CoreCodec/H.264 Codec "CoreAVC"

[BetaBoy]

CoreAVC is known in the industry as being the standard for playback of high quality H.264 video. CoreAVC allows you to directly offload video decoding with either NVIDIA CUDA. ATI with Microsoft's DirectX Video Acceleration (DXVA) interface for any Windows XP, Vista, or Windows 7 PC.

More info here: http://corecodec.com/products/coreavc .

CoreAVC™ 3.0.x Professional Edition Decoder
* Supports Windows 7
* 32/64 bit support
* 8/9/10 bit support
* DXVA 1/2 Compatible
* NVIDIA CUDA GPU support
* NVIDIA DXVA GPU support
* ATI GPU support (DXVA)
* Intel Media SDK support
* ARM NEON support
* Netlogic/RMI MAE GPU support
* Supports unlimited CPU Cores
* 8100x8100 Resolution support
* Low Latency support
* Uses Directshow for MKV
* Includes the Haali Media Splitter
* Full Interlaced support

OEM Licensing
OEM/ODM/Third party developers looking to license or evaluate the CoreAVC 2.x SDK for Android, iPhone/Touch, CE, CE Embedded, Windows Mobile, Windows, OS X, Linux, and DSP's can contact our Licensing Group licensing@corecodec.com or for general information info@corecodec.com for pricing, SDK, Promotional and or reference material.

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CoreCodec / CoreAVC H.264 Decoder
Configuration Properties Guide
*** UPDATED FOR v3.0 ***


INPUT FORMATS
This controls which DirectShow Media Types the CoreAVC video decoder accepts on input. Uncheck this only if you are troubleshooting problems with CoreAVC incorrectly decoding some variant of H.264, or want to use another decoder for it.

avc1 / AVC1 - Accept streams with avc1 / AVC1 FourCCs.
h264 / H264 - Accept streams with h264 / H264 FourCCs.
x264 / X264 - Accept streams with x264 / X264 FourCCs.
VSSH - Accept streams with VSSH FourCC.
Mainconcept H.264 - Accept H.264 streams from the Mainconcept splitter.
ArcSoft H.264 - Accept H.264 streams from the ArcSoft splitter.

OUTPUT FORMATS
This determines the preferred output color space. The decoder tries each enabled format in order from top to bottom until it is accepted by the Video Renderer filter.

9/10 Bit (checkbox) - check to enable

YV12 - YUV 4:2:0 planar format.
I420 - YUV 4:2:0 planar format with chroma planes in reverse order.
NV12 - YUV 4:2:0 with interleaved chroma samples.
YUY2 - YUV 4:2:2 packed format.
UYVY - YUV 4:2:2 packed format with different sample ordering.
RGB32 - 8 bits per channel RGB format with an extra padding byte.
RGB24 - 8 bits per channel RGB format.
RGB16 (565) - RGB format with 6 bits per green sample and 5 bits each for red and blue samples.
RGB15 (555) - 5 bits per channel RGB format.
Up Arrow - Increases the priority of the selected format by moving it towards to the top.
Down Arrow - Decreases the priority of the selected format by moving it towards the bottom.

INPUT LEVELS
TV (16-235) - always assume the stream uses TV levels.
PC (0-255) - always assume the stream uses PC levels.
Auto detect - use the full range flag in the stream to determine Luminance range.

OUTPUT LEVELS
TV (16-235) - assume the Video Renderer expects TV levels.
PC (0-255) - assume the Video Renderer expects PC levels.
Auto detect - use PC levels when VMR is used as a Video Renderer, and TV levels for all others.

INPUT COLORSPACE
BT.601 - use BT.601 colorspace coefficients when converting to RGB.
BT.709 - use BT.709 colorspace coefficients when converting to RGB.
Auto detect - use the colormatrix flag in the stream to determine the colorspace coefficients.

DEINTERLACING
This specifies how interlaced material is handled by the CoreAVC decoder.

None (Weave) - Each output frame contains two fields, flagged as progressive.
Single Field - Each output frame contains one field. Only one frame is produced for each field pair.
Bob - Each output frame contains one field. Two frames are produced for each field pair.
Hardware - Each output frame contains two fields, flagged as interlaced to allow the video renderer to perform deinterlacing.
Aggressive - in addition to SEI messages and POC numbers, assume the source is interlaced if any interlaced coding tools are used (MBAFF, PAFF)

DEBLOCKING
This controls how the deblocking step of H.264 specification is executed by the CoreAVC decoder. Deblocking is a complex process that consumes significant processing resources. If your machine is not fast enough, you might want to turn off deblocking for some frames, but it will degrade visual quality. This setting has no effect when hardware acceleration is in use.

Standard deblocking - do deblocking exactly as specified by H.264.
Skip when safe - skip deblocking step when decoding B-frames.
Skip always - does not perform any deblocking.

CROP 1088 to 1080
H.264 encoded video size is always a multiple of 16, and sequences that are 1080 pixels high are encoded as 1088 padded at the bottom. Also H.264 specifications provides a set of cropping parameters to signal that parts of the encoded picture are not important and should not be displayed. Some H.264 encoders fail to specify cropping parameters when encoding 1080 video.

Not Checked - do not crop video.
Checked - when input video is exactly 1088 pixels high, crop 8 pixels off the bottom.

PREFERRED DECODER
Overrides any other AVC directshow video decoders, and uses CoreAVC instead.
Not checked - does not change system merit.
Checked - enables the highest merit on the PC. This option is recommended to be on.

FORCE VMR AR CORRECTION
This option can be used if you are working with the decoder outside the normal player environment.

Not checked - does not change VMR settings.
Checked - instructs VMR filter to maintain aspect ratio of the video that it displays. Normally this AR correction is the responsibility of a video player. This option should normally be off.

USE TRAY ICON
This determines if an icon will be shown in the system tray when the CoreAVC decoder is in use. The tray icon can be used to access the configuration settings while media is playing. Changes to this option may not take effect until the means for playback is restarted or the computer itself is restarted.

Not checked - does not show the tray icon.
Checked - enables the tray icon while media is playing.

LOW LATENCY
This causes frames to be decoded synchronously, reducing the time between when a compressed frame is received and when the corresponding decoded frame is output.

Not checked - use asynchronous decoding, improves CPU utilization.
Checked - use synchronous decoding, less than optimal CPU utilization.

Low Latency Technical: When a stream is properly muxed into a MP4 format, it has the advantage of storing the NALU lengths at the beginning of each frame. When the Byte stream format is used instead, the size of the NALU can only be determined when the next startcode is seen, this adds one frame of latency, plus the existing one frame delay.

Additionally you will need to use FORMAT_MPEG2Video for the input connection format type, with dwFlags set to the length of the size field (commonly 2 or 4 bytes) and the sps and pps NALUs should be passed in dwSequenceHeader. Also note that you should not use MEDIASUBTYPE_MAINCONECPT_H264 ({0x8D2D71CB, 0x243F, 0x45E3, 0xB2, 0xD8, 0x5F, 0xD7, 0x96, 0x7E, 0xC0, 0x9B}) for the subtype, as it is not meant for this format. Use one of the other regular H264 subtypes made by using either "avc1" or "h264" as the fourcc.

ACCELERATION
This sets the preferred method of hardware acceleration for decoding H.264 streams. Changes to this option will not take effect until playback is restarted.

CUDA - Use a compatible NVIDIA graphics card if the stream is encoded using compatible features.
DXVA - Use an ATI or NVIDIA DXVA1/DXVA2 compatible graphics card if the stream is encoded using compatible features with a renderer filter connected.
NONE - Use software decoding only.

TRAY ICON STATES
When the "Use Tray Icon" option is enabled, the tray icon indicates whether or not hardware acceleration (GPU) is active in CoreAVC.

Blue - CUDA or DXVA is not active or in use.
Green - CUDA acceleration is active and in use.
Red - DXVA acceleration is active and in use.

PICTURE LEVELS
Picture level slider adjustments can be made in ‘real time’ so you see the effects of the changes as you make them. Once the adjustments are made, ensure that you press ‘Apply’ to save changes or they will be lost.
Note: Picture levels cannot be adjusted when DXVA hardware acceleration is in use.

Brightness - Adjusts the overall brightness level.
Contrast - Adjusts the difference between light and dark areas.
Saturation - Adjusts the vibrancy of colors.
Restore Defaults - Reset all picture level adjustments. It is not necessary to click Apply after this option.


Full Changelog:
http://corecodec.com/products/coreavc/changelog


Also... as a reference here are the install flag options for Haali's splitter:
Haali Media Splitter supports the following command line options:
/S - silent install without any UI
/MKVONLY - register only Matroska components
/AVI=[yes|no] - register AVI support
/MP4=[yes|no] - register MP4 support
/OGG=[yes|no] - register OGG/OGM support
/TS=[yes|no] - register MPEG TS support
/PS=[yes|no] - register MPEG PS support
/WMP=[yes|no] - register WMP to play in Windows 7


Also when reporting issues, please include the following:
People, how about providing detailed bug reports? Simply saying that it's not working or it's slow for me won't really help. It should be something like this:

1. Description: Explain the problem throughly and provide video sample if possible, if not then at least provide screenshots
2. OS:
3. CPU:
4. GPU:
5. Video Driver Version#:
6. Player and Version#:
7. Renderer:
8. Splitter and Version#:
9. Codec Version:
10. Output:
11. Acceleration (DXVA/CUDA):
12. Other info that might help.

[Sirber]

Sweet!

What is it's speed compared to FFMPEG?

[BetaBoy]

Sirber... from my tests... 75% faster... but this is on my PPC and Palm... Windows, well... read the thread... its a great start... and we have very big plans for CoreAVC.

[Sirber]

at 320x240@12FPS, I can barely decode it on my 400MHz xScale using FFMPEG. I will test this ASAP :D

[BetaBoy]

You'll probally need some specifically encoded AVC files to test properly.. Picard added 8x8 transform on Friday and b-frames (consecutive b-frames, b-frames referencing...) should work in theory, but he noted there are some bugs left.

Devel will slow on this as we are working on Skins and Symbian for TCPMP at the moment... and are preping for CES (we have 30+ companies demo'ing TCPMP).

[DarkZell666]

Wow, that is definitely a good news !

Been waiting for that for quite a long time now, nice to hear of such an initiative !

Keep up the good work ;)

[BetaBoy]

I just spoke to the Devels 'CoreAVC' is officially born.... next is the 'CoreAVC Encoder'

[Sirber]

Encoder for pocket pc? ;)

[BetaBoy]

Sirber.... no a full blown 'CoreAVC H.264 Encoder'... there is plan with a few of our devels... one envolves our Dr Doom Media Encoder aka DDME. But some of the devels have noted that they did not want another encoder 'program'... we may just adopt Dr DivX 2.0 and mod it to our needs...

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

Great news, BetaBoy.

About encoding quality, anything to say, perhaps, or it's too early, yet.

[BetaBoy]

Kostarum Rex Persia... yeah way too early... its on the roadmap but you are looking at Late Feb. early March at the earliest when I bring on about 6 more paid developers @ CoreCodec to help.

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

Your plans for that AVC encoder, include what. All new stuff that x264 codec have?

[BetaBoy]

to be honest Kostarum Rex Persia..... We plan on a full blown feature rich and licensable encode and decoder for CoreAVC @ CoreCodec @ http://www.coreavc.com

BTW... we just added CABAC - http://picard.exceed.hu/tcpmp/test/

[Sharktooth]

wow, that was fast :)
are you going to implement the full specs (all profiles and levels)? and why is it closed source?

[BetaBoy]

Sharktooth... its to be determined still on if we keep it closed source or not. Reasoning is this... with TCPMP we have had 'alleged' thefts of our GPL source code and decoders that are in third party hardware/software. We have worked hard over the past three years to get were we are at now with CoreCodec/TCPMP and are going to take baby steps in protecting ANY of our projects IP.

Why invest our time to get our source code ripped off and that those doing the ripping do not comply with the GPL when we release it that way? Pretty sad since we also state that we own 100% of the code as well and offer a closed source alternative license to it, and they still OPT to steal it.

So with that being said... we are taking the cautious steps first with CoreAVC and yes, we have larger plans with our encoder like you had asked... we do plan on supporting ALL profiles and levels.

Now to get bond a directshow filter.... ;-)

[Sharktooth]

I understand your point. It's not the first time and it's not an isolated case.
However closing the source will help protecting from code stealing but will potentially kill the codec development at some time in its existence.

[BetaBoy]

Well... for the most part yeah. Killing devel in it will not happen as we at CoreCodec are hiring about a dozen plus developers over the next few weeks to work on the various projects we have going on. Including:
- TCPMP
- CoreAVC, CoreMP4, CoreAAC (new version)
- CoreTheque
- Websites

But we can protect what we have... and when the unfortunate few that have chosen to steal the GPL code have been announced they will wish they had not gone the route that they did not only from a community perspective. But as the actual products they sell suffer from the theft as well... I leave the rest to the lawyers.

[ShAQ]

Hi BetaBoy.

Thanks for sharing this with us. I will take a closer look at the codec when I have a little bit more freetime. Feedback will come - soon oder later. ;)

[guada 2]

@BetaBoy

I have a problem.
Look at this:

" ActiveSync not found in this computer. Setup cannot continue and will now exit ".

An idea please.

[BetaBoy]

guada 2... your running the windows TCPMP?

if not LMK...

[guada 2]

Sorry Beteboy,

It is similar.
The problem persists.

[BetaBoy]

Sorry Beteboy,

It is similar.
The problem persists.
OK... i'll look into it....

Here is v0.71d:
http://picard.exceed.hu/tcpmp/test/tcpmp.win32.0.71d.zip

and it now includes:
- AVC weighted prediction support

[CruNcher]

as soon as it supports cabac i try it ;)

[Sharktooth]

as soon as it supports cabac i try it ;)
it does: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=754347#post754347

[CruNcher]

ups sorry , yeah wow this thing is fast damnit nice work Betaboy really nice playback of that 1920x1080p sample is not easy but TCPMP + CoreAVC do it perfect looking forward for a Directshow Filter and implementation into mplayer and VLC would be also nice but i see you don't want to open it for now what a pitty :) Like you have another Skal on your team now hehe this Picard guy really knows low level coding it seems. Skals Decoder should be as fast as this :D If the Encoder gets the same optimization cure as the decoder my my alot have to watch out and CoreAVC Encoder could be in the future on the 1 place here on Doom9 i wish it CoreCodec so much that this becomes reallity :)

@BetaBoy
something is strange with the ffmpeg.plg it's very slow compared to CoreAVC rendering to slow compared with a recent ffdshow build hmm seems you useing a very outdated ffmpeg with libavcodec here ?

[superdump]

I look forward to trying CoreAVC when binaries are available for dshow use. *Looks at Toff* :) And it will be nice to have another AVC codec on the scene. By the sounds of the the quality of the decoder is very good so... Thanks for the news Betaboy and good luck with the programming for this little lot. :)

[BetaBoy]

http://picard.exceed.hu/tcpmp/test/avc.win32.0.71e.zip

Plugin 'only' for TCPMP for Windows... with the new AVC weighted prediction support

[DeathTheSheep]

So now it supports everything except lossless, CQM, and interlaced stuff (x264 doesn't do interlaced encoding anyway)! It's very fast, and it's optimized for the PocketPC, so it performs even better there relative to the PC.
Sony's PSP AVC decoder, shabby as it is, is falling behind rapidly, as is Nero's PocketPC AVC decoder, it seems...
The age of true handheld AVC-HP has arrived with a BOOM thanks to Picard, BetaBoy, and the TCPMP team!

[Sirber]

I'm upgrading my 400Mhz PPC with the latest TCPMP.

currently decoding x264 (Q35) + vorbis (8kbps) = 65% realtime with FFMPEG

[Sirber]

110% with new codec :D :D :D

great work!!!

[Sirber]

Any clue why bench I ahve all frames while in real playback I have dropped frames? It's unfair :(

[DeathTheSheep]

Well, AVC is a format in which certain scenes of the video requre more processing power than others--more complex in certain areas than in others.

While benchmarking, the 110% you achieve is an average. As such, it is very inconsistent throughout the video stream--some places in the video may decode at 250% while others lag at 75%. In realtime playback, you notice the more complex places with frame drops.

[Sirber]

ok... fair enough :)

Also it might be my PPC, but I cannot playback from SD card :( It jam after few seconds.

[DeathTheSheep]

Oh? Try freeing some ram, giving it to mostly program memory, and/or adjust the player's buffer size in the settings-> player menu.

If the problem keeps up, try uninstalling some 3rd-party programs, removing the SD card, and doing a soft-reset (keeps your data). Then try it again ;)

[HQ-LQ]

have you already a directshow-decoder?

[BetaBoy]

@BetaBoy
something is strange with the ffmpeg.plg it's very slow compared to CoreAVC rendering to slow compared with a recent ffdshow build hmm seems you useing a very outdated ffmpeg with libavcodec here ?

It is from source coode from about 3 months ago.... However even with the changes that thay have made it would not make a diff with the current code.

This is why we made the choice to do a decoder/encoder from scratch and expand our business model to include AVC as we were going to license it anyway for TCPMP and our licensees.

have you already a directshow-decoder?
Toff is working on it now and we hope to have it out as soon as possible.

[Scarpad]

I've been waiting to get AVC support. I have an Axim X30 624mhz PPC, anyone using it with this hand help. I primarily want to use the files I create for my Ipod Video on the PPC. The files are only 320x240 at 768kbps

[PicardGK]

Like you have another Skal on your team now hehe this Picard guy really knows low level coding it seems.
We are both demoscene trained :D
Heaven 7 (http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=5)

something is strange with the ffmpeg.plg it's very slow compared to CoreAVC rendering to slow compared with a recent ffdshow build hmm seems you useing a very outdated ffmpeg with libavcodec here ?
That plugin is not meant for real life usage. I'am building it with Visual Studio without any gcc inline assembly (mmx/sse). Maybe I will have look at the DivX version of ffmpeg where the assembly stuff is separated to libavdsp.

[nm]

We are both demoscene trained :D
Heaven 7 (http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=5)
Still my favourite 64k intro :), though I haven't followed the scene much lately.
Nice work you're doing here too.

[CruNcher]

yeah picard i got your exceed background very impressive nice to see you working on multimedia solutions , and yes heaven 7 is also 1 of my favs hehe :)


Maybe I will have look at the DivX version of ffmpeg where the assembly stuff is separated to libavdsp.


You mean Dr.DivX OSS with that ?

[PicardGK]

You mean Dr.DivX OSS with that ?
Yes, that's the correct name.

[CruNcher]

i found decoding probs
those decoding errors seem to occur only with the Directdraw output with GDI their are no problems visible useing blitting instead of overlay with directdraw the problems are also gone strange.

Picard is deblocking 100% supported ???

[PicardGK]

Picard is deblocking 100% supported ???
Yes. It should be.

If GDI mode shows it correctly it seems a problem with my DirectDraw overlay handling. What does media info dialog tell about the video size (maybe odd pixels, but in theory it shouldn't be a problem)? Can you send a sample with problem? picard[at]demoscene[dot].hu

[CruNcher]

try this http://rapidshare.de/files/9787718/The-Island_HD-Trailer-High_Profile-x264-nodeblocking.mp4.html
you gonna find a bug in CoreAVC with this Clip

Merry Christmas

[PicardGK]

Thanks. The problem was caused by a buffering problem with high bitrate files dropping reference frames (there were also some audio gaps)

[CruNcher]

In the case of DirectDraw overlay mode the full sized YUV color space frames are transfered to the video card memory and it's downscaled by video card during displaying.

But the null vs directdraw speed difference is larger as mine. Do you have a 8x AGP video card? Or maybe it does vsync even in benchmark mode. Do you seen tearing during benchmark? (I do with my Radeon 9600)

Sorry for being offtopic. For further CoreAVC discussion: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=104277

ps: ops. I forget to update the version number in the player to 0.71g


Jep better to continue here hehe no no tearing visible got a Radeon 9800 pro 8x Agp yes running @ 8 AGP on ULI M1695+M1567 ASrock Dual Sata-II Catalyst 5.13

you still have no changelog for the CoreAVC 0.71g version on your site is this intentional ?

[easyfab]

Thanks Picard and all corecodec Team :) .
Now I can play HD 1080p AVC files on my XP2500 :)

I'm impressed that your (assembly?) optimizations gives so better speed improvement

You prove that we not absolutely need new generation PC each new codec generation ( same for games or softwares ).

[Scarpad]

0.71 D works well on my Axim 30 H, of course there's a price to be paid for AVC decoding, it eats Battery life.

[Pomyk]

I have a problem with normal playback - it skips frames when file has b-frames. In benchmark it plays smoothly and I get over 300%. I'm using win32.0.71g version.

[BetaBoy]

Got word Toff is finishing up work on the CoreAVC directshow decoder filter and doing speed comparisons now to other filters that are available. I'll get the status for everyone... but I am counting on this for CES to demo for everyone.

That aside.... On sunday I want to demo H.264 in our new TCPMP 'CoreXtension Web browser Plug-in'.... the first version will be only for IE. But dont worry FireFox will be right behind it.... ill post a link then.

[Sharktooth]

Any news on Weighted prediction front?:)

[CruNcher]

hehe sharktooth that's supported allready

version 0.71e (avc plugin only):
-some fixes
-weighted prediction support

we are at 0.71g allready but therefore no changelog is existing right now seems to had some speed optimations :)

@BetaBoy
that sounds cool but i hope going into Directshow and outside of TCPMP will not hurt the performance that much :(

[BetaBoy]

CruNcher... thats the goal... the TCPMP decoders are written at such a low level that in theory they should be at least 20% or more effecient then a comparable decoder. I am guessing this is why Toff wanted to diff other decoders.

[Lobuz]

It's wonderfull decoder ... but I have a little problem with maximizing CPU usage. Tested with Aplle trailers at WInXP and even in benchmark mode there is max around 60-70% CPU usage. My hardware is a little old: Newer AthlonXP 2400+ running on old Asus A7V at 1.5 GHz with 100MHz bus + 512MB of 133Mhz RAM on GForce2Pro64 . Is my hardware causing some bottleneck problem for TCPMP optimisations? Anyway it would be nice to know in what kind of video output TCPMP is working (WMV7-9 etc.) and color space (YV12 - YUY2 ) for better graphics card setting (YUY2 for my card).

Regards
Lobuz

[PicardGK]

There were no changes other that avc optimizing in 0.71g

In general the player is not really tuned for win32/x86 yet. Example some color space transformations maybe slow like hell.

Anyway it would be nice to know in what kind of video output TCPMP is working (WMV7-9 etc.)
You mean VMR7 / VMR9? Neither. The player is not DirectShow based, it uses simple DirectDraw overlays for output.

and color space (YV12 - YUY2 ) for better graphics card setting (YUY2 for my card).
It will try to use planar YUV formats first, like YV12, IYUV, I420. If that fails it will try the packed ones like YUY2. But I just checked and the planar->packed transformation in the player is handled by a slow fallback function currently with x86. This may cost speed, but didn't explain lower cpu usage.

One explanation I can think of is vsync. If you don't see tearing this means the ddraw overlay driver uses vsync. Try benchmarking the movie with selecting options/video/null in menu.

[Lobuz]

It will try to use planar YUV formats first, like YV12, IYUV, I420. If that fails it will try the packed ones like YUY2. But I just checked and the planar->packed transformation in the player is handled by a slow fallback function currently with x86. This may cost speed, but didn't explain lower cpu usage.
That would be useful to choose YUV formats like in ffdshow config. My graphics card isn't good with YV12 .. some hroma/luma shift and it propably does some conversion from yv12 color space.

One explanation I can think of is vsync. If you don't see tearing this means the ddraw overlay driver uses vsync. Try benchmarking the movie with selecting options/video/null in menu.
With null video set it uses 100% CPU and gets in benchmark of V 1080p 120% speed.

Regards
Lobuz

ps. Are there any chances of mpeg2 in ts HDTV support witch such fast decompression speed?

[unmei]

Yeah, i got the same "problem" here, i didn't even see that it wasn't using all of the CPU, i just noticed that a Xvid, a 450kbit AVC and a 2400kbit AVC all had exactly 60.09Hz in benchmark - highly unlikely (my assumption is either the GPU or the TFT itself (on DVI) locked the overlay memory to only allow writing at that certain freq max, which is the monitors refresh rate). Anyway with the NULL decoder speeds are amazing.

[bond]

first of all wow! this decoder really blows away!
i guess i can for the first time decode D1 res avc + he-aac in realtime on my 866mhz pentium3 :)

here my speed results for
x264_hp_2pass_720x288_B3-Ref_Ref5_p4x4-i8x8_loop-5_WBP_cabac:
coreavc-tcpmp: 90.32fps
ateme: 50.62fps
ffmpeg-mplayer: 49.91fps
ffmpeg-ffdshow: 44.98fps
ffmpeg-tcpmp: 38.58fps

i guess the values speak for themselves, coreavc-tcpmp is ~80% faster than the second fastest decoder, ateme!!!

the tcpmp values are derived via the tcpmp benchmark option together with "null video".
with directdraw video i still get 36.92fps

as i see it the now used avc features not supported by coreavc are:
- custom quant matrices
- lossless
- interlacing
i hope at least the first two will be supported too

another interesting thing i saw was that ffmpeg avc decoding via tcpmp is clearly more slower than when decoding with ffmpeg via ffdshow or mplayer. i guess thats because tcpmp itself is not that fast?

Thanks. The problem was caused by a buffering problem with high bitrate files dropping reference frames (there were also some audio gaps)i am wondering when does tcpmp drop frames? and is it possible to disable this, so i know for sure that tcpmp plays my videos in realtime without dropping frames

[Revgen]

This decoder (V. 71g) may be fast for some videos (The Greatest Game) but it's slow with my x264 encoded Beavis and Butthead video.

FFDshow and VLC player play this video fine.

If BetaBoy or Picard would like to take a look at it just send me a PM with your e-mail and I can send it to you via www.yousendit.com

[bond]

make sure you have avc.plg in your folder, otherwise the player will use ffmpeg for decoding, and thats slow

[Revgen]

The avc.plg is in my folder.

Or else The Greatest Game.mp4 video would play slow.

[kurt]

great player! But a question the developers:

what about AR-signaling (SAR in mp4 / DAR in matroska)? will this be implemented in the future?

[Birdy1]

This is amazing. I benchmarked a trailer of the movie Serenity. Before I couldn't play it at all.

player: tcpmp.win32.0.71g.zip
plugin: avc.win32.0.71g.zip

Serenity movie trailer serenity_1080p.mov

without avc and aac plugin (no sound) 53%
with avc and aac plug in 171%

P4 3GHz
ATI Radeon 9600 Pro

[BetaBoy]

Revgen and others.... if you have the FFMPEG plug-in installed and the AVC plug-in installed and are trying to play a video with our unsupported AVC features
- interlacing
- custom quantizer matrices
- lossless coding

Playback will the default to the FFMPEG plugin. This is the likely reason it is playing slow. Try another AVC video with the supported features and let us know the results.

[Revgen]

Okay, here are the details again.


1) My Beavis and Butthead video doesn't use any of these above features. So it shouldn't be the problem.

2) My video plays well with FFDShow and VLC player. The FFMPEG plugin shouldn't be the problem.

3) My video plays slow using TCPMP 0.71G combined with AVC plugin 0.71G. It also plays slow when the AVC Plugin IS NOT in the folder.

4) I can upload and send a link to my video through www.yousendit.com if you're interested.

[CruNcher]

Revgen what does the Media Info show after you load the file ?

[Revgen]

Revgen what does the Media Info show after you load the file ?

URL: H:\BEAVIS_BUTTHEAD_VOL_1\VIDEO_TS\Beavis and Butthead Vol 1 Disk 1.mkv
Format: Matroska File (MKV,MKA)
Duration: 1:47:40.960
Filesize: 715821 KB


Video: AVC aka H.264
Codec: CoreCodec AVC
Video Size: 720x480
Frame Rate: 23.976
Language: eng


Audio: AC-3
Codec: LibA52 (AC-3)
Format: 48000 Hz Stereo
Data Bit Rate: 224 kbit/s
Language: und


Played: 0
Frames Dropped: 0
Played FPS: 23.976

[Hyper Shinchan]

Really amzaing this plugin!!! I'll make extended tests later, but I'm really impressed!
Sugoiii!!!

[DeathTheSheep]

In having some MKV problems here as well. I think its the same one, actually; an MKV file of mine benches near 400% despite dropping many frames during playback.
AVI works just fine, though.

[travisbell]

Can't wait to see this DirectShow filter you are teasing us with... should be very, very interesting...

[BetaBoy]

ok... you have been warned!!! This is a pre-pre-pre-alpha directshow version of CoreAVC.... bond has tested it and it needs alot of work still ;-)

<bond> ffdshow: 47.16
<bond> ateme: 50.62
<bond> coreavc: 73.33 ;)
<bond> that is with a stream that has pretty much everything enabled

CoreCodec AVC DirectShow Video Decoder

ALPHA VERSION FOR TESTING PURPOSE ONLY

Changelog:
==========

Version 0.0.0.1 Alpha :
Use a very high merit in this alpha release, don't install it if you
don't want to use it.
Should support anamorphic from Matroska (native mode) and MP4 files.
Limitations :
- Only output to YV12 and I420
- No dynamic output mediatype change
- No flushing for buffered frame at end of file
- Linked with some unecessary code from TCPMP
- no cqm, lossless or interlacing support


There are way too many issues to even bother posting about... but hey, I did say it was a pre-pre-pre alpha build... so with that.... Have fun.

Download here: http://cc.serveftp.org:8884/CoreAVC20060102.7z

[falcon2000eg]

thanx i just tried it and loved it keep the good work.

[Revgen]

Beavis and Butthead plays great with this one. Good Job! :thanks:

The Greatest Game trailer (1920x1080) also plays great.


Your pre pre pre alpha build has earned a right to graduate! :)

[Sirber]

On my 3000+ (running in low power mode, RealAnime is not encoding :D)

On 640x480 with (x264 + AAC+v2 = MKV), in overlay mode

FFDShow: ~50% CPU
CoreAVC: ~38% CPU
MPlayer: ~30% CPU

[CruNcher]

yep it's like Bond said blasting 40% faster then any of the other Decoders :)

[sillKotscha]

blasting 40% faster then any of the other Decoders :)

first time I can watch these trailers...

sample H264 High Profil

KingKong (http://multimediacom.free.fr/Download/x264HP_KingKong_720p_1500.mp4)
1280*720*25
1500 Kbps

Harry potter IV (http://multimediacom.free.fr/Download/x264HP_HPIV_720p_1250.mp4)
1280*720*25
1250 Kbps

IceAge (http://multimediacom.free.fr/Download/x264HP_IceAge_720p_1250.mp4)
1280*720*25
1250 Kbps

really flawless with my system...

http://tinypic.com/jkvlzn.png
http://tinypic.com/jkvn1l.png
http://tinypic.com/jkvm6h.png

[bond]

<bond> ffdshow: 47.16
<bond> ateme: 50.62
<bond> coreavc: 73.33note that with the tcpmp i get on the same stream a decoding speed of 90fps, so its even a lot faster than coreavc dshow

edit:
so on this sample (720x288_B3-Ref_Ref5_p4x4-i8x8_loop-5_wbp_cabac_770kbps) with my pentium3 866mhz cpu
- coreavc-dshow is ~45% faster than ateme
- coreavc-tcpmp is ~75% faster than ateme

ateme _was_ the fastest decoder till now (and not publically available). compared to the available other fast decoders (libavcodec, moonlight) the speed increase is obviously even bigger

so this decoder really rocks! great job! :)

[PicardGK]

4) I can upload and send a link to my video through www.yousendit.com if you're interested.

Please upload it, if there is a little chance it will make faster finding problem. In next few days I will be still busy with some other stuff I need to finish, but I will get back to coreavc after that (cqm support is coming also).

[bond]

cqm support is coming alsouhm, actually it seems the 0.0.0.1 version of coreavc already handles cqm!
did this happen automagically? :D

no lossless and interlacing tough

[Revgen]

Please upload it, if there is a little chance it will make faster finding problem. In next few days I will be still busy with some other stuff I need to finish, but I will get back to coreavc after that (cqm support is coming also).

Uploaded the file and the link has been sent to your e-mail address.

[Sirber]

http://picard.exceed.hu/tcpmp/test/ is dead :(

[BetaBoy]

yeah.... there is an outage in the host country.

[Wedgedkc]

Huge thanks for this, I can now watch the the fountain teaser and other hd trailers in 720p on my athlon xp 1800+. Amazing!

[Sirber]

Bug: Can't use CoreAVC DShow from AVISynth. Takes 100% CPU and timeout.

[CruNcher]

Bug: Can't use CoreAVC DShow from AVISynth. Takes 100% CPU and timeout.


Known problem is being worked on actually it will load it but it takes very long ;)

[Sirber]

AVISynth timeout :) so it will never load... NEVER!!! :D

[bond]

my issues till now with coreavc:
- loading via directshowsource() doesnt work
- helix vfw yuv codecs cant handle the yv12 output of coreavc (but can handle ffdshow's yv12)
- after seeking in very rare cases the audio takes some seconds till its played again

[MatMaul]

:eek: :eek:

with a x264 high profile source (688*368), I obtain on my processor (pentium M Dothan 1,73 ghz) :

CoreAVC : 163.5 fps
ffdshow-20051230-icc-sse2 by issa : 104,1 fps (fastest build on this processor)
TCPMP : 172 fps
mplayer2005.11.23.P4 by celtic_druid : 106,7 fps

with a x264 high profile HD source (1280*720) :

CoreAVC : 69,5 fps
ffdshow-20051230-icc-sse2 by issa : 44,3 fps
TCPMP : 77 fps
mplayer2005.11.23.P4 by celtic_druid : 46,4 fps

Really good job !! Thanks a lot !!
I can now decode HD 720p trailer without dropped frames !

[Sirber]

What about mplayer?

[Revgen]

If anybody wants an easy way to register/unregister .dll, .ax, or other types of files I recommend RegDrop (http://www.addisonsw.com/revsqu.htm) . Just put the regdrop.exe onto your desktop and drag whatever file you want to register over the regdrop.exe icon and it will register the file for you. Drag that same file over the icon again to unregister it.

Works well with the CoreAVC decoder.

[MatMaul]

with this build of mplayer (http://www.aziendeassociate.it/cd//mplayer/mplayer2005.11.23.P4.7z) and this command line :
mplayer "file.mkv" -vo null -benchmark
I obtain 106,7 fps

PS : I edited my last post with a test on a hd source

[[Toff]]

I've uploaded a new version :
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/CoreAVC20060104.7z

Changelog :
Version 0.0.0.2 Alpha (20060104) :
Fixed some compatibility problems (AVI Decompressor, AviSynth, ...)
Project cleanup (smaller size)

[CruNcher]

Yep works great thx toff good work :)

[AlexW]

Hi, could one of the CoreAVC devs please have a look at this clip?: http://mirror05.x264.nl/Alex_W/force.php?file=./clips/b0rked.mp4

The problem seems to occur when the 8x8 transform is used on direct blocks in B-frames.

[Sirber]

It seems I have dropped frames with the player (0.71g). Seems to drop on low motion, so it could be the same problrm as AlexW.

[dbzgundam]

That's odd... Still no mention of CQM, yet the above posted CoreAVC can handle all my CQM encoded videos. ;)

[omion]

Wow. VERY nice.

ffdshow:
880 CABAC = 23.88 fps
720 CABAC = 32.40
720 CAVLC = 46.07

CoreAVC 0.0.0.2:
880 CABAC = 38.14
720 CABAC = 49.16
720 CAVLC = 63.67

60% faster than ffdshow at 1600x880. Very impressive! Keep up the great work!

The only quibble I have with it is that it doesn't seem to work with MPC's "VMR9 (renderless)" setting. It keeps using some sort of overlay.

[lexor]

@omion: what's up with 1600x880? what footage do you have in such a weired resolution?

[omion]

Heh. I knew somebody would ask that. The source is actually a 1920x1080 HDTV capture. I rescaled it to be 1600 wide because that's the width of my monitor. The height just came out to 880.

[futurex]

that it doesn't seem to work with MPC's "VMR9 (renderless)" setting. It keeps using some sort of overlay

i noticed that too

[[)370|\|470!2]

Is there any way of adjusting brightness/contrast?

[rozemab]

Is there any way of adjusting brightness/contrast?

options | settings | select page

You will find the sliding controls there.

[[)370|\|470!2]

options | settings | select page

You will find the sliding controls there.

..huh?


http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/5056/coreavc9ee.jpg

[Sirber]

Wasn't he talking about TCPMP?

[Sirber]

I made a test with RealAnime 4 using my new "Low Complexity" profiles and with x264 and vorbis I get 156% realtime. It seems though to have problem playing bframes in realtime though.

320x240 @ 12 FPS
1-pass CQ 36

[Caroliano]

A little n00b question: to where I shoud copy the CoreAVCDecoder.ax file to? It is the directshow filter, isn't?

