ffdshow tryouts project: Discussion & Development

[georgevalkov]

H.264 decoding should be a bit faster since rev1941.

:thanks: I have also noticed that at mode: one pass quality=52; min quantizer=18; max quantizer=31:
~ the average quantizer during encoding dropped from 29-31 to 26-27 resulting in better output quality. :)
~ I have not encoded one and same content using the old and the new versions, in order to make an accurate comparison, but the average file size on the new encodings doesn't seem larger at first sight.

[georgevalkov]

I am encoding from an interlaced PAL 704x576 source with ffdshow to H.264 format;
output=store frames to external file: RAW frames.264,
and then I use MP4box to mux it into a MP4 container.

MP4Box.exe -fps 25 -add "%1" -new "%1.v.mp4"

I can also open the RAW .264 stream directly in MPlayer, with the same results, as described below.

If I on the ffdshow encoder I enable both:
[x] Interlaced
[x] B frames
with B frames prediction = [spatial, temporal or auto]

The file plays properly in MPlayer, but it will complain outputting this warning on every frame:
[h264 @ 00D4FB70]MBAFF + spatial direct mode is not implemented

With B frames enabled I save 5% file size, but I don't like that warning to appear.
The file plays properly in both MPlayer and DirectShow using the ffdshow video decoder.

What would You recommend me?
A: ignore the warning
B: disable B frames
C: ?

Thanks for any advice! :thanks:

[clsid]

The same warning applies to ffdshow, although it isn't displayed anywhere.
When you get the warning it means that it is very likely that not everything will be decoded properly. It may look visually OK if your are lucky.
Decoding interlaced video requires more processing power than progressive video. So my advice would be to deinterlace the video before encoding.

[georgevalkov]

Thank You for the advice. :thanks:
I will preserve interlacing on interlaced sources,
but without B frames, to be safe. And I will use
the B frames on progressive sources.

Decoding interlaced video requires more processing power than progressive video. So my advice would be to de interlace the video before encoding.
Yes, de interlaced video will also requires lower bit-rate, but at the cost of:
~ blurring (reduced vertical resolution);
~ motion is no longer smooth.

The advantages of interlaced video are:
~ perfect for TV output;
~ preserves high resolution, when there's less or no motion;
~ preserves smooth motion;
~ when the screen is set to 720x576@100Hz, the interlacing artefacts are less noticeable and usually no deinterlacing is needed;
~ some interlaced 704x576 materials look good at 1152x864@75Hz, and no deinterlacing is needed, artefacts are less noticeable at normal watching distance;
~ setting the BOB flag in the output format of ffdshow, will cause the render to take care of the deinterlacing, preserving the smooth motion. If used with VMR9 it will play at double frame rate 50Hz, preserving both smooth motion and details.



The same warning applies to ffdshow, although it isn't displayed anywhere.
I followed this guide to write my first :) DirectShow console application:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms783787(VS.85).aspx

that simply renders a file:
hr = pGraph->RenderFile(L"M:\\interlaced+b frames.mp4", NULL);
It used the ffdshow video and audio decoders, but did not output any warnings in the console window.

A few days ago I tested the same code to render an AVI:
hr = pGraph->RenderFile(L"M:\\AXE-effect-01.avi", NULL);
And the ffdshow audio decoder showed a single warning message in the console output:
"mpg123: Can't rewind stream by 642 bits!".

Who would have thought! :cool: My first step in DirectShow and it's getting interesting!
Seems like the DirectShow filters can output debugging information to the standard output. :)

[nm]

Yes, de interlaced video will also requires lower bit-rate, but at the cost of:
~ blurring (reduced vertical resolution);
~ motion is no longer smooth.
Both of these problems can be avoided by using a good motion-compensating framerate-doubling deinterlacer like MCBob, MVBob (AviSynth) or yadif+mcdeint (MEncoder). The cost is a higher bitrate (for the same quality) and slower encoding/decoding (due to the higher bitrate and framerate). If you don't want to double the framerate, blurring can still be avoided by using these better deinterlacers and dropping half of the output frames.

