ffdshow tryouts project: Discussion & Development

[Thunderbolt8]

My dual-core system is in repair for a week; I'll check it, but might not be able to until then.would be great, thanks!

[jruggle]

it looks like this is ffmpeg problem.
I can normally decode audio using ffmpeg SVN 19894, but with svn 20421 I have a bunch of errors like:
[ac3 @ 0x2268070]error decoding the audio block
[ac3 @ 0x2268070]exponent out-of-range
and audio distorted in the same way...

EDIT:
ffmpeg-r20024 -> fine
ffmpeg-r20060 -> distorted
Thank you for reporting this and giving a sample. I did a lot of changes between 20036 and 20055. I will track down the problem and fix it as soon as possible.

edit: now fixed in r20437. sorry for the regression...

[clsid]

Thanks!

[leeperry]

Thank you for reporting this and giving a sample. I did a lot of changes between 20036 and 20055. I will track down the problem and fix it as soon as possible.

edit: now fixed in r20437. sorry for the regression...
oh, a ffmpeg developer :)

any chance you could make ffmpeg decode AC3 and DTS in 32float instead of 16 integer please? all the other AC3/DTS decoders in ffdshow output 32 float, this allows less rounding errors...especially when post-processing audio.

:thanks:

[mark0077]

oh, a ffmpeg developer :)

any chance you could make ffmpeg decode AC3 and DTS in 32float instead of 16 integer please? all the other AC3/DTS decoders in ffdshow output 32 float, this allows less rounding errors...especially when post-processing audio.

:thanks:

Gets my vote also :D

[jruggle]

oh, a ffmpeg developer :)

any chance you could make ffmpeg decode AC3 and DTS in 32float instead of 16 integer please? all the other AC3/DTS decoders in ffdshow output 32 float, this allows less rounding errors...especially when post-processing audio.

:thanks:
I'm not DTS maintainer, but for AC3 I have a patch mostly ready. It is a bit slower than the 16-bit decoding, so I will need to make it configurable to decode to either float32 or int16.

[leeperry]

oh cool, you're the man! actually liba52 sounds fine already(and is 32float), but it's still very nice to have an alternative http://forum.slysoft.com/images/smilies/agreed.gif

OTOH, libdts sounds pretty bad(32 float too)...so 32float DTS in ffmpeg would be really fantastic. thanks for your prompt reply btw, much appreciated http://forum-images.hardware.fr/images/perso/otakonleboss.gif

[albain]

Hi all,

here I am again with a new beta build for HD bitstream

Here is the link (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mfngmmtqjqh/ffdshow_rev3115_20091104_dbt_bitstream_beta26.zip)

In this build I have fixed TrueHD and DTS HD bistream from the logs you posted.

@tetsuo55
However DTS HD does not work because the HD blocks are stripped off by MPC splitter. I don't understand why, do you know something about it ?

@testers
I have posted an updated build of the hook tool on the same link I have PM. Please use this new build for the new tests, I have added traces on the media types used between the player and the audio card (the official MS media types are not accepted for all formats), and also on the wasapi implementation.
I need you redo the tests with the new hook tool

[Mercury_22]

Hi all,

...
@tetsuo55
However DTS HD does not work because the HD blocks are stripped off by MPC splitter. I don't understand why, do you know something about it ?

...

This apply to both MPC-HC's MPEG PS/TS/PVA and Matroska splitters ?

[albain]

It works for MKV (I receive the full DTS HD blocks), but not with M2TS files

[THX-UltraII]

Albain,

is this a version where DTS-master and TrueHD should work also for 4xxx users?

[tetsuo55]

I have browsed through the source, but i do not see any stripping code.

Source is here: http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/mpc-hc/browser/trunk/src/filters/parser/mpegsplitter

[albain]

Albain,

is this a version where DTS-master and TrueHD should work also for 4xxx users?

Not for now : technically nothing prevents HD bitstream to work on those series. Only the PAP is missing.
The work to do on those is to trick the audio driver by providing LPCM format whereas it is compressed. This needs to be done after DTSHD/TrueHD/EAC3 bitstream completely work (from ffdshow to MPC wasapi audio renderer).

Otherwise, there is a problem with DTS HD : the HD blocks are not stripped off correctly by ffdshow, this needs to be fixed.

[liquidskin76]

@Albain

I'll try and give the beta build a test on my geforce 9300 at lunch time today. I'll be running the audio from an MKV container.

Will report back this afternoon if i can.

Cheers for all your hard work!

[SamuriHL]

Let me finish breakfast and I'll give it a try. I have been ridiculously busy with work the last week and that will continue til the end of the week unfortunately. However, I'll give it a shot and see what I can do.

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Here's my logs from beta26, using GeForce 9300 HDMI Audio, MKV container, and MatroskaSplitter (not Haali).

TrueHD passthrough enabled, get LPCM audio... (http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m464914fc)

DTSHD passthrough enabled, get no audio... (http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m3be23c4b)

AC3 and DTS appear to bitstream ok. With DTSHD disabled i get the DTS core bitstreamed ok.

Cheers

[SamuriHL]

@albain

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d2f084a8e

No joy on TrueHD. Light doesn't come on for it and I get no sound at all. I'll try to do the hook tests later if I can get to it.

[THX-UltraII]

CyberlinkUSA (Tom) just announced that PDVD9 will be updated later this month by a patch that give bitstream support for the 5xxx-cards.

So I was thinking: ''If Cyberlink can do it, why would others can't?''. Or is it a matter of a 'secret' that ATI only provided to Cyberlink?

[Skinleech]

Thanks albain.

I'll try the new hook tool when I have time - hopefully later on today and see how I get on. Though I expect I will still encounter issues unprotecting audiodg. Worth a try however.

@ SamuriHL, are you using your Xonar for these tests at all, or is it just your ATI card?

[SamuriHL]

This won't work on the Xonar. The hook tool is made for that, but, the tryouts are made for the ATI card. I'll get to the hook tool later. I just have a lot of work to get through today. (and have been for the past 2 weeks, unfortunately)

[albain]

@liquidskin76 : you don't have an ATI 5xxx right ?
The TrueHD/DTSHD media types are refused by the audio driver

This will be the next step (with the new hook tool)

Also the new hook tool will tell the buffers size to set.

I am surprised that TrueHD does not work at all, maybe this is due to the buffer size.

There are still differences between TMT implementation and FFDShow parsing : there is some extradata in TMT buffers at the beginning and at the end. Don't know what it is used for.

[SamuriHL]

It didn't work for me, so, I don't know. I grabbed the new hook tool a bit ago and will give it a shot in a bit.

[madshi]

There are still differences between TMT implementation and FFDShow parsing : there is some extradata in TMT buffers at the beginning and at the end. Don't know what it is used for.
Is the extra data static or dynamic? Can you post an example here?

[Skinleech]

This won't work on the Xonar. The hook tool is made for that, but, the tryouts are made for the ATI card. I'll get to the hook tool later. I just have a lot of work to get through today. (and have been for the past 2 weeks, unfortunately)

Sorry, I should rephrase what I meant: Will you be able to try the hook tool with the xonar, or just your ATI card?

I should have been more specific that I meant the hook tool.

I think I just realised my issue with dpinpurr - both of my systems are 64-bit. I might try and switch the xonar from my HTPC to another PC with 32-bit Windows on it.

Good luck on the work front...

[SamuriHL]

I can't get it to work. I get nothing in the bitstream.txt file. If I try to unlock audiodg manually I get an internal error. No idea what to tell you but I simply can't get anything to log.

[SamuriHL]

Sorry, I should rephrase what I meant: Will you be able to try the hook tool with the xonar, or just your ATI card?

I should have been more specific that I meant the hook tool.

I think I just realised my issue with dpinpurr - both of my systems are 64-bit. I might try and switch the xonar from my HTPC to another PC with 32-bit Windows on it.

Good luck on the work front...

It doesn't work for me, either. I'm also on 64 bit, so, if that's the issue then I'm screwed with regard to that tool. The tool doesn't work with the ATI....what exactly are you going to use to bitstream with it? :) It'll work with an auzentech and PDVD9 or a Xonar with TMT3. That's pretty much it.

[liquidskin76]

@liquidskin76 : you don't have an ATI 5xxx right ?
The TrueHD/DTSHD media types are refused by the audio driver

This will be the next step (with the new hook tool)

Also the new hook tool will tell the buffers size to set.

I am surprised that TrueHD does not work at all, maybe this is due to the buffer size.

There are still differences between TMT implementation and FFDShow parsing : there is some extradata in TMT buffers at the beginning and at the end. Don't know what it is used for.

@Albain,

No, i'm on a Zotac GeForce 9300 motherboard that has NVidia HDMI audio. Before hand i was testing on Asus ION motherboard however that was also GeForce 9300 with NVidia HDMI audio.

So far my result have pretty much matched SamuriHL's ATi 5xxx tests.

Do you want me to run the new hook tool on the NVidia HDMI audio?

Thanks

[albain]

Is the extra data static or dynamic? Can you post an example here?

Sure :
In red this is the IEC header, in blue the TrueHD frame, and in the middle the extra data
72F81F4E1600F0EF9E070300018401010080A556F43B83818049E077A0B0CFFE72F8BA6F17000FA052B7...

A part of it is fixed, some other changes (extract from the next frames) :
9E070300018401010080A556F43B83818049E077A640B0FF
9E070300018401010080A556F43B83818049E07790B0D8FF

Then the last bytes of the buffer are always like this : C2C3C4C00000000000000000000011970000000000000000

The TrueHD frame size is always set to 61424 bytes and the total frame (IEC header+extra bytes 1+TrueHD frame+extra bytes2) are always 61440 long which corresponds to the IEC recommandations.

Something painful with WASAPI renderer is that the buffers are set in duration instead of bytes.

For now I didn't put extra bytes 1, and extra bytes 2 are filled in with zeros, and I fill the buffers frame by frame :
<IEC header>Major frame
<IEC header>Non major frame
...
<IEC header>Major frame
...
Lastly, as you said, the AC3 bytes are stripped off.

EDIT : one other thing, the TrueHD frames are not always stick to the IEC header, sometimes there are a bunch of zeros between, probably due to the time spacing between frames. There are also IEC recommandations about that. This will need to be done too
The full logs are accessible from here : http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1339265#post1339265

@liquidskin
I don't know for before, but it can't work here because the format is refused as told in the logs :
[3656] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat : the output sample format (compressed stream to bitstream) Bitstream Dolby True HD is not accepted by the renderer for codec bitstream Dolby True HD

[Skinleech]

I can't get it to work. I get nothing in the bitstream.txt file. If I try to unlock audiodg manually I get an internal error. No idea what to tell you but I simply can't get anything to log.

From what I read earlier, without audiodg unprotected you won't get anything in bitstream.txt and it definitely looks like dpinpurr doesn't work on 64bit.

I'll try my 32 bit vista install with the same commands and see if that works. If so, I'll transfer the xonar over to a machine with 32 bit to see if I can get a dump into the bitstream folder.

[SamuriHL]

From what I read earlier, without audiodg unprotected you won't get anything in bitstream.txt and it definitely looks like dpinpurr doesn't work on 64bit.

I'll try my 32 bit vista install with the same commands and see if that works. If so, I'll transfer the xonar over to a machine with 32 bit to see if I can get a dump into the bitstream folder.

Yea, I think 64 bit is hosing me, too. Sorry, albain, looks like I won't be much help with the hook tool. Hopefully others will be able to provide you with the info you need.

[albain]

In that case I need Sebastii who has a 32 bits version and supplied the logs from the previous hook version

[SamuriHL]

Who knew going 64 bit on all my machines except my netbook would be a bad thing. :D

[madshi]

Sure :
In red this is the IEC header, in blue the TrueHD frame, and in the middle the extra data
72F81F4E1600F0EF9E070300018401010080A556F43B83818049E077A0B0CFFE72F8BA6F17000FA052B7...

A part of it is fixed, some other changes (extract from the next frames) :
9E070300018401010080A556F43B83818049E077A640B0FF
9E070300018401010080A556F43B83818049E07790B0D8FF

Then the last bytes of the buffer are always like this : C2C3C4C00000000000000000000011970000000000000000
Not sure about all of those bytes. But I found some interesting information in google. Search for the following key words:

- "audio infoframe"
- "High Bitrate (HBR) Audio Stream Packet"
- hdmi_audio_infoframe

That should lead you to some interesting new information. It seems that the open source Intel HDMI drivers might help getting access to some of those structures... ;) I'm not sure yet whether the "audio infoframe" is identical to the "HBR Audio Stream Packet", or whether it's a subset, or something else...

[albain]

Okay thanks I will
But isn't the HDMI encapsulation handled by the audio/GPU driver ?

[madshi]

Okay thanks I will
But isn't the HDMI encapsulation handled by the audio/GPU driver ?
I've no idea. If I had written Windows, you could bitstream without even knowing what IEC headers are. Since you do have to manually add IEC headers, I think it's not an unrealistic thought that you may also have to add HDMI headers. Don't really know, though...

Edit: I think the "audio infoframe" is actually an entry in the EDID. So probably not what we're looking for... :( Not sure about this "High Bitrate (HBR) Audio Stream Packet" yet, though.

[madshi]

Maybe the HDMI 1.3a specification helps?

http://www.hdmi.org/download/HDMISpecification13a.pdf

[Skinleech]

Yea, I think 64 bit is hosing me, too. Sorry, albain, looks like I won't be much help with the hook tool. Hopefully others will be able to provide you with the info you need.

64bit is definitely the cause. I just tried it on my Vista 32 install on my main PC - no HD audio card in this, but I couldn't unprotect audiodg under Win7 x64. It worked fine on Vista x86.

I will try the Xonar for you Albain, but it won't be until at least Sunday as I will be away all weekend and doubt I can do it tonight.

[SamuriHL]

64bit is definitely the cause. I just tried it on my Vista 32 install on my main PC - no HD audio card in this, but I couldn't unprotect audiodg under Win7 x64. It worked fine on Vista x86.

I will try the Xonar for you Albain, but it won't be until at least Sunday as I will be away all weekend and doubt I can do it tonight.

That sucks. I wish there was a version for 64 bit.

[Sebastiii]

Hi, i'll make log tonight :) (in not very longtime lol)
Seb.

[Sebastiii]

In that case I need Sebastii who has a 32 bits version and supplied the logs from the previous hook version

With last Hook Tool, i can't get bitstream.txt.
I have try to put only Old version of DumpPCM.dll in new hook tool and it works (bitstream.txt grow up).
With the new DumpPCM.dll it doesn't work.

I'm in starting block to try to log :)

Sebastiii.

[rica]

It works for MKV (I receive the full DTS HD blocks), but not with M2TS files

I need an mkv file and audio renderer you used in your trials.
Btw finally i have an ati 5770 and an HDMI receiver.

[albain]

Great, I have made one DTS HD mkv sample.

But there is a bug in the current FFDShow beta for DTS HD, here is also the new build

Here is the MKV DTS HD sample (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mznbyzzyzmw/DTS-HD.MA.LOGO.71.24.96 - 1 - h264, 1080i60.mkv)

Here is the new FFDShow HD bitsteam beta 28 build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/jzzmmn3yejm/ffdshow_rev3115_20091106_dbt_bitstream_beta28.zip)

And here is the MPC wasapi audio renderer (http://www.mediafire.com/file/y2ngljjgiad/MpcAudioRendererFilter.zip) (compiled in debug mode, may be slow)

[SamuriHL]

Has anything changed that may help me with TrueHD bitstreaming?

[rica]

Thanks albain but i can't get any audio.

[Mercury_22]

It works for MKV (I receive the full DTS HD blocks), but not with M2TS files
@ albain can you please confirm that with MPC-HC rev 983 HD blocks are NOT stripped off from DTS-HD ?
Revision 984 - Directory Listing
Modified Sun Jan 25 20:01:24 2009 UTC (9 months, 1 week ago) by beliyaal

Added: Support for Blu-ray clip info (language for audio and subtitles in m2ts files)
Changed: Sort MPEC audio streams according to quality. The best quality stream will be played by default.
Fixed: Strip the non-core info from DTS-HD tracks until a decoder is available. Fixes problems with SPDIFer.
Fixed: If Blu-ray clip info is available all subtitle streams will be available from the start of the clip.

[Keiyakusha]

Thank you for reporting this and giving a sample. I did a lot of changes between 20036 and 20055. I will track down the problem and fix it as soon as possible.

edit: now fixed in r20437. sorry for the regression...

Hi. Thanks for your work! But it seems there is still a bit of distortion. I noticed it with my previous sample but it was hard to tell. Now I found another one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mtmhtyzmmm2/sample2.AC3). I can hear some distortion at 5-6 second, which shouldn't be there.
Latest ffmpeg revision tested 20467 - distortion
As before, works fine with 20024 revision (closest revision to 20036-20055 that I have...).
No errors reported this time.

[albain]

Thanks albain but i can't get any audio.

Oh, I forgot, the official DTS HD media type is not accepted by radeon 5xxx.

I think this is a driver issue : AMD's driver is not ready for DTS HD bitstream or use a non official media type.

The alternative is to get the xonar's one from the new hook tool (which does'nt work for now :mad:, I am working on it with sebastii's help) which dumps the media types values

About TrueHD, nothing has changed, but I will try to analyze the current streams provided and somehow reproduce the extradata.

But the problem may come here from the wasapi audio renderer which is not correctly set.


@Mercury22

Right, this is due to this modification : in MpegSplitter.cpp, line 1449
if I replace #if 1 by #if 0 I can see DTS HD blocks again

else if (m_mt.subtype == MEDIASUBTYPE_DTS || m_mt.subtype == MEDIASUBTYPE_WAVE_DTS) // DTS HD MA data is causing trouble, lets just remove it
{
#if 0

[Mercury_22]

Oh, I forgot, the official DTS HD media type is not accepted by radeon 5xxx.

I think this is a driver issue : AMD's driver is not ready for DTS HD bitstream or use a non official media type.

The alternative is to get the xonar's one from the new hook tool (which does'nt work for now :mad:, I am working on it with sebastii's help) which dumps the media types values

About TrueHD, nothing has changed, but I will try to analyze the current streams provided and somehow reproduce the extradata.

But the problem may come here from the wasapi audio renderer which is not correctly set.


@Mercury22

Right, this is due to this modification : in MpegSplitter.cpp, line 1449
if I replace #if 1 by #if 0 I can see DTS HD blocks again

Can you please do that in the SVN ! so we can have DTS-HD with internal mpeg splitter too
:thanks:

[albain]

Can you please do that in the SVN ! so we can have DTS-HD with internal mpeg splitter too
:thanks:

Sure, give me a commit access to subversion !
My user is also albain on sourceforge

[Mercury_22]

Sure, give me a commit access to subversion !
My user is also albain on sourceforge
I thought you have commit access !:confused: I wish I could give it to you but I can't maybe Casimir or Tetsuo can do that

[mark0077]

Hi all. I have a few hundred mobile phone videos in mp4 format that wont play using ffdshow libavcodec mpeg4 decoder. Using xvid ffdshow decoder, or mpc-hc's own decoder it works fine.

Can anyone confirm, or shall I give a sample if anyone is interested in looking into it?

[clsid]

A sample would be useful.

[mark0077]

Thanks, here is a 6mb sample. If I use ffdshow libavcodec mpeg4 decoder, the sound plays, the first frame of the video shows but no more. I notice if I move the window around a little bit, the frames start to show. Its like the frames are being decoded properly just not getting through to the renderer or something like that, until I do a window move, pause / unpause.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=PAZP0O12

[nightfly]

Here are the various media types exposed by the arcsoft demuxer:

"[ArcSoft MPEG Demux].Audio"
SubTypes:
{697AD091-7F64-43CC-86B0-5D190A372E2E}
LPCM

"[ArcSoft MPEG Demux].Audio"
SubTypes:
{F6498F57-B399-4A43-A6FA-F694AD42B9BE}
DTS-HD

"[ArcSoft MPEG Demux].Audio"
SubTypes:
{4288B843-610B-4E15-A53B-43007FCFF614}
TrueHD

[tetsuo55]

Sure, give me a commit access to subversion !
My user is also albain on sourceforgeyou have access

[Andy o]

Hey guys been experimenting with some h.264 interlaced video and it really brought my 3.0 Core 2 duo to its knees. Is there any way to have ffdshow NOT deinterlace, and output interlaced so my TV can handle it? For the life of me I can't seem to find the option, and google has been useless.

[Andy o]

I'm not sure now if ffdshow is deinterlacing. I just assumed it did because of the huge CPU resources it is required for 1080i H.264. Maybe it's the renderer (using MPC-HC 1330).

[jruggle]

Hi. Thanks for your work! But it seems there is still a bit of distortion. I noticed it with my previous sample but it was hard to tell. Now I found another one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mtmhtyzmmm2/sample2.AC3). I can hear some distortion at 5-6 second, which shouldn't be there.
Latest ffmpeg revision tested 20467 - distortion
As before, works fine with 20024 revision (closest revision to 20036-20055 that I have...).
No errors reported this time.
fixed in r20473. This was a different bug.

[leeperry]

fixed in r20473. This was a different bug.
BTW, any idea who I could ask to see 32float DTS please? I tried to sign up on the ffmpeg user mailing list, but never received any confirmation email...I tried w/ 2 different email providers.

[clsid]

Thanks, here is a 6mb sample. If I use ffdshow libavcodec mpeg4 decoder, the sound plays, the first frame of the video shows but no more. I notice if I move the window around a little bit, the frames start to show. Its like the frames are being decoded properly just not getting through to the renderer or something like that, until I do a window move, pause / unpause.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=PAZP0O12
The problem only seems to occur with EVR Custom Presenter.
It also only occurs when the output colorspace is NOT equal to YV12. If I force YV12 (uncheck all others), then it plays fine.

I don't know why this happens or how to solve it. But maybe anyone else knows. Maybe one of the MPC devs.

[jruggle]

BTW, any idea who I could ask to see 32float DTS please? I tried to sign up on the ffmpeg user mailing list, but never received any confirmation email...I tried w/ 2 different email providers.
You could put in a feature request on the issue tracker.
http://roundup.ffmpeg.org/roundup/ffmpeg/

[Brazil2]

The problem only seems to occur with EVR Custom Presenter.
It also only occurs when the output colorspace is NOT equal to YV12. If I force YV12 (uncheck all others), then it plays fine.

I don't know why this happens or how to solve it. But maybe anyone else knows. Maybe one of the MPC devs.
The funny thing is that it's working fine for me on an old PC using a very old version of ffdshow that I never bothered to update. It's playing fine with YUY2 and EVR custom output:

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/4852/strange1.png

http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/4161/strange3.png

There is some kind of little 'hop' at the start but after that it's playing fine. Also the file is using variable frame rate mode, maybe that's the reason of the troubles ?

Frame rate mode : Variable
Frame rate : 29.212 fps
Minimum frame rate : 7.442 fps
Maximum frame rate : 31.120 fps

EDIT:
That's on XP 32 bits
Radeon 9800 Pro
ffdshow-20050303-sse (the very latest SSE build from Milan Cutka! :D)
MPC-HC 1.2.1043 using the built-in splitter

[albain]

Hi,

new FFDShow HD bitstream beta build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/jvuymtyqnzz/ffdshow_rev3128_20091108_dbt_bitstream_beta29.zip)


This new build adds the following feature : testing several subtypes if the official one fails. This should bring bitstream support to the xonar.

I didn't change the bitstream code yet

Damien

[leeperry]

You could put in a feature request on the issue tracker.
http://roundup.ffmpeg.org/roundup/ffmpeg/
I will :thanks:

PS: hah, live.com/gmail.com/lavache.com appear to never get any confirmation from their bots..oh well, it's open source but closed group I guess :o

[SamuriHL]

Hi,

new FFDShow HD bitstream beta build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/jvuymtyqnzz/ffdshow_rev3128_20091108_dbt_bitstream_beta29.zip)


This new build adds the following feature : testing several subtypes if the official one fails. This should bring bitstream support to the xonar.

I didn't change the bitstream code yet

Damien

Well that's quite interesting. I can try that out in a bit.

[liquidskin76]

Hi,

new FFDShow HD bitstream beta build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/jvuymtyqnzz/ffdshow_rev3128_20091108_dbt_bitstream_beta29.zip)


This new build adds the following feature : testing several subtypes if the official one fails. This should bring bitstream support to the xonar.

I didn't change the bitstream code yet

Damien

Cool, time to dig out my Xonar! Was started to get worried that i might not be able to bitstream with my GeForce 9300 HDMi audio!

When you say bitstream, are you hoping for DTS-HD as well?

Cheers

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

new FFDShow HD bitstream beta build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/jvuymtyqnzz/ffdshow_rev3128_20091108_dbt_bitstream_beta29.zip)


This new build adds the following feature : testing several subtypes if the official one fails. This should bring bitstream support to the xonar.

I didn't change the bitstream code yet

Damien

Hi,

Could you explain what you use for bitstream :) ?
If i use MPC-HC ffdshow Audio don't start.
If i make GRF with graphstudio, i can play but no sound and no light comes on.
Did we use MPC Audio Wasapi Renderer (i think yes lol).

So this is the log and Screenshot of my Graphstudio :
http://sebinternet.free.fr/DTSHDscreen.jpg


And


Log Debugview release Beta29 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/DTSHDffdshow29.zip)

Thanks for all :)
Seb.

[Skinleech]

I will try it in a while also.

Thank you yet again!

[Skinleech]

Ok, so using the latest ffdshow bitstream pack & MPC Audio renderer, I get no sound on anything except regular ac3 which is fine.

The files don't play at all and the debugview logs keep going as long as MPC is active.

Will pastebin the logs for each soon.

[SamuriHL]

Same result I got with the last version.

[albain]

For this one the goal is just to make the connection accepted by the audio driver for the xonar (not for 4xxx series yet).
There is a new "try mode" that will for bitstream formats try several media types. Maybe this will also make DTS-HD work

You won't get more sound that with sebastii tests but I just need the logs (debugview) to confirm or not the connection.

What's next : I have to analyze sebastii's last logs, and reproduce as much the bitstream, then the work will be finished on FFDShow's side.

Then the last part : the MPC audio renderer implementation, which must not be correct (buffer size, buffer feeding) otherwise you would get some sound.

Be patient, this takes a lot of time, and most of us have a job in parallel (besides I spent some time lately on Media Control)

[SamuriHL]

No problem on my side, albain, with the patience thing. You've put a remarkable amount of time and effort into this and it's very appreciated! Take your time. I'm sure it'll come. I'm hoping my work schedule slows down after tomorrow so I can do more testing. It's been crazy the past couple weeks. :( So, I fully get the real world stuff getting in the way concept. I hope others understand, as well.

[albain]

Oh my....

@Sebastii : the audio renderer you got is buggy.

Please use this one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/y3f5yndhgmz/MpcAudioRendererFilter.ax)

@Sebastii : can you also test a TrueHD stream with this audio renderer (the buffer has been resized)
MPC audio renderer with TrueHD buffer size (http://www.mediafire.com/file/y3f5yndhgmz/MpcAudioRendererFilter.ax)

Thanks !

You should see the light again on your receiver

[Skinleech]

Albain, I have no issue with being patient at all either, I'm very grateful for your time and effort and will continue to help in any way I can. I've seen it exactly as you describe - an attempt to connect several times. Here are the logs for you:

TrueHD: http://pastebin.com/f4f0f2692
DTS-HD: http://pastebin.com/f5a30e648
DDplus: http://pastebin.com/f2d1bb3f0
LPCM: http://pastebin.com/mf03c6f5
AC3: http://pastebin.com/f2995de44

Thank you as always.

[albain]

Albain, I have no issue with being patient at all either, I'm very grateful for your time and effort and will continue to help in any way I can. I've seen it exactly as you describe - an attempt to connect several times. Here are the logs for you:

TrueHD: http://pastebin.com/f4f0f2692
DTS-HD: http://pastebin.com/f5a30e648
DDplus: http://pastebin.com/f2d1bb3f0
LPCM: http://pastebin.com/mf03c6f5
AC3: http://pastebin.com/f2995de44

Thank you as always.

Sorry, but the mpc audio renderer was a debug version that only wrote to a file, which explains the "Setfilename ok" trace in it.

This explains why you guys don't get any light and sound. Sorry for that

Please use the link in previous post

[tetsuo55]

May i suggest donations of cash or hardware to albain?
This would speedup this research a 100fold

the Onkyo TX-SR607 is about 400 euros and supports all the formats we are testing

Hdmi cable is about 10-20 euros

5xx0 card is about 120 euros
Xonar is about 130 euros

[Skinleech]

Sorry, but the mpc audio renderer was a debug version that only wrote to a file, which explains the "Setfilename ok" trace in it.

This explains why you guys don't get any light and sound. Sorry for that

Please use the link in previous post

No problem.

I will try shortly and post back the traces for you.

[Skinleech]

TrueHD: http://pastebin.com/f773f1256 - Sound but in PCM, started to stutter about 70 seconds in.
DTS-HD HR: http://pastebin.com/f4dedbb2 - No Sound, file played fine
LPCM: http://pastebin.com/f7b18c985 - played in PCM
DDplus: http://pastebin.com/d6399a732 - played in PCM
AC3: http://pastebin.com/f6ecf0699 - played video, no audio. Likely a setup issue, as changiong from Asus Speakers to Asus Spdif device in Windows audio mixer gave the following:
AC3 2: http://pastebin.com/f4d374802 - played fine, DD showed up on avr.

May i suggest donations of cash or hardware to albain?
This would speedup this research a 100fold

If albain sets up a Paypal or similar I will happily send something over.

[honai]

May i suggest donations of cash or hardware to albain?
This would speedup this research a 100fold

the Onkyo TX-SR607 is about 400 euros and supports all the formats we are testing

Hdmi cable is about 10-20 euros

5xx0 card is about 120 euros
Xonar is about 130 euros

Unfortunately, even the top-of-the-line receivers from Onkyo (and Denon) suffer from HDMI implementation issues. You should take a look at AVSforum where countless HTPC users report issues with various combinations of GPU/IGP + receiver. Some work, some don't.

The only route, and this is what Intel, nVidia and ATI engineers are doing, is to purchase and test several different receivers.

In any case, the Denon 1610 (caveat from first paragraph still applies) could do the job and can be had for as low as 315 EUR. A quality HDMI cable can be purchased from Amazon for about 5 EUR.

[albain]

May i suggest donations of cash or hardware to albain?
This would speedup this research a 100fold

the Onkyo TX-SR607 is about 400 euros and supports all the formats we are testing

Hdmi cable is about 10-20 euros

5xx0 card is about 120 euros
Xonar is about 130 euros

Thanks :-) but I already have an okyo 606, and I wait that AMD releases a passive 5xxx card. I hope that it will be released soon

@Skinleech : thanks, it is better with the new renderer, but your logs seem incomplete. Can you check ?

[Sebastiii]

Oh my....

@Sebastii : the audio renderer you got is buggy.

Please use this one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/y3f5yndhgmz/MpcAudioRendererFilter.ax)

@Sebastii : can you also test a TrueHD stream with this audio renderer (the buffer has been resized)
MPC audio renderer with TrueHD buffer size (http://www.mediafire.com/file/y3f5yndhgmz/MpcAudioRendererFilter.ax)

Thanks !

You should see the light again on your receiver

Hi :)

Like SamuriHL said no pb and thx you for your patience :)
So i think the 2 link are the same.
I wrote more clearly i think
In my setup, In graphstudio i can't connect ffdshow Audio to the New MPC Renderer directly.
When i connect it, WMAudio Encodeur to WMAudio DECODEUR appear between ffdshow Audio and MPC Renderer.
I must be something wrong lol.

If i put directly Asus Digital renderer bitstream don't work for DTS-HD and TRUE-HD.
For DTS-HD : Asus Digital renderer -> Sound but no DD
For DTS-HD : Asus Speaker renderer -> Sound in PCM

For TRUE-HD (96Khz) standard TRUE-HD : Asus Digital renderer -> don't want to play Sound and Video
For TRUE-HD (96Khz) standard TRUE-HD : Asus Speaker renderer -> don't want to play Sound and Video

Big thx :)
Seb.

[Px]

I wait that AMD releases a passive 5xxx card. I hope that it will be released soon
http://www.powercolor.com/Global/NewsInfo.asp?id=834 :)

[albain]

Thank you Seb

Indeed the links were the same, here is the other link (http://www.mediafire.com/file/wmimmyizunn/MpcAudioRendererFilter_bufferTrueHD.zip)

Could you post the debugview of graphstudio connection ?

If the direct connection is refused by the renderer, the media types have been refused and it should appear in FFDShow debugview

Merci !

[Sebastiii]

Hi :)

Yep sorry this is the log :) Renderer N°1=MPC Renderer And Renderer N°2=MPC TrueHD Buffer (http://sebinternet.free.fr/Debugrenderer1et2.zip)

Thx you :)
Seb.

[Skinleech]

Hi Albain.

I'll repost the logs when I get in from work - but not sure what was missing? I copied/pasted directly from the saved dbgview logs into pastebin.

If you need me to re-run them just say and I'll get on it.

Thanks!

[albain]

Ok thank you guys

Here is a new beta build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/fm2z5mzmozj/ffdshow_rev3128_20091109_dbt_bitstream_beta30.zip)

The DTS-HD implementation is now correct : I reproducted EXACTLY the bitstream sent by TMT

Concerning TrueHD, this may be more complicated because frames are spaced differently but we may have sound

In both cases I added the missing frames in the header

[THX-UltraII]

Ok thank you guys

Here is a new beta build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/fm2z5mzmozj/ffdshow_rev3128_20091109_dbt_bitstream_beta30.zip)

The DTS-HD implementation is now correct : I reproducted EXACTLY the bitstream sent by TMT

Concerning TrueHD, this may be more complicated because frames are spaced differently but we may have sound

In both cases I added the missing frames in the header

so with this beta DTS-HD passthrough with ATI card should work now?

[Skinleech]

Ok thank you guys

Here is a new beta build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/fm2z5mzmozj/ffdshow_rev3128_20091109_dbt_bitstream_beta30.zip)

The DTS-HD implementation is now correct : I reproducted EXACTLY the bitstream sent by TMT

Concerning TrueHD, this may be more complicated because frames are spaced differently but we may have sound

In both cases I added the missing frames in the header

Thanks! I will try when I get in from work - several hours away still though.

Assume it will make no difference if I try DTS-HD HR and not DTS-HD MA?

[madshi]

The DTS-HD implementation is now correct : I reproducted EXACTLY the bitstream sent by TMT
Sounds great! Did you find out what those funny additional bytes mean?

[Sebastiii]

Hi again :)

So i made test and not again bitstream, because i can't connect MPC Renderer directly.


So this is the log and Screenshot of my Graphstudio :
http://sebinternet.free.fr/TrueHD-MPCTrueHD-Beta30.jpg


And


Log Debugview release Beta30 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/Beta30-LOG.zip)

Thx you :)
Seb.

[albain]

Seb,

have you disabled the IEC structure in ffdshow output section ?

I can see that the AC3 media types are automatically transformed by FFDShow to PCM (i.e decoding). Didn't you check AC3 bitstream ?

Besides, the wasapi driver will refuse all PCM multichannel stream :
00000137 0.91412973 [3928] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000139 0.91415852 [3928] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000142 0.91419107 [3928] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000143 0.91419107 [3928] subFormat : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000146 0.91422248 [3928] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000147 0.91422248 [3928] Valid bits per sample : 16
00000150 0.91424966 [3928] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000151 0.91424966 [3928] wFormatTag :
00000152 0.91427571 [3928] WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE
00000154 0.91431516 [3928] cbSize : 22
00000155 0.91431516 [3928] nAvgBytesPerSec : 576000
00000156 0.91431516 [3928] Channels : 6
00000157 0.91431516 [3928] Bits per sample : 16
00000158 0.91431516 [3928] Samples per second : 48000
00000159 0.91431516 [3928] nBlockAlign : 12

Whereas the following is accepted :
00002474 4.95134211 [3928] Media Type Structure
00002475 4.95134211 [3928] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00002477 4.95137167 [3928] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00002480 4.95139980 [3928] WAVEFORMATEX :
00002481 4.95139980 [3928] wFormatTag :
00002482 4.95142412 [3928] PCM
00002484 4.95146322 [3928] cbSize : 0
00002485 4.95146322 [3928] nAvgBytesPerSec : 192000
00002486 4.95146322 [3928] Channels : 2
00002487 4.95146322 [3928] Bits per sample : 16
00002488 4.95146322 [3928] Samples per second : 48000
00002489 4.95146322 [3928] nBlockAlign : 4

Sounds great! Did you find out what those funny additional bytes mean?
No but this extra bytes are the same for all the samples I provided for a given format.
I just reproduced them

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

Yes it's not checked :)
I don't know why i have this no connection (strange).
Seb :)

[Keiyakusha]

Does wavpack decoder in ffdshow supports only lossless streams?

Anyway, I can't decode audio in this (http://www.mediafire.com/file/z2ybzvbhzzt/sample.mkv) sample. Works fine with official wavpack DS decoder.

EDIT: by the way, this is 5.1 wavpack stream. mediainfo shows wrong channel info...

[clsid]

The WavPack decoder in ffdshow has limited capabilities. It is recommended to use the official WavPack filters.

[albain]

Ok I don't know why you get this, I will digg this around

Otherwise, I think I understood why the TrueHD bitstream did not work.

There is a last step for perform. I try to figure this out with Madshi and this should be the last (I hope)

Otherwise, DTS-HD is okay from my point of view. It should work once the connection works again with the MPC audio renderer

[Skinleech]

Here are my Beta 30 logs. Hopefully what you need, these are the full logs as saved from DebugView.

True HD: Played as PCM: http://pastebin.com/f4552cb7f
DTS-HD HR: Played video, no sound: http://pastebin.com/f39652e03
LPCM: Played video, no sound: http://pastebin.com/f12652908

This LPCM sample crashed about froze about 40 seconds in, th elog just kept on going until I force closed MPC. DDplus did not play at all. MPC-HC just sat there.

[albain]

Here are my Beta 30 logs. Hopefully what you need, these are the full logs as saved from DebugView.

True HD: Played as PCM: http://pastebin.com/f4552cb7f
DTS-HD HR: Played video, no sound: http://pastebin.com/f39652e03
LPCM: Played video, no sound: http://pastebin.com/f12652908

This LPCM sample crashed about froze about 40 seconds in, th elog just kept on going until I force closed MPC. DDplus did not play at all. MPC-HC just sat there.


I know, you don't have FFDShow debugging enabled :
please open regedit, goto HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\GNU\ffdshow and create a DWORD value named "allowDPRINTF" with value 1. It should be better

[Sebastiii]

Ok I don't know why you get this, I will digg this around

Otherwise, I think I understood why the TrueHD bitstream did not work.

There is a last step for perform. I try to figure this out with Madshi and this should be the last (I hope)

Otherwise, DTS-HD is okay from my point of view. It should work once the connection works again with the MPC audio renderer

Great very good Info :)
I will try to see why MPC don't connect lol
Good louck and big thx
Seb.

[Skinleech]

I know, you don't have FFDShow debugging enabled :
please open regedit, goto HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\GNU\ffdshow and create a DWORD value named "allowDPRINTF" with value 1. It should be better

It looks much better now. Here are the new logs:

TrueHD: Played video & audio (multichannel PCM), but stuttered: http://pastebin.com/f9b2ce74
DTS-HD HR: Played video, no audio: http://pastebin.com/f3ddaa2bd
LPCM: Played video, no audio: http://pastebin.com/f72acef28
DDPlus: PLayed this time, video & audio (mutlichannel PCM): http://pastebin.com/fa5aeb4f

[rica]

Hi albain, with the newest audio renderer and ffdshow, i get these:

No sound at all:

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/2863/nosound.th.png (http://img69.imageshack.us/i/nosound.png/)


Noise/distortion only:

http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/9439/loudysound.th.png (http://img692.imageshack.us/i/loudysound.png/)

Trials were made with Ati 5770 and Denon 1910 using latest Ati drivers or with Realtek R235.

Thanks.

BTW MPC mpeg source doesn't want to connect to ffdshow but ACMWrapper so the chain would be: MPC mpeg source > ACM Wrapper > MPC Audio Renderer. (with/without ffdShow debugging enabled)

Another thing; both PDVD9 and TMT3 gives DD core (false; lets say basic ac3) audio when i use the same source file.

[Emilot]

Hi albain, with the newest audio renderer and ffdshow, i get these:

No sound at all:

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/2863/nosound.th.png (http://img69.imageshack.us/i/nosound.png/)


Noise/distortion only:

http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/9439/loudysound.th.png (http://img692.imageshack.us/i/loudysound.png/)

Trials were made with Ati 5770 and Denon 1910 using latest Ati drivers or with Realtek R235.

