CoreCodec/H.264 Codec "CoreAVC"

[emmel]

Are you using the Haali splitter? or another third party one?

I was able to do some verification with a more powerful computer and found out that some other filters seem to play the interlaced content corretly.

To me it seems that if only simple vui timing info is available, and if there is a sequence of fields followed by a sequence of frames (even if they are correctly marked in the sei), they all get played with the same number of ticks/field = ticks/frame. I'm not an expert here, this is just a guess, but it at least seems like that when watching the output.

Anyways, I was able to solve the problem by running the output through Avisynth with a fixed fps=25, or by adding an additional dshow frame rate converted between the CoreAVC and renderer. The output is then 100% perfect.

emmel

ps. I'll add for reference a more detailed description of the timing info (by h264_parse):

- For field based sequences::
ref 0 type 6 SEI
payload_type: 1 pic_timing
payload_size: 1 0x14
pict_struct: 1
clock_timestamp_flag[0]: 0

ref 0 type 6 SEI
payload_type: 1 pic_timing
payload_size: 1 0x24
string is "$"
pict_struct: 2
clock_timestamp_flag[0]: 0

-For frame based sequences:
ref 0 type 6 SEI
payload_type: 1 pic_timing
payload_size: 1 0x32
string is "2"
pict_struct: 3
clock_timestamp_flag[0]: 0
clock_timestamp_flag[1]: 0

-Vui timing info:
timing_info_present_flag: 1
num_units_in_tick: 1
time_scale: 50
fixed_frame_scale: 1

[Revgen]

@BetaBoy

I just bought your decoder and the speed is great. I was able to encode a 1280x720@60FPS (Basketball game) .ts file with X264 using just about all the b-frame settings,High Profile, CABAC, 0:0 deblocking, 6 subme, and everything else at defaults and play it back smoothly on my AMD 4600+ Dual Core.

Unfortunately I'm experiencing graphical errors when playing with Zoom Player. When I first start playing the video it plays upside down and the colorspace is screwed up. However, after the video is done playing and Zoom Player restarts it automaticaly again, it looks fine. Fortunately, the video is only 11 secs and it ends and restarts pretty quickly. This wouldn't be good for longer videos.


You can download the file at http://rapidshare.de/files/18504471/luke.mkv.html

[emmel]

Managed to craete a small sample for the interlacing problem:

http://rapidshare.de/files/18508978/hdf.mp4.html

The first 5 secs of the clip play badly, the last 5 secs play well.

[Revgen]

Don't you mean "decode" ;)

No I meant "encode". Just how I wrote it. I was describing the clip that I encoded for playback purposes. Read the paragraph again.

[BetaBoy]

@BetaBoy

I just bought your decoder and the speed is great. I was able to encode a 1280x720@60FPS (Basketball game) .ts file with X264 using just about all the b-frame settings,High Profile, CABAC, 0:0 deblocking, 6 subme, and everything else at defaults and play it back smoothly on my AMD 4600+ Dual Core.

Unfortunately I'm experiencing graphical errors when playing with Zoom Player. When I first start playing the video it plays upside down and the colorspace is screwed up. However, after the video is done playing and Zoom Player restarts it automaticaly again, it looks fine. Fortunately, the video is only 11 secs and it ends and restarts pretty quickly. This wouldn't be good for longer videos.


You can download the file at http://rapidshare.de/files/18504471/luke.mkv.html

Did you try to switch colorspace to see if this has any effect? in teh mean time... i'll download the clip and give it a test.

[Revgen]

I can't switch colorspace. X264 only supports YV12 encodes. The colorspace and the upsidedown picture is fine once Zoomplayer automatically replays it. The problem has to be either my Dual Core CPU, videocard drivers, or the codec itself.

Oh that reminds me.

Video Card: Nvidia GeForce 6800 Ultra w/71.89 drivers.

EDIT:

Okay, I found a solution. Apparently the native overlay colorspace convertor is screwy. So I enabled FFDShow's by choosing Raw Video--> "all supported" in the FFDShow video decoder page. Zoomplayer now uses FFDShows convertor instead. So, now the video no longer looks upside down and no longer has color issues.

[puffpio]

I havnet used CoreAVC since the beta, but has image quality improved? Back then the decoder seemed to be really efficient, but at the cost of image quality. Of particular note was blocking/banding of solid colors or gradients in dark areas that other decoders did not show (ie a flat wall w/ a gradiant of low light...)