[[)370|\|470!2]

A little n00b question: to where I shoud copy the CoreAVCDecoder.ax file to? It is the directshow filter, isn't?

Copy it anywhere u like, then run regsvr32.exe CoreAVCDecoder.ax

[[)370|\|470!2]

Wasn't he talking about TCPMP?


Hmm, yea, seems so..:|

[TEB]

with this build of mplayer (http://www.aziendeassociate.it/cd//mplayer/mplayer2005.11.23.P4.7z) and this command line :
mplayer "file.mkv" -vo null -benchmark
I obtain 106,7 fps

PS : I edited my last post with a test on a hd source

I tested on Saggitares x264HP_IceAge_720p_1250.mp4 on that mplayer build and TCPMP build (-nosound as default)

Mplayer w/directshow as -vo 36fps -vo null 63fps
TCMP/AVC w/directshow as -vo 77fps -vo null 97fps

URL \x264HP_IceAge_720p_1250.mp4
Size 12923107
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 3590 Mhz
Video output DirectDraw 1280x1024 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1280x720 -> 1280x720


My comment: Man this is impressive :) Keep up the good work and keep the builds coming!
Btw do u support mpeg2-ts demuxing and decoding in hd and sd?
I see that u dont use HT or Multicore/smp, is this planned to be implemented?

[rozemab]

yes, I was referencing the player, not the directshow filter.

[Caroliano]

My rounded results in a 1.7GH celeron with an 640x352 High profile Noir opening:

file -> ffdshow -> chegepuga: ~40fps
file -> coreavc -> chegepuga: ~65fps
file -> coreavc -> ffdshow -> chegepuga: ~58fps

The last is because I cant plug the coreavc into Video Render directly. If I try that the FFDShow apears automaticaly between them. Even though can conect it directly to chegepuga... maybe a compatibility bug?

[bond]

The last is because I cant plug the coreavc into Video Render directly. If I try that the FFDShow apears automaticaly between them. Even though can conect it directly to chegepuga... maybe a compatibility bug?coreavc doesnt make a colorspace conversion, so it only outputs yv12. afaik old video renderer doesnt like yv12 input. try vmr7

[Caroliano]

coreavc doesnt make a colorspace conversion, so it only outputs yv12. afaik old video renderer doesnt like yv12 input. try vmr7
I'm not familiar with Graphedit yet. It shoud be in graph -> insert filters, but where? In directshow tree? Other tree? It has exactly this name?

[bond]

I'm not familiar with Graphedit yet. It shoud be in graph -> insert filters, but where? In directshow tree? Other tree? It has exactly this name?in the mpc options you can enforce what renderer you want to use

[MatMaul]

I have edited my fps for ffdshow because there are wrong (I used a YV12->RGB conversion...)

now the values are good and it appears ffdshow=mplayer ( normal :D , they use the same library for decode...)

[Caroliano]

I tried VRM7 windowed in MPC but this way apear a lot of blocking and some artifacts in motion. With renderless is the same thing, plus that I cant see anything in fullscreen (very strange artifacts). I'm using ffdshow for an directshowsource() encode right now, this can be the problem, I don't know.

Also, it don't afect graphedit. I'm doing anything wrong?

[GhengisKhan]

This decoder is awesome - have it running from a USB drive and it almost allows me to play Apple Trailers in 1080p.

Great work Picard!

GhengisKhan

Edit. P.S. Picard do you think you could get 1080p to play perfectly for me (1.6Ghz Intel Centrino proc.)
P.P.S. Any updates about the encoder or other development... Picard... Betaboy...anyone?
P.P.P.S. How's soon can we expect a full decoder (all features implemented)?

Thanks, you guys are great!

[MatMaul]

Edit. P.S. Picard do you think you could get 1080p to play perfectly for me (1.6Ghz Intel Centrino proc.)

I can decode 1080p films with my pentium m @1,73ghz (about 35 fps)

[GhengisKhan]

Yeah, that's what I meant by saying it wasn't quite perfect yet. It's almost like I can reach it. It was like this in 720p before in Quicktime on my 1.6Ghz -almost there, but still dropping some frames. I'm sure by the time the new release comes out (the one Betaboy is probably demoing at CES), I will be able to watch 1080p trailers from www.apple.com/trailers perfectly (my brother wants to buy that new Panasonic HD camera which records in 1080p HD so this is really important to me - so I can watch what he records).

GhengisKhan

P.S. It takes too long to be allowed to post - I couldn't post when all the good stuff was being talked about... and I'm leaving (skiing) the day after I'm allowed... this sucks (Picard do me a favor and hold off on the release wait about 5 days - then release a big sucker. Just for me? Just kidding, it would be nice though... I'm so addicted to TCPMP...)

[CruNcher]

Panasonic HD camera which records in 1080p HD


Hmm but im sure it won't record in H.264, so for the raw stuff you should have no problems watching it on your specs with a fast Mpeg-2 Decoder with DXVA support.

@picard
im not sure but it seems to be the same decoding bug that AlexW experienced http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=762293&postcount=94
in this sample http://rapidshare.de/files/10498977/coreavc_decoding_prob.mp4.html

when useing (bframes 2)
--analyse all --8x8dct <- i have not such Decoding problems but when useing
--analyse p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct the problems as the sample shows occour

[Selur]

Ok, seems like I'm doing something wrong, I downloaded tcpmp.win32.0.71g.zip (from http://picard.exceed.hu/tcpmp/test/) and ice_age_2-tlrD_h1080p.mov (from http://www.apple.com/trailers/fox/ice_age_2/hd/), remuxed ice_age_2-tlrD_h1080p.mov into ice_age_2-tlrD_h1080p.mp4 using Quicktime 7pro.
Then I unziped tcpmp.win32.0.71g.zip, started player.exe, ignored the message about the aac audio decoder, opened the mp4 file and tried to play it. => 100% CPU usage and a no way watchable (to slow, skipping frames) playback. Playback works fine in TCMP using ffdshow for Audio&Video decoding, no problem watching the mp4 smoothly. (70-99% CPU usage, would be a bit less if I would use ffdshow to convert the aac stream on the fly to ac3)

Shouldn't this work? Am I doing something wrong?

Cu Selur

Ps.: running WinXpro 32bit with newest updates, 2GB RAM, Athlon 64bit 3500+, display resolution: 1920x1200.

[bond]

selur, you need to get avc.plg, which is available together with the aac.plg in an extra package on the page

[Selur]

Ah, okay, thx.
Just tested the directshowdecoder. :)
CPU usage dropped to 46-75%, nice. :D

Thx, bond worked fine, CPU usage even dropped another 5%. ;)

Cu Selur

Ps.: Nice work CoreCoded-Team :D

[JoeBG]

selur, you need to get avc.plg, which is available together with the aac.plg in an extra package on the page

@ Selur

You got it? :D

[Selur]

yup, that's why I inserted 'Thx, bond worked fine, CPU usage even dropped another 5%.' :D

[cjei]

I hope CoreAVC can have these color conversion options :
ColorMatrix("Rec.709->Rec.601")
ColorMatrix("Rec.601->Rec.709")
ColorYUV(levels="TV->PC")

Because vmr7&9 seems to need PC scale YUV
and overlay needs Rec.709 for HD.

[falcon2000eg]

Is there any way of adjusting brightness/contrast?

yes i hope that (in the dshow decodr i mean) to quit using ffdshow.

[[Toff]]

yes i hope that (in the dshow decodr i mean) to quit using ffdshow.

Graphic cards already have settings for that, why would you want to have settings in each video decoder ? That mean that each time you install a new decoder, you have to tweak its settings. If you want to have 2 or more configurations, for example for day and night, you need to change again all the settings in all the video decoders.

[[)370|\|470!2]

']Graphic cards already have settings for that, why would you want to have settings in each video decoder ? That mean that each time you install a new decoder, you have to tweak its settings. If you want to have 2 or more configurations, for example for day and night, you need to change again all the settings in all the video decoders.

It's not always help to brighten the picture, especially when color conversion applied. Darken details are still unwatchable.

[[Toff]]

It's not always help to brighten the picture, especially when color conversion applied. Darken details are still unwatchable.

How would that be different with decoder level brigthness settings ?

[[)370|\|470!2]

']How would that be different with decoder level brigthness settings ?


Hmm, just thought, that applying brightness before rendering on more deeper level is more effective...

[bobololo]

I did a quick test using TheGreatestGame_HD_AVC.mp4 trailer (1920x1080p) available from nerodigital.com and timeCodec from Haali. I'm running an AMD X2 4400+ @ 2420 MHz.

Nero: 52.3 fps
CoreAVC: 45.3 fps
Ateme: 30.6 fps

As you can see CoreAVC shows really good performance it's only beaten by nero decoder which exploits both cores of my CPU while others don't.

[bond]

I did a quick test using TheGreatestGame_HD_AVC.mp4 trailer (1920x1080p) available from nerodigital.com and timeCodec from Haali. I'm running an AMD X2 4400+ @ 2420 MHz.

Nero: 52.3 fps
CoreAVC: 45.3 fps
Ateme: 30.6 fps

As you can see CoreAVC shows really good performance it's only beaten by nero decoder which exploits both cores of my CPU while others don't.well bobololo left some of his values away:
the values he posted are for plain decoding (eg via avisynth). for playback (via directshow) the display fps shown by haalis tool are important and these are in bobololo's setup:

CoreAVC: 45.1 fps
Nero: 36.1 fps
Ateme: 30.6 fps

as you can see coreavc is faster than nero for playback, even altough nero is multithreaded and coreavc isnt, so i wouldnt say nero is able to beat it at all

[videomixer9]

Athlon XP 3000+, 1 GB Dualchannel DDR333 RAM, TheGreatestGame_HD_AVC.mp4, Haali timeCodec

ffdshow 04 Jan 2006
User: 173s, kernel: 0s, total: 174s, real: 180s, fps: 21.1, dfps: 20.3
CoreAVC:
User: 107s, kernel: 0s, total: 107s, real: 111s, fps: 34.1, dfps: 32.8

Plays fine and in sync with CoreAVC and stutters otherwise, I guess I say byebye to ffdshow, too bad I cannot use quicktime decoder in timeCodec as I'm sure that one would be by far slower, tried with an apple trailer that stutters around totally in Quicktime Player and test result was this, besides the totally fluent playback in the player (x-men_3-pre_teaser_h1080p.mov):
User: 42s, kernel: 0s, total: 42s, real: 48s, fps: 55.7, dfps: 49.4
Apple ever going to update their crappy decoders? I got lots of ppl that think their PC is not ready for HDTV stuff because of the bad performance of Quicktime ...

Hope CoreAVC will be improved and regularly released soon!

[SeeMoreDigital]

What a fabulous little MPEG-4 AVC decoder....

With it I've been able to play some 1280x720 samples quite perfectly, samples that previously stuttered ;)


Great work guys.... once AR signalling detection is included, it will be a brilliant little MPEG-4 AVC decoder :)


Cheers

[bobololo]

well bobololo left some of his values away:
the values he posted are for plain decoding (eg via avisynth). for playback (via directshow) the display fps shown by haalis tool are important and these are in bobololo's setup:

CoreAVC: 45.1 fps
Nero: 36.1 fps
Ateme: 30.6 fps

as you can see coreavc is faster than nero for playback, even altough nero is multithreaded and coreavc isnt, so i wouldnt say nero is able to beat it at all

LOL that's really funny to see how strong you're defending OSS things (is CoreAVC OSS btw ?) against evil commercial things ;). That even brings you to post mis-leading information without rigorously checking them !

To come back to the topic, our main interest here is to compare the raw performance of the decoders no matter what there is around (dshow, displaying, rendering, etc.). And this raw performance is indicated by the fps entry from timeCodec as Haali explained to you. I provided the figures corresponding to it in my post above.

The display fps (dfps) gives the actual framerate of the whole display graph if I understand correct and therefore it includes many things like parsing, rendering, output color conversion, displaying, etc. that are to my opinion out of the previous scope.

I don't know the reason why the dfps is quite lower with nero decoder, but it's rather abnormal since I used the null renderer in which case the fps should be close to the dfps (as it's verified with other decoders btw). I have the feeling that for some reasons, an unknown additional filter had been added in nero's case and drastically slowed down the display graph given its poor result. Whatever the cause, it doesn't change the raw performance figures showing that nero is faster than CoreAVC and there is no discussion possible here (unless there are some issues in the way timeCodec does its job).

And as a conclusion to my 2 cents' comment :), I would suggest you to spend your energy bitching CoreAVC devs to exploit MT optimization to definitively bring it far ahead from others decoders instead of trying to arrange actual facts that don't please your taste ;). That would be much more useful for the development progress !

[fight2win]

hi,
i have done some avc encodes using megui x264, high profile with jvt turned on, so will core avc decoder be able to play them?

[bond]

LOL that's really funny to see how strong you're defending OSS things (is CoreAVC OSS btw ?) against evil commercial things ;). That even brings you to post mis-leading information without rigorously checking them !coreavc is not oss, as i see it its indeed a "commercial" solution, given away for free tough (till now)

i simply posted the info you left away, i see nothing wrong with that

To come back to the topic, our main interest here is to compare the raw performance of the decoders no matter what there is around (dshow, displaying, rendering, etc.). And this raw performance is indicated by the fps entry from timeCodec as Haali explained to you. I provided the figures corresponding to it in my post above."our" interest is not what you described here, as its not your job to decide what our main interest is.

imho the main interest is how nero and coreavc perform during playback, as currently avc decoders are as good as always used for playback
if nero does some wierd colorspace conversion or something else during playback which slows it down, it still makes it slower than coreavc during playback

therefore the dfps value is interesting and shows that during playback coreavc is faster than nero
you should have at least provided us that info

[Sagittaire]

Bond use simple core CPU
bobololo use dual core CPU

perhaps simple SMTP optimisation for Nero Decoder ... ???

[lexor]

Bond use simple core CPU
bobololo use dual core CPU

perhaps simple SMTP optimisation for Nero Decoder ... ???
that's not what's happening above, from my understanding of what bobololo did, is that he just measured performance of pure decoding (without playback) to raw of each decoder. bond posted bobololo's figures but with playback component added in, I think the number bond posted are also from bobololo's test not bond's own, just bobololo didn't post those since he compared the raw perfomace.

As you can see both ateme and coreavc didn't take a performance hit (barely a dent in decimal part) when you add the playback component in (since they are both single threaded, just like dsfilters and players) whereas nero took a nose dive since its multi-threaded performance was negated by necessity to wait for the single threaded dsfilters and players.

I think the result of the comparison that bobololo made is that it doesn't matter if one step is multi-threaded, you gotta get all software in your playback chain multi-threaded, or you don't get benefit. Thanks for that bobo :) makes me feel better about not having dual core just yet.

[Doom9]

well, since there's such a significant difference between pure decoding and the whole playback stream, that would warrant some investigation on which filter uses how much CPU time so see if there's a bottleneck somewhere, if there's a filter that may be unable to cope with the amount of data the decoder feeds it and starts to choke. Comparing the CPU usage in both scenarios might also be interesting.. are both cores really being maxed out in the DShow scenario? If not but they are in the pure decoding scenario, that would be a strong indicator that one of the additional filters used by dshow playback causes a slowdown.

And as far as QT goes.. perhaps Apple will learn by the year 3000 but I wouldn't expect anything before that. They may make good video editing software but encoding and decoding video is another story entirely.

[CruNcher]

bobololo use dual core CPU


I think he uses a P4 Hyperthreading Cpu no Dual Core, anyway
all of you here entirely forget what CoreAVC is about and that it's still in early Development and from that result it shows here in that state as a ST Decoder against an MT Version of Neros Decoder i would call that allready much better low level optimized and in ST Mode it looks completly different, because that's what Picard optimized CoreAVC initialy for (showcased on CES @ the Sandisk and HP booth) Single Core Mobile Devices and now with the first Dual Core Mobile Devices and Multimedia CE Devices showing up im sure Picard gonna enhance it even further also in that direction and it really seems to be a Dshow bottleneck like lexor said that the Nero filter can render faster in MT mode but can't display it out as fast. But anyway in my eyes that doesn't make Neros Decoder better even if it could provide the same speed for the output :P

Before Picard goes on optimizing it for Dual Core i think it's more important to fix the for now last known Decoding bug inside it. That would be http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=762293&postcount=94

[lexor]

I think he uses a P4 Hyperthreading Cpu no Dual Core, anyway

I'm running an AMD X2 4400+ @ 2420 MHz.
how did you get P4 out of that? :cool:

[videomixer9]

I'm quite amazed the difference between X2 4400+ and XP 3000+ is only ~11fps with CoreAVC, guess the 4400+ is only given with both cores fully used ... so far the test seem to be kinda unfair and I'd wonder how it'll turn out once CoreAVC does multithreading ... if Nero would equally spread the load on the two cores the amount of fps bobololo reached isn't that impressive really ... it'd mean that Nero only got 26,15 fps out of each core, that's less fps than CoreAVC managed on my single core XP 3000+. Considering the overclocking from 2200mhz to 2420mhz this is a real bad performance imo.

[Doom9]

it really seems to be a Dshow bottleneck like lexor said that the Nero filter can render faster in MT mode but can't display it out as fast.That's not correct. There's decoding, and then there's filters after it.. it really needs to come down to analyzing the filter and what percentage of CPU they use (in relation to the complete available CPU power). Assuming everything before the decoder filters is the same, and further assuming that there's just the renderer after the decoder, the renderer might be doing something screwed up. Since when it comes to raw decoding power, the Nero decoder appears to be the fastest, and it no longer is when there's a renderer in the picture, wouldn't it be reasonable to suspect the renderer as a bottleneck, and that much of a bottleneck that it actually punishes fast decoders?

[videomixer9]

null renderer is shit, vmr7 has better dfps on my system :)
(at least with fps this low, on mpeg4 decoding with over 300fps it cannot keep up, still quite mysterious)

[CruNcher]

@lexor
oops yeah i oversaw that last time i spoke with him about the results of the Nero filter he was on a P4 HT ;)

[bobololo]

Whatever the cause, it doesn't change the raw performance figures showing that nero is faster than CoreAVC and there is no discussion possible here (unless there are some issues in the way timeCodec does its job).

Thanks to Haali's help, we finally sorted out what was happening. Due to the way timeCodec is measuring the decoding time, it doesn't account all running threads which cause the incorrect fps measurement with nero decoder since is multithreaded. According to Haali, dfps when using null renderer is close enough to the actual decoding fps (less than 1% error when using long enough clip). So finally, I redid my bench and the results are summarized as follow :

CoreAVC: 48.6 fps
Nero: 39.6 fps
Ateme: 33.6 fps
ffdshow: 30.7 fps

On my AMD X2 @ 2420 MHz (I recently upgraded my hardware from a P4/HT @ 3 GHz) which means that if there isn't any further measurement mistake, CoreAVC outperforms any decoders around even without exploiting MT. It's just impressive, and we'll have some hard work to catch up ;) !

update: added ffdshow's result

[PicardGK]

Actually I'am not at CES, but busy with Symbian porting of TCPMP.

I found the decoding bug (bframe + 8x8dct) and the problem with mkv under TCPMP. But as I understand the CoreAVC ddshow filter was not effected by this mkv timing problem.

I will compile a new TCPMP build tomorrow.

Multithreaded decoding, x86-64bit build are on my todo list, the problem is time and I have to prioritize. Probably adding some mmx color space transformation support will be the first (which will also help TCPMP with other codecs)

CQM support was added a while back. The second version of ddshow filter already has it, but TCPMP binaries not yet.

[lexor]

sorry pickard, someone at corecodec forums said you were at CES, and the bit about coreAVC I admit I just made up :) the original poster with mkv problem did say he was using TCPMP getting the problem (so do I) so I'm going to grab that new version asap when released :)

[Ice =A=]

Seems to be very fast indeed. But you should describe a little more clearly what to download and how to "install" the plugin, that's what kept me from testing it the last few days...
Then again, measured by this forum's standards I'm quite a noob... :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

CoreAVC outperforms any decoders around even without exploiting MT. It's just impressive, and we'll have some hard work to catch up ;) !Thanks for your confirmation bobololo. It's very gracious of you ;)

[kurt]

just noticed version 0.71h is up :)

version 0.71h
+aspect ratio support for mkv files
+avc cqm support
-mkv avc timing fix
-avc bug fixes
http://picard.exceed.hu/tcpmp/test/

download is very slow - so i made a mirror (http://home.arcor.de/mutterstadt/)
(hope this is ok?)

[bond]

just noticed version 0.71h is up :)anamorphic resize with mp4 in tcpmp works fine now too

[Sirber]

Did the 8x8 dct on bframes bug resolved?

[PicardGK]

Did the 8x8 dct on bframes bug resolved?
It should be. It's up to Toff to build a new dshow filter.

[Sirber]

Still the same problem with TCPMP 0.71h: bframes are dropped completly.

[bond]

Still the same problem with TCPMP 0.71h: bframes are dropped completly.sure you placed the new avc.plg into the tcpmp folder?
my avc mp4 streams with b-frames are played very nicely on my pentium3 866mhz

[PicardGK]

Still the same problem with TCPMP 0.71h: bframes are dropped completly.
Is this with mkv files? Does file/media info dialog show the dropped frames? Does this sample also drop frames? http://rapidshare.de/files/10655776/test-002.mkv.html

Make sure both the player and avc files are updated. Check version in about for 0.71h and check media info for CoreAVC video codec.

[Sirber]

duh!

I only upadted the player lol

works #1 now :D

[thetrueavatar]

Oops I forgot to update tpcmp. Now both tcpmp and plugins are up to date and it works fine with my mkv. Great job and keep going.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I'm getting a bit confused...

What's the latest direct-show encoder? The one I currently have installed is CoreAVCDecoder.ax v0.0.0.2 Alpha (2006-01-04).


Cheers

[travisbell]

I'm getting a bit confused...

What's the latest direct-show encoder? The one I currently have installed is CoreAVCDecoder.ax v0.0.0.2 Alpha (2006-01-04).


Cheers

I believe that is still the most updated. Only the Core player and plugin were just updated.

[nurbs]

I have some performance issues with TCPMP. I have 2 PCs, one with a 2 GHz Athlon XP and one with a 1.8 GHz Athlon 64.
I tested a 1080p trailer from Apple.

video not displayed; audio deactivated
Athlon XP: 180%
Athlon 64: 245%

video direct draw; audio wave out
Athlon XP: 120%
Athlon 64: 65% ;choosing GDI does improve this by ~ 5%

The trailer actually plays fine on the Athlon 64 as long as I keep the default window size, but when I go fullscreen the framerate drops and its not watchable any more.

[PicardGK]

Is the updated timeCodec.exe somewhere available?
How did you guys benchmark Nero7 filter when it only works in Showtime?

[PicardGK]

Athlon 64: 65% ;choosing GDI does improve this by ~ 5%
My guess the ddraw overlay mode didn't kick in or it couldn't use yv12 format. The fallback mode is kind of useless (unoptimized) at the moment. Fullscreen slowing down, means the player uses (fallback) software scaling.

[kurt]

I don't know if this is the right time to ask, but are there any plans to implement spdif output for AC3/dts/HE-AAC?
that would be great for all receiver owners :)

[asdfsauce]

I'm a little confused. Does the latest corecodec dshow filter do h.264? And if so, where can I get it?

[kurt]

I'm a little confused. Does the latest corecodec dshow filter do h.264? And if so, where can I get it?
yes it does, look here for download: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=762244#post762244

[thetrueavatar]

Since it's coreAVCdecoder there is a lot of chance that it does :p

[asdfsauce]

Thanks kurt,

Very nice decoder, cut my CPU usage in half with MPC.

[[Toff]]

New DirectShow filter build up :
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/CoreAVC20060109.7z

Changelog :
Version 0.0.0.3 Alpha (20060109) :
CQM support
Fix for 8x8dct
Flush buffered frame
Support for X264 and x264 FOURCCs
Now use MERIT_NORMAL

[travisbell]

Awesome! Just gave it a try and love it. .mkv's seem to working properly with 0.0.0.3.

Keep up the good work guys!

[ChronoReverse]

Works and is fast. This wins.


I'm not sure how the Aspect signaling things work but an clip in mp4 resized itself automatically (like it should) in Zoomplayer when I tried playing it using 0.0.0.2 (and 0.0.0.3). So does this already support it or is this something about the container that Haali's splitter handles instead?

[foxyshadis]

I know this is a little off-topic, but since I want to switch off ffdshow to use this for a while, is there a way I can run the output through avisynth without creating a new script with directshowsource(file) for every file? If not I'll find a way around it with batch files or scripts, but it'd be cooler if it did. ;)

[SeeMoreDigital]

I'm not sure how the Aspect signaling things work but an clip in mp4 resized itself automatically (like it should) in Zoomplayer when I tried playing it using 0.0.0.2 (and 0.0.0.3). So does this already support it or is this something about the container that Haali's splitter handles instead?AR signalling detection does not appear to be working in either .AVI or .MP4 for me :(

[ChronoReverse]

No idea why it works for me and not you =(

I have the latest Haali Splitter installed and played the .mp4 (video only) clip using Zoomplayer Standard 4.51 using Derived Aspect setting.

The .mp4 file is a 640x432 video with the pixel set to 6:5 in megui. Zoomplayer automatically resizes to 768x432 (in VMR9 Windowed... VMR9 Windowless seems to have a bug with it) with both FFDSHOW and CoreAVC.

Of course, I'm probably not understanding how it works...


confirmed: it only works with CoreAVC + haali splitter. gabest splitter failed for mp4....

Ah, there it is. I'm using Haali's Splitter.

[kurt]

AR signalling detection does not appear to be working in either .AVI or .MP4 for me :(
confirmed: it only works with CoreAVC + haali splitter. gabest splitter failed for mp4....
TCPMP works fine btw :)

testfile (http://home.arcor.de/evil.bert/test/hq%20slowest.cqm.sar.mp4)

[bond]

anamorphic resize doesnt work here with coreavc with either haali or gabests mp4 splitter with vmr7 and vmr9
haali works with overlay mixer (1 and 2) and the old video renderer, but gabest doesnt

[ChronoReverse]

anamorphic resize doesnt work here with coreavc with either haali or gabests mp4 splitter with vmr7 and vmr9
haali works with overlay mixer (1 and 2) and the old video renderer, but gabest doesnt


Okay... now I need to figure out what I did to make it work on my end with VMR9 Windowed.

[wata]

anyone using matrox g400 32mb (latest driver)
can't play any 720p trailers from apple using directdraw, 50% drop frames
if switch to gdi, playable but with a few drop frames
i am using amd64 3500+ with asus a8v deluxe board
i saw people using axthonxp and play 1080i no problem, does this have to do with the old videocard i am having, any setting to fix.

the same trailer clip can be play using either nero or ffdshow filter with mpc.

[ChronoReverse]

If you're using VMR modes, it's almost certainly it since those modes require a fast enough video card that can handle the resolutions you're playing at.

[wata]

i am using the latest tcmp player with the latest avc plugin to play

[ChronoReverse]

Not sure then since I haven't used that player.


Bug report (I think).

Media Player Classic 6.4.8.7
Video clip is Vorbis + AVC + .ass softsubs inside .mkv using AR signaling.

When using CoreAVC Aspect Ratio is automatically corrected in MPC, but the softsubs will not show up.

As soon as I switch back to ffdshow, Aspect Ratio is no longer automatically corrected but the softsubs do show up.

Incidentally, in Zoomplayer, the Aspect Ratio is corrected regardless of whether I use CoreAVC or ffdshow.

Hmm, none of the VMR9 features in MPC seem to work with CoreAVC. Does CoreAVC do something that doesn't jive with VMR9 renderless?

[kurt]

anyone using matrox g400 32mb (latest driver)
can't play any 720p trailers from apple using directdraw, 50% drop frames
if switch to gdi, playable but with a few drop frames
i am using amd64 3500+ with asus a8v deluxe board
i saw people using axthonxp and play 1080i no problem, does this have to do with the old videocard i am having, any setting to fix.

the same trailer clip can be play using either nero or ffdshow filter with mpc.
I also have this videocard - but in my secondary pc (PIII, 1ghz, 256 MB RAM)...

full anamporphic x264 dvdrips (704x432) are able to play smoothly up to ~2000kbps with AC3 sound in mkv container with this decoder :) (need to do some more tests with even higher bitrates)

Did you try mplayer for comparison? (have a look here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=727638#post727638) to setup mplayer)
The hdtv trailers (720p) I didn't check out yet (could do this only at the weekend) but in my case I guess the cpu/low RAM is the limited factor ...

[dzy]

Hmm, none of the VMR9 features in MPC seem to work with CoreAVC. Does CoreAVC do something that doesn't jive with VMR9 renderless?

VMR9 doesn't accept the two output formats CoreAVC supports now. Colorspace convertion might cause a severe performance impact though.

[videomixer9]

For me it works just fine ... using DirectX 9 Dec 2005, GeForce FX 5600 and 83.10 Forceware with MPC and 0.0.0.3 DShow CoreAVC and Haali, both Overlay and VMR9 ... anamorphic encodes also play fine incl. softsubs (both vsfilter and mpc internal one).

[SeeMoreDigital]

For me it works just fine ... using DirectX 9 Dec 2005, GeForce FX 5600 and 83.10 Forceware with MPC and 0.0.0.3 DShow CoreAVC and Haali, both Overlay and VMR9 ... anamorphic encodes also play fine incl. softsubs (both vsfilter and mpc internal one).Hmmmm!

Somewhere along the line Haali's filters must be interpreting the "streams" AR signalling data and sending it along to the media player, because without Haali I can't get AR signalling to work at all in MPC or (shock horror) WMP10.


Cheers

[bond]

basically the nero mp4 parser was the one which introduced the way how avc mp4 parsing is done now in as good as all mp4 parsers (haali, gabest, elecard...), so its in a way the benchmark

coreavc shows the same behaviour with the nero parser as with gabest here, which tells me coreavc doesnt read out the anamorphic resize correctly it gets from the parsers (they attach the SPS/PPS storing the ar info)
propably haali does something additional/different which makes coreavc work

but still, this means coreavc has incomplete anamorphic resize support with mp4

[SeeMoreDigital]

....but still, this means coreavc has incomplete anamorphic resize support with mp4Agreed ;)

[BetaBoy]

picard noted it is on Toff to add it to the DS filter as the decoder now can pass the AR info parsed from video stream.

[Ice =A=]

@ChronoReverse:
Could you tell me how to use CoreAVC in MPC? Thanks!

[ChronoReverse]

Um, I'm presuming you mean how to install the CoreAVCDecoder.ax? MPC uses dshow filters just like many other players do.

In WinXP:

regsvr32 <pathto>\CoreAVCDecoder.ax

You may have to open the ffdshow settings and turn off h.264 decoding (stop it from using libavcodec).

[lexor]

ooh and Pickard (or anyone from Core team or anyone else for that matter) is there a way to make seek slider appear in full screen? it's kinda weired now having to minimize to seek.

[Ice =A=]

@ChronoReverse: Thanks for your help, I mixed up the direct-show decoder with that tcpmp plugin. To be honest, I still don't quite understand it, but I don't have to know everything... :)

[ChronoReverse]

VMR9 doesn't accept the two output formats CoreAVC supports now. Colorspace convertion might cause a severe performance impact though.

I'm not sure if this has been asked yet, but what are the two formats that CoreAVC uses?

And which are the ones that VMR9 supports?

Check that, is it YUY2 and RGB?

[videomixer9]

VMR9 Renderless in MPC seems to have YUY2 enforced, windowed always used YV12 with videos also using it if I didn't convert to RGB manually.

VMR9 is btw. b0rked for me since some time already, fullscreen stutters around or it stutters if I put another window on top of MPC, with any video driver and decoder ... dunno what's so great about VMR9 anyways, just keep using Overlay, works great and bugfree ... I only remember a post that CoreAVC supports only YV12 ... did I overread another format being supported now?

[ChronoReverse]

VMR9 Renderless in MPC seems to have YUY2 enforced, windowed always used YV12 with videos also using it if I didn't convert to RGB manually.

VMR9 is btw. b0rked for me since some time already, fullscreen stutters around or it stutters if I put another window on top of MPC, with any video driver and decoder ... dunno what's so great about VMR9 anyways, just keep using Overlay, works great and bugfree ... I only remember a post that CoreAVC supports only YV12 ... did I overread another format being supported now?


Does it now?


As for VMR9 being borked, it works fine for me. I generally use it in MPC for the prettier softsubs (the only reason I use MPC). In ZP, I turn it on for the VMR9 style colour controls.

[videomixer9]

Oh well it my VMR9 works but not using Direct3D, if you render with Direct3D it fails with stuttering around ... as to SeeMoreDigital ... maybe try another ASP decoder, if the decoder somehow enforces this, not like there not enough MPEG4 SP/ASP decoders ... (oh well seems many more answered before me, quite much activity currently here!)

As Toff already mentioned I too dislike the concept of those huge all incl. packs like ffdshow as it's basically killing the dshow concept ... I like to have each for it's own ... especially as you can get the best for anything then easily without having to carry around the bloat of other ffdshow stuff e.g. like I never needed all those filters in ffdshow and some things like the vorbis decoder was always buggy.

[[Toff]]

I'm not sure if this has been asked yet, but what are the two formats that CoreAVC uses?

And which are the ones that VMR9 supports?

Check that, is it YUY2 and RGB?

CoreAVC currently output YV12 or I420 which are 12 bits planar format (Y,U,V plane are separated and not interlaced like YUY2 for example).

VMR9 support is probably dependant of the hardware you use. For example here it support YV12 without problem (Radeon 9600 pro).

I mostly use just the old Overlay Mixer myself.

[videomixer9]

I think not supporting YV12 for a video renderer would be quite dumb as almost any material is encoded in YV12 ...

[[Toff]]

About AR handling, I'v only tried Haali splitter so it's very possible to be buggy with other splitters. I will try Gabest's splitter.

[ChronoReverse]

']CoreAVC currently output YV12 or I420 which are 12 bits planar format (Y,U,V plane are separated and not interlaced like YUY2 for example).

VMR9 support is probably dependant of the hardware you use. For example here it support YV12 without problem (Radeon 9600 pro).

I mostly use just the old Overlay Mixer myself.


Well looking at the Graph information output in Zoomplayer, both ffdshow and coreAVC outputs to yv12 and works fine in VMR9 (i.e., the VMR9 colour controls work).


It seems like with MPC, it somehow renders not using VMR9 though...

[videomixer9]

Btw. I noticed a quite funny thing, while the aspect ratio is mostly correct with actual playback, te thumbnails created via haali for video with AVC are wrong in aspect ratio ... with other codecs this works fine in any container, thumbnails are all stretched to max size. I dunno how thumbnails are generated, but as I understand it create a graph for the requested frame and shows this, with ffdshow widescreen movies had fitting aspect ratio thumbnails, with CoreAVC not ... odd.

[SoleBastard]

Wow, this decoder just rocks:

I tried it on my Tungsten T5 (Intel Xscale 420MHz) with a personal encode using the following encoding settings:

Nero Recode 'Max definition' (b-frames, CABAC, the works)
576x328
25fps
80kbps HE-AAC
around 600kbps video bitrate

...And it *almost* runs smoothly! With 'Disable AVC deblocking filter' it runs with acceptable speed (stillf frame-dropping but in sync) at full screen! This is just amazing :D. I hope if I'd use LC-AAC and 480*xxx I can get smooth playback on my T5...

Thank you for this kick ass decoder 8)

/edit

benchmark info (disabled avc-deblocking filter):
Average speed: 60.55%
Benchmark FPS: 15.14

Ah well, I guess it looks better then the cold hard numbers tell. Can't spoil the fun for me though ;-)

[videomixer9]

well as long as anybody knows what is meant, it's just that 4CC is understood by much more ppl then those who'll know instantly what subtype will describe ...

Except that tool like hypersnap are imo useless you cannot capture overlays really, no matter which tool you're using. What you see in your shoot is the video you opened and it moves as the overlay position is set to your player coordinates, but the color supposed to be the placeholder for the video also works in screenshots of it, thus overlay video is also placed into any areas that have the same overlay colorcode.

Btw. usually in the filter list overlay mixer or videomixing renderer 7 should appear listed, my filterlist only looks like yours if ancient rendering is used. Oh well whatever, maybe something to do with the standard thing.

[sillKotscha]

you cannot capture overlays really, no matter which tool you're using.

hmm, look above at SMDs screencapture_image...

What you see in your shoot is the video you opened and it moves as the overlay position is set to your player coordinates, but the color supposed to be the placeholder for the video also works in screenshots of it, thus overlay video is also placed into any areas that have the same overlay colorcode.

I know, I know... it's just the fact that I thought hypersnap might do well in that respect

Btw. usually in the filter list overlay mixer or videomixing renderer 7 should appear listed

it does, if another renderer is used instead of the standard one :)

Oh well whatever, maybe something to do with the standard thing.

see above...