Thanks.

BTW MPC mpeg source doesn't want to connect to ffdshow but ACMWrapper so the chain would be: MPC mpeg source > ACM Wrapper > MPC Audio Renderer. (with/without ffdShow debugging enabled)

Another thing; both PDVD9 and TMT3 gives DD core (false; lets say basic ac3) audio when i use the same source file.

I think you should check 24bit and 32bit, at ffdshow output....or just try it....

[rica]

I think you should check 24bit and 32bit, at ffdshow output....or just try it....

thx; already given it a go.

[liquidskin76]

Hi Albain,

Just double checking... is the latest beta intended to bring bitstreaming to the Xonar card only (for the time being), or should it also bring bitstreaming to the ATi 5xxx and GeForce 9300/9400 HDMI Audio as well at this stage?

Just checking so the non-Xonar guys know whether to stand down at the moment or keep testing.

I'm cool either way as i have both a Xonar and GeForce 9300! :devil:

Thanks

[tal.aloni]

Hey Guys,
neb1236 has brought to my attention that I have forgot to implement one of the previous OSD features:
in the past, there was an ability to auto-hide the OSD after a predefined number of frames.

I have now implemented this feature:

http://iknowu.net/files/public/ffdshow/PresetOSD/AutoHideOSD.png

patch:
http://iknowu.net/files/public/ffdshow/PresetOSD/3130-AutoHideOSD.patch

build: (use it for OSD testing only, GCC dlls are not up to date)
http://iknowu.net/files/public/ffdshow/PresetOSD/ffdshow_rev3130_20091110-AutoHideOSD.exe

[ryrynz]

Feature Request:

I would love to see a "on directory match" preset for configuration loading.

[albain]

Finally,

here is the last FFDSHow HD bistream beta (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mymzgynumyn/FFDShow_HDbitstream_beta31_pack.zip)

Now the behaviour is "iso-TMT".

It is a pack that contains the MPC mpeg splitter updated to passthrough DTS HD streams (you have to register it)
There is also an updated version of the MPC renderer

Thanks for your feedbacks

[THX-UltraII]

Finally,

here is the last FFDSHow HD bistream beta (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mymzgynumyn/FFDShow_HDbitstream_beta31_pack.zip)

Now the behaviour is "iso-TMT".

It is a pack that contains the MPC mpeg splitter updated to passthrough DTS HD streams (you have to register it)
There is also an updated version of the MPC renderer

Thanks for your feedbacks

is this the version also for the ATI 4xxx-users so bitstreaming works?

[Sebastiii]

Finally,

here is the last FFDSHow HD bistream beta (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mymzgynumyn/FFDShow_HDbitstream_beta31_pack.zip)

Now the behaviour is "iso-TMT".

It is a pack that contains the MPC mpeg splitter updated to passthrough DTS HD streams (you have to register it)
There is also an updated version of the MPC renderer

Thanks for your feedbacks

Hi :)

Great , i want to test it quickly :)
Big Thx :)
Seb.

[albain]

is this the version also for the ATI 4xxx-users so bitstreaming works?

Not yet

[albain]

A few precisions on changes :

Improvements of the codec initialization : before FFDShow always published an uncompressed type in output then switched to SPDIF/bitstream. This could cause problems, especially with wasapi renderer that (for an unknown reason) refuses the multichannel PCM streams (which explains the recent failing tests)
TrueHD : the most complicated implementation, because silenses have to be inserted at a regular rate (but the rate depends on the size of the MLP frame). I applied a 1/12 ratio (close to TMT but I didn't figure out the exact rule). I hope that this is correct and won't bring audio gaps
DTS HD : implementation is correct (equal to TMT's)
EAC3 : done but I didn't have any EAC3 logs (I have to supply a sample to Sebastii)
Maybe it will work with the arcsoft audio renderer (as FFDShow tries different types including arcsoft's)

[rica]

Not yet

5*** series; should i try?

[albain]

5*** series; should i try?

Sure, this is made for them first :-)

[rica]

Sure, this is made for them first :-)

OK, you say it's my turn :thanks:

[whurlston]

EAC3 : done but I didn't have any EAC3 logs (I have to supply a sample to Sebastii)

I've got a 7.1 sample if you need it.

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

So MPC connect to ffdshow for me :)
But no bitstream for now is hard because your great Work.
Strange think is that i register mpegsplitter but i can't see it in filter.
Strange think too, if i use DTSHD sample when i play ffdshow in output in output DTS option is not check.

So this this the log :)

Log Beta31 and MPC renderer. (http://sebinternet.free.fr/LOG-Beta31.zip)

Thank :)
And yes if someone can find E-AC3 Bitstream sample for i can log it with TMT :)

Seb.

[Sebastiii]

I've got a 7.1 sample if you need it.

Hi, yes it would be great :)
Thx,
Seb

[rica]

Strange think is that i register mpegsplitter but i can't see it in filter.


I was about to post the same issue.
BTW if i build a graph with arcsoft mpeg demux, ffdshow never selects MPC audio renderer but default direct sound device.
(Tried with albain's THD sample.)

[Skinleech]

EAC3 : done but I didn't have any EAC3 logs (I have to supply a sample to Sebastii)

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1342354#post1342354

Didn't I put an eac3 log in my post? The DDPlus one?

Oh, and as for the mpeg splitter - register it then browse with the add external filters option to the .ax file to make it show up in MPC. Won't be able to test this until at least tomorrow night :(

Thanks again albain.

[whurlston]

Hi, yes it would be great :)
Thx,
Seb

PM sent.

[rica]

Oh, and as for the mpeg splitter - register it then browse with the add external filters option to the .ax file to make it show up in MPC.


Sorry but it seems to me impossible unless you see it in the filters list. Negative in advance...

[rica]

btw, albain please have an ati card asap:)
I told i bet albain would fix bitstream before Cyberlink. :)

[SamuriHL]

Yikes I missed a lot today. Sorry had lots going on today. I will try to look at this maybe later tonight if not tomorrow for sure. Nice work!

[rica]

Yikes I missed a lot today. Sorry had lots going on today. I will try to look at this maybe later tonight if not tomorrow for sure. Nice work!

Tomorrow would be better i think since albain might release a new beta.

[Sebastiii]

PM sent.

Thx :)
Seb.

[albain]

Hi Seb,

I have seen your logs and unlike SamuriHL who also has a 5xxx card the TrueHD media type is refused by the renderer.

Could you guys exchange together on this, it must be a driver issue.

I must admit that I am relieved because it is just not normal that you get no sound

About DTS HD, indeed there is a problem with MPC splitter that I built, because it has no filter category : here is the new one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/nnztnyj2mty/MpegSplitter.ax)
However, as for TrueHD your driver will refuse the mediatype, but I think it was the same for SamuriHL too

About EAC3, the sample we already have is a M2TS file but I have troubles to make a bluray structure with tsmuxer (it does not detect the audio stream). If someone has an idea or a BR sample with DD Plus...

00000295 2.42509866 [1780] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat for codec bitstream Dolby True HD with sample format 256
00000296 2.42515683 [1780] Media Type Structure
00000297 2.42515683 [1780] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000298 2.42515683 [1780] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000299 2.42515683 [1780]
00000300 2.42515683 [1780] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000301 2.42515683 [1780] subFormat : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_MLP
00000302 2.42515683 [1780]
00000303 2.42515683 [1780] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000304 2.42515683 [1780] Valid bits per sample : 16
00000305 2.42515683 [1780]
00000306 2.42515683 [1780] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000307 2.42515683 [1780] wFormatTag : WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE
00000308 2.42515683 [1780] Channels : 8
00000309 2.42515683 [1780] Bits per sample : 16
00000310 2.42515683 [1780] Samples per second : 192000
00000311 2.42515683 [1780] nBlockAlign : 16
00000312 2.42515683 [1780]
00000313 2.42521739 [1780] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckMediaType
00000314 2.42526555 [1780] Media Type Structure
00000315 2.42526555 [1780] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000316 2.42526555 [1780]
00000317 2.42531013 [1780] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000318 2.42531013 [1780]
00000319 2.42536354 [1780]
00000320 2.42536354 [1780] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000321 2.42536354 [1780] subFormat : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_MLP
00000322 2.42536354 [1780]
00000323 2.42541194 [1780]
00000324 2.42541194 [1780] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000325 2.42541194 [1780] Valid bits per sample : 16
00000326 2.42541194 [1780]
00000327 2.42546058 [1780]
00000328 2.42546058 [1780] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000329 2.42546058 [1780] wFormatTag :
00000330 2.42550540 [1780] WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE
00000331 2.42555833 [1780]
00000332 2.42555833 [1780] cbSize : 22
00000333 2.42555833 [1780] nAvgBytesPerSec : 3072000
00000334 2.42555833 [1780] Channels : 8
00000335 2.42555833 [1780] Bits per sample : 16
00000336 2.42555833 [1780] Samples per second : 192000
00000337 2.42555833 [1780] nBlockAlign : 16
00000338 2.42555833 [1780]
00000339 2.42560577 [1780] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckAudioClient
00000340 2.42662287 [1780] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckMediaType WASAPI client refused the format

[Snowknight26]

About EAC3, the sample we already have is a M2TS file but I have troubles to make a bluray structure with tsmuxer (it does not detect the audio stream). If someone has an idea or a BR sample with DD Plus...


Only one I know if is Transformers with a DD+ commentary track. Sample available here (http://stfcc.org/misc/transformers.sample.m2ts). The MPC-HC splitter doesn't see the E-AC3 track though.

[albain]

I found why DTS-HD is not accepted, the sample rate I pushed was not correct. It should be now with this new pack (http://www.mediafire.com/file/thtinrwcnwz/FFDShow_HDbitstream_beta32_pack.zip) (FFDShow updated, MPC splitter updated, same MPC audio renderer)

Also, I know also why the PCM types are refused by the renderer : this is because when FFDShow switches back to PCM mode when the HD bitstream format is refused, it will uncompress the TrueHD track and the PCM stream runs at 192Khz, which is too high.
So you have to enable the resample filter to downsample to 96 or 48khz and it will be accepted.

Or else there is LPCM format but I am not sure that HDMI 1.3 is able to transport more than 96khz uncompressed data.

@Snowknight26 : I will address this problem later to see how to detect the track (maybe haali is able to see it, not gabest's)

[madshi]

Or else there is LPCM format but I am not sure that HDMI 1.3 is able to transport more than 96khz uncompressed data.
It would be great if you could support LPCM bitstream, too. HDMI 1.0 already supported 7.1 192khz.

[tal.aloni]

About EAC3, the sample we already have is a M2TS file but I have troubles to make a bluray structure with tsmuxer (it does not detect the audio stream). If someone has an idea or a BR sample with DD Plus...

"The Sound of High Definition" Blu-Ray Had a few,
I kept "00026.m2ts" which is DD+ 7.1 Channe Test,
I'll try to upload it tonight, if I won't get arrested for sneaking into Nouriel Roubini's lecture this evening.

[albain]

The problem is to transform it to a Bluray structure because TMT won't bitstream with media files, only blurays (disc or folder structure).

Tsmuxer does this conversion (m2ts to BR structure) but does not recognize the EAC3 track.
Maybe there is another tool

Concerning LPCM, ffdshow already supports it, but I don't know when it is used. I *just* have to use the existing support when the input stream is HD bistream

Any 5xxx owner awake ? :thanks:

[tal.aloni]

Tsmuxer does this conversion (m2ts to BR structure) but does not recognize the EAC3 track.
Maybe there is another tool

yes, there is, TSRemux.

[Sebastiii]

I found why DTS-HD is not accepted, the sample rate I pushed was not correct. It should be now with this new pack (http://www.mediafire.com/file/thtinrwcnwz/FFDShow_HDbitstream_beta32_pack.zip) (FFDShow updated, MPC splitter updated, same MPC audio renderer)

Also, I know also why the PCM types are refused by the renderer : this is because when FFDShow switches back to PCM mode when the HD bitstream format is refused, it will uncompress the TrueHD track and the PCM stream runs at 192Khz, which is too high.
So you have to enable the resample filter to downsample to 96 or 48khz and it will be accepted.

Or else there is LPCM format but I am not sure that HDMI 1.3 is able to transport more than 96khz uncompressed data.

@Snowknight26 : I will address this problem later to see how to detect the track (maybe haali is able to see it, not gabest's)

Hi Damien,

Great news, so go to new test :)
My log for version 31 was made with Xonar Driver, if i use ATI HDMI, ffdshow show Bitstream when i move mouse on it (i haven't made log yet) but no sound.

I'll make test tonight, i'm at work, i can make test via TSE, but not on ATI HDMI card and i can't see if AVR show up the light with Xonar lol.

Seb :)

Thx :)

[albain]

Seb, you don't have a webcam starring on your receiver lights ;-) ??

From your logs, indeed the xonar will refuse the official truehd type and ffdshow will try others (including arcsoft), but I think there is a bug on that part because the MPC renderer don't see the updated types that are tried (the official one is still sent). I will check on this.

So a 5xxx is the way to go for now

[Sebastiii]

hi lol :)

I'll make test with ATI :)
I'll post log for DD+ in couple of minutes i think :)
Seb. :)

Vla le Log :)
Log EAC3 Bitstream (http://sebinternet.free.fr/bitstreamEAC3.zip)
Seb.

[albain]

Thanks, I have now brought support to EAC3 and fixed DTS-HD (there was another bug again)

Here is the FFDShow build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mymegtnmytj/ffdshow_rev3128_20091112_dbt_bitstream_beta33.zip)

Those 2 formats are easier to bitstream than TrueHD.

Now : 1 FFDShow bitstream frame = 1 TMT frame for DTS-HD and EAC3, and for TrueHD silences are just not equally spaced

If this still does not work then the problem comes from the MPC audio renderer

[SamuriHL]

I'm up now and as soon as I get the handshaking to play nice I'll give it a shot. Gotta leave for a while in a few minutes but I'll be back later.

[SamuriHL]

Sorry my friend, but, DTS-HD MA is not working for me with the 5870. I get DTS and it detects it completely wrong when mousing over the tray icon.

DTS-HD MA: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d27c5448

[SamuriHL]

TrueHD: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d17b0cb54

Lights are on but no one's home. No audio. But at least there's some lights. :D

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Are these latest beta's aimed at getting HD bitstreaming working (at this stage of development) for the ATI 5xxx cards only, or are you aiming at the Xonar card as well?

I'm a little lost at where we are in the grand scheme of things!

Thanks

[liquidskin76]

@samuriHL,

Are you testing on your ATI 5xxx or Xonar, or both?

Thanks

[SamuriHL]

5870. I'm not testing it with the Xonar at all.

[albain]

Sorry my friend, but, DTS-HD MA is not working for me with the 5870. I get DTS and it detects it completely wrong when mousing over the tray icon.

DTS-HD MA: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d27c5448

Ok, the TrueHD log "sounds" good

Concerning the DTS-HD log, indeed you only get DTS because you don't have the last version of the MPC splitter (which strips off HD blocks) Please use this one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/nnztnyj2mty/MpegSplitter.ax) : register it and use graphstudio with "MPC - Mpeg source" filter.

About the Xonar, it should work with it as arcsoft media types are sent to the driver but Seb tried and didn't any good results.

So to summarize :
- the latest build claims to support HD bitstreaming on radeon 5xxx
- the xonar is supposed to be supported but tests are not good so far (but further tests are needed)
- the 4xxx series is not supported yet

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Thanks for the summary.

[SamuriHL]

Ok, the TrueHD log "sounds" good

Concerning the DTS-HD log, indeed you only get DTS because you don't have the last version of the MPC splitter (which strips off HD blocks) Please use this one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/nnztnyj2mty/MpegSplitter.ax) : register it and use graphstudio with "MPC - Mpeg source" filter.

About the Xonar, it should work with it as arcsoft media types are sent to the driver but Seb tried and didn't any good results.

So to summarize :
- the latest build claims to support HD bitstreaming on radeon 5xxx
- the xonar is supposed to be supported but tests are not good so far (but further tests are needed)
- the 4xxx series is not supported yet

That's odd. I reregistered them this morning with the latest versions. Anyway, I'll try again.

[SamuriHL]

Yea, no. Doing what you suggest hangs GraphStudio, I get no audio at all, and I have to kill the process.

[SamuriHL]

Managed to log what I could for that. This is a DTS-HD MA track run through graphstudio.

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d14998238

[albain]

The DTS HD format is accepted by the renderer

This is weird that graphstudio hangs...

[liquidskin76]

I've been doing some early test on my Xonar however i haven't had chance to test on my av receiver yet so i don't know the true outcome audio wise.

Doing just visual test on graphstudio i'm finding the TrueHD and DTS-HD MA files are playing ok. I'll let you what ffdshow is reporting the output as later (i'll do some test later tonight on my av reciever).

One thing i did notice is that if i have video decoding disabled in ffdshow, and use a decoder like CoreAVC, the audio renderer switches to the default directshow renderer in graphstudio. You have to manual switch renderer, whereas if you have video decoding enabled in ffdshow, the MPC audio renderer is automatically used.

One to note for later maybe?

Thanks

[SamuriHL]

The DTS HD format is accepted by the renderer

This is weird that graphstudio hangs...

Yea I don't get it. And it doesn't work in MPC-HC either. I guess I can try a different movie but I doubt it'll make any difference.

[SamuriHL]

So MPC-HC gives me just DTS (and the tray icon shows it as DD...yeaaaaaa). I tried another DTS-HD MA source in graphstudio and I get the same result. The tray icon shows DTS-HD and that it's bitstreaming but the receiver does nothing and the file hangs graphstudio. I'm sure I have the latest versions of everything you've given us so I don't know.

[albain]

Have you tried to play a regular DTS/DD File and do you get any sound with it ?

Also have you tried TrueHD and DD+ ?

[SamuriHL]

I haven't tried core audio, no. TrueHD didn't do much for me. DD+ crashes graphstudio when I try to select it. sigh. Can't even build the graph on that one. Awesome.

[rica]

I've tried with your THD sample albain.
And i got core ac3 as stereo.
DTS-HD trials didn't work for me.

Samuri, i'd be appreciated if you upload your dtshd sample.

[rica]

So it would be great guys if we give it a go with the same sample files.

[SamuriHL]

I've tried with your THD sample albain.
And i got core ac3 as stereo.
DTS-HD trials didn't work for me.

Samuri, i'd be appreciated if you upload your dtshd sample.

Sample? Yea, about that. :) It's a freaking movie! :) I figure no guts no glory here. I ain't using some wussy couple of hundred megs of sample stuff here! We're talking full on 30 gig m2ts file in a BD structure mounted using VCD!! :D As for TrueHD and EAC, I use the samples albain provided plus a TrueHD movie of my own. I just load up the m2ts from the mounted drive and away we go.

[SamuriHL]

Hey, uh, albain....I had a DTS-HD MA mkv someone must have posted a few days ago sitting in my download dir. So I gave it a shot. Yea, um, I get DTS-HD MA lights on the receiver. No audio, but, here's a log man. :)

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d42ba3caf

[tal.aloni]

as promised, Here is another DD+ sample:

(DD+ 7.1 Channel Test, untouched, From "The Sound of High Definition" Blu-Ray)

http://iknowu.net/files/public/Samples/00026%20-%20DD+%207.1%20Channe%20Test.m2ts

and here is another untouched TrueHD sample:

http://iknowu.net/files/public/Samples/00009%20-%20TrueHD%20Introduction.m2ts

(p.s. I have some DTS-HD MA samples as well)

[GaBBa-Gandalf]

Hi Guys...

I have been following this intressting topic now for few weeks....
It`s amazing what u guys are doing... !

######################################

I have also a HTPC with an iGPU - 9300 (nvidia)...
Unfortunately there are the same problems with the new hd-sound formats.

I read something about how you shouldn't use the haali media splitter... Is that truth?

Which version of all needed tools (MPC-hc, ffdshow tryout, etc.) should I use to test TrueHD or DTS-HD with my system? Before I forget.. I have a Denon avr 2309.

greetz,
GaBBa

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Tested latest beta kit with my Xonar. I get different result when testing through GraphStudio and MPC-HC. Double checked and both are using your version of MPC audio renderer.

MPC-HC

TrueHD

With TrueHD passthrough enabled the file plays ok however i get 2 channel LPCM, which keeps skipping or breaking up. FFDShow reports output as 48000Hz, 6 channels 16-bit integer.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m37e5646f

With TrueHD passthrough disabled, same results. It's not decoding and outputting as LPCM as it normally would do.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m46bd667

DTS-HD MA

With DTS-HD passthrough enabled the file plays ok however i get 2 channel LPCM, which plays ok. FFDShow reports output as 48000Hz, 6 channels 16-bit integer.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2c22e815

With DTS-HD passthrough disabled i get the DTS core as normal. This plays fine.


GraphStudio

TrueHD

With TrueHD passthrough enabled, the file plays ok however i get no audio. My av receiver's display keeps flashing up with 2 channel LPCM every few seconds.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m48ddc2

With TrueHD passthrough disabled, same results. Again it's not decoding and outputting as LPCM as it normally would do.

Here's the logs... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m3cfc598f

DTS-HD MA

With DTS-HD passthrough enabled, same result as TrueHD.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7b5418f6

With DTS-HD passthrough disabled, i get DTS core however no audio. Again my av reciever's display flashes up DTS every few seconds.

Thanks

[albain]

Hi,

@liquidskin : in both cases (TrueHD/DTSHD) the format is refused by your audio driver. Try to communicate with SamuriHL or Sebastii who got it working on their radeon 5xxx (you're using a radeon 5xxx right ?)


The status : FFDShow is okay since yesterday (in the last beta 31 build), for DTSHD, EAC3 and TrueHD. I mean that the bitstream is correct

So if you guys don't get any sound, then the problem comes from the wasapi renderer.

I have built a new one with a different approach (event driver, but I will spare the details). This approach doesn't work on my system but this is a audio driver matter.

Here is the link (http://www.mediafire.com/file/nyyyjjmwjf0/MpcAudioRendererFilter.ax)

[SamuriHL]

I'll give it a shot in just a bit. Will logs help if it doesn't work?

[albain]

I'll give it a shot in just a bit. Will logs help if it doesn't work?

Yes thanks

[SamuriHL]

Lights are on but no sound. :(

DTS-HD MA: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d32c082bc
TrueHD: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d168ce9c5

EAC3 crashes MPC-HC and GraphStudio, so, um, that's ungood. As in just trying to select the file crashes it hardcore. No idea what's up with that.

[albain]

Okay, I have tested on my HTPC and even on regular AC3/DTS files I have no sound although the wasapi mode is correctly set

I should be able to work on this on my own

[SamuriHL]

Ok. Let me know when you want me to run more tests.

[Skinleech]

The tests didn't go well for me. True HD & DDPlus played jerkily as PCM, DTS played but with no sound.

TrueHD 1: http://pastebin.com/fec7ef43
TrueHD 2: http://pastebin.com/d320405a4
DDPlus: http://pastebin.com/fb1e3471
DTS-HD: http://pastebin.com/d7c51ab1e

[SamuriHL]

What are you running for a card and what driver are you using? I'm sure you've mentioned it before but I'm too lazy to look. :)

[Skinleech]

What are you running for a card and what driver are you using? I'm sure you've mentioned it before but I'm too lazy to look. :)

The Xonar with driver set 1775.

[SamuriHL]

I refuse to install that driver. I've seen lots of issues with it. But that's good to know. I tried with my Xonar briefly and got nothing good for results, as well.

[Skinleech]

Really? It's working fine for me, though I do seem to have some handshaking issues. If it happens though, I just fire up RealVNC and refresh my powerstrip 23.976 settings and it's fine.

Seems the Xonar is giving us all the same results which is something I guess.

[SamuriHL]

The handshaking thing is always a problem. I have saved off a complicated fix for it and will try it when I have time. But yea, numerous people have had problems with that driver, and me being lazy hadn't gotten around to installing it yet. So, I didn't bother after I read about all the bitstreaming issues people were having.

[mrcorbo]

Has anyone with a Xonar tried the latest beta with the ArcSoft Renderer?

[SamuriHL]

I haven't. That's a good idea. I'll see what I can do in a bit.

[Skinleech]

Has anyone with a Xonar tried the latest beta with the ArcSoft Renderer?

Nope - but I will just now!

[SamuriHL]

Ah, ok, if you're going to do it I'll hold off so I don't have to switch back to the Xonar.

[Skinleech]

DTS HD played back as DTS. True HD and DDPlus played as PCM.

Albain - would logs be useful at all?

[Jeff Flowerday]

Hi Guys...

I have been following this intressting topic now for few weeks....
It`s amazing what u guys are doing... !

######################################

I have also a HTPC with an iGPU - 9300 (nvidia)...
Unfortunately there are the same problems with the new hd-sound formats.

I read something about how you shouldn't use the haali media splitter... Is that truth?

Which version of all needed tools (MPC-hc, ffdshow tryout, etc.) should I use to test TrueHD or DTS-HD with my system? Before I forget.. I have a Denon avr 2309.

greetz,
GaBBa

Bitstreaming won't work with your iGPU, if that is what you are trying to do? You would need the new 5 series ATI or Xonar HDAV 1.3.

[liquidskin76]

Hi,

@liquidskin : in both cases (TrueHD/DTSHD) the format is refused by your audio driver. Try to communicate with SamuriHL or Sebastii who got it working on their radeon 5xxx (you're using a radeon 5xxx right ?)

@Albain,

No, i'm testing on a Xonar.


DTS HD played back as DTS. True HD and DDPlus played as PCM.

Similar to what i'm getting, however with Albain's MPC audio renderer.

@Skinleech,

See my result in post #9159. Are you seeing the same with Albain's MPC audio renderer, and the Arcsoft renderer?

Cheers

[Skinleech]

lmost, but not quite. I seem to get multichannel PCM on TrueHD, and nothing on DTS-HD using Albain's renderer.

Using Arcsofts, it plays as per my post you quoted.

[GaBBa-Gandalf]

@ Jeff Flowerday

Thanks for your answer ;)

If it really should work with a 5xxx series ATi/AMD card than I would buy that for my htpc...

greetz

GaBBa (From Germany ;))

[rica]

I can't connect ffdshow to MPC audio renderer.

[Andy o]

Bitstreaming won't work with your iGPU, if that is what you are trying to do? You would need the new 5 series ATI or Xonar HDAV 1.3.

Someone here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17515135#post17515135) says he's got DD+ bitstreaming working with an Nvidia GT220 card, which should have the same HDMI device as the 8200/8300 and 9300/9400. Anyone else got DD+ working? I haven't seen it mentioned here, maybe I missed it.

[SamuriHL]

Someone here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17515135#post17515135) says he's got DD+ bitstreaming working with an Nvidia GT220 card, which should have the same HDMI device as the 8200/8300 and 9300/9400. Anyone else got DD+ working? I haven't seen it mentioned here, maybe I missed it.

I've mentioned several times that DD+ crashes MPC-HC and GraphStudio for me. Awesome. :) So no, I haven't gotten that to work.

[madshi]

Someone here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17515135#post17515135) says he's got DD+ bitstreaming working with an Nvidia GT220 card
No, he did not. He's got DD bitstreaming working.

I still don't think that DTS-HD, TrueHD and E-AC3 bitstreaming will ever work on anything other than ATI 5xxx and Xonar (and maybe next year's new NVidia generation), but I'll be happy enough if albain proves me wrong... :p

[SamuriHL]

No, he did not. He's got DD bitstreaming working.

I still don't think that DTS-HD, TrueHD and E-AC3 bitstreaming will ever work on anything other than ATI 5xxx and Xonar (and maybe next year's new NVidia generation), but I'll be happy enough if albain proves me wrong... :p

Have faith. :D

[Andy o]

I've mentioned several times that DD+ crashes MPC-HC and GraphStudio for me. Awesome. :) So no, I haven't gotten that to work.

No, he did not. He's got DD bitstreaming working.

I still don't think that DTS-HD, TrueHD and E-AC3 bitstreaming will ever work on anything other than ATI 5xxx and Xonar (and maybe next year's new NVidia generation), but I'll be happy enough if albain proves me wrong... :p

Yeah, someone pointed that out at that thread. I had the HD-DVD version of Corpse Bride in my head, so I didn't notice the context menu languages/formats.

[SamuriHL]

Yup. No DD+ on that one. DD/DTS bitstreaming has been working for a while now (well, until the latest renderer change anyway). I'm hoping albain has some good ideas on how to fix the renderer so we can get bitstreaming working for HD codecs soon.

[Andy o]

There was some confusion on that thread, on my part as well. Trailergod first said (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17506757#post17506757) he could get DD+ (right now waiting for his reply) and then I asked him what card he was using, then Nimo made that post I linked above in reply, in which he didn't mean DD+, just DD.

[albain]

Hi,

I am in a situation when the old renderer worked (with audio gaps/jitter) at least for AC3 and not the new one and I don't know why (luckily I have both sources):
http://damienbt.free.fr/MpcAudioRendererFilter_old_working.ax

Maybe you can try bitstream with the latest ffdshow I posted, otherwise you could try reclock too

Thanks

[SamuriHL]

Didn't we already try the old renderer and we got no sound? And ReClock won't accept the bitstream formats. So, we're at an impasse.

[mrcorbo]

Yeah, this is something I can test....

Going back to the renderer that was in the beta 20 pack, I can get ac3 to bitstream with audio gaps and jitter, but only when DebugView is running. As before, this behavior is repeatable. Obviously, this is odd behavior. Maybe it's timing related?

My experience with the WASAPI+exclusive implementations of J. River Media Center, Foobar and ReClock show that WASAPI+exclusive is very sensitive to buffer size. To the degree that a buffer that is 1 ms too large can break it in J. River's implementation.

[SamuriHL]

James said the same thing in relation to ReClock, so, that's very possible as to what's going on.

[mrcorbo]

BTW - This last "old" renderer skips much worse than the beta 20 one. It still only bitstreams when DebugView is running, though.

[rica]

Hi,

I am in a situation when the old renderer worked (with audio gaps/jitter) at least for AC3 and not the new one and I don't know why (luckily I have both sources):
http://damienbt.free.fr/MpcAudioRendererFilter_old_working.ax

Maybe you can try bitstream with the latest ffdshow I posted, otherwise you could try reclock too

Thanks

I'm really confused.
Why do i try non-working renderers again?

[albain]

I'm really confused.
Why do i try non-working renderers again?

Well because FFDShow is now fixed : TMT and ffdshow streams are identical. We just miss a working renderer.

But now I remember that the old renderer was not able to dynamically change of media type.

James from Slysoft already gave me some tips. I also have a working sample app (but which does not use directshow)

Also if someone has hints/sample code I take it

Meanwhile I will go on trying different things until a clear sound comes out

[SamuriHL]

Hopefully you're able to figure it out soon.

[mark0077]

Hi thanks all for working so hard

it just strikes me though that should it be so tricky to get all of this working. What I mean is there not any specs available. Is this the reason why it is down to trial and error.

Keep up the good work albain

[SamuriHL]

The fact that he got the bitstreaming support done is remarkable. It's just now how to pass through the bitstream to the receiver. For that you need a WASAPI audio renderer. That's easier said than done. He's working on it. :) Quite simply, what albain has accomplished so far is nothing short of amazing.

[rica]

Nobody is helping albain but madhsi and james gives support to him.
So we are waiting as passive testers for the time being.

[SamuriHL]

Unfortunately I don't know anything about this kind of code. Madshi, James, and albain are the experts here. So yes, we're just waiting unfortunately. Wish I had the time to learn this code.

[albain]

Thank you all for your encouragements, but we still lack of results

Here is an updated and working version (at least for AC3/DTS) of MPC renderer

Actually wasapi implementation is buggy : it may be due to the drivers or to an incompatibility butween wasapi with event driver mode (which is the easiest to implement) and directshow.

Anyway, here it is (http://damienbt.free.fr/MPCRenderer.zip)

There are 2 versions : one debug and one release (that should avoid glitches)

THank you for your feedbacks !

EDIT : I have an audio delay on this one but no more glitches. I will fix this later.

[Skinleech]

Hi albain.

Thanks for yet again more excellent work. Here are my results with the new renderer:

TrueHD: The sample played jerkily, and in PCM: http://pastebin.com/f34f6be21
DD Plus: As above: http://pastebin.com/f7d40474e
DTS HD MA (from m2ts): The file played, but I got no audio: http://pastebin.com/f702b8304
DTS HD MA (from mkv): The file played as PCM, but halli splitter loaded rather than your mpeg splitter: http://pastebin.com/f38172210

Thanks!

[albain]

Thanks but you have a xonar right ?

It seems that the xonar will refuse the arcsoft media types (!).

I believe that there is additional security rules in the audio driver that will refuse the connection if for example the process is not protected or something like that (because otherwise FFDShow will try different media types including the arcsoft's ones).

Sorry, but for now I need a radeon 5xxx owner.

Maybe this is fixable for the xonar : for that I am still trying to improve the dumper tool to retrieve more information from the *well known player*

[Skinleech]

Yep, I have a Xonar. Can't say I'm surprised that it's causing problems!

I will keep my eyes peeled on the thread.

[rica]

..for now I need a radeon 5xxx owner.

Now i'm here; gonna try. :)

[SamuriHL]

I'm awake now. Give me a minute to switch over to the ATI card. :)

[rica]

albain, your sample thd m2ts gives dolby digital but ffdshow output gives only 2 channels.

Btw i created some sample m2ts files via eac3to+tsmuxer but ffdshow never accepted to connect to MPCAudio Renderer (with those files) while your sample m2ts (thd) file works; dunno why?

Would you please remux your dtshd.mkv to m2ts?

[SamuriHL]

TrueHD: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d1931dda2
DTS-HD MA: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d5ef51a85

TrueHD shows me lights. DTS-HD MA shows me DTS. Neither give me audio. This is the debug version. I can try the release version now but I'm not hopeful.

[SamuriHL]

Release version made no difference.

[SamuriHL]

rica, converting the mkv's to m2ts is academic. Get tsMuxer.

[rica]

rica, converting the mkv's to m2ts is academic. Get tsMuxer.

I don't think you read my previous post, did you?

[SamuriHL]

I don't think you read my previous post, did you?

Not sure I follow. I remuxed the DTS-HD MA mkv that was posted around the 6th to m2ts and it's fine. What's the issue exactly?

[albain]

Something is wrong. I don't see many traces from MPC renderer. Is MPC renderer really used at the end ?
Please use graphstudio with the MPC splitter that I released in the last pack, thanks


Could you try with this one (http://damienbt.free.fr/MpcAudioRendererFilter_2.zip)

Thanks

[SamuriHL]

Those logs were with MPC. I've tried with GraphStudio with the same setup and it gave the same results, so, that's why I didn't post GS logs. I'll try with your new filter now.

[albain]

Those logs were with MPC. I've tried with GraphStudio with the same setup and it gave the same results, so, that's why I didn't post GS logs. I'll try with your new filter now.

Thank you !

[SamuriHL]

Same thing. TrueHD lights are on but no one's home.

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d79905c1e

[SamuriHL]

DTS-HD MA...it's an mkv converted to m2ts and played in GS.

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d518707c6

DTS light, no audio.

[rica]

Not sure I follow. I remuxed the DTS-HD MA mkv that was posted around the 6th to m2ts and it's fine. What's the issue exactly?

OK, restarting PC fixed the connecting issue :)

truhd > Dolby Digital light on > with sound (ffdshow output gives two channels only)

dtshd-ma > no light on > without sound

dts (core) > DTS light on > with sound (ffdshow output gives
two channels only)

EDIT: btw- those trials made with ex-filter; didn't see new update while writing :)

Now i'm trying the new one.

[mrcorbo]

I'm getting mixed results here on the formats I am able to test.

AC3 passthrough has the same behavior as before with me having to check "output strings to debugger" and run DebugView to get bitstreaming to work. One or the other of these does not work, it requires both. When it *does* bitstream, though, it now seems to be mostly glitch-free with maybe a couple of skips when first starting playback.

TrueHD, unsurprisingly, falls back to decoding and outputting PCM. With my sample, it is able to play back the decoded PCM audio as 5.1 channels (matching my speaker configuration) and sounds fine. No distortion, no glitches.

DD+ and DTS-MA also fall back to PCM, but play back with a lot of distortion.

Another odd behavior pops up when trying to test with a file with an MP3 audio track. FFDShow won't connect directly to the MPC audio renderer and instead inserts the WMAaudio Encoder/Decoder combo in between. Deleting these filters from the graph makes the FFDshow filter connect to the renderer directly. :confused: Either connected directly or with the WMAudio filters in between there is distortion of the audio during playback.

[rica]

Here are the results:

truhd > Dolby Digital light is on > with sound (ffdshow output gives 5.1 even it shows 2 channel output in ffdshow properties page) _this is maybe comes from using thd+ac3 file (created by eac3to) in tsmuxer?

dtshd-ma > no light is on > without sound

dts (core) > DTS light is on > with sound (ffdshow output gives 5.1 even it shows 2 channel output in ffdshow properties page)

Seems there is a conflict between the results of mine and samuri?

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/4803/51079204.png

[SamuriHL]

Post logs. That's the only way to know for sure what's going on.

[albain]

Okay, there is too much delay between each buffer feeding on the renderer side (FFDShow takes too much time to parse the bistream) so the renderer should not sleep so much too

I have adjusted this time dynamically according to FFDShow parsing

http://damienbt.free.fr/MpcAudioRendererFilter_3.zip

Please try this one with then without debugview

@Rica : I suspect that the HD formats are refused by your audio driver. Please post the debugview trace to confirm this

[Brazil2]

Here is another DD+ sample:

(DD+ 7.1 Channel Test, untouched, From "The Sound of High Definition" Blu-Ray)
http://iknowu.net/files/public/Samples/00026%20-%20DD+%207.1%20Channe%20Test.m2ts
This sample seems to have problems. MPC-HC can play it fine but it stutters a lot with many other players.

MediaInfo reports the audio to have 5 channels:
Audio
ID : 4352 (0x1100)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : E-AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Duration : 1mn 34s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 024 Kbps
Channel(s) : 5 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Stream size : 11.5 MiB (9%)

eac3to reports the audio to be AC3 5.1, the track not to be clean and can't extract/convert the audio:
M2TS, 1 video track, 1 audio track, 0:01:34, 60i /1.001
1: h264/AVC, 1080i60 /1.001 (16:9)
2: AC3, 5.1 channels, 640kbps, 48khz
Track 2 is used for destination file "EAC3.wavs".
[a02] The Nero decoder doesn't seem to work, will use libav instead.
[a02] Extracting audio track number 2...
[a02] Decoding with libav/ffmpeg...
[a02] Remapping channels...
[a02] Reducing depth from 64 to 24 bits...
[a02] Writing WAVs...
[a02] This track is not clean. <WARNING>
[a02] [libav] Dependent substream is not implemented. If you want to help, update your FFmpeg version to the newest one from SVN. If the problem still occurs, it means that your file has extension which has not been tested due to a lack of samples exhibiting this feature. Upload a sample of the audio from this file to ftp://upload.mplayerhq.hu/incoming and contact the ffmpeg-devel mailing list. <WARNING>
[a02] [libav] invalid header <WARNING>
[a02] The libav decoder reported an error while decoding. <ERROR>
Aborted at file position 1048576. <ERROR>

And TsMuxer simply doesn't recognize the audio track.

Is any other 7.1 DD+ sample with speakers recognition available ?

[rica]

@Rica : I suspect that the HD formats are refused by your audio driver. Please post the debugview trace to confirm this

Ok but please remind me how to get debugview traces?

Or samuri?

[madshi]

This sample seems to have problems. MPC-HC can play it fine but it stutters a lot with many other players.

MediaInfo reports the audio to have 5 channels.

eac3to reports the audio to be AC3 5.1, the track not to be clean and can't extract/convert the audio.

And TsMuxer simply doesn't recognize the audio track.

Is any other 7.1 DD+ sample with speakers recognition available ?
You should simply forget that 7.1 DD+ ever existed. It's totally useless and AFAIK has not been used on *ANY* Blu-Ray disc out there (except for a Dolby demo disc). And that's why no software (which includes eac3to) can handle 7.1 DD+, because it's simply not worth it to add support for it.

[tal.aloni]

Brazil2,
1. most importantly: this track is untouched from the Blu-Ray.
2. madshi already said it.
3. Try TSRemux, working for me.

[albain]

Ok but please remind me how to get debugview traces?

Or samuri?

You have to create an "allowDPRINTF" DWORD value set to 1 in
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\GNU\ffdshow

Then run debugview (http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb896647.aspx) while you play the file

[rica]

You have to create an "allowDPRINTF" DWORD value set to 1 in
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\GNU\ffdshow

Then run debugview (http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb896647.aspx) while you play the file

Thanks.