The advantages of interlaced video are:
~ perfect for TV output;
But hard to get to the TV from a PC without deinterlacing at some point. Standalone players are better at this.

~ when the screen is set to 720x576@100Hz, the interlacing artefacts are less noticeable and usually no deinterlacing is needed;
I don't see such an effect. At least bobbing is still needed to make it look half-decent.

~ some interlaced 704x576 materials look good at 1152x864@75Hz, and no deinterlacing is needed, artefacts are less noticeable at normal watching distance;
That's because scaling the video vertically less than 2x blends the fields together, so it works like a cheap deinterlacer.

[georgevalkov]

:thanks: Thank You nm, for your opinion and for the names of the filters, I will test them, whenever I have time for experiments.

Both of these problems can be avoided by using a good motion-compensating framerate-doubling deinterlacer like MCBob, MVBob (AviSynth) or yadif+mcdeint (MEncoder). The cost is a higher bitrate (for the same quality) and slower encoding/decoding (due to the higher bitrate and framerate). If you don't want to double the framerate, blurring can still be avoided by using these better deinterlacers and dropping half of the output frames.


Decoding 50 fps is twice as hard as 25 fps. The double bitrate is very hight. It's much cheaper to encode interlaced 25 fps, and to deinterlace after the decoder. In the future, my de-interlaced recordings will look the same... But there will be faster computers and better deinterlacing filters, so my interlaced recordings will look better :cool:.

If I set the BOB flag in ffdshow, EVR and VMR9 will do the hardware BOB deinterlacing, so I can get the smooth 50 fps at the cost of lower CPU usage. Athlon XP 1700+ is not strong enough to do this with software de-interlacing filters. It's also not fast enough to decode H.264@50p, but it can do H.264@25i.

[thuan]

I've just tried the subtitle filter in ffdshow-tryouts again, and it seems like the karaoke rendering timing is still off. And there're still differences in rendering position of some subs. Do you need a sample?

[draggoon01]

i use ffdshow to play subtitles. i'm trying to play a mkv file which contains multiple subtitles (utf-8). how do i select different subtitle languages with ffdshow?

[vlada]

You can select subtitle streams from menu by right clicking on ffdshow or Haali's splitter icon in tray.

[draggoon01]

You can select subtitle streams from menu by right clicking on ffdshow or Haali's splitter icon in tray.

ahh, i normally disable tray icons. enabling ffdshow tray icon let's me select subtitle.

is there any way to select subtitle from within ffdshow properties page?

[leeperry]

Right, very quick and very dirty lesson in AR......

You're resizing a 1440x816 video to the same AR, but 1280 width, so that it displays correctly. That's 1280x544 as your destination. The SAR STAYS as 4:3, because the frame size is still the same dimension multiple. Try it yourself. 1440/816 = 960/544. The SAR is reported as 1.77 because it's the closest to 1440/816. ffdshow isn't reporting the SAR to the renderer, hence why it appears to be 1.77.

Try this: resize JUST the horizontal to 1280, check "Keep Aspect Ratio" down the bottom of the box, and then see. ;)

BTW: 1280/768 = 1.666666666, AKA 5:3. :)

to get back on that matter.

it was OK with MPC HC + EVR on XP.

but it's not with HR :(

with this video :
http://download.microsoft.com/download/c/e/a/ceaf0def-8889-4462-9616-7ce4246569ae/Taxi_3_1080.exe

HR says : 1080x816.....instead of 1920*1080

seems there's some AR hiccup again :(

[Inventive Software]

What's HR?

EDIT: Forget that, I figured it'd be Haali Renderer. I think I need caffeine! :D

Have you tried other renderers, like VMR7, VMR9 (windowed and renderless)? Do they exhibit the same flaw? If so, then call it an ffdshow problem. If they're correct, head to the Haali Renderer thread in Software Players.

[leeperry]

right....thanks for the reply.