[tomos]

from the 1st public alpha/beta that i tried i didnt notice a single problem with image quality versus ffdshow/nero showtime. truth be told, the only probs i have ever had with this decoder is the audio sync part.

can you show some shots of what you've noticed? with coreavc and some other codec to show? i'm curious if i am just not noticing these things :D

[Avish]

@Betaboy, sorry If I'm being rude, but What do I have to do to get a simple reply from u? I posted a simple question here http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=810623#post810623, but no reply for 2 weeks! So I sent PM to u 2-3 days back, & still havn't got any answer!! So pls tell me what is it that'll bring me your reply?:rolleyes:

Sorry again for the rudeness but I've waited long enough.

[videomixer9]

h264 decoders are supposed to output all exactly the same quality, however most decoders except for ffdshow maybe don't output YV12 and there's plenty of older crappy gfx card that have YV12 problems.

[puffpio]

I havnet used CoreAVC since the beta, but has image quality improved? Back then the decoder seemed to be really efficient, but at the cost of image quality. Of particular note was blocking/banding of solid colors or gradients in dark areas that other decoders did not show (ie a flat wall w/ a gradiant of low light...)
I dont have the sample with me...it was a 1280x720 @ 24fps (ie 24P) encode of an episode of 24 I did as a test using x264 w/ one of Sharktooth's high quality profiles...it was a dark room and the wall of the room was a flat color or had a slight gradiant...

when I played it in tcpmp w/ coreavc I got blocking on the wall...when I played it with ffdshow in media player classic, the wall was smooth....

so not sure...

[CEC]

I've done some tests with MPC+FFDSHOW, MPC+COREAVC, VLC-0.8.6-svn-20060421-0000 and here are some results:

MPC+FFDSHOW = 20~23 CPU :rolleyes:

MPC+COREAVC = 16~19 CPU :p

VLC = 10~13 CPU :cool:


Vlc seems to beat coreavc!!! Can someone else do some tests with vlc??

I have a 3 ghz pentium 4 HT

[MrWizard]

They must have made some serious improvements. Past builds of VLC were outperformed by CoreAVC, at least in my tests. Have you messed around with the various renderers? That can significantly impact the results you get with MPC.

[GmorG McRoth]

I'd be happy to test but I can't realy... I dont have coreavc and I can't find VLC-0.8.6-svn-20060421 best I found was vlc-0.8.5-test3

also what was your test video? was it an movie trailer I could download?

-edit-

Dear lord I just tested vlc-0.8.5-test3 against old Coreavc alpha and difrence was great! with VLC i had 0-1% usage and from mpc with coreavc alpha it was 9-30% WOW

I need to get some higher resolution test sample (heads to apple trailers page)

--edit---
on second test it was 6-9% for VLC I had to mess something up for first test (like watching wrong program cpu usage percentage)

[emmel]

Hmm.. actually yes. At least with 720p the performance is quite equal, maybe vlc is even better. The problem is, that vlc still dies with most of my clips, whereas CoreAVC does not. Well, they are mostly interlaced and tv-originated and less popular formats anyways.

[IgorC]

Guys, VLN uses open source libraries of H.264 decoder which is very slow right now.

Most probably your videocards support H.264 hardware aceleration. That's why VLN doesn't use CPU.

Without hard. ac. it's very slow
http://nightlies.videolan.org/build/win32/

[GmorG McRoth]

I have geforce Fx 5700 no hardware h.264 acceleration there.

[IgorC]

Sure? http://es.nvidia.com/object/winxp_2k_84.21_es.html

Just think. AVC 0-1% . Is it possbile? Even not a misc. doubt that is videocard.

[GmorG McRoth]

Support for high definition H.264 hardware decode acceleration on GeForce 6 and 7 series GPUs.

mine is generation 5... (sob)

resolution of video I tested was low (480x360 25.00fps). so it's possible that audio decoder had influence. I'm downloading high res trailer now.

[IgorC]

look . I have VLN 22d of april and it's slow as hell.

[breez]

IgorC: I don't think the open source decoders in VideoLAN support hardware acceleration at all. But anyway, 0-1% doesn't seem right either.