[SamuriHL]

Okay, there is too much delay between each buffer feeding on the renderer side (FFDShow takes too much time to parse the bistream) so the renderer should not sleep so much too

I have adjusted this time dynamically according to FFDShow parsing

http://damienbt.free.fr/MpcAudioRendererFilter_3.zip

Please try this one with then without debugview

@Rica : I suspect that the HD formats are refused by your audio driver. Please post the debugview trace to confirm this

I'll try this at half time. Football is on so can't interrupt that. :D

[albain]

No problem, I hope that your team will win so that you get enough luck to make this new build working :-)

[SamuriHL]

No problem, I hope that your team will win so that you get enough luck to make this new build working :-)

Thanks. They're losing now. And they're losing to my wife's favorite team. SIGH. :D I'll get to testing soon and get you some new logs.

[albain]

I saw that in 5 days the passive radeon 5750 is released, I will get one of those as soon as available

[SamuriHL]

Oh, I see how it is. String us along til YOUR card come out. :p ROFLMAO! :D

[albain]

Yes I like to share the work, 31 betas this is a record lol

[SamuriHL]

Definitely not a problem for us testing it. You make it easy. Compared to the stuff I do at work, this is child's play. :)

[rica]

Here are the logs (created using previous MPC audio renderer):

dtshd sample log (i had to terminate the graphstudio)

http://www.mediafire.com/?4t5yzvgkmlm



thd sample log:

http://www.mediafire.com/?5ntv4zwezzm

[SamuriHL]

Ran a quick GraphStudio of a DTS-HD MA m2ts track. No change. DTS light, no audio. Did not get to try it without debugview running.

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d3f99f7d

[mrcorbo]

I managed to get AC3 to bitstream with this renderer without DebugView running a couple of times (I checked/unchecked output debug strings and got it to work once with and once without) but the results were inconsistent and now I can't reproduce at all. I will load Realtek-sourced HDMI drivers to see if the results are different. When bitreaming worked it seemed glitch-free.

AC3 with output strings to debugger checked:

Result: Stream is recognized, audio signal rapidly cuts in and out constantly.

http://pastebin.com/d60e8a57f

MP3 decoded to PCM:

It now connects directly to renderer, but will not play.

Generates the following log (pasted here since it's relatively short).

[9880] TffdshowDecAudio::StartStreaming
[9880] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin::NewSegment
[9880] TffdshowDecAudio::NewSegment
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckAudioClient
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckFormatChanged
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckAudioClient First initialization of the audio renderer
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::InitAudioClient
[9880]
[9880] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
[9880] subFormat : OTHER
[9880]
[9880]
[9880] wSamplesPerBlock : 0
[9880] Valid bits per sample : 0
[9880]
[9880]
[9880] WAVEFORMATEX :
[9880] wFormatTag :
[9880] PCM
[9880]
[9880] cbSize : 22
[9880] nAvgBytesPerSec : 176400
[9880] Channels : 2
[9880] Bits per sample : 16
[9880] Samples per second : 44100
[9880] nBlockAlign : 4
[9880]
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::InitAudioClient format supported
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::GetBufferSize
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::InitAudioClient failed (0x80070057)
[9880] CMpcAudioRenderer::Run Error on check audio client
[9880] TffdshowDecAudio::BeginFlush
[9880] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin::EndFlush
[9880] TffdshowDecAudio::EndFlush
[9880] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin::NewSegment
[9880] TffdshowDecAudio::NewSegment

True HD, EAC3 and DTS-MA all had the same result as before.

[albain]

Thanks, something is still wrong in the implementation

Another shot ?

http://damienbt.free.fr/MpcAudioRendererFilter_4.zip

@Mcorbo This one should also fixed your progressive cuts. For now I haven't work on PCM (it should be not very difficult)
Thanks

[SamuriHL]

Will give it a try soon. My game should be done within the hour.

[whurlston]

I saw that in 5 days the passive radeon 5750 is released, I will get one of those as soon as available

Wow. I was about to order a 5750 tomorrow. Looks like I'll wait a couple of days.

[SamuriHL]

Wow. I was about to order a 5750 tomorrow. Looks like I'll wait a couple of days.

Yea, that would definitely make a good card for an HTPC.

[SamuriHL]

Went for TrueHD in GS this time. THD lights came on, no audio as before.

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d3d4bf7e7

[GaBBa-Gandalf]

Sorry that I have to ask again, but for me it isn't really clear...

Does the hd-sound (dts-hd & truehd) works perfectly with the ati 5xxx series?

GaBBa

[SamuriHL]

Not yet. The audio renderer portion is still an issue. However, the bitstreaming support in the latest ffdshow tryout should be good. Just gotta get it to the receiver.

[albain]

. The delays are still incorrect, I have to work on this.

I will work on this tomorrow

thanks again for your tests

[SamuriHL]

Thanks for the work on this.

[mrcorbo]

Thanks, something is still wrong in the implementation

Another shot ?

http://damienbt.free.fr/MpcAudioRendererFilter_4.zip

@Mcorbo This one should also fixed your progressive cuts. For now I haven't work on PCM (it should be not very difficult)
Thanks

I tried the Realtek drivers with the previous renderer and the results were similar (slightly worse, actually).

Now I'm back to the ATI-sourced drivers and with this latest renderer the stuttering is gone when using DebugView. Also found that DebugView only needs to be running when playback is started to get bitstreaming to work. Once the stream is playing I can close DebugView and it will continue to work.

Without Debugview, playing back the graph in GraphStudio will still not bitstream on the initial attempt. However, if I hit stop and then play again bitstreaming works. This is repeatable.

[albain]

Hi,

here is a new one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/4yniyzztiwj/MPCAudioRenderer.zip) that should solve these buffer delays problem.

There are 2 versions : 1 debug and 1 release version

Thanks

[SamuriHL]

Checking now.

[SamuriHL]

Nope. No change. I'll post logs if you need them, but, testing the release version with TrueHD and DTS-HD MA tracks I get exactly the same situation as before. DTS only light, no audio. TrueHD light, no audio.

[albain]

I have another hope on the dumper tool to retrieve the buffering values that I need for wasapi

Could you post the logs for truehd ? (I need those to check the delays) Thanks

Also maybe the 5xxx drivers are buggy, there is no compatible & working bitstream player yet

This is the reason why the dumper is still useful : with the right values, if the renderer work with the xonar and not on the ati then the ati driver is faulty

[SamuriHL]

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d5abd370d

TrueHD with debug renderer.

[SamuriHL]

Also, has anyone used Process Hacker before? It's a source forge task manager replacement. On 32 bit it says it can unprotect and protect processes. Might be useful.

[Skinleech]

Also, has anyone used Process Hacker before? It's a source forge task manager replacement. On 32 bit it says it can unprotect and protect processes. Might be useful.

I'll give it a blast, but looks like it prob won't unprotect on 64 bit.

[SamuriHL]

I'll give it a blast, but looks like it prob won't unprotect on 64 bit.

Yea, that was my thought, too. It doesn't seem to even show the options on 64 bit from what I can see. But, it's at least another tool that the 32 bit users can play with.

[albain]

Hi,

thanks to Sebastii we have the new logs, this will help to make bitstream work for the xonar

The same waveformat tag is used for DTSHD,TrueHD and EAC3
More insteresting :KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_DIGITAL is used for all bitstream formats (and I didn't try that one in my betas).

One weird thing : IAudioClient is loaded but no IAudioRenderClient is raised (loaded from IAudioClient), which is necessary for wasapi. So maybe wasapi is not used after all (asio ?). I am lacking of skills on that part

Any expert point of view ?
I will build a new FFDShow with this new structure in output


For all : TrueHD/DTSHD/EAC3
Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
Sub type : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_DIGITAL

TrueHD
WAVEFORMATEX
wFormatTag : 577
Channels : 8
Bits per sample : 16
Samples per second :192000
nBlockAlign : 16


DTSHD MA
WAVEFORMATEX
wFormatTag : 577
Channels : 8
Bits per sample : 16
Samples per second :192000
nBlockAlign : 16

DTSHD Hires
WAVEFORMATEX
wFormatTag : 577
Channels : 8
Bits per sample : 16
Samples per second :192000
nBlockAlign : 16

EAC3
WAVEFORMATEX
wFormatTag : 577
Channels : 2
Bits per sample : 16
Samples per second :192000
nBlockAlign : 4

[SamuriHL]

Fascinating. I wish I had the knowledge you're looking for. I'm glad his new log helped you though. Maybe it'll help the 5xxx bitstreaming, as well. If they're not using WASAPI excl mode, though, how are they bypassing the windows audio stuff?

[Sebastiii]

Great news :)
Coooooooool :)
Seb.

[madshi]

Fascinating. I wish I had the knowledge you're looking for. I'm glad his new log helped you though. Maybe it'll help the 5xxx bitstreaming, as well. If they're not using WASAPI excl mode, though, how are they bypassing the windows audio stuff?
The windows audio stuff can't do damage to bitstream. Unless you suggest that they decode the bitstream, process the PCM data and then recompress to TrueHD/DTS-HD bitstream on the fly... ;)

[SamuriHL]

The windows audio stuff can't do damage to bitstream. Unless you suggest that they decode the bitstream, process the PCM data and then recompress to TrueHD/DTS-HD bitstream on the fly... ;)

No, I'm not suggesting that. However, if that's the case then we shouldn't need an audio renderer using wasapi excl mode.....right?

[mrcorbo]

Fascinating. I wish I had the knowledge you're looking for. I'm glad his new log helped you though. Maybe it'll help the 5xxx bitstreaming, as well. If they're not using WASAPI excl mode, though, how are they bypassing the windows audio stuff?

S/PDIF bitstream output has worked with standard renderers all along. I'd expect the new formats are just an extension of that functionality.

A WASAPI+exclusive renderer may still be a way for devices that don't have explicit support to bitstream the new HD formats (by spoofing as Multichannel PCM). I loaded up the old beta 9 build and even with all the changes to the renderer this still gives me a stream out of my 4870 that is detected as TrueHD by my receiver. It doesn't make any sound, but it's something. :) Also, an open source WASAPI+exclusive renderer is a worthy project for its own sake.

[SamuriHL]

S/PDIF bitstream output has worked with standard renderers all along. I'd expect the new formats are just an extension of that functionality.

A WASAPI+exclusive renderer may still be a way for devices that don't have explicit support to bitstream the new HD formats (by spoofing as Multichannel PCM). I loaded up the old beta 9 build and even with all the changes to the renderer this still gives me a stream out of my 4870 that is detected as TrueHD by my receiver. It doesn't make any sound, but it's something. :) Also, an open source WASAPI+exclusive renderer is a worthy project for its own sake.

I would agree in theory, however, the wasapi excl renderer is complicating things right now when we should be trying to simplify. First rule of development...simplify simplify simplify. (Henry David Thorough was a genius and ahead of his time, I tell you. :D) If we don't NEED it right now, I suggest maybe we do without it for now. If that's possible.

[madshi]

I would agree in theory, however, the wasapi excl renderer is complicating things right now when we should be trying to simplify. First rule of development...simplify simplify simplify. (Henry David Thorough was a genius and ahead of his time, I tell you. :D) If we don't NEED it right now, I suggest maybe we do without it for now. If that's possible.
I guess that albain thought WASAPI exclusive mode would be necessary to bitstream TrueHD/DTS-HD. Now if it's not that simplifies things, of course. But for LPCM + FLAC etc playback it would still be very nice to have WASAPI exclusive mode.

[whurlston]

I loaded up the old beta 9 build and even with all the changes to the renderer this still gives me a stream out of my 4870 that is detected as TrueHD by my receiver. It doesn't make any sound, but it's something. :) I know I got these results previously but I can't get them now for some reason. Which driver are you using?

[SamuriHL]

I guess that albain thought WASAPI exclusive mode would be necessary to bitstream TrueHD/DTS-HD. Now if it's not that simplifies things, of course. But for LPCM + FLAC etc playback it would still be very nice to have WASAPI exclusive mode.

Absolutely agree that wasapi excl would be nice for LPCM, but, in order to get past the bitstreaming hurdles it might make sense to forget about it for the moment and revisit it when bitstreaming support is done. Is there a way to test this theory? What audio renderer could I use to try bitstreaming without wasapi excl mode? It'd still need to know about the bitstream types and pass them, right? So, I'm guessing we still need some custom renderer to do this? (As you can probably tell, my knowledge on this stuff is pretty much near 0. :))

[SamuriHL]

Well, removing the MPC audio renderer that albain gave us and using MPC-HC's default (output to system default), I get the exact same results as with the custom renderer, except, in the case of DTS-HD MA, I actually get DTS core audio bitstreamed. So no audio in TrueHD, but, the TrueHD light comes on. So it would seem that you are correct that wasapi excl does not seem to be necessary, but, there's still a bug somewhere preventing it from working. And why is it only seeing DTS on DTS-HD MA tracks?

[mrcorbo]

Well, removing the MPC audio renderer that albain gave us and using MPC-HC's default (output to system default), I get the exact same results as with the custom renderer, except, in the case of DTS-HD MA, I actually get DTS core audio bitstreamed. So no audio in TrueHD, but, the TrueHD light comes on. So it would seem that you are correct that wasapi excl does not seem to be necessary, but, there's still a bug somewhere preventing it from working. And why is it only seeing DTS on DTS-HD MA tracks?

Interesting results. Clearly there's still a missing ingredient or two. Still, the fact that a normal renderer can get a TrueHD syream through (even a malformed one) is encouraging, though

[SamuriHL]

Interesting results. Clearly there's still a missing ingredient or two. Still, the fact that a normal renderer can get a TrueHD syream through (even a malformed one) is encouraging, though

Yea, that was my thought, too. I figured it couldn't hurt to try it. And sure enough, the TrueHD light lit up just fine. So that would indicate the current issue isn't a timing problem in the custom renderer I would think. Something else seems to be awry here. Hopefully by being able to eliminate the custom renderer, albain can figure it out.

[rica]

For THD i get DolbyDigital light and sound.

Here is the log:

http://www.mediafire.com/?wvyvanmxoo4

Sample:

[4424] TffdshowDecAudio::deliverSampleBistream Delivering IEC sample format type 1 - sample size 2560 - buffer length 6144
00000106 0.06650028 [4424] Media Type Structure
00000107 0.06650028 [4424] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000108 0.06650028 [4424] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000109 0.06650028 [4424]
00000110 0.06650028 [4424] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000111 0.06650028 [4424] subFormat : {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
00000112 0.06650028 [4424]
00000113 0.06650028 [4424] wSamplesPerBlock : 0
00000114 0.06650028 [4424] Valid bits per sample : 0
00000115 0.06650028 [4424]
00000116 0.06650028 [4424] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000117 0.06650028 [4424] wFormatTag : Dolby AC3 SPDIF
00000118 0.06650028 [4424] Channels : 2
00000119 0.06650028 [4424] Bits per sample : 16
00000120 0.06650028 [4424] Samples per second : 48000
00000121 0.06650028 [4424] nBlockAlign : 4
00000122 0.06650028 [4424]
00000123 0.06689384 [4424] Write 3236 bytes (809 frames), total available 3236 bytes, frame size 4 bytes, maximum size in buffer 2048 frames
00000124 0.06696528 [4424] CMpcAudioRenderer::DoRenderSampleWasapi Sleep2 for 21 ms
00000125 0.08739735 [4424] Write 2908 bytes (727 frames), total available 3888 bytes, frame size 4 bytes, maximum size in buffer 2048 frames
00000126 0.08768014 [4424] Subframe : 218,

[SamuriHL]

According to your log, it isn't detecting that it's a THD track. The second line says something about "lossless check failed". I would maybe try a different track?

[albain]

Well, removing the MPC audio renderer that albain gave us and using MPC-HC's default (output to system default), I get the exact same results as with the custom renderer, except, in the case of DTS-HD MA, I actually get DTS core audio bitstreamed. So no audio in TrueHD, but, the TrueHD light comes on. So it would seem that you are correct that wasapi excl does not seem to be necessary, but, there's still a bug somewhere preventing it from working. And why is it only seeing DTS on DTS-HD MA tracks?

This is interesting but in that case I don't understand why the default renderer wouldn't give any sound.
I will release a custom version of ffdshow that output the same media structure as TMT.
I hope that it will work with arcsoft renderer and confirm that ffdshow implementation is correct
To use it you will have to register asaudiorenderer.dll file (with regsvr32) and it will appear in the renderers list

@Rica : do you have more logs before the beginning point because it seems that ffsdshow switched back to AC3 core which happens if the output filter (renderer) will refuse the bitstream format. But I can confirm that ffdshow sees the true hd frames because of all the major frame/subframe traces (specific to truehd)

[rica]

According to your log, it isn't detecting that it's a THD track. The second line says something about "lossless check failed". I would maybe try a different track?

I used albain's sample here and used dpinpurr and graphstudio.

[rica]

@Rica : do you have more logs before the beginning point because it seems that ffsdshow switched back to AC3 core which happens if the output filter (renderer) will refuse the bitstream format. But I can confirm that ffdshow sees the true hd frames because of all the major frame/subframe traces (specific to truehd)

I will create another log as well.
But if it works i'll return back to Vista SP1 and TMT2; i mean can i use TMT audio renderer with your ffdshow?

Another question albain: what if i give it a go with a pure thd (without an ac3 core) like an HD-DVD track?

EDIT: as for the second q; sorry... I haven't noticed your response to samuri.

[SamuriHL]

I used albain's sample here and used dpinpurr and graphstudio.

Hmmm. I guess I'm seriously confused as to what you're trying to do. dpinpurr isn't necessary to see if a file will bitstream using ffdshow. It's only needed for the hook tool.

[SamuriHL]

This is interesting but in that case I don't understand why the default renderer wouldn't give any sound.
I will release a custom version of ffdshow that output the same media structure as TMT.
I hope that it will work with arcsoft renderer and confirm that ffdshow implementation is correct
To use it you will have to register asaudiorenderer.dll file (with regsvr32) and it will appear in the renderers list



It's worth a shot. I can certainly try it.

[rica]

Hmmm. I guess I'm seriously confused as to what you're trying to do. dpinpurr isn't necessary to see if a file will bitstream using ffdshow. It's only needed for the hook tool.

I know but it was just a trial :)

[albain]

In Ffdshow I strip off the ac3 blocks already (as well as tmt).
For dtshd this is different as the dts core is complementary to hd blocks

Concerning arcsoft renderer I don't think it holds any protection but I may be wrong.

[SamuriHL]

So, I try to use the ArcSoft renderer with what I have now. I get some freaky results. ffdshow defaults back to libavcodec and decodes it to LPCM. I'm guessing it no likey the fact that I'm using an ATI card with it. :D I guess I'll have to switch to the Xonar to try this.

[SamuriHL]

With the Default DirectSound device renderer, however, I get TrueHD lights and no audio in GS.

[SamuriHL]

And even with the Xonar set as default device, it defaults back to libavcodec and decodes to LPCM with the arcsoft renderer.

[rica]

Given it a go with Arcsoft AR (of TMT3) in SP2.

No light, no sound but the log is interesting i suppose.

http://www.mediafire.com/?yj2nmwnndfn

[Skinleech]

And even with the Xonar set as default device, it defaults back to libavcodec and decodes to LPCM with the arcsoft renderer.

THis is what I saw when I tired the arcsoft renderer a day or 2 back.

[SamuriHL]

THis is what I saw when I tired the arcsoft renderer a day or 2 back.

I haven't looked at a log on this yet but my gut feeling is that the log will tell us the renderer refused the bitstream. I guess we have to wait for albain's new version.

[SamuriHL]

00000046 0.01536511 [4872] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat :
the output sample format (compressed stream to bitstream) Bitstream Dolby True HD is not accepted by the renderer for codec bitstream Dolby True HD


Yup. That sucks.

[Skinleech]

Here are mine: the exact same message is contained within.

TrueHD: http://pastebin.com/m6b5b174e
DTS-HD MA: http://pastebin.com/m73e61917

[SamuriHL]

Yea, no renderer I've tried wants to play nice. I tried the Cyberlink PDVD9 audio renderer. Nearly keeled over from the horrifying noise coming out of the speakers. sigh. :D Actually, check this out from the PDVD9 renderer:


00000043 0.02003592 [4740] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat :
the output sample format (compressed stream to bitstream) Bitstream Dolby True HD is accepted by the renderer for codec bitstream Dolby True HD


Fascinating.

[rica]

A little bit more detais from the log:


00000000 0.00000000 [5504] TffdshowDecAudio::StartStreaming
00000001 0.00047527 [5504] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin::NewSegment
00000002 0.00051508 [5504] TffdshowDecAudio::NewSegment
00000003 0.00444575 [5504] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat for codec AC3 s/pdif with sample format 16
00000004 0.00452076 [5504] Media Type Structure
00000005 0.00452076 [5504] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000006 0.00452076 [5504] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000007 0.00452076 [5504]
00000008 0.00452076 [5504] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000009 0.00452076 [5504] subFormat : {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
00000010 0.00452076 [5504]
00000011 0.00452076 [5504] wSamplesPerBlock : 0
00000012 0.00452076 [5504] Valid bits per sample : 0
00000013 0.00452076 [5504]
00000014 0.00452076 [5504] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000015 0.00452076 [5504] wFormatTag : Dolby AC3 SPDIF
00000016 0.00452076 [5504] Channels : 2
00000017 0.00452076 [5504] Bits per sample : 16
00000018 0.00452076 [5504] Samples per second : 48000
00000019 0.00452076 [5504] nBlockAlign : 4
00000020 0.00452076 [5504]
00000021 0.00464878 [5504] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat : the output sample format (compressed stream to bitstream) ac3 is accepted by the renderer for codec AC3 s/pdif
00000022 0.00468872 [5504] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin : switching codec from liba52 to AC3 s/pdif
00000023 0.00472295 [5504] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin::Receive : Initialize audio codec AC3 s/pdif
00000024 0.00488952 [5504] TaudioCodecBitstream::init
00000025 0.00496669 [5504] Major frame :320
00000026 0.00500776 [5504] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat for codec bitstream Dolby True HD with sample format 256
00000027 0.00507083 [5504] Media Type Structure
00000028 0.00507083 [5504] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000029 0.00507083 [5504] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000030 0.00507083 [5504]
00000031 0.00507083 [5504] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000032 0.00507083 [5504] subFormat : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_MLP
00000033 0.00507083 [5504]
00000034 0.00507083 [5504] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000035 0.00507083 [5504] Valid bits per sample : 16
00000036 0.00507083 [5504]
00000037 0.00507083 [5504] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000038 0.00507083 [5504] wFormatTag : WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE
00000039 0.00507083 [5504] Channels : 6
00000040 0.00507083 [5504] Bits per sample : 16
00000041 0.00507083 [5504] Samples per second : 192000
00000042 0.00507083 [5504] nBlockAlign : 12
00000043 0.00507083 [5504]
00000044 0.00510987 [5504] TaudioParser::getSupportedFormat Official format not supported, trying {EB27CEC4-163E-4CA3-8B74-8E25F91B517E}
00000045 0.00514639 [5504] TaudioParser::getSupportedFormat Second format not supported, trying {4288B843-610B-4E15-A53B-43007FCFF614}
00000046 0.00518048 [5504] TaudioParser::getSupportedFormat Third format not supported
00000047 0.00521854 [5504] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat : the output sample format (compressed stream to bitstream) Bitstream Dolby True HD is not accepted by the renderer for codec bitstream Dolby True HD
00000048 0.00525199 [5504] TaudioParser::getCodecIdFromStream truehd
00000049 0.00528705 [5504] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin : switching codec from AC3 s/pdif to truehd
00000050 0.00532065 [5504] TffdshowDecAudioInputPin::Receive : Initialize audio codec truehd
00000051 0.00747763 [5504] Subframe : 166,
00000052 0.00751702 [5504] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat for codec bitstream Dolby True HD with sample format 256
00000053 0.00764008 [5504] Media Type Structure
00000054 0.00764008 [5504] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000055 0.00764008 [5504] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000056 0.00764008 [5504]
00000057 0.00764008 [5504] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000058 0.00764008 [5504] subFormat : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_MLP
00000059 0.00764008 [5504]
00000060 0.00764008 [5504] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000061 0.00764008 [5504] Valid bits per sample : 16

[Skinleech]

That is pretty interesting. And that's not you using the bitstream patch that was supposed to come out a week or so back I guess?

[SamuriHL]

PDVD9 bitstream full version comes out this Friday. The patch won't come out until the 27th. You like that? :) So no, this is not a bitstreaming version of PDVD9.

@rica, yea, your renderer told you where to go and it wasn't nice. LOL :)

[SamuriHL]

@albain

When you get a chance, check out this log. This is a TrueHD file played through the PDVD9 audio renderer in GS. I did NOT get TrueHD lights on the receiver, but, I did get LPCM audio (although it was horribly garbled and nearly killed me til I hit mute LOL). Might be worth looking at?

http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d2273fc6a

[mrcorbo]

I know I got these results previously but I can't get them now for some reason. Which driver are you using?

ATI-sourced from catalyst beta (for 5800 series).

[rica]

Log with PDVD9 (unpatched) audio renderer:

Same results with yours samuri and it's clear it is not an audio renderer issue:

http://www.mediafire.com/?wnyqyjzn1wm


I did NOT get TrueHD lights on the receiver, but, I did get LPCM audio (although it was horribly garbled and nearly killed me til I hit mute LOL).

Confirmed.

[SamuriHL]

ATI-sourced from catalyst beta (for 5800 series).

The October 15th driver? I'm using Catalyst 9.10 official release. People tell me I'm crazy but it mostly seems to work for me. :D

[SamuriHL]

Log with PDVD9 (unpatched) audio renderer:

Same results with yours samuri and it's clear it is not an audio renderer issue:

http://www.mediafire.com/?wnyqyjzn1wm




Confirmed.

Sweet. Good to have someone confirm it. I've tried several times to make a connection to the ReClock renderer but it doesn't play nice. So, we have a few renderers to play with:

albain's custom MPC renderer
default directshow renderer
Cyberlink's PDVD9 renderer
TMT3's renderer

All give varying, but consistent, results. So this is good. If we can use one of the other renderers that may free up albain from having to continually mess with his. In that case, maybe he can find the root of the no sound issue. That'd be nice to get this working right before he gets his card. :) And so close to the official PDVD9 release. :D

[rica]

Ok but don't forget we have not similar results except the one which is gotten by PDVD renderer.

PDVD renderer and thd:

Same result:
No light, unbelieavable noise from the speakers.


ArcSoft Audio renderer and thd:

Me: No light, no sound.
You:Get LPCM.


MPC Audio renderer and thd:

Me: Dolby Digital light and core ac3 sound.
You:THD light but no sound :):)

[SamuriHL]

We also have different hardware, no? :)

[rica]

We also have different hardware, no? :)

Yes, sure; i have 5770+Denon1910+Ati 13.10 drivers on WinVista32 SP2.
You have 5800 series card and ?AVR?

[SamuriHL]

I've got a 5870 running 9.10 drivers on W7 x64 connected to an Onkyo 606. I also have a Xonar using the 17_73 driver.

[rica]

So i don't think it's related with HW but with 32/64?

[SamuriHL]

Could be. No real idea.

[rica]

I'm sure cause 1910 and 606 are very similar to each other.
Maybe a 32/64 or a driver issue?

[SamuriHL]

Not something I can test unfortunately. :) I have absolutely no intention of ever going back to 32 bit computing for any reason.

[rica]

Yes, you're right but i remember i decided to pass 32 bit from 16 bit three years later :)

Same story for 8 to > 16 passthrough :)

[SamuriHL]

I have a feeling the 9.11 driver will be out soon, so, we'll see if that makes any difference. Also, I have other issues in that I can't run moninfo and get the realtime EDID info from this card. So, something is wrong but I'm not sure what. And I have no idea if it affects audio. I badly need PDVD9 to get updated so I can verify that bitstreaming works with this card on there.

[rica]

Yes the drivers are still buggy.

Sometimes i need to shut-down and restart the AVR since Ati HDMI output disappears from time to time.

[SamuriHL]

I just looked at XFX's site and they recommend the 9.10 driver, as well, so, the people who say I'm crazy for using it are nuts. :D

[rica]

I'm not an Atiist guy :) but nVidiaist one; i just buy this one so as to try bitstreaming.
Never happy with video performance at all. (sorry guys it is my subjective opinion.)
But anyway i gonna give it a go with those ex-drivers :devil:

[rica]

Those ex drivers didn't work for me btw.
FYI.

[albain]

Hi,

@rica : there is a problem with your driver because the HD audio media types are not accepted by the renderer (so by the driver) unlike SamuriHL and you both have a radeon 5xxx. You should compare your config together : driver version, default audio endpoint, the parameters of the endpoint (is exclusive mode checked ?)...

PDVD9 bitstream full version comes out this Friday. The patch won't come out until the 27th. You like that? :)
I don't understand, you grabbed the patch before the release date ? Is it working ?

At least I can tell from the PDVD logs that it will accept the HD media types.

This morning I make a new FFDShow build that should be compatible with arcsoft renderer

[liquidskin76]

This morning I make a new FFDShow build that should be compatible with arcsoft renderer

Looking forward to it!

Will this be for the Xonar only, or for ATI 5xxx and Xonar?

I'll test on my Xonar this evening... however i expect SamuriHL will beat me to it!! Secretly, i think were all competing to be the first to say to you "i don't bloody believe it, i've got TrueHD/DTSHD bitstream"!!!

[albain]

Here is the new build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/dmzhyoy45ty/ffdshow_rev3128_20091117_dbt_bitstream_beta35.zip)and I have a greater hope on this one

On my laptop (no xonar of course) the arcsoft renderer will accept the TrueHD bistream and take the stream

I have improved the media types trial feature : now there is an array of media structures that are tried for a given input format.

So this new build is compatible with the others : it will try the official media structure (this is not only the types that change) then the more exotic structures.

[Sebastiii]

Hi :)

I have tested it and yes on Xonar and ATI, ffdshow bitstream with Arcsoft but no sound :(

Strange, i can't see log in debugview ! (sorry one already start lol)
So i think we succeed quickly :)
Seb.

[albain]

Okay, can you try DTS HD and EAC3 ?

This is weird that there are no debug logs

[Sebastiii]

Hi :)
Yes debug works now, it don't work because i have one already debugview started lol.

So this is log :) Log Beta 35 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/logbeta35.zip)

:)

[albain]

About the DTSHD MA sample : did you use the same between yesterday logs on TMT and those one ?

Is it a 6 or a 8 channels sample ?

This may explain why DTS HD does not work

Concerning TrueHD I have no idea

[Sebastiii]

Yep,
Yes it 8ch and it's the same from yesterday :) (For TMT i started the DEMO DTSHS bluray) and for Graphstudio, i have take the .m2ts and put with MPG (gabest Mpeg splitter)
It's strange !
I don't know why !!
Seb :)

[Sebastiii]

Weird thing that i have :

It's maybe from my AVR (Harman) i never seen light comes for DTSHD etc. with different audio renderer (maybe the AVR display the logo after a long signal (1 or 2 second).
I seen the light only with TMT.

And often but i must be wrong, the sample are 8CH but when i look at in (IN OUT) of filtre, it's often 6CH -> I don't know why.

But i MEGA ready for test :)))))
Seb.

[Cheesegeezer]

I have an ATI HD5850 card and would like to help with the testing, I'm using win7 32bit.

Would someone please tell me which renders are required along with the beta35 of FFDShow.

Many Thanks

[albain]

Sorry Seb, there is a bug in my code, I have to fix it

*EDIT* : here the fixed build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/zm3m32m3ddz/ffdshow_rev3128_20091117_dbt_bitstream_beta36.exe) (tested and provides the right structure this time)

I have also changed the number of channels on both TrueHD/DTSHD.

Maybe this will have an effect on both the ATI and the Xonar

[Sebastiii]

No pb at all :)

@Cheesegeezer, Arcsoft renderer :) see preview post Albain say's what dll to register :)

Big thx :)
Seb.

[albain]

I updated the post but here is the new link (http://www.mediafire.com/file/zm3m32m3ddz/ffdshow_rev3128_20091117_dbt_bitstream_beta36.exe)

[Cheesegeezer]

Thanks Sebastiii,

So, install Beta 36 now, setup FFDShow Audio Config outputs by ticking all the HD Audio Formats, tick 16bit & 24bit and tick the experimental box near the bottom.

Open MPC_HC and register external filters - FFDShow Audio decoder and the Arcsoft Renderer - Which is the Audio renderer I need, do you have a link?

Cheers

[albain]

Don't check the "use IEC .... (experimental)" checkbox, it will bring unexpected results

Next step : better use graphstudio

Insert the following filters :
1/ MPC -Mpeg source => select a m2ts file
2/ FFDshow audio
3/ A renderer : MPC audio renderer or default waveout or default directsound or Arcsoft renderer (but a xonar is needed for that one)

Connect them together and play

FYI, it seems that TMT use waveout (instead of directsound). I am not sure of that but this makes sense because I read somewhere that waveout does not allow audio mixing (so this is a kind of exclusive mode)

[Skinleech]

Sounds great albain.

I'll have some results in about 3 hours when I'm in from work, really looking foprward to testing this one out.

[Cheesegeezer]

Don't check the "use IEC .... (experimental)" checkbox, it will bring unexpected results

Next step : better use graphstudio

Insert the following filters :
1/ MPC -Mpeg source => select a m2ts file
2/ FFDshow audio
3/ A renderer : MPC audio renderer or default waveout or default directsound or Arcsoft renderer (but a xonar is needed for that one)

Connect them together and play

FYI, it seems that TMT use waveout (instead of directsound). I am not sure of that but this makes sense because I read somewhere that waveout does not allow audio mixing (so this is a kind of exclusive mode)

Many Thanks Albian, I'll be home in a couple of hours and start some testing for you. I have graphstudio already and check validity of movies streams using mediainfo I have a good DTS-HD MA Track in mkv that is 8 Ch, However when I load a Kungfu panda TrueHD in mediainfo I get 2 x AC3 files both at 48Khz 6 channel, is this correct for TrueHD or do you know of a better TrueHD sample.

Looking forward to this.

[albain]

No, this sounds great because mediainfo doesn't parse streams correctly.

I first need to know if there is sound, if not I will need the logs and for this you just have to launch debugview (google it) before.

Otherwise if there is a xonar owner to test the last ffdshow with arcsoft renderer...

[SamuriHL]

I don't understand, you grabbed the patch before the release date ? Is it working ?

At least I can tell from the PDVD logs that it will accept the HD media types.

This morning I make a new FFDShow build that should be compatible with arcsoft renderer

No no no. I have PDVD9 that does NOT bitstream but I was able to use the PDVD9 renderer with ffdshow.

I'm not home today so I can't play with the new builds. :(

[albain]

Okay, so as long as PDVD does not bitstream this is normal that FFDShow can't with PDVD renderer.

If the test with the last ffdshow and the xonar succeeds, this means that the ATI drivers are not ready.

Damm, this is annoying this lack of information from AMD/nvidia. I posted a while ago on AMD forum with no luck

[SamuriHL]

I have the beta 9.11 driver that I could install. I definitely won't get to it tonight though. It'll be tomorrow morning before I can test anything. If someone with a 5xxx card wants to update to the 9.11 beta and try it that'd be good.

Also, the information on PDVD is not accurate. It does bitstream. Just not with the ati card. It has bitstreaming support for the auzentech, so, the renderer should support bitstreaming.

[Cheesegeezer]

I can check the 9.11 beta drivers tonight, are you getting them from Guru3d?

[liquidskin76]

Otherwise if there is a xonar owner to test the last ffdshow with arcsoft renderer...

Albain,

If no Xonar owner test before hand, i'll test on my Xonar when i get in from work (a few hours time) and let you know.

Cheers

[Skinleech]

Albain,

If no Xonar owner test before hand, i'll test on my Xonar when i get in from work (a few hours time) and let you know.

Cheers

I should have results posted here within the hour as I'll be home in approx 30 mins..

[SamuriHL]

I can check the 9.11 beta drivers tonight, are you getting them from Guru3d?

That's one place. They're posted all over so I'm sure you can find them.

[Skinleech]

:D

No audio, but TrueHD came up on my receiver. It took 15-20 seconds after playback, it switched to stereo at first, then to THD, then momentarily dropped the connection, then back to TrueHD. The playback was jerky, and the file crashed about 1:14 into a 1:34 file.

DTS-HD MA in m2ts: The file played jerkily, with stuttering audio. My AVR picked it up as regular DTS.

DTS-HD MA in mkv: AVR showed DTS, no sound, no apparent stuttering

DDPlus: Nothing on AVR, file played smoothly but no sound.

Logs (http://rs481l3.rapidshare.com/cgi-bin/upload.cgi?rsuploadid=147237951848066322)

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Tested latest beta + arcsoft renderer on my Xonar.

TrueHD plays ok and get TrueHD lights on my av reciever however no sound.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m1eaecc

DTSHD plays ok however shows as DTS 1 channel on my av reciever! No sound.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2317e221

Thanks

[albain]

About truehd : when you said garbled, was it totally unrecognizable or kus stutteriing ?

Have you tried to disable allowDPRINTF key ?
Thanks

[Browncoat]

Greets from Russia and sorry for my very bad English.
First of all, many thanks to albain, you are doing really important and demanded work.

Now I'm waiting for arrival of my Auzen HomeTheater HD sound card. This should happen next week. If you find my help useful, I can do some tests. My AVR is Marantz SR5003.
I'm using Windows Seven x64, but, if it's realy needed, I can install x86 version, this is not a problem (if you need any other Windows for tests just tell me).

And i have some questions:
-Is Auzen in "todo" list, or you want to stop after radeon and xonar?
-Will be output HD sound formats as decoded multi ch pcm 24bit/96KHz supported (with wasapi)? Some AVR (as my Marantz) can't apply Audessey room acoustics correction AND decode HD sound, but Audessey+HD pcm is supported. Of course, this refers to the formats, for which we have decoders.
-Are you staying in touch with the developers of the mpc-hc? Will be bitstreaming feature and wasapi output (user controlled) included into it, when it finaly works, or we have to use ffdshow and separate mpc audio render?

Also I have notebook with Nvidia 9300 gpu and hdmi out (hd pcm supported).Only working wasapi for lossless audio output needed. Can do some tests here too.

[albain]

[2076] jitter correction

This is not good and will break the bitstream for sure (and may be the cause to the no sound issue). I have to disable the jitter correction for bitstream formats.
But this is due to all the logs, so this may be good to disable the tracing (allowDPRINTF key set to 0 in HKEY_Class_Curent_User\Software\GNU\ffdshow)

About azuentech : this one does bitstream with PDVD only. Support will be added but first I may need you to do some tests with the dumper tool, but it is only compatible with 32 bits (and Vista SP? like Sebastii).

[albain]

Here is a new build (http://damienbt.free.fr/ffdshow_rev3128_20091117_dbt_bitstream_beta37.exe) with no jitter correction on bitstream formats

I have removed some traces, but I recommand first to test without allowDPRINTF set.

It will stop to resist us this #§;:!% renderer !

PS : about DTS-HD, there is no jitter, I suspect the renderer to switch back to DTS mode.

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

I'm come back :)

So the is the log for Beta36 : With allowprintf enable :
LOG Beta 36 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/logbeta36.zip).

I go to test Beta37 :)

Big thx :)

So no light and no sound but good ident Channel on TrueHD but 6ch on DTS (over mouse ffdshow icon).
Seb.

[Sebastiii]

:)

With Beta37 :
The first time, i have DTS MSTR appear :) but no sound lol
No TrueHD appear for me for this moment.

But it strange when i tested bitstream, after with windows i have no sound so i must start to play MP3 and when no sound appear i must play bitstream with TMT to catch the sound.

And after i can retest, and with this procedure i have DTS-MSTR appear so maybe i can have it with preview version.

It very closed to work :)
Great great Work :)
Seb.

[Sebastiii]

So i remade Test on Win7 for now with Xonar.

When i play DTS-MA, it's appear on my AVR but no sound.
To get sound (or reset AVR), i must play mp3 with Wasapi Xonar (Foobar2000) to reenable sound.

Detection of DTS-MA is 6ch and not 8ch.

But with eac3 and Truehd not appear on my AVR.
Seb :)

So the is the log for Beta37 : With allowprintf enable :
LOG Beta 37 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/logbeta37.zip).

And for Truehd, it's play too fast 2 or 3 second for 1. :)

[albain]

Okay, everything seems normal this time : delays between buffers are identical between TMT and FFDShow

Could you do the following : graphstudio + ffdshow + arcsoft renderer + launch the dumper tool on the graphstudio process. THanks again

If the bitstream are identical (which is what I expect) and if the delays between feeds are identical too, then it means that the renderer won't work without TMT and the protection path.

