes per disc.

UsEac3to does it. But yeah, if you are doing television episodes the size that it takes on the disc would kind of add up. I was thinking that you were just doing the odd film here and there. But, a bunch of episodes, well, you would have to use more discs and have fewer episodes per disc maybe. That's what I would do...

[MrVideo]

Either eac3to, or ffmpeg, will do the trick. UsEac3to is a GUI. CLI quicker for me. Keep in mind that I have cygwin installed, so doing command line stuff with my Zshell scripts, for me, is a lot faster.

I do not want to use any more than six discs per season, so that they will fit into the Blu-ray cases. I print my own artwork as well.

[Lathe]

Either eac3to, or ffmpeg, will do the trick. UsEac3to is a GUI. CLI quicker for me. Keep in mind that I have cygwin installed, so doing command line stuff with my Zshell scripts, for me, is a lot faster.

I do not want to use any more than six discs per season, so that they will fit into the Blu-ray cases. I print my own artwork as well.

Sounds like a good plan; I've also done a lot of myself :)

I'm trying to remember, I THINK I ordered just a few 7 or 8 disc cases special for when I was making up my own STAR TREK: TNG set. I think I did order a box of 6 disc cases which I would use more often, but for a couple of seasons where I wanted more of the episodes, I think I special ordered like 2 or 3 of the 7 or 8 disc cases.

Here is just one disc and cover where I arranged the artwork out of several hundred (at least) that I've done...

http://lathe-of-heaven.com/trektngcover.jpg

http://lathe-of-heaven.com/trektngdisc.jpg

[Sharc]

That is very unfortunate....(
Nope. It's a Godsend that BD-RB prevents users to include Blu-ray non-compliant stuff in a Blu-ray authored structure.

[MrVideo]

Nope. It's a Godsend that BD-RB prevents users to include Blu-ray non-compliant stuff in a Blu-ray authored structure.
The kinda problem is that the being compliant is for the average joe/jane. For those of us in forums like this, we usually know what our tech can, or cannot do. And if not, questions can be asked. Or one experiments.

Supplying a "I know this isn't compliant option" for those of us who know it will work is not really a bad thing. If making it disc non-compliant doesn't work for you, then leave the option at the default off setting (compliant).

But, it isn't my program.

That only leaves the VFR issue.

[MrVideo]

Here is just one disc and cover where I arranged the artwork out of several hundred (at least) that I've done...
You can download scanned/custom covers, and disc artwork, for free, or very cheap. If you would like to know where, PM me.

[jdobbs]

The kinda problem is that the being compliant is for the average joe/jane. Sure... that's fine when you're not the one who has to respond to 500 "BD-RB's output doesn't work" and "it creates non-compliant output" on forums all over the world. How about I write my software, and you write yours.

It doesn't, however, have to be compliant in the pseudo-bd folder. So I'll see what I can do to keep it intact when the output is to MKV or MP4 and save the reencoding step until a BD is being reencoded. That assumes that TSMUXER doesn't reject it, though (which it may very well do, I'll have to test it).

[MrVideo]

Sure... that's fine when you're not the one who has to respond to 500 "BD-RB's output doesn't work" and "it creates non-compliant output" on forums all over the world.
Which is why the default is to be compliant. The user has to force non-compliance via the fully explained hidden option.
How about I write my software, and you write yours.
I did write in the same posting that it is not my program.
It doesn't, however, have to be compliant in the pseudo-bd folder. So I'll see what I can do to keep it intact when the output is to MKV or MP4 and save the reencoding step until a BD is being reencoded. That assumes that TSMUXER doesn't reject it, though (which it may very well do, I'll have to test it).
I do not output to MKV/MP4. The Pseudo directory is always empty. I burn the BDMV/CERTIFICATE directories, which I burn right after the menus are created and before never running the Backup (I do not click on the Backup button).

TsMuxer likes the EAC3 audio stream just fine. It declares it to be no core, 0 kbps and 0 channels. But, mediainfo still shows the resultant M2TS file to have 6 channels of EAC3 audio.