[videomixer9]

whenever I use standard vmr9 pops up even though vmr7 and overlay mixer work fine ...

[ChronoReverse]

hmm, look above at SMDs screencapture_image...

He's probably using a VMR mode in which case screenshots work just fine (and another reason I use VMR).

[AVmaniac]

I did a reencode on the X-Men3-HD-Trailer with megui-x264-awesome-setting
[1920x816@2048kbps]
When using ffdshow for the decoding i had a 99% CPU load on my Athlon64-3400+So754 Machine ...
Since i use the CoreAVC-DS-Filter i've an average load of 65% for the same video ...

simlpy GREAT !!!
You folks at CoreCodec really did a great job !!!! THX !!!!! and please go on !!!

[Sharktooth]

This thing is getting faster and faster... :D
Keep up the good work guys

[FFWD]

Hi BetaBoy,

I have an iPaq rx3715 Windows Mobile 2003SE pocket pc. I installed these components on my iPaq File Store;

tcpmp.setup.0.71h.exe
ac3.setup.0.71h.exe
ffmpeg.setup.0.71h.exe
avc.setup.0.71h.exe
tcpmp_aac_plugin.windows_mobile.0.66.zip

However, when I try to play back an H.264/AVC file, I get an "avc decoder not found" error. If I remove the "avc.setup.0.71h.exe" plug-in, I can play back the file (with ffmpeg plug-in), but I only see a new frame each 5 seconds :-/

The .mp4 file was made with MeGUi and the x264 codec. I used the MeGui HQ Slowest preset.

[bob0r]

What about a splitter and decoder in 1?

Once CoreAVCDecoder.ax is "finished" and ready to ship with the x264 installer, it would be great to run a splitter at the same time, as then we have a complete package.

I will still host the alternative splitters and decoders, but its just a thought on how to further take over the world.

[grouik]

Very Nice Decoder i can now play 720p AVC trailer on a simple 2400+ with sdram, 1080p need a little more power it was playaing at 22 fps as well

Good Job and Thanks a lot

What about a "corevc1" ? (joke)

[3ngel]

Many compliments for the AVC ds filter, this filter was something really miss :cool:

You may ask for a CoreASP
This would be another SO GREAT thing to have :), as now ASP is the most difficult coding to read correctly (atm only Nero itself and 3ivx decode it correctly, ffdshow has a little brightness problem (and moreover i hate ffdshow :))).

[GhengisKhan]

Hahaha! I love you Picard! Unbelievable! My 1.6Ghz Intel Centrino Proc. now can decode 1080p perfectly! Actually, the benchmark said 117.83% average speed (that's with one IE page open - it couldn't even decode it that well before)!

This is all using TCPMP Win32. I couldn't get it to work properly using the Directshow filter in WMP10. But, playing in TCPMP is enough for me now!

Thanks again Picard - and all the other devs helping :thanks: ,

GhengisKhan :cool:

P.S. I am considering "switching" (that means dual booting) to Mac (Intel Macs of course). Can anyone tell me about how the development is going that arena? I'm assuming it won't be that big of a deal - but, I can't be sure. Thanks again.

P.P.S. why don't I get audio in WMP10 (playing 1080p V is for Vendetta Trailer 2) and why does it skip so many frames? I thought the Directshow filter wasn't supposed to be that much slower...

[tomos]

just found out about this tonight, worked a treat - thanks all and keep up the good work :)

[[Toff]]

New build up :
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/CoreAVC20060113.7z

Version 0.0.0.4 Alpha (20060113) :
Support for VSSH FOURCC
Support for YUY2 output
Force anamorphic flag on renderer

You can thank Haali for this release ;-)

(I haven't look at this .ts sample yet)

[chichazor]

¿Can anybody make a simple setup for the directshow version?

[ChronoReverse]

Cool, I'll test this out as soon as I get home.


@chichazor

I have a few batch files to do it but frankly, just use Regdrop (http://www.addisonsw.com/revsqu.htm). Drag the ax to the executable to register it and drag it with shift held down to unregister.

[Scoty]

this Codec is very great. with MPC i can run it but how can i use with WMP 9 or 10 ?

[loni_blues]

And for lossless support?

[ChronoReverse]

']New build up :
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/CoreAVC20060113.7z

Version 0.0.0.4 Alpha (20060113) :
Support for VSSH FOURCC
Support for YUY2 output
Force anamorphic flag on renderer

You can thank Haali for this release ;-)


Haali gets a cookie. VMR9 Renderless mode is working perfectly in Media Player Classic now. I'm getting my automatic aspect ratio and my softsubs.

[Pookie]

You CoreAVC guys deserve medals for this big leap in playback functionality, and I mean BIG !

Thank you very, very much :)

[LigH]

']Support for YUY2 output
...
You can thank Haali for this release ;-)
Yes - thank you [Toff], thank you Haali. YUY2 output will help my old and crappy GeForce2 a little.

[hippoth]

@BetaBoy

A new TCMP-version (NOT TCPMP) is coming soon (I hope so). What can we expect in relation to AVC support? Is it similar to TCPMP?

[SeeMoreDigital]

Hmmm.

I'm still unable to get anamorphiclly signalled MPEG-4 AVC streams within AVI to auto AR in Media Player Classic or WMP10. And it's no-go with MPEG-4 AVC streams within MP4 in Media Player Classic too!

When tested on my other WinXP boot, the same encodes work fine with Haali's splitter!


Cheers

[sillKotscha]

Hmmm.

I'm still unable to get anamorphiclly signalled MPEG-4 AVC streams within AVI to auto AR in Media Player Classic or WMP10. And it's no-go with MPEG-4 AVC streams within MP4 in Media Player Classic too!

at first I've experienced the same beahviour with your posteted clip - but than I've reinstalled latest Haali Media Splitter and wOOt :)

what about http://tcpmp.corecodec.org/tcpmpx/index.htm ?

I can't see anything 'cause FireFox does need a plugin and I'm to dumb to install the required one...

[bond]

basically the nero mp4 parser was the one which introduced the way how avc mp4 parsing is done now in as good as all mp4 parsers (haali, gabest, elecard...), so its in a way the benchmark

coreavc shows the same behaviour with the nero parser as with gabest here, which tells me coreavc doesnt read out the anamorphic resize correctly it gets from the parsers (they attach the SPS/PPS storing the ar info)
propably haali does something additional/different which makes coreavc work

but still, this means coreavc has incomplete anamorphic resize support with mp4still the case with 0.0.0.4

anamorphic resize works with haali's mp4 parser, but not with nero's (and all the other mp4 parsers acting the same way as nero, like gabest, elecard...)

therefore i think haali does something different than all the others making coreavc not resize and therefore the support in coreavc is, unfortunately, still incomplete

[SeeMoreDigital]

....therefore i think haali does something different than all the others making coreavc not resize and therefore the support in coreavc is, unfortunately, still incompleteAgreed....

I cross-checked to see if Media Player Classic's own internal MP4 parser was working okay by playing some anamorphic MPEG-1 and MPEG-2 in MP4 streams (muxed using YAMB/MP4box) and they work perfectly ;)


Cheers

[bond]

'] Support for YUY2 outputthx to this i can now connect to vmr9 without the need for the avi decompressor doing the colorspace conversion

some random speed comparison between yv12 and yuy2 output:

yv12: 72.32fps
yuy2: 67.47fps (-7%)

edit:
is the colorspace conversion done in coreavc lossless?

[3ngel]

New build up :
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/CoreAVC20060113.7z

Version 0.0.0.4 Alpha (20060113) :
Support for VSSH FOURCC
Support for YUY2 output
Force anamorphic flag on renderer

It works absolutely great on my side! Great!

One question, how can i know what colorspace is used during the decoding? I use MPC. Is there a way to force the output colorspace to RGB? You can add the option in the control panel of DirectShow filter to decide the output color space?

[videomixer9]

Isn't there a way to make GPU do all the colorspace conversions via directx or something? I still wonder why this things cannot be easily done via simple interfaces to the graphics adapter. Imo VMR9 should've been made that way though, connect with anything and convert via hardware to anything else ... but now I'd think filters could fix this up at least maybe ...

[Koti]

']New build up :

Version 0.0.0.4 Alpha (20060113) :


Thx Haali , Toff , Picard , CoreCodec

[SeeMoreDigital]

Isn't there a way to make GPU do all the colorspace conversions via directx or something? I still wonder why this things cannot be easily done via simple interfaces to the graphics adapter. Imo VMR9 should've been made that way though, connect with anything and convert via hardware to anything else ... but now I'd think filters could fix this up at least maybe ...Agreed....

I wonder, would it be possible to place some "user settings" that can be accessed and adjusted via the filters "Properties" widow: -

http://img486.imageshack.us/img486/9890/coreavcsettings7cp.png


Cheers

[[)370|\|470!2]

']New build up :
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/CoreAVC20060113.7z

Version 0.0.0.4 Alpha (20060113) :
Support for VSSH FOURCC
Support for YUY2 output
Force anamorphic flag on renderer

Just great! With an YUY2 it's now possible to mess around with
saturation/brightness/contrast. Thx Core team. Keep up teh
good work. ;)

[foxyshadis]

GPUs doing colorspace conversions is what causes so many problems with YUV levels being incorrectly converted to RGB for output, and why the big flamewar over ffdshow and/or vmr9 sucking erupted. Still, it's worth investigating if you need the speed and can find a colorspace it doesn't trash.

[Revgen]

I personally have trouble with VMR9/VMR7 whever I use FFDShow or CoreAVC. I pretty much stick to Ol' Fashioned Hardware Overlay.

[Isochroma]

Thank you CoreCodec team for your awesome work! Unfortuantely, my GeForce FX5200 (and MX400) don't do either YUY2 or YV12 colorspace conversions right - the result looks really ugly - faded, washed out colors.

When you get time, it would be really great to add RGB24 output to your decode filter, thanks!

[molinacabaleiro]

mpc 6481 + ffdshow = 40% cpu
tcpmp + ffmpeg = 20% cpu

not bad, but ogg vorbis volume goes down quite a bit compared to radlight decoder

what do i do with CoreAVC.ax so mpc will recognize it?
when i uninstall ffdshow it resorts to nero for x264 playback :(

[bond]

mpc 6481 + ffdshow = 40% cpu
tcpmp + ffmpeg = 20% cpunice, but this has nothing to do with coreavc

not bad, but ogg vorbis volume goes down quite a bit compared to radlight decodernot nice, but this has nothing to do with coreavc :D

what do i do with CoreAVC.ax so mpc will recognize it?
when i uninstall ffdshow it resorts to nero for x264 playback :( register it ;)

[3ngel]

When you get time, it would be really great to add RGB24 output to your decode filter, thanks! Or even RGB32, choosable from a control panel inside the filter.

[Ice =A=]

Version 0.0.0.4 Alpha (20060113) works very well in my case. Plays all 1080-videos smoothly on an Athlon 3500+ (at least with mpc in overlay mode). Good work! :)

[breez]

Thank you CoreCodec team for your awesome work! Unfortuantely, my GeForce FX5200 (and MX400) don't do either YUY2 or YV12 colorspace conversions right - the result looks really ugly - faded, washed out colors.

Well actually the conversion is done just right, but there is a difference with video and PC levels. In video levels reference black is at 16 and reference white at 235 (0 and 255 in PC levels).

It is problematic for mixed use PCs. One either calibrates display for video or PC levels, but not for both. One can also expand the 16-235 range to 0-255 to use with a display calibrated to PC levels. This of course isn't a lossless operation (banding may occur when done at low precision). You can do the expanding with ffdshow 'levels' or only allowing RGB32 output colorspace (with HQ YV12 to RGB32 checked to get reduced banding). And at least on ATI cards the overlay mode does the expanding for you (with 10-bit precision, less banding than with 8-bit). Try overlay for starters.

[BetaBoy]

bond... should we make this a sticky now?

[SeeMoreDigital]

bond... should we make this a sticky now?Well... I agree ;)

[Sharktooth]

agreed ;)

[[)370|\|470!2]

Thumbs up! ;)

[Sirber]

I'm against!

Nothing to see, move along ;)

Why not adding it to the AVC sticky in the decoder section?

[edit]

Ha! like the "ateme beta encoder" :)

I agree then :D

[GhengisKhan]

Making this thread a sticky must be the best idea I've seen in this thread yet!

Go for it :D !

GhengisKhan :cool:

[videomixer9]

Making this thread a sticky must be the best idea I've seen in this thread yet!

Go for it :D !

GhengisKhan :cool:

That must be of the most useless posts in this threads here though ...

As to ideas, I'd wonder if CoreAVC or only the DShow filter could output some stats like Haali Media Splitter does too, maybe some infos about bitrates or maybe also about the connections in the graph for the DShow version and which colorspaces, I really hate that most filters don't show you any nice stats and debug infos. It'd be nice if filters all had this as you always need ppl to get GraphEdit for debugging.

[GhengisKhan]

That must be of the most useless posts in this threads here though ...

As to ideas, I'd wonder if CoreAVC or only the DShow filter could output some stats like Haali Media Splitter does too, maybe some infos about bitrates or maybe also about the connections in the graph for the DShow version and which colorspaces, I really hate that most filters don't show you any nice stats and debug infos. It'd be nice if filters all had this as you always need ppl to get GraphEdit for debugging.

:eek:

First off, :thanks: -I am honored to deserve such recognition from... you,

The top priority right now with CoreAVC is supporting AVC to the fullest (same goes for the Dshow filter), right after that is making it as fast as possible.
I fail to see how much more important seeing info is compared to making and using the application... maybe it's just me.

GhengisKhan :cool:

[3ngel]

After some tests, i've found that the "best looking" output of NeroDigital decoder (both in ASP and AVC mode) is because its output is in every case straight to RGB32. In this sense, Nero Digital does itself the color space conversion and fires to the GPU the best possible raw data RGB32.
So, i think that is even more important that CoreAVC, in both versions (filter and exe) supports the RGBs output (and do a best possible color-conversion), to avoid (as said by someone in this thread before), buggy or difficult color-conversions done by the graphic cards.

[videomixer9]

GhengisKhan, I fail to see where I said to put this on top priority, usual feature request as done anywhere without ppl making dumb comments on it, and certainly has more to do with this than you playing the bootlicker imo :)

As to my idea from before with colorspace conversions, I stated that I don't wanna have it the way it's done with overlay but having the calculation being done by the GPU rather than by using the CPU, last year some compilers were presented that can compile to do certain operations all on GPU and had outstanding performance. This way a performance loss could be kept minimal, however seeing CoreAVC also works for mobile PCs I'd wonder if this would be an issue for code portability, besides only ATI and nVidia really support this, besides you could do all the encoding then via this O_o lol.

Besides this, I'd really wonder if we need all these conversion in the decoders ... I dunno if it gives you quality gain because of actual decoding interaction, but imo there should be one HQ Filter that can do those conversions, and not the cheap hack via using ffdshow for uncompressed video which will prolly work with CoreAVC too :)

[Isochroma]

3ngel: yes! I use the Nero decoder for MPEG 1/2/4/AVC for that exact reason, though ffdshow with output set to RGB24/32 only works well - excepting the brightness difference.

[3ngel]

@Isochroma
Exactly :) But at this point i think that NeroDigital has an upgear in the space-color conversion routine too, comparing to FFDShow (not considering the brightness problem). Even in RGB32 i found FFDShow inferior as global visual effect compared to ND.
I hope CoreAVC developers, will take good suggestions from our experiences :)

[Scoty]

how can i use the CoreAVC codec in WMP 10 ??

[molinacabaleiro]

nice, but this has nothing to do with coreavc

not nice, but this has nothing to do with coreavc :D

register it ;)
"thank you" but I'd already guessed THAT much

[SeeMoreDigital]

how can i use the codec in WMP 10 ??I've included some installation instructions (and "bat" files) to the latest version of CoreAVC_DSDec.zip (http://81.98.148.105/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/CoreAVC_DSDec.zip)

Hope that helps you out ;)


Cheers

[bond]

actually i wont make this thread a sticky, cause i am absolutely against making discussion threads sticky

being sticky means carrying general information people should look at before posting and using search
a 20 and increasing pages discussion thread is definitely not useable for this

if we dont make such a limitation there could be lots of threads with some useful info somewhere being made sticky, which would definitely be an overkill

that said, if you want coreavc info in a sticky, wait till i update the info and decoder thread with coreavc

[Isochroma]

Yes, the XviD directshow filter has a very good output colorspace selector; this would be great to have in CoreAVC!

[Scoty]

please People help me. i can not use the CoreAVC in MPC and WPM 10. which settings in MPC and WPM 10 i need ?

[calinb]

Well actually the conversion is done just right, but there is a difference with video and PC levels. In video levels reference black is at 16 and reference white at 235 (0 and 255 in PC levels).

It is problematic for mixed use PCs. One either calibrates display for video or PC levels, but not for both. One can also expand the 16-235 range to 0-255 to use with a display calibrated to PC levels. This of course isn't a lossless operation (banding may occur when done at low precision). The other problem with expanding levels from the video to pc range is levels outside the "permitted" video level range sometimes occur--the so called "blacker than black levels." They will be clipped in the expansion. When using the video range, it's still possible to properly adjust your display to render them (supported by some monitor/TV calibration DVDs), whereas they are simply lost when expanded to the PC range.

[dk75]

please People help me. i can not use the CoreAVC in MPC and WPM 10. which settings in MPC and WPM 10 i need ?
regsvr32 /s CoreAVCDecoder.ax
And you shouldn't uninstall ffdshow.
You should change decoding option in codec settings: "H.264" to "disabled" and "RAW" to "supported all".
With this, you could do color space conversion with ffdshow for CoreAVC decoded stream.

[Zero1]

The speed is remarkable, excellent job. This will help bring H.264 to many more people now :)

Such a shame it won't become a part of FFDShow(/libavcodec). Let's just hope they are able to speed up also. We already have the best ASP decoder :D

[sillKotscha]

I wonder, would it be possible to place some "user settings" that can be accessed and adjusted via the filters "Properties" widow: -

Cheers

at least some kind of infos... would it be possible to show the profile that was used for the encode?? like ffdshow does via osd (bframes, gmc, etc.)

that would be very nice :)

btw, enjoy the nice sunday

[bond]

ok before this non-avc related discussion evolves too much, note that this thread is about coreavc, the _AVC_ decoder ;)

if you want to discuss different things, like mpeg-2, .ts, streaming or whatever start new threads where they belong plz

[lexor]

ok before this non-avc related discussion evolves too much, note that this thread is about coreavc, the _AVC_ decoder ;)

if you want to discuss different things, like mpeg-2, .ts, streaming or whatever start new threads where they belong plz
it is? I thought it was about TCMPM which reached mature stage and just got coreAVC, I thought decoder discussion was just a bonus based on BetaBoy's first post.

[bond]

guys, betaboy started an own thread for tcpmp in the software player forum (where it belongs):
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=103199

post there your non-coreavc issues

[PicardGK]

I'am checking rgb32/24 mmx transformation. It will cost speed for sure (like ffdshow). Alone the bytes written to memory is almost 3 times as many. Benchmark performance with Null output will suffer more because of lower memory latency which doesn't really hide the mmx transformation.

Why people use rgb32 for video playback? I heard some Nvidia card has crappy yuv colorspace transformation, but I'am not sure why.

Does all VMR9 driver support YUY2 input? I also have the brightness problem in this scenario, but it can be adjusted by the decoder (like ColorYUV(levels="TV->PC")), although I'am not sure how much quality loss there is because of the 8bit channel resolution.

[bond]

Why people use rgb32 for video playback? I heard some Nvidia card has crappy yuv colorspace transformation, but I'am not sure why.well i used to notice jerky playback in rare cases with my old nvidia tnt2 pro with yv12, that happened with gabest's realvideo dshow stuff iirc
especially i noticed jerkyness with yv12 anamorphic resize (with asp)
this would speak for that the old tnt2 has problems with yv12

than there is the thing that anamorphic resize works in mplayer, tough i am not sure it really uses yv12 (altough it says so)
tcpmp also works fine it seems (does it output yv12?)
so this might indicate that there are simply some issues with the dshow filters i used (ffdshow for asp) and yv12 works fine on the tnt2

than there is that mf once told me that these cards have problems with yv12 overlay but i wasnt able to find any info about this anywhere in the web, so i am not sure about this

also after i upgraded to win2000 i dont seem to get these issues that clearly anymore (eg yv12 anamorphic resize with coreavc seems to work fine)
the thing is the jerks are hardly spotable, so its hard to say whether there are problems or not, especially if you are testing with avc on a pentium3 866mhz pc you never know if lack of cpu kicks in

so all in all my tnt2 is an old card and i still cant say for sure if it has problems or not

Does all VMR9 driver support YUY2 input?on my tnt2 vmr9 only wants to directly connect to coreavc if it outputs yuy2. when coreavc outputted yuy2 only it force a colorspace converter in between

I also have the brightness problem in this scenario, but it can be adjusted by the decoder (like ColorYUV(levels="TV->PC")), although I'am not sure how much quality loss there is because of the 8bit channel resolution. if you add something that means quality loss make sure to add an option for the user to en- or disable it plz

[PicardGK]

tcpmp also works fine it seems (does it output yv12?)
YV12 is the deafult if the DirectDraw overlay supports it. But I will add some options in settings dialog to be able to override.

on my tnt2 vmr9 only wants to directly connect to coreavc if it outputs yuy2. when coreavc outputted yuy2 only it force a colorspace converter in between
I guess the second part was about YV12. My Radeon 9600 doesn't support YV12 either with VMR9. I guess because it's planar.

if you add something that means quality loss make sure to add an option for the user to en- or disable it plz
Of course. Btw the only problem with TV->PC yuv level transformation that scaling [16..235] to [0..255] means the result will have some gaps, but I guess it's not visible. But it may cost little performance, so everything is optional.

[videomixer9]

I think many ppl want to convert the ranges as you can clearly see any encoding glitch in VMR9 with YV12 video. I have lots of encodes that look fine in overlay but you'll see how crappy they really are in VMR9. Besides it's kinda awkward seeing a grey tone instead of black even though this is the correct way of displaying it. Where this doesn't matter should be HTPCs or if you use VMR9 on your TV screen otherwise, of course.

Imo the problem clearly is that there's no hardware accelerated colorspace conversion available as part of VMR9 and imo MS should fix this.

Besides the bonus of being able to have lots of accelerated videos running at the same, I don't see much bonus in using VMR9 (excl. all uses for videos in games). If you got an graphics adapter with bad hardware resizer you'll prolly lack the power to correct this via software anyways, seeing that high quality lanczos resizing or even hq bicubic resizing takes lots of power in realtime.

Whatever, VMR9 sounds cool and is new, thus many ppl will keep using it and some might actually gain quality with it, but sure not those with old pcs and graphics cards that have broken support for things like YV12, and those sure aren't the new top modells of nvidia and ati ...

[3ngel]

Why people use rgb32 for video playback?
Because doing YUY2->RGB32 conversion in software avoid possibile bad conversion, and any visualization problem you can imagine cause of the grafic card hardware routine.
Doing in software a good conversion (with a good routine) you are sure to send to the GPU the raw video stream (already converted in the color space used by the GPU that is RGB) and so the GPU has only to send to video without any other operation. And so there are no problems at all (and a maximum quality visualization).

[PicardGK]

I hope CoreAVC can have these color conversion options :
ColorMatrix("Rec.709->Rec.601")
ColorMatrix("Rec.601->Rec.709")
ColorYUV(levels="TV->PC")

Because vmr7&9 seems to need PC scale YUV
and overlay needs Rec.709 for HD.

I checked and AVC does have a way to signal input yuv levels and whether it's BT601 or BT709. So by default the decoder will use this info (example all Apple 1080p trailers us BT709, but 720p and lower are BT601). Not sure if there is a need to be able to override it. On the other hand the output properties should be optional, because I don't know any way to detect them.

At the moment BT601 vs BT709 transformation will only work with RGB output. (btw maybe it's just me, I see almost no different on my LCD monitor between this modes...)

I think many ppl want to convert the ranges as you can clearly see any encoding glitch in VMR9 with YV12 video.

Sure. It will be supported (optional). This an output property.
Btw I don't understand why would VMR9 look good on TV? This would mean the gray on monitor looks black on TV, which means an old overlay black would be more black or something.

Imo the problem clearly is that there's no hardware accelerated colorspace conversion available as part of VMR9 and imo MS should fix this.
You mean whem CoreAVC outputs YUY2 to VMR9, it's transformed by the video driver software and not pixelshader or something? This would mean there is not much perfomance loss if CoreAVC would do the transformtion (with correct yuv level and colormatrix usage).

[Inventive Software]

Guys, I'm impressed! For the first time I can play 720x576@25 AVC content on my Celeron 800. You should have an award! This stuff is revolutionary, no joke.

As yet, I haven't tried ASP content with all the bells and whistles, but that time will come soon!

[CruNcher]

This stuff is revolutionary, no joke.


It isn't really, it shows that good clean low level coding can be very powerfull but sadly alot of developers today go more in the direction of .Net and stuff loseing all this knowledge :(

[breez]

Btw I don't understand why would VMR9 look good on TV? This would mean the gray on monitor looks black on TV, which means an old overlay black would be more black or something.

Old overlay with a TV would look bad as supposedly gray colors would be black (and white when dealing with light gray).

[BetaBoy]

mmx color transformation code has been added to SVN for TCPMP and also to the CoreAVC filter.. it's up to Toff to listen to the proposals from you 'SMD' to add the about dialog controls so the user has more options.

[videomixer9]

You mean whem CoreAVC outputs YUY2 to VMR9, it's transformed by the video driver software and not pixelshader or something? This would mean there is not much perfomance loss if CoreAVC would do the transformtion (with correct yuv level and colormatrix usage).

Actually I thought that MS could implement VMR9 to accept almost anything and give video drivers the chance to pass over colorspace conversion to the graphics hardware, all I know is that MS currently delivers this odd colorspace conversion filter that's not really brilliant. Or can VMR9 do conversions via PixelShaders or sth. similar already without the player, or are there any shaderscripts you can e.g. use with MPC to do conversions e.g. to RGB?

Oh well seeing how skillful CoreAVC is done I guess you'd do something nice for this thing too, maybe better than fake hardware acceleration we all know :)

As to TV it seems funky as classic overlay and VMR9 look almost perfectly the same here. Dunno what nvidias drivers or hardware do there ...

[Isochroma]

Agreed. Until M$ gets its OS act together (Vista?) on this issue, it seems wise that decoders provide their users the option of software colorspace conversion. The default could be none, thus incurring no speed penalty.

[niknik]

It isn't really, it shows that good clean low level coding can be very powerfull but sadly alot of developers today go more in the direction of .Net and stuff loseing all this knowledge :(

Tell me about it, I do real time image analysis with micro controllers running at 25Mhz and having the "massive" amount of 16Kb on-chip ram...
My next project will face an upgrade to 25Mhz and 32Kb ram... Just try and do the same with a PC! :)

There really is no excuse to how bloated programming has become... and worse: people are now used that, in order to write a letter, they need a 2Gb program to do it! geeee :scared:

Back on topic: great work! 264 to the masses! :)

[TheBashar]

This thread started out so promising. Sigh.... Can someone please split off all the non CoreAVC related crud. Yes, including this.

[bond]

i will clean up the thread tomorrow and once i cleaned it up everyone who posts something here not belonging to coreavc will get striked for rule 15 (and this means also non-coreavc tcpmp issues are a nono in this thread)

so if you have a new issue not yet discussed here, start a new thread or post in threads already existing fitting the topic!

you have been warned...

[BetaBoy]

/me hugs bond

[DeathTheSheep]

/me hugs bond
That's ... awkward ;) Mmm, snuggly bond XD Well, Happy cleanin' to ya bond (tomorrow, not today I hope, cuz I just posted :D)


PS: Are their any pending plans for CoreAVC lossless support? If so, could you enlighten me as to thier to-do priority as opposed to the implementation of interlace support? Thank you.

[dk75]

Is CoreAVC decoding HigProfile?
I have some file from QuickTime encoded with MainProfile and this files was played OK. But, i have some other files encoded by myself, probably HighProfile (everything that i can switch in x264 ;PPPp) and i can't play these files with CoreAVC. At least files with B-Frames. I have one file with everything on but B-Frames and this file was played ok to.

[bond]

i had fun cleaning up the mess in this thread and splitted things to new threads:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105966
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105967
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105969
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105970
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105971
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105977
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105978
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105979
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105980
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105981
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105982
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105984
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105985
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105986
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105987
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105988
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105989
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105990
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105991

enjoy :D

[CruNcher]

@dk75

What for problems you have @ playback High Profile should work there was a bug with b-frames for High Profile in the first versions of CoreAVC but that should be fixed in the latest, maybe you are still useing an older version ?

@bond
nice work :)

[blubberbirne]

Little Problems with CoreAVC and 1920x1080 Endoced File.

Yesterday i created some Testfiles with x264 and MeGui. (HQ Slow Profile)

Problem is now, that this files only Playbacks with ~26fps, instead of 29,97.
CPU Usage is only 48% with my AMD X2 3800+. For Testing i encodet this Video @1440x816 and everythink works fine. CPU usage was only 34% :D

Any Idea what happens? Is it a CoreAVC Problem (no SMP support at this time i know), or whats going frong?

[SeeMoreDigital]

...Problem is now, that this files only Playbacks with ~26fps, instead of 29,97.
CPU Usage is only 48% with my AMD X2 3800+. For Testing i encodet this Video @1440x816 and everythink works fine. CPU usage was only 34% :D

Any Idea what happens?Have you cross checked the "reported" FPS speed of your encodes?

If your streams have been placed within the MP4 container you can use YAMB to check them!

[bkman]

CoreAVC simply has no SMP support, I would guess, and just one of your cores isn't powerful enough to decode the video at full speed.

[handtruck]

Didn't know whether to start a new thread in the software players forum, but since this may be AVC codec related, I'll post here. Let me know if I should start one in the other forum.

All these issues are with x264 video and mp3 audio (vbr and cbr)

MKV container (muxed with mkv merge):
-Choppy play on any videos with b-frames (I encoded one video with and without to make sure). The video plays fine in all other containers I've used in tcpmp windows. This problem does NOT occur in the Palm OS version of tcpmp.

MP4 container (muxed with mp4box):
-If I scroll through the video, the audio goes blank for a while and then it starts again. The farther I go into a video, the longer it takes for the audio to start up again. I originally thought it was a cbr/vbr issue with the mp3, but I reproduced the error with cbr. For some reason, this doesn't always happen, but I haven't figured out the difference between the successful and unsuccessful files. This happens in both the Palm OS and windows version of tcpmp. This problem does not happen in MPC or mplayer, however, so I think it might be a software issue.

[sjchmura]

Wow wow wow. I am STUNNED at the quality of the decoder and the low CPU time. On my AMD X2 I get <20% CPU time playinh back 720p clips scaled to 1920x1080p (HP 65" set).

SIMPLY STUNNING WORK.

So am I missing something? Is there some "deblocking" not going on that I would see if had lower (crappier) bit rate encodes? The color looks great - I mean - just shockingly good.

Strong work - will CoreAVC Decoder be a donationware project? I would definitely pay pal a few USD

Steve

[nm]

Magic ;)

[BetaBoy]

Wow wow wow. I am STUNNED at the quality of the decoder and the low CPU time.

Strong work - will CoreAVC Decoder be a donationware project? I would definitely pay pal a few USD

Steve

Thanx... No, not donationware... we will be live with www.coreavc.com in about 2 weeks and will sell CoreAVC at that time... there is alot going on... and as we progress further i'll let everyone know more details.

[bob0r]

Sell? Means i can't put the CoreAVCDecoder.ax with the x264 installer package?

[dk75]

What for problems you have @ playback High Profile should work there was a bug with b-frames for High Profile in the first versions of CoreAVC but that should be fixed in the latest, maybe you are still useing an older version ?
I think i have latest version (20060113) but i have update about this.
CoreAVC works with my encodings up to "-qp16" (my latest encoding, with B-Frames) but don't work with "-qp0" encoded file (older one).
I've didn't checked at which point (-qp settings) it's stop to work.

[bond]

I think i have latest version (20060113) but i have update about this.
CoreAVC works with my encodings up to "-qp16" (my latest encoding, with B-Frames) but don't work with "-qp0" encoded file (older one).
I've didn't checked at which point (-qp settings) it's stop to work.qp0 is propably lossless, which coreavc doesnt support yet

[BetaBoy]

I should have been more specific... but I also am not going to spell it all out at once... CoreAVC will be offered for windows on CoreAVC.com, be featured in other DS based media players... and as we will expand outwards we have larger goals in mind.

Some of those 'goals' is that CoreAVC will also be featured in TCPMP and in as many as 40 million devices by the end of 2006 alone ;-)

[Foreigner999]

I got a crash of either tcpmp or it's avc/ffmpeg plugin (internal not the DS version).
It was on a customers computer when I was running a test to see what kinda video the old p3 1ghz could handle. It was a trailer from quicktimes site called x-men_3-pre_teaser_h480p.hdmov at 480p and was downloaded to a flash drive and played from there (tcpmp also). It's extension was an hdmov and was downloaded using quicktime alternative. Where should i send the crash.txt?

Computer specs: Windows ME 128MB Ram Internal Intel Video Driver.

P.S. The video ran fine after the first crash and benchmarked at 167% using standard playback with audio.

[Foreigner999]

I should have been more specific... but I also am not going to spell it all out at once... CoreAVC will be offered for windows on CoreAVC.com, be featured in other DS based media players... and as we will expand outwards we have larger goals in mind.

Some of those 'goals' is that CoreAVC will also be featured in TCPMP and in as many as 40 million devices by the end of 2006 alone ;-)

:D Did you manage to get a mobile phone provider contract?

[sillKotscha]

Some of those 'goals' is that CoreAVC will also be featured in TCPMP and in as many as 40 million devices by the end of 2006 alone ;-)

nice B-Plan :)

did you spoke to one of those guys (http://ifa2005.videocoverage.org/) (2nd footage) - ok, maybe not really one of them... :P

[bob0r]

Edit:
CoreAVCDecoder.ax will not be added to the x264 installer, unless CoreAVC developers/legal owners will give me a go.

Thanks and keep up the great work!

encoders:
-x264
-xvidavc
-coreavc
-ateme

Great competition, this should be great for the end user! :D

[GhengisKhan]

Update about AVC plugin:

Picard removed the AVC plugin from the test site. They are planning to put up this site www.coreavc.com and offer it for purchase and have a trial version as well (not sure about DS filter - so far I have only checked the Win32 and PPC versions).

So, don't crash your PPC or something (unless you still have the installer - I don't :scared: ) before the site goes up!

It seems like TCPMP 1.0 must not be so far away...

GhengisKhan

P.S. Bob0r I'm guessing by the look of it, you won't be able to add CoreAVC in as a free version - maybe as a trial.

[BetaBoy]

GK... we are looking at adding the last of the bulletpoints for CoreAVC 1.0... IE; interlacing, lossless coding, SMP, x86-64bit

Interlacing and Loseless are the first priorites so we comply with _all_ AVC profiles... then we move to multi-processor support (that will probally come very soon) and last 64bit.

There will be two fast release waves for CoreAVC.... as we go from v1.0 to v2.0... We are predicting less then a few months between these versions as we add the features and work towards our encoder and a very BIG suprise with v2.0.

[Selur]

@BetaBoy: Will the Decoder(Encoder?) stay free for personal use?

Cu Selur

[GhengisKhan]

Oh sure, first you get me all hyped for v1.0 an now you tell me v2.0 is coming soon after that with a BIG suprise... looks like you almost have the AVC codec finished though. Interlacing and SMP are my "most wanted" features, although I might use lossless (I don't think Nero Recode has it though).

Keep up the good work :)

GhengisKhan

[crypto]

Although I like CoreAVC, I don't like seeing it going commercial. It is always the same. People from the scene help making something into a product. And as soon as this is done, someone starts making money out of it. This has a bitter taste and I encourage you to rethink this strategy.

[CruNcher]

@crypto
"Nothing is for Free except dying but even that costs your life"

[SeeMoreDigital]

@crypto
a common german saying "Nothing is for Free except dying but even that costs your life"Yeah...

And who-ever came up with the expression "love is free" must have been delusional :scared:


Cheers

[niknik]

I don't mind paying for something, if the price is right.

And although I support "freeware/donations" stuff, I have nothing against good programmers making some money out of their hard work. (I'm a professional programmer myself)

Just let's hope they won't become like Sony or some other mega-big-corporation in a few years, installing rootkits in their codecs! :)
ehehe

[Inventive Software]

Yeah...

And who-ever came up with the expression "love is free" must have been delusional
Amen to that. Nothing in life is free, except possibly GPL'd software. ;)

On-topic, sort of, can somebody point me in the direction of the CoreAVC DirectShow decoder? I can't seem to find it. :(

[kurt]

On-topic, sort of, can somebody point me in the direction of the CoreAVC DirectShow decoder? I can't seem to find it. :(
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=767051#post767051 :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

Amen to that. Nothing in life is free, except possibly GPL'd software. ;)

On-topic, sort of, can somebody point me in the direction of the CoreAVC DirectShow decoder? I can't seem to find it. :(As far as I'm aware the latest DSdec build is still v0.0.0.4 (Dated Jan 09 2006).