This is now hard to tell what's wrong : ati's driver, arcsoft renderer not accepting third party decoders, ffdshow bitstream, mpc renderer

[Sebastiii]

:)
DTS-MA appear with ATI 5xxx with Waveout Renderer only but no sound and 6ch.

With Xonar and waveout it does'nt appear lol.
Seb.

[Sebastiii]

Okay, everything seems normal this time : delays between buffers are identical between TMT and FFDShow

Could you do the following : graphstudio + ffdshow + arcsoft renderer + launch the dumper tool on the graphstudio process. THanks again

If the bitstream are identical (which is what I expect) and if the delays between feeds are identical too, then it means that the renderer won't work without TMT and the protection path.

This is now hard to tell what's wrong : ati's driver, arcsoft renderer not accepting third party decoders, ffdshow bitstream, mpc renderer

Hi,

So this is the log for DTS-MA :
Log Bitstream Beta37 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/DTSMABeta37bitstream.zip)

Seb :)

[Sebastiii]

If the bitstream are identical (which is what I expect) and if the delays between feeds are identical too, then it means that the renderer won't work without TMT and the protection path.

This is now hard to tell what's wrong : ati's driver, arcsoft renderer not accepting third party decoders, ffdshow bitstream, mpc renderer

Yep, but the AVR receive something because DTS-HD MSTR on screen. :) So it's cool :).

And with ATI it's with waveout renderer :)
Seb.

[Betsy25]

I have a problem with ffdshow video losing sync with subtitles.

Original discussion : http://codecs.freeforums.org/post9846.html#p9846

The problem is the following.

When playing a .VOB in latest MPC-HC or other media player using ffdshow video decoder the subtitles render perfectly synced as long as you don't use the position bar to jump to a different location.

When you click the position bar to jump in time the subtitles are getting horribly desync'ed.

The problem happens on all Mediaplayer using ffdshow, it works perfectly fine in the KMPlayer which uses it's own decoder chain,
or when you make MPC-HC use it's own internal MPEG-2 filter.

Please, can someone try to get this bug fixed ?

Attached is a small fraction (20MB = 40sec) of the .VOB file with the synced .srt file.
There is also a MediaInfo text file included of the full original .VOB file.

Attachment is here (20 MB) : http://rapidshare.com/files/308449631/VOB_01_1.rar

[Cheesegeezer]

I should have a log for you soon. Using the 9.10 CCC audio driver. I have the 9.11 beta to test also.

do I need to use an m2ts file or is an mkv ok?

[rica]

[CODE][2076] But this is due to all the logs, so this may be good to disable the tracing (allowDPRINTF key set to 0 in HKEY_Class_Curent_User\Software\GNU\ffdshow)


İ can't see any "allowDPRINTF" DWORD value as expected under the destination with your new ffdshow build.

BTW here are the logs gotten with MPCAudio renderer:

http://www.mediafire.com/?kikzz3yovvz
(THD gives DD light and sound, DTS-HD gives DTS light and no sound.

Arcsoft audio renderer gives no light, no sound, no debug at all.

My endpoint is set to wasapi exclusive preferred, 24/96, 48/16 and supported formats are DTS audio, DD.
My OS Vista SP2 doesn't accept 4000 drivers which samuri has but we get the the same resullt with PDVD9 renderer which means it is not an driver issue or OS mainly but decoder; i suppose.

[albain]

@Rica : weird, your audio driver will accept DTS HD format but not True HD ???

So for truehd ffdshow rollbacks to AC3 whereas for DTS HD all looks fine

00000028 0.00730093 [5920] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckMediaType
00000029 0.00738187 [5920] Media Type Structure
00000030 0.00738187 [5920] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000031 0.00738187 [5920]
00000032 0.00744676 [5920] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000033 0.00744676 [5920]
00000034 0.00751415 [5920]
00000035 0.00751415 [5920] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000036 0.00751415 [5920] subFormat : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_MLP
00000037 0.00751415 [5920]
00000038 0.00758043 [5920]
00000039 0.00758043 [5920] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000040 0.00758043 [5920] Valid bits per sample : 16
00000041 0.00758043 [5920]
00000042 0.00764706 [5920]
00000043 0.00764706 [5920] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000044 0.00764706 [5920] wFormatTag :
00000045 0.00770440 [5920] WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE
00000046 0.00778074 [5920]
00000047 0.00778074 [5920] cbSize : 22
00000048 0.00778074 [5920] nAvgBytesPerSec : 3072000
00000049 0.00778074 [5920] Channels : 8
00000050 0.00778074 [5920] Bits per sample : 16
00000051 0.00778074 [5920] Samples per second : 192000
00000052 0.00778074 [5920] nBlockAlign : 16
00000053 0.00778074 [5920]
00000054 0.00784709 [5920] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckAudioClient
00000055 0.01058151 [5920] CMpcAudioRenderer::CheckMediaType WASAPI client refused the format

[rica]

Dunno what it means but i'm about to give it a go with 9.11 drivers.
You're not but i'm tired really :)

[Skinleech]

I just tried beta 37 with allowDPRINTF set to 0.

True HD played better, but I got no sound. The video froze from time to time and it took about 10 seconds to lock onto the THD stream. It dropped momentarily a couple times.

DTS-HD MA played as DTS, and skipped a bit.

[rica]

9.11 drivers and the logs:

http://www.mediafire.com/?1q3znetn4dt

I don't wanna make any comment.

[Emilot]

Official from now!!!

Ati 9.11

http://game.amd.com/us-en/drivers_catalyst.aspx

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Tested beta 37 on my Xonar.

With debug disabled, TrueHD video plays ok however there's no audio. Dolby TrueHD is displayed on my Sony STR-DG820.

With debug disabled, DTSHD appears as DTS however no audio.

With debug enabled, same result for TrueHD. Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7db52615

With debug enabled, DTSHD appears as DTS however it takes a while for the receiver to lock on as DTS. No audio. Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7caaf422

Keep going man, don't give in!


[EDIT:] Just tested through MPC-HC with renderer set to Arcsoft renderer however i get totally different results compared to Graphstudio.

With debug enabled or disabled, both TrueHD and DTSHD outputs as 2 channel LPCM with audio playing fine. FFDShow output description reports '48000Hz, 6 channels 16-bit integer'.

[JarrettH]

Is this going to hit beta this year? I don't understand what's happening

[albain]

I have a problem with ffdshow video losing sync with subtitles.

Original discussion : http://codecs.freeforums.org/post9846.html#p9846

The problem is the following.

When playing a .VOB in latest MPC-HC or other media player using ffdshow video decoder the subtitles render perfectly synced as long as you don't use the position bar to jump to a different location.

When you click the position bar to jump in time the subtitles are getting horribly desync'ed.

The problem happens on all Mediaplayer using ffdshow, it works perfectly fine in the KMPlayer which uses it's own decoder chain,
or when you make MPC-HC use it's own internal MPEG-2 filter.

Please, can someone try to get this bug fixed ?

Attached is a small fraction (20MB = 40sec) of the .VOB file with the synced .srt file.
There is also a MediaInfo text file included of the full original .VOB file.

Attachment is here (20 MB) : http://rapidshare.com/files/308449631/VOB_01_1.rar

You should create a bug tracker ticket for that

[Sebastiii]

Hi :)

From my test of yesterday, I look at more and I saw that DTS-HD MA and HI, the play is slow like 1 second for 2.

I saw also in AVR (when i go to setup AVR and see signal in input on monitor (not that is display in front of AVR) that is detect DTS-HD MSTR and no detect and redetect and so on when i play it.

I don't know if it help.

Thx, seb.

Maybe something wrong with timing, i have tested with and without debug enable in registry :)

[albain]

Great, I found a new bug : the DTS HD blocks don't appear in the logs you sent me (ffdshow+arcsoft renderer), although the IEC header is correct. This explains why you get regular DTS or no sound at all !

I will continue to analyze the other streams and make a new ffdshow build

To Madshi : it seems that the extra bytes we discussed about between the IEC header and the DTS-HD stream are fixed but different between DTS-HD HR and DTS-HD MA
DTS-HD MA
0001000000000000FEFE5C08
DTS-HD HR
0001000000000000FEFEA80A
So how to make the distinction between a MA and a HR stream ?

I found in the stream the following difference, don't know if it could make the rule :
The DTS core block (with the FE7F0180 header)
DTS-HD MA
FE7F01803CFCB27D02773B0D09807BEFDEDEBDF70
DTS-HD HR
FE7F01803CFCB27D00773B0D09807BEFDEDEBDF70

And then the DTS-HD block :
MA
5864252003000FE000F88
HR
586425200300596000788

Also of course the size is different (it is fixed for a stream but I don't know from one sample file to another) : 5800 bytes for MA and 2024 bytes for HR

[Sebastiii]

Great Great :)
Good luck :)
Seb.

[albain]

Here is the one (http://www.mediafire.com/file/y0jxt1kji1o/ffdshow_rev3128_20091118_dbt_bitstream_beta38.exe)

I have this time a better hope on this build (there were several important bugs in the parsing).

It should give different results with the xonar and with the radeon

[THX-UltraII]

wow Albain, 38 betas released in such a short period. Must say I m impressed!

[Skinleech]

I'll post results ASAP - about 3 hours time. Really want to leave work early now to go try this out!

Thanks as always albain.

[SamuriHL]

Guys, everyone on an ATI should update to 9.11 (including me as I haven't yet). The release notes say there are bugs fixed in the driver with regard to high bitrate audio. I don't know if anything else has been fixed. I'm going to update to 9.11 and then give this a try.

[SamuriHL]

The ATI HDMI driver version didn't change, so, um, yeaaaa. No idea what the release notes are talking about. Anyway, will give this build a try as soon as my machine reboots.

[Betsy25]

You should create a bug tracker ticket for that

Thank you, bug tracker created here :
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=2899338&group_id=173941&atid=867360

[SamuriHL]

@albain

I don't know what happened with this release, but, it's not doing ANYTHING with the ArcSoft audio renderer now. It doesn't even try to pass audio to the receiver. No change on DirectShow Default or Cyberlink renderers.

[Cheesegeezer]

I'm really sorry albian, i tried to create some logs last night but couldn't get along with debugview to create them.

I'll have another go tonight or I could just post findings.

Let me know either way

Cheers

Dave

[albain]

@albain

I don't know what happened with this release, but, it's not doing ANYTHING with the ArcSoft audio renderer now. It doesn't even try to pass audio to the receiver. No change on DirectShow Default or Cyberlink renderers.

You mean it does not connect ?

With graphstudio I did the following : MPC mpeg splitter -> ffdshow -> arcsoft renderer

I just have one trouble : the ffdshow -> arcsoft renderer fails to connect once, but succeeds if I retry to link the pins.

Then after that I can see the bitstream going through (with the dumper I see the bitstream arriving on the renderer), and this time it is REALLY correct

I tried with EAC3 and DTS HD : those are the 2 formats that I fixed.

The tests to do are the following :
- xonar owners : graphstudio with mpc mpeg splitter (on a m2ts DTSHD/EAC3 sample) + ffdshow + arcsoft renderer
- ati 5xxx owners : graphstudio with mpc mpeg splitter (on a m2ts DTSHD/EAC3 sample) + ffdshow + waveout renderer, or same chain with MPC-HC (by selecting waveout as the default renderer)

Let's forget the MPC wasapi renderer for now

@Cheesegeezer : thanks, but I have enough logs for now (except beta38, but some of you will build me some right ;-))

[SamuriHL]

No no, I didn't say it didn't connect. It connects just fine. It sends absolutely nothing through to the receiver when using the ArcSoft renderer, however. I tried with THD and DTS-HD MA. Nada. I'll give you a log in a minute.

[SamuriHL]

DTS-HD MA: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d534dd5e7

[albain]

Everything seems normal (although I didn't trace the content of the buffers), I hope that Sebastii will have some time to dump the logs of the renderer with the dumper.
Also I didn't change the TrueHD part so I don't understand why it doesn't work anymore

Have you tried with the ATI+waveout renderer ?
Is it the same with EAC3 ?

[rudiev]

Hi, i don't really know for sure if this is the right thread to post my problem, but i'll give it a try.
I have windows 7 x64 installed and using megui to encode to x264. I installed avisynth(AviSynth_090927.exe), k-lite codec pack 5.4.4 full and megui stable v1056(and updated it). When i have a blu-ray which uses the VC-1 encoding format and try to create an avs script with the AVS Script Creater(from megui) i got an error when i try to open the .m2ts file. The error is "Avisynth script error: DirectShowSource: Timeout waiting for graph to start.".
I think i narrowed it down with the help of GraphStudio to see which links it follow to render the original .m2ts file. On my Windows 7 x64 machine the VC-1 blu-ray is rendered thru the 'WMVideo Decoder DMO', while on my Windows 2003 x64 is is rendered thru 'ffdshow Video Decoder'. I think here's the problem why Avisynth isn't able to open the WVC1 source cause it normally uses ffdshow.
In k-lite codec pack is a tool called Win7DSFilterTweaker where you can select which filter to use with which decoder. But for VC-1 i can only select microsoft and not ffdshow like with other decoders.
Does anyone know a solution for this? Or am i completly wrong with my explantion?

[Sebastiii]

Hi :)

I'm not @ home but i log with Dumper :)

Log DTSHDHRBeta38 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/DTSHDHRBeta38.zip)
Log DTSMAHDBeta38 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/DTSMAHDBeta38.zip)
Log EAC3Beta38 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/EAC3Beta38.zip)
Log TrueHDBeta38 (http://sebinternet.free.fr/TrueHDBeta38.zip)

So on ffdshow icon for DTS i have 6ch and i think it play to fast.
So on ffdshow icon for EAC3 i have 4ch.
So on ffdshow icon for TrueHD i have 8ch and i think it play to fast.

Big thx i hope it helps :)
Seb.

[SamuriHL]

TrueHD decodes to LPCM with the arcsoft renderer for some reason. I can try other stuff, but, I've never been able to bitstream eac3, so, that's not a useful test for me to try. I did not try with the ATI renderer, but, I can definitely do so.

[SamuriHL]

Well that was interesting.

DTS-HD MA with ATI renderer (DTS-HD MA light eventually came on, no audio): http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d59b5949e

EDIT: TrueHD with the ATI renderer (THD light came on, no audio): http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d5fdafe2f

[Skinleech]

Question: I can never get the Arcsoft renderer to show up in Grpahstudio. I've registered the .dll with regsvr32 but graphstudio doesn't see it. I can browse to the .dll in MPC-HC and it works just fine.

Any ideas? Creating the graphs in Graphstudio is probabnly easier than faffing about with MPC.

Will have some logs posted within the hour either way.

[clsid]

Hi, i don't really know for sure if this is the right thread to post my problem, but i'll give it a try.
I have windows 7 x64 installed and using megui to encode to x264. I installed avisynth(AviSynth_090927.exe), k-lite codec pack 5.4.4 full and megui stable v1056(and updated it). When i have a blu-ray which uses the VC-1 encoding format and try to create an avs script with the AVS Script Creater(from megui) i got an error when i try to open the .m2ts file. The error is "Avisynth script error: DirectShowSource: Timeout waiting for graph to start.".
I think i narrowed it down with the help of GraphStudio to see which links it follow to render the original .m2ts file. On my Windows 7 x64 machine the VC-1 blu-ray is rendered thru the 'WMVideo Decoder DMO', while on my Windows 2003 x64 is is rendered thru 'ffdshow Video Decoder'. I think here's the problem why Avisynth isn't able to open the WVC1 source cause it normally uses ffdshow.
In k-lite codec pack is a tool called Win7DSFilterTweaker where you can select which filter to use with which decoder. But for VC-1 i can only select microsoft and not ffdshow like with other decoders.
Does anyone know a solution for this? Or am i completly wrong with my explantion?
You need to enable VC-1 in ffdshow first (on the Codecs page in the settings).
Win7DSFilterTweaker only shows ffdshow as an option when ffdshow is configured to decode that a/v format.

[Sebastiii]

TrueHD decodes to LPCM with the arcsoft renderer for some reason. I can try other stuff, but, I've never been able to bitstream eac3, so, that's not a useful test for me to try. I did not try with the ATI renderer, but, I can definitely do so.

Hi SamuriHL, did you try with Waveout Renderer ?
With this renderer, i have the light with ATI HDMI but no sound, i didn't try latest beta, i will try hit tonight :)
Seb.

[SamuriHL]

Question: I can never get the Arcsoft renderer to show up in Grpahstudio. I've registered the .dll with regsvr32 but graphstudio doesn't see it. I can browse to the .dll in MPC-HC and it works just fine.

Any ideas? Creating the graphs in Graphstudio is probabnly easier than faffing about with MPC.

Will have some logs posted within the hour either way.

Hmmm, that's screwy. I registered it (in an administrator cmd prompt) and it shows up under the audio renderer's section in GS. I can also select it as my output device in MPC-HC. Not sure what to tell you on that one.

[SamuriHL]

Hi SamuriHL, did you try with Waveout Renderer ?
With this renderer, i have the light with ATI HDMI but no sound, i didn't try latest beta, i will try hit tonight :)
Seb.

I did. Same. Lights are on but no one's home. LOL

[Sebastiii]

Question: I can never get the Arcsoft renderer to show up in Grpahstudio. I've registered the .dll with regsvr32 but graphstudio doesn't see it. I can browse to the .dll in MPC-HC and it works just fine.

Any ideas? Creating the graphs in Graphstudio is probabnly easier than faffing about with MPC.

Will have some logs posted within the hour either way.

Hi, i have register on cmd the dll : ASAudioRenderer.dll
in patch : E:\Program Files\ArcSoft\TotalMedia Theatre 3\Codec\ for me it's E: lol :)
Seb.

[Skinleech]

No idea about graphstudio, I've done as above. Anyway, onto the interesting stuff.

TrueHD: Lights came on, no sound
DDPlus: Crashed MPC-HC straight away.
DTS-HD HR: Played as DTS, got sound.
DTS-HD MA in m2ts: Played as DTS, no sound.
DTS-HD MA in mkv: DTS-HD MSTR light came on, haali loaded, no sound.

Log: http://rs646l3.rapidshare.com/cgi-bin/upload.cgi?rsuploadid=147237951848910710

Mkv is interesting, it seems the MPC splitter isn't even needed in that case.

[Thunderbolt8]

afaik mpc splitter is not needed when using haali for .mkv, as it is the other way round as well.

[albain]

About the number of channels : this is normal that this number is incorrect because this is the number of IEC 60958 channels : 2 for AC3/DTS on SPDIF, 2 for EAC3, 8 for DTSHD TrueHD but not sure about that

But this number is totally different for xonar+arcsoft renderer

[albain]

Nothing really great but I am happy to say that (this time) the bitstreams are identical between arcsoft and ffdshow.

But there is no sound : I think the man reason is the time duration (seb saying the videos are playing too fast).
So this should be the key to have sound.

But how to calculate the time duration of a compressed stream ?

This should not be very difficult to figure out

[Sebastiii]

Dolby Digital EAC3 workssssssssssssssssssss !!!!!!!!!!

On Win7 Xonar ffdshow (16bits or 24bits out) + Arcsoft :)
The sound is not good, but it's the same sound with TMT (bitstream)

Yes it's very good.

For DTSMA or DTSHR or TrueHD nothing appear in AVR.

I make more test but, it confirm that with arcsoft renderer and xonar it's work :)

Big Thx :)
Seb.

[albain]

Great !! Finally, this means that there is no protection within the renderer. Have you tried with the ati ?

I will update the dumper with traces of timestamps for each buffer

very encouraging result Seb, thanks

[SamuriHL]

This is good news. And yes, I see the video playing too fast on my TrueHD title, as well. So, I think the timing is definitely off somewhere. I hope you can figure that out. I think you're REALLY close.

[gorgeousjorge]

Hi all.

I`m a little bit confused about some settings in ffdshow:

1-The "process whole image" is for processing the black bars at bottom and top?
If this is so,what`s the use of it?

2-In the rgb conversion page,the contrast;standard or full range;do they mean the input or output of the video,or both?
I´m confused because they appear to do the oposite of what is written in them.
Standard (16-235) expands the image giving me the correct colors but clipping the btb and wtw data.
Full range (0-255) seems to "brighten" the image.

Shouldn`t be the oposite?

For example:if i play a video file (16-235) on my computer,then i should choose full range because the monitor is expecting (0-255)!
Is this right?

Tx for any help anyone can provide and sorry if this is already answered,i didn`t read the 100+ pages.

Best regards.

[Sebastiii]

Great !! Finally, this means that there is no protection within the renderer. Have you tried with the ati ?

I will update the dumper with traces of timestamps for each buffer

very encouraging result Seb, thanks

Yes, so i have tested too on ATI but no light for EAC3 for now :).
I'll make retest to see exactly, but with Xonar when i saw DD+ on AVR 7.1 :) i'm very happy :).
Seb.

[rica]

Here are my test results with albain's THD sample:

1) Default WaveOut device:
Gives no light, no sound, no debug.

2) Default DirectSound Device:
Gives PCM light and PCM sound but no debug.

3) MPC AudioRenderer:
Gives PCM light and sound and debug.
Here is the debug file:
http://www.mediafire.com/?oozz2311mdj

4) TMT AudioRenderer:
Gives no light, no sound, no debug.

5) PDVD9 Renderer:
Gives PCM light but a bad noise only and no debug.

Ati 5770 and 9/11 drivers.

Endpoint set to wasapi exlusive and 192/24.

[tal.aloni]

gorgeousjorge,
- I have a feeling you're not using the latest version, the input and output levels in the RGB conversion page are labeled clearly in the latest version, and it's not hard to figure out the rest. (when dealing with 16-235 input, you're not losing anything by expanding to 0-255, this is the only way to go if you have a computer monitor / LCD TV)

- regarding "process whole image", there is a seperation in ffdshow between the clip dimensions and the output dimensions.

Tal

[clsid]

1-The "process whole image" is for processing the black bars at bottom and top?
If this is so,what`s the use of it?

2-In the rgb conversion page,the contrast;standard or full range;do they mean the input or output of the video,or both?
I´m confused because they appear to do the oposite of what is written in them.
Standard (16-235) expands the image giving me the correct colors but clipping the btb and wtw data.
Full range (0-255) seems to "brighten" the image.

Shouldn`t be the oposite?
1) I am not 100% sure, but the most logical thing would be that this option indeed enables processing of the bars that may have been added around the video by the resize&aspect filter in ffdshow.

2) As the header above options says, its for the input. The descriptions are correct. Most videos are encoded with the 16-235 range.

[gorgeousjorge]

Well,tx very much for your inputs.
I´m seeing my ffdshow version and its well outdated,jun 27 2008.
i could i be so careless!!!
I will update and talk back here my feedback.

And again tx for your replies.

Best regards.
--------------------------------------------------
Just to not double post.

I see now my confusion,in the previous version i`ve had installed the levels were refering to input;i see that now because i have played with the input and output levels in this latest version and it`s straighforward.

In it`s default settings:
Input:16-235
Output:0-255

Meaning 16 will be mapped to 0 and 235 to 255;thus giving me the correct colors for pc monitor;clipping the btb and wtw data.
Is my thought correct?

Regarding the "process whole image" feature.

"there is a seperation in ffdshow between the clip dimensions and the output dimensions"

"I am not 100% sure, but the most logical thing would be that this option indeed enables processing of the bars that may have been added around the video by the resize&aspect filter in ffdshow"


Is the resize&aspect filter the only one wich interfere with this?Meaning that if i don`t use this filter i shouldn`t care with the process whole image?
Sorry mates,but i`m not following you there;can you please elaborate?

Tx for your inputs and sorry for so many questions.

Best regards
-----------------------------------------
Lol another edit,sorry guys.

I`ve just come across this:

“Process Whole Image” tick box instructs FFDShow to process the black bars encoded in the image (if they exist).
This is a waste of CPU, and so should NOT be used.
In the av foruns.
I´ve seen very little movies encoded like this;and if it is it`s only purpose then i think this feature is completly useless,or i am wrong here?
Just trying to understand the issue.
Best regards once again.

[Sebastiii]

Hi for being happy this day :

http://sebinternet.free.fr/Picture24.jpg
http://sebinternet.free.fr/Picture6.jpg

Seb :)

[Sebastiii]

And :) For DTS-HD-Hi Res only on 6ch and sound crackling but we are sound :)

http://sebinternet.free.fr/Picture26.jpg
http://sebinternet.free.fr/Picture27.jpg

Seb :).

[Skinleech]

Seb, any chance you post/upload your EAC3 sample? The ones I have crash MPC immediately, so I'd be interested to try yours.

FYI, the samples I have were both posted into this thread, so perhaps they are the same ones - the most recent one I got was 126mb and named

00026 - DD+ 7.1 Channe Test.m2ts

Thanks!

Great to see your pics as well.

[albain]

Hi again,

a new build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/jzu2gyzget4/ffdshow_rev3128_20091119_dbt_bitstream_beta39.exe) with a fix on the time periods.

Seb, I will also send you an updated version of the dumper with traces of the timestamps.
With this I will be able to correct those timestamps if this new build does not fix them

[Sebastiii]

Hi, it's the same sample i use, in MPC it crash too.
I must use Graphstudio - MPC source gabest - ffdshow audio - arcsoft rendere on Xonar.

I didn't use video only sound but both works too :)
Seb.

[Sebastiii]

Hi again,

a new build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/jzu2gyzget4/ffdshow_rev3128_20091119_dbt_bitstream_beta39.exe) with a fix on the time periods.

Seb, I will also send you an updated version of the dumper with traces of the timestamps.
With this I will be able to correct those timestamps if this new build does not fix them

Hi and Great :) i will try it :)
I no receive new dumper for now, but i hope i will receive it quickly lol :)
Seb.

[Skinleech]

Hi, it's the same sample i use, in MPC it crash too.
I must use Graphstudio - MPC source gabest - ffdshow audio - arcsoft rendere on Xonar.

I didn't use video only sound but both works too :)
Seb.

Ah, thanks Seb. That will no use to me then seeing as i can't get the Arcsoft renderer to show up in Graphstudio. Great to know that sound works, I might kust try and make my own m2ts sample from an HD-DVD and see if that works.

Looking forward to the new build albain - efficient work as always. Thank you.

[albain]

Hi and Great :) i will try it :)
I no receive new dumper for now, but i hope i will receive it quickly lol :)
Seb.

I have sent it to you by email. I have just PM too

[Sebastiii]

Yes, i have receive it just after my post lol and i send you log :)
Big Thx :)
Seb.

[Gleb Egorych]

Just for info: new ForceWare 195.55 broke NV12 support for some files. Output using NV12 is wrong with different codecs including ffdshow.

[rudiev]

You need to enable VC-1 in ffdshow first (on the Codecs page in the settings).
Win7DSFilterTweaker only shows ffdshow as an option when ffdshow is configured to decode that a/v format.

This is it, nog graphstudio shows that the ffdshow is used.
:thanks::thanks:

I can't reboot now to test, megui is busy for the rest of the day, but allthought graphstudio shows that ffdshow is used with that VC-1 movie, i still can't get it to load in avisynth, i still got the error "Avisynth script error: DirectShowSource: Timeout waiting for graph to start.".
Maybe this is solved after a reboot, or is this an other problem? As far as i know avisynth should be able to open vc-1 movies, right? I only use the following line in the avs script:
DirectShowSource("X:\directory\file001.m2ts", fps=23.976, audio=false, convertfps=true)

*Post edited to meet forum rules.*

[madshi]

To Madshi : it seems that the extra bytes we discussed about between the IEC header and the DTS-HD stream are fixed but different between DTS-HD HR and DTS-HD MA

So how to make the distinction between a MA and a HR stream ?
I'd suggest to check out the BDInfo source code. The BDInfo author got help from me to identify MA vs. HR and his code is already C++, so his code should be the easiest way for you to solve this.

[albain]

@madshi : Great, thanks I will check this out


@All : here is an updated build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/mkzzvmjtymu/ffdshow_rev3128_20091119_dbt_bitstream_beta40.exe) with the correct timestamps

[Sebastiii]

:)

Great, i'll test it, what log you want to help you ?
I think i'll made graphstudio and dumper :)
Seb.

[albain]

:)

Great, i'll test it, what log you want to help you ?
I think i'll made graphstudio and dumper :)
Seb.

No log, just your "ears", because I have just changed the timestamps

[rudiev]

You need to enable VC-1 in ffdshow first (on the Codecs page in the settings).
Win7DSFilterTweaker only shows ffdshow as an option when ffdshow is configured to decode that a/v format.


This is it, nog graphstudio shows that the ffdshow is used.
:thanks::thanks:

, i still can't get it to load in avisynth, i still got the error "Avisynth script error: DirectShowSource: Timeout waiting for graph to start.".

Found the solution:
Change splitter for .m2ts files. Startmenu -> programs -> k-lite codec pack -> configuration -> manage preferred source filters -> scroll to .m2ts files and choose Haali.
Avisynth should now be able to .m2ts with VC-1 encoding fine. The avs script editor from megui worked fine now.

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

For Xonar.
Eac3 -> Ok on avr but i must confirm sound
DTSHR -> Ok on avr but i must confirm sound
DTSMA -> NOK on AVR
TrueHD -> NOK on AVR

I think it play better but i'm not @ home lol so i can more tonight :).

For ATI i must made test :)
Thx,
Seb.

[SamuriHL]

As soon as it downloads I'll give it a shot.

[Skinleech]

I'll be home early today, so will test this in about 30 mins.

It's very handy living a 10 mins walk from work :)

[SamuriHL]

DTS-HD MA lights are on with ATI renderer, but, no audio. Video was frozen. Eventually receiver switched to no audio signal and the video continued normally.

With DirectSound renderer, same with little pops of sound here and there.

ArcSoft renderer nothing. No audio to the receiver at all. Same as before.

Cyberlink renderer LPCM complete static.

Waveout pretty DTS-HD MA light, no audio.

[Skinleech]

My results were not good.

DTS-HD MA in m2ts: played as DTS
DTS-HD MA in mkv: DTS-HD MSTR lights came on, slow video, no sound.
TrueHD: Either light came on but no sound, light came on and video froze, or no lights, frozen video & my AVR read stereo (tried 3 different THD m2tst files).

Let me know if you need logs.

[tetsuo55]

assume logs are needed

[albain]

The problem is that the expected implementation on the xonar is probably different for the ATI.

The upcoming PDVD version will help to figure out what has to be done (hoping the dumper will work too). Does someone know the GUID of the PDVD renderer by the way ?

[Sebastiii]

I don't know if it's the good but Version 9 :

{1962C876-C8F7-4474-9C46-BCFB23BDB516}

Seb.

[mrcorbo]

The (current) PowerDVD 9 audio renderer seems quite content to accept bitstream input regardless of whether it is capable of making the hardware transmit it properly. It is quite happy to attempt to send bitsream data generated by ffdshow through the standard audio pathway (including the Windows mixer) on my system. The audible result is not pleasant....

[buletti]

I tested the recent build with my Xonar and the ArcSoft renderer. Results were:

Dolby True HD:
Video did not play at all and there was no sound output. During playback the receiver recognized a THD signal with wrong channel settings and volume offset values.
THD (http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/9140/thd.jpg)

Dolby Digital Plus:
Video played with half of the original frame rate (12 instead of 24 fps) and although the receiver recognized the stream correctly, there was no audio output.
DD+ (http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/9596/ddplus.jpg)

DTS HD HR:
Video and audio was fine but the receiver got the DTS core only.

[albain]

I a little stuck rigth now (but this is not the first time lol)

EAC3 work with the xonar with ffdshow+arcsoft renderer

I can make it work for DTSHD (HR or master audio) with the same config by analyzing the dumper logs of Sebastii

For TrueHD this is more complicated as I don't have the exact rule between TrueHD frames : each frame is separated by a variable number of zeros.

@Madshi : the docs I provided you explain that each MLP frame should be spaced by 15360 IEC 60958 frames (IEC 60958 frame = uncompressed frame), which means AFAIU that for all the compressed formats the docs think in uncompressed frames and that we have to translate the MLP frame rate in uncompressed frame rate). But which frame rate (each MLP frame has a different rate and non major frames don't hold any information about that I think.
Anyway it is said in the doc that frames should be spaced by 15360 frames between the middle of 2 consecutive MLP frames
If you have an idea of how to understand this doc (the MLP doc and the generic ones that explain IEC 60958) that will help me a lot


Otherwise the upcoming version of PowerDVD (compatible with radeon 5xxx) might help to solve this mess.

[madshi]

@Madshi : the docs I provided you explain that each MLP frame should be spaced by 15360 IEC 60958 frames (IEC 60958 frame = uncompressed frame), which means AFAIU that for all the compressed formats the docs think in uncompressed frames and that we have to translate the MLP frame rate in uncompressed frame rate). But which frame rate (each MLP frame has a different rate and non major frames don't hold any information about that I think.
Anyway it is said in the doc that frames should be spaced by 15360 frames between the middle of 2 consecutive MLP frames
If you have an idea of how to understand this doc (the MLP doc and the generic ones that explain IEC 60958) that will help me a lot
I don't have much time right now. But the "frame rate" should be identical for any major and non-major frame. Basically for 44.1khz and 48khz every frame (major and non-major) contains exactly 40 LPCM audio samples. For 88.2khz and 96khz every frame contains 80 LPCM audio samples. For 176.4khz and 192khz every frame contains 160 LPCM audio samples.

[Sebastiii]

Hi :)

If you want more log, i'm here :)
So yesterday, i have tested this (but i want to reconfirm) if i uncheck AC3 DTS-HD DD+ in ffdshow etc. and i play the stream, the result is not good (sound cut) maybe timing ?

But i must remake test in front of my AVR lol.
Thx,
Seb.

[SamuriHL]

The 9.11 driver really screwed up my machine. Probably to the point where I'm going to have to reinstall windows. To say I'm a bit unhappy is putting it mildly. I'm going to attempt to go back to 9.10 first, but, I'm not exactly hopeful. This is just not a good week.

[Jeff Flowerday]

The 9.11 driver really screwed up my machine. Probably to the point where I'm going to have to reinstall windows. To say I'm a bit unhappy is putting it mildly. I'm going to attempt to go back to 9.10 first, but, I'm not exactly hopeful. This is just not a good week.

How? 9.11 has been a god send for my 5750.

[SamuriHL]

How? 9.11 has been a god send for my 5750.

On my main HTPC, when installing 9.11 the driver crashes and windows is forced to reload the driver in memory. At that point, after rebooting, CCC no longer works at all. I've tried several times to reinstall it and it fails. Someone else I know is NEVER able to update the Cat drivers at all. He always has to reinstall windows in order to get a new driver version installed. To say I'm not impressed with the driver installation quality is a severe understatement.

[mrcorbo]

On my main HTPC, when installing 9.11 the driver crashes and windows is forced to reload the driver in memory. At that point, after rebooting, CCC no longer works at all. I've tried several times to reinstall it and it fails. Someone else I know is NEVER able to update the Cat drivers at all. He always has to reinstall windows in order to get a new driver version installed. To say I'm not impressed with the driver installation quality is a severe understatement.

Try DriverSweeper (http://www.guru3d.com/category/driversweeper/) before going as far as re-installing windows.

Boot into safe-mode (assuming you can), uninstall the drivers through the Windows add/remove programs control panel and then run DriverSweeper to clean out the rest of the junk. After a re-boot, you should then be able to re-install the 9.11 drivers and hopefully everything is back to normal.

[SamuriHL]

I'm trying it now. We'll see how well this goes. Definitely not the best of weeks for me.

[SamuriHL]

And it did not help at all. But thanks for the suggestion. I'm convinced the 9.11 driver just plain sucks.

[Cheesegeezer]

On my main HTPC, when installing 9.11 the driver crashes and windows is forced to reload the driver in memory. At that point, after rebooting, CCC no longer works at all. I've tried several times to reinstall it and it fails. Someone else I know is NEVER able to update the Cat drivers at all. He always has to reinstall windows in order to get a new driver version installed. To say I'm not impressed with the driver installation quality is a severe understatement.

I have had similar issue, my work around was to extract the .exe using 7zip and install the audio driver thru the device manager. Worked a treat.

[albain]

I don't have much time right now. But the "frame rate" should be identical for any major and non-major frame. Basically for 44.1khz and 48khz every frame (major and non-major) contains exactly 40 LPCM audio samples. For 88.2khz and 96khz every frame contains 80 LPCM audio samples. For 176.4khz and 192khz every frame contains 160 LPCM audio samples.

Okay I have found (man I hate assembler code...)

The number of zeros are added according to : the system time, the input time, and the length of the mat frame

So one should know the time duration of a MAT block and add IEC 60958 frame (so a given number of zeros, but how many ?) so that it matches the duration. So this is totally dynamic

[SamuriHL]

I have had similar issue, my work around was to extract the .exe using 7zip and install the audio driver thru the device manager. Worked a treat.

Yea, well, I'm done screwing around now. 9.10 won't work now, either. So whatever 9.11 did, dirversweeper can't undo. Time for a hybrid upgrade/migration install. Don't ask. You don't want to know what I'm about to do to that poor machine. :)

albain, any progress at all? Clearly I'm going to be down for a while today so no testing from me. EDIT: Uh, nevermind. Just saw your post.

[Sebastiii]

oupps :) it was difficult to implemente :( right ?
hard hard,
Seb.

[SamuriHL]

Okay I have found (man I hate assembler code...)

The number of zeros are added according to : the system time, the input time, and the length of the mat frame

So one should know the time duration of a MAT block and add IEC 60958 frame (so a given number of zeros, but how many ?) so that it matches the duration. So this is totally dynamic

Good Lord. That's insane!

[Thunderbolt8]

Try DriverSweeper (http://www.guru3d.com/category/driversweeper/) before going as far as re-installing windows.

Boot into safe-mode (assuming you can), uninstall the drivers through the Windows add/remove programs control panel and then run DriverSweeper to clean out the rest of the junk. After a re-boot, you should then be able to re-install the 9.11 drivers and hopefully everything is back to normal.perhaps drive cleaner .NET works

[SamuriHL]

Nothing worked. I just finally broke down and reinstalled windows. It's not a clean install but the method I use has been tested by someone with worse Cat driver install problems than I have an it always works. Once my settings are restored (momentarily) I'll reinstall the Cat 9.11 driver and go from there. So not happy. Also, still no confirmation that new users are getting an updated PDVD9 build yet, so, who knows if that made it out the door or not. The patch for existing users is scheduled for next Friday...hopefully.

[SamuriHL]

I'll try to restrain myself. I just spent all that time reinstalling windows. And I have the same problem. ATI is not making me happy. At all. Until I get this straightened out I don't think I'll be testing anything. :(

[SamuriHL]

From Tom on AVSForum:


As of today, new PowerDVD 9 Ultra customers will receive build 2320, which includes support for HDMI bitstreaming of undecoded (full quality) audio with ATI Radeon 5000 series graphics cards, and the Auzentech X-Fi Hometheater HD sound card. An update patch for current owners of PowerDVD 9 Ultra is scheduled to be available next Friday (11/27).

Tom
Cyberlink


So, for those of us that own PDVD9 already, we'll get the patch next week.

[albain]

Great news, the dumper is ready

[SamuriHL]

Awesome. I think I got my machine back together and working again with 9.11, so, I should be able to test once a new build is ready.

[Thunderbolt8]

so what was the problem with 9.11, now I don't dare to update :D

[rica]

Vista 32 SP2; no problem here.

[Browncoat]

Well, I finaly have my Auzen HT HD.
I made clean install of Windows Vista SP2 and Seven (both x86). Both fully updated, with latest drivers.
Minimum installed software: only PowerDVD 9 Ultra build 2227 and Virtual Clone Drive. Daemon tools doesn't mount my test bluray iso well (powerdvd just hang) but with Virtual Clone drive bitstriming works well (in both Vista and Seven).
I have two .iso (made them with tsremux) one with DTS-HD MA, other DD TrueHD. And also these files:
test_5.1_dd (AC3).avi
test_5.1_truehd.m2ts
test_7.1_ddplus (EAC3).m2ts
test_7.1_dts-hd_hr.m2ts
test_7.1_lpcm_hd.m2ts
test_7.1_truehd.m2ts

So i'm ready for some test. I need a dumper tool and instructions :)

[SamuriHL]

so what was the problem with 9.11, now I don't dare to update :D

Like I have any idea? The stupid driver crashes on install even when it installs correctly. That instills great confidence. When it didn't work, the CCC would hang in memory and never come up. Ever.