[GmorG McRoth]

I retested to duble check and it seems I just watched wrong program CPU usage indicator -_- sorry for missinforming. it was 6-9% this time

with cars-tlr_1_h1080p.mov (renamed to mp4 and played) trailer: VLC 26%-43% (with spikes to point of video freeze), MPC+CoreAVC 24%-40% (mostly under 30%)

CPU= prescott 3.0 GHz HT

not so Impressive, seems like I again jumped the gun.

[BetaBoy]

I've done some tests with MPC+FFDSHOW, MPC+COREAVC, VLC-0.8.6-svn-20060421-0000 and here are some results:

MPC+FFDSHOW = 20~23 CPU :rolleyes:

MPC+COREAVC = 16~19 CPU :p

VLC = 10~13 CPU :cool:


Vlc seems to beat coreavc!!! Can someone else do some tests with vlc??

I have a 3 ghz pentium 4 HT

Can you please enighten me with you testing methods, the clip that you used and the version of CoreAVC you tested with please?

[Revgen]

I've done some tests with MPC+FFDSHOW, MPC+COREAVC, VLC-0.8.6-svn-20060421-0000 and here are some results:

MPC+FFDSHOW = 20~23 CPU :rolleyes:

MPC+COREAVC = 16~19 CPU :p

VLC = 10~13 CPU :cool:


Vlc seems to beat coreavc!!! Can someone else do some tests with vlc??

I have a 3 ghz pentium 4 HT

These are strange results.

I have the CoreAVC professional version. I can say with certainty that both VLC and CoreAVC play Standard Definition (720x480, 24fps, 2000kbps, HP,CABAC, all b-frame options) H264 files at about the same CPU usage according to the taskbar.

High Definition (1280x720, 60fps, 6500kbps, HP, CABAC, all b-frame options) files can't hardly be played at all with VLC player but play smooth in CoreAVC by using my Dual-Core CPU.


All I can think of is that this problem may be related to HyperThreading. I remember reading articles talking about how HyperThreading sometimes slows down system performance.

[JoeBG]

I have the CoreAVC professional version.

I bought this version too. But I only got a e-mail with a download for a Test Version. Is this correct?

[sjchmura]

Suddenly FFDShow is crushing the old 0.4 build of coreavc. Did they change it or break it? I need to look carefully but it lookd very very very good

[soresu]

Something is seroiusly wrong here, I have religiously checked my e-mail account since wednesday when I was told that my download link e-mail was being resent, and yet still nothing!

Is there problems with the payment system or something? Inquiring minds NEED to know!

[CEC]

Can you please enighten me with you testing methods, the clip that you used and the version of CoreAVC you tested with please?

I used a movie I have at 688x288 25fps vorbis audio mkv container

The CoreAVC version was 0.0.0.4!!! You haven't released any trial of your latest to test with!!! :sly: But anyway, how much big differnce is going to have from your old alpha version in speed???

The version of vlc I tested can use both virtual cores (HT) of my CPU!!!

[videomixer9]

Something is seroiusly wrong here, I have religiously checked my e-mail account since wednesday when I was told that my download link e-mail was being resent, and yet still nothing!

Is there problems with the payment system or something? Inquiring minds NEED to know!

Sounds like a usual problem with crappy email providers. Btw. CoreAVC domain is still in many blocklists, not only blocklists like ipfilter.dat by several providers but also others :P Seems the IP range was assigned to some weird site before ...

[siddharthagandhi]

How come people with Dual Core processors are having trouble decoding HD content when I can play HD content and encode in HD at the same time using Nero Showtime on my Pentium 4 3.4 ghz processor with HT and my 1.5 GB of Ram. Its not a dual core processor that I have.

[BetaBoy]

I bought this version too. But I only got a e-mail with a download for a Test Version. Is this correct?
The test version is the PRO Edition that we had to manually send emails to.

[BetaBoy]

I used a movie I have at 688x288 25fps vorbis audio mkv container

The CoreAVC version was 0.0.0.4!!! You haven't released any trial of your latest to test with!!! :sly: But anyway, how much big differnce is going to have from your old alpha version in speed???

The version of vlc I tested can use both virtual cores (HT) of my CPU!!!
CEC... thats what I thought... please do NOT post any results for 0.0.4. You are confusing results with the current 1.0 version.