Anyway, I placed it on my own website together with some installation instructions (and "bat" files). All of which can be found here (http://81.98.148.105/Uploaded_Files/Doom9_Forum_files/CoreAVC_DSDec.zip).


Note to CoreAVC developers:
If there's a problem with me hosting your direct-show filter, please let me know and I wll remove it.


Cheers

[travisbell]

Although I like CoreAVC, I don't like seeing it going commercial. It is always the same. People from the scene help making something into a product. And as soon as this is done, someone starts making money out of it. This has a bitter taste and I encourage you to rethink this strategy.

I dunno if I agree. If any piece of software is a quality tool I have absolutely no problem paying for a product. It's the old saying right? You get what you pay for. I believe that statement 110% and you will see me purchase CoreAVC once it has finalized up a bit better.

[BetaBoy]

Although I like CoreAVC, I don't like seeing it going commercial. It is always the same. People from the scene help making something into a product. And as soon as this is done, someone starts making money out of it. This has a bitter taste and I encourage you to rethink this strategy.

Well... OS or Closed... from the very beginning (only 4 weeks ago) we were telling everyone about our plans about selling it. First a 1.0 decoder, then v1.5 NEW decoder (sorry GK no v2.0 right away like we planned)... then an encoder.

While we host and offer some great open source Audio and Video apps on CoreCodec.org... there is a line to be draw on what we need to actually do to make 'something' to support those projects. TCPMP and CoreAVC are that medium atm.

Hey, I dream of a true Open Source video codec that CoreCodec can host... in the real world however IP costs cash and comes at a cost (IE; AVC). It will always be a balance for us, we are not XIPH and will never be. We actually make things happen fast and dont have an ever prolonged devel period that last what seems, well, forever.

Proof is the value in Audio and Video development we bring by our actions and intentions. Open Source when possible and push for open standards... I do this on a daily basis... and I hope that CoreCodec and the other developers associated with us have shown that 'intention' over the past few years.

[Isochroma]

Are there license fees to pay the MPEG-LA for AVC encoders/decoders? I assumed that open-source and other freeware codecs weren't billed because the MPEG-LA either couldn't be bothered or had a formal/informal policy of not pursuing non-monetary implementations...

[CruNcher]

@Isochroma
as long as they don't get a major threat to commercial available solutions this might be true but CoreAVC is threatening AVC Aliance solutions (with it's decoding efficiency).
What i don't understand why customers have to pay finaly for it the revenue could be gathered by major deals (SDK for example) with other companies not from the avg joes i hope this can be achived sooner or later so all get it for free again.

[GhengisKhan]

Well... OS or Closed... from the very beginning (only 4 weeks ago) we were telling everyone about our plans about selling it. First a 1.0 decoder, then v1.5 NEW decoder (sorry GK no v2.0 right away like we planned)... then an encoder.

While we host and offer some great open source Audio and Video apps on CoreCodec.org... there is a line to be draw on what we need to actually do to make 'something' to support those projects. TCPMP and CoreAVC are that medium atm.

Hey, I dream of a true Open Source video codec that CoreCodec can host... in the real world however IP costs cash and comes at a cost (IE; AVC). It will always be a balance for us, we are not XIPH and will never be. We actually make things happen fast and dont have an ever prolonged devel period that last what seems, well, forever.

Proof is the value in Audio and Video development we bring by our actions and intentions. Open Source when possible and push for open standards... I do this on a daily basis... and I hope that CoreCodec and the other developers associated with us have shown that 'intention' over the past few years.

Sounds logical to me... I mean Corecodec is a company - not a group of developers. By the way, Betaboy, are you hinting that 2.0 will be released alongside the CoreAVC encoder (so that I can finally call it a codec...). Cause if you are I should become a some sort of anaylist... and that would, of course, be really cool as well :) .

I agree with CrunNcher though, it would be really nice if Corecodec offered the solution for free to the average joe and made all the money off of big businesses. I don't think this would be that hard, but... there are some things you want to offer consumers that come at a price as well...

Now, I hope the new AVC site gets up soon... I'm getting really impatient. Although, I do understand that TCPMP v1.0 is under major development too. I'm really excited - release it soon! :D

Keep up the good work,

GhengisKhan

P.S. I think it's good that CoreCodec comes to forums and asks for people's help - that way they make a great product people will like right off the bat.
P.P.S. Betaboy can you give us some time period we can expect TCPMP v1.0 released - internal goal, from the way it's going now, what Picard thinks, etc. I rough estimate will sastisfy me for now - don't answer this question if you are releasing it this week...

[ChronoCross]

No one should charge for a decoder. however the encoder is something one should charge for as it is something that can be much more difficult.

[foxyshadis]

It looks like their goal is to have it used for low-power x32/x64 processors in an embedded/media center style machine for home theaters, though. Thus the decoder is an integral feature in making older, cooler, and much cheaper chips usable, whereas there's already free slower decoders for everyone else. So it does make sense.

[crypto]

Well... OS or Closed... from the very beginning (only 4 weeks ago) we were telling everyone about our plans about selling it. First a 1.0 decoder, then v1.5 NEW decoder (sorry GK no v2.0 right away like we planned)... then an encoder.

BetaBoy:
I am relatively new to CoreAVC. Can you point me to a post of this statement?

I would also like to add, that in this case your plans are totally ok. I was not criticizing going commercial at all. What I was talking about is, holding such plans behind.

[bond]

obviously everyone wants everything to be freely available, but thats not how capitalism works ;)

that said nothing wrong with coreavc going commercial, i am sure there is lots of money to make from it (as its really good)
there is just one thing that needs to be added imho before it really can become a "threat" to other professional solutions and thats support for interlacing

[bratao]

But i tip.
Make a stripped to bone, free for personal use, version of you decoder.
Then a professional version with the good stuff.
This can make a huge publicity for your pro version witout any effort.

[niknik]

Even nvidia was charging for their "purevideo" codec, and that's for people that already spent hundreds of dolars buying their cards.

A good codec, vastly improving on existing ones, allowing you to use "old/low-end" hardware to be used effectively as a media center is something most people won't mind paying a small price for it.

But back on the *real* topic: are any there any news coming up? how's the development going? :)

[Scarpad]

I'm using TCPMP on my 51V. So there will be encoder for AVC now? Will Profiles be used and will it include a baseline profile for Ipod Encoding? I want to be able to play the vids in either the PPC or the Ipod.

[clsid]

I can understand that the AVC encoder and TCPMP are going commercial because of the MPEG license fees and generating revenue required to run CoreCodec. But no fees have to be paid for a decoder, right? Keeping the DS decoder free would make many of us happy. Plus that would be a good way for people to get to know the CoreAVC name/brand, making it easier to sell the commercial products.

[BetaBoy]

Eventually we would like to work towards that goal with AVC (and all our pay codecs)... and with the other things that TCPMPx supports COSP (3D enviro pics) and soon SVG (vector graphics)... we hope with these additional tools and our plans to license them that it will make TCPMP and our filters as free as Flash/IPIX/Real/QT players are...

[slavickas]

I can understand that the AVC encoder and TCPMP are going commercial because of the MPEG license fees and generating revenue required to run CoreCodec. But no fees have to be paid for a decoder, right? Keeping the DS decoder free would make many of us happy. Plus that would be a good way for people to get to know the CoreAVC name/brand, making it easier to sell the commercial products.
nope avc ip licensing is per product, iirc it is same if decoding or encoding or both capabilities supports product

[Foreigner999]

@betaboy
Will the pay version of TCPMP (with AVC for win32) would I be able to move about with it in a flash drive from computer to computer (for example) and not have to deal with registration issues like calling an 800 number to register it a billion times?

Has this part been thought out at all?

How would the licensing system work? Cause the current system that TCMP has of registering through email and having to get a key and all that was a real turn off to buying the software. Not exactly streamlined. Comments welcome.

[BetaBoy]

The 'PC Desktop' version of CoreAVC at first will be for Windows only but will expand in a 1.xx version to bundle it with Linux as well (you can only use one of those at a time).

On registering... we are gonna make it easy.. once you register the filter... you are really registering @ CoreCodec and are associating your account to our backend DB for CoreTheque (CT is our metadata management client and backend DB). On portablilty... i'll look into that... seeing something like Sandisk U3 platform being used.

[GhengisKhan]

Just thought everyone might want to know that a new version of TCPMP has been released. Here's the changelog. I don't know if the old AVC plugin still works in it (prob. not).

Changelog

version 0.71i
+nsv container support (but no vp3/vp6 codec...)
-installer file naming changed
-playlist shuffle mode fix
-buffering fix for very high bitrate movies
-avi audio timing fix with incompatible files
-PalmOS: pixel aspect option in preferences dialog
-WinCE: asf http streaming stream selection
-WinCE: XScale driver fix (for O2 Atom. still needs testing)
-WinCE: fix X50v WM5 black display after power on
-WinCE: telling "go online" to OS before http connection
-WinCE: better handling of special hotkeys (record, menu, green, red phone buttons)
-WinCE: ATI Imageon 3200 "Keep ATI driver active" option (maybe helps with crashes...)
-WinCE: DirectDraw mode fixes (+disabled with some devices...)
-Win32: DirectDraw clipping blit when overlay not available
-Win32: DirectDraw overlay color space option in settings

GhengisKhan 8)

[Negi]

What types of secret techniques make this filter runnable on slow cpus? Is that trade-secret or is it just a decoder that's been worked on extensively?

[Irwin]

What types of secret techniques make this filter runnable on slow cpus? Is that trade-secret or is it just a decoder that's been worked on extensively?

Picard - that's all :D

[niknik]

What types of secret techniques make this filter runnable on slow cpus? Is that trade-secret or is it just a decoder that's been worked on extensively?

Good, old-fashioned, optimized to death, coding... that's all.

Just imagine if Windows itself was coded this way... It would fit in a few Megabytes, boot instantly, and run like the wind! :)

[pankov]

Good, old-fashioned, optimized to death, coding... that's all.

Just imagine if Windows itself was coded this way... It would fit in a few Megabytes, boot instantly, and run like the wind! :)
I hope you are right and they are not giving us speed for the price of quality. I personally didn't have the opportunity to compare in details different decoders but it looks OK so keep up the good work
:)

[SeeMoreDigital]

Just thought everyone might want to know that a new version of TCPMP has been released. Here's the changelog. I don't know if the old AVC plugin still works in it (prob. not).That's encouraging news.... Hopefully a revised DSdec filter isn't too far behind also :)


Cheers

[allclone]

Awesome added support for NSV in v0.71i, I dunno if they got my e-mail a while back or I'm just lucky. Either way thanks for adding it to the latest TCPMP, great stuff, and look forward to future releases.

Edit:
Not that its a huge issue because nsv support was just added, but using avc video specifically x264 and aac audio in nsv container causes some weird audio and video sync issues when playing back the files in the new TCPMP 0.71i

[slavickas]

Awesome added support for NSV in v0.71i, I dunno if they got my e-mail a while back or I'm just lucky. Either way thanks for adding it to the latest TCPMP, great stuff, and look forward to future releases.
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=775896#post775896

[although your post and mine reply should be in that thread]

[unmei]

I hope you are right and they are not giving us speed for the price of quality.
AVC is bit exact decoding. Therefore every decoder will produce exactly the same output. The only issue here are bugs (;)) and a potentially bad quality color space conversion or resizing - that is the stuff that comes after the actual decoding.

[BetaBoy]

pankov.... unmei has it exactly right. Maybe bond wants to do a comparison of our quality against others decoders?

[GhengisKhan]

You can check, but I think Quicktime gives a slightly better ouput for the apple trailers. The color is more vivid and sharper.... but I could be wrong.
However, I think the difference is only very slight.

GhengisKhan

[foxyshadis]

The only valid comparison is to ISO reference decoder. Anything different is either wrong, or more likely includes various post-processing. Also different video renderers and video cards can create differences where there are none.

[Manao]

GhengisKhan : it's due to your overlay. Configure it properly, and you'll have the same "vivid" colors.

[Sirber]

Is 0.0.0.4 the latest?

[COREiP]

http://coreavc.corecodec.org/CoreAVC20060113.7z This link is dead...

[COREiP]

Where can i download version 0.0.0.4?

[Koti]

Where can i download version 0.0.0.4?

See Post=315 (http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=773877&postcount=315)

[rushin_911]

perhaps this has been asked before (the thread is 18 pages,,,) but are there any plans for making a linux version of the decoder?

[BetaBoy]

There will be a Linux version of the decoder.... the link is dead atm... but we will probally release another test build soon.

[blubberbirne]

There will be a Linux version of the decoder.... the link is dead atm... but we will probally release another test build soon.

that sounds good :D

[pike]

@BetaBoy

I see you :p

[bob0r]

Where can i download version 0.0.0.4?

Always have a short look at http://files.x264.nl :sly:

[lexor]

Always have a short look at http://files.x264.nl :sly:
is that legal though? I mean if corecodec intended for it to be available they wouldn't have removed links, after all it's still their product that was a demo, never an actual freely available product.

[bond]

is that legal though? I mean if corecodec intended for it to be available they wouldn't have removed links, after all it's still their product that was a demo, never an actual freely available product.its as long legal as corecodec doesnt have anything against coreavc being mirrored there :)

[bob0r]

And even if it isn't legal, i don't have delete rights :cool:

[wata]

will there be a ape plugin for 0.71i
remember it is mention before somewhere, i saw only wavepack and flac plugin

[amango]

I'd like to see the CoreAVC-decoder in XBMC. :-)

[Sirber]

Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at files.x264.nl.

Will this host get back online for Canadian users one day?

[foxyshadis]

Traceroute it. Does it stop in the rogers network, or does it make it out to interoute.net? If the former, only Rogers can fix its routing.

[vendol21]

I'd like to see the CoreAVC-decoder in XBMC. :-)

Me too :D

[Sirber]

http://w1.hidemyass.com/index.php?q=ZmlsZXMueDI2NC5ubA--&hl=1111101001

:D

[fogbav]

I'd like to see the CoreAVC-decoder in XBMC. :-)


Vote ! Vote ! Vote !

I'm also willing to pay some bugs 4 that ! 8)

[nm]

I'm also willing to pay some bugs 4 that ! 8)
I doubt the developers are willing to receive payment in bugs ;)

[BetaBoy]

as long as those bugs are coverd with PIMS... we will gladly accept it... (it might get Toff to add the suggested filter properties box too)

[tomos]

cent believe how much decoding x.264 has changed since dec (when i first really started messing around with this).

on my 4400+, i 1st used ffdshow to play back some clips i made - which it couldnt handle on 1 core. then moved to nero showtime since it used both cores.

now this codec plays back on 1 core what showtime needed 2 for. have only now found its limits on my sys. playing back hidef underworld, coreAVC cant handle it on 1 core (maxxed @ 50%) - but then again, it plays it better than showtime does using both cores (maxxed @ 100%)

in short, credit to the writers of coreAVC - cant wait for what the next 2 months development bring :D

[BetaBoy]

Then get ready for Interlacing and SMP ;-)

[tomos]

sweet :D

not sure why someone would want to encode interlaced content, but the SMP would definetely be most welcome :)

[krackato]

I'm having a really hard time testing this codec. I have CoreAVC20060113.7z, CoreAVC_DSDec.zip, and tcpmp.win32.0.71j. After installing CoreAVCdecoder.ax, I've tried playing an h.264 file but tcpmp says "Error: Player: Video codec (AVC aka H.264) not supported by the player!" I've tried playing 2 files with the same error. Is there a way to fix this?

[[Toff]]

I'm having a really hard time testing this codec. I have CoreAVC20060113.7z, CoreAVC_DSDec.zip, and tcpmp.win32.0.71j. After installing CoreAVCdecoder.ax, I've tried playing an h.264 file but tcpmp says "Error: Player: Video codec (AVC aka H.264) not supported by the player!" I've tried playing 2 files with the same error. Is there a way to fix this?

You're mixing up things, CoreAVCdecoder.ax is a DirectShow filter meant to be used with player like WMP, MPC, ZoomPlayer ...
tcpmp.win32.0.71 is currently not using you're installed DirectShow filter but his own kind of plugin.

So if you install CoreAVCdecoder.ax you need to try with a DirectShow player.

If you install TCPMP you need to add the CoreAVC plugin for TCPMP, currently called avc.plg (and maybe also to disable ffmpeg.plg by deleting/moving it)

[hellfred]

I'm having a really hard time testing this codec. I have CoreAVC20060113.7z, CoreAVC_DSDec.zip, and tcpmp.win32.0.71j. After installing CoreAVCdecoder.ax, I've tried playing an h.264 file but tcpmp says "Error: Player: Video codec (AVC aka H.264) not supported by the player!" I've tried playing 2 files with the same error. Is there a way to fix this?
The win32 port of Core Pocket Media Player (TCPMP) does not (yet) support DShow filters. So with CoreAVCDecoder.ax installed on your system, and a splitter like Haali's, you should be able to watch h264 clips in mp4 or mov contianer (file) with any DShow Media Player like MediaPlayerClassic, mplayer2, BSPlayer, Zoomplayer etc.
TCPMP had an h264 plugin (avc.plg) that needed to be placed in the TCPMP folder of to decode h264 clips. The plugin was distributed in an archive called avc.win32.0.71h.zip.

Hellfred

EDIT: Toff was faster

[krackato]

Thanks guys for the info. Two questions.

1. Where can I get avc.plg and/or avc.win32.0.71h.zip?

2. Since I have CoreAVCdecoder.ax installed and Halli's Media Splitter, how do I get Media Player Classic to use CoreAVC to decode my h.264 clip? As far as I can tell, it's still using the ffdshow mpeg-4 video decoder and I can't figure out how to switch it.

[bond]

Thanks guys for the info. Two questions.

1. Where can I get avc.plg and/or avc.win32.0.71h.zip?

2. Since I have CoreAVCdecoder.ax installed and Halli's Media Splitter, how do I get Media Player Classic to use CoreAVC to decode my h.264 clip? As far as I can tell, it's still using the ffdshow mpeg-4 video decoder and I can't figure out how to switch it.disable h.264 in ffdshow

[videomixer9]

just noticed something cool, played an h264 video with coreavc on my old athlon 1ghz and it needed less decoding cpu than divx 6.1 needs for decoding without postprocessing on it for a similar video ... rofl

[Schrade]

Heh that's pretty damn funny. I love CoreAVC. It actually makes it quite a pleasure to play MPEG4 AVC videos.

[Avish]

The win32 port of Core Pocket Media Player (TCPMP) does not (yet) support DShow filters. So with CoreAVCDecoder.ax installed on your system, and a splitter like Haali's, you should be able to watch h264 clips in mp4 or mov contianer (file) with any DShow Media Player like MediaPlayerClassic, mplayer2, BSPlayer, Zoomplayer etc.
TCPMP had an h264 plugin (avc.plg) that needed to be placed in the TCPMP folder of to decode h264 clips. The plugin was distributed in an archive called avc.win32.0.71h.zip.

Hellfred

EDIT: Toff was faster
I downloaded the player, but the plugin "avc.win32.0.71h.zip" is not there at the TCPMP website. Anyone have it?

[kurt]

http://home.arcor.de/mutterstadt/

[pankov]

Then get ready for Interlacing and SMP ;-)
Will this allow playback of MPEG-4 AVC captures (or even live) from some satellite channels like TPS HD, which use H.264 for their 1080i content? Or the problem lies in the MainConcept MPEG Demultiplexer which doesn't like CoreAVC Decoder???

[Avish]

http://home.arcor.de/mutterstadt/
Thank u very much Kurt :)

[kopavel]

Player don't play AVC at all :( what's wrong?
After file opening and play button pressing position slider momentaly moving at end of clip and this is all :/
may be plugin don't support some of the features of AVC? all clips is from the same source.
Mplayer play without problem, coreavc DS filter play them too but much SLOWER then mplayer...

[blubberbirne]

Will this allow playback of MPEG-4 AVC captures (or even live) from some satellite channels like TPS HD, which use H.264 for their 1080i content? Or the problem lies in the MainConcept MPEG Demultiplexer which doesn't like CoreAVC Decoder???

Current CoreAVC does not support Interlaced ;)

[pankov]

Yes, I know but is this the reason why the MainConcept MPEG Demultiplexer doesn't allow the CoreAVC Decoder to connect to it?

[sjchmura]

Which splitter (elecard, nero etc) works best? Has anyone seen if the initial splitter canimpact CPU time?

Right now COREAVC just stopped decoding despite its high priority - I have no idea what happned. I have nero 6.6 and Purevideo installed and no matter WHAT I do thenero digital decoder is always picked (despite its low prioriry)

[BetaBoy]

Haali splitter hands down... imho

[boombaard]

never mind

[HookedOnTV]

Video: MPEG2 Video 1280x1088 (16:9) 29.97fps 65000Kbps [Video]


Are you trying to play a mpeg2 file?

[HookedOnTV]

Then get ready for Interlacing and SMP ;-)

I'm ready...

[BetaBoy]

I was informed that the requested filter properties and an about screen we added... http://cc.serveftp.org:8884/CoreAVCLogo.png

Interlacing work continues as well as profile support for High 10 and High 4:2:2 for our Enterprise version.

[HookedOnTV]

Just did a quick comparison between CoreAVC and Cyberlink's H264 decoder that utilizes hardware (x1300) acceleration...

CoreAVC ~ 18% utilization
Cyberlink ~ 28% utilization

Keep up the good work!

[CruNcher]

@HookedOnTV
please more info
Resolution: ???
Encoding Settings: ???
thx

[bond]

Just did a quick comparison between CoreAVC and Cyberlink's H264 decoder that utilizes hardware (x1300) acceleration...

CoreAVC ~ 18% utilization
Cyberlink ~ 28% utilization

Keep up the good work!how did you measure the average cpu useage? did you use windows' perfmon tool for that?

[HookedOnTV]

Sorry for the lack of detail. Used TaskManager first time. Went back and tested again using perfmon.

CoreAVC 16% average
Cyberlink 24% average

1280x720, 7000kbps, MeGui HQ-Slower, mkv (haali splitter)

[bond]

720p resolution with only 16%??? what cpu do you have?

[HookedOnTV]

Dual core Opteron running at 2.7GHz. Encodes like a banshee :)

[tomos]

Dual core Opteron running at 2.7GHz. Encodes like a banshee :)

hmm, my 3800+ x2 runs at 2.8 and a 720 ep of 24 encoded with x.264 takes about 25% CPU (with corecodec of course) and a 1080 source @ 35ish CPU

ahh, missed the x1300 bit.

[acidsex]

Anyone have any idea of when CoreAVC decoder will be available for purchase?

[bob0r]

acidsex

1: when its ready
2: when money is needed
3: when they figure out what features will be in what version
4: all of the above

[BetaBoy]

acidsex

1: when its ready
2: when money is needed
3: when they figure out what features will be in what version
4: all of the above

Very well said... it will likely be by the end of February for CoreAVC Standard and maybe the Professional Decoder... Enterprise Decoder will be a lil ways off. We have defined what each version will feature and be capable of and are getting all internally to sign off on it.

On the encoding side of things... more news on that as it developes further.

[bond]

what will be the difference between standard/pro/enterprise decoder?

[BetaBoy]

Standard: Main and Baseline
Professional: Main, Baseline, Extended? high?
Enterprise: Main, Baseline, Extended, High, High 10, High 4:2:2

When it comes to Extended, High profiles we are working on which will be in Standard and Pro versions. SMP support in the Pro version will be limited to 4 processors and have GPU enhancements enabled.

Suggestions? Thoughts?

[bond]

noone needs extended, everyone needs high profile ;)

[bob0r]

...

Suggestions? Thoughts?

All features in 1 freeware or buyware version, pro/lite/standard/enterprice/full/ I so hate those.

[BetaBoy]

All features in 1 freeware or buyware version, pro/lite/standard/enterprice/full/ I so hate those.

Thx... noted...

[videomixer9]

Soon we'll see then how CoreAVC development goes anticracking rather than improve decoding ... :devil:

[bond]

hehe we will see ;)

[Dreassica]

That would be useless to do though, since its nearly impossibe to stop hackers from cracking :(

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

Standard: Main and Baseline
Professional: Main, Baseline, Extended? high?
Enterprise: Main, Baseline, Extended, High, High 10, High 4:2:2

When it comes to Extended, High profiles we are working on which will be in Standard and Pro versions. SMP support in the Pro version will be limited to 4 processors and have GPU enhancements enabled.

Suggestions? Thoughts?

Wow, that's really good, BetaBoy. I am impressed:goodpost:

My notice about Standard and Pro version:

1) Standard version: Currently, standard version is very poor in capabilities, however, you must add, at least, Extended profile and support to AMD64 processors.

2) Professional: Main, Baseline, Extended and High are very good for PRO version, and, of course, you should add full support for adaptive quantization, trellis quantization, RDO for B/frames and Bidirectional encoding.

3) Enterprise: Main, Baseline, Extended, High, High 10, High 4:2:2 and all options from PRO version.

I really hope that you will appreciate my advice, BetaBoy

And, of course, Enterprise version should have SMP support for, at least 4 processors( but, I hope for 8 processors SMP support) and GPU enhancements enabled (support for newest Ati and Nvidia GPU, X1900XTX and future Nvidia 7900 GTX)

[foxyshadis]

Decided yet which ones get interlaced decoding?

Rex, these are decoders, most of those extra features don't matter as much in a decoder. And do you still not know what extended-profile is? (It's like sub-baseline with error correction.)

[ChronoCross]

I'm in agreement with bob0r on this one. IT's all or nothing in terms of a decoder. Offering the decoder with ad support, and a paid version with no ad support is the way to go I believe.

[bob0r]

I'm in agreement with bob0r on this one. IT's all or nothing in terms of a decoder. Offering the decoder with ad support, and a paid version with no ad support is the way to go I believe.

ad = advertisements?
if so, NOOOO ads/banners/crap!

Freeware of Buyware, not Crapware(quicktime already holds this title)

[BetaBoy]

I'd give it away for free before that would happen. We are not Radlight ;-)

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

Glad to hear that, BetaBoy.

[Sirber]

I'd give it away for free before that would happen. We are not Radlight ;-)LOL

:goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost:

[tomos]

quick Q, will SMP be in the test codec or be saved till the final product?

[pankov]

So I read about the versions but as I'm not familiar with the terms (Extended/High/High-10/High 4:2:2) I have a simple question:
Which version will I need to decode MPEG4-AVC satellite channels?
I'm talking about the channels shown here
http://www.kingofsat.net/en/hdtv.php
As far as I know there is a differences in resolution (1080i / 720p / 528i) but are there any other differences?
Also what's the reason not to be able to use CoreAVC for the 720p from SkyItaliaHD (HotBird 13E)?
Here you can find different captures I was able to capture in .ts format
http://www.casyst.com/mitko/tmp/80e_11064_H [704x576i].avc-ts (http://www.casyst.com/mitko/tmp/80e_11064_H%20%5b704x576i%5d.avc-ts)
http://www.casyst.com/mitko/tmp/SkyIt HD [1280x720p].avc-ts (http://www.casyst.com/mitko/tmp/SkyIt%20HD%20%5b1280x720p%5d.avc-ts)
I also have a 1080i capture from TPS HD but it's too big for me to host it. If someone can handle 42MB please send me a PM

The other quesiton I have is can someone advice me on a Transport Files Source and/or Splitter that can handle H.264 in Transport Stream. Except of course the combo FileSource(Async.) + MainConcept MPEG Demux.

[Selur]

"If someone can handle 42MB please send me a PM"
Try e.g. http://rapidshare.de/

[bond]

pankov, may i ask where this "80e" clip is from? what channel/country?

[pankov]

http://rapidshare.de/files/13094302/TPS_HD__1920x1080i_.avc-ts.html
it's a little harder to get to the file but it's there
if you read good you will get it
;)

[XiN]

yes, i also tried many DVB sofware trying to get MPEG4 AVC channels working with CoreAVC (especially for the olympics). author of SkyAVC.ax DVB filter for SkyStar2 card even made special build, because coreavc didnt want to connect the graph, but that also didnt help. so far Nero and Moonlight AVC codecs work, but they are way too slow on singlecore CPUs to produce fluent picture (they are fine on dualcore). I was thinking that the problem may be that the DVB Transport Streams use MPEG2 encapsulation of MPEG4 AVC stream. but thats just a guess.

oh and thank you for this great codec!

[bond]

the problem with those stream is generally that they are interlaced, which coreavc doesnt support

[XiN]

pankov, may i ask where this "80e" clip is from? what channel/country?

looks like it could be from 80,0°E Express AM-2 sattelite. channel Kavkaz-Hit 11,064/H 6666 3/4. but you need huge dish to receive this one from central/western europe.


the problem with those stream is generally that they are interlaced, which coreavc doesnt support

ahh, thats probably it

[pankov]

pankov, may i ask where this "80e" clip is from? what channel/country?
A friend of mine told me this
80°E 11064 H 6667 3/4 (QPSK modulation, so can tune it with ss2)

vpid and apid are hidden in mux

found them by pid scanner in skyview

vpid 556 (AVC/H264)
apid 557 (AAC)
btw
it was him that made the capture. I can't get a sat that far east

[clsid]

This is what MPC and ffdshow make of it:
http://img105.imagevenue.com/loc253/th_c46c2_thumbs20060212192152.jpg (http://img105.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc253&image=c46c2_thumbs20060212192152.jpg)

[pankov]

the problem with those stream is generally that they are interlaced, which coreavc doesnt support
I understand this for the 576i/1080i content but what about SkyItaliaHD? its 720p

@clsid
I agree it's heavily interlaced animated music clip but with MainConcept's DMO + FFDShow (DScaler) Deinterlace it's acceptable ... except the CPU hit :(

[bond]

I understand this for the 576i/1080i content but what about SkyItaliaHD? its 720pit works with coreavc when you remux the stream to mp4
(demux to raw with mplayer and import to mp4 with mp4box)

[pankov]

Well that's a good news
So we have another problem then:
We need a Demux that will allow connection to CoreAVC. Obviously the MainConcept MPEG Demux doesn't allow it
:(
last night I did some testing with different demultiplexors/source filters and didn't find another working solution.
I think that all other are fooled by the Transport Stream container and MPEG4. All other label their output pin as MPEG2Video and I think this prevents all MPEG4-AVC Decoders to connect
Am I right?
Can someone make a type(label)converter directshow filter? Which will allow MPEG2 input and have MPEG4 output ... or am I talking nonsence?

[bond]

try the gabest mpg/ts splitter (inbuilt in mpc)

but i think the streams you posted are somehow strange as they bork mplayer (and mplayer handles all the other hdtv captures fine)

[pankov]

if you are talking about this
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=82303&package_id=170670
I've tried it already without success
:(

[bond]

thats outdated you need a new compile of mpc (read the mpc thread in the software player forum)

[pankov]

OK I'll do it later but I have to ask if I'm supposed to use MPC or I'll be able to get the DirectShow filter only?

[bond]

for getting the standalone filter you will have to ask someone to compile it for you (or you compile it yourself)

[pankov]

Well, I've found a build of the MPEG Splitter from 09feb2006
http://ffdshow.faireal.net/mirror/Media%20Player%20Classic/external%20filters/uniocde/
and there is a light at the end of the tunnel
;)
Look here
http://www.casyst.com/mitko/tmp/MPEGSplitter%201.0.0.2.png
This graph even works ... somewhat.
It's not what I expected - a nice fluent decoding but I see something.
There are problems though:
1. It doesn't decode all the frames and it's not because of not enough CPU power - it simply doesn't decode/show all of them !??!?!
2. with another capture (SkyItHDmpg4.avc-ts made with SkyView... the "working" one is done with AltDVB) it doesn't show any picture at all - only black window ... with the correct HiDef dimensions though.

I've noticed that there are different MediaSubTypes when using the MPEG Splitter and the MainConcept MPEG Demux.
Why is that !??!

I'm really lost now
:(

[bond]

Well, I've found a build of the MPEG Splitter from 09feb2006
http://ffdshow.faireal.net/mirror/Media%20Player%20Classic/external%20filters/uniocde/
and there is a light at the end of the tunnel
;)
Look here
http://www.casyst.com/mitko/tmp/MPEGSplitter%201.0.0.2.png
This graph even works ... somewhat.
It's not what I expected - a nice fluent decoding but I see something.
There are problems though:
1. It doesn't decode all the frames and it's not because of not enough CPU power - it simply doesn't decode/show all of them !??!?!
2. with another capture (SkyItHDmpg4.avc-ts made with SkyView... the "working" one is done with AltDVB) it doesn't show any picture at all - only black window ... with the correct HiDef dimensions though.well i already said that i doubt that these captured .ts files are correct

try other samples from other capturers

I've noticed that there are different MediaSubTypes when using the MPEG Splitter and the MainConcept MPEG Demux.
Why is that !??!dshow allows you to use what you want (eg to make it possible that only your filters can connect to each other)
thats why commercial filters suck

[pankov]

well i already said that i doubt that these captured .ts files are correct

try other samples from other capturers
OK I believe that too, but then why does the MainConept graph works fine (good quality but high CPU usage)? There is something wrong but what? :(

[bond]

i now tried gabests mpeg splitter together with other hdtv captures and .mpg and .ts encodes done with mainconcept/moonlight and i got none of the hdtv .ts captures (all created with tandberg) to work (only black). i tried .mpg samples created by mainconcept and coreavc didnt show all frames and those it showed only half (the rest of the frame being green). the .ts samples from mainconcept and moonlight played fine

my conclusion:
- in contrary to .mp4 the filter situation with .mpg and .ts is currently a mess with lots incompatibilities
- avc decoders are currently written to work together with .mp4 splitters (like coreavc) as noone uses avc with mpg and ts is only used for hdtv
- .mpg and .ts splitters dont act like the mp4 splitters (which causes the not working of coreavc)
- the only chance i see to get a useable ts/mpg splitter is by asking gabest to make his splitter act like his mp4 splitter in the case of avc being stored, cause this will also ensure broad interoperability with all important avc decoders

[sillKotscha]

and i got none of the hdtv .ts captures (all created with tandberg) to work (only black).

if you switch back to ffdshow for x.264 decoding you'll see a picture :)

[bond]

if you switch back to ffdshow for x.264 decoding you'll see a picture :)ffdshow has dozens of workarounds for various splitters included, i would prefer a splitter that is able to work with nearly all avc decoders (without workarounds) instead of applying workarounds in all the decoders
it was possible with mp4, i am sure its also possible with mpg/ts :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

if you switch back to ffdshow for x.264 decoding you'll see a picture :)Yes I too obtain a picture when using FFdshow's H.264 (AVC) decoder filter.

Maybe we Media Player Classic users require a separate "MPEG-4AVC PS/TS/PVA" Source filter option?!


Cheers

[bond]

Maybe we Media Player Classic users require a separate "MPEG-4AVC PS/TS/PVA" Source filter option?!what for?

[BetaBoy]

for SMD and those who wanted to see our filter options.... http://cc.serveftp.org:8884/CoreAVCProp.png

[SeeMoreDigital]

what for?Because I presume MPC's current option: -

http://i1.tinypic.com/np11co.png

..... is for MPEG-2 within PS/TS/PVA and not MPEG-4 AVC

[SeeMoreDigital]

for SMD and those who wanted to see our filter options.... http://cc.serveftp.org:8884/CoreAVCProp.pngIt's "a thing of beauty... un-surpassed" :D

[bond]

Because I presume MPC's current option: -

http://i1.tinypic.com/np11co.png

..... is for MPEG-2 within PS/TS/PVA and not MPEG-4 AVCthat option is for demuxing ps/ts/pva files

whether avc is demuxed from such files in an useable way is a different story

[SeeMoreDigital]

it works with coreavc when you remux the stream to mp4
(demux to raw with mplayer and import to mp4 with mp4box)As a matter of interest, could you upload your re-muxed MP4 sample please?

Our very own Richard Berg is offering some (very) temporary ftp space (ftp://tempclips%40avisynth.org:QfJY(86m@avisynth.org).


Cheers

[RBF]

As a matter of interest, could you upload your re-muxed MP4 sample please?
Cheers
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=04CBCNQB

[Isochroma]

Very impressive, BetaBoy! Your RGB output options pretty much guarantee that I will purchase the decoder...

[3ngel]

Wow betaboy, i'm waiting the moment of the release and possibly to buy it :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

That reminds me....

Has any progress been made with respect to anamorphic signalling detection for AVC streams placed within AVI and MP4/


Cheers

[[Toff]]

That reminds me....
Has any progress been made with respect to anamorphic signalling detection for AVC streams placed within AVI and MP4/
Yes, there was some progresse made with anamorphic signalling detection and MP4, now it should works properly works with Gabest MP4 splitter.
Nothing new on the AVI side.