[albain]

A good thing to bring to FFDShow : http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1159859#post1159859

There is a MLP encoder, I imagine that we could add it to ffdshow next to AC3 encode mode in the output section of FFDShow

Typically for uncompressed HD multichannel streams and if there is a HDMI 1.3 output and a TrueHD receiver

Of course, when the bitstream support will be operational

[madshi]

A good thing to bring to FFDShow : http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1159859#post1159859

There is a MLP encoder, I imagine that we could add it to ffdshow next to AC3 encode mode in the output section of FFDShow

Typically for uncompressed HD multichannel streams and if there is a HDMI 1.3 output and a TrueHD receiver

Of course, when the bitstream support will be operational
FWIW, Blu-Rays use TrueHD and not MLP. I don't know if bitstreaming works with MLP. And yes, TrueHD and MLP are different (slightly). Also I think the first target of the libav MLP encoder was to encode stereo, only. I don't know the current state. Last time I checked, even stereo encoding didn't work reliably yet. But maybe things have improved since then. I hope!

[albain]

Hi, I am not going to say to much but the MLP encoding is much more complicated than I thought. I am doing the necessary analysis to build the exact code

DTS-HD and EAC3 are different and should be working right now which means that the problems are probably due to wrong timings

[Sebastiii]

hi :)
Yes it's very closed to work perfectly :)
I hope that you can succeed :) very thx and good luck :)
Seb.

[Andy o]

What could be the purpose of on-the-fly MLP encoding though? I think some receivers take it and decode it, but if 7.1 LPCM via HDMI is available, what could be the advantage?

[madshi]

What could be the purpose of on-the-fly MLP encoding though?
The advantage is the guarantee that neither the OS nor the audio driver has any chance to damage our precious audio data. If you output LPCM, there's a big chance that either the OS or the audio driver (or both) think they should apply some processing for whatever funny reason...

[Andy o]

Hmm, but you'd still have to decode the original audio to encode it to MLP, and you'll still have to use exclusive mode, which if you can, you can also output untouched LPCM through it.

[htpc66]

The advantage is the guarantee that neither the OS nor the audio driver has any chance to damage our precious audio data. If you output LPCM, there's a big chance that either the OS or the audio driver (or both) think they should apply some processing for whatever funny reason...

As a side note, those Blu-rays I had converted via EAC3to sound as good, if not better than, standalone players through Xonar slim 1.3 driver with waspi. Madshi, thank you.

In the absence of Xonar, some how I cannot achieve the same through ATI 4xxx/Nvidia 8200/9300 realtek/ati/nvidia htmi drivers (with or without waspi) with various receivers.

Albain, please keep up the good work.

[Andy o]

htpc66, I'm guessing you remux blurays to mkv/flac, right? If so, how are you using the Xonar with WASAPI exclusive? The Xonar will resample everything to whatever the Xonar CP is set at. Also, I'm having no trouble using exclusive mode with my ATI 4670, with Realtek drivers. Nvidia is buggy last time I checked.

[htpc66]

htpc66, I'm guessing you remux blurays to mkv/flac, right? If so, how are you using the Xonar with WASAPI exclusive? The Xonar will resample everything to whatever the Xonar CP is set at. Also, I'm having no trouble using exclusive mode with my ATI 4670, with Realtek drivers. Nvidia is buggy last time I checked.

Unfortunately I have no such luck with a ATI 4XXX alone.

I am now using 9800GT/Xonar slim. Other than Xonar drivers, no htmi driver was installed in Vista sp1. Mkv/flacs were delivered via madflac/reclock.

Could someone kindly share their listening experience - ie. without the any (ATI/realtek/nvidia) hdmi driver installed?

[albain]

Advancement status : I still doing some reverse engineering on the truehd frames
Some results :

IEC frames are 61440 bytes long, there is a sync word added in the middle of each IEC frame and extrawords at the end (I have the algorithm for both)
The number of zeros to add between each MLP frame (major or non major) : this is the tough part. This number is recalculated for each frame and is based upon the content, including the rate bits, the number of substreams. I am still on it. I guess at the end I will have a duration giving me the number of zeros to fill.


Maybe I should use the libavcodec parser to avoid double coding because many of the needed fields will require to parse all the content of MLP frames (for now the ffdshow TrueHD/MLP parser is basic)

Another thing not related : the ffdshow ac3 encoder is limited to 48000hz. Is there a better of updated ac3 encoder (or maybe dts encoder :)) ?

[Emilot]

Advancement status : I still doing some reverse engineering on the truehd frames
Some results :

IEC frames are 61440 bytes long, there is a sync word added in the middle of each IEC frame and extrawords at the end (I have the algorithm for both)
The number of zeros to add between each MLP frame (major or non major) : this is the tough part. This number is recalculated for each frame and is based upon the content, including the rate bits, the number of substreams. I am still on it. I guess at the end I will have a duration giving me the number of zeros to fill.


Maybe I should use the libavcodec parser to avoid double coding because many of the needed fields will require to parse all the content of MLP frames (for now the ffdshow TrueHD/MLP parser is basic)

Another thing not related : the ffdshow ac3 encoder is limited to 48000hz. Is there a better of updated ac3 encoder (or maybe dts encoder :)) ?

ac3filter maybe??

http://ac3filter.net/

Or Sonic Scenarist?

[Sebastiii]

Hi Albain :)

Good luck this that, i have hope that you can find the answer :)
If you need help no pb, but only for test log lol, because i'm not like you (big coder) :)
Seb.

[SamuriHL]

No one's posted it here yet?? Wow. I thought you'd all be all over this one. WinDVD 10 has support for ATI 5xxx bitstreaming. :) Confirmed by me. It's not without problems as it drops the audio connection every few seconds, but, it does bitstream. Just thought you'd all like to know. Carry on. :)

[whurlston]

No one's posted it here yet?? Wow. I thought you'd all be all over this one. WinDVD 10 has support for ATI 5xxx bitstreaming. :) Confirmed by me. It's not without problems as it drops the audio connection every few seconds, but, it does bitstream. Just thought you'd all like to know. Carry on. :)

I was waiting for you to post it. ;)

[Sebastiii]

Hi confirmed by me too :)
On DTS-HD-MA, it play perfect but on TrueHD it's cut all 5 seconds.

I can't dump log because windvd crash.

BUT It's because when the dump will work, there are more help for Albain (i hope :) )
Thx,
Seb.

[madshi]

I can't dump log because windvd crash.
Maybe there's still a (small) log being created before the crash occurs? If so, post it. It might help albain figuring out where the crash is coming from.

[SamuriHL]

I was waiting for you to post it. ;)

Wow. You're lazier than I am. Impressive! :p LOL!

[SamuriHL]

Hi confirmed by me too :)
On DTS-HD-MA, it play perfect but on TrueHD it's cut all 5 seconds.

I can't dump log because windvd crash.

BUT It's because when the dump will work, there are more help for Albain (i hope :) )
Thx,
Seb.

DTS-HD MA drops for me. As does TrueHD.

[Sebastiii]

Maybe there's still a (small) log being created before the crash occurs? If so, post it. It might help albain figuring out where the crash is coming from.

Hi, this the log :)

Log of Crash (http://sebinternet.free.fr/Log windvdcrash.txt)

Thx:)

[Sebastiii]

i have installed catalyst 9.11 on Win7 X86.

i have a DTS-HD MA Demo BD and with it, it works good.
With sample DTS-HD MA sample make with tsmuxer, my avr detect DTS-HD MA but the sound comes at the end (10 seconds).

But with demo BD, it works with no drop audio (strange that with you it drops)

Seb.

[SamuriHL]

I'll try another movie when I get a chance. Got one of those wonderful work conferences going on now. :rolleyes:

[whurlston]

Wow. You're lazier than I am. Impressive! :p LOL!

I prefer the term "busier". :p

I'll be trying to get a dump for albain but it will be much later tonight.

[Sebastiii]

Hi dolby true Hd play perfect too :)
I must change frequency of video card @24 the sound cut.
But @50 and @60Hz, it working !

But i have another pb with my AVR harman (maybe need SAV) because i heard a noise sound on even source HDMI or RCA ....
So not cool even with Mute enable on AVR the sound is gere (it's low sound but he here :( ) but this HS lol

For now TrueHD and DTSHD works on windvd 2010 :) must be log now :)

Seb.

[SamuriHL]

I get audio dropouts with both TrueHD and DTS-HD MA. So not sure what's going on there. UGH.

[whurlston]

I get audio dropouts with both TrueHD and DTS-HD MA. So not sure what's going on there. UGH.

Ditto. I'm even getting it with regular AC3 audio.

[SamuriHL]

Ditto. I'm even getting it with regular AC3 audio.

Yup. The same for me. I hope it's not an Onkyo issue. That'd really bite.

Anyway, the reason I posted this info here was clearly for albain's benefit. Hopefully someone can use the dump tool to get him some more logs. Without crashing. :D

[whurlston]

I have a Yamaha RX-V863 so if's definitely not an Onkyo issue.

[SamuriHL]

Good to know. Also it looks like there may be a potential problem with PDVD9 bitstreaming with the 5xxx cards on 64 bit machines. Oh joy. Can't WAIT for that on Friday. :D albain, any progress man?? :D

[Emilot]

Just to clarify, you need v10.0.5.163 of Windvd and not 10.4....

[RiotRay]

@albain

Hi! I'm a user of the new Auzentech HomeTheater HD card.
Are you interested making ffdshow bitstream builds that work for this card, too? I would be happy to test them.
All I need is a hint to the required settings in ffdshow and what exactly to look for.

Kind regards

[whurlston]

Just to clarify, you need v10.0.5.163 of Windvd and not 10.4....

:confused: Who said 10.4?

[Browncoat]

@RiotRay
Do you have PowerDVD 9? It's too early to test ffdshow. We (I have auzen too) need a working dumper to give albain some usefull info. The current one doesn't work for me. So let's give albain some time.

[albain]

Hi,

here are my results but they are not correct

@Madshi : this is what I got from my analysis of the code (low level code if you see what I mean).
The result is the number of zeros to insert between 2 TrueHD frames (between a major and a non major or between 2 non major frames).
Clearly, it depends on the buffer size, and there is a modulo on it
My understanding is that you have to get the size as if it was uncompressed (40 samples typically) and add the missing zeros

Example : for 166 bytes data => 2266 bytes of zero


Here is the code I extracted :
frame_size1 = (bitdata.wordpointer[0] << 8) | bitdata.wordpointer[1]; // 28755 in the example for this frame. Why dealing with this ?
frame_size=(frame_size1 & 0xfff) * 2; // 166 bytes for this frame

rate=64 >> (ratebits & 7); // These are the 4 rate bits extracted from the major frame header : ratebits=0 in the sample so rate=64 (I had a doubt on this one, thought that it should be << instead of >> but it is really a right shift
value1=(frame_size1<<16 - access_unit_size)*rate; // Not sure about this one, sometimes access unit size (uncompressed size) is substracted, sometimes not
value2=value1*frame_size & (rate - 1);
nbZeros = (valué1-value2)%(rate << 16);

Also here is a chain of results extracted from what is outputted by TMT (Frame=frame size, BL: blank size)
Frame:166;BL:2266;Frame:166;BL:2266;Frame:160;BL:2144;Frame:166;BL:2202

If you have an idea about the correct formula.... thanks

[RiotRay]

@Browncoat

Yes, I have PowerDVD9 and I hate it for its unflexibility.
Why major companys like cyberlink don't include picture manipulating features in their products eldues me.
I prefer ZoomPlayer.

[spida_singh]

New PDVD patch is out: http://www.cyberlink.com/downloads/support/powerdvd/patches_en_GB.html

:D

[Gleb Egorych]

Just for info: new ForceWare 195.55 broke NV12 support for some files. Output using NV12 is wrong with different codecs including ffdshow.
195.62 WHQL still has the problem.

[Sebastiii]

New PDVD patch is out: http://www.cyberlink.com/downloads/support/powerdvd/patches_en_GB.html

:D

Great :) more log to see :)

[SamuriHL]

I can say that it works great for most, but, the PDVD9 patch does have issues with certain receivers. That looks to be a bug in the ATI driver, so, albain, that's something to note and be aware of. It works fine with my receiver. I've pulled the Xonar out of that machine completely. With WinDVD and PDVD9 bitstreaming on the 5xxx cards, it's only a matter of time before ArcSoft gets in the game.

[albain]

Hi all,

here is a new FFDShow beta build for HD audio bitstream

I am happy to announce thanks (again) to Madshi contribution that Dolby TrueHD/MLP bitstream is now iso-TotalMedia.

Also timestamp generated have been fixed, so I hope that DTS HD will also work better.

I worked hard on this one so I hope that this time results will be significantly better !

http://damienbt.free.fr/ffdshow_rev3128_20091128_dbt_bitstream_beta42.exe

It should work with the xonar (at least) and with the new radeons too

[albain]

Also I have created a new SVN branch called bitstreamHD

64 bits users can grab it and make builds from it (I don't have any 64 bits compiler set up for now).
It is based upon the last beta42

[Emilot]

I've just saw it at avsforum....

"Guys, couldn't wait and got a 5770 and of course could not bitstream at first. But just DID IT! Bistreaming working just fine on my Denon 988. Here's the way to do it.

Thanks to the guys of the EDID OVERRIDE thread I could grab the EDID of an Onkyo 906. Naturally I modified the monitor driver of my Denon AVR and replaced the Denon EDID for the Onkyos and BANG, it just works!

I have a standard LCD display so this procedure should work for almost ALL receivers not working out there.

So, just extract the .inf file in the zip file attached and do step 3 of the procedure posted here. Reboot and you should bitstream like me.

Those of you with a different brand might just want to edit the .inf file attached and replace this two lines at the end of the file with your own brand name:

PRODUCTID="DENON-AVAMP (EDID Override)"
VENDOR="Denon"

In case of problems you can always rollback.

Enjoy guys!"

"You know, maybe THAT - the ID descriptor - is the key element of the PAP validation! I still can't figure out what's so special with the Denon EDID to break the PAP. I don't think there's any EDID parsing problem at all as multichannel PCM over HDMI is enabled with no issues.

Anyway will try playing with this and report back."

[Emilot]

Plus....to see the option for hd decoding...with 5xxx ATI...

From avsforum

"You have to play the blu ray first, then you will see the option, PDVD needs to be fed teh streams before it allows you to pass them though to the receiver"

[SamuriHL]

I'll give it a try this morning, albain, and see what happens. I took the Xonar out of my machine so I can't test with that. But I have bitstreaming working with PDVD9 so if this is correct now, it'll work on my setup.

[SamuriHL]

Same as before. Lights come on, no audio. Sorry.

[albain]

Could it be caused by the PAP altering the transmission ?

This is not normal on this one that you get no sound.

Have you tried with the arcsoft renderer ?

[SamuriHL]

I tried with every renderer I had installed. The arcsoft one never gives me anything. No signal sent to the receiver at all. PDVD9's renderer gave me LPCM this time. Direct Sound gave me lights but no audio. Same with ATI HDMI renderer. Honestly have no idea what's up with that. PAP shouldn't even be involved unless it's activated by the sending app afaik. What I do know is I no longer have the Xonar in the machine and that I can bitstream perfectly with PDVD9 now. I wish I knew what to tell you.

[albain]

There is also the audio driver that could require a PAP to pass a bitstream.
Or something else missing in FFDSHOW

Thanks anyway

[SamuriHL]

I wish I knew. WinDVD and PDVD9 are both able to bitstream with my 5870. WinDVD has bugs where it loses connection and has to re-handshake with the receiver. But it's able to bitstream. PDVD9 is flawless. I guess it's possible that the driver is blocking the bitstream if no PAP is detected. That would massively suck if that ends up being the case!

[albain]

Not necessarily, the PAP could be reproduced.

I found this article with sample code from MSDN :
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd756608%28VS.85%29.aspx

Also, I read from http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=84&topicid=45679 that PDVD9 does not bitstream when anydvdhd is on, which seems to confirm that a PAP is necessary

The good news from the MS article is that directsound can be used to bitstream over PAP.

I hope that Sebastii will be able to confirm this soon : the arcsoft renderer holds this part (PAP initialization) and with the xonar the last ffdshow should bitstream TrueHD correctly (and also maybe DTS HD) as it did for EAC3.

If this is confirmed, then the MPC audio renderer should be updated with this PAP part

[htpc66]

Also, I read from http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=84&topicid=45679 that PDVD9 does not bitstream when anydvdhd is on, which seems to confirm that a PAP is necessary


Albain, wonder what would you make of this statement (from CyberlinkUSA):

"PowerDVD doesn't care whether AnyDVD is running or not."

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17612160#post17612160

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

My AVR is again in SAV, so i hope i will receive it quickly, i have mange to find a friend next to me with AVR compatible with HD, but no success.

So i want to test :)
Seb.

Big Thx to all tester :) and specially to Albain and Co :)

[SamuriHL]

Whoever said PDVD9 doesn't bitstream with AnyDVD active is full of BS. I've done so on MANY movies over the weekend. ISOs and originals. I never disable AnyDVD for any reason. So that claim is 100% inaccurate. Now, I'm sure they're still doing PAP even on "unprotected" sources. In any case, I believe that you can bitstream with Direct Sound, as well. Your latest builds show the lights coming on, so, the receiver is receiving it, but, it's not able to decode the audio correctly and hence we get no sound. Something is still missing somewhere. :(

[rica]

Yes +1 samuri.
Btw i see the HD light on AVR and DTSHD MA but no sound at all.


http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/4074/dtshdma.th.png (http://img30.imageshack.us/i/dtshdma.png/)



_ _ _ _

[SamuriHL]

rica, did you try different audio renderers? I've tried all of them and while I got different results, none of them worked. I have not re-enabled debugging output in ffdshow with this latest version so I didn't get a chance to create logs.

[rica]

rica, did you try different audio renderers? I've tried all of them and while I got different results, none of them worked. I have not re-enabled debugging output in ffdshow with this latest version so I didn't get a chance to create logs.

Yes i did on Vista32 (for the time being)

Default Direct Sound and Arcsoft Audio Renderer recognised it as DD core and gave the sound. (the original is DTSHD-MA btw)

Cyberlink audio renderer gave nothing.

MPC Audio Renderer showed me DTSHD MA and blue light but no sound.

[SamuriHL]

Wonderful. Well, I don't know what to say about these results. We can see the lights, but, no one appears to be home. I can see them with Direct Sound, but, no audio. It would appear on W7 I'm getting different results than you are. That's just great.

[rica]

You know i have an Ati 5*** series card not a Xonar.
But i'm almost sure i would get the similar results on 7/64.

[SamuriHL]

My Xonar's not installed anymore. I'm only running the 5870 now.

[rica]

OK, i'll give it a go on 7/64 tomorrow.

[rica]

7/64 results:

With Ati HDMI Output or MPC HD Audio Renderer i got blue and DTSHD-MA light but no sound.

With Direct Sound and Cyberlink Audio Renderer i got nothing.

I don't have Arcsoft on my 7 btw.

[SamuriHL]

That's STILL different than my results! :(

Default Direct Show: DTS-HD MA light, no audio
ATI HDMI Renderer: DTS-HD MA light, no audio
Cyberlink: LPCM with audio
MPC: DTS-HD MA light, little pops here and there from different speakers

[rica]

That's STILL different than my results! :(

Default Direct Show: DTS-HD MA light, no audio
ATI HDMI Renderer: DTS-HD MA light, no audio
Cyberlink: LPCM with audio
MPC: DTS-HD MA light, little pops here and there from different speakers

What can i do?
You know i use tulli's edidoverride.

[SamuriHL]

You know i use tulli's edidoverride.

And I use my own custom override for my 606 that I made this afternoon. :) I can bitstream flawlessly in PDVD9. And WinDVD still has that wonderful bug of dropping audio every few seconds, but, at least bitstreams.

[rica]

So you should tell how to create your custom override here?

[SamuriHL]

For me it was super easy. Using moninfo on my laptop, I attached the laptop to the receiver using the same cable I have going to my HTPC. The reason is, the 5xxx cards are not able to read realtime EDID info. From there I just did a save as inf. The I copied the inf file to my HTPC, opened up dev manager, selected update driver/have disk, and selected the inf file (make sure it's the ONLY inf in the directory you put it in). Reboot after it's installed. Done. No more handshaking problems at ALL. And bitstreaming is flawless.

[rica]

Thanks but it seems to work for who has the laptop with an HDMI output? Or with a non-Ati HDMI output PC?
At least i have none of them and i created a crappy inf before which never worked at all.

[SamuriHL]

Right, this method requires a non-5xxx card. My laptop has a 3450 which is why I used it. There's no way to get realtime EDID info from a 5xxx card. That's a LOT of the issue.

[albain]

Hello,

currently this is hard to tell what's going on :

1/ The ATI driver would refuse non PAP streams (even if you see light on the receiver it does not necessarily mean that the stream is untouched)
=> I will add PAP support to MPC audio renderer on directsound mode (when I will have time)

2/ The streams must be formatted differently between arcsoft player for the xonar and powerdvd for the ATI
=> I wish the dumper would work on powerdvd. I will work on this when Sebastii will get his receiver back

3/ FFDShow implementation is wrong
=> I will check on this (also) when Sebastii will get his receiver : I really expect ffdshow=>arcsoft renderer=>xonar to work

I am pretty confident on point 3.

Lastly, I am waiting for the release of the passive ATI 5750 for not being "blind" anymore

[SamuriHL]

If no one's tested #3 by tomorrow I'll throw my Xonar in, reinstall it, and give it a try for you. I just don't really want to put it back unless I absolutely have to as I FINALLY have my system running perfectly now without it. #2 doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Shouldn't the streams be formatted the same in order for the receiver to understand and be able to decode them?? :confused: #1 is certainly possible, though. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if the driver refused the stream without PAP being enabled. That does suck though if true.

[albain]

No problem, I can work on some things meanwhile

I have to try the following structure as it seems that it is the same used by windvd and powerdvd towards ATI 5xxx

WAVEFORMATEX
wFormatTag : 576
Channels : 2
Bits per sample : 16
Samples per second :48000
nBlockAlign : 4

Also, I have never seen logs from the dumper since the patch is out on powerdvd.

Could you post me one ? I know that powerdvd crash but there are a few things that are dumped out before it crashes (i.e the media structure)

Thanks

Concerning point #2 : IEC61937 (HD bitstream formats) gives rules (that must be followed, for example syncwords, headers...) and recommandations (that are free to follow).
For example for TrueHD Arcsoft uses 61440 bytes for each buffer which is the maximum size and fill its buffers with multiple audio frames.
So other players can formats streams differently and use variable sizes.
And the GPU driver which has to encapsulate those streams with the video part into HDMI can handle things differently too

[Skinleech]

Sorry folks, was out of the country for the last 6 days, and with very limited internet access - when I had the time to check here the forum was down and I didn't think to check the overall doom9 page for info.

I'll get working on testing the latest build with my Xonar later tonight & post back results.

[Sebastiii]

Hi :)

I will try tonight to make log with last patch on PDVD :)
Seb

No avr again, snif !!!!

[albain]

Great ! thank you guys

[albain]

Hi again,

here is a new build (http://damienbt.free.fr/ffdshow_rev3128_20091201_dbt_bitstream_beta43_alternateformat.exe) with the alternate mediatypes (same as windvd)

[Skinleech]

No good news I'm afraid. I can only assume this is an issue with the new FFdshow build as I have made no other changes to the system.

I've managed to get Graphstudio working, but any time I load in the required filters (MPC splitter, ffdshow audio decoder, Arcsoft audio renderer) and connect the pins AC3 Filter automaticially loads inbetween Ffdshow and Arcsoft. If I delete AC3 Filter and try to connect again, it still inserts itself. Using MPC as I normally do, and blocking Ac3 Filterm and setting Ffdshow to prefer doesn't work either - Ffdshow will not load, and I'm left with an alternate audio decoder, such as Dscaler.

Weird. The HTPC is off for now, but I will try again soon.

EDIT: I'll try the new build too.

[SamuriHL]

Now all I get is LPCM decoded tracks??? :confused: Doesn't matter what renderer I use.

[Skinleech]

NO change for me in the new build - any file with HD audio codecs and Ffdshow does not load. If I choose a file with a lossy codec it comes up fine.

[albain]

Ok, forget this one. This was just a shot

[whurlston]

I must be doing something wrong apparently. It seems I'm the only one who is getting TrueHD bitstreaming with build 42.

[albain]

I must be doing something wrong apparently. It seems I'm the only one who is getting TrueHD bitstreaming with build 42.

What do you mean exactly ?

[whurlston]

TrueHD bitstreams using the test file.

My John Mayer 96/24 gives static however. I tried another movie but that didn't bitstream.

I'm going to check the test file for the bitrate/depth and see if I have a movie to match it.

I'll keep you informed.

Edit: the "i must be doing something wrong" was a joke. I couldn't find where anyone else got TrueHD bitstream to work, maybe I missed it though.

[whurlston]

Here are the debug logs (I don't know if they'll help).

I notice they have differing media types but I don't know if that is the issue.

[liquidskin76]

@Albain

I'll test this evening (8 hours from now... uk time!) on my Xonar if Sebastiii or SamuriHL haven't already tested, using the 'Beta42 - Xonar - Arcsoft Renderer' combo as requested.

Keep up the hard work my friend!

[liquidskin76]

I must be doing something wrong apparently. It seems I'm the only one who is getting TrueHD bitstreaming with build 42.

@whurlston

What card are you running... ATI 5xxx or Xonar?

Cheers

[albain]

@whurlston : can you repost your logs somewhere else because the forum approvals are very slow... thanks

[SamuriHL]

OMG! Whurlston is right!!!! I just reinstalled 42 and tried one of my TrueHD tracks and it bitstreamed!!!!!!! I got audio! It was broken up a bit, but, I got audio!!!!!!! I'd been so focused on DTS-HD MA that I must have not run this one file through build 42. Will need to set the deugging keys again before I can get logs to post. But it works!!! Actual real live bitstreaming!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SamuriHL]

Ok, now I know why I didn't catch this before. It doesn't work with all my test material. I have 2 TrueHD files. (And am downloading another one purported to work) Only 1 of them bitstreams. The other does not. So there's some work left to be done here. But the fact is, I have a file that can actually bitstream with audio now!!!!

[whurlston]

@whurlston : can you repost your logs somewhere else because the forum approvals are very slow... thanks

Sure.

http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/NonWorkingTrueHD.txt
http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/WorkingTrueHD.txt

Tests were done with an ATI 5770, a Yamaha RX-V863 and GraphStudio using the following filters:

MPC - MPEG Source (Gabest)
ffdshow Audio Decoder (bitstream build 42)
Default DirectSound Renderer (ATI HDMI from 9.11)

I can't remember which video filter but it's irrelevant.

[SamuriHL]

whurlston, do you get audio breakups when playing? I tried the file you gave me and it works as well as the file I have...basically it does bitstream with audio, but, I get random dropouts here and there. (Nothing like WinDVD, but, still)

[renethx]

Congratulations, albain. TrueHD bitstreaming is finally working!

HD 5750
Catalyst 9.11
MPC HomeCinema v1.3.1330.0 with internal M2TS source/splitter filter and video decoder
ffdshow beta 42
Windows default audio renderer
TrueHD 7.1ch 96KHz.m2ts (http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=05fb19b4b2e4495ee7c82ed4b8f0c380e04e75f6e8ebb871) & TEST_7.1_TRUEHD.m2ts (http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/TEST_7.1_TRUEHD.m2ts)
ONKYO TX-SA606X

[whurlston]

whurlston, do you get audio breakups when playing? I tried the file you gave me and it works as well as the file I have...basically it does bitstream with audio, but, I get random dropouts here and there. (Nothing like WinDVD, but, still)

I sometimes get dropouts when running DebugView but otherwise, no.

[SamuriHL]

I sometimes get dropouts when running DebugView but otherwise, no.

Hmmm. I am getting some audio dropouts in there, but, I also haven't turned on debug tracing yet, so, it could be a weird timing issue. Also I've yet to get any DTS-MA HD material to bitstream which is frustrating. And I have at least 1 file with TrueHD that doesn't work. So there are some issues, but, at least we know it's possible and that PAP isn't necessary. This is a huge breakthrough!

[liquidskin76]

@SamuriHL

Have you resurrected your Xonar yet? If not, don't worry with the hassle as i'll be testing in a few hours.

Hopefully we'll see the same results with the Xonar... maybe even better with the Xonar/Arcsoft Renderer combo!!!

[SamuriHL]

I have not. It's still sitting on top of the machine. My original plan was to use it in my bedroom HTPC for analog, but, two problems with that one. 1) I didn't get the actual deluxe model, just the regular HDAV 1.3, so, I don't have the daughter board with it. sigh. 2) It won't fit in my bedroom machine's case. So, it sits useless until I figure out what I wanna do with it.

[Skinleech]

I will have another look with beta 42 on the Xonar just now.

[SamuriHL]

The audio dropouts I was getting were only happening in graphstudio. If I open it in MPC-HC, it's flawless. Most impressive.

[SamuriHL]

I think I see a pattern here. Anything touched by tsMuxer doesn't seem to want to bitstream. Whurlston, that file you gave me, not touched with tsMuxer? I'm willing to bet it wasn't.

[whurlston]

The audio dropouts I was getting were only happening in graphstudio. If I open it in MPC-HC, it's flawless. Most impressive.

Were you using the FileSource (Async) connected to a demux to open the file? Or were you using the MPC source filter?

I think I see a pattern here. Anything touched by tsMuxer doesn't seem to want to bitstream. Whurlston, that file you gave me, not touched with tsMuxer? I'm willing to bet it wasn't.

No it wasn't but then neither are any of my other m2ts files but that's the only one I got to work. I think renethx has a second file that worked.

[Skinleech]

Well well. I had the exact same issue as I reported yesterday, with ac3 filter appearing in the chain. I simply unchecked ac3 and DTS from the ffdshow passthrough option and yep, the sample file bitstreamed with very little stutter. I only tried one other TrueHD track (Payback) which gave no sound. DTS-HD MA showed up on the AVR, but no sound.

The Payback m2ts and DTS-HD MA m2ts were not touched by TSMuxer, they are the direct dump m2ts files. Could it be the other audo tracks causing issues? I can't do any further tests until later now.

This was graphstudio btw.

[madshi]

I believe there are some unknown bytes in the bitstream where albain doesn't know what purpose they have. Maybe for the TrueHD files which don't work, these bytes have a different value? I guess albain would need logs from his hook utility to be sure about that. Just guessing here, though...

[SamuriHL]

Were you using the FileSource (Async) connected to a demux to open the file? Or were you using the MPC source filter?


The way I do graphstudio is I right click on the file and say "open with..." and select graphstudio. It then builds a graph for me. (I've said many times I'm lazy! :D) It uses the MPC-MPEG Splitter and creates connections to the ffdshow audio decoder to whatever renderer I want (DirectSound by default) and the MS DTV-DVD Video Decoder for video.


No it wasn't but then neither are any of my other m2ts files but that's the only one I got to work. I think renethx has a second file that worked.

Yea, I'm seeing that now. :( I was hoping the tsMuxer thing would pan out, but, opening Star Trek 2009 directly from disc isn't playing, either. Lights, no audio. I hope albain can use this data to figure out what's up.

@albain, if you need logs from me let me know.

[SamuriHL]

I believe there are some unknown bytes in the bitstream where albain doesn't know what purpose they have. Maybe for the TrueHD files which don't work, these bytes have a different value? I guess albain would need logs from his hook utility to be sure about that. Just guessing here, though...

That's a good possibility. I wish it worked on 64 bit. I'd run it for him now but it no workie for me. sigh. This is at least encouraging for a few reasons. It validates a few things for us:

1) No need for a custom audio renderer for bitstreaming
2) No need for PAP as the driver happily passes it along without it

These are really important findings as they weren't known for sure until now.

[crisscross]

Nice breakthrough! Will a working solution here pave the way for full (no downconverting) range analogue playback with non-PAP soundcards? Or is that a total different matter?

[SamuriHL]

Both from MPC-HC

Working: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d3efb44d8
Not Working: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d13d0de10

I hope these logs help show something useful. The first one works and gives audio. The second one doesn't even give me lights in MPC-HC. It does in graphstudio but no audio.

[SamuriHL]

Nice breakthrough! Will a working solution here pave the way for full (no downconverting) range analogue playback with non-PAP soundcards? Or is that a total different matter?

Very different issue. For that you have to decode to LPCM for which no decoder exists for DTS-HD MA. TrueHD should be possible already.

[crisscross]

Very different issue. For that you have to decode to LPCM for which no decoder exists for DTS-HD MA. TrueHD should be possible already.
Really? I was under the impression that for analogue out I would just need decoding of all the channels (LPCM is for digital out isnt it, or is it a middle step TrueHD->LPCM->analogue out?). I was also under the impression that it is always downconverted to 16/48 without PAP.

[SamuriHL]

Really? I was under the impression that for analogue out I would just need decoding of all the channels (LPCM is for digital out isnt it, or is it a middle step TrueHD->LPCM->analogue out?). I was also under the impression that it is always downconverted to 16/48 without PAP.

ALL audio gets decoded to LPCM at some point in the process, even for analog. Consider LPCM the "raw" format that contains information for each channel. A compressed format like TrueHD or DTS-HD MA needs to be decoded to play, either by the player or the receiver depending on if you're bitstreaming or not. The same is true for analog playback of those formats, except in that case, it MUST be the player that decodes it to raw LPCM. So for TrueHD and LPCM, you're golden as is with the latest ffdshow as it can decode TrueHD to bit perfect LPCM for playback on your analog device. DTS-HD MA, however, can't be decoded. Only the core DTS track can be decoded. Still decent quality, but, not the full HD you're looking for. I have no idea when or if that situation is ever going to get resolved. I don't know of anyone working on an open DTS-HD MA decoder, but, it would be nice.

[Emilot]

Where is Albain, "the man who rule them all......"???

Congrats man....

[albain]

Hi,

I had so much work today that I didn't read the "news"

Thanks everyone for your support !

The credits are not to be given to me only but to madshi and all the patients testers who stand 42 betas before getting to something working :thanks:

I will spend some time tomorrow on those logs you sent me to find out what's wrong with non working samples (but I have a little idea) and then working on DTS HD then on LPCM

This is a great step forward indeed : no more blind stepping, now the solution is here, no PAP, no custom renderer, and full compatibility with existing directshow players.
I also expect FFDShow to work today with the xonar and tomorrow with the azuentech (thanks to the multi-media structures trial feature inside FFDShow).

[albain]

@SamuriHL : can you give me the specifications of the working/non working samples, i.e.

Number of channels : 5.1, 7.1
Sample rate : 48000, 96000, 192000

Thanks

EDIT : I think I know

Working : 96000Hz 7.1
Non working : 48000Hz 5.1

The media structures sent are different : this is the key I guess. This is also I think the same cause for DTS HD

The bitstream is correct I think (because I worked from 48000 5.1 samples)

[SamuriHL]

Sure, NP.

Working: 7.1, 96000, 98767kbps according to ffdshow
Non-Working: 48000, 5.1, 5445kbps according to ffdshow

The working one is the sample you gave us originally. The non-working one is a transformers sample that was posted here a while back. Well, I have LOTS of non-working ones, but, the one the log came from. :D

[SamuriHL]

The other file that works is:

7.1, 48000, 5844kbps

I did not log this one.

[albain]

Okay thanks, are non working all 5.1 ?

[SamuriHL]

Hmmm. That's an interesting question. :) Um, I believe that might be the case for my TrueHD tracks, yes. You're going to make me go through them all and find another 7.1 track to test on, aren't you? :p I can tell you that DTS-HD MA I've tried both 7.1 and 5.1 so that's a different issue. However, TrueHD...I believe you are correct, that the 5.1 tracks are not working. I'll see if I can find another 7.1 THD track in my library to test with.

[albain]

I believe there are some unknown bytes in the bitstream where albain doesn't know what purpose they have. Maybe for the TrueHD files which don't work, these bytes have a different value? I guess albain would need logs from his hook utility to be sure about that. Just guessing here, though...

No they are fixed (and I am sure of that)


Differences are the following :

- Non working : dwChannelMask : 63
- Working : dwChannelMask : 255

- Non working : channels : 6
- Working : channels : 8

I think that channels should always be 8 afterwards, this is not the real channel number because this is based on encoded content and it is used to calculate the blockalign which is also different.
This MS documents tends to confirm this (but I am not 100% sure) : http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd316761%28VS.85%29.aspx

This is my lead for now

[albain]

Here is an updated build (http://damienbt.free.fr/ffdshow_rev3128_20091202_dbt_bitstream_beta44.exe) : I hope that 5.1 THD will work

I also changed the DTS HD structure (not sure of that one though)

[SamuriHL]

http://price-adjustment.com/BLURAY-audio

Posting that here so I don't lose it again and for other people to have it for reference. :) I have found one of my 7.1 THD titles. As you surmise.......IT WORKS :) You have found the issue my friend! Well done!!!!!

[Skinleech]

So, in theory, if a 7.1, 96000 track works, and tracks with less channels and differing sample rates don't, I guess another 7.1, 96000 track will maybe work too?

Going to try and find one on my disks.

EDIT: Came late to the party and missed all the posts above.

Will post Xonar logs soon with the new build.

[SamuriHL]

Oh albain. I love you man. :D That fixed 5.1. :D :D :D :D :D :D

[SamuriHL]

Oh, btw. DTS-HD MA is working now, too. :D No, I'm not joking. Holy crap!

[Skinleech]

Oh, btw. DTS-HD MA is working now, too. :D No, I'm not joking. Holy crap!

Whaaa! Amazing! Just waiting for the file to dl now, the HTPC is fired up and ready to go!

[SamuriHL]

Well, it's working on a test sample I have for DTS-HD MA. It's not working in MPC-HC and it's not working on my actual movies.

[SamuriHL]

Hmmmm....well, it's working kinda odd for me. I load up my standard ISO image of a 7.1 DTS-HD MA movie and in graphstudio, that actually bitstreams correctly. The audio is all over the place in terms of breaking up, dropping out, etc, but, there's audio which is a first. I can NOT get it to play in MPC-HC at all. It just does DTS. So, I think it's REALLY damn close, man, but, there's a couple issues to fix up. TrueHD, golden. :)

[liquidskin76]

@Skinleech,

What renderer are you using with your Xonar on the working TrueHD bitstream? Also, is the sample 5.1 or 7.1?


@Albain,

Using 'Beta42 - Xonar - Arcsoft Renderer' i get TrueHD showing on avr however no audio. FFDShow reports output as 'HDMI Bitstream (1402)'.

It's a 5.1 channel file however it's showing as 7.1 on my Sony ST-DG820 avr.

Here the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m3171cda3

Also (you may expect this), it only works with debug enabled and Dbgview running, otherwise the sample hangs.

The 'MPC - Audio Renderer' and 'Default Directshow Device' either cause the sample to hang or play ok with FFDshow reporting the output as '48000 hz, 6 channel 16 bit integer'.

Well done so far man!

[EDIT:] Sorry, catching up with the most recent posts! I'll test with beta44.

[SamuriHL]

@Skinleech,

What renderer are you using with your Xonar on the working TrueHD bitstream? Also, is the sample 5.1 or 7.1?


@Albain,

Using 'Beta42 - Xonar - Arcsoft Renderer' i get TrueHD showing on avr however no audio. FFDShow reports output as 'HDMI Bitstream (1402)'.

It's a 5.1 channel file however it's showing as 7.1 on my Sony ST-DG820 avr.

Here the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m3171cda3

Also (you may expect this), it only works with debug enabled and Dbgview running, otherwise the sample hangs.

The 'MPC - Audio Renderer' and 'Default Directshow Device' either cause the sample to hang or play ok with FFDshow reporting the output as '48000 hz, 6 channel 16 bit integer'.

Well done so far man!

Hey pay attention, will ya? He's on to beta 44 now. :p LOL! And THD 5.1 and 7.1 are working! DTS-HD MA is giving audio in graphstudio. So, major progress here!! Try again with 44 and see what happens. Note i'm not on the Xonar, so, your results may vary.

[liquidskin76]

I know man, i was eating tea! Serves me right for stopping to eat!!

Testing now.

[SamuriHL]

I know man, i was eating tea! Serves me right for stopping to eat!!

Testing now.

Just giving you a hard time. :) I want other people testing DTS-HD MA because I can NOT get it to work in MPC-HC with any renderer. TrueHD is golden with a bunch of the renderer's I've tried. Not with arcsoft or cyberlink, but, directsound, all the "ati" ones, waveout, etc. All work. So, TrueHD is done IMO. :) On to DTS-HD MA I say! :D

[albain]

Hmmmm....well, it's working kinda odd for me. I load up my standard ISO image of a 7.1 DTS-HD MA movie and in graphstudio, that actually bitstreams correctly. The audio is all over the place in terms of breaking up, dropping out, etc, but, there's audio which is a first. I can NOT get it to play in MPC-HC at all. It just does DTS. So, I think it's REALLY damn close, man, but, there's a couple issues to fix up. TrueHD, golden. :)

Great news, what a relieve, love you too for all these great news.
Do you have a big red coat with a white beard and like cold ;-)

About MPC : beware that the M2TS splitter strips off the DTS HD blocks to only keep the core.