[jdobbs]

Which is why the default is to be compliant. The user has to force non-compliance via the fully explained hidden option. You've obviously never worked in software development. It's never the user's fault -- especially when they are dragging your software through the dirt.

But I forgot... you are never wrong.
TsMuxer likes the EAC3 audio stream just fine. It declares it to be no core, 0 kbps and 0 channels. But, mediainfo still shows the resultant M2TS file to have 6 channels of EAC3 audio.Have you tried playing it? I seem to remember that nothing is there, but it's been a while.

[MrVideo]

You've obviously never worked in software development. It's never the user's fault -- especially when they are dragging your software through the dirt.
20+ years. Unix. I was the build engineer of the software and the person who wrote the installation scripts. I dealt with many a customer on the phone over the years. But, my dealings had to do with the installation. When it came to the actual day-to-day dealings with the operation of the software, that was handled by the customer support staff.
Have you tried playing it? I seem to remember that nothing is there, but it's been a while.
With VLC, which converts the DD+ into PCM to send over the S/PDIF connection. As indicated in a posting from another user, a Blu-ray S/PDIF connection to an amp will result in there being silence, as there is no core.

[Sharc]

Which is why the default is to be compliant. The user has to force non-compliance via the fully explained hidden option.

I did write in the same posting that it is not my program.

I do not output to MKV/MP4. The Pseudo directory is always empty. I burn the BDMV/CERTIFICATE directories, which I burn right after the menus are created and before never running the Backup (I do not click on the Backup button).

TsMuxer likes the EAC3 audio stream just fine. It declares it to be no core, 0 kbps and 0 channels. But, mediainfo still shows the resultant M2TS file to have 6 channels of EAC3 audio.
I wouldn't worry too much as your "doit" script (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1811711&postcount=46) will solve it all for you, right? :D

[Sharc]

@jdobbs
I noticed that a 24.00fps 1920x1080p source gets per default converted to 23.976 fps during file import, and the audio is slowed down accordingly. Couldn't it be left untouched at 24fps because it is Blu-Ray compliant? Not that the slight slowdown really matters, it just requires a re-encoding (video + audio) and prevents to burn the compliant IMPORT folder without re-encoding.
For Quick Play reauthoring the disc, the 24.00 fps is however kept intact.

This brings up a second question: How would an imported 25fps 1920x1080i source be processed? Would it also be framerate converted during import or left untouched as 25i, assuming I don't deinterlace it?
(When I find a 1920x1080i25 source I'll try out myself to see what happens).

[jdobbs]

@jdobbs
I noticed that a 24.00fps 1920x1080p source gets per default converted to 23.976 fps during file import, and the audio is slowed down accordingly. Couldn't it be left untouched at 24fps because it is Blu-Ray compliant? Not that the slight slowdown really matters, it just requires a re-encoding (video + audio) and prevents to burn the compliant IMPORT folder without re-encoding.
For Quick Play reauthoring the disc, the 24.00 fps is however kept intact.

This brings up a second question: How would an imported 25fps 1920x1080i source be processed? Would it also be framerate converted during import or left untouched as 25i, assuming I don't deinterlace it?
(When I find a 1920x1080i25 source I'll try out myself to see what happens).I'll look at that. I'd gotten a previous report that it was converted -- but I can't, for the life of me, remember doing that (or why I would do it). Getting old, I guess. I'll look at it and make sure it doesn't convert 24fps to 23.976fps for the next release.

25fps should import without conversion. I do, though, have a hidden option (IMPORT_PAL_TO_FILM) that will convert it to 23.976 for non-PAL countries and for sources that were originally film -- but I know that one also adjust the audio.

[Sharc]

Thank you. No rush! When (almost) all problems are solved people become a bit nit-picking, right? ;)

[MrVideo]

I wouldn't worry too much as your "doit" script (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1811711&postcount=46) will solve it all for you, right? :D
It is a script for only doing video recoding. No audio work is done with it.

I have other scripts for doing audio work.