I made more tests, it might be due to KMPlayer's own AR implementation.

If I check "Original AR" I get 1.78....I have to enforce 2.35 in KMP

any chance someone could make the Ozone winamp2 plugin avoid deadlocks at shutdown in ffdshow audio ?

you can open 2 files a row, then it starts freezing more and more for each new file.....and after 6 files everything's frozen :(

Haruhiko is the only active ffdshow coder ? :(

[whiterabbit99]

can anyone help me with using the automatic presets?

ffdshow tryout beta4a_rev1723_20071224_clsid

im trying to setup some automatic presets for the video decoder

i have a dvd one -> dimensions must be 720x576
tv -> dimensions must be 704x576
other -> no conditions

"other" preset doesnt do anything, the other 2 do resizes, blurs etc.

i ticked the "automatic preset loading". tried it with "try to load preset from file" ticked and unticked - dont know what that is.

whatever i try the preset loading conditions are ignored - the default preset in bold is always loaded.

i dont understand what im doing wrong - i used the osd to make sure the resolutions above are correct.

please help.

[Leak]

i dont understand what im doing wrong - i used the osd to make sure the resolutions above are correct.
It could be that the image dimensions aren't known when the filters connect, but only when the first frame is sent - and that's after the preset has been loaded.

Preset loading based on FPS doesn't work for DVDs either, for instance.

In that case, preset loading would have to be done whenever the video streams properties (dimensions, frame rate, aspect ratio, etc.) change for this to work.

np: Bill Laswell - Vessel (Y34RZ3R0R3MIX3D)

[leeperry]

BTW, why is the "linear blending" deinterlace so blurry in ffdshow ? :(

I can't use MPC HC's pixel shaders scripts anymore coz I'm back with HR.......but MPC HC's "blend deinterlace" PS script is not blurry at all

any chance of getting the same kind of performance in ffdshow ?

TIA,

[Inventive Software]

Use kernel deinterlace or cubic blending. Kernel recommended, as it made my interlaced videos look very nice. :D

[leeperry]

ok sounds like a plan, I'll try thanks!

any settings that work for everything with Kernel ?

it seems that setting it to 10 and checking "sharp" gives nice results :
http://leak.no-ip.org/AviSynth/LeakKernelDeint/LeakKernelDeintHelp.html

[Leak]

any settings that work for everything with Kernel ?
Well, I personally use ffdshow's KernelBob (about the same code as my AviSynth plugin) with a threshold of 0 - as long as your display has the correct framerate (i.e. 50Hz for PAL material, or 59.940Hz for NTSC) it looks great.

np: Justus Köhncke - Wo Bist Du (Doppelleben)

[whiterabbit99]

so how do i use the presets - if i want specific presets to apply just to dvds for example.

i tried using just decoder match as mpeg2video but it still uses which ever preset is the default :(

[wyrd]

for dvds, i've been ticking both of dimensions and fourcc.
http://tirnanog.fate.jp/tmp/snap/preset_autoload1_t.jpg (http://tirnanog.fate.jp/tmp/snap/preset_autoload1.png)

[Leak]

so how do i use the presets - if i want specific presets to apply just to dvds for example.
What works for me is setting "DirectShow filter presence" to "DVD Navigator".

np: Nine Inch Nails - Ghosts I (Ghosts I-IV)

[rebkell]

How is the Input bitrate calculated, the one in the OSD option for the video decoder?

[draggoon01]

request/suggestion:

for mkv files with multiple embedded subtitles, the only way to choose different languages is by right clicking on the tray icon which shows "subtitle sources" menu under "subtitles".

could the "subtitle sources" menu be added to ffdshow configuration/properties as a sub-menu item under "subtitle" along with "text", "font", "vobsub" ?

[leeperry]

is it me or "accept embedded subtitles" is checked by default in the subtitles section of ffdshow ?

that's very annoying, because I couldn't get subtitles to work in KMPlayer with "Haali's Media Splitter" because that option was checked.