I committed a fix recently (into MPC-HC repository) so you have to grab a very recent version of MPC HC

Otherwise the MKV splitter is fine (DTS HD blocks are untouched)

[SamuriHL]

Great news

About MPC : beware that the M2TS splitter strips off the DTS HD blocks to only keep the core.

I committed a fix recently (into MPC-HC repository) so you have to grab a very recent version of MPC HC

Otherwise the MKV splitter is fine (DTS HD blocks are untouched)

Oh, um, well, that'd explain that then. I'm running with a fairly old MPC-HC build. Guess it's time to upgrade. However, DTS-HD MA is still giving me problems. With Default DirectSound in graphstudio I get audio. With any other renderer it's not locking on. Something screwy's going on there. I badly need someone else with a 5xxx card to test their results.

TrueHD...you da man! :)

[liquidskin76]

YEEEHAAAAA!!! TrueHD is bitstreaming on 'Beta44 - Xonar - Arcsoft Renderer' with good audio from GraphStudio!!

I'll test in the most recent build of MPC-HC.

DTS-HD is giving DTS core. Here's the logs for DTS-HD... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2ba86ed0

Great work Albain... i love you man.

[Skinleech]

OK here are my results with the Xonar. Liquidskin, I am using the Arcsoft renderer from TMT 3.

True HD: I have mixed results, some files work, others dont. The avr picks up THD and I get sound, but its stuttery. Working tracks are 5.1, 48000, not working are the 7.1 96000 and another 5.1, 48000

Working: http://pastebin.com/m705b11da
Not Working: http://pastebin.com/m5d769e5

DTS-HD MA: More mixed results. m2ts gives me PCM that's garbled (possible due to the issue in post 9575, will try a new MPC build) wheares mkv with Haali works audio wise, but the video is a slideshow.

Working (mkv): http://pastebin.com/m63c4b5a1
Not working (m2ts): http://pastebin.com/m12ce6388

[liquidskin76]

Sweet... TrueHD also bitstreaming ok on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer' within graphstudio from MKV container!

[SamuriHL]

I got DTS-HD MA working with the latest SVN build. :D Flawless. :D :D Thanks, albain!!!! You ARE da man!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[liquidskin76]

holy shit... DTS-HD is bitstreaming with good audio on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer' within graphstudio from MKV container!!!!!!!!!!

Albain, you are GOD!

[Skinleech]

I got DTS-HD MA working with the latest SVN build. :D Flawless. :D :D Thanks, albain!!!! You ARE da man!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yep, I got an HR track working perfectly, my netowrk went down to can't check MA yet - currently rebooting. Superb!

Oh, and TrueHD tracks that work also work once tsmuxered for me.

Thank you albain!

[SamuriHL]

Grab the latest SVN version of MPC-HC and you're done. You can open DTS-HD MA and TrueHD discs and/or files and it bitstreams flawlessly. Albain, CONGRATS!!!! WELL FREAKING DONE!!!! Absolutely amazing work.

[liquidskin76]

@SamuriHL,

Have you got the link to the most recent MPC-HC download?

[Skinleech]

Sweet... TrueHD also bitstreaming ok on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer' within graphstudio from MKV container!

What splitter are you using mate?

[SamuriHL]

@SamuriHL,

Have you got the link to the most recent MPC-HC download?

I just happen to have that open for some odd reason, yes. ;)

http://www.xvidvideo.ru/media-player-classic-home-cinema-x86-x64/media-player-classic-homecinema-x86-x64-svn-1373.html

Enjoy everyone! This is freaking phenomenal!!!!

[Emilot]

From Greece Albain and the rest of the team....For Those About to Rock.....

WE SALUTE YOU!!!!

[albain]

GreatGreatGreatGreat...Great

I understand that there are still issues concerning the xonar : this does not surprise me as I send the same media structures to arcsoft renderer whatever the input format is.

To fix this I need dumper logs from the xonar owner using TMT on non working samples in order to reproduce the structure correctly

Same thing with the azuentech with powerdvd (even if it crashes I can see the structures too).

Then next step is non regression tests on FFDShow before merging the SVN bitstream branch to the trunk (there is a lot of new code) : on PCM, regular AC3 and DTS especially


Something that I realized recently that has nothing to do with audio : ASS/SSA subtitles are renderer completely differently than regular (SRT) ones. Someone knows about this ?
I remember that Haruhiko implemented memory tracking in subtitles but did he implemented a new subtitles renderer ?

[Skinleech]

Great stuff albain, thanks. I got a working m2ts with DTS-HD MA, a non working one (stutters, PCM) and a non working HR track (PCM, no stutters).

I can arrnage to post samples here to sebastii can pick them up if he is happy to take a look at them.

Superb work my man, superb!

[liquidskin76]

What splitter are you using mate?

Matroska Splitter v1.0.2.9. Haali Media splitter i believe cannot see TrueHD.

@Albain,

DTS-HD on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer' from m2ts container within graphstudio still only gives DTS core.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2d0662c7

Cheers!

[Skinleech]

Matroska Splitter v1.0.2.9. Haali Media splitter i believe cannot see TrueHD.

No, it can't. Thanks for the info. The MPC-HC splitter seems to work ok too.

[liquidskin76]

No, it can't. Thanks for the info. The MPC-HC splitter seems to work ok too.

Tell a lie... just checked and that's the one i'm using!

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

It's great ;), i can't test myself, but it's very very very coooooooool to the hard work that Albain Madshi and Co :)

I'm very happy, so yes you can send me sample for testing with TMT and i can post LOG :)

Very great news :)
Seb.

[SamuriHL]

Seb, you're going to have a lot of work to do with the Xonar I think. :) I'm on 64 bit so even if I put mine back in I'm not going to be able to dump the info albain needs to get Xonar users fixed up. This is so amazing. albain's persistence was remarkable but it certainly has paid off!! We should all step back for just a moment and really contemplate what he accomplished here. Bitstreaming of TrueHD and DTS-HD MA, in an open environment, with no PAP or other restrictions. *********************! :)

[albain]

Matroska Splitter v1.0.2.9. Haali Media splitter i believe cannot see TrueHD.

@Albain,

DTS-HD on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer' from m2ts container within graphstudio still only gives DTS core.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2d0662c7

Cheers!

FFDShow don't see the DTS HD blocks. You don't have the right spllitter.

Try to register this one (http://damienbt.free.fr/MpegSplitter.ax)

Here is also a recent MPC-HC build (with DTS HD) (http://damienbt.free.fr/mpc-hc.exe)

[liquidskin76]

FFDShow don't see the DTS HD blocks. You don't have the right spllitter.

Try to register this one (http://damienbt.free.fr/MpegSplitter.ax)

Here is also a recent MPC-HC build (with DTS HD) (http://damienbt.free.fr/mpc-hc.exe)

Ok, testing now.

Thanks

[crisscross]

ALL audio gets decoded to LPCM at some point in the process, even for analog. Consider LPCM the "raw" format that contains information for each channel. A compressed format like TrueHD or DTS-HD MA needs to be decoded to play, either by the player or the receiver depending on if you're bitstreaming or not. The same is true for analog playback of those formats, except in that case, it MUST be the player that decodes it to raw LPCM. So for TrueHD and LPCM, you're golden as is with the latest ffdshow as it can decode TrueHD to bit perfect LPCM for playback on your analog device. DTS-HD MA, however, can't be decoded. Only the core DTS track can be decoded. Still decent quality, but, not the full HD you're looking for. I have no idea when or if that situation is ever going to get resolved. I don't know of anyone working on an open DTS-HD MA decoder, but, it would be nice.
Ah thank you for that explanation! Thats great news. I guess the technical reason behind that is that ffdshow bypasses PAP by not going via the sound card drivers?

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Still getting DTS core with GraphStudio using xonar.

Here's the log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m335f8fc8

Testing with your MPC-HC now.

Thanks

[SamuriHL]

Ah thank you for that explanation! Thats great news. I guess the technical reason behind that is that ffdshow bypasses PAP by not going via the sound card drivers?

There's no "bypassing" PAP involved. PAP is used by an "official" player that's trying to bitstream. It's a requirement of the studios for all licensed PC players to use PAP in order to be allowed to play full bitrate audio that's not downsampled. ffdshow doesn't care about that requirement to downsample. It simply didn't bother implementing it. :D So LPCM can be sent over analog to your receiver no problem. That means TrueHD decoded to LPCM will work just fine. In theory, if there was a DTS-HD MA decoder available, you'd be able to decode that to LPCM and send that, as well. In any case, PAP isn't the issue. It's the requirement for licensed players to downsample that's the issue. ffdshow doesn't bother with that nonsense. :)

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Just to summarize on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer'...

GraphStudio

From m2ts container... TrueHD working great. DTS-HD giving DTS core.
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m6b53dcb1

From MKV container... both TrueHD and DTS-HD working great!

MPC-HC (SVN 1373)

From m2ts container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD is giving DTS core.
TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7b37a2dc
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m5d22fc24

From MKV container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD not working, no audio and showing as Dolby Digital on AVR!!
TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2729c620
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7e2cda62


Do you want me to test with the dumper tool?

[SamuriHL]

Holy snikes. I just checked my cpu usage with MPC-HC bitstreaming a DTS-HD MA ISO image. Is 5% cpu usage bad? :eek: WOW! :D I love this!!!!!

[crisscross]

There's no "bypassing" PAP involved. PAP is used by an "official" player that's trying to bitstream. It's a requirement of the studios for all licensed PC players to use PAP in order to be allowed to play full bitrate audio that's not downsampled. ffdshow doesn't care about that requirement to downsample. It simply didn't bother implementing it. :D So LPCM can be sent over analog to your receiver no problem. That means TrueHD decoded to LPCM will work just fine. In theory, if there was a DTS-HD MA decoder available, you'd be able to decode that to LPCM and send that, as well. In any case, PAP isn't the issue. It's the requirement for licensed players to downsample that's the issue. ffdshow doesn't bother with that nonsense. :)
Ok, but I am not talking about sending anything digital to my receiver. I am talking about analog out (ie using the dacs of my soundcard) from my soundcard directly to amps. But I guess its the same case with that? Solved for bitstreaming and LPCM should mean solved for analog out?

[whurlston]

I'm not able to get TrueHD bitstreaming with Resident Evil 3 or John Mayer. DTS-HD works on everything I've tried so far though.

I'll post some logs a little later but I have to run out.

[SamuriHL]

Ok, but I am not talking about sending anything digital to my receiver. I am talking about analog out (ie using the dacs of my soundcard) from my soundcard directly to amps. But I guess its the same case with that? Solved for bitstreaming and LPCM should mean solved for analog out?

I don't think I'm explaining this very well. Let me try again.

For HDMI bitstreaming:
albain's latest solves this issue for us 5xxx owners and we can bitstream to our heart's content. This has absolutely _0_ to do with what you're trying to accomplish. Nothing at all. Does not apply one bit.

For analog:
In order to play HD audio tracks on analog, they *MUST* be converted to LPCM. The LPCM is then used to drive each channel in your analog set up. To do this, DTS-HD MA and TrueHD tracks must be decoded by the player to LPCM, and then the player sends each channel to the appropriate analog output (center, front left, front right, surround left, surround right, sub, etc). That's controlled by the player using the raw LPCM data. There is absolutely *NO* way to send uncompressed data using analog to a receiver. I repeat...you can NOT bitstream with analog. You MUST allow the player to decode it, and the player then sends the channels to the correct analog output.

This is of course a vastly simplified view of things, but, it gets the idea across (I hope). So to recap, you an do discs that have native LPCM and TrueHD as ffdshow can decode TrueHD and obviously the LPCM is what you want anyway. DTS-HD MA does not have a decoder available. The best you can do is DTS core on those discs. Still, not a bad deal considering it's all open software with no restrictions. :)

[SamuriHL]

I'm not able to get TrueHD bitstreaming with Resident Evil 3 or John Mayer. DTS-HD works on everything I've tried so far though.

I'll post some logs a little later but I have to run out.

Will try RE3 now.

[SamuriHL]

Ummmm, ffdshow isn't even trying to bitstream RE3 as a TrueHD track. It's decoding to LPCM for me. Log coming up.

[dehati_paul]

Guys - Great job on this one! This clearly shows what "open source" can do!!

I have a quick question (to clarify my confusion) - Are you using/outputting from the Xonar or ATI 5xxx to make the latest ffdshow bitstream TrueHD and DTS-HD work?

I have the Xonar but not the ATI 5xxx, so I am wondering if I need to dump $150 to hear the sweet sound of bitstreaming.

[SamuriHL]

Uhhhh, albain?? Can you please look at this one?!

RE3: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d5a862f3d

What's up with that??

[SamuriHL]

Guys - Great job on this one! This clearly shows what "open source" can do!!

I have a quick question (to clarify my confusion) - Are you using/outputting from the Xonar or ATI 5xxx to make the latest ffdshow bitstream TrueHD and DTS-HD work?

I have the Xonar but not the ATI 5xxx, so I am wondering if I need to dump $150 to hear the sweet sound of bitstreaming.

I'm using my 5870 and it's working 99% for me (see RE3 issue we're having). Others are using the Xonar with mixed success. Albain will clean up the remaining Xonar issues when he gets the data he needs. Hang in there. albain's not done yet. But this is an absolutely incredible leap forward!

[liquidskin76]

Guys - Great job on this one! This clearly shows what "open source" can do!!

I have a quick question (to clarify my confusion) - Are you using/outputting from the Xonar or ATI 5xxx to make the latest ffdshow bitstream TrueHD and DTS-HD work?

I have the Xonar but not the ATI 5xxx, so I am wondering if I need to dump $150 to hear the sweet sound of bitstreaming.

Both however the result vary at the moment. When Albain has sorted, both should work!

[rica]

Home Premium 7/64. Ati 5770 -Ati drivers and tulli patch.

ffdshow beta 44.

I can't see ffdshow under Program files so can not see it in external filters of latest 64 build of MPC-HC; finally i'm not able to try it.

I can see ffdshow audio decoder on GraphStudio and i get DD core/or LPCM.

What's wrong with me???

Albain pls get an Ati card asap :p

[liquidskin76]

But this is an absolutely incredible leap forward!

Slight understatement! The creation of planet earth, birth of jesus, and moon landings all pale in comparison!!!

[dehati_paul]

I'm using my 5870 and it's working 99% for me (see RE3 issue we're having). Others are using the Xonar with mixed success. Albain will clean up the remaining Xonar issues when he gets the data he needs. Hang in there. albain's not done yet. But this is an absolutely incredible leap forward!
It is a GIANT leap indeed!! We are finally free from the shackles of PDVD and TMT software crap.

SamuriHL, quick question on the side - what chain are you using (e.g. MPC-HC -> ffdshow -> renderer -> ATI)? Also is it working only in graphstudio or direcly from file with your favourite player?

[SamuriHL]

Home Premium 7/64. Ati 5770 -Ati drivers and tulli patch.

ffdshow beta 44.

I can't see ffdshow under Program files so can not see it in external filters of latest 64 build of MPC-HC; finally i'm not able to try it.

I can see ffdshow audio decoder on GraphStudio and i get DD core/or LPCM.

What's wrong with me???

Albain pls get an Ati card asap :p

Use 32 bit MPC-HC. I'm on 64 bit OS, too, but you wanna use 32 bit MPC-HC for this.

[liquidskin76]

@Albain,

Just to summarize on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer'...

GraphStudio

From m2ts container... TrueHD working great. DTS-HD giving DTS core.
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m6b53dcb1

From MKV container... both TrueHD and DTS-HD working great!

MPC-HC (SVN 1373)

From m2ts container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD is giving DTS core.
TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7b37a2dc
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m5d22fc24

From MKV container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD not working, no audio and showing as Dolby Digital on AVR!!
TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2729c620
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7e2cda62


Do you want me to test with the dumper tool?

Albain,

Gonna watch transformers 2 now (on PS3 slim!) however i'll check-in in a bit.

[SamuriHL]

Slight understatement! The creation of planet earth, birth of jesus, and moon landings all pale in comparison!!!

LOL! No kidding. Absolutely amazing. 44 betas. WOW!

[SamuriHL]

It is a GIANT leap indeed!! We are finally free from the shackles of PDVD and TMT software crap.

SamuriHL, quick question on the side - what chain are you using (e.g. MPC-HC -> ffdshow -> renderer -> ATI)? Also is it working only in graphstudio or direcly from file with your favourite player?

I have albain's MPC splitter installed, so, what I do for files is right click, say "open with", select graph studio, and let it build me a graph. :D I'm lazy, what can I say. :) This gives me audio with stutter and dropouts, but, that's just graph studio being fun. To actually USE this, I load up MPC-HC. The instructions I've given to others is like this:

-Install MPC-HC
-Install ffdshow beta 44
-Configure ffdshow, on options page check all passthrough options
-Configure options for MPC-HC. Add ffdshow audio decoder to external filters and set to prefer
-Output in MPC-HC...pick your favorite working renderer. I'm using default directsound
-File, open DVD, select your BD and enjoy. :)

[Sebastiii]

Seb, you're going to have a lot of work to do with the Xonar I think. :) I'm on 64 bit so even if I put mine back in I'm not going to be able to dump the info albain needs to get Xonar users fixed up. This is so amazing. albain's persistence was remarkable but it certainly has paid off!! We should all step back for just a moment and really contemplate what he accomplished here. Bitstreaming of TrueHD and DTS-HD MA, in an open environment, with no PAP or other restrictions. *********************! :)

Yes you're right :) it's amazing stuf :)
So i'm ready now with xonar to log if it's necessary, i have test it now with my sample and it's working on my new fresh Install (i must have to format my OS because viruses come in).
So i have a clean and good system to work and help on W7 32bit Xonar and ATI (but with ATI i must test when my AVR HD come back from sav because without it i can only see 2 channel). But i'm ok on Xonar but blind on sound because i haven't receive my AVR.

Big Thx and Great amazing great work :)
Seb.

[dehati_paul]

I have albain's MPC splitter installed, so, what I do for files is right click, say "open with", select graph studio, and let it build me a graph. :D I'm lazy, what can I say. :) This gives me audio with stutter and dropouts, but, that's just graph studio being fun. To actually USE this, I load up MPC-HC. The instructions I've given to others is like this:

-Install MPC-HC
-Install ffdshow beta 44
-Configure ffdshow, on options page check all passthrough options
-Configure options for MPC-HC. Add ffdshow audio decoder to external filters and set to prefer
-Output in MPC-HC...pick your favorite working renderer. I'm using default directsound
-File, open DVD, select your BD and enjoy. :)
SamuriHL - Prefect - Thanks!!

[rica]

Use 32 bit MPC-HC. I'm on 64 bit OS, too, but you wanna use 32 bit MPC-HC for this.

Weird!!!!
OK, i gonna give it a go anyway :)

[Skinleech]

I'll work on some samples, Seb.

Thanks.

[SamuriHL]

Weird!!!!
OK, i gonna give it a go anyway :)

Not really. ffdshow is only 32 bit compiled unless you wanna compile it for 64. albain said he's not set up to compile it that way right now. And I can't put my dev tools on my HTPC either because they cause problems with the moronic protections of certain players. :mad: So, use 32 bit for now and it'll work.

[Spec-Chum]

Just popped on to say fantastic work albain et al!

[crisscross]

I don't think I'm explaining this very well. Let me try again.

For HDMI bitstreaming:
albain's latest solves this issue for us 5xxx owners and we can bitstream to our heart's content. This has absolutely _0_ to do with what you're trying to accomplish. Nothing at all. Does not apply one bit.

For analog:
In order to play HD audio tracks on analog, they *MUST* be converted to LPCM. The LPCM is then used to drive each channel in your analog set up. To do this, DTS-HD MA and TrueHD tracks must be decoded by the player to LPCM, and then the player sends each channel to the appropriate analog output (center, front left, front right, surround left, surround right, sub, etc). That's controlled by the player using the raw LPCM data. There is absolutely *NO* way to send uncompressed data using analog to a receiver. I repeat...you can NOT bitstream with analog. You MUST allow the player to decode it, and the player then sends the channels to the correct analog output.

This is of course a vastly simplified view of things, but, it gets the idea across (I hope). So to recap, you an do discs that have native LPCM and TrueHD as ffdshow can decode TrueHD and obviously the LPCM is what you want anyway. DTS-HD MA does not have a decoder available. The best you can do is DTS core on those discs. Still, not a bad deal considering it's all open software with no restrictions. :)
Ok, thanks for being patient with me, and just to be really clear I am not trying to bitstream through analog. I am just trying to get real analogue out, no LPCM. I have no receiver, I just use my soundcard so every decoding is made in software and the D/A conversion is made in the DACs of the soundcard before passing it out to separate amplifiers for each channel.
There is not much talk about analogue out and the information that I have seen all talks about downsampling to 16/48. Your information about this is great news for us still using soundcards as pre/pro. This since every documentation I have found talks about limiting non-PAP cards to 16/48 for analogue out.

[SamuriHL]

Ok, thanks for being patient with me, and just to be really clear I am not trying to bitstream through analog. I am just trying to get real analogue out, no LPCM. I have no receiver, I just use my soundcard so every decoding is made in software and the D/A conversion is made in the DACs of the soundcard before passing it out to separate amplifiers for each channel.
There is not much talk about analogue out and the information that I have seen all talks about downsampling to 16/48. Your information about this is great news for us still using soundcards as pre/pro. This since every documentation I have found talks about limiting non-PAP cards to 16/48 for analogue out.

Right, all the "licensed" players are going to downsample your analog. And all they're doing is decoding to LPCM, downsampling that, and sending it to the windows audio renderer which then does all your DAC and output to speakers. (Remember when I said I was oversimplifying? This is the part I left out) So, now we have MPC-HC + ffdshow. Same decoding to LPCM, only it doesn't downsample. Sends the non-downsampled LPCM to the windows audio renderer which then does your DAC and output to the speakers. Only this time at full res, no downsampling.

[albain]

Uhhhh, albain?? Can you please look at this one?!

RE3: http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d5a862f3d

What's up with that??

I don't understand this :
00000264 7.50988388 [2784] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat for codec bitstream Dolby True HD with sample format 256
00000265 7.51001358 [2784] Media Type Structure
00000266 7.51001358 [2784] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000267 7.51001358 [2784] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000268 7.51001358 [2784]
00000269 7.51001358 [2784] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000270 7.51001358 [2784] subFormat : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_MLP
00000271 7.51001358 [2784]
00000272 7.51001358 [2784] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000273 7.51001358 [2784] Valid bits per sample : 16
00000274 7.51001358 [2784] dwChannelMask : 63
00000275 7.51001358 [2784]
00000276 7.51001358 [2784] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000277 7.51001358 [2784] wFormatTag : WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE
00000278 7.51001358 [2784] Channels : 8
00000279 7.51001358 [2784] Bits per sample : 16
00000280 7.51001358 [2784] Samples per second : 192000
00000281 7.51001358 [2784] nBlockAlign : 16
00000282 7.51001358 [2784] nAvgBytesPerSec : 3072000
00000283 7.51001358 [2784]
00000284 7.51131964 [2784] TaudioParser::getSupportedFormat format not supported, trying another one

I have to compare this part of the log with the one from working samples. What has changed from the other samples ?
liquidskin76 has similar issues with the xonar but I need dumper traces to fix this on the xonar.
So 2 similar issues but 2 different ways to fix them

[Skinleech]

Hmm, seems that m2ts with DTS-HD MA that do not work are fine when remuxed to mkv. Interesting.

[albain]

Okay guys, bedtime, I will continue tomorrow

Thanks again for your active contributions :thanks:

I will analyze all the logs you posted or will post (from dumper or ffdshow) tomorrow

[SamuriHL]

I don't understand this :
00000264 7.50988388 [2784] TaudioParser::checkOutputFormat for codec bitstream Dolby True HD with sample format 256
00000265 7.51001358 [2784] Media Type Structure
00000266 7.51001358 [2784] Format type : FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
00000267 7.51001358 [2784] Sub type : MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM
00000268 7.51001358 [2784]
00000269 7.51001358 [2784] WAVEFORMATEXTENSIBLE :
00000270 7.51001358 [2784] subFormat : KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_MLP
00000271 7.51001358 [2784]
00000272 7.51001358 [2784] wSamplesPerBlock : 16
00000273 7.51001358 [2784] Valid bits per sample : 16
00000274 7.51001358 [2784] dwChannelMask : 63
00000275 7.51001358 [2784]
00000276 7.51001358 [2784] WAVEFORMATEX :
00000277 7.51001358 [2784] wFormatTag : WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE
00000278 7.51001358 [2784] Channels : 8
00000279 7.51001358 [2784] Bits per sample : 16
00000280 7.51001358 [2784] Samples per second : 192000
00000281 7.51001358 [2784] nBlockAlign : 16
00000282 7.51001358 [2784] nAvgBytesPerSec : 3072000
00000283 7.51001358 [2784]
00000284 7.51131964 [2784] TaudioParser::getSupportedFormat format not supported, trying another one

I have to compare this part of the log with the one from working samples. What has changed from the other samples ?
liquidskin76 has similar issues with the xonar but I need dumper traces to fix this on the xonar.
So 2 similar issues but 2 different ways to fix them

Yea, that's exactly what I was hoping you'd have an idea about. :( I have NO idea what's different. It's just a TrueHD 5.1 track. But when it was mentioned it didn't work I had to try it out. And sure enough, that's what I get.

Also, does anyone have Bolt kicking around? Trying to play this in MPC-HC crashes it. I can open one of the m2ts files in graphstudio and it plays fine so I'm guessing it's a navigation problem in MPC-HC.

[SamuriHL]

Okay guys, bedtime, I will continue tomorrow

Thanks again for your active contributions :thanks:

I will analyze all the logs you posted or will post (from dumper or ffdshow) tomorrow

Thanks, man. EXCELLENT work!!

[Andy o]

Well this is nothing short of amazing. I still can't try this cause I'm waiting for the 5600 or 5500 series (something with about the same power as my 4670 and CHEAP!), but this is great. Thanks albain and all who helped.

[rica]

Not really. ffdshow is only 32 bit compiled unless you wanna compile it for 64. albain said he's not set up to compile it that way right now. And I can't put my dev tools on my HTPC either because they cause problems with the moronic protections of certain players. :mad: So, use 32 bit for now and it'll work.

Ok, thx; done it with a DTSHD-MA ISO file.

MPCHC 1373-32bit over 7/64
Filters:
Internal mpc mpeg source, output Default direct sound device,
external filters ffdshow beta 44 preferred.

Thanks albain and madshi and samuri with his patience and tulli with his patch to non-working AVRs and the others :thanks:

[SamuriHL]

Ok, thx; done it with a DTSHD-MA ISO file.

MPCHC 1373-32bit over 7/64
Filters:
Internal mpc mpeg source, output Default direct sound device,
external filters ffdshow beta 44 preferred.

Thanks albain and madshi and samuri with his patience and the others :thanks:

Excellent. Glad you got it working. Only a few titles we've seen that have issues and albain will hopefully look into that tomorrow. I've run a bunch of my ISOs through it already and have mostly positive things to say. Bolt crashed MPC-HC, but, I can bitstream the individual m2ts files in graphstudio. Gonna try opening one up in MPC-HC directly now to see what I get.

EDIT: Nope, opening the m2ts files directly still crashes mpc-hc. But they work in graphstudio so that sucks.

[crisscross]

Right, all the "licensed" players are going to downsample your analog. And all they're doing is decoding to LPCM, downsampling that, and sending it to the windows audio renderer which then does all your DAC and output to speakers. (Remember when I said I was oversimplifying? This is the part I left out) So, now we have MPC-HC + ffdshow. Same decoding to LPCM, only it doesn't downsample. Sends the non-downsampled LPCM to the windows audio renderer which then does your DAC and output to the speakers. Only this time at full res, no downsampling.
Great! I always thought windows and its drivers was a player in this PAP-thing but it seems its only the software players then!
I was (incorrectly as it seems) assuming this after reading some PAP-documentation about analog also demanding PAP all the way to the analog conversion and there doing the downconversion to 16/48 if PAP was broken. Time for me to buy a BD-drive then...

[rica]

This is the end of the PAP story guys :D

[SamuriHL]

Great! I always thought windows and its drivers was a player in this PAP-thing but it seems its only the software players then!
I was (incorrectly as it seems) assuming this after reading some PAP-documentation about analog also demanding PAP all the way to the analog conversion and there doing the downconversion to 16/48 if PAP was broken. Time for me to buy a BD-drive then...

That's not entirely accurate. PAP is required for analog output, as well, so long as the player supports it. And PAP is controlled by a combination of the player and the sound card driver. And there's no real standard implementation, so, this is why it's such a pain for players to add support for a particular new card's implementation. Xonar does it one way, Auzentech does it another, ATI does it a different way still. So the player asks the driver to check the PAP chain. The driver returns a "yey" or "nay" response. If nay, then the player downsamples. If yey, the player is allowed to do what it wants as long as it uses PAP. And by uses, this is where it gets silly. The player decrypts a frame of audio (aacs protected assuming you're not using AnyDVD or whatever), then encrypts the audio using the PAP implementation for the particular audio hardware, sends it to the audio hardware which then decrypts it using the PAP encryption chip it has on board, and then sends the frame to the receiver or DAC for analog. If this sounds ridiculously stupid, it's because it is. albain's solution is much more elegant. Receive decrypted audio frame, bitstream to receiver. Notice something missing? :D Or in the case of analog, receive decrypted audio frame, decode to LPCM, send to windows audio for DAC. Much better. :D

[SamuriHL]

This is the end of the PAP story guys :D

You got that right. :)

[rica]

Guys, here are the results of my trials:

I've found i get only HD bitstream via beta 44 from DTSHD sources (even they are ISO or original BD)

Samples:

DTSHD-MA:

Angels and Demons,
Close Encounters (even the default audio is THD i get DTSHD-MA bitstreamed)


DTSHD-HR:

Quantum of Solace,
HITMAN.

None of my trials gave me any HD bitstream on THD discs (BD via AnyDVD-HD or ISO) but just a core DD over beta 44.



_ _ _ _ _

[SamuriHL]

Yea, that's exactly what I was hoping you'd have an idea about. :( I have NO idea what's different. It's just a TrueHD 5.1 track. But when it was mentioned it didn't work I had to try it out. And sure enough, that's what I get.

Also, does anyone have Bolt kicking around? Trying to play this in MPC-HC crashes it. I can open one of the m2ts files in graphstudio and it plays fine so I'm guessing it's a navigation problem in MPC-HC.

Ok, I solved the RE3 and other title problem with TrueHD not working right. I switched my audio renderer to waveout and it now works. However, that doesn't work for DTS-HD MA. :mad: SOOOOOOO, I re-registered the MPC audio renderer and low and behold it works for every damn thing I've got. Everyone having issues, please try the MPC audio renderer and see what you get for results. :thanks:

P.S. It also fixes my crash with Bolt. IOW, it works with *EVERY* source I've tried it on now.

[Casshern]

Great Work Albain!

When do you think it's ready to be merged with the regular ffdshow tryouts?

We also need some new options so people can configure if they want passthrough, dts or DD core's via spdif, or decode it to analog.

I myself (and many others i am sure) hope that the dts or DD core extraction still works. At the moment it's kind of hidden in the regular tryouts. But for example if you want the DD core from a TrueHD track (if it has one), you can deactivate E-AC3 and TruHD in the codec options and ffdshow will pass the core via spdif (you also have to check the pass through options for DTS and AC3 on the output page). This is really cool. I hope it does not get lost.



Okay guys, bedtime, I will continue tomorrow

Thanks again for your active contributions :thanks:

I will analyze all the logs you posted or will post (from dumper or ffdshow) tomorrow

[SamuriHL]

Guys, here are the results of my trials:

I've found i get only HD bitstream via beta 44 from DTSHD sources (even they are ISO or original BD)

Samples:

DTSHD-MA:

Angels and Demons,
Close Encounters (even the default audio is THD i get DTSHD-MA bitstreamed)


DTSHD-HR:

Quantum of Solace,
HITMAN.

None of my trials gave me any HD bitstream on THD discs (BD via AnyDVD-HD or ISO) but just a core DD over beta 44.



_ _ _ _ _

See my post above. What audio renderer are you using? Use the MPC audio renderer if possible. You need to register it and then select it in MPC-HC output.

[Skinleech]

None of my trials gave me any HD bitstream on THD discs (BD via AnyDVD-HD or ISO) but just a core DD over beta 44.

Try unchecking regular ac3 passthrough. That's what I need to do to get it working.


samples

TrueHD: http://www.mediafire.com/?iyyg5wzgjgl
TrueHD: http://www.mediafire.com/?zjddwmzwean
DTS-HD MA: http://www.mediafire.com/?qzj1zgtzqyj

Sebastii, can you try these ones please? The DTS-HD sample crashes MPC, but works straight after. There might be the odd audio drop out.

I get stutters or slow recognition of the THD track in both THD samples.

Thanks.

As noted in a previous post, MKV seems to work much better for me.

[Gleb Egorych]

Here was posted a 7.1 TrueHD sample (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1348668#post1348668), I tried it with libav decoding. I have a special preset in ffdshow - switch to mixer 5.1 mode when input has 8 channels. With 8 channel LPCM it works, but with that TrueHD doesn't. ffdshow (b3136 by clsid) outputs 8 channels. Is 5.1 AC3 core confusing ffdshow's preset switcher?

[SamuriHL]

Guys, if you are having problems, please use the non-debug MPCAudioRenderer from here:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/4yniyzztiwj/MPCAudioRenderer.zip

This is what I'm using to get this to work with *ALL* my samples now. Not one fails using that. Just register it with regsvr32 from an admin command prompt and then use that as the output device in MPC-HC. It should work.

[whurlston]

Guys, if you are having problems, please use the non-debug MPCAudioRenderer from here:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/4yniyzztiwj/MPCAudioRenderer.zip

This is what I'm using to get this to work with *ALL* my samples now. Not one fails using that. Just register it with regsvr32 from an admin command prompt and then use that as the output device in MPC-HC. It should work.

I'll try this later and post the results.

[SamuriHL]

I'll try this later and post the results.

Well, it was going well with that. Ran into a DTS-HD MA image that crashes MPC-HC with all the renderers including this one. Something's still not 100% right with this latest build but it's like 99% there afaic.

EDIT: Uhhhh, that was weird. I switched renderers and then switched back to MPC renderer and it works now. Freaky.

[rica]

Guys, if you are having problems, please use the non-debug MPCAudioRenderer from here:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/4yniyzztiwj/MPCAudioRenderer.zip

This is what I'm using to get this to work with *ALL* my samples now. Not one fails using that. Just register it with regsvr32 from an admin command prompt and then use that as the output device in MPC-HC. It should work.

Even i got it and register, i have never got rid of Default Direct Sound Device on my MPC-HC. (output is set to MPC Audio Renderer in MPC-HC)

[SamuriHL]

Even i got it and register, i have never got rid of Default Direct Sound Device on my MPC-HC. (output is set to MPC Audio Renderer in MPC-HC)

Not sure I follow what you're saying here. :confused:

[rica]

Not sure I follow what you're saying here. :confused:

I say: even i select registered non-debug mode MPC Audio Renderer (which you uploaded) on MPC-HC Output Options, i see Default Audio Device under filters as an output audio renderer instead of MPC Audio Renderer while playing a BD.
Is it clear?

[SamuriHL]

I say: even i select registered non-debug mode MPC Audio Renderer (which you uploaded) on MPC-HC Output Options, i see Default Audio Device under filters as an output audio renderer instead of MPC Audio Renderer while playing a BD.
Is it clear?

I see, yes, that's clear now. Hmmm, I'm not sure what to tell you on that one. It seems to work for me. Every disc I've thrown at it so far works with that configuration. Even the one I had problems with, I changed to another renderer and then changed back to MPC audio renderer and it worked after that. I wish I knew why it's not working for you. You can always force the issue by going to external filters, add the mpc audio renderer and set it as preferred. Cheating, but it'll work. :)

(To do that, you'll have to browse for the ax file you registered when adding it to the external filter list)

[Sebastiii]

Try unchecking regular ac3 passthrough. That's what I need to do to get it working.


samples

TrueHD: http://www.mediafire.com/?iyyg5wzgjgl
TrueHD: http://www.mediafire.com/?zjddwmzwean
DTS-HD MA: http://www.mediafire.com/?qzj1zgtzqyj

Sebastii, can you try these ones please? The DTS-HD sample crashes MPC, but works straight after. There might be the odd audio drop out.

I get stutters or slow recognition of the THD track in both THD samples.

Thanks.

As noted in a previous post, MKV seems to work much better for me.

Hi thx :)
So i have made BD disc structure from 2 softs : TsRemux0212 and tsMuxeR_1.10.6 from your sample to play with TMT bitstream and Xonar.

And this is the log from 2 softs :)

ROME-DTSMA-tsMuxeR_1.10.6-TMT-bitstream (http://sebinternet.free.fr/ROME-DTSMA-tsMuxeR_1.10.6-TMT-bitstream.zip)
ROME-DTSMA-TsRemux0212-TMT-bitstream (http://sebinternet.free.fr/ROME-DTSMA-TsRemux0212-TMT-bitstream.zip)
THD_Intro-tsMuxeR_1.10.6-TMT-bitstream (http://sebinternet.free.fr/THD_Intro-tsMuxeR_1.10.6-TMT-bitstream.zip)
THD_Intro-TsRemux0212-TMT-bitstream (http://sebinternet.free.fr/THD_Intro-TsRemux0212-TMT-bitstream.zip)
THD71-tsMuxeR_1.10.6-TMT-bitstream (http://sebinternet.free.fr/THD71-tsMuxeR_1.10.6-TMT-bitstream.zip)
THD71-TsRemux0212-TMT-bitstream (http://sebinternet.free.fr/THD71-TsRemux0212-TMT-bitstream.zip)

I hope is quite Good.
Seb :)

[rica]

I see, yes, that's clear now. Hmmm, I'm not sure what to tell you on that one. It seems to work for me. Every disc I've thrown at it so far works with that configuration. Even the one I had problems with, I changed to another renderer and then changed back to MPC audio renderer and it worked after that. I wish I knew why it's not working for you. You can always force the issue by going to external filters, add the mpc audio renderer and set it as preferred. Cheating, but it'll work. :)

(To do that, you'll have to browse for the ax file you registered when adding it to the external filter list)

MPC Audio Renderer has been already added and selected as preferred under external filters but i kept going to have Default Audio Renderer as default while playing :mad:

[SamuriHL]

MPC Audio Renderer has been already added and selected as preferred under external filters but i kept going to have Default Audio Renderer as default :mad:

I don't get why that's happening to you. :( Sorry, I really don't know what to tell you.

[Sebastiii]

@Rica
Sometimes it happen to me when i not select 16 bit in output of ffdshow.

If you have like me preset setting, don't forget to all set to 16bits and check DTSHD etc. pass-through.

I think you have already check that but maybe setting goes out :)
Seb.

[rica]

I don't get why that's happening to you. :( Sorry, I really don't know what to tell you.

Neither am i :)

[SamuriHL]

Yea I ONLY have 16 bit set and all the passthrough options checked. I don't have MPC Audio Renderer set in my external filters, just as the output device. It works for me. Rather well, in fact.

[rica]

Yea I ONLY have 16 bit set and all the passthrough options checked. I don't have MPC Audio Renderer set in my external filters, just as the output device. It works for me. Rather well, in fact.

All the ways have been tried but no result; Default Audio Renderer really seems as default to me :)
Tomorrow i'll try again.
Thanks guys.

[SamuriHL]

Sorry, Rica. Wish I could figure it out for you.

[rica]

Sorry, Rica. Wish I could figure it out for you.

Thx samuri, we'll fix it anyway :)

[whurlston]

The MPC renderer didn't work for me with GraphStudio but I tried the ATI HDMI WaveOut and everything works, including RE3 and John Mayer.

[rica]

ffdshow audio renderer always selects "default audio renderer" as default on GraphStudio in my case which explains why i can never see MPC Audio Renderer on MPC-HC.

[Stereodude]

Will the GeForce 9300/9400 chipset or ATI 4xxx be able bitstream, or is this going to be limited to the Asus Xonar HDMI cards and the ATI 5xxx cards?

[dehati_paul]

Gurus of bitstreaming - Please help me.
The good news first - I get bitstreaming (both TrueHD and DTS-HD MA) using "MPC-HC -> ffdshow -> Arcsoft Renderer -> Xonar". I do not have the ATI 5xxx card
The bad news - I cannot get the same config work in Graphstudio, even if I set the same chain. I tried Arcsoft renderer, Defaultsound without any success. MPC Audio Renderer didn't help either. Is there anyway to setup Arcsoft audio renderer as default audio renderer (I changed the merit of Arcsoft renderer to highest using Gspot, didn't help either).