[SeeMoreDigital]

']Yes, there was some progresse made with anamorphic signalling detection and MP4, now it should works properly works with Gabest MP4 splitter.
Nothing new on the AVI side.Sadly.... I've been unable to get MPC to correctly display anamorphic AVC streams in MP4 with Gabest's MP4 splitter.

I've tried the all the latest MPC compiles, including todays.


Cheers

[[Toff]]

Sadly.... I've been unable to get MPC to correctly display anamorphic AVC streams in MP4 with Gabest's MP4 splitter.
I've tried the all the latest MPC compiles, including todays.

I can tell you it works fine with your Starwars sample and current CoreAVC developpement build.

[3ngel]

It works for me with Haali Media Splitter and MPC (and latest CoreAVC) with no problems.

[[Toff]]

It works for me with Haali Media Splitter and MPC (and latest CoreAVC) with no problems.
Haali's splitter is more clever because it decode the AR signaling info and provide them when connecting to the decoder. So with Haali's splitter you can just pass the information to the video renderer, with Gabest's splitter you need to decode the information provided in the SPS.

[SeeMoreDigital]

']I can tell you it works fine with your Starwars sample and current CoreAVC developpement build.Just tried it... and no it does not :(

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/3002/coreavc4oq.png



Just to confirm... I do not wish to install Haali's splitter because I've been testing Gabest's external MP4 splitter.... Which has just made it into Celtic_Druid's latest compiles of MPC: -

Updated (celtic_druid's build)
mplayerc2006.02.14.2kxp.7z (http://www.fairyland.to/celtic_druid/Media_Player_Classic/mirror/Media%20Player%20Classic/mplayerc2006.02.14.2kxp.7z)
mplayerc2006.02.14.2kxp.7z (http://m17n.cool.ne.jp/freeware/mpc/mirror/Media%20Player%20Classic/mplayerc2006.02.14.2kxp.7z)
Cheers

[bond]

']Haali's splitter is more clever because it decode the AR signaling info and provide them when connecting to the decoder. So with Haali's splitter you can just pass the information to the video renderer, with Gabest's splitter you need to decode the information provided in the SPS.actually its not only gabest's splitter who acts like gabest's splitter :D
basically every mp4 splitter handling avc acts the same way (including haali) as they all attach the SPS/PPS at dwSequenceHeader, so if you readout the sar info from there (do you do that?) coreavc will work with every mp4 avc splitter publically known (haali, gabest, nero, elecard, moonlight)

[[Toff]]

Just tried it... and no it does not :(
I'm talking about the development build. It does not works with v0.0.04.

[[Toff]]

actually its not only gabest's splitter who acts like gabest's splitter :D
basically every mp4 splitter handling avc acts the same way (including haali) as they all attach the SPS/PPS at dwSequenceHeader, so if you readout the sar info from there (do you do that?) coreavc will work with every mp4 avc splitter publically known (haali, gabest, nero, elecard, moonlight)
Well Gabest splitter is free so it's easier to test :)
And as I have said Haali's splitter is more clever because in addition to attaching the SPS/PPS, it decodes the SPS and put that info in the media type.

[SeeMoreDigital]

']I'm talking about the development build. It does not works with v0.0.04.You'll have to excuse my ignorance... the development build of what?

Can you point me to it please?

[[Toff]]

You'll have to excuse my ignorance... the development build of what? Can you point me to it please?
The developement build of CoreAVC DirectShow filter, what are we talking about into this thread ;)
And no it's not available.

[multicone]

lol ..... everybody knows that [Toff] is the developer of CoreAVC ... long life [Toff] !

[SeeMoreDigital]

']The developement build of CoreAVC DirectShow filter, what are we talking about into this thread ;)
And no it's not available.Bummer.... It was worth a try :)

Nice to know it works though... well done ;)

[[Toff]]

lol ..... everybody knows that [Toff] is the developer of CoreAVC ... long life [Toff] !
Only the DirectShow "port" to be percise.

[dk75]

CoreCodec staff... had you heard that AT&T have right for some parts of the MPEG-4 and licensing it?

[SeeMoreDigital]

Bummer.... It was worth a try :)

Nice to know it works though... well done ;)By-the-way.... I have not broken any of the NDA's I've signed ;)

[thuan]

I have a problem with this file [Relish]Kino_no_Tabi_-life_goes_on-[h264][20772313].mkv. When I play it with Haali splitter (latest) and CoreAVC 0.0.0.4 (dl from here) it play with wrong frame rate. With Haali and ffdshow I play it fine.
But the file itself is muxed the wrong way I think, when I tried to remux it with mkvtoolnix I got the following error massage:
Error: 'G:\Files\[Relish]Kino_no_Tabi_-life_goes_on-[h264][20772313].mkv' track 1: You are trying to put AVC/h.264 video from an AVI or a similar VfW (Video for Windows) compatible source into a Matroska file in the so-called 'VfW compatibility mode'. Please note that this is not the official way to store AVC/h.264 video in Matroska. Therefore proper playback of such files cannot be guaranteed, and we strongly urge you to use the native Matroska-mode.

So I extract the timecodes of this file and the video track to raw then I mux the video with mp4box to .mp4 and I mux the the new mp4 with the remaining streams in the original file to the new mkv with the timecodes I extracted earlier and the new mkv file play fine with CoreAVC.

The file is muxed the wrong way but ffdshow play it fine so I think the developer may want to take a look into it.

[[)370|\|470!2]

COREAVC 0.0.04 hangs & crashes explorer when it tries to create
a thumbnail for a fresh-created avc(avi) file. Anyone can confirm this?..

[ChronoCross]

gotta love avc in avi...................

[BetaBoy]

gotta love avc in avi...................

Can someone pass the word along... just let AVI die already? :thanks: (sorry Alexnoe)

[[)370|\|470!2]

i'm impressed
you're very original

[SeeMoreDigital]

Can someone pass the word along... just let AVI die already? :thanks: (sorry Alexnoe)We'll need more MP4 capable stand-alone players/devices before that happens!

Some supporting MKV would not be bad either ;)

[Sirber]

I like more MKV than MP4, but MP4 is pretty well supported on handled.

[Sharktooth]

the problem with mkv is you cant know what codec is used for the video and audio streams without opening the file, while with mp4 you expect mpeg 4 for both...
avi is another story though... 90% of avis are mpeg-4 video + mp3 or ac3 audio.

[Sirber]

MP4 can be ASP, AVC, AAC, AAC+, AAC+v2, MP3, and maybe more
so you can't be that sure of the content

[SeeMoreDigital]

the problem with mkv is you cant know what codec is used for the video and audio streams without opening the file, while with mp4 you expect mpeg 4 for both...Yes... 99% of the time.

However, MPEG-1 and especially MPEG-2 video works well in MP4.... As does MP3 audio ;)

[fight2win]

does a directshow based core avc decoder exists? if no, when can we expect it to be released?

[Sirber]

does a directshow based core avc decoder exists? if no, when can we expect it to be released?It's already Dshow...

[bond]

MP4 can be ASP, AVC, AAC, AAC+, AAC+v2, MP3, and maybe more so you can't be that sure of the contentthere is no difference between aac, aacv1, aacv2 mp4-wise
as noone uses mp3 in mp4 i would say the only really unsure thing is whether avc or asp video is used in mp4

[Sirber]

as noone uses mp3 in mp4 i would say the only really unsure thing is whether avc or asp video is used in mp4I've seen some, so it's possible and used by some people.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I've seen some, so it's possible and used by some people.Indeed...

I used it quite a bit, when I first started re-muxing my early MPEG-4+MP3 in AVI encodes straight to MP4.... I did not really feel it necessary to re-encode 2Ch MP3 audio to 2Ch AAC-LC (and suffer the inevitable quality drop).


Cheers

[Hellworm]

the problem with mkv is you cant know what codec is used for the video and audio streams without opening the file, while with mp4 you expect mpeg 4 for both...
avi is another story though... 90% of avis are mpeg-4 video + mp3 or ac3 audio.

I think the Situation for mp4 and mkv is nearly the same. It's possible to place nearly everything in an mp4/mkv, but most times you can assume that it's some mpeg4 for mp4 and for mkv you can expect some mpeg4 for video and for audio one of the three ogg, aac or mp3.

[foxyshadis]

wmv-in-mkv via vfw is painfully common. rm-in-mkv I spot occasionally. I've yet to see quicktime or flash in mkv except when I remux. Fortunately mpeg-4 is the most common, given the competition.

[SeeMoreDigital]

....I've yet to see quicktime or flash in mkv except when I remux. Fortunately mpeg-4 is the most common, given the competition.There's no such thing as QuickTime video.... Do you mean Sorenson?


Cheers

[Sirber]

rm-in-mkv I spot occasionally.I have quite a lot :D (no wonder :p)

[Hellworm]

I have to admit, i've nerver seen an wmv in an mkv, only in avi.
( And when I will ever see, I'll destroy the file and desinfect my hd carefully :D )
But what I've seen is mpeg4 ( and nowadays avc ) in vfw-mode in an mkv and also often in avi, which is quite a pain, and ( to come back to topic) people tend to want it decoded by an avc-decoder, but I think that's not something developers of decoders should have to worry about. Unfortunately until there are no vfw-encoders for mpeg4 any more there will always be Problems with that.

[[)370|\|470!2]

Unfortunately until there are no vfw-encoders for mpeg4 any more there will always be Problems with that.

Oh really? I'd suggest ya to format c: becoz M$ is ev!l and buggy!

Also you probably violating rule #6 by addmiting of downloaded video files.

[Ice =A=]

[)370|\|470!2: Also you probably violating rule #6 by addmiting of downloaded video files.
ROFL!!! :D :mad:

[Hellworm]

Oh really? I'd suggest ya to format c: becoz M$ is ev!l and buggy!

I don't know how this could help me against M$, but in full trust in your instructions I tried. But everything I get for an answer is:
bash: format: command not found

What should I do?

[Sirber]

bash: format: command not found

What should I do?emerge -C wine? ;)

[[)370|\|470!2]

A proud *nix user huh? Accept my apologies, taking off my hat xD
Hence it is clearer now, why you against vfw...

[Sirber]

A proud *nix user huh? Accept my apologies, taking off my hat xD
Hence it is clearer now, why you against vfw...Isn't it 14 years old?

[BetaBoy]

I guess to get the boat back on track and to keep everyone in the loop... and to answer a question I was asked. Yes, CoreAVC will be available for Linux... not in MPlayer or VLC but it will be in TCPMP for Linux (gtk) and (juce).

Also, is anyone interested in helping our current efforts in coding a universal streaming module for RDP/UDP/RTP/RTSP/HTTP?

[Sharktooth]

if there's an SDK available it will be easier :)

[Selur]

Any news if coreavc will support/use nvidia hardware?
(potential buyer over here :D)

[ChronoCross]

Any news if coreavc will support/use nvidia hardware?
(potential buyer over here :D)

*takes a leak on nvidia*

use ATI. It'll smoke your nvidia. Coreavc is just fine without adding useless hardware specific enhancements.

[BetaBoy]

if there's an SDK available it will be easier :)
We have one.... its a work in progress and I am working on the Linux side of things ATM as things are added/discussed (and changed) ;-)

[Sharktooth]

i wish i could help, but im stuck in a hospital. i'll get home later this month and have tons of things to do but maybe i'll contact you.

[Sharktooth]

Any news if coreavc will support/use nvidia hardware?
(potential buyer over here :D)
nvidia HW acceleration is done thru DXVA. Even h.264 acceleration will be done thru DXVA 2.0 (in windows vista only though).
supporting different ways to accelerate playback means to use pixel shaders for common functions and it requires some advanced knowledge of GPU HW and programming.

[Isochroma]

The CoreAVC filter seems to be just one in a series of high-quality decoders produced by the Core project people. I was having trouble recently with the OGG DS filter 0.9.9.5 not working with Haali's splitter, so finally uninstalled it and installed CoreVorbis. Voila, functional!

This got me thinking about something: why not integrate in one installer or package all these nice decoders? The three decoders really fill in gaps that would otherwise be filled by significantly slower decoders like ffdshow, or buggy/incompatible ones like OGGDS.

It could be called the Core Powerpack or maybe the Core Decoders Package or CoreCodecs Pack, and would contain latest versions of:

CoreAAC
CoreAVC
CoreVorbis
CoreWavpack

[bond]

This got me thinking about something: why not integrate in one installer or package all these nice decoders? The three decoders really fill in gaps that would otherwise be filled by significantly slower decoders like ffdshow, or buggy/incompatible ones like OGGDS.i heavily doubt that aac and vorbis decoding in ffdshow is slower than with coreaac and corevorbis, as they all use the same decoder libraries

apart from that ffdshow is exactly what you are asking for

[BetaBoy]

We have talked about a "6-pack Bundle"...

1) CoreAAC v2.0 (w/DSFilter) will be out around the time TCPMP 1.0 is released based on our internal devel'd HE-AAC decoder for TCPMP.
2) CoreASP 1.0 (same as above)
3) CoreMP3 1.0 (same as above)
4) CoreAVC 1.0 (soon)
5) CoreFLAC
6) CoreVORBIS

But I despise the term 'Codec Pack' as most are 'codec hacks'. With layer after layer of codecs and filters that do not act in a cohesive manner.

/me hugs Haali's splitter

[Caroliano]

Sorry to ask, but what would be the advantage of CoreMP3 over the native mp3 decoder of windows?

[CobraX]

Howly cow :eek:

Let me straighten out things. I recently downloaded some HD trailers from the apple site. I didn't have any AVC decoders installed back then (cause I'm using the koepi XviD exe to decode my movies, so no ffdshow for me). On my rig (Athlon64 3000+@3200+, 1 GB ram) most of the movies didn't play fluently at all. They played fluently during 50% of the clip. It got me down a bit cause I couldn't play 720p trailers on my (pretty) fast rig. So I tried out CoreAVC 0.0.0.4. What the hell happened??? My trailers are now playing fluently during 90% of the clip. Simply amazing! Now I got down again when I read this thread and heard that CoreAVC is not going to be free :(. Can't you guys make it free for personal use (just like xvid)? Pleeeeease you would make my day (and even year).

[BetaBoy]

Sorry to ask, but what would be the advantage of CoreMP3 over the native mp3 decoder of windows?
- Speed savings
- Quality sound
When its ready (the DS filter that is.. the decoder has been done for months now) i'll submit it to HA for some testing.

[lexor]

- Quality sound
I wouldn't claim that, especially at HA, if I were you. All decoders must produce identical output (it's a finite state machine after all), otherwise there is a bug that needs to be fixed. If there was a bug that affected default decoder, it would have already been found by now, especially by the guys at AH, I mean they found a bit missallocation in Nero AAC encoder by ear, even though betrate analysis revealed no faul play. So you can claim speed, but no way you can claim quality improvement.

[Sharktooth]

quality improvment can be there thru a better interpolation and post processing.
it has been already proven there are better mp3 decoders than the reference decoder and the fraunhofer one included in windows.

[lexor]

quality improvment can be there thru a better interpolation and post processing.
it has been already proven there are better mp3 decoders than the reference decoder and the fraunhofer one included in windows.
What now? Where is this "proof" you speak of? All I see is claims being made by the same people that claim snake oil improves sound (these guys love MAD mp3 decoder), never seen a proof. Plus post processing is not decoding, and what interpolation? you mean dithering from 44.1 to 48 Khz (or from 16 to 24bits) or something like that? that's not decoding either.

[dimzon]

What now? Where is this "proof" you speak of? All I see is claims being made by the same people that claim snake oil improves sound (these guys love MAD mp3 decoder), never seen a proof. Plus post processing is not decoding, and what interpolation? you mean dithering from 44.1 to 48 Khz (or from 16 to 24bits) or something like that? that's not decoding either.
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=17728

[Caroliano]

The diferences are so subtle that even Guruboolez had an hard time to find them. And audio decoding speed is not so important if we compare with video decoding speed... but anyway, good work.

[Sharktooth]

What now? Where is this "proof" you speak of? All I see is claims being made by the same people that claim snake oil improves sound (these guys love MAD mp3 decoder), never seen a proof. Plus post processing is not decoding, and what interpolation? you mean dithering from 44.1 to 48 Khz (or from 16 to 24bits) or something like that? that's not decoding either.
dimon provided the link. post processing (dct noise reduction, frequencies restoration, etc) is part of the decoding as well as interpolation between samples.
maybe you should get a clue of what you're talking about before posting.

[BetaBoy]

lexor... chill... all I said was quality sound. I did not say "IT IS THE BEST", "IT'S BETTER THEN...", etc. I'd never do that in a non-competitive manner.

[dimzon]

2 lexor && Sharktooth
The diferences are so subtle that even Guruboolez had an hard time to find them. And audio decoding speed is not so important if we compare with video decoding speed... but anyway, good work.

[lexor]

dimon provided the link. post processing (dct noise reduction, frequencies restoration, etc) is part of the decoding as well as interpolation between samples.
maybe you should get a clue of what you're talking about before posting.
ok... so you threw terms into your first post without explaining and I misinterpreted, amazing (I can see how that warrants an insult of my intelligence). But you go ahead, post this quality claim at HA, they gonna looooove you long time there :) don't let little old me stop you.

@betaboy, yeah that is a good point, just your original post seemed like you were gonna claim as advantages speed and quality (so in effect you did claim "better than..."), problem is that if you have a decoder you gotta have quality or you don't have a proper decoder. It's just different when you said speed, you guys got kick ass product in that respect, putting quality into same list would suggest equal level of superiority, which I don't believe can be produced (at all, not just by you).

My point wasn't that you can't make a top notch decoder in terms of quality, I merely doubt that you can achieve superiority of the same level as you do with speed, I seriously doubt anyone can compete there with you.

@dimzon sorry you posted while I was typing, since there is no link, can you clarify, the quote says "difference", but did he found an improvement? or is it just difference, as in, different people like different sound?

[Sharktooth]

you asked for proofs... and the proofs are there... by the same HA guys you mention in your posts.
obviously you still dont have a clue of what are you talking about.
discussing with arrogant and ignorant ppl drives to nowhere, so this is my last post on the subject.

[dimzon]

@dimzon sorry you posted while I was typing, since there is no link, can you clarify, the quote says "difference", but did he found an improvement? or is it just difference, as in, different people like different sound?


as you can read from linked post:
guruboolezwrote:

It's not a MAD CHALLENGE. I repeat again that the listening conditions of the test are not reproductible on daily music listening. I've just put the decoder behind a magnifying glass, by using low volume samples.

CONCLUSIONS:

MAD isn't impressive. On four samples, result was worse than simplest decoders: increase in noise, without audible benefit on other points of the signal (aliasing, higher definition, etc...). But on some other samples, real improvements were noticed (less aliasing, less naturel and less synthetic sound)

LAME and Fraunhofer (WA5) are close, but not totally identical. Both are noisy, but less than MAD (good point). With some samples, sound was irregular, unatural... MAD partailly correct this feeling, and foobar2000 was perfect in comparison. Something like aliasing or moiré was introduced by the decoding stage. Slight difference between LAME and Fraunhofer (hard to ABX : up to 30...50 trials), in favour of Fraunhofer, less synthetic and maybe slightly more noisy

foobar2000 : each time winner. The less noisy of all challengers on all samples. The only additionnal noise audible was a very high-pitched band, very typical, and audible on extreme conditions (near silence sound, and with my amp pump to the maximum). All aliasing, irregularities... were gone: instruments are smooth, naturel. Nothing synthetic at all. With one sample (the #7), the sound was clearly better than the reference file (CD!). The lack of dithering on mastering seem to be prejudicial on very low volume part, and foobar2000 decoding correct the aliasing present on the CD. Simply amazing conclusion....

[lexor]

you asked for proofs... and the proofs are there... by the same HA guys you mention in your posts.
obviously you still dont have a clue of what are you talking about.
discussing with arrogant and ignorant ppl drives to nowhere, so this is my last post on the subject.
And still you show no proof (dimzon bolded important an sentance)... how amusing. I agree with you on your last point then.

@betaboy: sorry I derailed the discussion, I promise to focus on the subject matter of the thread from now on.

[Episodio1]

Sharktooth, I see lexor here not being ignorant: "Plus post processing is not decoding, and what interpolation? you mean dithering from 44.1 to 48 Khz (or from 16 to 24bits) or something like that? that's not decoding either." Besides he is explaining his position; not same as you. :(

Having read the link... Im with lex0r.

[Kurtnoise]

We have talked about a "6-pack Bundle"...

1) CoreAAC v2.0 (w/DSFilter) will be out around the time TCPMP 1.0 is released based on our internal devel'd HE-AAC decoder for TCPMP.
2) CoreASP 1.0 (same as above)
3) CoreMP3 1.0 (same as above)
4) CoreAVC 1.0 (soon)
5) CoreFLAC
6) CoreVORBIS
7) CoreWavPack
8) CoreTTA
......:p :D

[lexor]

btw betaboy, I've been meaning to ask about 1.0 features, last we spoke you were saying that there is going to be a player (somewhat like the ActiveX preview from CES) that can be integrated into anything and works with any format. I was wondering if 1.0 gonna have browser integration or will it still be purely stand alone. (I'm still grasping at the hope that I can one day be rid of QT)

[Sharktooth]

Sharktooth, I see lexor here not being ignorant: "Plus post processing is not decoding, and what interpolation? you mean dithering from 44.1 to 48 Khz (or from 16 to 24bits) or something like that? that's not decoding either." Besides he is explaining his position; not same as you. :(

Having read the link... Im with lex0r.
well, i only said there are techniques (postprocessing - and yes it's part of the decoding process) to improve the audio output of a decoder (as well as post processing on mpeg4 asp improves video).
is it so hard to understand?
the proof is there are better decoders than the fraunhofer reference decoder (read the dimzon post and follow the link on HA).
sure the difference is not that big but there's indeed a difference and there's still space for improvment.
hope it's all clear now.

[BetaBoy]

CoreWavPack needs work... CoreTTA.. Well... we stopped supporting Alexander's efforts after he used CoreCodec... but that is a whole other subject.

[BetaBoy]

So... back on track all... Since we are close to releasing CoreAVC. I want to discuss with the community our current CoreAVC versions... the only thing in question atm is the 'Extended' AVC profile and how best to fit this in.

[[ Standard Version ]]
- Baseline, Main, High profile support
- No, Interlaced
- No, SMP
- No, GPU

[[ Professional Version ]]
- Baseline, Main, High profile support
- Yes, Interlaced support
- Yes, SMP support (limit 2)
- Yes, GPU support

[[ Enterprise Version ]]
- Baseline, Main, Extended, High, High10, High 4:2:2, High 4:4:4 profile support
- Yes, Interlaced support
- Yes, SMP support (unlimited)
- Yes, GPU support

Thoughts... Suggestions.

[ChronoCross]

Add interlaced support to the standard version. SMP and GPU should be the upgrade to professional.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Add interlaced support to the standard version. SMP and GPU should be the upgrade to professional.Agreed :)

Do we really need three versions. Would two not do?


Cheers

[tomos]

personally consider myself a standard user, and the last test version i downloaded does all i need minus SMP (only cos i have an X2), although interlace support would be useful for supporting video content i havent encoded myself

GPU support i would think belongs in the professional one, along with other features :)

[[)370|\|470!2]

(postprocessing - and yes it's part of the decoding process) LOL?
to improve the audio output of a decoder Huh? In which manner exactly it improves audio quality?
Haven't you ever heard an expression that there's no way of getting a candy from a crap?
(as well aspost processing on mpeg4 asp improves video). Is this a joke?
is it so hard to understand? Well, yes. For me at least.
Though working as an asm coder for a several years, i simply don't get it,
how you could gain anything else from a plain stream
except for stuff that is initially there and already extracted/dequantized.
the proof is there are better decoders than the fraunhofer reference decoder
(read the dimzon post and follow the link on HA).
sure the difference is not that big but there's indeed a difference and there's still space for improvment.
hope it's all clear now.
Yea, right. But if you look bit more closely, you'll see, that all he talking about is dithering there.
Or is it a part of decoding process too? :D

[jjesusfreak01]

Add interlaced support to the standard version. SMP and GPU should be the upgrade to professional.
Yeah, this interlaced support is the only one of these features that standard users really need. Seriously, it would be a significant impediment if interlace support was missing.

[GhengisKhan]

Alright, maybe it's me, but these versions seem really targeted at x264 users... I use Nero Recode and I don't have any of those options. I currently use the Maximum Definition - AVC profile with Nero Recode. Could anyone tell me what version/features I would be using then... Betaboy, will this type of encoding even play on my Axim X50v under TCPMP?

I'm a little confused with this whole splitting up the features thing... maybe someone can help me out...

[ChronoCross]

Alright, maybe it's me, but these versions seem really targeted at x264 users... I use Nero Recode and I don't have any of those options. I currently use the Maximum Definition - AVC profile with Nero Recode. Could anyone tell me what version/features I would be using then... Betaboy, will this type of encoding even play on my Axim X50v under TCPMP?

I'm a little confused with this whole splitting up the features thing... maybe someone can help me out...

This is a decoder. not an encoder.

[Sirber]

What would be the prices for that?

[foxyshadis]

Noise shaping and dithering are psychoaudio enhancements, the same way that EQ and DSP are enhancements, would you argue there is no way you can imagine the sound being improved by them? The former are much more subtle, though. As a coder you should know that the quantized fft stores information at a higher resolution than the source, even if it may not be entirely meaningful information, and using that extra resolution properly can improve the output quality slightly.

It won't make a 96 kbps mp3 sound like a 160, but no one's arguing that; though Core may have some magic artifact reduction algorithms, who knows.

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

BetaBoy, hi, your idea about three versions looks fine, but you should add Interlace support in Standard version.

About the price, Standard version should be FREE, Pro and Enterprise versions should could cost about 25 $ for Pro, and 50-60 $ for Enterprise version.

[BetaBoy]

SMD... Interlaced in the pro version based on what is currently available in AVC content. This is the basis for the three CoreAVC versions and why I asked about 'Enhanced' profile comments, because now we are leaning for it to be a Enterprise feature but for some streamed/mobile content (down the road) it will be essential. We could move this to the Pro version in a 1.xx version if the feedback and needs warrant it.

ChronoCross... noted.... but as I stated to SMD.

jjesusfreak01... the issue is time and investment it has taken to properly devel interlaced... but why needed in a standard version? (Other then SAT content).

Sirber... tbd... as this is one of the reasons why i posted for all of your thoughts on what I had proposed.

[BetaBoy]

CoreWavPack needs work... CoreTTA.. Well... we stopped supporting Alexander's efforts after he used CoreCodec... but that is a whole other subject.
Toff informed me I was wrong on CoreWavPack... I thought it was based on a beta library (sorry David) so add it to the list.

[nm]

SMD... Interlaced in the pro version based on what is currently available in AVC content.
We already have DVB satellite channels broadcasting interlaced H.264 video here in Europe and for many people that is their first encounter with H.264. CoreAVC could have a large market here just because of this transition to HDTV that is just beginning (and because other decoders are painfully slow).

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

BetaBoy, you didn't answer on my question(comment).

[BetaBoy]

If you read the thread earlier I commented on why it cannot be free... at least initially. It is a goal of ours... but the CAP for AVC is 1 1/2 times that of ASP, so... I can say that our PRO version will be well under the $25 you stated (we are thinking a discounted $14.95) and our Enterprise version is tbd as it not be out till Q2 anyway.... but maybe sooner.. you never know ;-)

Also... we will have a vertical upgrade path for those who have purchased the CoreAVC decoder for when our encoder is released.

[leowai]

Also... we will have a vertical upgrade path for those who have purchased the CoreAVC decoder for when our encoder is released.CoreAVC Encoder? After the experience on the ultra fast decoder. I'm wondering whether it encodes AVC DVD resolution (720x480) or even HD resolution with AMD 3200++ in real time? If yes, it's really an evil like this :devil:.

[Sharktooth]

@betaboy: i just want one thing clarified: are the encoder and decoder features the same in what you listed above?
I mean, SMP could be a feature of the "standard" decoder but not of the "standard" encoder... and interlacing support too, etc...
or the decoder will be the same for the 3 packages?

[Sharktooth]

LOL?
Huh? In which manner exactly it improves audio quality?
Haven't you ever heard an expression that there's no way of getting a candy from a crap?
Ah yes... tell that to the movie studios... LOL...
Post processing is there to improve perceived quality removing compression artifacts or modifing the output to be "easier" to perceive.
Well, we can get rid of ffdshow PP or loop deblocking or divx/xvid decoder PP if they are useless... dont we?
. Is this a joke?
Well, yes. For me at least.
Though working as an asm coder for a several years, i simply don't get it,
how you could gain anything else from a plain stream
except for stuff that is initially there and already extracted/dequantized.

Yea, right. But if you look bit more closely, you'll see, that all he talking about is dithering there.
Or is it a part of decoding process too? :D
everything done by the decoder is part of the decoding process... or it would have been done in another stage...
however let's stop discussing about those things in this thread. just open another one if we want to continue coz we're getting OT.

[pest]

Sorry for posting offtopic, but this is making me a bit angry


Though working as an asm coder for a several years, i simply don't get it,
how you could gain anything else from a plain stream
except for stuff that is initially there and already extracted/dequantized.


A audio coder is a bit different.
There are numerous ways to improve rounding even on the decoding side.
Every stage depends on the accuracy of a prior stage and yes there are
very subtle differences. If you could hear them is another story.

[SeeMoreDigital]

SMD... Interlaced in the pro version based on what is currently available in AVC content. .Hmmm,

Currently I've only been able to get my hands on progressive AVC sources but given MPEG-4 AVC has just started being broadcast in Euroland, there must be a way of getting hold of some PAL 1080i (@ 50 fields per second) test samples.

I guess it's too early to ascertain, which European countries will be using what output resolution, which in-turn will determine whether it will be progressive or interlaced....

From what I understand, Sky in the UK will be trying-out, 1280x720 @ 50 frames per second and 1920x1080 @ 50 fields per second.


Cheers

[Sharktooth]

1920x1080i @25fps (50 fields per second) looks crappy...

[videomixer9]

hm, Pro7 Germany will air "Hero" this Sunday ... specs for the station are named as MPEG4 / AVC - 1080i/25 (25 Vollbilder/Sekunde). Previous Movies like Star Wars were only aired in 720 by them in MPEG2.

If anyone got a DVB-S2 receiver, it airs on Sunday 20:15 CET via ASTRA 1E, 19,2° Ost, Transponder 102, 12,441 GHz vertical. It's Free to Air without any encryption.

However at least on Astra I know that there are several Demostations too airing HD content in MPEG4 AVC over DVB-S2.

[pankov]

http://rapidshare.de/files/13094302/TPS_HD__1920x1080i_.avc-ts.html
it's a little harder to get to the file but it's there
if you read good you will get it
;)
here and in one of my previous posts you can find some interlaced MPEG4-AVC content captured from sats over Europe

[blubberbirne]

*hm* ok, how can i get the pro Version. I'm from germany.

Paypal, Creditcard or what? I have nothing of them ;)

[SeeMoreDigital]

here and in one of my previous posts you can find some interlaced MPEG4-AVC content captured from sats over EuropeSadly I am not always able to download "file samples" from those kind of hosting services :(

[pankov]

if ftp://avisynth.org/ can handle the 42MB file I can upload it there too

[asdfsauce]

I know it might be a bit too early to ask, but are you planning to add hardware acceleration to your encoder as well?

And also, I don't know if it's already been posted in this thread, didn't see it - does anyone know of a dshow splitter for that AVC-TS clip? Tried using VLC, but my computer can't play 1080 AVC without CoreAVC.

[videomixer9]

it's regular ts, MPC internal ts splitter works fine with it

[tomos]

1920x1080i @25fps (50 fields per second) looks crappy...
isnt that what c more HD in sweden (or thereabouts) broadcast as?

theirs are the best quality HD vids i've seen apart from those download clips from microsoft etc.

[ChronoReverse]

Looks like I'll probably get the Pro version depending how it's priced.

I don't know if this has been asked already, but if I purchase one decoder, does it also counts for other platforms as well? For example, if I had a Pro license for x86 Windows, would I be able to transfer it to PocketPC?

[Sharktooth]

isnt that what c more HD in sweden (or thereabouts) broadcast as?

theirs are the best quality HD vids i've seen apart from those download clips from microsoft etc.
25fps makes motion... uhm... jerky...

[BetaBoy]

ChronoReverse.... desktop to desktop only, IE; Windows/Linux. But our CorePlayer for Linux will have this included.... and yes there is overlap but this is why we provide the filter for other platforms that support the DS framework (outside of TCPMP).

[SeeMoreDigital]

1920x1080i @25fps (50 fields per second) looks crappy...Both MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 at 1920x1080 @ 50 fields per second looks fine to me when played in hardware (Zensonic Z500) and viewed on a high-def capable display running at 50Hz :)

When you are feeling a little better, hop on a plane to the UK and come see...


Cheers mate

[tomos]

25fps makes motion... uhm... jerky...

yeah, 25 as opposed to what, 24 for film?

the only jerkyness is with (IMO) pal DVDs (that i wont buy) made from NTSC sources (badly made). (plus the fact that the speedup drives me nuts sometimes) :)

a friend of mine showed me return of the king in 1080i@50 from c more HD, and it was even better than the Bev gladiator broadcast

as long as its done properly, 50 or 60 hz is fine IMO. (would prefer the UK to be 60 hz tho since most stuff i watch is from the US)

[SeeMoreDigital]

plus the fact that the speedup drives me nuts sometimes) :) Indeed... it's quite intriguing as to the number of people who dislike the "24fps-to-25fps" effect!

May I ask, which annoys you the most. The speeded up audio, or the speeded up video?


Cheers

[Sharktooth]

ever tried to watch a 25fps (or 24...) movie on a 100hz TV or PC Monitor?

[tomos]

ever tried to watch a 25fps (or 24...) movie on a 100hz TV or PC Monitor?

yep :D (monitor)

no worries here. now on a LCD projector and a 2405 dell tho

[SeeMoreDigital]

ever tried to watch a 25fps (or 24...) movie on a 100hz TV or PC Monitor?Yes... it looks pants :D

I totally loath and hate 100Hz processing on (PAL/SECAM) TV's... utterly useless!

[tomos]

Indeed... it's quite intriguing as to the number of people who dislike the "24fps-to-25fps" effect!

May I ask, which annoys you the most. The speeded up audio, or the speeded up video?


Cheers

audio. the sound is crazy. the pitch i mean. going from 24 to 25 isnt too bad, but going back then to a lower pitch is just too weird!

women sound like men in drag

[nm]

Maybe there is something wrong with the pitch correction method you used.

[SeeMoreDigital]

audio. the sound is crazy. the pitch i mean. going from 24 to 25 isnt too bad, but going back then to a lower pitch is just too weird!This seems to be most peoples gripe!

[tomos]

Maybe there is something wrong with the pitch correction method you used.

?? this would be what was aired in the US v UK

nothing to do with me (apart from watching of course)

[GhengisKhan]

Two things:

First - I experience the weird pitch thing too. Mostly when my CPU can't process the video fast enough...

Second - I still don't have my question answered. I'll try to make it more clear for those of you who think you're "all that", and don't need to read a whole post.

How do I find out what decoder of the types that Betaboy mentioned (standard, professional, enterprise) will decode Nero Max. Def. AVC encoded video? In other words what features does a Max. Def. AVC encoded Nero video contain?

Please notice... If you decode something you need an encoder - right? So, if I'm using encoding using Nero Max. Def. AVC, would I need the standard, professional or enterprise decoder?

Or, does the decoder come with an encoder - bundled into a codec?

GhengisKhan :cool:

[ChronoCross]

Nero's current encoder is main profile. The ateme(supposed future nero version) is main and high profile with interlacing support. The basic version of coreAVC decoder will play everything except interlaced content and different colorspaces(not supported by any encoder atm). The pro version will play everything cept colorspaces and it also includes multi-threading and GPU speedups. The enterprise plays all content including different colorspace.

I think the typical joe schmoe will only need the basic version. The professional if they reallly absolutely must watch someone who encoded something interlaced (stupid IMHO but oh well I guess).

[nm]

?? this would be what was aired in the US v UK

nothing to do with me (apart from watching of course)
Then you should really complain to the broadcaster. No problems here in Finland (or at least I haven't noticed although I've often watched both 24fps and broadcasted PAL versions).

[tomos]

Then you should really complain to the broadcaster. No problems here in Finland (or at least I haven't noticed although I've often watched both 24fps and broadcasted PAL versions).


what can they do? anything going from 24 to 25 fps is going to be sped up. unless they use pitch correction then it would sound different to the US version.

[nm]

what can they do? anything going from 24 to 25 fps is going to be sped up. unless they use pitch correction then it would sound different to the US version.
They can and should use proper pitch correction. Speeding up audio is different to the US version, but it can't really be noticed if the pitch has been corrected without playing 24fps version at the same time. I was just saying that there should be no "drag queen effects" if the PAL broadcast is done correctly.