[MrVideo]

I do, though, have a hidden option (IMPORT_PAL_TO_FILM) that will convert it to 23.976 for non-PAL countries and for sources that were originally film -- but I know that one also adjust the audio.
As we all know, PAL doesn't exist anymore (it is an analog format). That said, whenever I look for a new monitor, I have to double-check the specs to make sure it supports ALL of the frame rates and resolutions (not including 4K). For some dumb reason, some manufactures that import some models into the U.S. tend to not include the 25/50 frame rate sizes. Something they do not do with overseas models. Dumber still because the Blu-ray players do not have that limitation. At least my Samsung players do not.

A long tradition with display manufactures that just won't go away.

[MrVideo]

(When I find a 1920x1080i25 source I'll try out myself to see what happens).
I can provide a sample from a Doctor Who Blu-ray release. I get all of the U.K. Doctor Who releases, as I prefer the original frame rate.

What I've never understood is why the Blu-ray group never included 25p as a frame rate. It is only 1fps away from 24p, which is supported. It was very illogical.

[Lathe]

You can download scanned/custom covers, and disc artwork, for free, or very cheap. If you would like to know where, PM me.

Thanks kindly mate! Yeah, I've done hundreds of searches when I'm looking to put together some covers or disc art, and I've found a number of excellent sites where people come up with some good stuff. Some times I use theirs untouched, especially the disc art, but many times, especially for multiple box series like STAR TREK: TNG or the James Bond series, I kind of want the box art to look consistently a certain way and then create a template.

[Lathe]

Sure... that's fine when you're not the one who has to respond to 500 "BD-RB's output doesn't work" and "it creates non-compliant output" on forums all over the world. How about I write my software, and you write yours.

It doesn't, however, have to be compliant in the pseudo-bd folder. So I'll see what I can do to keep it intact when the output is to MKV or MP4 and save the reencoding step until a BD is being reencoded. That assumes that TSMUXER doesn't reject it, though (which it may very well do, I'll have to test it).

That's really nice of you to think about doing that considering the oddity of the occurrence... when I try to play MKV files with Eac3 files in them, my OPPO shows Dolby+ on the screen, but I don't hear anything. But, as Dr. V pointed out, that is I guess because the 'core' has been removed, similar to how MKVMerge handles TrueHD which has been muxed into MKV files.

[MrVideo]

Some times I use theirs untouched, especially the disc art, but many times, especially for multiple box series like STAR TREK: TNG or the James Bond series, I kind of want the box art to look consistently a certain way and then create a template.
In the case of ST:TNG, the artwork that has been released is for all seven seasons. For pretty much any TV series, either scanned artwork, or custom artwork, can be found. For further discussion, let's move this to a PM conversation.

[MrVideo]

when I try to play MKV files with Eac3 files in them, my OPPO shows Dolby+ on the screen, but I don't hear anything. But, as Dr. V pointed out, that is I guess because the 'core' has been removed.
As I've posted above, that is only part of the issue. The other is that using a S/PDIF/coax connection to the amp requires a core, as that connection only supports the core bitrates. No core, no audio.

[MrVideo]

But yeah, if you are doing television episodes the size that it takes on the disc would kind of add up.
As a test, I converted an EAC3 file to LPCM. The audio file was 10x larger, taking the 4GB file to 6GB. That basically means that I would only be able to fit two files in the space of three, if the audio were AC3/EAC3.

For me, that is unrealistic. For a 24 episode season, that means at least four episodes a disc. But, at 6GB an episode, that takes up more space than the disc contains.

Hence the reason for trying to keep the EAC3 file, if at all possible.

[Lathe]

In the case of ST:TNG, the artwork that has been released is for all seven seasons. For pretty much any TV series, either scanned artwork, or custom artwork, can be found. For further discussion, let's move this to a PM conversation.

No, that's okay; as I mentioned, I've already made (at least) several hundred cases / discs over the last several years, so I pretty much can find plenty of whatever I need, but thanks though...