So please help.

[fuzz!]

Is this something that can be used without specific ArcSoft and/or Xonar drivers being installed?

I have a Radeon 4850 - No TMT, No Xonar.. Should I still be able to get bitstreaming?

[Gizzmo]

Hi, for me the same question like Stereodude : What about GeForce 9400 onboard HDMI ?
I am afraid there is an issue with the bitrate, because the 9400 only supports 16 and 24 bit
and TruHD seems to have 32bit. But even if i let ffdshow downsample to 16bit i get no audio.
And with DTS HD MPC crashes.

I tryed to use the nondebug version but i can't registrate the filters in my W7 32bit PC. I get
an errormessage about a problem with the registration. Could that be a problem of the new
handling of filters within Windows 7 ?

I also get an error message that my DirectX is not actual, do i have to do a manual installation ?
I did all upgrades with the updatemanagement of W7.


Here my system : Gigabyte mainboard with NVIDIA 9400 onboard graphic/HDMI, Windows 7 32bit,

[liquidskin76]

Gurus of bitstreaming - Please help me.
The good news first - I get bitstreaming (both TrueHD and DTS-HD MA) using "MPC-HC -> ffdshow -> Arcsoft Renderer -> Xonar". I do not have the ATI 5xxx card
The bad news - I cannot get the same config work in Graphstudio, even if I set the same chain. I tried Arcsoft renderer, Defaultsound without any success. MPC Audio Renderer didn't help either. Is there anyway to setup Arcsoft audio renderer as default audio renderer (I changed the merit of Arcsoft renderer to highest using Gspot, didn't help either).

So please help.

What version of MPC-HC are you running? Also, is this from m2ts or MKV?

Thanks

[tetsuo55]

@ Everyone

This does NOT work on anything other than Xonar and 5xx0

[dehati_paul]

What version of MPC-HC are you running? Also, is this from m2ts or MKV?

Thanks
Hi liquidskin76 - I am using the SVN 1373 version of MPC-HC. Also my files are in m2ts (direct blu-ray copies with anydvd, not remuxed). The part that I am not getting is why is it not working through graphstudio (or through anything other than the MPC-HC player), even if I am following the same chain?

[dehati_paul]

Hi liquidskin76 - I am using the SVN 1373 version of MPC-HC. Also my files are in m2ts (direct blu-ray copies with anydvd, not remuxed). The part that I am not getting is why is it not working through graphstudio (or through anything other than the MPC-HC player), even if I am following the same chain?
Problem resolved - it was related the version of MPC-HC standalone filters compared to the player. Now bitstream is possible from MPC-HC and graphstudio. I am loving it!!

[SamuriHL]

Problem resolved - it was related the version of MPC-HC standalone filters compared to the player. Now bitstream is possible from MPC-HC and graphstudio. I am loving it!!

Sweet!!!

[dehati_paul]

Albain and others

Can you please tell me if it is possible to select Arcsoft audio renderer as the system default audio renderer? Or is it possible to set ffdshow audio to always output to Arcsoft audio renderer (preferably by profile setting)?

I do not have the ATI 5xxx but only Xonar, so if I could output ffdshow audio through Arcsoft audio renderer then I can use the Vista Media Center front end (my current setup) or any other app to have bitstreaming. Otherwise I will have to spend for the ATI 5xxx card.

Thanks a lot for all of these.

[albain]

@dehati_paul : yes it is but you have to register the renderer first
Dos windows in admin mode, do :
regsvr32 "c:\program files\ArcSoft\TotalMedia Theatre 3\Codec\ASAudioRenderer.dll"

@all

Let's summarize things a little bit :

xonar + arcsoft renderer : work with all DTSHD samples ? work with some THD but not all => I have Sebastii's logs to fix THD
xonar + other renderer : doesn't work ? This does not surprise me
ATI 5xxx : I saw some THD samples working, some others won't with directsound. But non working samples will work if you use waveout. Right ? I have ffdshow logs for non working sample (a 5.1 track if I remember correctly) but not a working track with the same attributes (I mean sample rate and number of channels). Please also report the sample rate too. I suspect a bug in the ATI driver, it also may come from the channels mask sent
ATI 5xxx + DTSHD : works with directsound (MA or HR) but not with waveout (MA only), right ?
ATI 5xxx and Dolby Digital Plus : what about this one ? Still working in all cases ?

[SamuriHL]

I have every single source working with your mpc audio renderer. I tried numerous titles and watched a whole TrueHD movie in its entirety last night. All DTS-HD MA and TrueHD tracks I threw at it worked flawlessly. Tell me what you need for logs and I'll get up and go make some with whatever renderer you need tested.

[liquidskin76]

xonar + arcsoft renderer : work with all DTSHD samples ? work with some THD but not all => I have Sebastii's logs to fix THD

@Albain,

See my previous post (posted last night) below for results from xonar + arcsoft renderer... particularly the various findings using MPC-HC...


@Albain,

Just to summarize on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer'...

GraphStudio

From m2ts container... TrueHD working great. DTS-HD giving DTS core.
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m6b53dcb1

From MKV container... both TrueHD and DTS-HD working great!

MPC-HC (SVN 1373)

From m2ts container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD is giving DTS core.
TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7b37a2dc
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m5d22fc24

From MKV container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD not working, no audio and showing as Dolby Digital on AVR!!TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2729c620
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7e2cda62

... however I need to test further as dehati_paul claims to have it working good from MPC-HC and m2ts container.

Any suggestions from the above logs?

Thanks

[albain]

@liquidskin76 : your issues concern the xonar, and I have all Seb's logs to figure this out

[liquidskin76]

@liquidskin76 : your issues concern the xonar, and I have all Seb's logs to figure this out

Cool... i'll sit tight and try not to get too excited!!

Thanks

[SamuriHL]

Resident Evil 3: TrueHD, 48000, 6 channels, 4653kbps

Default DirectSound (decodes to LPCM): http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d55d6a5c1
MPC Audio Renderer (bitstreams TrueHD): http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=d1ade42e8

Hopefully that'll help with the TrueHD stuff that doesn't work through DirectSound.

[dehati_paul]

@Albain,

See my previous post (posted last night) below for results from xonar + arcsoft renderer... particularly the various findings using MPC-HC...




... however I need to test further as dehati_paul claims to have it working good from MPC-HC and m2ts container.

Any suggestions from the above logs?

Thanks
Yes I can confirm that both DTH-HD (5.1, 7.1) and TrueHD (5.1, 7.1) worked from both MPC-HC player and Graphstudio using MPC filters (all version 1373) from m2ts (non-remuxed, pulled straight from Blu-ray). Unfortunately, I didn't have mkvs to test. My chain

.m2ts -> MPC - mpeg splitter -> ffdshow -> arcsoft raudio renderer -> Xonar -> DVDO upscaler (igonore this) -> Onkyo TX-SR876

.m2ts tested
DTS-HD: Wall-E (5.1), Hellboy II (7.1)
TrueHD: the TrueHD 7.1 sample on this forum, IronMan (5.1)

[madshi]

Maybe a stupid question: But why does the Xonar only work through the ArcSoft Audio Renderer, while the ATI 5xxx seems to be happy with virtually any renderer?

[SamuriHL]

Maybe a stupid question: But why does the Xonar only work through the ArcSoft Audio Renderer, while the ATI 5xxx seems to be happy with virtually any renderer?

Cough crappy drivers cough cough. :D

[dehati_paul]

Maybe a stupid question: But why does the Xonar only work through the ArcSoft Audio Renderer, while the ATI 5xxx seems to be happy with virtually any renderer?
May be Arcsoft wants to prove that are smarter than everyone (read proprietary or only Arcsoft+Xonar). Jokes apart - I think ATI left it open to make it work with all the vendors, whereas Asus (Xonar) wanted it only to work with Arcsoft TMT.

Hopefully, Albain can explain.

[htpc66]

I find interesting to note that with the latest fixes, ATI4xxx is able to deliver LPCM "unmolested" (according ffdshow info) to AVR . Save for frequent hickups with Mpc-hc, Truehd & dts-htma are both decoded (according ffdshow info and sounded like it) in their fully glory in multichannel to AVR.

[SamuriHL]

Not possible with DTS-HD MA. It's only decoding the DTS core. There's no decoder for the DTS-HD MA extensions.

[whurlston]

Maybe a stupid question: But why does the Xonar only work through the ArcSoft Audio Renderer, while the ATI 5xxx seems to be happy with virtually any renderer?

I've been asking myself the same thing. Even WinDVD can bitstream with the 5xxx series (with glitches but still).

[htpc66]

Not possible with DTS-HD MA. It's only decoding the DTS core. There's no decoder for the DTS-HD MA extensions.

Uhh? well thats according to ffdshow info and my old pair of (placebo) ears:)

[Stereodude]

@ Everyone

This does NOT work on anything other than Xonar and 5xx0Is that the expected way it will stay, or is that just the current status?

[SamuriHL]

Is that the expected way it will stay, or is that just the current status?

Current status. albain has said he'll work on more later. But for now he wants to get the Xonar and the 5xxx cards working perfectly first.

[SamuriHL]

Uhh? well thats according to ffdshow info and my old pair of (placebo) ears:)

Not sure what to tell you on that one. I can say almost certainly, though, that if it's decoding DTS it's only doing core.

[htpc66]

Not sure what to tell you on that one. I can say almost certainly, though, that if it's decoding DTS it's only doing core.

The ffdshow info shows large 4 digit (4000+ to 9000+ rather than 1530) bitrates which sound so pleasing to through my modest sound system.

[SamuriHL]

The ffdshow info shows large 4 digit (4000+ to 9000+ rather than 1530) bitrates which sound so pleasing to through my modest sound system.

That's really odd. I have Watchmen in there right now and turned off DTS/DTS-HD MA passthrough so I can get it decoded. It's showing me 1536.

[htpc66]

That's really odd. I have Watchmen in there right now and turned off DTS/DTS-HD MA passthrough so I can get it decoded. It's showing me 1536.

It may be really odd but I got all pass through ticked in ffdshow. That's what it shows in its info and that how I felt it suppose to sound like through a stand alone player.:) By the way its ATI 4XXX. Ho ho ho its Xmas:)

[SamuriHL]

Its real odd indeed I have all pass through ticked. That's what it shows and how it suppose to sound like through a stand alone player:). By the way its ATI 4XXX. Ho ho ho:)

So in that case it attempts to bitstream, fails because the driver says no, and reverts to LPCM decoding. :) So what's reported is likely wrong because ffdshow is reporting what it WOULD be playing if it were in fact bitstreaming, but, since it's not, that's not really what you're getting. You found a bug, iow. :)

[htpc66]

So in that case it attempts to bitstream, fails because the driver says no, and reverts to LPCM decoding. :) So what's reported is likely wrong because ffdshow is reporting what it WOULD be playing if it were in fact bitstreaming, but, since it's not, that's not really what you're getting. You found a bug, iow. :)

What about those LPCM when they register only 0 bitrate? Are those bugs as well?

[SamuriHL]

What about those LPCM when it registers 0 bitrate?

Don't know. I've never seen that. But it definitely seems like there's a bug there somewhere.

[dehati_paul]

@SamuriHL,

Can you please test/confirm that you can get bitstream from outside MPC-HC player or Graphstudio by using the same filter/renderer chain (e.g. by using windows media player). I am dying to use this solution in Vista Media Center (using MPC-HC standalone filters, ffdsow, etc. - my current setup) but need some validation. if you confirm, I will buy the ATI 5xxx card.

Thanks!

[SamuriHL]

I've been testing with graphstudio, as well, and yes I can graph it and have it work. It's not smooth when playing in graphstudio, though. I get all kinds of weird issues. I'm not able to open it in WMP, though. I don't think my system is setup to correctly split things for WMP.

[albain]

Originally Posted by liquidskin76
Just to summarize on 'beta44 - xonar - arcsoft renderer'...

GraphStudio

From m2ts container... TrueHD working great. DTS-HD giving DTS core.
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m6b53dcb1

From MKV container... both TrueHD and DTS-HD working great!

MPC-HC (SVN 1373)

From m2ts container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD is giving DTS core.
TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7b37a2dc
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m5d22fc24

From MKV container... TrueHD not working, giving 2 channel LPCM. DTS-HD not working, no audio and showing as Dolby Digital on AVR!!TrueHD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m2729c620
DTS-HD log... http://pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=m7e2cda62
Thanks

Okay, only MKV traces give interesting results, for the others I don't see the DTS HD blocks. There should be a problem with your MPCHC build and m2ts standalone splitter.

[SamuriHL]

@albain

I'm getting some messed up results. If I change my audio renderer, weird things start to happen. At this point I'm not able to get it back to fully working again. :( I really hope you can figure out a way to make the default DS renderer work for everything. What logs can I post that'll help with that aim?

[whurlston]

Includes tests for the following using the default DirectSound and default WaveOut renderers (ATI 5xxx):

6 ch TrueHD 96/24 and 48/24
6 ch DTS-MA 48/24
8 ch DTS-MA 48/24

Sorted in folders according to working/non-working. I also included the graph reports from GraphStudio for the tests as well as the graph reports for the PDVD bitstreaming of the same movies.

http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/Beta44Reports.zip

I'm having an issue with DTS-MA losing audio/video sync but I reported them as working since the bitstreaming is fine. I'm still looking for a 7.1 TrueHD disc.

[SamuriHL]

Includes tests for the following using the default DirectSound and default WaveOut renderers (ATI 5xxx):

6 ch TrueHD 96/24 and 48/24
6 ch DTS-MA 48/24
8 ch DTS-MA 48/24

Sorted in folders according to working/non-working. I also included the graph reports from GraphStudio for the tests as well as the graph reports for the PDVD bitstreaming of the same movies.

http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/Beta44Reports.zip

I'm having an issue with DTS-MA losing audio/video sync but I reported them as working since the bitstreaming is fine.

Yea, thanks a lot! :p I have the same problems now thanks to you! :D Watchmen is out of sync when using DS or MPC audio now. I think waveout was in sync for me. Can't get MPC audio back in sync to save my life. It was before I changed the renderer. Will look at Wanted in a few.

[whurlston]

Yea, thanks a lot! :p I have the same problems now thanks to you! :D

Um... Merry Christmas??? :D

[SamuriHL]

Um... Merry Christmas??? :D

Gee, uhhhh, thanks. :) So, Default DS plays it back in sync for me. Waveout never makes a connection at all. Any of the ATI ones are either out of sync or crash MPC-HC. I'm of the opinion....fix DS for TrueHD and call it good. :D

[SamuriHL]

So, I thought I'd share my new laziness story with you. :D I've discovered that I can bitstream while on a remote desktop session to my HTPC without having to have the tv on. So I can control it all from my laptop. As long as the receiver is set to the HDMI port of my HTPC, it'll bitstream(or not as the case may end up being). In short....NICE :)

[albain]

Man, so many posts, so much information ... :rolleyes:

Here is a new build (http://www.mediafire.com/file/2y31lzyyzhm/ffdshow_rev3140_20091203_dbt_bitstream_beta45.exe)

Changes :

For xonar : DTS HD structure changed. I hope that it will work (with arcsoft renderer or other). From the logs I got from liquidskin only mkvs seem not to strip off DTS HD block. I still believe that something is wrong on your MPC or m2ts filter.
ATI 5xxx TrueHD : added a new structure to try in the list (changed channels mask). Which is weird is that on some samples directsound won't work unlike waveout. So I changed the only field that is different between working and non working samples

[SamuriHL]

Default DS still doesn't work for TrueHD. Getting decoded LPCM instead. Will post logs in a bit.

Waveout still won't lock for DTS-HD MA, either. It just sits there trying to identify the stream.

[whurlston]

Beta 45: TrueHD 6 ch decoded to PCM using DirectSound.

http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/ffdshow/beta45TrueHD6ch.txt

Are you ready for a vacation yet albain? You deserve one.

[albain]

Sorry, beta45 is incomplete for the ati & thd

[whurlston]

No problem. Just reporting.

[blackEyEz]

Awesome work guys, i been following this thread for some months on HD bitstreaming. I am not as technical could someone recap what has been achieved and what hardware you need to bitstream truehd and dts-ma? And could someone say if (and when) i can bitstream truehd/dts-ma within MediaPortal?

Thank you

[albain]

Here is an updated build (http://damienbt.free.fr/ffdshow_rev3140_20091203_dbt_bitstream_beta46.exe) for both xonar and ATI 5xxx

[SamuriHL]

Oh thank God man! You fixed Default DirectSound! :D Now we got the best of all worlds because that was in sync for DTS-HD MA and now it works for TrueHD, as well. HURRAY! I'm gonna uninstall the MPC audio renderer now and just use DS for all my testing. Thank you!!!!

[SamuriHL]

@whurlston

Use Default DirectSound on Watchmen. I bet it works fine. And kick some TrueHD tracks through it that would only play as LPCM before. Those should now play correctly as TrueHD. WOO HOO!

[albain]

great !

Now what about regular formats : AC3/DTS & analogs streams encoded to AC3 in output section, are they still okay ?

This works fine on my side but I would like to be sure

Two others thing to test :
1/ Audio & video synchronisation : is it okay on HD formats ?
2/ when you do some jump to another part of the video, do you still have audio & video in sync (especially for TrueHD) ?

The last beta I have made is taken from the last revision of the bitstreamHD branch that I merged from the trunk so this one is a good build for non regressions testing.

I wait for these last feedbacks (and for the xonar too) and for clsid's go to perform the merge to the trunk

[SamuriHL]

Audio sync is good now from what I can see. Even moving around in the video is good. I just tested an AC3 file, that seems fine. I haven't tested a DTS file yet. Don't have one handy.

[whurlston]

Audio still loses sync for me. Happening on all sources actually if I let them play longer than 5 minutes. Audio is playing faster than the video. I think that is a separate issue though and not related to ffdshow. Possibly the renderer, maybe this is the reason for the glitches in WinDVD?

As for bitstreaming, both DTS-HD and TrueHD work great with the DSound renderer. Even 96/24 5.1 TrueHD.

@albain: :thanks::thanks::thanks:

[albain]

Can what whurlston says be confirmed ?

Do you all have lost of sync on THD, DTSHD ?

With all the renderers ? directsound, waveout, MPC wasapi ?

Why do you say that this is not related to ffdshow ? Is powerdvd having glitches or lost of sync too ? Means that this is a bug in the ATI driver but I doubt it

[whurlston]

Definitely not an ffdshow issue!!! I forgot to set the clock on the audio renderer. I'll blame it on lack of sleep. DTS-HD and TrueHD 48/16 as well as TrueHD 96/24 (everything I tested) all in sync now. I'll try to find a DTS file to test.

:o

[SamuriHL]

Watchmen is still sync screwed. I'm watching a TrueHD movie right now and it's fine so far. I think watchmen is just not a happy freaking movie to be playing in MPC-HC in general. I mean, I watched an entire DTS-HD MA movie last night with this and had ZERO sync problems.

[SamuriHL]

Definitely not an ffdshow issue!!! I forgot to set the clock on the audio renderer. I'll blame it on lack of sleep. DTS-HD and TrueHD 48/16 as well as TrueHD 96/24 (everything I tested) all in sync now. I'll try to find a DTS file to test.

:o

Play watchmen. I can't get it to stay in sync.

[whurlston]

That was one of the ones I tested and it works up to 5 minutes (which was out of sync without the clock set). I'll let it play longer and report back.

[SamuriHL]

That was one of the ones I tested and it works up to 5 minutes (which was out of sync without the clock set). I'll let it play longer and report back.

Try skipping around after that, too. But, the audio quickly went out of sync for me. Playing off the disc as I didn't like that movie enough to make an ISO of it.

[whurlston]

It stays in sync with the DSound renderer if I set the clock before I start playback. I skipped backwards and forwards throught the whole movie. Let me see if I can find where my wife put the disc. (She's been on a cleaning and packing spree.)

Are you using MPC or GraphStudio?

[albain]

So TrueHD loss of sync to be confirmed... That would not surprise me as I remember that arcsoft performs additional steps when a seek is detected

Concerning DTSHD, I don't think we may have this issue because the buffers have fixed size, as well as EAC3

[SamuriHL]

It stays in sync with the DSound renderer if I set the clock before I start playback. I skipped backwards and forwards throught the whole movie. Let me see if I can find where my wife put the disc. (She's been on a cleaning and packing spree.)

Are you using MPC or GraphStudio?

MPC for everything. I'm playing another DTS-HD MA movie right now and having zero issues. I think it's just watchmen that hates me. Which is fine cause I'm not particularly fond of it, either. :D TrueHD stayed in sync, and I went all over the freaking place in that movie.

[SamuriHL]

So TrueHD loss of sync to be confirmed... That would not surprise me as I remember that arcsoft performs additional steps when a seek is detected

Concerning DTSHD, I don't think we may have this issue because the buffers have fixed size, as well as EAC3

TrueHD is fine. I haven't seen any sync issues with TrueHD. I watched an entire DTS-HD movie last night start to finish with no sync issue, as well. I truly feel Watchmen just blows in MPC. EAC3 I can't do. For whatever reason the driver refuses it and ffdshow then decodes it to LPCM.

[SamuriHL]

P.S. Using Default DS for renderer on all of this.

[whurlston]

Ah, I was testing in GraphStudio. I had to manually enable the clock (is this something ffdhow can activate automatically?). Once I remember to do that, everything stays in sync for me.

[SamuriHL]

Ah, I was testing in GraphStudio. I had to manually enable the clock (is this something ffdhow can activate automatically?). Once I remember to do that, everything stays in sync for me.

I'm not sure what you mean by enable the clock. :confused: And I would rather test where I'm going to actually use it. GraphStudio is fine and all, but, I want to watch movies not graph them. :D

[whurlston]

I'm downloading MPC now. I just use the standalone filters in another app which is why I test with GraphStudio.

[albain]

Yes I know what you mean : when you add a renderer, there is a clock on it and you can click on it to enable

I don't know why this is not managed automatically

I guess that this is enabled by default by MPC

Concerning EAC3, it should not be difficult to fix

[SamuriHL]

I'm downloading MPC now. I just use the standalone filters in another app which is why I test with GraphStudio.

I think MPC doesn't deal with Watchmen correctly which is why the issue with audio sync is creeping in. All other discs I've tried are fine.

[SamuriHL]

Yes I know what you mean : when you add a renderer, there is a clock on it and you can click on it to enable

I don't know why this is not managed automatically

I guess that this is enabled by default by MPC

Concerning EAC3, it should not be difficult to fix

Do you want a log from eac3? I have a file with eac3 that I can use for debugging.

[gametiger]

Kudos to albain and everybody else who's helping with this, great job!


I'm planning to build a new HTPC and the progress you guys made right here is surely gonna influence my hardware choice.

As I understood it, the Xonar sound card and the ATI 5xxx series are the only cards that currently "support" HD audio bitstreaming.

So what would you recommend? Go for a Xonar sound card + a ATI/Nvidia video card combo or a video card out of the ATI 5xxx series?
What I'm looking for is a solidly working solution. Important criteria are reliability, quality and low heat/noise levels.

What would you guys go for?

Thanks in advance :)

[sub24ox7]

Hello albain and samuriHL I know you samuriHL from your moderating postion at slysoft forum and i am a loyal customer of anydvd hd anyway to the point. I have been following this thread for some time and anything great i say about it would be an understatement in the most true since of the word, this to say the least is a GODSEND!.
I haven't posted yet becuase i didn't want to take up anyones time but i have decided to try to bitstream with my xonar in light of the recent accomplishments. I have but one question at this time, I can't find the arcsoft renderer in mpc-hc where you can add external filters i have arcsoft totalmedia theater 3 installed on this vista x64 machine so i thought i could find it in the list of external mpc-hc filters. do i need to use greaphstudio to acomplish this or can i just use the new beta 46 of ffdshow from albain and use mpc-hc and then ffdshow and finally arcsoft renderer?

[whurlston]

I think MPC doesn't deal with Watchmen correctly which is why the issue with audio sync is creeping in. All other discs I've tried are fine.

I have to wait for my wife to get home to get the disc but playing from the HDD, it stays in sync for me. I tested with the latest MPC SVN build. I have 16 and 24 bit checked in ffdshow (don't know if it's relevant).

Regarding EAC3: DD+ does not show up in the supported formats in the Windows audio device, so we may not even be able to get it to work for the 5xxx series.

[sub24ox7]

NEVERmind i figured it out thank you anyways!(a big duh to me) should have known better i need to register it

[SamuriHL]

I have to wait for my wife to get home to get the disc but playing from the HDD, it stays in sync for me. I tested with the latest MPC SVN build. I have 16 and 24 bit checked in ffdshow (don't know if it's relevant).

Regarding EAC3: DD+ does not show up in the supported formats in the Windows audio device, so we may not even be able to get it to work for the 5xxx series.

That was my thought on EAC3, too, was that the driver simply refuses it. So I don't know how albain plans on fixing that.

As for Watchmen I'm not terribly concerned but I'd like to see if you get the same results off the disc when you get a chance.

[SamuriHL]

NEVERmind i figured it out thank you anyways!(a big duh to me) should have known better i need to register it

Glad you got it. :)

[SamuriHL]

@albain

Monsters Inc crashes MPC-HC with both DS and waveout renderers. I have no idea what's on this disc for codecs yet. This is one I rented and just stuck the disc in to see how it'd go. So far, not well. :)

[sub24ox7]

Hello again does anyone know why i can't register from CMD ASAudioRenderer.dll It keeps telling me to make sure the path is NOT correct where the binary is stored and i am sure i have it right (rgsvr32 C:\Windows\Program Files (86)Arcsoft\TotalMedia Theatre 3\Codec\ASAudioRenderer.dll)

[SamuriHL]

Um, no C:\Windows there. ;)

[SamuriHL]

Monsters Inc works with MPC Audio Renderer. I'll log it up as soon as I can get a chance. Not sure how to log the crash.

[albain]

Hello again does anyone know why i can't register from CMD ASAudioRenderer.dll It keeps telling me to make sure the path is correct where the binary is stored and i am sure i have it right (rgsvr32 C:\Windows\Program Files (86)Arcsoft\TotalMedia Theatre 3\Codec\ASAudioRenderer.dll)

Try to add quotes around the path : regsvr32 "c:\..."

[sub24ox7]

so i should leave out Windows and make it C:\program files\arcsoft and so on, I am sorry if this is taking up to much of your time this is the reason i haven't posted before but i am not computer illiterate and have manually registered .ax, .ocx, and .dll files from the command promt before because of fussy installers or should i say fussy vista. anyway thanks for the help samurihl i obviously have the path incorrect because that is what it is telling me. also should i manually move ASAudioRenderer.dll to C:\windows\system32 directory

[albain]

Monsters Inc works with MPC Audio Renderer. I'll log it up as soon as I can get a chance. Not sure how to log the crash.

Hard to tell indeed. You don't have visual studio installed ?

It will be able to tell you which module if faulty : MPCHC.exe, ffdshow.ax

I don't know if there is another way : when there are crashes windows store the dump with call stack and faulty module somewhere but I don't know if this can be extracted easily

Otherwise there is dbgview that can will give you traces before it crash and I can make my idea about it.

For EAC3, I am interested in logs too, just to see if the media structure is accepted by the ATI

We already know that EAC3 works with FFDShow and the xonar, and indeed the ATI may not support EAC3 for now but I don't see why it wouldn't

so i should leave out Windows and make it C:\program files\arcsoft and so on, I am sorry if this is taking up to much of your time this is the reason i haven't posted before but i am not computer illiterate and have manually registered .ax, .ocx, and .dll files from the command promt before because of fussy installers or should i say fussy vista. anyway thanks for the help samurihl i obviously have the path incorrect because tha is what it is telling me. also should i manually move ASAudioRenderer.dll to C:\windows\system32 directory

Just leave the file where it is and open a dos windows in administrator mode and type
regsvr32 "c:\program files\arcsoft....\asaudiorenderer.dll"

[rica]

46 is working for me very well with DTSHD and THD.

Thanks albain :)

[SamuriHL]

so i should leave out Windows and make it C:\program files\arcsoft and so on, I am sorry if this is taking up to much of your time this is the reason i haven't posted before but i am not computer illiterate and have manually registered .ax, .ocx, and .dll files from the command promt before because of fussy installers or should i say fussy vista. anyway thanks for the help samurihl i obviously have the path incorrect because tha is what it is telling me. also should i manually move ASAudioRenderer.dll to C:\windows\system32 directory

Personally I'd cd to the directory and just regsvr32 ASAudioRenderer.dll in that directory. Also make sure you're using an admin command prompt. A regular command prompt won't do it.

[SamuriHL]

Hard to tell indeed. You don't have visual studio installed ?

It will be able to tell you which module if faulty : MPCHC.exe, ffdshow.ax

I don't know if there is another way : when there are crashes windows store the dump with call stack and faulty module somewhere but I don't know if this can be extracted easily

Otherwise there is dbgview that can will give you traces before it crash and I can make my idea about it.

For EAC3, I am interested in logs too, just to see if the media structure is accepted by the ATI

We already know that EAC3 works with FFDShow and the xonar, and indeed the ATI may not support EAC3 for now but I don't see why it wouldn't


Yea I can get a stack trace of the crash. Can't right now...my son saw me messing with Monsters Inc and uh, well, we're watching that now. :) Might be tomorrow before I get back to it. We'll see.

As for EAC3, I don't get why it's not supported either. It should be.

[rica]

I don't have any expectation on eac3 support since it's not mandatory format for the blu , so i don't care :)

(And haven't seen any eac3 on any Blu.)

[stinman]

Is there ever a chance,this might work on the ATI 4870 or 4850 cards?It will bitstream DTS at 1536 at least.It would be nice!
stin

[sub24ox7]

Thanks for the info i will regsvr with that directory and remove the ASAudioRenderer dynamic link library file from system32 I had opened up the cmd with admin (dang vista) wish there was just a true sudo command in windows . My htpc vista sp2 x64 machine is now shutoff and i have to do some errands but when i get back i will do try both suggestions i.e. the correct way to do it. Its odd how memory can fail so easily and we remember the most trivial things. Thanks for the correct way to do it bye.:thanks:

[whurlston]

I have no idea what's on this disc for codecs yet.

http://www.cinemasquid.com/blu-ray/tools/bdinfo

[SamuriHL]

http://www.cinemasquid.com/blu-ray/tools/bdinfo

Yea, I have that. Was just being lazy. :) I could have just loaded up PDVD9, too. :D But it's DTS-HD MA. And crashes unless I use the MPC Audio Renderer. Good times.

[SamuriHL]

Thanks for the info i will regsvr with that directory and remove the ASAudioRenderer dynamic link library file from system32 I had opened up the cmd with admin (dang vista) wish there was just a true sudo command in windows . My htpc vista sp2 x64 machine is now shutoff and i have to do some errands but when i get back i will do try both suggestions i.e. the correct way to do it. Its odd how memory can fail so easily and we remember the most trivial things. Thanks for the correct way to do it bye.:thanks:

I cheat even more. :D I have a right click option in explorer that opens an admin cmd prompt here. So I just go to the folder in explorer, right click, open my admin cmd prompt, and have at it. :D

EDIT: http://www.winhelponline.com/articles/158/1/How-to-open-an-elevated-Command-Prompt-in-Windows-Vista.html

In case you're interested in my laziness. :D

[whurlston]

EAC3 logs:

DSound Renderer: http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/ffdshow/Beta46EAC3-DS.debug.txt
WaveOut: http://www.oshinetworks.com/DirectShow/ffdshow/Beta46EAC3-WO.debug.txt

[whurlston]

46 is working for me very well with DTSHD and THD.

Thanks albain :)

rica, are you still using Vista?

[rica]

rica, are you still using Vista?

No i'm on 7/64 anymore.
But i keep my second disc loaded with Vista for testing purposes.

[rica]

BTW guys; the story began with this afair:

http://85.230.118.136/showthread.php?p=1329075#post1329075


Thanks again albain for all your hard work and to the supporters :thanks:

[SamuriHL]

@albain

The MPC-HC crash with Monsters Inc using probably Waveout on this crash:


Level Date and Time Source Event ID Task Category
Error 12/3/2009 4:40:26 PM Application Error 1000 (100) "Faulting application name: mpc-hc.exe, version: 1.3.1373.0, time stamp: 0x4b153037
Faulting module name: ffdshow.ax, version: 1.0.7.3280, time stamp: 0x4b17fc74
Exception code: 0xc0000005
Fault offset: 0x00257135
Faulting process id: 0xdb0
Faulting application start time: 0x01ca74612f1db569
Faulting application path: C:\Program Files (x86)\MPC HomeCinema\mpc-hc.exe
Faulting module path: C:\Program Files (x86)\ffdshow\ffdshow.ax



Fault offsets for different renderers:
0x00257152 -Default Waveout
0x0024da7a - Default DS

I'm not sure if those offsets help you, but, it's definitely crashing in ffdshow.

[SamuriHL]

Interestingly enough, I found a renderer that works for me in all cases. WOO HOO. :D DirectSound: ATI HDMI Output is working for DTS-HD MA and TrueHD with no problems. (No, didn't try watchmen with it. Put it back on the shelf). However, this renderer is working for all the titles that I've tried so far.

[davinleeds]

I'm eager to try 46. 44 gave me only multichannel.

[rica]

I'm eager to try 46. 44 gave me only multichannel.

Just try it.
It's the end of the story :)
There might be some directors cut later but who cares for now? :)

[SamuriHL]

I recommend people try the DirectSound: ATI HDMI renderer and see how that works for you. Haven't crashed that one yet. :D

[gametiger]

Kudos to albain and everybody else who's helping with this, great job!


I'm planning to build a new HTPC and the progress you guys made right here is surely gonna influence my hardware choice.

As I understood it, the Xonar sound card and the ATI 5xxx series are the only cards that currently "support" HD audio bitstreaming.

So what would you recommend? Go for a Xonar sound card + a ATI/Nvidia video card combo or a video card out of the ATI 5xxx series?
What I'm looking for is a solidly working solution. Important criteria are reliability, quality and low heat/noise levels.

What would you guys go for?

Thanks in advance :)

Can someone give me advice on this please :)

[SamuriHL]

Can someone give me advice on this please :)

Let me give you an idea...I pulled my Xonar out of my machine even though it works fine. I have a 5870 which is all I use now. I don't think it makes ANY sense whatsoever to use a card that's tied (officially) to only one player. Yes, albain has it working in ffdshow but it's likely to never be supported in PDVD9, for example. The ATI card is officially supported in PDVD9 and WinDVD 2010. And now of course with ffdshow. And the likelihood is that TMT3 is going to have to support it or risk falling behind. A single card that does all that or a dual card solution that adds heat, power consumption, and complication to your life. Plus the external HDMI cable chaining required. You decide what's better. :)

[Andy o]

so i should leave out Windows and make it C:\program files\arcsoft and so on, I am sorry if this is taking up to much of your time this is the reason i haven't posted before but i am not computer illiterate and have manually registered .ax, .ocx, and .dll files from the command promt before because of fussy installers or should i say fussy vista. anyway thanks for the help samurihl i obviously have the path incorrect because that is what it is telling me. also should i manually move ASAudioRenderer.dll to C:\windows\system32 directory

Next time in Windows explorer you can just go to the folder where the file you wanna register is, and do a shift + right-click on a blank space in the window and choose "open command window here".

Alternatively, you can go back one step (to the folder where the folder that contains that file is), and do a shift + right-click on the folder that contains the file you wanna register.

Or you can just navigate to the file you want to register, and shift + right-click on it, and select "copy as path", and it will copy the full path of it, which you can then paste on the command prompt, quotes and all.

[SamuriHL]

Next time in Windows explorer you can just go to the folder where the file you wanna register is, and do a shift + right-click on a blank space in the window and choose "open command window here".

Alternatively, you can go back one step (to the folder where the folder that contains that file is), and do a shift + right-click on the folder that contains the file you wanna register.

Not if UAC is on. It has to be an admin cmd prompt.

[gametiger]

Let me give you an idea...I pulled my Xonar out of my machine even though it works fine. I have a 5870 which is all I use now. I don't think it makes ANY sense whatsoever to use a card that's tied (officially) to only one player. Yes, albain has it working in ffdshow but it's likely to never be supported in PDVD9, for example. The ATI card is officially supported in PDVD9 and WinDVD 2010. And now of course with ffdshow. And the likelihood is that TMT3 is going to have to support it or risk falling behind. A single card that does all that or a dual card solution that adds heat, power consumption, and complication to your life. Plus the external HDMI cable chaining required. You decide what's better. :)
Alrighty, thanks :)

The 5770 should be fine, right (I'm not planning to use it for any new games)? The only thing that worries me is the possible noise, but I heard that shouldn't be an issue for those cards?

Some people also mentioned the advantage of having 1 dedicated card for the video and 1 dedicated card for the audio. I didn't quite get that though :rolleyes:

[SamuriHL]

Alrighty, thanks :)

The 5770 should be fine, right (I'm not planning to use it for any new games)? The only thing that worries me is the possible noise, but I heard that shouldn't be an issue for those cards?

Some people also mentioned the advantage of having 1 dedicated card for the video and 1 dedicated card for the audio. I didn't quite get that though :rolleyes:

The advantage is if you're into gaming you can upgrade the video card and not affect your audio solution. YAWN. Like ATI is going to suddenly say "hey, you know, with the 6xxx cards we decided to drop bitstreaming support. Sorry!" RIGHT. :) And you yourself said you're not going to use it for gaming, so issue solved. Noise is not an issue when watching movies. Even my giant 5870 is silent when playing video. Get a video card with bitstreaming in more apps for the same price as an audio only card that's tied to one app, or get that audio card plus a video card....tough call. ;)

[Andy o]

Not if UAC is on. It has to be an admin cmd prompt.

Was wondering about that. I never have UAC on.

[SamuriHL]

Was wondering about that. I never have UAC on.

I leave it on in 7 as it's not obnoxious like Vista. But yes, it requires elevated privs to register a file.

[gametiger]

The advantage is if you're into gaming you can upgrade the video card and not affect your audio solution. YAWN. Like ATI is going to suddenly say "hey, you know, with the 6xxx cards we decided to drop bitstreaming support. Sorry!" RIGHT. :) And you yourself said you're not going to use it for gaming, so issue solved. Noise is not an issue when watching movies. Even my giant 5870 is silent when playing video. Get a video card with bitstreaming in more apps for the same price as an audio only card that's tied to one app, or get that audio card plus a video card....tough call. ;)
Thanks man, you were a great help :)

On another note... does anyone know if this will work in MediaPortal? Well it should, right?

[honai]

I recommend people try the DirectSound: ATI HDMI renderer and see how that works for you. Haven't crashed that one yet. :D

Is that with the ATI drivers, or Realtek drivers?

[SamuriHL]

Is that with the ATI drivers, or Realtek drivers?

The ATI Cat 9.11 HDMI driver. Someone said the realtek driver is the same as the ATI one now, but, I don't think that's accurate from what I've seen. I just use the one from ATI. AFAIK, the realtek one still isn't capable of bitstreaming, even with ffdshow, but I haven't tried the latest realtek driver with the latest ffdshow. It'd be a good thing to try though. If I get a chance I can try them tomorrow.

[Andy o]

Does the MPC audio renderer use wasapi exclusive mode? As in, will it switch channels/sample rate automatically when playing decoded audio?

[albain]

@albain

The MPC-HC crash with Monsters Inc using probably Waveout on this crash:


Level Date and Time Source Event ID Task Category
Error 12/3/2009 4:40:26 PM Application Error 1000 (100) "Faulting application name: mpc-hc.exe, version: 1.3.1373.0, time stamp: 0x4b153037
Faulting module name: ffdshow.ax, version: 1.0.7.3280, time stamp: 0x4b17fc74
Exception code: 0xc0000005
Fault offset: 0x00257135
Faulting process id: 0xdb0
Faulting application start time: 0x01ca74612f1db569
Faulting application path: C:\Program Files (x86)\MPC HomeCinema\mpc-hc.exe
Faulting module path: C:\Program Files (x86)\ffdshow\ffdshow.ax



Fault offsets for different renderers:
0x00257152 -Default Waveout
0x0024da7a - Default DS

I'm not sure if those offsets help you, but, it's definitely crashing in ffdshow.

Thanks SamuriHL, this crash dump states that FFDShow is responsible of the crash.
This will be difficult to figure it out : visual studio with ffdshow compiled in debug mode is required to get the exact location of the crash.

Is there a developer/or compiler person who owns a radeon 5xxx ?

[Snowknight26]

Under ffdshow's video output, the tooltip for Standard under Input levels says that ffdshow automatically uses Full range for Fraps videos, even though it does not. The only way to get Full range is to select it, which is quite annoying having to change that setting back and forth, depending on what content is being decoded. Should be an easy fix, though.