[tomos]

they dont use pitch correction the last time i watched a UK airing of an US show. even if they did use pitch correction, you could end up with other faults like in the UK release of the LOTR movies!

its a non issue for me now since i watch US versions of the show entirely now.

this is kinda dragging this thread off topic, so lets end it on that :)

[Episodio1]

There are 3 ways to convert from 24 to PAL. One of them is speeding up, and another is creating an interlaced video playing with the fields. http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=106609

[3ngel]

From 24 to 25 the only professional (and correct, and best quality looking) way is to speed up a little (or better to change the FPS parameter, and morph-speed-streching the audio).
The fields play a game only in a 24->29,97(NTSC) environment (telecine).

[SeeMoreDigital]

By contrast...

How about all the interlaced stuff that's made/shot in Europe (at 25fps/50i) and is converted to NTSC?


Cheers

[tomos]

dont recall any tbh

[3ngel]

@SeeMoreDigital
I think it's quite the inverse. From 25 -> 24 -> 29.97 (Telecine) for a clear transfer.
Other methods, involve combed frames.

[GhengisKhan]

Maybe this is a stupid question, but I'd like to know whether I would be able to (in the future) watch Blu-ray and HD DVD's using the AVC decoder (DS and TCPMP component) from CoreCodec... if I'm going to pay money for it, I'd like to be able to watch BD or HD DVD disc with menus and everything. Is it just me?

Betaboy, what are you planning? Will you liscense out the decoder to be used/modifiable by other big DVD software player developers (such as Intervideo, Nero, Cyberhome, etc.).

GhengisKhan


P.S. Thanks for clearing the decoder thing up ChronoCross :) .

[lexor]

Maybe this is a stupid question, but I'd like to know whether I would be able to (in the future) watch Blu-ray and HD DVD's using the AVC decoder (DS and TCPMP component) from CoreCodec... if I'm going to pay money for it, I'd like to be able to watch BD or HD DVD disc with menus and everything. Is it just me?

Betaboy, what are you planning? Will you liscense out the decoder to be used/modifiable by other big DVD software player developers (such as Intervideo, Nero, Cyberhome, etc.).

GhengisKhan


P.S. Thanks for clearing the decoder thing up ChronoCross :) .
I hightly doubt the big boys are gonna use this decoder, no matter how good it is, they are just snobby this way. And to properly support BD and HD-DVD they would have to incorportate a whole range of things into the TCPMP (remember there is hardware component to their encryption/DRM as well) so I neither believe they will, nor do I think they should. They have kick ass decoder, that's what they should push, maybe other (not so big) desktop DVD players would use them.

[TEB]

I read someone further up the thread wrote that CMore was sending in 1080i/50, but in mpeg2...no mpeg4 there yet..

Feb 22 00:04:37: ts: info: using program 3306 with PMT PID 256
Feb 22 00:04:37: ts: info: using PCR PID 512
Feb 22 00:04:37: ts: info: using video PID 512
Feb 22 00:04:37: ts: info: initial PCR: 74476.089s
Feb 22 00:04:37: pes: info: video stream number: 0
Feb 22 00:04:37: video: info: frame size: 1920x1080
Feb 22 00:04:37: video: info: aspect ratio: 9:16
Feb 22 00:04:37: video: info: frame rate: 25.000
Feb 22 00:04:37: video: info: flags: intra_quant_matrix non_intra_quant_matrix sequence_extension
Feb 22 00:04:37: video: info: profile/level: main/high (0x44)
Feb 22 00:04:37: video: info: acquired video service

[tomos]

yep, me :D

god bless Cmore HD and hyperlove

[BetaBoy]

ok... so we are doing QA before we launch CoreAVC.com and have noticed yet another limitation of AVI that VSS has exploited with their encoder/decoder.

Here have a look: http://www.vsofts.com/h264/clips_d1.html try any of the clips... but I personally enjoy the Cheerleader one ;-)

Haali states that the Ateme filter plays it but it looks like crap. I tried the VSS filter and it works... but both CoreAVC and FFDshow have the artifacts. So... with that we ruled out that it is an interlaced issue or a 'buggy' feature of an encoder.

So looking at the files some more... it turns out that the actual problem is not caused by the buggy feature we suspected, but it was the packed b-frames in avi file format. What this means is that there are two frames stored in a packet and none in the next. Packed b-frames are a workaround (hack) for the limited capabilities of avi container.

/me prays for AVI to eventually just go away so we can look to the future and stop hacking the past.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Jeez.... Why would anybody want to put packed B-VOP's into an H.264 .AVI stream?

That's soooooo DivX :scared:


EDIT: Fortunately if you use YAMB to de-mux from .AVI (to an RAW .h264 stream) and re-mux to .MP4.... the problem is fixed ;)

[bond]

avi simply needs to die, cant be devs start to repeat the mess of asp

therefore i would simply prefer if coreavc ignores videosofts "buggy" files

[SeeMoreDigital]

avi simply needs to die, cant be devs start to repeat the mess of asp

therefore i would simply prefer if coreavc ignores videosofts "buggy" filesI could not agree more!

AVC should be confined to the MP4 container, with the .MKV container or even the .TS container coming in second....

By the way... are there any tools for muxing streams into .TS?


Cheers

[bond]

.ts sucks for local storage, the overhead is simply too big. its meant for transmissions

[SeeMoreDigital]

.ts sucks for local storage, the overhead is simply too big. its meant for transmissionsIndeed...

Although I would not mind experimenting with it for (future) use with stand-alone players... oh, and CoreCodec ;)

Plus, maybe the over-head could be vastly reduced. Seeing as though we don't really need all that error correction!?


Cheers

[Inventive Software]

@SeeMoreDigital: On the subject of going from PAL to NTSC, slow down 25 FPS to 24, tele-cine to 30 FPS, then slow down a little to 29.97 (or 30000/1001)

[fight2win]

where to download coreavc? will coreavc encoder be free? is the decoder free?

[tomos]

where to download coreavc? will coreavc encoder be free? is the decoder free?

from first page



NOTE: We have taken down the download link for the demo as we prepate to launch the www.coreavc.com homepage.

[BetaBoy]

as a status update... work on SMP and Interlaced continues... GPU support will be delayed for a 1.0x release as we are waiting on third party info atm. So with that... we are on track for our March 15th launch date.

[tomos]

great. SMP support will fix most of my probs with high bitrates on some encodes i've done (maxes out 1 core on my X2).

any guesstimates as to how long the delay for GPU support will be, or is that in the air as well at the moment? have a friend with a pc that cant handle x264 on high bitrates at all but he does have a 7800GT so hopefully that would fix it :)

thanks for the update :)

[BetaBoy]

great. SMP support will fix most of my probs with high bitrates on some encodes i've done (maxes out 1 core on my X2).

any guesstimates as to how long the delay for GPU support will be, or is that in the air as well at the moment? have a friend with a pc that cant handle x264 on high bitrates at all but he does have a 7800GT so hopefully that would fix it :)

thanks for the update :)
TBD atm..... Wish I could say more... but I can't. Just know we are still on for trying to getting 'them' in before the launch.

[tomos]

great. will buy in for the SMP support when its out. hopefully 'they' will sort out their side sharpish. i did hear they plan for something by end of march. but then again, there's bound to be the odd delay :(

good luck with the launch anyway :)

[MrWizard]

March 15th, eh? Well I suppose I can wait that long. Looking forward to it.

[killerhex]

its an encoder/decoder release right

[ChronoCross]

its an encoder/decoder release right

decoder only.

[crypto]

Great News. Finally we can use CoreAVC for 1080i HDTV broadcasts.

[BetaBoy]

We just put up a holder page at www.coreavc.com

[fight2win]

URL Added to Firefox Bookmarks

[Scoty]

what is the latest CoreAVC and who can download ?

[SeeMoreDigital]

what is the latest CoreAVC and who can download ?This question has been asked and answered many times before.... Try reading from the beginning of this thread :eek:

[Scoty]

This question has been asked and answered many times before.... Try reading from the beginning of this thread :eek:

no, i can not see a download link on the first page !

[SeeMoreDigital]

no, i can not see a download link on the first page !You've asked this question on Jan 14th and I answered it....

If you want to keep up with what's going on... try reading some more pages please!


Cheers

[tomos]

no, i can not see a download link on the first page !

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=790268#post790268

[CiTay]

no, i can not see a download link on the first page !

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=786019#post786019

0.0.0.4 Alpha was the latest.

[BlackSharkfr]

Really impressive !
I can run 720p videos flawless on my amd xp2000+
http://blacksharkfr.free.fr/CoreAVC_Performance_full.jpg

1080p are too big but it's already amazing how you managed to make such a fast codec !

(when i did the screenshot i hadn't QT alternative... shame on me !)

[Isochroma]

BlackSharkfr:

Nice desktop - where did you get that Studio Ghibli wallpaper?

I have a 2500+ running DDR333, so I assume CoreAVC will be able to do 1080p, though maybe not...

[Ice =A=]

Hey BlackSharkfr, sorry to disappoint you, but I can even play those 720p files flawlessly on a 1GHz Athlon XP (underclocked, passively cooled)! :D :D :D :devil: ;)

[3ngel]

And a "CoreMpeg2" ? :D

[BetaBoy]

We have hinted at an MPEG-2 decoder in the past... and with the issues we are running into with TS streams and CoreAVC we might as well finish the code we had started and do it. But lets get past the CoreAVC launch and then we can move on.

[bond]

what issues do you have with TS? gabest's latest mpegsplitter should output exactly the same data for ts streams as for mp4 streams, so it should be no problem to play

[IgorC]

I don't know if this question was already mentioned before.
Will be there some kind of upgrade/update of purchased decoder? Will owners of commercial version 1.0 have any discount to buy version 2.0?

[bond]

I don't know if this question was already mentioned before.
Will be there some kind of upgrade/update of purchased decoder? Will owners of commercial version 1.0 have any discount to buy version 2.0?now are you sure this question makes sense?
there isnt even 1.0 released and you are already asking for what will be with 2.0? ;)

[IgorC]

I know it.
Yes, my question has a BIG sence. (talking about the possible upgrade as Nero6/7).

now are you sure this question makes sense?

I'm not a newbie ... to talk to me like that. But even with newbies itґs better not violate rule N4.

[3ngel]

@Betaboy
The gabest MPC ts splitter, works flawlessy, so i think you can concentrate only on the decoding part. Or if you want, to develop a separate splitter filter.
I think the most modularity (separate directshow filters), the best from every point of view.

[SeeMoreDigital]

@Betaboy
The gabest MPC ts splitter, works flawlessy, so i think you can concentrate only on the decoding part. Or if you want, to develop a separate splitter filter.Indeed... It seems to work perfectly with just about every std-def and high-def MPEG-2 .TS sources I've thrown at it.

I've not had much luck splitting and sending MPEG-4 AVC .ts to CoreAVC decoder filter though :(

[BlackSharkfr]

Nice desktop - where did you get that Studio Ghibli wallpaper?

I got it from studio ghibli main page http://www.ghibli.jp
I saved the flash file, opened it in flash MX, removed the texts end exported as an image (i only let the studio ghibli logo in the corner)

you can find the 1600x1200 jpeg here : http://blacksharkfr.free.fr/TalesFromEarthSea1600x1200.jpg

Hey BlackSharkfr, sorry to disappoint you, but I can even play those 720p files flawlessly on a 1GHz Athlon XP (underclocked, passively cooled)!

Did i miss something ? Or you are just kidding ?

[Sirber]

Thanks for the wallpaper :D

[lexor]

Did i miss something ? Or you are just kidding ?
nah, you said that you can play back 720p on xp2000+, and he's saying that he can do it on even weaker cpu, I guess the intent is that he wins at decoding with weak hardware :)

[BlackSharkfr]

i understood that but what i don't see how he could possibly have done that.. is there any trick or is he just joking...

[Ice =A=]

Well, I can hardly believe it myself, but it did run smoothly (of course CPU usage was near 100% most of the time).

Edit:
I did test e.g. the UltraViolet trailer from Apple (720p of course) with mpc.

[nm]

i understood that but what i don't see how he could possibly have done that.. is there any trick or is he just joking...You could use TCPMP (with CoreAVC) for playback. It should be faster than the DShow filter.

Edit: Of course, if you don't have that combination available, you'll need to wait a while for the official release ;) Personally, I'm looking forward for the Linux version, and I'll probably buy it if the player works properly.

[Ice =A=]

Well, I have also tested it on an Intel Pentium M at only 1.1GHz: Did run flawlessly, too!

[BlackSharkfr]

Ok i understand with Ultraviolet Trailer, it doesn't requires as much cpu as the other video i tried :
http://blacksharkfr.free.fr/coreavc_performance_uv.jpg

[Ice =A=]

...which is somehow strage, since it's full of fast paced action and video quality seems very good. Anyway, could you name a 720p trailer with higher than average cpu utilization? (Yes, go on, shatter my beautiful world of silent htpc hd video decoding!!! ;))

[BlackSharkfr]

lol !
Well the one on the other screenshot then...
It's Warren Miller's Higher Ground HD... it's in the HD samples (not in the trailers)
And i'm preparing something myself (you can see a glimpse of it on the 2nd screen i took)

[BetaBoy]

I don't know if this question was already mentioned before.
Will be there some kind of upgrade/update of purchased decoder? Will owners of commercial version 1.0 have any discount to buy version 2.0?

Our 'Core Account' system will know that user X has bought product X and is capable of any and all upgrades. We do have a roadmap for a 2.0 version but... we are likely going to move those plans up to v1.5 (code name Orion) as we want to take a few ppl by suprise in what we are coding.

[pankov]

what issues do you have with TS? gabest's latest mpegsplitter should output exactly the same data for ts streams as for mp4 streams, so it should be no problem to play
Bond are you talking about the standalone DirectShow decoder from 26.02.2006 http://ffdshow.faireal.net/mirror/Media%20Player%20Classic/external%20filters/unicode/
or the MPC's internal decoder in the 26.02.2006-2 build?
I've tried both and none of them play fine with this file for example
http://www.casyst.com/mitko/tmp/SkyHD_test.avc-TS

What am I doing wrong? What should I do to make MPC play these files only using CoreAVC and not FFDShow?

[bond]

pankov, the standalone and the interal filters are identical

if the stream uses interlacing (very likely) you cant decode it with ffdshow and coreavc as both dont support interlacing

[pankov]

bond, the SkyHD is progressive (720p). This sample is similar to the one that you have remuxed in mp4 and it worked fine with CoreAVC. So this one should work too ... I think. But it doesn't.
:(
can you look at it closely?

[SeeMoreDigital]

bond, the SkyHD is progressive (720p). This sample is similar to the one that you have remuxed in mp4 and it worked fine with CoreAVC. So this one should work too ... I think. But it doesn't.
:(
can you look at it closely?Indeed...

This is exactly the same problems I experience with FFdshow and CoreAVC's filters in MPC

Which is why I requested the exact same streams within the .TS container be re-muxed .MP4 (as a cross reference) ;)


Cheers

[bond]

for a decoder to be able to decode a stream it also needs to start with the right headers (SPS, PPS)

in those tv transmission captures thats generally not the case, as people simply start capturing anywhere in the stream

mplayer is able to drop everything before the first SPS/PPS and is able to decode from there. other players might not be able to do this

[emmel]

But isn't ts supposed to be a robust format, insensitive with respect to possible reception errors? A lost packet every now and then should not totally kill the view. The necessary headers in ts are suppposed to be repeated in the stream every now and then, and the splitter is supposed to wait until the headers are ok? Forgive me, I'm a newbie here. But the ts robustness is something also I understand and respect.

[pankov]

for a decoder to be able to decode a stream it also needs to start with the right headers (SPS, PPS)

in those tv transmission captures thats generally not the case, as people simply start capturing anywhere in the stream

mplayer is able to drop everything before the first SPS/PPS and is able to decode from there. other players might not be able to do this
OK
so does this mean that this is a fault of the MPEG Splitter or the application that I used to capture the transport stream? I think it's the former because a graph with MainConcept Demux+Decoder works fine with the same file (capture).
I'm using ZoomPlayer Pro and as it's only a directshow player it can't and won't be able to skip everything before the first SPS/PPS so we need a Demux/Decoder that will be able to do it. Right?

[bond]

well gabest's splitter and ffdshow is able to play some file, but not this one. so i dunno whats wrong

[SeeMoreDigital]

The "SkyItalia" sample file seems a little strange... Can somebody confirm?

The SkyItalia .TS file (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=784400#post784400) with 2Ch AC3 audio is 9,115KB
The SkyItalia .MP4 file (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=785466#post785466) with no audio is 8,741KB

If I use YAMB to de-mux the AVC stream out of the .MP4 container, the .h264 stream is 8,736KB

However, if I use YAMB to re-mux the .h264 stream into the .MP4 container, the file is 4,986KB

Strangely, the 4,986KB .MP4 file plays better than the 8,741KB .MP4 file, using both FFdshow's and CoreAVC's filters :eek:


Why is this?

[bond]

gabest splitter + ffdshow/coreavc doesnt work with all tandberg created .ts streams (sky italia, sky uk, premiere, pro7 sat1)

still those files work with mplayer, which tells me that its not related to libavcodec not being able to decode the stream but to the gabest splitter

gabests splitter and ffdshow/coreavc works tough on mainconcept and moonlight created avc ts files, so the tandberg files do something strange

[BetaBoy]

gabest splitter + ffdshow/coreavc doesnt work with all tandberg created .ts streams (sky italia, sky uk, premiere, pro7 sat1)


This will be resolved with the next release... /me note s comment from devel on the TS splitter devel.

[bond]

This will be resolved with the next release... /me note s comment from devel on the TS splitter devel.gabest is currently working on making his mpegsplitter output exactly the same as the mp4splitter with avc so there is no need for decoders to support anything special depending on the container

[lazyn00b]

...which is somehow strage, since it's full of fast paced action and video quality seems very good. Anyway, could you name a 720p trailer with higher than average cpu utilization? (Yes, go on, shatter my beautiful world of silent htpc hd video decoding!!! ;))

Take a closer look at the trailer - see how spatially smooth everything is? Then go watch Ultraviolet at the theater: it's exactly the same! Ultraviolet may be the first "pre-avisynthed" movie ever made. :D This probably made the trailer very compressible, even with all the fast action.

[BetaBoy]

As an FYI... we are gonna delay the launch of CoreAVC for a few more days...

[SeeMoreDigital]

Thanks for letting us know :)

[travisbell]

As an FYI... we are gonna delay the launch of CoreAVC for a few more days...

Thanks for the update. Still can't wait!

[wiak]

I could not agree more!

AVC should be confined to the MP4 container, with the .MKV container or even the .TS container coming in second....

By the way... are there any tools for muxing streams into .TS?


Cheers
no .MKV is the best container after my testing
.mp4 = only supports AAC sound
.mkv = supports most formats
.ts = good format for transporting :P

[Oline 61]

MP4 will have more hardware support though.

[fight2win]

As an FYI... we are gonna delay the launch of CoreAVC for a few more days...

Eagerly Awaiting CoreAVC....

[BetaBoy]

Well... if there are any dual/multi processor people that want to test an SMP version of CoreAVC give me a shout... this is for up anyone with up to 4 CPU Cores... BUT I will only accept D9 regulars... and please do not bother if you are not going to supply feedback... thx! Email me betaboy@corecodec.com and I will email you a time bombed SMP demo to test.

Also, I know some of you will ask... so this version will _not_ be enable for PAFF or MBAFF interlaced content and is essentially our CoreAVC Standard Edition with SMP enabled just for this test.

[blubberbirne]

*hm* Want test this build, but my X2 R.I.P. since two weeks :(

Still waiting for my new one (RMA)

[SeeMoreDigital]

Bummer.... that's me and my "one core" out :(

[tomos]

been here a while but tend to lurk a lot too :)

would like to try the SMP version so will mail and keep my fingers crossed heh

[niknik]

and me thinking my A64 3500+ wouldn't be "obsolete" this quickly...

I'm feeling old!
:)

[soresu]

Does it still count as worthwhile SMP if you have a Hyperthreading P4?

[Sharktooth]

sorry but HT is not multicore/smp... it even gives weird results in multithreaded apps...

[BetaBoy]

You will see improvments with HT as well... our testing is showing a 15% improvement.

[BetaBoy]

Some early test results;

- HT gets about 15-20% boost
- Dual Core gets about a 90% increase in playback performance
- Load balancing needs to be optimized (cpu usage differs)
- 'Field only' has some bugs

On a side note... TS format is now fully supported.

[Gnerma]

The SMP support is looking great BetaBoy. Forgive me for asking this but will you be going into detail about GPU support once version 1 is out the door?

Regardless I've got my credit card in hand :D

[Selur]

@betaboy: got a dual athlon 1800+ MP system so dropped you a mail ;)

[sasam]

That is great stuff...

[Eretria-chan]

I'll be interested to participate as well. I already sent an email.

[BetaBoy]

I am emailing everyone now... you might as well post your results to this thread so the community can see the progress we are making.

Specifically I will send those people TCPMP win32 with SMP enabled... I will also send the pre SMP 'avc.plg' to compare it too.

Post the differences between the two.... but even if you dont have SMP and have HT available. You will see a nice boost in performace ;-)

Anyone say 64 bit version?

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

Well, yes, 64-bit version would be very nice to see.

[Eretria-chan]

Yeah, since I have an Athlon64 and will be installing XP 64-bit, that would also be interesting to see! Send a 64-bit build when you can too! Will be interesting to see the difference.

[Sirber]

WinXP64 is not worth it.

[tomos]

got my mail (thanks Dan :) )

started some little tests and so far:

BUGS

player sees avi's as folders and gives error on trying to open "private test version!, CPU 0003 2", misreports their size. opens and plays fine afterwards tho - apart from seeking wont work (all my clips are in avi so may just be due to that) no probs at all with codec itself so far. :D

CPU usage

with clips that just cant play well on a single core alone, it plays flawlessly so far. havent had a clip go above 55% overall yet.

Speed gain

seems 1 core cpu % is lower than the prev version i was using. playing same clip in mpc versus this one. MPC goes about 45% but with this codec it hits about 30-35% with same vid clip.

CPU info - 4400+ X2 @ stock

will have to make a new clip to mess around with at different bitrates for more info.

[3ngel]

There will be some price discount for the retail version, for us "alpha tester" doom9 registered? :D

[Eretria-chan]

WinXP64 is not worth it.
Why so? I still need to reinstall this stupid Windows installation that seems to have become corrupted after a few days use.

[Sirber]

I tryed it a month and I came back to 32bit. Too much incompatibility with current softs and no speed gain.

[tomos]

Vista x64 should do it better i would hope. dont see why MS are doing it in 32 bit as well.

[Sirber]

I won't move to vista. I don't like their DRM stuff.

[nashse]

- Bugs

- CPU load
30-50 % running maria_taylor_m1080p.mov

- Speed gain
pre smp version Average Speed 99.84% running benchmark of maria_taylor_m1080p.mov

smp Average Speed 185.44% running benchmark of maria_taylor_m1080p.mov


- How many CPU's (2-4)
Dual Core Intel Pentium D 805

[tomos]

I won't move to vista. I don't like their DRM stuff.

i dont like that either, but in time, games will be vista only i would think, or something more in line with this forum - dxva 2 will be vista only

will see how it goes for a few months before moving across tho

[Sirber]

Then I'll put linux and use a console for games :)

[tomos]

consoles! for FPS? that's like gaming heresy man.

:p

[niknik]

Aren't you getting a bit off topic?
(unless games start streaming realtime video output in x264... ehehe :)

[Selur]

here are my first benchmarks using two trailers and a commercial on my dual athlon 1800+ MP system with the TCMP_SMP_version.

X-Men 2 Trailer:

SMP:
average: 29.190%
maximum: 53.906%
benchmark Average Speed: 120.01%
(see: xmen2_bench_20060316_171446_smp.txt)

non SMP:
average: 30.777%
maximum: 42.969%
benchmark average speed: 71.29%
(see: xmen2_bench_20060316_171903_normal.txt)

bravia commercial:

SMP:
average: 2.683%
maximum: 15.625%
benchmark average speed: 340.60%
(see: bravia_bench_20060316_171137_smp.txt)

non SMP:
average: 2.375%
maximum: 17.969%
benchmark average speed: 288.83%
(see: bravia_bench_20060316_165546_normal.txt)


Ice Age 2 Trailer:

SMP:
average: 37.985%
maximum: 71.875%
benchmark Average Speed: 86.00%
(see: iceage2_bench_20060316_164324_smp.txt)

non SMP:
average: 28.224%
maximum: 37.500%
benchmark average speed: 56.18%
(see: iceage2_bench_20060316_164911_normal.txt)

sidenode:
- used perfmon to monitor cpu usage
- used benchmark incorparated in TCMP
- attached the mentioned txt files to post

Cu Selur

[BetaBoy]

Selur... thx for the post... it seems dual AMD MP's are a little slower then I had expected.

[tomos]

some more results:

made a 1080p clip and a 10mbit bitrate which was pretty much unplayable on a single core - played flawless on the new SMP coreavc. definetely more efficient than the prev releases too. shows when locking affinity to just one core.

anyway, some benchies.

x-men - last stand - 1080p quicktime clip on my 4400+ X2

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 381.48%
Video Frames 3590
Audio Samples 7207147
Amount of Data 179001 KB

Bench. Time 0:39.250
Bench. Frame Rate 91.46
Bench. Sample Rate 183623
Bench. Data Rate 37.3 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:29.733
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 9.7 Mbit/s

URL c:\xmenthelaststand_h1080p.mov
Size 183297384
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2140 Mhz
Video output DirectDraw 1920x1200 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x800 -> 1920x800
Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

x-men - last stand - 1080p quicktime clip on my 3800+ X2 (O/C)

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 249.20%
Video Frames 3599
Audio Samples 7187659
Amount of Data 179001 KB

Bench. Time 1:00.234
Bench. Frame Rate 59.75
Bench. Sample Rate 119330
Bench. Data Rate 24.3 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:30.108
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 9.7 Mbit/s

URL c:\xmenthelaststand_h1080p.mov
Size 183297384
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Video output DirectDraw 1920x1200 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x800 -> 1920x800
Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

****************
for some reason, this is slower than my 4400+??? i mean this is clocked to 2.8 gig per core as opposed to 2.2 for the other. everything else is faster on this PC apart from this? weird. also the clock speed is missing from the results. its not in the txt file or on the popup after finishing the benchmark.
****************

Ultraviolet 1080p quicktime trailer

3800+ X2

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 249.40%
Video Frames 3286
Audio Samples 6558374
Amount of Data 165204 KB

Bench. Time 0:54.952
Bench. Frame Rate 59.80
Bench. Sample Rate 119350
Bench. Data Rate 24.6 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:17.053
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 9.8 Mbit/s

URL c:\ultraviolet-tlr1_h1080p.mov
Size 169169668
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Video output DirectDraw 1920x1200 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x1056 -> 1920x1056
Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.


4400+ X2

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 348.04%
Video Frames 3281
Audio Samples 6573737
Amount of Data 165204 KB

Bench. Time 0:39.318
Bench. Frame Rate 83.45
Bench. Sample Rate 167196
Bench. Data Rate 34.4 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:16.845
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 9.8 Mbit/s

URL c:\ultraviolet-tlr1_h1080p.mov
Size 169169668
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2170 Mhz
Video output DirectDraw 1920x1200 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x1056 -> 1920x1056
Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

***********
same again. playing these back normally definetely uses more CPU time on the 4400 than the 3800 so why does the benchie not show this?
***********

[Selur]

Did another test and caused a crash while scolling through a file.
get it here: http://rapidshare.de/files/15668430/lemony-muxed.mp4.html

lemony

SMP:
average: 65.574%
maximum: 80.469%
benchmark Average Speed: 80.20%
(see: lemony_bench_20060316_190607_smp.txt)

Single:
average: 38.164%
maximum: 49.219%
benchmark average speed: 42.67%
(see: lemony_bench_20060316_190607_normal.txt)

attached the txtfiles and the crash.txt
(if needed I can also provide the source and the avs script that I used to create the file)

Cu Selur

[Eretria-chan]

EDIT: Looking for HD trailers...
Can't seem to find any...

[Sirber]

Is it me or a new buid is avalible and everyone is testing it except me? ;)

[tomos]

we mailed betaboy as he req if we wanted to test the new version :)

[PicardGK]

some more results:
3800+ X2
Bench. Frame Rate 59.75
Bench. Frame Rate 59.80

same again. playing these back normally definetely uses more CPU time on the 4400 than the 3800 so why does the benchie not show this?

It seems the 3800+ has a video card which always does vertical sync (and limits benchmark to 60fps). Try comparing the speeds after selecting option/video/null menu.

[tomos]

It seems the 3800+ has a video card which always does vertical sync (and limits benchmark to 60fps). Try comparing the speeds after selecting option/video/null menu.

ok cool. cant see the video playing anymore but seems to go faster :thanks:

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 642.81%
Video Frames 3593
Audio Samples 7227914
Amount of Data 179001 KB

Bench. Time 0:23.312
Bench. Frame Rate 154.12
Bench. Sample Rate 310059
Bench. Data Rate 62.9 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:29.858
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 9.7 Mbit/s

URL c:\xmenthelaststand_h1080p.mov
Size 183297384
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Video output Null Video 1920x800 0bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x800 -> 0x0
Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

and

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 648.94%
Video Frames 3282
Audio Samples 6595727
Amount of Data 165204 KB

Bench. Time 0:21.093
Bench. Frame Rate 155.59
Bench. Sample Rate 312723
Bench. Data Rate 64.1 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:16.886
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 9.8 Mbit/s

URL c:\ultraviolet-tlr1_h1080p.mov
Size 169169668
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Video output Null Video 1920x1056 0bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x1056 -> 0x0
Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

[travisbell]

Wish I had a SMP system to test with *sniff-sniff*

[MuTeK]

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

harry_potter_goblet-tlr2_h720p.mov

Average Speed 1766.44%
Video Frames 3342
Amount of Data 114390 KB

Bench. Time 0:07.890
Bench. Frame Rate 423.52
Bench. Data Rate 118.7 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:19.389
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Data Rate 6.7 Mbit/s


x-men_3-pre_teaser_h720p.mov

Average Speed 2096.96%
Video Frames 2362
Amount of Data 70145 KB

Bench. Time 0:04.697
Bench. Frame Rate 502.77
Bench. Data Rate 122.3 Mbit/s

Original Time 1:38.515
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Data Rate 5.8 Mbit/s

[foxyshadis]

All are audio disabled, ddraw interface.

Silent Hill 1080p:

Average Speed 409.45%
Video Frames 3594
Amount of Data 187462 KB

Bench. Time 0:36.609
Bench. Frame Rate 98.17
Bench. Data Rate 41.9 Mbit/s


Original Time 2:29.774
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 10.2 Mbit/s

non-smp:

Average Speed 224.43%
Video Frames 3601
Amount of Data 187462 KB

Bench. Time 1:06.921
Bench. Frame Rate 53.81
Bench. Data Rate 22.9 Mbit/s


Da Vinci Code 1080p:

Average Speed 324.73%
Video Frames 3594
Amount of Data 161894 KB

Bench. Time 0:46.160
Bench. Frame Rate 77.86
Bench. Data Rate 28.7 Mbit/s

Original Time 2:29.899
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Data Rate 8.8 Mbit/s

non-smp:

Average Speed 177.34%
Video Frames 3601
Amount of Data 161894 KB

Bench. Time 1:24.690
Bench. Frame Rate 42.52
Bench. Data Rate 15.6 Mbit/s


So far all of the trailers play fine, no hiccups or random bugs noticed. Normally uses up around 30% cpu. Oh, and audio drops the bench speed by about 7% in each case.

I'll try testing non-apple trailers when I get more time to make one this weekend.

Specs:
1.66 GHz Core Duo (2mb shared cache)
2GB 677 DDR2
X1300 mobility

It'll probably be too late to update for the 4-way servers coming in next month, but I can give the dual xeons w/ hyperthreading a shot.

[Selur]

V

SMP:
average: 26.255%
maximum: 48.438%
benchmark Average Speed: 120.64%
(see: v_bench_20060317_100704_smp.txt)

Single:
average: 28.622%
maximum: 36.719%
benchmark average speed: 75.11%
(see: v_bench_20060317_101814_normal.txt)

ipod_itunes-1000_songs_h1080p

SMP:
average: 30.957%
maximum: 48.438%
benchmark Average Speed: 109.79%
(see: ipod_bench_20060317_104045_smp.txt)

Single:
average: 28.784%
maximum: 39.063%
benchmark average speed: 67.64%
(see: ipod_bench_20060317_103741_normal.txt)

basic_instinct_2_h1080p

SMP:
average: 48.958%
maximum: 67.969%
benchmark Average Speed: 91.39%
(see: basic2_bench_20060317_104701_smp.txt)

Single:
average: 31.116%
maximum: 13.750%
benchmark average speed: 55.05%
(see: basic2_bench_20060317_105525_normal.txt)

textfiles attached as usual ;)
Cu Selur

[billou2000]

I done some tests too with 2 encoded avc streams on a dual xeon 3.2 Ghz.
Two things to note:
The video card is a bit old and slows everything down if the windows gets too large, so the bench were processed in NULL renderer, and the CPU usage in real time playback were obtained with DirectX in the default window size of TCPMP, which is ok.
I also put a quick comp with nero decoder.

clip1: D1 25fps @ 2mbps (High Profile)
------------------------------------
coreAVC 1CPU
bench 563.37% ( 11.2 Mbps)
playb. 11-19 % CPU (avg 13%) / 25 fps

coreAVC 2CPU
bench 1076.42 % (21.5 Mbps)
playb. 9-19% CPU (avg 13%) / 25 fps

Nero
playb. 16-22 % CPU (avg 19%) / 25 fps

clip2: 720p 50fps @ 4mbps (High Profile)
---------------------------------------
coreAVC 1CPU
bench 129.83 % (5.1 Mbps)
playb. avg 40% / 30 fps

coreAVC 2CPU
bench 245.32 % (9.8 Mbps)
playb. avg 38% / 50 fps

Nero
playb. 50% CPU / 20 fps

[sasam]

Did you delayed the release of coreavc because you wanted to add SMP support to it before the release?
Can someone test how much faster is it with HT turned ON compared to OFF on 1core...

[Sharktooth]

betaboy said 15% improvment:
You will see improvments with HT as well... our testing is showing a 15% improvement.

[tomos]

there's improvement on a single core PC as well (tried on my old athlon xp) V prev beta release

[SeeMoreDigital]

there's improvement on a single core PC as well (tried on my old athlon xp) V prev beta releaseThat's very nice to know :D

Wish I could try it!

[sasam]

That's great progress. By the time its finished if it continues to develop at this rate it will be able to play HD AVC movies on PII :D

BetaBoy, will this new version be on your site or some older stable version on March xx ?

[Eretria-chan]

Argh, really sorry to haven't been able to test, but I've had problems with the computer.
It seems the windows installation is corrupted :( I will format it and reinstall, at least until tomorrow and hope that I will be able to test by then.

[BetaBoy]

Our plan atm is just for the Directshow filter to be available for the initial launch (Standard and Professional). We maybe offering a download as well for both CorePlayer and BetaPlayer till we officially launch them.

[Eretria-chan]

Okay, first results are in! I tried the XMen 3 demo with directshow, and unfortunaly, the computer was unable to properly display it (it jumped to 100% and down, then up, then down, etc) and the picture was lagging. This might be due to that I have underclocked the system (lowered the hypertransport and the ram speed), so I will test again later.

With TCPMP:
Okay so using TCPMP SMP I got cpu load about 40% - 60% flawless playback! Great work!
With TCPMP Non-SMP I got practically the same... is this normal? Both seems to use both the processors really. Unless I did something wrong...

[Selur]

@betaboy: did you check the crash.txt ?
@Eretria-chan: you did excahnge the avc.plg didn't you?

[jblade]

Anyway we can get an updated CoreAVC codec before release :) still using .0.0.4

[Eretria-chan]

@betaboy: did you check the crash.txt ?
@Eretria-chan: you did excahnge the avc.plg didn't you?
Yes, I did. I moved the smp one avc.plg to a sub-folder called plugins and copied the old one from the mail into the folder.

[BetaBoy]

Selur... yes, thx. I'll probally have one more test for you guys before we slap 1.0 on it. What we really need atm is some more people with 'true' 4 CPU's to test loads on each CPU.

Anyone?

[GhengisKhan]

People have 4 CPU's! I want one of those computers - getting a 2.16 Dual Core MacBook Pro (soon)... I guess that would be two CPU's...

Betaboy, how does the current, updated decoder compare to the latest public beta test?

[SeeMoreDigital]

I've tested a couple of hi-def AVC within .TS streams...

The 332KB AVC.plg indicated that it did not support "interlaced" files. However, the 348KB AVC.plg had no such worries ;)

Playback was still a little jerky though... but that's more likely to be my "slow" PC :eek:

[BetaBoy]

yeah... the newer version I sent you had basic interlaced support for field only.