Results w/o HT are about a 10%... add HT and add another 10%. Add SMP and it drops significantly. Results will vary per system.

[BetaBoy]

Sounds like a usual problem with crappy email providers. Btw. CoreAVC domain is still in many blocklists, not only blocklists like ipfilter.dat by several providers but also others :P Seems the IP range was assigned to some weird site before ...
You are correct..... we are in the middle of moving to a DIFF subnet on our host. This will eliminate issues like this.

Anybody not receiving emails with their download can email me betaboy@corecodec.com with their email address and the PayPal transaction ID and i'll handle it.

[nm]

How come people with Dual Core processors are having trouble decoding HD content when I can play HD content and encode in HD at the same time using Nero Showtime on my Pentium 4 3.4 ghz processor with HT and my 1.5 GB of Ram. Its not a dual core processor that I have.
Encoding at the same time doesn't matter much since the encoding process is most likely executed at a much lower priority. Or at least it should be. What kind of HD content have you tested? Your processor should have a hard time with High profile 1080p24, at least with other decoders than CoreAVC. Depending on the player, this can be experienced as A/V sync problems or dropped frames.

Edit: Try this (at 720p and 1080p): http://trailer.nerodigital.com/eng/The_Greatest_Game_Ever_Played.html

[BetaBoy]

Encoding at the same time doesn't matter much since the encoding process is most likely executed at a much lower priority. Or at least it should be. What kind of HD content have you tested? Your processor should have a hard time with High profile 1080p24, at least with other decoders than CoreAVC. Depending on the player, this can be experienced as A/V sync problems or dropped frames.
Speaking of dropped frames.... in 1.1 we are adding a dropped frames option to DS.

[ravemax]

@BetaBoy:
Already an decision with regards to the Linux/Unix release format? E.g. universal, dynamic library with an FFMPEG like interface, or an application (e.g. mplayer) plugin?

[HookedOnTV]

So I tested the VLC vs CoreAVC. On my 1.6 Pentium M I can play the King Kong trailer with Core and it plays smooth at about 95% CPU. Using the latest VLC build dated 4/22 CPU is pegged at 100% and playback is less than real time.

[Revgen]

I used a movie I have at 688x288 25fps vorbis audio mkv container

The CoreAVC version was 0.0.0.4!!! You haven't released any trial of your latest to test with!!! :sly: But anyway, how much big differnce is going to have from your old alpha version in speed???

The version of vlc I tested can use both virtual cores (HT) of my CPU!!!

The speed difference is quite noticable. Especially at HD resoultions using using SMP with my AMD 4600+. The decoder clearly uses both cores when processing these clips. DVD resolution clips aren't going to show much difference though.

CoreAVC 0.0.0.4 doesn't even hold a candle to this new version.

[BetaBoy]

@BetaBoy:
Already an decision with regards to the Linux/Unix release format? E.g. universal, dynamic library with an FFMPEG like interface, or an application (e.g. mplayer) plugin?
Well... let me speak more of a general perspective on the player side, then of our plans for CoreAVC.

We are working on several versions of CorePlayer and BetaPlayer for Linux atm which will feature CoreAVC Professional Edition. Those being GTK, QT, QTopia, JUCE, and a native version for Linux based PMP's utilizing our CoreTheque DB (see http://www.coretheque.com ) and our upcoming SVG interface for CorePlayer 1.xx.

But more specific to your question... we are going to have a more 'Universal' approach for our codecs (CoreMP3, CoreASP, CoreAAC v2, CoreAVC, CoreAC3, CoreDTS, CoreAVS) on Linux with Libraries/Headers and API documentation... but this is more targeted to our much LARGER goal of a possible Open Source alternative to FFMPEG which i'll talk about more over the few months as the encoder side of our codecs matures.

[jblade]

Is it at all likely we will see a codec for the XBMC (Xbox Media Center, which is based off of mplayer) relatively soon?

[starg4ze]

Is it at all likely we will see a codec for the XBMC (Xbox Media Center, which is based off of mplayer) relatively soon?

We are alot of people DYING to have CoreAVC for XBMC...

Hey BetaBoy...Who do I pay? How much? Will you accept my wife as a downpayment?:D

[CobraX]

First of all I wanna say that I hate paying for a "decoder". But I'm considering buying CoreAVC Standard or Pro. I have never used PayPal before but I have a Visa card so this won't be a problem.