I've never touched this section of ffdshow, and it was disabled :eek:

[Jong]

Hi everyone. New to this thread, but a long time user of ffdshow. Thanks for all the hard work.

As the RGB Converter is just about vital now when upscaling SD, as drivers assume BT.709 when passed HD, is there any plan to multi-thread RGB Conversion, as was done with the resize filter.

It is really punishing right now!

[leeperry]

hey Jong ;)

to get back on deinterlacing, kernel bob required double frame rate, so not pratical at all.

kernel deinterlace makes ugly artefacts.

cubic blending doesn't really do its job.

only "linear blending" works fine, but it's blurry as hell.

I really miss the "blending" PS script from MPC :(

anyone knows a non-blurry good blending interlace algorithm ? D-Scaler plugin maybe ?

thanks!

[haruhiko_yamagata]

request/suggestion:

for mkv files with multiple embedded subtitles, the only way to choose different languages is by right clicking on the tray icon which shows "subtitle sources" menu under "subtitles".

could the "subtitle sources" menu be added to ffdshow configuration/properties as a sub-menu item under "subtitle" along with "text", "font", "vobsub" ?
It is not possible. You can select subtitle track by right clicking Haali's icon.

[haruhiko_yamagata]

is it me or "accept embedded subtitles" is checked by default in the subtitles section of ffdshow ?

that's very annoying, because I couldn't get subtitles to work in KMPlayer with "Haali's Media Splitter" because that option was checked.

I've never touched this section of ffdshow, and it was disabled :eek:
I don't understand. Could you send me the sample?

[leeperry]

well, it happens with any movie in KMPlayer.

is this option checked by default ?

because even if the "subtitles" section of ffdshow is disabled, it still blocks the subs from reading in KMP :(

so anyone knows of a way to get nice deinterlacing in ffdshow w/o jaggies and bluriness ?

[vlada]

haruhiko_yamagata> I think I understand what leeperry is trying to say. He wants KMPlayer to render subtitles, but the they are treated by ffdshow. The checkbox "accept embedded subtitles" used to be unchecked. I haven't tried any of latest versions if this has changed.

leeperry> Kernel bob is doing a good job for me. It doubles the framerate which is the best thing to do. It would be nice to have yadif ported to ffdshow.

Any blending deinterlacer is supposed to create a blurry image. If you want a sharp picture, you have to use motion adaptive bob.

[leeperry]

yes, that's what I meant.

well I've just tried everything on some strongly interlaced 29.97 video, and nothing looks as good and sharp as doubling the "deinterlace(blend)" PS script from MPC.

kernel bob does terrible artefacts, and anyway I run my CRT in 90Hz.

KMP also supports stacking PS scripts with EVR on XP, so that's pretty cool :cool:

[haruhiko_yamagata]

@leeperry
Then just uncheck that option. I won't support KMPlayer.

[leeperry]

yes I did, but wondering why ffdshow was "keeping" subs to itself, even though the "subtitles" ffdshow section was disabled and I never touched it ?!

it might occur with other players ;)

I understand KMPlayer breaks the GPL, I'm sorry for that.....it's a very good player(basically MPC on steroids) and a lot more frame stable than MPC HC(never misses the VSYNC, even after 60/90').....I regret its author decided to convert MPC code to Delphi and call it his :(

I think Reclock is also breaking GPL, but I won't stop using it either :p

[haruhiko_yamagata]

yes I did, but wondering why ffdshow was "keeping" subs to itself, even though the "subtitles" ffdshow section was disabled
Because ffdshow has to show subtitles if subtitles (in ffdshow configuration) are enabled during playback.
ffdshow has to get subtitles from input pin for that purpose.
Haali's media splitter can connect to both of MPC's internal renderer and ffdshow at the same time.

[MfA]

Any chance of more tarballs? SVN checkout is tortuously slow. (Or is that just divine punishment for using TortoiseSVN instead of a command line version?)

[puffpio]

is ffdshow still respecting aspect ratios?