[SeeMoreDigital]

yeah... the newer version I sent you had basic interlaced support for field only.Thanks for the confirmation...


Cheers

[HookedOnTV]

Selur... yes, thx. I'll probally have one more test for you guys before we slap 1.0 on it. What we really need atm is some more people with 'true' 4 CPU's to test loads on each CPU.

Anyone?

I have 4 cpu's... but they aren't all in the same box ;)

[GhengisKhan]

I have 4 cpu's... but they aren't all in the same box ;)

Well, in that case I have 5... oops fogot my PDA - 6

[TEB]

Betaboy. I got a couple of HP-DL385 at work with 2xDualcore AMD opterons on.. unfortunatly these are running linux only.. Is there are possibility for a linux version in the nearby future? (i could run /dev/null for the rendering tho for testing threading capabilities of the decoder..)..

teb

[BetaBoy]

Our first of 5 linux versions will be ready for testing in about 3 weeks. So till then...

[708145]

Our first of 5 linux versions will be ready for testing in about 3 weeks. So till then...

great :D
finally testing on a non-obsolete OS :>

P.S.: I can offer testing on a quad 850 as well :)

bis besser,
Tobias

[MuTeK]

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results: Non-SMP / SMP

>>batman_begins_1080p.mov

Average Speed 228.68% 818.21%
Bench. Time 1:03.104 0:17.565
Bench. Frame Rate 54.83 196.17
Bench. Data Rate 19.7 Mbit/s 70.8 Mbit/s


>>bbc_1080p.mov

Average Speed 165.10% 598.16%
Bench. Time 0:56.481 0:15.512
Bench. Frame Rate 39.62 143.56
Bench. Data Rate 13.8 Mbit/s 50.3 Mbit/s


>>ice_age_2-tlrD_h1080p.mov

Average Speed 305.90% 1020.21%
Bench. Time 0:28.155 0:08.384
Bench. Frame Rate 73.34 244.60
Bench. Data Rate 32.2 Mbit/s 108.3 Mbit/s


>>king_kong_h1080p.mov

Average Speed 229.64% 811.37%
Bench. Time 1:05.401 0:18.443
Bench. Frame Rate 55.06 194.54
Bench. Data Rate 22.5 Mbit/s 79.8 Mbit/s


>>the_new_world_h1080p.mov

Average Speed 259.20% 910.21%
Bench. Time 0:57.333 0:16.257
Bench. Frame Rate 62.14 218.23
Bench. Data Rate 24.2 Mbit/s 85.6 Mbit/s


>>serenity_1080p.mov

Average Speed 266.91% 900.00%
Bench. Time 0:53.098 0:15.686
Bench. Frame Rate 64.01 215.85
Bench. Data Rate 21.8 Mbit/s 74.0 Mbit/s


>>the_ringer_h1080p.mov

Average Speed 238.18% 828.01%
Bench. Time 0:55.808 0:15.992
Bench. Frame Rate 57.11 198.52
Bench. Data Rate 23.3 Mbit/s 81.4 Mbit/s


>>transporter_2_h1080p.mov

Average Speed 239.72% 823.10%
Bench. Time 0:58.302 0:16.888
Bench. Frame Rate 57.48 197.35
Bench. Data Rate 21.5 Mbit/s 74.3 Mbit/s


>>x-men_3-pre_teaser_h1080p.mov

Average Speed 334.24% 1115.75%
Bench. Time 0:29.661 0:08.836
Bench. Frame Rate 80.14 267.51
Bench. Data Rate 34.0 Mbit/s 114.4 Mbit/s

[Gnerma]

And what hardware did you run those tests on MuTeK? Looks like a 4 device system.

[MuTeK]

And what hardware did you run those tests on MuTeK? Looks like a 4 device system.

Yes, Dual Opteron 270 :rolleyes:

[Farpenoodle]

Wow. Looks like it scales extremely well with more threads. Don't know how you guys did it. Looking forward to getting my hands on a dual-core system. :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

How successfully can you guys play the following AVC in .TS samples. Captured from Pro7 HD Channel using a DVB-S2 PCI card?

http://www.dvbmagic.de/download.php?nav=Download-Center&downloadid=26 (20.5MB)

http://www.dvbmagic.de/download.php?nav=Download-Center&downloadid=27 (at 18.4MB)


Cheers

[BetaBoy]

MuTeK... looks great. Your results mirror a few...

I guess... the bottom line is that it looks like there are no bugs being reported related to the SMP code... so it looks like a go.

[3ngel]

@Betaboy
In the retail release of CoreAVC DxFilter, there will be an option to obtain maximum quality (regadless of performance)? Something like "IEEE 64bit Float Decoding"? And deringing and deblocking options?

[IgorC]

That would be interesting to see.
But I think perfomance of H.264 decoders is different to ASP.
Deringing and deblocking are already here ( in encoder-decoder. Pre-postproscessed by inloop filter)
"IEEE 64bit Float Decoding" has misc. effect. Visual quality's impact is *much* less than 1%, but speed will gone down noticebly.

Nero/Ateme, Elecard, CoreAVC decoders have the same metric results. Standard restricitions? Not much to change?

[GodofaGap]

AVC decoding is bit-exact. Any decoder that is bug free and outputs to the same colorspace should give the *exact* same picture.

[tomos]

How successfully can you guys play the following AVC in .TS samples. Captured from Pro7 HD Channel using a DVB-S2 PCI card?

http://www.dvbmagic.de/download.php?nav=Download-Center&downloadid=26 (20.5MB)

http://www.dvbmagic.de/download.php?nav=Download-Center&downloadid=27 (at 18.4MB)


Cheers

plays fine on my 4400+ X2. 20-25% CPU usage

2nd file tho causes an alert - 'buffer size is too small for this media. try increase it in player settings for better playback'.

after that its fine tho :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

2nd file tho causes an alert - 'buffer size is too small for this media. try increase it in player settings for better playback'. Yes.... I get this alert when playing the second file too!

Does anybody else?

[Dreassica]

First plays fine, 2nd only audio output, no error msg though.

[pankov]

yeah... the newer version I sent you had basic interlaced support for field only.
I was just thinking if the decoder will support Interlaced content what kind of Deinterlaceing will it has ... if any. Also will it be possible to somehow use the GPU for deinterlacing as it's done with the NVidia's PureVideo MPEG2 decoder which has very good (may be better than all software I've seen) hardware deinterlacing (pixeladaptive / spatial-temporal de-interlacing).

I also want to ask if the current beta/test version includes a DirectShow filter because I use ZoomPlayer and would like to test it in reallife conditions.

[RBF]

Our first of 5 linux versions will be ready for testing in about 3 weeks. So till then...
Any plans for MacOS X (universal binary) versions?

[BetaBoy]

Any plans for MacOS X (universal binary) versions?
By the end of the year we hope to have 2 different OS X versions.

[BetaBoy]

I also want to ask if the current beta/test version includes a DirectShow filter because I use ZoomPlayer and would like to test it in reallife conditions.

No its strickly for TCPMP.

[pankov]

@BetaBoy

I'll be waiting for the official release then :)
any ETA?

any comment on deinterleasing and GPU support (hardware acceleration)?

[BetaBoy]

I'm hoping to announce the new launch date later today.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I'm hoping to announce the new launch date later today.Nice one ;)

[Romario]

BetaBoy, I know that your official CoreAVC will be very good. Can't wait to test it.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I forgot to ask before but what does the abbreviation, TCPMP stand for?


Cheers

[nm]

http://tcpmp.corecodec.org/about

[SeeMoreDigital]

Thanks mate....

"The Core Pocket Media Player".... doh!


Cheers

[niknik]

you probably aren't used to the "pocket" part. ;)

for anyone having a pocket PC, TCPMP is an essential tool. :)

[GhengisKhan]

Just for you guys to know Betaboy said in the corecodec forums (not exact quote): when v. 1.0 is released the name will change from TCPMP to Betaplayer and Coreplayer. Betaplayer will be the GPLed version and Coreplayer will be the Free and Demo/Pay version.
The difference between Coreplayer Free and Betaplayer will most noticeably be the GUI, and Betaplayer will be a "playground" for testing new releases/features.

For more info you can go to Corecodec.com.

How this tie in with CoreAVC? CoreAVC and Coreplayer are goiing to be released at the same time (if I understood correctly), and for maximum performance in CoreAVC you'll want to be using either Coreplayer, or Betaplayer (DS Filter is slower).

[BetaBoy]

Looks like we have a lil more work todo on the DS filter side of things all. I'll fill you in when I can.... /me grumbles at TS streams.

[BetaBoy]

Incoming email guys... CoreAVC SMP test #2 has been sent... it also now has PAFF interlaced content enabled... so give it a try and post feedback if you are seeing an improvement over SMP #1... thx

[tomos]

testing progressive content is not a problem, but interlaced....

any interlaced samples to download? have none handy to mess around with

[BetaBoy]

one of the earlier posts in this thread has some stuff you can download....

[tomos]

ah ok, didnt even realise they were interlaced. cool :)

1 thing i've noticed just now playing in mpc - my clips all seem out of sync - like the audio is playing about 250ms early

trying it in the first player and thats ok. cant seek forward as this version wont allow it.

the 2nd player seeks well and doesnt lose sync at all from what i've seen so far. jumped around movies of various lengths and no probs with audio/video sync yet.

the audio oddity is the only prob with the use of the codec in MPC so far. CPU usage is great

as far as comparing the 2 players :

player 1
TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 344.37%
Video Frames 4534
Audio Samples 9081600
Amount of Data 115860 KB

Bench. Time 0:54.913
Bench. Frame Rate 82.57
Bench. Sample Rate 165381
Bench. Data Rate 17.2 Mbit/s

Original Time 3:09.105
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 48000
Original Data Rate 5.0 Mbit/s

URL C:\sin city sync ttest.avi
Size 118640640
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2143 Mhz
Video output Null Video 1920x1080 0bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x1080 -> 0x0
Audio output Null Audio 48000Hz 32Bits 2Ch.

player 2

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 352.37%
Video Frames 4541
Audio Samples 9081600
Amount of Data 115860 KB

Bench. Time 0:53.750
Bench. Frame Rate 84.48
Bench. Sample Rate 168972
Bench. Data Rate 17.6 Mbit/s

Original Time 3:09.397
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 48000
Original Data Rate 5.0 Mbit/s

URL C:\sin city sync ttest.avi
Size 118640640
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2144 Mhz
Video output Null Video 1920x1080 0bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x1080 -> 0x0
Audio output Null Audio 48000Hz 32Bits 2Ch.


not much diff between these as far as progressive content goes.

as for interlaced, tried the charlie's angels one and couldnt see any diff between the 2 with either player to be honest. both seemed spot on. couldnt get the video going in MpC. audio only.

as for the john cleese clip, the 1st player gives the buffer err as mentioned before but unlike before, the image now pixelates?

2nd player worked sweet, no errors, no pixellation. it just worked.

MpC wont show video. guessing i'm missing a splitter or something?

as for benchies. here's player 1 v 2 on the john cleese clip

player 1

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 244.03%
Video Frames 207
Audio Samples 371200
Amount of Data 18793 KB

Bench. Time 0:03.168
Bench. Frame Rate 65.32
Bench. Sample Rate 117143
Bench. Data Rate 48.5 Mbit/s

Original Time 0:07.733
Original Sample Rate 48000
Original Data Rate 19.9 Mbit/s

URL c:\prosieben_hd_21155412022006.ts
Size 19323768
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2152 Mhz
Video output Null Video 1920x1088 0bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x1088 -> 0x0
Audio output Null Audio 48000Hz 32Bits 2Ch.


player 2

TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 258.37%
Video Frames 208
Audio Samples 378368
Amount of Data 18793 KB

Bench. Time 0:03.050
Bench. Frame Rate 68.18
Bench. Sample Rate 124016
Bench. Data Rate 50.4 Mbit/s

Original Time 0:07.882
Original Sample Rate 48000
Original Data Rate 19.5 Mbit/s

URL c:\prosieben_hd_21155412022006.ts
Size 19323768
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2144 Mhz
Video output Null Video 1920x1088 0bits Lookup
Video zoom 1920x1088 -> 0x0
Audio output Null Audio 48000Hz 32Bits 2Ch.


Overall it looks like the 2nd player is a little faster but more stable too.

as far as Mpc v Player 2 with x264 in avi goes:

a test clip or rome i have uses between 50-75% CPU usage in Mpc while averaging out at roughly 50-55%

player 2 jumps to about 70% on 'complex' scenes but drops down to 33% and averages about 35-45% overall

also more importantly - the same clip is in sync in player 2 but slightly off in MpC with the newer codec. using time shift works but curious that it goes out of sync at all

forgot to add that this is on a stock 4400+ X2 :)

[PicardGK]

1 thing i've noticed just now playing in mpc - my clips all seem out of sync - like the audio is playing about 250ms
early
I just made some changes and compiled the new DShow filter, but it was not really tested yet :o

What type of files are out of sync: avi or mp4? Or both? Are apple trailers also effected? (I will too make some tests tomorrow)

[tomos]

will try some apple trailers later on. so far i;ve been using my own clips which are in avi

ok, just tried some movs

scanner darkly, xmen last stand both play in sync. so it looks like just avi's so far. cant use megui to make mp4's to test.

[BetaBoy]

Here is a wierd one... This Apple HD clip:
http://www.apple.com/trailers/imax/imaxdeepsea3d/hd/

Comparing to playback in QT... it seems to play slower in TCPMP... I have not tried the DS filter yet with it.

[PicardGK]

so it looks like just avi's so far.
There is a very good chance it's only avi. This is where I made some timing changes without verifing.

[tomos]

ah ok. if i find some mp4's i'll give those a go just to eliminate those too :)

[MuTeK]

MuTeK... looks great. Your results mirror a few...
I guess... the bottom line is that it looks like there are no bugs being reported related to the SMP code... so it looks like a go.

Yes, the results turned out to be very good, performance increases ~3,6 times on SMP version. At that, I experienced no decoding problems .

Incoming email guys... CoreAVC SMP test #2 has been sent... it also now has PAFF interlaced content enabled
Thank you, but it seems that I will have to search for PAFF streams. How the things are going with MBAFF? It’s much easier to find MBAFF streams.

[BlackSun]

Here is a wierd one... This Apple HD clip:
http://www.apple.com/trailers/imax/imaxdeepsea3d/hd/

Comparing to playback in QT... it seems to play slower in TCPMP... I have not tried the DS filter yet with it.

I don't have quicktime installed but it plays fine both with TCMP + CoreAVC or my own CorePlayer build.

[BetaBoy]

Load QT... play the file in it... then play it in TCPMP and you will see it plays about 10% slower.

[sasam]

Thanks for the mail Dan,
I ran a little speed test on my 2 desktop and 3 laptop 1core machines...

Here it is if anyone is interested:
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/1851/coreavc6br.gif

PM = Pentium mobile
CM = Celeron mobile

All exept the old one can play HD Superman trailer, and thats pretty cool. ;)

[lexor]

Here is a wierd one... This Apple HD clip:
http://www.apple.com/trailers/imax/imaxdeepsea3d/hd/

Comparing to playback in QT... it seems to play slower in TCPMP... I have not tried the DS filter yet with it.
I had a similar issue with a lot of Apple's HD trailers (well slower playback, and more CPU usage). It has to do with .mov container, I repacked into mkv and it's all peachy.

btw I'm on the last alpha of DS filter publically available before you pulled the download (so 0.0.0.4 or something like that)

[BetaBoy]

Picard fixed the audio timing issue in SMP2 which I did not test it on.

BTW... SMP3 is heading out now guys... check your emails... this fixes the reported AVI timing issues.

[popper]

you probably aren't used to the "pocket" part. ;)

for anyone having a pocket PC, TCPMP is an essential tool. :)

great i can finally post here (whats with the LONG 5 days delay anyway, and could'nt even MP people)

so your saying if you have a PPC its essential :devil:

what about the people that have real PPC's as in G4/5 with altivec units ?.

will there be a linux PPC (G4)(with altivec ) version of Core for the likes of http://www.ppczone.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=387 people
see http://www.ppczone.org/forums/index.php for all the linuxPPC platforms that exist today, theres a valid market there.

remember to have FUN :rolleyes:

[SeeMoreDigital]

BTW... SMP3 is heading out now guys... check your emails... this fixes the reported AVI timing issues.What more can I say other than many thanks :D


Cheers for now

[blubberbirne]

Thanks for the mail Dan,
I ran a little speed test on my 2 desktop and 3 laptop 1core machines...

Here it is if anyone is interested:
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/1851/coreavc6br.gif

PM = Pentium mobile
CM = Celeron mobile

All exept the old one can play HD Superman trailer, and thats pretty cool. ;)

Pro7 HD Broadcast 25FPS ;)

[sasam]

Pro7 HD Broadcast 25FPS ;)
I know it should be 25fps but 27.45*100/103.78=26.45???
Doesn't matter anyways because all other values are from tcpmp...

And tcpmp gave me for PM 1.7Ghz 25.83 / 99.09%... so it thinks that the fps is 26.45 or something?:confused:

[SeeMoreDigital]

Using the Apple "Imax Trailer" as the source.

Here are the results for the original .MOV file: -TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 101.21%
Video Frames 1417
Audio Samples 2802330
Amount of Data 68152 KB

Bench. Time 0:58.396
Bench. Frame Rate 24.26
Bench. Sample Rate 47988
Bench. Data Rate 9.5 Mbit/s

Original Time 0:59.100
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 44100
Original Data Rate 9.4 Mbit/s

URL \Documents and Settings\SeeMoreDigital\Desktop\imax-deep_sea_h1080p.mov
Size 69788593
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2727 Mhz
Video output DirectDraw 1360x768 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1440x1080 -> 1024x768
Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

And here are the resuts after re-muxing the streams to the .MP4 container using YAMB 1.5: -TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 102.58%
Video Frames 1417
Audio Samples 2871721
Amount of Data 68118 KB

Bench. Time 0:57.616
Bench. Frame Rate 24.59
Bench. Sample Rate 49842
Bench. Data Rate 9.6 Mbit/s

Original Time 0:59.100
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 48000
Original Data Rate 9.4 Mbit/s

URL \Documents and Settings\SeeMoreDigital\Desktop\Bench Tests\imax-deep_sea_h1080p_YAMB re-mux.mp4
Size 69753688
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2727 Mhz
Video output DirectDraw 1360x768 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1440x1080 -> 1024x768
Audio output Wave Output 48000Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

Hope that helps.... "1 core" PC's rock..... (slowly) :)


Cheers

[tomos]

Picard fixed the audio timing issue in SMP2 which I did not test it on.

BTW... SMP3 is heading out now guys... check your emails... this fixes the reported AVI timing issues.

just got home and tried it - works sweet :D. no seeking probs and its all in sync too.

just waiting for the official launch now :)

[PicardGK]

Audio output Wave Output 44100Hz 16Bits 2Ch.
This is what causing trouble. But if you use the smp2 or smp3 test versions with all the plg files overwritten, it should detect the apple mov file as 48Khz correctly.

[SeeMoreDigital]

This is what causing trouble. But if you use the smp2 or smp3 test versions with all the plg files overwritten, it should detect the apple mov file as 48Khz correctly.Thanks for the heads-up... I did not notice that....

Here are the results for the original .MOV file: - TCPMP Version 0.72RC1 Benchmark Results

Average Speed 102.01%
Video Frames 1391
Audio Samples 2750093
Amount of Data 68152 KB

Bench. Time 0:56.873
Bench. Frame Rate 24.46
Bench. Sample Rate 48354
Bench. Data Rate 9.8 Mbit/s

Original Time 0:58.016
Original Frame Rate 23.98
Original Sample Rate 48000
Original Data Rate 9.6 Mbit/s

URL \Documents and Settings\SeeMoreDigital\Desktop\Bench Tests\imax-deep_sea_h1080p.mov
Size 69788593
Platform Windows
OS Version 5.01
Clock speed 2727 Mhz
Video output DirectDraw 1360x768 32bits Lookup
Video zoom 1440x1080 -> 1024x768
Audio output Wave Output 48000Hz 16Bits 2Ch.

Cheers

[DeathTheSheep]

Is the PocketPC version of CoreAVC planned to be released after this desktop version? Or will it be launched when everything is ready together (Desktop, PPC, etc)? Thanks!

[BetaBoy]

CoreAVC for mobile devices IE; CorePlayer/BetaPlayer will only be available when www.CorePlayer.com is launched on May 15th.

[popper]

CoreAVC for mobile devices IE; CorePlayer/BetaPlayer will only be available when www.CorePlayer.com is launched on May 15th.

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=804032#post804032

what about the real ppc cpu and linux please

[BetaBoy]

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=804032#post804032

what about the real ppc cpu and linux please

We are already working on the framework on our multiple Linux versions.... GTK, Freescale, QT, QTopia, Juce.

However... for an older PPC its tbd as devel progresses.

[tomos]

any further betas to test Dan, or are you all set with SMP/interlaced support etc?

fast running out of numbers to put in for the launch date 'march xx' :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

Hi BetaBoy,

When playing MPEG-4 AVC video streams, containing anamorphic signalling, muxed within the MP4 container, both Media Player Classic and WMP10 is detecting the signalling perfectly now.... many thanks!

However, when the same video stream is muxed into the AVI container, the signalling does not appear to work....

Can other testers confirm (if they have not done already)?


Cheers

[tomos]

hmmm, i have a clip i made from a dvd thats 4:3 and refuses to change the AR to 16:9 in MpC. tried the same problem clips on 2 pcs and both are the same

i didnt choose any AR so presume its on 4:3 as default

will have a look around on exactly 'how' to do this and report back later on :)

[thuan]

IIRC, AVI container doesn't support anamorphic signalling in container (mp4 and mkv does), you have to set the anamorphic value in the bitstream which is not recommended. AVI die die die...

[tomos]

i dont mind moving on from avi, cant at the mo due to most software being set for vfw - at least the ones i use.

might give mkv a go and see how it handles

[SeeMoreDigital]

IIRC, AVI container doesn't support anamorphic signalling in container (mp4 and mkv does), you have to set the anamorphic value in the bitstream which is not recommended.The anamorphic signalling "is" embedded within the raw h.264 video stream.... Which "is" recommended.

[BetaBoy]

Hi BetaBoy,

When playing MPEG-4 AVC video streams, containing anamorphic signalling, muxed within the MP4 container, both Media Player Classic and WMP10 is detecting the signalling perfectly now.... many thanks!

However, when the same video stream is muxed into the AVI container, the signalling does not appear to work....

Can other testers confirm (if they have not done already)?


Cheers

Thx SMD... we'll look into it.

[BetaBoy]

any further betas to test Dan, or are you all set with SMP/interlaced support etc?

fast running out of numbers to put in for the launch date 'march xx' :)

There will be one more test after the weekend... not sure if we will expand this to all testers but this is the BIG one. in that its for our splitter, error handling, and DS deinterlace support.

We are on track to release it this coming Friday March 31st.

[tomos]

great. so all looks good :)

any news on the hardware decoding?

[BetaBoy]

tomos... I cannot comment on GPU support at this time.

[Valeron]

@betaboy:
I would like to join the SMP test?
Am I late?
Or I still have a chance?:thanks:

[Selur]

@Valeron: since they plan to release on friday, you ar probably late ;)

[billou2000]

Sorry a bit late on this one:
The proc is a Dual Xeon 3.2 Ghz
Everything rendered with the NULL renderer as my video card slows down decoding:)

-clip1 D1 25fps @ 2mbps (HighProfile)
---------------------------
coreAVC beta1 (single threaded)
bench: 563.37% ( 11.2 Mbps)
playback: 11-19 % CPU (avg 13%) / 25 fps

coreAVC beta1 (multi threaded)
bench: 1076.42% (21.5 Mbps)
playback: 9-19% CPU (avg 13%) / 25 fps

coreAVC beta3 (multi threaded)
bench 1081.21% (21.6 Mbps)
playback: 9-15% CPU (avg 12%) / 25fps

Nero
playback: 16-22 % CPU (avg 19%) / 25 fps


-Clip2 720p 50fps @ 4mbps (HP)
-----------------------------
coreAVC beta1 (single threaded)
bench 132.27 % (5.2 Mbps)
playback:50% avg, 50 fps

coreAVC beta1 (multithreaded)
bench: 249.88% (10 Mbps)
playback: 39% avg, 50 fps

coreAVC beta3 (multithreaded)
bench: 250.00% (10 MBps)
playback: 38% avg, 50 fps

Nero
playback: 50%, 20 fps
-------------
Note that as it is a 2 CPU machine, so 50% means one CPU is fully used when an app isn't multithreaded

[BetaBoy]

Thanx to everyone for the kind words, encouragement, suggestions and hard testing everyone has done. Without you we are nothing...

So with that... I am Officially announcing that the CoreAVC Standard and Professional Edition Decoders will be available this Friday March 31st, 2006 @ www.coreavc.com

We hope all our hard work is worthy of everyones expectations...... now lets move on and finish our CoreAVC encoder ;-)

[crypto]

@BetaBoy
That's great news and congrats for keeping the tight schedule. CoreAVC and the team behind are the best.

[Gnerma]

Great news BetaBoy. Are you going to reveal the pricing and supported features of each version beforehand or will we learn that on the 31st?

[ChronoReverse]

Just as well I don't know what will happen with hardware decoding since my 6800 exploded. This decoder looks good I'll be checking out the site on the 31st.

[niknik]

Don't we deserve a "sneak preview" on the prices and features?

(but yeah, I guess anything posted here would quickly get out into the "rest" of the internet - so I understand if you want to keep that till friday. :)

[foxyshadis]

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=788027#post788027
This isn't enough of a peek?

[BetaBoy]

The only difference is that:
- Professional only has PAFF interlaced and CPU support was bumped up to 4 'cores' from 2.
- GPU support is tba later in Pro and Enterprise Editions

On our todo list atm:
- Move MBAFF interlaced to the pro editon
- Add FGT to all editions
- Add true interlaced output with soft telecine in Enterprise Edition (probally Pro too)
- Add 3:2 pull down support in Enterprise Edition

I will add a TODO link @CoreAVC.com so everyone knows what on the current devel list.

[BetaBoy]

Don't we deserve a "sneak preview" on the prices and features?

(but yeah, I guess anything posted here would quickly get out into the "rest" of the internet - so I understand if you want to keep that till friday. :)

I quoted what discounted pricing was earlier in this thread...
Standard: $7.45
Professional: $14.95
Enterprise: tbd

[CEC]

Good prices!!!!!:D

[niknik]

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=788027#post788027
This isn't enough of a peek?

Prices! We needed to know the prices! :)

.. and here they are! A very nice surprise indeed! :)
Professional, here we go.

[Selur]

Will it be possible to kind of 'upgrade' from e.g. Professional to Enterprise later?
(atm professional seems to be okay for me, but who know what the future brings)

Cu Selur

[BetaBoy]

Selur, yes. By the time we roll our our Enterprise edition in a few weeks. We will have our 'Core Account' system up and going. In the meantime for those that have purchased standard and want Pro we will offer an upgrade as well.

[breez]

Great news about the prices. I'll be sure to get a copy of the standard edition (for now, let's see if they start H.264 broadcasts here somewhere in five years ;) for which interlaced support could be needed).

[niknik]

I'd say, BAN all interlace stuff... :)
along with PAN & SCAN...
and then , let starts getting som real 50/60Hz progressive video...
Those 24fps pans give me the creeps... yck.

Dan, any chance we can "pre-order" the codec? Friday is still so far away... :)

[TEB]

Good to hear that the release is imminent, but a question:
Have any idea when it will support mpeg2 and mpeg4ASP?

[videomixer9]

Cracks for CoreAVC - coming this Friday 31st March :D :D :D :D :D :D

oh well considering what some ppl want for really crappy software these prices are decent considering how it can save you upgrading to super expensive CPUs ...

[Isochroma]

Oh, I was sure the cost would be about $30 for basic, $50 for Pro, and $75-100 for Enterprise. Absolutely sure.

[3ngel]

Quote. Fantastic price for the Standard Edition!

[ChronoCross]

this is for a decoder? I'm a little dissapointed....considering divx sells their entire codec suite for 19.99 lol. perhaps I'l buy it in a few months when the price drops(hopefully)

[BetaBoy]

ChronoCross dont be disappointed... wait till you hear about our plans for our decoder/encoder bundle and pricing.

[Sirber]

Will the decoder with in mPlayer by then? I'm no fan of DShow player anymore :)

[tomos]

ChronoCross dont be disappointed... wait till you hear about our plans for our decoder/encoder bundle and pricing.

any hints about the encoder? comparisons with other encoders? especially the x264 one :)

[videomixer9]

... as long as mplayer stops playback if you move around the videowindow and lacks styled softsub support it may please rot in hell :p

As for the encoder I still wonder why anybody buys such things if not integrated as hardware chip, same for decoders though ... lol? Though even stuff like dvd players should be free, after all they wanna sell me the videos so I have to be able to view them ... :o

[Sirber]

... as long as mplayer stops playback if you move around the videowindow and lacks styled softsub support it may please rot in hell :pNo problem with that :)
The solution is in your config file :p

[BetaBoy]

Not sure if I have commented on this.... but we will be bundling the Windows/Linux versions in a future release. Mplayer? Well I dont wanna commnet atm, but more to let you know we are working on it.

tomos.... hehe... i'm not gonna fall for that ;-) I guess I can say it like XviD did, in that... it will be ready when its ready. Just know we are working on it and if you like the decoder then you already know whats coming.

[tomos]

tomos.... hehe... i'm not gonna fall for that ;-) I guess I can say it like XviD did, in that... it will be ready when its ready. Just know we are working on it and if you like the decoder then you already know whats coming.

if the encoder gives anywhere near the encoding speed increase over other progs that the decoder gives then i'll be a happy bunny :D

[dimzon]

@BetaBoy
Just a little suggestion about your AVC Encoder

Please keep it CLI application with AVS support and (maybe) x264-compatible command-line arguments

In this case we will add support for it into MeGUI and other tools

[tomos]

hmm, i always imagined it would be a vfw encoder to use in vdub etc.

as you can tell, i'm one of those point and click people :p

[Pomyk]

There's a small problem with playback of 120fps avi files with coreavc - it plays too fast. It works normally with libavcodec. I know avi should die, but some people still make them :(

[MatMaul]

Not sure if I have commented on this.... but we will be bundling the Windows/Linux versions in a future release. Mplayer? Well I dont wanna commnet atm, but more to let you know we are working on it.

and why not in VLC ?

[videomixer9]

No problem with that :)
The solution is in your config file :p

so thousand of ppl still didn't find the FullySupportSSA/ASS=yes switch and the DoNotFreezeMyFuckingVideoWindowOnPlaybackIfIMoveTheWindowOnwin32=yes switch?

VLC has a GPL only policy, you'll make VLC creators cry using closed source.

And ppl that use h264 encoders via vfw interface and try to put that stuff in avi pls die.
120 fps content also plays sometimes oddly out of sync with WMV encodes here, only with some players though, odd thing. So whatever, try a different splitter and player too maybe.

[3ngel]

@BetaBoy
A pheraps silly question : the retail version of AVC Decoder, will come as simple .ax file? Or it will be one those sh***y installer that mess up with my registry and i need to reinstall when i change dir or change OS?

[dimzon]

And ppl that use h264 encoders via vfw interface and try to put that stuff in avi pls die.
:goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost:

[videomixer9]

@BetaBoy
A pheraps silly question : the retail version of AVC Decoder, will come as simple .ax file? Or it will be one those sh***y installer that mess up with my registry and i need to reinstall when i change dir or change OS?

what's so bad about an installer? not anyones problem that you cannot use unattended installer modes or just reregister the ax file that you get after installing, as all filters are the same and have to be registerable via just .ax files.

I doubt it won't come with an installer as many ppl will want one. Too many noobs that don't know what to do with just an .ax file.

I hate people like you just plain for their wannabe leetness. Your messing with my registry bitching seems to totally expose how much of an newbie you are too.

[DeathTheSheep]

"And ppl that use h264 encoders via vfw interface and try to put that stuff in avi pls die."

Wishing death on people is hardly civilized behavior. This isn't a flame war between AVI and CLI. They'll release it however they want.

Thank you.

[Romario]

And ppl that use h264 encoders via vfw interface and try to put that stuff in avi pls die.

I totaly agree with you DeathTheSheep. This is very strange behaviour.

Mods, please give one big warning to member videomixer9.

[videomixer9]

omg pls die DeathTheSheep ... :O (what's with the whining?)

I seriously hope everyone drops VFW support for AVC encoding so we don't get more AVC in AVI, not that hard to use a good container. CLI is nice and versatile and considering there will be a Linux version of the encoder too prolly I hope for no efforts to create VFW interfaces, more important to implement a versatile interface for many more apps on multiple platforms.

It's just sad too see how old fashioned ppl just cannot get over the VFW crap that is as old or even older than Windows 3.0.

[3ngel]

Videomixer9, you're totally out of mind...
Watch less a monitor, and more some other real thing... :D

[shon3i]

Wait ppl, BetaBoy will make decision. Maybe him want to make app like Recode.

[ChronoCross]

you guys keep this up and you'll all get stiked. As doom9's tollerance level is pretty much 0 when argueing about cli versus vfw.

As for their encoder I doubt they've even started it. But if they take the path of other professional companies working on encoders you won't see a vfw version. everything will be done either through a separate gui or a cli. (ateme, nero, elecard, etc.)

[Kostarum Rex Persia]

Wait ppl, BetaBoy will make decision. Maybe he want to make app like Recode.

I hope so, application like Nero Recode 2 would be very nice to see.:)

Regarding videomixer9 strange post, I won't say anything at all.:sly:

[Sirber]

Why making a GUI when people can make their own? :D

[GmorG McRoth]

Why making a GUI when people can make their own? :D
That depends on how good that GUI whuld be. Beyond that, GUI made by original developer will have all features implemented (or it shuld have). Not to mention that searching for usable home made GUI is sometimes problematic, and since CoreAVC encoder will be commercial product eny customer can expect it to be complete with GUI. ofcourse since there is no program yet its all speculation and we will see what core designers have to offer (hmm by the way do the makers of tomb rider and heimdall2 do not feel offended by using their name? Lets hope there will be no lawsuit).

[leowai]

I hope so, application like Nero Recode 2 would be very nice to see.:)
As a MeGUI user, I prefer what dimzon suggested here:
@BetaBoy
Just a little suggestion about your AVC Encoder

Please keep it CLI application with AVS support and (maybe) x264-compatible command-line arguments

In this case we will add support for it into MeGUI and other tools

[ChronoCross]

their trying to sell it. not to make it compatible with open source apps.

[breez]

Btw, what kind of payment options will be available? Paypal? Credit card?

[berrinam]

What's wrong with both. I personally think that the adoption over here in Doom9 would not only depend on quality/speed, but also on ease of use. Anyway, a CLI interface is relatively simple, so I think that if the users want it (which some of us, like dimzon, leowai and me certainly do), CoreAVC should supply it.

[pankov]

About the payment methods.
Please, do support direct credit card payments, because there are many countries that PayPal doesn't work with. Bulgaria for example is one of them :(

[niknik]

Just keep the money at hand... tomorrow we will know! :)

[videomixer9]

Better include something that is not credit cards and paypal too, in germany e.g. you lose almost all buyers with only offering credit card and paypal payment, acceptance rate of both payments methods are really low. Many companies already seemed to wonder about that in germany, but e.g. I have not a single friend and person I know here who has a credit card. "Einzugsermächtigungen" for your bank account are way more usual or payment on bill. A thing that works for most countries though seems to be payment by phone, though it has stupid extra fees.

Acceptance of things like credit card and paypal seems higher in the US and some other countries cause they totally lack other sane payment methods ...

[Eretria-chan]

Lack other sane payment methods? Dude, they don't have to have those other payment methods because very many use credit cards which is easy to use. Very easy. Why would the other countries need other payment methods then, if almost all of the population had credit cards?

I see the sense in making alternate payment methods for countries where things like credit cards almost does not exist, but don't blame these payments, since there needs be no other payment methods in those countries.

[videomixer9]

So what, of course you may fail selling stuff here, not my problem. Just stated that you may fail selling in many countries if you only go for credit card and paypal. Credit cards are just a late invention and all that I say is that adoption to it went fast in some countries due to lack of other sane payment methods, also due to less acceptance for other reasons. What are you pissed about? Annoying folk, pissed about someone not praising US or so, then declare war on my country or whatever.

In the US even paying cash seems to be not a sane method as people always suspect you of using fake money and give you funny glances if you pay with 20 dollar bills etc.

[3ngel]

Credit cards, and online payments are now essential (and a normal situation for software).
But i think is a good thing to extend even to non-online payment (international bank money order, or postal order).

[CiTay]

Better include something that is not credit cards and paypal too, in germany e.g. you lose almost all buyers with only offering credit card and paypal payment, acceptance rate of both payments methods are really low.