[Sharc]

I can provide a sample from a Doctor Who Blu-ray release. I get all of the U.K. Doctor Who releases, as I prefer the original frame rate.
Thanks, but I could run a test with a sample from my home videocam which has a setting for 1920x1080i25. BD-RB imports this correctly as 25i. So the conversion issue seems to exist only for 24.00fps import footage.

[Mark_Venture]

Will BD-Rebuilder encode fail if a file can't be read from the source bluray?

Example: Ripping Minions 3D, the ripper fails on a .SSIF file when ripping the disc to folder on HD, or ISO file. However, if I fire up BD-REbuilder, set Alt-MovieOnly-MKV and point it to the Bluray drive as the source, it completes processing fine.

Should I expect the output MKV to be ok?

[Sharc]

Will BD-Rebuilder encode fail if a file can't be read from the source bluray?

Example: Ripping Minions 3D, the ripper fails on a .SSIF file when ripping the disc to folder on HD, or ISO file. However, if I fire up BD-REbuilder, set Alt-MovieOnly-MKV and point it to the Bluray drive as the source, it completes processing fine.

Should I expect the output MKV to be ok?
I assume you are encoding to 3D SBS format, right?
Even though BD-RB completes without error it could still be that the encode shows some glitches if something failed during the source decoding process. You would have to check the final result carefully.

[jdobbs]

Will BD-Rebuilder encode fail if a file can't be read from the source bluray?

Example: Ripping Minions 3D, the ripper fails on a .SSIF file when ripping the disc to folder on HD, or ISO file. However, if I fire up BD-REbuilder, set Alt-MovieOnly-MKV and point it to the Bluray drive as the source, it completes processing fine.

Should I expect the output MKV to be ok?If it's a multipart source, it's possible that some of the segments (for a playlist that is never referenced, for example) may have errors purposefully. But you'd think the ripper would catch that.

[bryrabknowles]

Out of curiosity, how does BDRebuilder choose where to split files? Is there some sort of scene change detection that keeps it from cutting in the middle of a scene and potentially (albeit very slightly) reducing compression efficiency?

[jdobbs]

Out of curiosity, how does BDRebuilder choose where to split files? Is there some sort of scene change detection that keeps it from cutting in the middle of a scene and potentially (albeit very slightly) reducing compression efficiency?I assume you mean when multiprocessing is enabled. A BD contains information as to where a reasonable percentage of the I-frames in a stream are located (it's used for chapter skipping, fast forwarding, etc.). All scenes begin on an I frame. BD-RB uses that information to choose a split point that starts on an I-frame and is nearest a location that evenly distributes the encoding between the multiple encode processes. When you are doing a backup, all scenes and chapter points, etc, are maintained from the original authoring.

[AmigaFuture]

Hey...!



........................................http://lathe-of-heaven.com/I Fart in Your General Direction.gif

NIIIIIIIIIICCCEEEEE quote!!! *Slaps you on the back!!* Attaboy!! *Gives big hug!*

[AmigaFuture]

I stole 'em. You're not the only one with social issues.

Sorry, but no. Did I say I would? If so, I think I lost the bubble on it.

Haaaahaaaahaa!! Before I looked at the next reply, I was thinking the same way, JD!

[Lathe]

niiiiiiiiiiccceeeee quote!!! *slaps you on the back!!* attaboy!! *gives big hug!*

. :)

[Sharc]

Making a Full backup of a disc with 1 Feature and 2 Extras (all VC-1).
I selected "Quicker Encode for Extras". Nevertheless Extra 1 was encoded 2-pass i.e. same as the Feature. Extra 2 was encoded 1-pass CRF (as expected).
Is this possibly a bug?
Perhaps to add that Extra 1 was quite large (14.4GB), Extra 2 was 1.5 GB, the feature was 26.4GB.
In the .ini I set the option "QUICK_USE_QUALITY=1", but I would have assumed that this affects only the encoder quality settings but not the mode which should still be 1-pass CRF for all Extras.

Secondly: Since v0.50.24 the .log is no longer written (or updated) to the HD. Is there as setting for this which I missed?