I have an mp4 file w/ an h264 video stream in it
the video stream is 720x480 pixels and mp4box is reporting a PAR of 32:27
this should get me a 16:9 for a typical anamorphic widescreen DVD

ffdshow is reporting:
Input aspect ratio: SAR: 1/1, DAR: 3/2
Output aspect ratio: SAR: 1/1, DAR: 3/2

I'm using a 19" LCD monitor 1280x1024 so the DAR maybe coming from there

but why is the SAR not being picked up from the PAR in the mp4 stream?

I'm playing it in media player classic home cinema using the EVR renderer...I've tried in w/ haali's renderer and plain overlay with similar results

anything I'm missing?

[SeeMoreDigital]

I'm playing it in media player classic home cinema using the EVR renderer...I've tried in w/ haali's renderer and plain overlay with similar results

anything I'm missing?Hi puffpio,

You're not alone... I experienced this very issue a few weeks ago and reported it here: -

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1109947

In the meantime I've gone back to the regular version of MediaPlayer Classic.

[leeperry]

Any blending deinterlacer is supposed to create a blurry image. If you want a sharp picture, you have to use motion adaptive bob.

Seb.26 has improved the PS deinterlacing script so it doesn't need to be doubled anymore.

maybe it can be improved even further, we'll see about that......

but on strongly interlaced files, it looks better than anything I've seen from ffdshow....it doesn't blur at all and 95% of the lines are killed :eek:

feel free to comment ppl ;)

this works with MPC and KMPlayer as long as you choose "3D surface rendering" in VMR9 or EVR.

could this script be translated to ffdshow, somehow ?! :eek:

// deinterlace (blend).txt=ps_3_0
sampler s0 : register(s0);
float4 p0 : register(c0);
float4 p1 : register(c1);

#define width (p0[0])
#define height (p0[1])
#define counter (p0[2])
#define clock (p0[3])
#define one_over_width (p1[0])
#define one_over_height (p1[1])

#define PI acos(-1)

float4 main(float2 tex : TEXCOORD0) : COLOR
{

float2 h = float2(0, one_over_height);
float4 c1 = tex2D(s0, tex-h);
float4 c2 = tex2D(s0, tex+h);
float4 c0 = (c1+c2)/2;

return c0;
}

[Shinigami-Sama]

Hi puffpio,

You're not alone... I experienced this very issue a few weeks ago and reported it here: -

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1109947

In the meantime I've gone back to the regular version of MediaPlayer Classic.

so I wasn't going crazy when it refused to give me the proper resolution of some files I have...

[cc979]

is there a problem ffdshow-tryout svn1954 being compiled with gcc-4.0.4

make[1]: Entering directory `/home/User/svn/ffdshow-tryout/ffdshow-tryout/src/imgFilters'
gcc -c -mno-cygwin -mdll -fno-rtti -mthreads -pipe -D_WINGDI_ -DUCLIBCPP -D_GLIBCPP_HAVE_MBSTATE_T -D_WIN32_IE=0x0500 -DARCH_IS_IA32 -DARCH_IS_32BIT -DHAVE_MMX -mmmx -msse -mfpmath=sse -w -DNDEBUG -UDEBUG -DFFDEBUG=0 -I. -I.. -Iuclibc++ -Ibaseclasses -I../baseclasses -IimgFilters -I../imgFilters -Implayer -I../mplayer -Isettings -I../settings -Isettings/filters -I../settings/filters -Icodecs -I../codecs -Isubtitles -I../subtitles -Iconvert -I../convert -Idialog -I../dialog -IaudioFilters -I../audioFilters -Icygwin -I../cygwin -Iffmpeg -I../ffmpeg -Iacm -I../acm -Ifilters -I../filters -Imuxers -I../muxers -I/dx/Include -L/dx/MingLib -ldx9 -O3 -march=i686 -fomit-frame-pointer -MMD -o ffdshow_imgfilters_all.o ffdshow_imgfilters_all.cpp
gcc.exe: -ldx9: linker input file unused because linking not done
make[1]: *** No rule to make target `../ffmpeg/libavcodec/i386/skl_dct_sse.o', needed by `.all'. Stop.
make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/User/svn/ffdshow-tryout/ffdshow-tryout/src/imgFilters'
make: *** [lib] Error 2

cheers

[clsid]