Please speak for yourself :)

[bond]

- Add FGT to all editionsyummie film grain (included in the hddvd specs btw) :)

[Eretria-chan]

So what, of course you may fail selling stuff here, not my problem. Just stated that you may fail selling in many countries if you only go for credit card and paypal. Credit cards are just a late invention and all that I say is that adoption to it went fast in some countries due to lack of other sane payment methods, also due to less acceptance for other reasons. What are you pissed about? Annoying folk, pissed about someone not praising US or so, then declare war on my country or whatever.

In the US even paying cash seems to be not a sane method as people always suspect you of using fake money and give you funny glances if you pay with 20 dollar bills etc.
For the record, I'm not dissing other payment methods than credit cards - but credit cards are easy to use - so why should countries that has adopted it use other payments methods? Countries that does not have credit cards should, of course, use other payments methods.

Also, I do not live in US.

[bond]

what the hell? this thread is about coreavc and not some payment methods

betaboy will come up with the payment methods he agrees on and the user will have to use those

if you want to do financial discussions, do it in another board

[videomixer9]

Please speak for yourself, i'm german and i use Paypal for a long time already...

So you are all the germans, you use it so everyone uses it? Acceptance of PayPal in Germany is very low, just check out stuff like ebay (it's an ebay service after all). Very few using paypal, exchange rates are bad and buisness account are expensive and have high fees for no real service. Also PayPal is a Ltd. and based outside the country under funny laws and if you have problems with them it is very tricky to get a lawyer handling that case and their rules are twisty too. Basically PayPal also makes lots of cash with investing the money without giving back anything.

So you basically speak about yourself while I talk about the masses, learn that not everyone is like you.

/me wants to see the funny colorful CoreAVC installer already, lol

[niknik]

I too believe this whole thread could use a "prune"...
So many posts not really related to the subject.
Ppl shouldn't be "obliged" to read all that stuff - including some flamings and unrelated "philosofical" digressions...

As Bond said: want to rant about something else, do it in another thread (or better yet, another forum!)

And yes, this post too should be pruned.

[CiTay]

So you basically speak about yourself while I talk about the masses, learn that not everyone is like you.

Jeez, take it easy. But as Bond said, i'd rather stop it here.

[bond]

strike for rule 16 for videomixer9

[BetaBoy]

Let me explain it so it ends for bond. Payments will temporarily be thorugh PayPal... no you do not need a PayPal account... When our Core Account system is up, all people and what they purchased will be brought over to the new system and at that time you can pay through our more universal payment system we have setup. Unlike PayPal this has no restrictions (that I am aware of).

I'll check on adding a 'world pay' alternative for those others that cannot pay with PayPal.

Our installer is simplistic... and we have worked with Haali on with adding his splitter along with CoreAVC. What will not be done at launch like we had wanted is full support for TS streams. This will come in a future update Haali noted.

Also... Our launch will not be till late tomorrow. For many of you it will be Saturday morning. This friday 'soft' launch over the weekend will allow us to adjust any devel and or make any site adjustments over the weekend for the expected monday rush.

OK... TMI ;-)

[SeeMoreDigital]

No dis-respect to Haali but will installing his splitter be optional during the installation set-up proceedure?

Shame about the .TS support.... but it's better to wait, test some more and get it right...


Cheers

[GmorG McRoth]

and we have worked with Haali on with adding his splitter along with CoreAVC.
This won't be a problem when it will come to update Haali splitter (with installers from Haali website) when new version will be out?

[BetaBoy]

No dis-respect to Haali but will installing his splitter be optional during the installation set-up proceedure?

Shame about the .TS support.... but it's better to wait, test some more and get it right...


Cheers
Yes its optional... we knew people would want it that way.

[BlackSharkfr]

what's wrong with haali splitter ? I haven't had any problems with it.

[fight2win]

so, according to coreavc homepage, it is gonna launch on 31st march, 2006, is this really true?:sly:

[niknik]

No... it's just a pre-April's Fool joke. :P

Of course it's true! :)

[BetaBoy]

I did say 'late' on the 31st... a few more hours. We are testing delivery atm.

[davidlt]

Okay, we are waiting... :) Its` a big day...

[fight2win]

I did say 'late' on the 31st... a few more hours. We are testing delivery atm.

:)

:D

[videomixer9]

lol just visited coreavc.com and it was blocked by ipfilter ... iprange named ... microtorrent.com http://www.bluetack.co.uk/fa/ut.txt ... lol?

[Dreassica]

Somehow I still think they're pulling an april fools on us now :P

[IgorC]

Jokes are coming tommorow ;)

[videomixer9]

well here it is 1st april already

[Doom9]

It's almost 1:30am here, but I did get a file called CoreAVC Professional-1.0.0.0-Setup.rar to my inbox two days ago so it's no April's fool. But the MPAA refraining from criminalizing their own customers is..

[HookedOnTV]

Just for a reference... what time zone are we using for the definition of March 31st?

[Sirber]

all of them are realllllly great :D

[ChronoCross]

they still have a long way to go if their using hawaii standard time.

[bob0r]

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/reference_maps/pdf/time_zones.pdf

I heard all Core activities take place on the Line Islands.......

[BetaBoy]

All... we are working on 3 seperate issues atm... one installer, one code based and one related to the site. It is likely a nogo for today.... and if that is the case I want one more day to QA this.

I'll post a follow-up in an hour or so.

[Sirber]

I'll be sleeping :'(

[travisbell]

Bummer guys! Can't wait for April 2 ;)

[Sirber]

April 1, here I come. going to sleep ;)

[fields_g]

Been checking the net all day for this release. I like the new "April Fools" message on the site.

I think you are intentionally building up the suspense!

[BetaBoy]

We are gonna give ourselves one more day to QA this and release it on Sunday. Sorry for the delay...

[neo squidward]

Wow! Real taskmasters making the poor devs and testers work on the weekends. ;)

[BetaBoy]

Most of us here work 7 days a week now... were playing catchup... CoreASP is next ;-)

[ChronoCross]

lol begining to look alot like microsoft heheh....good luck lol....only a 60% rewrite by sunday =P

[Selur]

if it's like microsoft a 60% rewrite would also be needed after the release ;)

[3ngel]

CoreASP is next
:eek:
I hope the price is the same as CoreAvc standard :D

[lexor]

forget MS, this is beginnig to sound like the whole Half Life 2 thing, people where yelling "but the engine was done over a year ago", with the amout of complaining you'd think Gabe was holding back a cure for cancer. lol. Take your time guys, quality first.

P.S. MS doing 60% rewrite is FUD, I don't think even the behemoth that is MS (especially since it's a behemoth) can do a 60% rewrite in 2 months launch delay.

[SeeMoreDigital]

CoreASP is next ;-)Cool.... can't wait :D

[tomos]

ASP? forgive my noobness but isn't that what other mpeg-4 codecs like xvid and divx are?

[Sirber]

ASP? forgive my noobness but isn't that what other mpeg-4 codecs like xvid and divx are?yes, MPEG4 ASP

[tomos]

yay i was right :D heh

[BetaBoy]

Not to get to OT... but our DS port for CoreASP should be pretty straight forward... although Toff indicated a few things that has to be done... the only things missing that picard indicated was Post Processing (and something else that is not coming to atm).

Anyway... CoreASP itself will likley not have its own site but be part of our 'Core Media!' codec bundle we will be selling along with CoreAAC+ v2.0, CoreMP3, etc.

I'll talk more about that later on.

[jblade]

Seems like CoreAVC is becoming another Duke Nukem.... jk :)

I don't mind waiting.

[tomos]

have you done any testing on the ASP codec yet? i mean to give you some idea to the speed of it compared to xvid/divx?

i know someone who encodes a lot and a codec comparable to those but faster to encode would be huge :)

[lexor]

have you done any testing on the ASP codec yet? i mean to give you some idea to the speed of it compared to xvid/divx?

i know someone who encodes a lot and a codec comparable to those but faster to encode would be huge :)
this is decoder, not encoder for ASP betaboy is talking about.

and I won't really care if ASP decodes at the same rate as ffdshow or xvid own decoder (same for mp3, and aac) since they are lite anyway. I'll get them as package deal so I have an all in one solution. AVC speedup and TCPMP (the new one they all rave about) are good enough selling poits for the whole package imho.

[tomos]

ahhh, ok. guess my mate's stuck then :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

this is decoder, not encoder for ASP betaboy is talking about.

and I won't really care if ASP decodes at the same rate as ffdshow or xvid own decoder (same for mp3, and aac) since they are lite anyway.....When you take into consideration the speed performance gains CoreAVC has over other AVC decoders, I'm kinda hoping they'll be able to do the same for MPEG-4 A/SP decoding.... It all helps when playing hi-def sources :)

[CruNcher]

tests between ffmpeg.plg and CoreASP with tcpmp show that its much more optimized if the DS filter will be faster then the ffdshow (libavcodec) decoder is another question

[videomixer9]

even divx decoder uses only 6-8% on many ASP videos nowadays on my pc ... newest divx decoder even beats ffdshow for most content o_O so CoreASP must have a real good argument to be used, especially as payware ...

[SeeMoreDigital]

even divx decoder uses only 6-8% on many ASP videos nowadays on my pc ....Surely not when playing hi-def 1280x720 at 23.976, 25, 50 or 59.94fps and/or 1920x1080 at 25 or 29.970fps.

When playing 1280x720 at 23.976fps I'm at around 80% with XviD.ax and 70% with FFdshow :eek:

[videomixer9]

best i found was a 1024x576 video in ASP on my HD and that plays at around 15-25% depending on motion speed with DivX 6.1.1 decoder incl. reclock and vsfilter interfering in VMR7.

[lexor]

Surely not when playing hi-def 1280x720 at 23.976, 25, 50 or 59.94fps and/or 1920x1080 at 25 or 29.970fps.

When playing 1280x720 at 23.976fps I'm at around 80% with XviD.ax and 70% with FFdshow :eek:
umm... yeah, that's a lot. that's my AVC usage, you sure something isn't going wrong there?

[SeeMoreDigital]

umm... yeah, that's a lot. that's my AVC usage, you sure something isn't going wrong there?In that case, can some of you try the following Thank You For Smoking (http://www.divx.com/movies/browse.php?categoryID=3) 1280x720 @ 23.976fps encode and report back?

I'm peaking at around 65% with FFdshow!


> BetaBoy,

Might be time to start a CoreASP thread and get some links to some high-def test files established ;)


Be seeing you!

[lexor]

ok SMD, tried it, and I don't know, it might be my 2.2GHz athlon 64, but I get 22% cpu usage pretty much stable, when I seek far ahead, it jumps to 40% for like a second, but then back down. ffdshow+mpc here.

same resolution AVC trailer would fluctuate between 50-70% usage depending on the scene.

[GmorG McRoth]

This trailer crunches my CPU (3.0 GHZ Intel Prescott) at about ~50% (maxes out one Threed) when mplayer deblocking (with accurate deblocking on, ~35% with AD off) and ~17% without deblocking. Played with ffdshow-20060226 and MPC

For comparision its about 12% for XVID (without deblocking and again 50% with booth deblocking option checked, but without deringing).

DIVX does about 17% without deblocking (and film grain off) 45% with deblocking ON (and deringing, Film Grain off).

3viX does about 19% without deblocking, 25% with PP slider half way (my best gues its booth color spaces deblocking) and about 30% when PP slider is all the way up (it's multithreeded)

[3ngel]

I would be interested in a "CoreMpeg2" too, in order to decode Mpeg2HDTV. Actually the fastest ds decoder is Mpeg2Dec Filter.
So it would be a great thing to have an even more faster mpeg2 ds filter, with some options like spacecolor forcing, or deinterlace.

[SeeMoreDigital]

ok SMD, tried it, and I don't know, it might be my 2.2GHz athlon 64, but I get 22% cpu usage pretty much stable, when I seek far ahead, it jumps to 40% for like a second, but then back down. ffdshow+mpc here. Here's what I get with XviD DSdec in MPC: -

http://img438.imageshack.us/img438/2559/xviddsdec6lq.png


Cheers

[lexor]

as someone pointed out above, post processing takes alot of cpu, do you use any? I personally don't have anything that can benefit from it (and that clip certainly wouldn't).

[SeeMoreDigital]

as someone pointed out above, post processing takes alot of cpu, do you use any? I personally don't have anything that can benefit from it (and that clip certainly wouldn't).No.... I never ever use any form of post-processing :scared:

EDIT: Here's what I get when I play the same file using XviD DSdec in GraphEdit: -

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/4046/xviddsdecgraphedit7fg.png


Cheers

[BetaBoy]

SMD... I'll start a thread in the ASP forum so bond does not have to start splitting this thread into 20 new ones ;-)

[SeeMoreDigital]

SMD... I'll start a thread in the ASP forum so bond does not have to start splitting this thread into 20 new ones ;-)Thanks mate,

I'll look forward to Bond moving all relevant ASP posts...


Cheers

[lexor]

@3ngel:

Are you referring to the mpeg2dec DLL for avisynth? I didn't know this could be used as a DS filter. If so, how?
I think he's just talking about make a script which opens up the video using mpeg2source and loading the avs file in the player. dunno about the speed of that, though.

[3ngel]

No, i'm talking about a real ds filter named that way.
I post the attachment of the .ax.

[videomixer9]

isn't that gabests directshow wrapper for libmpeg2? Moreover this has not even anything to do with ASP and even less with AVC ...

[jblade]

When is it coming out? I thought today?

[GmorG McRoth]

they have 30 minutes more to make it in time on GMT +1 time zone :)

[videomixer9]

Guess they are using Microsoft Vaporwarizer 2006

[breez]

Well, they are US based so there's a few more hours left.

[jblade]

My dollar bet is that it gets delayed once again.

[tomos]

not sure why since the betas worked well. unless possibly there's something up with the purchasing systems? thats my bet as to the cause of a delay

[futurex]

just change the release date to july already!

[vio_man]

I always said that people shouldn't promise things which would not deliver on time. It's better to just release when it's done than promising a date.

[pankov]

oooh
come one, guys
let's give them a break. it will be ready when it's ready.
The terms are to be broken, after all
;)

[GmorG McRoth]

It whuld be better if CoreAVC page had randomly generated excuses so refreshing it whuld be little bit less dissapointing.

[tomos]

what like

If CoreAVC is late, time better slow the *** down.

:p

[videomixer9]

"CoreAVC ... the longer you wait for the release the faster it has to decode your videos!"

"CoreAVC became obsolete, del HiDefContent.mp4 ... 1337% faster!"

[acidsex]

I kinda agree. The delay is complete joke. One surely would think that if they are having delivery/payment problems that this too would have been tested before the release date.

It just seems too common over the last several years for companies to pimp their products and then when the release date nears, its delayed. It doesnt necessarily show the public that they are trying to get it right but more so the general public sees it as incompetence. Not everyone of the public understands bugs that creep up.

But companies like M$ and even Nero have been hyping their crap all over and when it never makes the light of day, people bash them. No offense to the Core group or BetaBoy, but they are no different. MS last year announced distributed encoding with Gridiiron Software that was supposed to allow users to use multiple machines for encoding HD video. Here it is a year later after NAB2005 and the encoder has not (if it ever will) seen the light of day. Nero last year, pimped their Nero 7 software a few months after the H.264 AVC HP went to us beta testers. Mnay people ran out and got the program only to find us six months later still without HP/Interlaced encoding.

I am not bashing Core. But when you set an expectation to a very anticipating customer base, you should do all you can to deliver on time. Companies like MS continue to delay their products (Vista) so they can remain in the news to further anticipation and sales.

As we are quickly approaching April 3, it looks like the current expectation on the coreavc site will fail once again. Not a good way to build customer trust.

[BetaBoy]

Guys relax... we are still on track to deliver it by the end of the day today. All issues have been resolved, we are testing delivery.

[welew]

thanks for the great effort!
Seems some link still in testing (download, faq...)
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/recommend.html
It seems CoreAVC still need high hardware configuration for 1080P H.264 playback
Guys relax... we are still on track to deliver it by the end of the day today. All issues have been resolved, we are testing delivery.

[Gnerma]

So it looks like the site is online. The burning question on my (and I'm sure everybody else's) mind is how do I get that discounted price? :devil:

[ChronoCross]

There won't be a discounted price. They have to pay the bills you know.

[Gnerma]

Would you mind letting us in on your source on this bro? I was referencing this (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=806029#post806029) post made by BetaBoy on the 28th.

[Oline 61]

If you're in Jersey, it's already April 3rd.

[ChronoCross]

Just a guess based on the fact that it's impossible to decide who would get the discounted price. aka what qualifications. It would be unfair to say that everyone on doom9 gets it and it would be unfair to limit it to a certain group unless of course they put in alot of the effort....as I can see some people did in the testing.

even though the site is up now I see no way to purchase as all the links I think are supposed to be active aren't lol

[Shinjite]

thanks for the great effort!
It seems CoreAVC still need high hardware configuration for 1080P H.264 playback

So far 720p still runs fine in my comp without any dropped frames with my 64MB GF4 MX440-8X at 3.24Ghz (max 55% or below)
1080p havent tested yet though

[nm]

It seems CoreAVC still need high hardware configuration for 1080P H.264 playback
There is obviously a lot of air in those numbers so that people with broken configurations wouldn't complain when CoreAVC won't work well for them. For example 480p24 requires about half of those specs.

[Hans Ohlo]

even though the site is up now I see no way to purchase as all the links I think are supposed to be active aren't lolsame here :(

[ChronoCross]

now they're just rushing and tring to patch things together. They just put up the website to say that they were released on time. It's already 1am where their headquarters is located lol. Anyway I'll have to check back tomorrow because it's too late for me to do anything tonight.

[Hans Ohlo]

ok now its working.

[Alizar]

So far, I am not impressed in the slightest.

The installer fails to actually register the directshow filter. I had to use the re-register shortcut on the start menu to do so. Worse (and I hope this is just isolated to me) on playback using seeking, video seems to "fast forward" until it catches up to the point where I seeked to originally.

Edit: I've confirmed this seeking problem with multiple users on both MKV splitters and players. Haven't tested .mp4 yet. It seems to be related to GOPs and the fast foward seeking seems to originate from the GOP until playback catches up to timecode.

[Pomyk]

I have noticed the same problems.

[dimzon]

Oh...
I'm from Russia and threre are no Russia or Russian Federation in PayPal registration form

[robU*4]

From Cyt0plas (CoreCodec Tech Guy):
Download links are up. We are in the process of switching from one processing company to another; our automated registration system will be down for a day or so. In the meantime, all registrations will be manually ran within 12 hours.

Because of the launch delay, we're doing a 30% discount instead of the planned 25% for the next little bit. Discount applied after you click "buy now".

[Eretria-chan]

Oh...
I'm from Russia and threre are no Russia or Russian Federation in PayPal registration form
Be patient :) They will set up other payment methods soon enough ^_^

[BlackSun]

Okay we were a bit late, I agree. But I prefer to see this kind of delay instead of having a vaporware. Think Duke Nukem for ever.

[breez]

C'mon, only a few days late and worked through the weekend to get it released! I'm sure your average company would have continued working on monday morning from where they left the project on friday night.

[tomos]

well, have purchased my copy of the 'pro' one. just waiting for the download link now. cant wait for the GPU acceleration :D

[BetaBoy]

So far, I am not impressed in the slightest.

The installer fails to actually register the directshow filter. I had to use the re-register shortcut on the start menu to do so. Worse (and I hope this is just isolated to me) on playback using seeking, video seems to "fast forward" until it catches up to the point where I seeked to originally.

Edit: I've confirmed this seeking problem with multiple users on both MKV splitters and players. Haven't tested .mp4 yet. It seems to be related to GOPs and the fast foward seeking seems to originate from the GOP until playback catches up to timecode.

Welcome to Doom9 Alizar... I'll check the file registration...

[BetaBoy]

All... Thanx to everyone for your patience. Cyt0plas worked all weekend on the backend but in the end I uploaded a temp site and we bumbed the discount from 25% to 30% as a way thanking everyone for their patience.

We will bring the portal online soon which automates the purchase process. Each CoreAVC purchase is custom for each user.

Keeping reporting any issues you find.. on this thread or on our bug tracker @ http://corecodec.org/tracker/?atid=313&group_id=64&func=browse

[pankov]

All... Thanx to everyone for your patience. Cyt0plas worked all weekend on the backend but in the end I uploaded a temp site and we bumbed the discount from 25% to 30% as a way thanking everyone for their patience.

We will bring the portal online soon which automates the purchase process. Each CoreAVC purchase is custom for each user.
will this allow different payment methods? (credit card payments except PayPal in particular)?

[BetaBoy]

Yes, we are looking into a few alternatives atm till our 'Core Account' system is ready. I'll fill you in as it developes.... BTW... any suggestions?

[CEC]

Any trial version to check?????
I want to try before I buy!!!:thanks:

[BetaBoy]

We will release a trial version next month.

[bratao]

Yeah !
I trial its cool !

[CiTay]

Any trial version to check?????
I want to try before I buy!!!:thanks:

What about the 0.0.0.4 alpha? Should be a good preview.

See http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=786019#post786019

[Ice =A=]

I've bought the pro version this morning, congratulations on the release! Right now I'm waiting for the mail with the download link and I can't wait to test the decoder!!! :)

[CEC]

What about the 0.0.0.4 alpha? Should be a good preview.

See http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=786019#post786019


I did check that, but I had some problems! I did the post the problem, but I didn't took an answer and so I don't know if it is fixed!!!

See: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=105985

[Ice =A=]

OK, I got it by now! :)
First tests indicate that it does what it should do and that it needs about 35% processing power where quicktime needs about 55%, which really is not bad at all! :)
I also found some 1080p videos which do not run fluently with quicktime (played with quicktime player or mpc on an Athlon X2 4200+) but do play flawlessly with CoreAVC.
I can't say much about SMP since even the most demanding videos only result in a cpu usage of very slightly over 50%... :)

[ChronoCross]

I'm too poor atm to buy it but I think now it's even more prudent that I wait. Since this seems to still be a beta version. Although I don't remember seeing these errors int he last public version so I'm a little confused as to how their happening. To those of you having th eseeking issue are you using th epro version? Could it possibly be due to SMP support? Please give more details as to how your using the filter itself.

[tomos]

i'm still waiting for my download link. altho they did say it can take upto 12 hrs

[BetaBoy]

What about the 0.0.0.4 alpha? Should be a good preview.

See http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=786019#post786019

The current CoreAVC is about 1% faster then that build... Anyone up to do a detaied comparison?

[Ice =A=]

@ChronoCross:
I'm using the pro version with mpc on an Athlon X2 and have experienced no such seeking issues at all. Should I test with any specific video file?

[BetaBoy]

Tomos... I double checked your email was sent... if there is still an issue email me.

[ChronoCross]

@ChronoCross:
I'm using the pro version with mpc on an Athlon X2 and have experienced no such seeking issues at all. Should I test with any specific video file?

From what I read (see below) it's happening on several machines. So what we need to do as a community is get more input on why this might be happening.


Edit: I've confirmed this seeking problem with multiple users on both MKV splitters and players. Haven't tested .mp4 yet. It seems to be related to GOPs and the fast foward seeking seems to originate from the GOP until playback catches up to timecode.

I looked on their bug tracker and it looks to be an issue with the internal and external gabest splitter. If your using Haali's splitter this probably won't happen.

If your going to report a bug either in this thread or on the tracker you should include the following:

a) Version of CoreAVC (Basic or Professional)
b) Players you've tried with version numbers
c) Processor Type
d) Splitter that is being used for your particular file.

This should help them work out any additional bugs you guys find.

[tomos]

Tomos... I double checked your email was sent... if there is still an issue email me.

have mailed using addy in your profile :)

[bob0r]

I'm too poor atm to buy it but I think now it's even more prudent that I wait. Since this seems to still be a beta version. Although I don't remember seeing these errors int he last public version so I'm a little confused as to how their happening. To those of you having th eseeking issue are you using th epro version? Could it possibly be due to SMP support? Please give more details as to how your using the filter itself.

Beta version? Shall we try alpha?
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/changelog.html

[BetaBoy]

Thx ChronoCross you beat me too it ;-)

[BetaBoy]

Beta version? Shall we try alpha?
http://coreavc.corecodec.org/changelog.html
Nice catch... actually it was Beta After 0.4... i'll make the changes.

[ChronoCross]

Thx ChronoCross you beat me too it ;-)

you very welcome. I know how important it is to have accurate bug reports when trying to find a problem. else you just have giant ??? over your head when looking for the bug.

[Pomyk]

Some more info on the speedup bug:

I have Athlon X2. Using haali splitter and professional version of CoreAVC. I tried MPC and WMP and it's the same.
What's happening:
After seeking it immediately shows the I(DR?) frame, starts playing audio and video playback is faster until it catches up to audio.

[CEC]

We will release a trial version next month.

Next MONTH!?!?!?:eek: :eek:
Why SO LONG????:confused:

[BetaBoy]

Next MONTH!?!?!?:eek: :eek:
Why SO LONG????:confused:

Because the demo requires alot of work as well as an automated update process and third party Vendor ID lockin.

[fight2win]

is coreavc paid? is there a free version available?

[ChronoCross]

is coreavc paid? is there a free version available?


did you not READ!!!! It's paid version and the free preview version is not available for another month.

[CEC]

is coreavc paid? is there a free version available?

NO!:(

[Selur]

over here I always get a session timeout at the end of procedure when buying with mastercard over paypal => will try again tomorrow

[Pomyk]

Speed test with 1080p anime (15000 frames) on Athlon X2 @ 2.3Ghz:

v0.4 - 57.53
v1.0 pro - 62.67 (1 core) | 93.69 (2 cores ~90%)

About 9% speed increase using one core.

[tomos]

Dan, any chance to check my mail?

[BetaBoy]

Dan, any chance to check my mail?
no... send it to betaboy@corecodec.com ?

[Ice =A=]

One little thing:
"fix VMR9 color range" needs some cpu time, about the equivalent of 100MHz on an Athlon 64 or Pentium M, at least that's what it did look like to me...
(For those who are looking for every frame. :))

Interestingly I have seen no speed gains, if anything it seemd a little bit slower, especially with activated "fix VMR9 color range".
Any idea about that discrepancy, Pomyk?!?

[tomos]

sent to that one this time. used the hotmail one before :)

[ChronoCross]

@BetaBoy
If you buy a version of the decoder, do you get updates for life? Or will I have to buy a new one each time you guys make changes to it?

[fields_g]

Also, if we get pro version now, and wanted enterprise later, what kind of "trade-in" options are there?

[killerhex]

are you guys developing an encoder

[HookedOnTV]

Our installer is simplistic... and we have worked with Haali on with adding his splitter along with CoreAVC. What will not be done at launch like we had wanted is full support for TS streams. This will come in a future update Haali noted.

Where can we follow the progress on TS support?

[foxyshadis]

The first post should probably be updated with a FAQ, because all these questions have been answered before:

free: haha, no.
encoder: yes, later.
upgrade: price is discounted the amount of your previous purchase, though of course policy might change.
updates: no answer, but see this (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=794065&highlight=update#post794065). I assume 1.5 is free and 2.0 is discounted.

[ChronoCross]

I caved and bought it. I'll have to upgrade to the enterprise edition once it comes out as I could like to have all features supported lol.

[MrWizard]

I did as well. I hope I see the speed increases - I'm so close to being able to decode some of my 1080p video on my machine with the alpha. Here's hoping!

[Ice =A=]

@MrWizard:
Please feel free to share your findings concerning decoding speed with us here! :)

[MrWizard]

Of course! I hope to get my copy emailed to me by tonight so I can do some testing :D

[BetaBoy]

Where can we follow the progress on TS support?

I'll ping Haali on it... and let you know.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Where can we follow the progress on TS support? I'll ping Haali on it... and let you know.Sounds like a plan :)


Cheers

[tomos]

Dan, i've mailed you on the addy you specified and the support address on your site but i still havent had a reply yet :(

[ChronoCross]

They are probably a bit busy working on all the requests for the stuff. Be patient. I haven't got mine either. IT'll get done within 12 hours hopefully lol.

[tomos]

prob is Dan mentioned earlier on that my mail had already been sent :(

[BetaBoy]

The first post should probably be updated with a FAQ, because all these questions have been answered before:

free: haha, no.
encoder: yes, later.
upgrade: price is discounted the amount of your previous purchase, though of course policy might change.
updates: no answer, but see this (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=794065&highlight=update#post794065). I assume 1.5 is free and 2.0 is discounted.

I was referring to TCPMP with the revision numbers there.... _any_ 1.xx CoreAVC users will be entitled to an upgrade to 2.0 when it comes out.

[BetaBoy]

ok.... we found out what the issue was. Users that did not get an email should get it within the hour. Thanx for the patience guys.

[tomos]

have replied to your mail Dan. anyways have been up for 34 hrs so time to catch some zssss.

[lazyn00b]

BetaBoy, I figured out why I wasn't getting the emails - the download email from cyt0plas was getting blocked by the gmail spam filter and sent to the spam folder. I've got the decoder now and it's working great!

Thanks again,

lazyn00b

[popper]

So it looks like the site is online. The burning question on my (and I'm sure everybody else's) mind is how do I get that discounted price? :devil:

well, a discount might be your mind but not mine, it seems
a fair price for an apparent fastest decoder, what im more interested in is the Encoder, and weather it will be possible to get a single fully functional GUI that runs
on all the muti platforms the CoreAVC Encoder will eventually run on , im hopeing they might discuse with carl
the CEO at http://www.rebol.com/platforms-view.html to use a single GUI script (end-user extendable if required) on at least the x86 and PPC platforms.

i have a question for the Core developers would your code
run from an embeded FPGA such as will be found on the new
Genesi EFIKA v2.0 http://www.ppczone.org/forums/posting.php?mode=quote&p=2497.

they have a freeScale software development platform and a reference design here http://www.freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=PPCG40010 but that current V1 system doent have Genesi'
latest options as yet and its unclear weather the
EFIKA v2.0 with the XGI chip equivalent and the Altera FPGA Hardware will also be opened up as a free reference design at this time to their Power.Org partners alongside
the on-going ppczone developers hardware program.

FYI the Altera FPGA is unknown at this time
http://www.ppczone.org/forums/posting.php?mode=quote&p=2509
, but the onboard XGI chip will most likely be V3XT
http://www.xgitech.com/products/products_2.asp?P=8&CTID={5B57D0A3-5D50-435F-B0D2-F28FCA5EF23B}

but that has "High Definition TV-OUT Solution with XV301PAL and NTSC Systems

Composite, S-Video, and Component RGB Output Signals

Macrovision Copy Protection Process Rev. 7.1.L1

HDTV 480i/480p/1080i/720p YPbPr Output Signals

A single link TMDS transmitter with excellent scaling capability for TFT LCD panel display"

if it turns out your Encoder is as efficiant as your decoder and it can infact be
enbeded into an FPGA such as the board above then perhaps your encoder and apps
would compliment the hardware assisted decoding etc.

so perhaps if you were to inform BBRV 'bill buck'
that you might be interested in trying out one of these
boards to see if theres a market for your full product range he may give you one to develop on.

i noticed you replyed that PPC was TBD and that you implyed
that current PPC was 'old' , im trying to let you know there is lots of NEW PPC based hardware coming to market
over the next few years that could well make use of your (or others) products, and give you the heads-up that there is a valid market there for long term paid-for products.

look into it or dont, thats your choice, but it would be a shame to miss such a chance to get on at the ground level now, rather than not and wish you had later, it cant heart to try it and see, if it works out then potentially EVERY
V2 might have your tools as standard (rather than somethng else) and that could be werth much more to you than the initial outlay in time and effort now.

whatever......

[MrWizard]

BetaBoy, I figured out why I wasn't getting the emails - the download email from cyt0plas was getting blocked by the gmail spam filter and sent to the spam folder. I've got the decoder now and it's working great!
Same thing for me. :thanks:

[MrWizard]

Okay, I just finished my first comparison. I'm a little confused with some of the output from Haali's timeCodec app but here is the info:

System Info
Pentium 4 3.0 GHz w/ HT
2.0 GB 533 MHz DDR2 RAM

Clip Info
length 0:02:28
size 106289 KB
res 1920x784

Results
CoreAVC 0.0.0.4 alpha
User: 124s, kernel: 0s, total: 124s, real: 124s, fps: 28.8, dfps: 28.7

CoreAVC 1.0
User: 6s, kernel: 0s, total: 6s, real: 102s, fps: 573.3, dfps: 35.0

ffdshow (2005-12-21 gcc 4.0.2 SSE, no post processing)
User: 206s, kernel: 0s, total: 206s, real: 207s, fps: 17.3, dfps, 17.3

However, I assume the italicized/underlined numbers are the framerates that really matter. And the new version provides even more than the 15% speed increase (for HT) BetaBoy announced. This is somewhere in the neighborhood of 20%. I'm happy :D

[jblade]

Just bought it, have yet to recieve my link.

[tomos]

ok.... we found out what the issue was. Users that did not get an email should get it within the hour. Thanx for the patience guys.

Dan, i still havent had any mails. i dont have a spam filter/folder so not sure whats happening. it's been about 18 hrs now :(

[BlackSun]

However, I assume the italicized/underlined numbers are the framerates that really matter. And the new version provides even more than the 15% speed increase (for HT) BetaBoy announced. This is somewhere in the neighborhood of 20%. I'm happy :D

Thanks for the results, indeed it is very interesting :thanks:

[tomos]

is there anyone else who still hasnt had their download mail yet? it's been over 24 hrs now :(

[Eretria-chan]

I found my link in the bulk after checking again, now. You sure there is no link there?
I tried installing it with no problems. Don't have anything to test with right now, though.

[Sirber]

Does the DShow filter work under mplayer?

[tomos]

I found my link in the bulk after checking again, now. You sure there is no link there?
I tried installing it with no problems. Don't have anything to test with right now, though.

no email at all received apart from a check from Dan to ask if i had an email from carlos. no mails at all received otherwise :(

have mailed their support addy too and no reply from that either. would have though there was a problme between their domain and mine in regards to spam blocks somewhere but i got Dans test mails and his latest direct to me so that cant be it.

[BetaBoy]

Well Cyt0 stated our Mailer Server had a CBL blacklist on it... we have removed it from the blacklist and hope the issue is resolved in a few hours. See:
http://cbl.abuseat.org/lookup.cgi?ip=64.192.171.160

If you have spam filters you may want to check that folder till your local mail server updates its DNS to relist us as ok.

[tomos]

ah ok, never heard that before. dont have spam lists on mine. its my own domain. hopefully it will be sorted later on today then :)

[Pomyk]

Another bug: lossless video doesnt work (professional version)

[Abnormal1]

Does the DShow filter work under mplayer?
I was also wondering this. As it may then work with Xbox Media Centre. I would buy this decoder if it would allow XBMC to decode AVC better.

[BetaBoy]

Another bug: lossless video doesnt work (professional version)
Please be more specific... if you are referring to Predictive Lossless (High 4:4:4 profile) that will be in our Enterprise decoder.

[Sirber]

I was also wondering this. As it may then work with Xbox Media Centre. I would buy this decoder if it would allow XBMC to decode AVC better.Same here, I would buy it to use it with mplayer.

[emmel]

Nice decoder the new CoreAVC Pro.

I only have one question: Is there any tool atm for converting or parsing a (dvb) ts/h264 -recording into a form or mediatype accepted by CoreAVC?

Looking forward to the direct ts support,
emmel

[Pomyk]

Please be more specific... if you are referring to Predictive Lossless (High 4:4:4 profile) that will be in our Enterprise decoder.

Lossless video encoded with x264. I tried different players (mpc, wmp), splitters (haali, mpc), containers (mkv, mp4). When played it's just black screen and stops immediately. When muxed with audio - it plays audio normally and shows just black screen.
It works with libavcodec.
Does anyone else have this problem?

[CEC]

Hey, you must do something with your website "http://coreavc.corecodec.org/"! It is too much LIGHT!!! It doesn't give the confidence that people want to take!!! If you want to sell more give it a better style!!!:sly:

Yes, it might be a good and fast decoder and yes you did a very good advertisment in the video forums, but if you want to have NEW customers who doesn't look the forums? What then???? A light website isn't always the best choice!!! Give it something! (Like: DivX, on2)!!!

[Selur]

is it just me or does the coreavc pro crash if you enable 'Raw Video' and 'Picture properties' in ffdshow ?

[BetaBoy]

Nice decoder the new CoreAVC Pro.

I only have one question: Is there any tool atm for converting or parsing a (dvb) ts/h264 -recording into a form or mediatype accepted by CoreAVC?

Looking forward to the direct ts support,
emmel

emmel... we are trying to rollout an update in a few days based upon some of the few bugs reported. Haali is working on TS support.... no word atm on when it will be ready.

[Episodio1]

CEC, if someone has to based his sales on the webdesign and not in his product itself... i think they have a problem.

Every time I've gone to Divx.com i spent 10secs to know where to read (or click). I had to make a mental map previously to orientate myself. :(

I love simple web-desing: I know where to read/click in one second.