I still have a few questions though:

1) Do you get lifetime free updates for the version you buy (like with e.g. DVD Rebuilder Pro)?
2) Do you just download an installer and receive a serial? Or is there a key system like with DVD Rebuilder Pro? I'm asking this cause I want to use it on all of my PCs now and in the near future (for now I only have 2 desktops and 1 laptop).
3) I'm using CoreAVC Alpha 0.0.0.4 now and 1080p trailers from apple.com don't run decently on my Athlon64 3000+@3200+ with 1 GB RAM. Is there a big speed improvement in the 1.0 version?
4) I read something about CoreAVC users getting CoreAAC 2.0 for free? Can someone give me some more info about this?
5) I've also read something about a new account system (for ordering CoreAVC). Maybe I can better wait for this account system to get active before ordering CoreAVC?

Thanks in advance

CobraX

[CEC]

1)no

2)you Download The Installer! It Has Licenturion Protection!

3)yes

4)what More Info? You Get The Latest Version Of Coreaac!

5)there Is No Reason!

[tomos]

hmm, will have to check out this coreaac thing, havent heard much and dont know really what the big deal about aac is :)

Dan,

any guesstimates about the encoder? i am curious as to its potential and how far along you've gotten

[CobraX]

Pfff I've just read a bit about that Licenturion. Those extreme protections with activation stuff etc make it a big hassle and can demotivate possible buyers (like me). I just don't like the fact that you have to connect to some "strange" source (internet) to activate your software (feels like intrusion of my privacy). What if you upgrade your PC every year (or buy a new PC every year and sell your current one to stay up-to-date) and your software will only work with e.g. 3 hardware IDs? Then you're f*cked.

Also I don't like paying 19,99 USD every 6 months for a new version of CoreAVC Pro. I thought the developers didn't do it for the money (but to keep other companies from "stealing" their sourcecode). I guess I was a bit wrong here. :( Maybe I'd be better of buying a faster cpu then. :(

Over and out for now

A bit disappointed CobraX...

[jthunder]

We are alot of people DYING to have CoreAVC for XBMC...

Hey BetaBoy...Who do I pay? How much? Will you accept my wife as a downpayment?:D

I second this motion - this is one of the best uses of such a codec where the machine is cpu limited (I can't wait to find out how high a bitrate we can jam through xbmx)

Please update us on this!!!

Thanks.

[BetaBoy]

We are expecting our suite of encoders by the end of the summer to match our decoders (CoreMP3, CoreASP, CoreAVC).

As stated a few times in this thread... all 1.xx get 1.xx upgrades. Once the Core Account system is up you will be able to upgrade any of our non-Open Source products you have purchased.

2.0 is a way off but we have already been working on the framework for it even before 1.0 was finalized.

XBMC version of CoreAVC will not happen anytime soon as we spoke specifically with the devels of XBMC and were not able to work on a solution.

BTW... your 4 months too late for the 'wife' offer... as I am now on wife version 2.0 . . . thx anyway ;-)

[BetaBoy]

On CoreAAC v2.0.... All current CoreAVC users will gets this as a part of their CoreAVC 1.0 purchase...

We will have two releases for CoreAAC v2.0... 1st release will be a plain jane AAC decoder and be available in about 2 weeks.. 2nd release will be HE/SBR, however this version will not come out till after CorePlayer 1.0 is launched in June.

[remlap]

BBC have began thier HD tests on Astra 2 in DVBviewer of course theres an error needing MBAFF.

Is there away to get this working?

Cheers.

[xkodi]

BBC have began thier HD tests on Astra 2 in DVBviewer of course theres an error needing MBAFF.

Is there away to get this working?

Cheers.

there is also another problem with DVBViewer:

The CoreAVC relies on the resolution reported by the DVBViewer Filter when connecting to it. Obviously it doesn't evaluate the resolution info in the video headers (in contrast to all up-to-date MPEG2 video decoders)...

more here:

http://www.dvbviewer.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=9206&st=75#

and the picture looks strange (HDForum, 11240MHz, Hotbird 13.0E) :

http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/8318/coreavcdvbviwer5jh.th.jpg (http://img86.imageshack.us/my.php?image=coreavcdvbviwer5jh.jpg)

i hope soon there will be a solution to that problem too