Try this (untested) patch:
Index: Makefile
===================================================================
--- Makefile (revision 1954)
+++ Makefile (working copy)
@@ -4,7 +4,8 @@

SRCS_C=ffdebug.c

-SRCS_NASM=cpuid.asm memcpy.asm subtitles/fontRenderer.asm convert/colorspace_rgb_mmx.asm
+SRCS_NASM=cpuid.asm memcpy.asm subtitles/fontRenderer.asm convert/colorspace_rgb_mmx.asm \
+ imgFilters/Skal/skl_dct_sse.asm imgFilters/Skal/skl_fdct_mmx.asm

include makefile.inc

@@ -58,9 +59,8 @@
baseclasses/baseclasses_all.o \
ffmpeg/libavcodec/golomb.o \
audioFilters/TaudioFilterConvert.o audioFilters/dotproduct.o \
- imgFilters/simple_idct_mmx.o ffmpeg/libavcodec/i386/skl_dct_sse.o \
- ffmpeg/libavcodec/i386/skl_dct_sse2.o ffmpeg/libavcodec/i386/skl_fdct_mmx.o \
- ffmpeg/libavcodec/i386/skl_fdct_sse2.o
+ imgFilters/simple_idct_mmx.o imgFilters/Skal/skl_dct_sse.o \
+ imgFilters/Skal/skl_fdct_mmx.o

lib:
$(MAKE) -C baseclasses

[cc979]

thanks but still same error

[Liisachan]

Hi,
I think the embedded sub in MKV is out of sync (by about 0.5 sec?) in mplayerc_20080308 mplayerc_20080414 from Guliverkli2, if the internal MKV splitter is used, and if Queue is enabled in ffdshow.
mpc 20080127 build works ok, so this could be a pb of MPC.

(Edit: I mean, if MPC's internal sub renderer is used in VMR9. And output color space is RGB32 btw)

Tested ffdshow tryouts official beta4 and the newest nightly (ffdshow_rev1953_20080504_xxl.exe)

Test clip where softsubs and hardsubs should have the same timing
http://ffdshow.faireal.net/tmp/Hard_vs_Softsubs.mkv 48kb

http://ffdshow.faireal.net/tmp/hardsub_softsub.jpg

[clsid]

Confirmed. The only change to MPC in that period that is related to the above is this one:
http://guliverkli2.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/guliverkli2?view=rev&revision=44

I don't see any obvious bugs in that revision. Maybe someone else is able to spot it.

[Liisachan]

Thanks for confirmation. if anything, this change (http://guliverkli2.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/guliverkli2/src/subpic/ISubPic.cpp?r1=44&r2=43&pathrev=44) is fishy, but since MPC works ok if queue is not enabled in ffdshow, perhaps this is not a pb of MPC, but rather related to the hack used by ffdshow queue...

[thuan]

This is for EVR custom and MPCHC but it might be related to sub desynchronizing issue http://mpc-hc.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/mpc-hc?view=rev&revision=460.

[clsid]

The regular version of MPC does not have that code.

I will mess around with rev44 to see if I can fix the problem. But it may take a few days as I've many other things to do.

[haruhiko_yamagata]

Hi,
I think the embedded sub in MKV is out of sync (by about 0.5 sec?) in mplayerc_20080308 mplayerc_20080414 from Guliverkli2, if the internal MKV splitter is used, and if Queue is enabled in ffdshow.
mpc 20080127 build works ok, so this could be a pb of MPC.

I can't reproduce. Can this be related to video card driver? Mine is nVidia 7900GS.

[fastplayer]

Can't reproduce, too.

Setup:
ffdshow rev1945
MPC rev49
Windows XP64
Radeon X800 GTO + Catalyst 8.4