[Lathe]

Making a Full backup of a disc with 1 Feature and 2 Extras (all VC-1).
I selected "Quicker Encode for Extras". Nevertheless Extra 1 was encoded 2-pass i.e. same as the Feature. Extra 2 was encoded 1-pass CRF (as expected).
Is this possibly a bug?
Perhaps to add that Extra 1 was quite large (14.4GB), Extra 2 was 1.5 GB, the feature was 26.4GB.
In the .ini I set the option "QUICK_USE_QUALITY=1", but I would have assumed that this affects only the encoder quality settings but not the mode which should still be 1-pass CRF for all Extras.

Secondly: Since v0.50.24 the .log is no longer written (or updated) to the HD. Is there as setting for this which I missed?

Yeah, I've had that happen a number of times when any of the Xtras are somewhat large. don't have a solution though, sorry...

[bryrabknowles]

Are there any plans for conversion to DTS be added in the future, or are there reasons that dcaenc isn't implemented into BDRB? Usually I externally convert DD+ to DTS with LameXP before importing to BDRB, which on Full Disc reencodes then requires a MultiAVCHD reauthor beforehand. Would be nice to skip the extra steps if possible.

[jdobbs]

Are there any plans for conversion to DTS be added in the future, or are there reasons that dcaenc isn't implemented into BDRB? Usually I externally convert DD+ to DTS with LameXP before importing to BDRB, which on Full Disc reencodes then requires a MultiAVCHD reauthor beforehand. Would be nice to skip the extra steps if possible.
LameXP outputs DTS? What encoder does it use?

[bryrabknowles]

LameXP outputs DTS? What encoder does it use?

It uses dcaenc.

[jdobbs]

Making a Full backup of a disc with 1 Feature and 2 Extras (all VC-1).
I selected "Quicker Encode for Extras". Nevertheless Extra 1 was encoded 2-pass i.e. same as the Feature. Extra 2 was encoded 1-pass CRF (as expected).
Is this possibly a bug?
Perhaps to add that Extra 1 was quite large (14.4GB), Extra 2 was 1.5 GB, the feature was 26.4GB.
In the .ini I set the option "QUICK_USE_QUALITY=1", but I would have assumed that this affects only the encoder quality settings but not the mode which should still be 1-pass CRF for all Extras.

Secondly: Since v0.50.24 the .log is no longer written (or updated) to the HD. Is there as setting for this which I missed?There's really no definitive way for BD-RB to definitively identify which is the feature when there are multiple large playlists. It just makes an educated guess.

Not writing to the log file? I'll have to check that. There've been no changes to that code in ages.

[bryrabknowles]

I don't think I ever explained my other question very well.

BDRB stops Multiprocessing from being used on smaller files during a Full Disc Reencode.

When using Multiprocessing, I find that I get better results if I lower the number of threads used. For Multiprocess=12, I set Threads=1.

This works great for the main feature.

The problem I run into is when BDRB processes the smaller files on the disc that default back to only 1 process, the program still uses Threads=1. I was hoping you might include a fix for this in hidden options so that BDRB knows to use a different number of threads for those files.

For Multiprocess=0, the program would use the number of threads defined in Threads=y
For Multiprocess=x>0, the program would use the number of threads defined in Threads_MP=y

[Lathe]

There's really no definitive way for BD-RB to definitively identify which is the feature when there are multiple large playlists. It just makes an educated guess.

Not writing to the log file? I'll have to check that. There've been no changes to that code in ages.

This kind of ties in with what I had written about a few pages ago. Do you suppose it would be a big task for you to include a 'simple' tab in the menu where one COULD indeed indicate (maybe from a drop down list) which playlist is the 'main movie' file and which are the Xtras? That would be awesome, because in the uncommon case that I was mentioning before, I was extracting from a series disc (UFO) the last bonus disc, where in this case, one of the Xtras was larger than the one episode on the disc.

Do you think it would be workable to have a place in the menu 'simply' to select which is which so BDRB will 'know'...?