[THX-UltraII]

I have a question that s not related to the new bitstreaming thing, hope thats ok :):

When I play a movie which has True-HD audio MPC-HC does not load ffdshow. So after some testing I figured out that it has something to do with Haali Splitter. So I uninstalled Haali Splitter and enabled the internal TS filter in MPC-HC. Ater this FFdshow audio does load fine now. However, something is wrong with the decoding. I enabled all codecs in FFdshow and checked only 16-bit as output. I can see in the info of FFdshow (when playing the file) that True 5.1 decoding is active. However, the video stutters like hell. What could I be doing wrong here?

[albain]

I have a question that s not related to the new bitstreaming thing, hope thats ok :):

When I play a movie which has True-HD audio MPC-HC does not load ffdshow. So after some testing I figured out that it has something to do with Haali Splitter. So I uninstalled Haali Splitter and enabled the internal TS filter in MPC-HC. Ater this FFdshow audio does load fine now. However, something is wrong with the decoding. I enabled all codecs in FFdshow and checked only 16-bit as output. I can see in the info of FFdshow (when playing the file) that True 5.1 decoding is active. However, the video stutters like hell. What could I be doing wrong here?

Hi,

the number of channels may not be accurate.

Have you tried the last beta 46 from the earlier post ? Because I also brought some changes to decoding mode

[liquidskin76]

Can someone give me advice on this please :)

Put it this way... i have a xonar however as soon as a low profile ati 5xxx arrives in early 2010, i'll be pulling my xonar out and taking a hammer to it!

[liquidskin76]

Thanks man, you were a great help :)

On another note... does anyone know if this will work in MediaPortal? Well it should, right?

You would have to configure MediaPortal to use MPC-HC as an external player. This is what i'll be doing in XBMC.

Hopefully the mediaPortal/XBMC devs will code in HD bitstreaming in the near future (i'll certainly be putting in the request on the XBMC forums as soon as albain has completed the ffdshow build... watch out albain, i expect they will try and pick your brains!).

BTW... XBMC with Aeon skin totaly blows the tits off MediaPortal!

[STaRGaZeR]

Under ffdshow's video output, the tooltip for Standard under Input levels says that ffdshow automatically uses Full range for Fraps videos, even though it does not. The only way to get Full range is to select it, which is quite annoying having to change that setting back and forth, depending on what content is being decoded. Should be an easy fix, though.

Confirmed.

[Skinleech]

You would have to configure MediaPortal to use MPC-HC as an external player. This is what i'll be doing in XBMC.

Hopefully the mediaPortal/XBMC devs will code in HD bitstreaming in the near future (i'll certainly be putting in the request on the XBMC forums as soon as albain has completed the ffdshow build... watch out albain, i expect they will try and pick your brains!).

BTW... XBMC with Aeon skin totaly blows the tits off MediaPortal!

I use XBMC on my old Xbox 1 for SD content, but I really didn;t like it on the PC. Not sure why.

Anyway, will try the latest build once I'm done work. Thanks yet again for the hard work albain.

[renethx]

Does the MPC audio renderer use wasapi exclusive mode? As in, will it switch channels/sample rate automatically when playing decoded audio?
It supports WASAPI exclusive only. Channel count is preserved. But ATI driver accepts only 16 bit LPCM. So ffdshow first has to downsample LPCM audio streams to 16 bit. Outside MPC HomeCimena loading it is not easy (a trick similar to ReClockDS.dll works however). ReClock does not support HD audio bitstreams (yet) and suffers from the same 16-bit restriction. Realtek HDMI driver does not work for bitstreaming. So it's a no-go situation for those "bit-perfect" people.

@albain

It is possible to improve "WASAPI audio renderer" (I am not sure what way)?

[dehati_paul]

@dehati_paul : yes it is but you have to register the renderer first
Dos windows in admin mode, do :
regsvr32 "c:\program files\ArcSoft\TotalMedia Theatre 3\Codec\ASAudioRenderer.dll"

@all

Let's summarize things a little bit :

xonar + arcsoft renderer : work with all DTSHD samples ? work with some THD but not all => I have Sebastii's logs to fix THD
xonar + other renderer : doesn't work ? This does not surprise me
ATI 5xxx : I saw some THD samples working, some others won't with directsound. But non working samples will work if you use waveout. Right ? I have ffdshow logs for non working sample (a 5.1 track if I remember correctly) but not a working track with the same attributes (I mean sample rate and number of channels). Please also report the sample rate too. I suspect a bug in the ATI driver, it also may come from the channels mask sent
ATI 5xxx + DTSHD : works with directsound (MA or HR) but not with waveout (MA only), right ?
ATI 5xxx and Dolby Digital Plus : what about this one ? Still working in all cases ?

@albain I registered the Arcsoft audio renderer, but the question still remains as to how do I set it as default so that ffdshow when called from any app (not just MPC-HC or GS) will use Arcsoft Audio Renderer?

[Cheesegeezer]

Albain, great job and my hat off to you and everyone else that has helped you over time, I wished to have contributed but couldn't acquire any logs (probably due to my inexperience with debugging).

My .ts and .m2ts samples seem to play with no hicups both on TrueHD and DTSHD. The mkv file I have that was posted up on here a while ago with the DTSHD intro is not good though as you hear the sound, the lights appear on the AVR but the video is about 3-5 seconds delayed in appearing and the when it does arrive it breaks the audio.

I'm using Win7 32bit, HD5850, ATI CCC 9.11 and ATI hdmi audio 5.0.7000.9 driver.

If some one can tell me how to get debugger working with graphstudio I can help to post some logs.

Top Job again and thanks for all your hard work, I knew you could do it:thanks:

[gametiger]

BTW... XBMC with Aeon skin totaly blows the tits off MediaPortal!
XBMC has no TV functionality though, has it? Of course you could always call an external program, but I'm not really a fan of that method.

[albain]

It supports WASAPI exclusive only. Channel count is preserved. But ATI driver accepts only 16 bit LPCM. So ffdshow first has to downsample LPCM audio streams to 16 bit. Outside MPC HomeCimena loading it is not easy (a trick similar to ReClockDS.dll works however). ReClock does not support HD audio bitstreams (yet) and suffers from the same 16-bit restriction. Realtek HDMI driver does not work for bitstreaming. So it's a no-go situation for those "bit-perfect" people.

@albain

It is possible to improve "WASAPI audio renderer" (I am not sure what way)?

Sure, but I will let this part to MPC-HC team, due to lack of time
I will commit my version to MPCHC when I will have done some cleanings

EDIT : actually the MPC renderer supports both wasapi (exclusive) and directsound but I forced it to wasapi. The UI config must be added to select which mode to use.
Also the mode could be selected according to the input format
Also(2) the default audio endpoint is used. It could become selectable

[Andy o]

It supports WASAPI exclusive only. Channel count is preserved. But ATI driver accepts only 16 bit LPCM. So ffdshow first has to downsample LPCM audio streams to 16 bit. Outside MPC HomeCimena loading it is not easy (a trick similar to ReClockDS.dll works however). ReClock does not support HD audio bitstreams (yet) and suffers from the same 16-bit restriction. Realtek HDMI driver does not work for bitstreaming. So it's a no-go situation for those "bit-perfect" people.


That is interesting, cause 24-bit (padded to 32) works with foobar2000 and JRiver MC, at least with ATI drivers and the 4000 series. Have you tried these with the 5000 series? I thought it might have been ReClock's error.

[Skinleech]

Albain, great job and my hat off to you and everyone else that has helped you over time, I wished to have contributed but couldn't acquire any logs (probably due to my inexperience with debugging).

My .ts and .m2ts samples seem to play with no hicups both on TrueHD and DTSHD. The mkv file I have that was posted up on here a while ago with the DTSHD intro is not good though as you hear the sound, the lights appear on the AVR but the video is about 3-5 seconds delayed in appearing and the when it does arrive it breaks the audio.

I'm using Win7 32bit, HD5850, ATI CCC 9.11 and ATI hdmi audio 5.0.7000.9 driver.

If some one can tell me how to get debugger working with graphstudio I can help to post some logs.

Top Job again and thanks for all your hard work, I knew you could do it:thanks:

What splitter are you using for mkv? Using Haali I had issues, using the MPC internal splitter they seem to work well for me.

[SamuriHL]

Thanks SamuriHL, this crash dump states that FFDShow is responsible of the crash.
This will be difficult to figure it out : visual studio with ffdshow compiled in debug mode is required to get the exact location of the crash.

Is there a developer/or compiler person who owns a radeon 5xxx ?

If absolutely necessary I can grab my dev tools and throw it on that machine. It'll likely break TMT3 because of their stupid protection, but, if it helps fix this issue I can grab VS. Should I go for VS 2010? I'll definitely need some help with the setup of the project, though. I haven't compiled anything in VS in a while. The stuff I do for a living is all Java using Eclipse these days.

[renethx]

That is interesting, cause 24-bit (padded to 32) works with foobar2000 and JRiver MC, at least with ATI drivers and the 4000 series. Have you tried these with the 5000 series? I thought it might have been ReClock's error.
Yup, I tried. No sound if ffdshow sends > 16 bit LPCM to albain's MPC Audio Renderer. So I have to check only "16 bit integer" in "Output" tab in ffdshow audio decoder configuration and then it works fine (WASAPI exlusive with correct channel count). But even with 16 bit, the sound quality is much better than WASAPI shared mode (I am always wondering what kind of crappy processing is done by Windows audio engine, even when no *enhancement* is selected).

Precisely speaking

- If 24 bit integer (only) is selected, ffdshow Audio Decoder can't connect to MPC - Audio Decoder
- If 32 bit integer (only) is selected, ffdshow Audio Decoder connects to MPC - Audio Decoder, but no sound is sent.

[SamuriHL]

Yup, I tried. No sound if ffdshow sends > 16 bit LPCM to albain's MPC Audio Renderer. So I have to check only "16 bit integer" in "Output" tab in ffdshow audio decoder configuration and then it works fine (WASAPI exlusive with correct channel count).

That's why bitstreaming is better. :p

[renethx]

That's why bitstreaming is better. :p
We still need WASAPI exclusive mode via, say, MPC Audio Renderer, for *bit-perfect* LPCM. (A good portion of all HD audio tracks in BD movies are LPCM, an aspect forgotten also by PowerDVD/HD 5xxx and TMT/Xonar.)

[Andy o]

Yup, I tried. No sound if ffdshow sends > 16 bit LPCM to albain's MPC Audio Renderer. So I have to check only "16 bit integer" in "Output" tab in ffdshow audio decoder configuration and then it works fine (WASAPI exlusive with correct channel count). But even with 16 bit, the sound quality is much better than WASAPI shared mode (I am always wondering what kind of crappy processing is done by Windows audio engine, even when no *enhancement* is selected).

Actually, by "these" I meant if you had tried foobar2k and/or JR MC with 24-bit content. I'm pretty sure they would work, as with the 4000 series. Which leads me to think there might be something ReClock and the MPC renderer are missing. On the other hand it works with the Realtek drivers. Has anyone tried enabling 24 or 32-bit on ffdshow, with Realtek drivers?

[SamuriHL]

We still need WASAPI exclusive mode via, say, MPC Audio Renderer, for *bit-perfect* LPCM. (A good portion of all HD audio tracks in BD movies are LPCM, an aspect forgotten also by PowerDVD/HD 5xxx and TMT/Xonar.)

I know. I'd like to know how PDVD9 does it for streams 48/24 and above. For 48/16 they're throwing it into the lion's den of windows audio. But if the ATI driver doesn't support 24, how are they doing it?? Upsampling to 32?? But I thought that only worked with the realtek driver, so, again, how?

[renethx]

Has anyone tried enabling 24 or 32-bit on ffdshow, with Realtek drivers?
Realtek R2.35 driver:

- 16 bit integer: Works with correct sample rate, but channel count does not match (always the same as the one selected in Windows' Sound control panel).
- 24 bit integer, 32 bit integer, 32 bit fp: ffdshow does not connect to MPC Audio Renderer.

[madshi]

The ultimate solution would be a realtime DirectShow TrueHD encoder. Not sure if such a thing is coming anytime soon. Probably not...

[SamuriHL]

What, no DTS-HD MA???? ;) LOL!

[renethx]

I know. I'd like to know how PDVD9 does it for streams 48/24 and above. For 48/16 they're throwing it into the lion's den of windows audio. But if the ATI driver doesn't support 24, how are they doing it?? Upsampling to 32?? But I thought that only worked with the realtek driver, so, again, how?
Definitely ATI driver supports 24 bit as confirmed with foobar2000 and J. River MC. This (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16305663#post16305663) is a bit old result with HD 4670, but the same is true for HD 5xxx. There might be a compatibility issue between MPC Audio Renderer and ATI HDMI driver, like ReClock.

[Cheesegeezer]

What splitter are you using for mkv? Using Haali I had issues, using the MPC internal splitter they seem to work well for me.

Aha, I will try using the internals as I see Haali load up in the task bar.

Thanks for the advise.

[SamuriHL]

Definitely ATI driver supports 24 bit as confirmed with foobar2000 and J. River MC. This (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16305663#post16305663) is a bit old result with HD 4670, but the same is true for HD 5xxx. There might be a compatibility issue between MPC Audio Renderer and ATI HDMI driver.

That would mean reclock has the same issue. I'm not convinced yet.

[Andy o]

Realtek R2.35 driver:

- 16 bit integer: Works with correct sample rate, but channel count does not match (always the same as the one selected in Windows' Sound control panel).
- 24 bit integer, 32 bit integer, 32 bit fp: ffdshow does not connect to MPC Audio Renderer.

Then it doesn't seem like it's the same problem as with ReClock, cause ReClock can take in 24 and 32-bit, only that it can't output it with the ATI drivers. The MPC renderer it seems can't take in anything but 16-bit. This seems like it can be fixed fairly easily, no?

IOW, with the MPC audio renderer, higher-than-16 bit is failing before even reaching the driver.

[Andy o]

Does the MPC audio renderer only work with these betas of ffdshow? Cause I can't get it to connect with another ffdshow build (3126) even though I only enable 16-bit output.

[Skinleech]

Aha, I will try using the internals as I see Haali load up in the task bar.

Thanks for the advise.

Good luck! Haali doesn't see TrueHD stream either, so pretty useless for our purposes.

[albain]

If absolutely necessary I can grab my dev tools and throw it on that machine. It'll likely break TMT3 because of their stupid protection, but, if it helps fix this issue I can grab VS. Should I go for VS 2010? I'll definitely need some help with the setup of the project, though. I haven't compiled anything in VS in a while. The stuff I do for a living is all Java using Eclipse these days.

Well if nobody else can do it (is there ?), you can set up a development enviromnent but there is some work :

1/ VS 2008 (not 2010 it is crappy and so sloooow)
2/ DirectX SDK
3/ Grab last SVN release from bitstreamHD branch

[SamuriHL]

Well if nobody else can do it (is there ?), you can set up a development enviromnent but there is some work :

1/ VS 2008 (not 2010 it is crappy and so sloooow)
2/ DirectX SDK
3/ Grab last SVN release from bitstreamHD branch

Alright. I'll start getting that set up. It'll likely be sometime this weekend before I have everything set up. Also, I don't do anything with SVN, so, I will need assistance on how to get the latest SVN release code. (Where it's located, etc) But I've got experience debugging in VS, so, once I get it set up I should be able to help figure out what's going on.

[albain]

Then it doesn't seem like it's the same problem as with ReClock, cause ReClock can take in 24 and 32-bit, only that it can't output it with the ATI drivers. The MPC renderer it seems can't take in anything but 16-bit. This seems like it can be fixed fairly easily, no?

IOW, with the MPC audio renderer, higher-than-16 bit is failing before even reaching the driver.


The MPC renderer would accept anything in condition the audio driver would accept it. This is how it works

However : LPCM has a special mediatype so this is the reason why you won't get 24/32 bits for now with the new ATIs.

This has to be fixed on FFDShow : there is a LPCM checkbox in output section but I don't know what it is used for (DVD audio from the code). I wonder if it shouldn't be used in conjonction with 16/24/32/32 floats checkbox instead of exclusive (checking LPCM will disable the 16/24/32 checkboxes) ?

Anyway, LPCM support is a second step, let's focus on HD audio bitstream : we need to confirm that THD/DTSHD are okay (EAC3, I am working on it) and that now with the last build the xonar is also working correctly

[SamuriHL]

@albain

The latest DirectX SDK I see is from November 2007. Is that the right one to grab? I've got VS 2k8 downloading now and the SDK will download after that.

[Snowknight26]

Can we split the ffdshow bitstreaming discussion/development off to another thread? Seems like anything not relating to bitstreaming goes unnoticed and gets lost (bye bye, bug reports) in the 2/3 new pages made each day.

[tetsuo55]

@albain

The latest DirectX SDK I see is from November 2007. Is that the right one to grab? I've got VS 2k8 downloading now and the SDK will download after that.woah, classic lol.

Get the latest version here : http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=b66e14b8-8505-4b17-bf80-edb2df5abad4&displaylang=en#dx

[albain]

@albain

The latest DirectX SDK I see is from November 2007. Is that the right one to grab? I've got VS 2k8 downloading now and the SDK will download after that.

No, there is a more recent one
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=B66E14B8-8505-4B17-BF80-EDB2DF5ABAD4&displaylang=en

[SamuriHL]

Thanks, guys. Figures MSDN isn't up to date on that. :rolleyes: :) The download of VS is still going. I found a subversion client to integrate into it. So, getting there.

[albain]

Can we split the ffdshow bitstreaming discussion/development off to another thread? Seems like anything not relating to bitstreaming goes unnoticed and gets lost (bye bye, bug reports) in the 2/3 new pages made each day.

No problem with that. However, this subject is nearly over, a few things apart (latest feedbacks) before merging modifications to the trunk.

I propose to start over with a new thread this monday if necessary

[Skinleech]

Hi albain & fellow testers.

I'm sorry to say that I'm still not getting great results with this, certain files give me issues. One thing to note is that I'm playing back over a network currently - I don't think it will make a difference, but I will also try a problematic file from the local drive to be sure.

DTS-HD: All show was 96000hz with 8 channels in the Ffdshow tray icon, with varying bitrates. I get stutters & audio drop outs.
TrueHD: Seems to read the file data correctly, but I get audio stutter and drop outs on some files.

I have tried both in m2ts and mkv with no luck. Using MPC-HC 1373, the internal splitter, beta 46 and the Arcsoft renderer.

I'll post a sample for both problem files - do you want logs too? I guess yes.

Thanks.

[sub24ox7]

hello i have started testing now too and xonar with ffdshow beta 46 and arcsoft audio renderer works with dolby-true hd from the hangover blu-ray remuxed to m2ts with tsmuxer no drop outs or anything i can tell. I have A dolby true-hd blu-ray with 7.1 and 96000hz track if you would like me to try. i am playing these files over a network as well i don't think that will cuase any problems at all null

[sub24ox7]

alright the 7.1 dolby true-hd 96000hz bitreams perfect! no problems at all, same setup as the previous post WAIT EDIT there are some short dropouts but it is straight from disc with anydvd decrypting and playing the main movie m2ts. I don't think its because i am playing it from disc and not the hard drive so there are still a few things to be worked out. This is so wonderful i am not even taking the time to type a correct sentence or spell. Now i am going to try dts-hd and hr with the xonar

[sub24ox7]

mpc-hc is crashing on me with dts-hd discs

[SamuriHL]

mpc-hc is crashing on me with dts-hd discs

And chance you can look in the windows event viewer and post the offset that it's crashing at? This is an issue I'll be looking into as soon as I can get my dev env built up. Just want to see if the offset matches any of mine.

[sub24ox7]

yes i will do that now

[whurlston]

SHL, if you haven't set up the dev environment yet, I've got to run out and I can pick up a rental copy of Monsters Inc to test it. I've got the environment set up to test. It will be 3 or 4 hours before I get back though.

[sub24ox7]

xml view
<Event xmlns="http://schemas.microsoft.com/win/2004/08/events/event">
- <System>
<Provider Name="Application Error" />
<EventID Qualifiers="0">1000</EventID>
<Level>2</Level>
<Task>100</Task>
<Keywords>0x80000000000000</Keywords>
<TimeCreated SystemTime="2009-12-04T18:38:30.000Z" />
<EventRecordID>5244</EventRecordID>
<Channel>Application</Channel>
<Computer>showroom-PC</Computer>
<Security />
</System>
- <EventData>
<Data>mpc-hc.exe</Data>
<Data>1.3.1333.0</Data>
<Data>4b16cf28</Data>
<Data>ffdshow.ax</Data>
<Data>1.0.7.3280</Data>
<Data>4b17fc74</Data>
<Data>c0000005</Data>
<Data>0024da7a</Data>
<Data>e2c</Data>
<Data>01ca7510c5a71d11</Data>
</EventData>
</Event>

mpc-hc.exe
1.3.1333.0
4b16cf28
ffdshow.ax
1.0.7.3280
4b17fc74
c0000005
mpc-hc.exe
1.3.1333.0
4b16cf28
ffdshow.ax
1.0.7.3280
4b17fc74
c0000005
0024da7a
e2c
01ca7510c5a71d11
01ca7510c5a71d11


offset: 0024da7a

[SamuriHL]

SHL, if you haven't set up the dev environment yet, I've got to run out and I can pick up a rental copy of Monsters Inc to test it. I've got the environment set up to test. It will be 3 or 4 hours before I get back though.

That'd be awesome, too. Since you have it set up and know the environment better than me if you don't mind that'd be great. I'm working on getting it set up now. Got VS installed, doing updates. Then I'll install the DX sdk. Then the subversion plugin I found. Then I gotta get the project set up in VS. Clearly I have a ways to go and I'm going out tonight. But I'd like to learn this environment so I can help in the future. But having both of us look at it would be a good thing.

[SamuriHL]

xml view
<Event xmlns="http://schemas.microsoft.com/win/2004/08/events/event">
- <System>
<Provider Name="Application Error" />
<EventID Qualifiers="0">1000</EventID>
<Level>2</Level>
<Task>100</Task>
<Keywords>0x80000000000000</Keywords>
<TimeCreated SystemTime="2009-12-04T18:38:30.000Z" />
<EventRecordID>5244</EventRecordID>
<Channel>Application</Channel>
<Computer>showroom-PC</Computer>
<Security />
</System>
- <EventData>
<Data>mpc-hc.exe</Data>
<Data>1.3.1333.0</Data>
<Data>4b16cf28</Data>
<Data>ffdshow.ax</Data>
<Data>1.0.7.3280</Data>
<Data>4b17fc74</Data>
<Data>c0000005</Data>
<Data>0024da7a</Data>
<Data>e2c</Data>
<Data>01ca7510c5a71d11</Data>
</EventData>
</Event>

mpc-hc.exe
1.3.1333.0
4b16cf28
ffdshow.ax
1.0.7.3280
4b17fc74
c0000005
mpc-hc.exe
1.3.1333.0
4b16cf28
ffdshow.ax
1.0.7.3280
4b17fc74
c0000005
0024da7a
e2c
01ca7510c5a71d11
01ca7510c5a71d11


offset: 0024da7a

Then I can tell you what renderer you were using. :D Default DirectSound, non-ATI version. :) Thanks.

[sub24ox7]

yes that log is for the xonar with mpc-hc and ffdshow beta 46 and arcsoft audio renderer the crash that happens with dts-hd ma. Oh and i forgot to mention this same setup with dolby true-hd works great but if you skip with the mouse cursor to a different spot the audio is gone and never comes back in

[SamuriHL]

yes that log is for the xonar with mpc-hc and ffdshow beta 46 and arcsoft audio renderer the crash that happens with dts-hd ma

That was with the arcsoft renderer?? Ohhhh, fascinating. It crashed in the same place as mine did for me with the Default DS renderer. Hmmmmm. You *SURE* it's using the arcsoft renderer and not the Default DS one??

[Skinleech]

That was with the arcsoft renderer?? Ohhhh, fascinating. It crashed in the same place as mine did for me with the Default DS renderer. Hmmmmm. You *SURE* it's using the arcsoft renderer and not the Default DS one??

It has to be - the xonar won't bitstream without the Arcsoft renderer.

Sounds like the crash I get with DTS-HD files, though they play 2nd or 3rd try.

[SamuriHL]

It has to be - the xonar won't bitstream without the Arcsoft renderer.

Sounds like the crash I get with DTS-HD files, though they play 2nd or 3rd try.

I get the same thing with the default DS renderer with my 5870. However, it'll keep crashing. Now if I switch to the DirectSound: ATI HDMI renderer then everything plays fine. But the crashes I've seen reported are ALL with DTS-HD MA tracks. This is what I'm going to attempt to debug tomorrow after I get my system set up for debugging. Whurlston will hopefully beat me to it but I'll go through the exercise anyway as I want to learn so I can help in the future. I loathe putting a dev env on that machine due to TMT3 but I'm keeping my fingers crossed it'll be ok. TMT3 shouldn't care if VS isn't running. It will, however, exit immediately if VS is running. :mad: In any case, we're going to see if we can figure out why these crash.

[sub24ox7]

that is 100% for sure using the arcsoft renderer i hope you can find the reason for the crashes soon . bye and thanks

[Skinleech]

I get the same thing with the default DS renderer with my 5870. However, it'll keep crashing. Now if I switch to the DirectSound: ATI HDMI renderer then everything plays fine. But the crashes I've seen reported are ALL with DTS-HD MA tracks. This is what I'm going to attempt to debug tomorrow after I get my system set up for debugging. Whurlston will hopefully beat me to it but I'll go through the exercise anyway as I want to learn so I can help in the future. I loathe putting a dev env on that machine due to TMT3 but I'm keeping my fingers crossed it'll be ok. TMT3 shouldn't care if VS isn't running. It will, however, exit immediately if VS is running. :mad: In any case, we're going to see if we can figure out why these crash.

Good luck. All DTS-HD tracks here too - HR and MA. Mkv is better though, no crashes there, but I've only tested one so far.

[SamuriHL]

I'll do my best. I haven't touched VS in several years so don't expect miracles out me. :D I'm hoping I can at least pinpoint where it's crashing so albain can take a look at it. It doesn't happen on all DTS-HD MA tracks, so, something has to be common to the ones it's crashing on.

[SamuriHL]

One of you SVN people...help. I can't locate the bitstream branch for ffdshow in svn. Anyone? :)

[clsid]

http://ffdshow-tryout.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/ffdshow-tryout/

[SamuriHL]

Well if nobody else can do it (is there ?), you can set up a development enviromnent but there is some work :

1/ VS 2008 (not 2010 it is crappy and so sloooow)
2/ DirectX SDK
3/ Grab last SVN release from bitstreamHD branch

I don't see the bitstreamHD branch under ffdshow. I must be doing something wrong.

[SamuriHL]

http://ffdshow-tryout.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/ffdshow-tryout/

Thanks! I forgot it's the tryout not the main ffdshow project. sigh. :)

[SamuriHL]

I'm starting to not like SVN one bit. It keeps telling me the repository has been temporarily moved and won't allow me to open it. WTH???

Nevermind. I grabbed the tarball and called it good. Of course I get a bunch of errors when trying to compile it. Awesome. :)

EDIT: YASM, eh? No one warned me about that or having the source code in a path with spaces! Curse you all! :p

[clsid]

MinGW32 + YASM:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/ffdshow-tryout/files/Tools/mingw32_gcc441_20091010.exe/download

[SamuriHL]

Sorry, I didn't mean to suggest it was still an issue. Just that I was blindsided by it. Got that figured out but it can't find the DX SDK stuff. Not sure where to add the include dir for the headers.

EDIT: The rust is coming off. I'm getting there. Working through it all slowly but making progress. :D

[TripleH]

Hi everyone,

My setup is the following:

ASUS Xonar HDAV 1.3 Deluxe
Windows 7 Ultimate 32-bit
FFDShow Bitstream Beta 46
MPC-HC SVN 1378

I managed to get bitstreaming of HD Audio codecs working, but I have a problem.

I don't know why it happens, but if FFDShow video decoder is loaded, then the Arcsoft Audio Renderer refuses to load, in instead MPC-HC loads the Default DirectShow Device renderer, which of course can't bitstream with the Xonar.

What do you think can cause this problem ?

At first I thought that it is maybe the madVR renderer, but then I tried CoreAVC decoder instead of FFDShow and it worked fine. I also tried FFDShow with EVR and EVR Custom Pres. and the problem returned.

[SamuriHL]

I don't know, this doesn't seem like it's going to work. Every time I fix an error I get more and more and more each time. I added some Boost library and now I've got 1000's of errors. :mad: I think this is simply an exercise in frustration.

KSDATAFORMAT_SUBTYPE_IEC61937_DOLBY_DIGITAL undeclared identifier

[SamuriHL]

You know...I tell ya. I finally get the thing compiled (yea, about that error...I commented that code out :p) and I can tell you the debug version is NOT what you want. :D It skips, slows down, drops out. Yea, anyway, so I bring up Monsters Inc with direct sound. Runs fine. sigh. I give up. :)

[SamuriHL]

Holy snikes I have a headache now. albain, buddy. I know it seems like I'm an idiot when it comes to this dev stuff based on my trials and errors here. :D However, I rebuilt the damn thing in release mode to make sure the error is there. Indeed, KABOOM. Sweet! I figure now I'll just attach to MPC-HC and trap the error. Yeaaaaa, about that. :) I attach the debugger to it and it works fine. sigh. :) I don't have any idea at all how to trap this error!

[albain]

Thanks SamuriHL for all your efforts

This is a big problem when you can't reproduce the crash in debug mode. Have you tried to run it without vs debugging into ?
I mean there are 2 ways to debug : either attach to the process and run it, or let the player run without visual studio and when it will crash it will ask you if you want to debug

Last resort is to add DPRINTF but this is very difficult to narrow the problem down. I will perform some deeper analysis of the code, but I need a max of info

Could you send me logs whith working and "crashing" samples in that case ?

Otherwise I have opened a new thread for HD audio bitstream.

We have taken this one into hostage enough :)

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1349575#post1349575

[SamuriHL]

Moving the discussion to the new thread....

[Spec-Chum]

One of the main causes for something running in debug builds but not in a release build is variable/memory initialisation. This is because in release builds nothing is initialised unless you do it explicitly but in a debug build any allocated variable/memory is initialised automatically to set values.

In Visual C++ these are:

0xCD – Clean - Memory on the heap that has been allocated by new but not yet written to
0xDD – Dead – Heap memory that has been deleted
0xFD – Fence – AKA "no mans land". Automatically placed at boundaries of Clean memory. If you overwrite this you've probably gone off the end of an array
0xCC – All variables created on the stack are initialised to 0xCC until explicitly initialised in the code

There's also 0xFEEEFEEE which is Fill Heap Memory, which is memory marked for usage by the OS, but wasn't allocated by HeapAlloc() or LocalAlloc, or it could just have been freed by HeapFree().

Hope this helps, SamuriHL :)

Spec-Chum

[rica]

Moving the discussion to the new thread....

Yea, it's better i think.

[SamuriHL]

One of the main causes for something running in debug builds but not in a release build is variable/memory initialisation. This is because in release builds nothing is initialised unless you do it explicitly but in a debug build any allocated variable/memory is initialised automatically to set values.

In Visual C++ these are:

0xCD – Clean - Memory on the heap that has been allocated by new but not yet written to
0xDD – Dead – Heap memory that has been deleted
0xFD – Fence – AKA "no mans land". Automatically placed at boundaries of Clean memory. If you overwrite this you've probably gone off the end of an array
0xCC – All variables created on the stack are initialised to 0xCC until explicitly initialised in the code

There's also 0xFEEEFEEE which is Fill Heap Memory, which is memory marked for usage by the OS, but wasn't allocated by HeapAlloc() or LocalAlloc, or it could just have been freed by HeapFree().

Hope this helps, SamuriHL :)

Spec-Chum

Ohhh, nice. See, I've been in java too long and forgot all my C++ training. sigh. :) Yea, that's actually a very good thought. I'll walk through the code. I'd like to pinpoint where exactly it's failing so I can concentrate on whatever module it is. However, you may be on to something. I'll look in the morning. Too tired to deal with it tonight and my wife wants to watch some shows. Thanks for the tip!

[Leak]

I'm starting to not like SVN one bit. It keeps telling me the repository has been temporarily moved and won't allow me to open it. WTH???
You can't check out code from the nicely formated SVN Browse URLs that usually get posted around here, you'll need to use the URL that's listed on the "Code / SVN" page of the project:

https://ffdshow-tryout.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/ffdshow-tryout/branches/bitstreamHD/

np: Markus Guentner - Meer Der Luegen (Doppelgaenger)

[SamuriHL]

You can't check out code from the nicely formated SVN Browse URLs that usually get posted around here, you'll need to use the URL that's listed on the "Code / SVN" page of the project:

https://ffdshow-tryout.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/ffdshow-tryout/branches/bitstreamHD/

np: Markus Guentner - Meer Der Luegen (Doppelgaenger)

Ah, very nice. I'm new to the whole SVN thing so I had no clue at all how that worked. I ended up grabbing a tarball of the source and extracting that to my drive. I was able to find the crashing bug and offer up a fix so that worked out very well. Now I'm set up for any future debugging that albain needs done. :) Thanks for this tip!!

[[ReX]]

I would be asking too much if I said that register.bat shouldn't run automatically after the compilation?

Or I could just delete the
<Tool
Name="VCPostBuildEventTool"
Description="Registering output..."
CommandLine="bin/register.bat"
/>

lines? :confused:

[XhmikosR]

I don't like for ffdshow.ax to register after every build too. You can delete that or just exclude it from build.

[albain]

LPCM is already handled in FFDShow : it was inserted by Haruhiko for DVD audio which is LPCM 24 bits HD, the same as bluray hold.

Has anyone already used this feature ?

We are trying to make it work for bluray LPCM tracks but this does not work for now.

Any feedback would be appreciated.

Otherwise, I will need Sebastii's hands to use the dumper on PDVD9 and a LPCM bluray track

Thank you !

[tal.aloni]

Under ffdshow's video output, the tooltip for Standard under Input levels says that ffdshow automatically uses Full range for Fraps videos, even though it does not. The only way to get Full range is to select it, which is quite annoying having to change that setting back and forth, depending on what content is being decoded. Should be an easy fix, though.

fix commited at rev. 3147:
Bugfix: regarding Fraps, JPEG and MJPEG: when selecting standard input levels, and when "High quality YV12 to RGB conversion" was checked, ffdshow did not automatically used full range input levels for YV12 to RGB conversion.

[STaRGaZeR]

Thanks tal ;)

[rica]

LPCM is already handled in FFDShow : it was inserted by Haruhiko for DVD audio which is LPCM 24 bits HD, the same as bluray hold.

Has anyone already used this feature ?

We are trying to make it work for bluray LPCM tracks but this does not work for now.

Any feedback would be appreciated.

Otherwise, I will need Sebastii's hands to use the dumper on PDVD9 and a LPCM bluray track

Thank you !

I think what you are waiting for:

Here is the debug log from an original LPCM BD on Vista via PDVD9:

http://www.mediafire.com/?nyiunyjzvgy



_ _ _ _ _

[STaRGaZeR]

tal, your commit doesn't fix the issue completely. FRAPS videos now have proper levels, but the input levels options don't work anymore (only with FRAPS material, and maybe with MJPEG too, can't test).

[tal.aloni]

STaRGaZeR,
basically when dealing with FRAPS, the input level option
selects between the following 4:
+ Auto (= Full Range for fraps)
+ Standard (= Full Range for fraps)
+ Full Range
+ Custom

for Fraps, the only way to get something different than full range, is by using custom.
I can see that it doesn't work for Fraps ATM, and I'm on it.
is that what you meant?

Regards,
Tal

Edit: the above issue was fixed in rev. 3149

[albain]

I think what you are waiting for:

Thanks it is but I didn't see the traces from media structures.

I am not sure you have the right version of the dumper

Could you retry with the PM link I have sent you ?

Thanks

[STaRGaZeR]

STaRGaZeR,
basically when dealing with FRAPS, the input level option
selects between the following 4:
+ Auto (= Full Range for fraps)
+ Standard (= Full Range for fraps)
+ Full Range
+ Custom

for Fraps, the only way to get something different than full range, is by using custom.
I can see that it doesn't work for Fraps ATM, and I'm on it.
is that what you meant?

Regards,
Tal

Edit: the above issue was fixed in rev. 3149

Ah, there's something strage going on here. With Fraps v2.9.8 and r3149:

- YCbCr options all give the same output, can't say if the default is BT.601 or BT.709.

Input levels:

- Auto results in 0-255.
- Standard results in 0-255. <-- Wrong, should be 16-235. We're forcing standard levels here.
- Full range results in 0-255.
- Custom is working as it should.

- Output levels working fine

Fraps v3.0.1 and r3149:

Nothing in the RGB conversion tab works, it seems default is input 0-255 output 0-255.

"High quality YV12 to RGB" checked or unchecked, doesn't matter.

Keep in mind that anything other than Auto is for forcing those settings regardless of the codec and source used.

[tal.aloni]

- Standard results in 0-255. <-- Wrong, should be 16-235. We're forcing standard levels here.

Actually, according to the tooltip, it should be 0-255.
(standard levels can also imply standard in regard to the format)

[STaRGaZeR]

Actually, according to the tooltip, it should be 0-255.
(standard levels can also imply standard in regard to the format)

The tooltip for Standard says: "Nearly all videos use this. For JPEG, MJPEG and Fraps, ffdshow automatically uses full range".

Which is logical, since that's what Auto is for: Standard for everything except H.264 with the range flag, JPEG, MJPEG and Fraps. Then options for override the Auto decision.

Same for the YCbCr options: Auto will select what is usual, then you have the option to override it by using BT.601 or BT.709.

At least that's the way I see it. Have you corfirmed the v3.0.1 issue?

[tal.aloni]

1. I'm getting what you're saying, however, I wish to leave things as they are. I feel that the original intension was to force the user into making the right choice, and I'm ok with that. if someone really wants to display the wrong level for fraps, he can use the custom option.

2. There is indeed a problem with YCbCr specifications. I'm looking into it. (Edit: fixed in rev. 3151)

3. Can you please send a sample of v3.0.1 video so I could recreate the issue? Thanks!

Tal

[rica]

Thanks it is but I didn't see the traces from media structures.

I am not sure you have the right version of the dumper

Could you retry with the PM link I have sent you ?

Thanks

OK, dunno if it's helpful ? I mastered a new LPCM ISO but when i open it with debugger it crashes at the beginning. (PDVD9 on Vista 32 SP2)

Normally it gives 5.1 LPCM before forcing it to debugging. (That was the Vista trial, i'll add another one taken over 7/64 later and edit this post.)

http://www.mediafire.com/?2nwg0ym2jym


EDIT:

Here is the debug log created on 7/64; same thing: crash at the beginning but without debug i get 5.1 LPCM on my AVR. (Denon 1910) (PDVD9 on 7/64)

http://www.mediafire.com/?t2tmzlimkwl

BTW seems i don't need dpinpurr for 7; do i?

_ _ _ _

[STaRGaZeR]

1. I'm getting what you're saying, however, I wish to leave things as they are. I feel that the original intension was to force the user into making the right choice, and I'm ok with that. if someone really wants to display the wrong level for fraps, he can use the custom option.

2. There is indeed a problem with YCbCr specifications. I'm looking into it. (Edit: fixed in rev. 3151)

3. Can you please send a sample of v3.0.1 video so I could recreate the issue? Thanks!

Tal

Look here to see how ffdshow was before the creation of the Auto setting: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=143598. These options forced their value in all cases. I still think that this is a bug.

YCbCr fixed. However after some testing I'd suggest that if Auto is selected and Fraps is detected, BT.709 is always used regardless of resolution. All non-lossless Fraps videos are BT.709. Please confirm this. I did it comparing with PNG captures in game. Be careful as below 1024x768 Fraps records in RGB24 and no YCbCr-->RGB conversion will be done, see below.

About the v3.0.1 thing. This is really funny :). Since v3.0 Fraps has an option to force RGB lossless recording (finally!). If you use that mode, the videos are recorded in RGB24 instead of YV12. ffdshow can decode these videos, but since they are already RGB24 no conversion is done and of course the RGB conversion options won't work. However there's a bug (maybe feature?) in Fraps: even if you tell the program to not use RGB lossless, below a certain resolution between 800x600 and 1024x768, videos will be recorded in RGB24. With lossless RGB unchecked 1024x768 results in YV12, but 800x600 results in RGB24. This is why the RGB conversion options weren't working for me with v3.0.1. Then I revert back to v2.9.8 and this thing is still here! Please record something at 640x480, you'll see how it is RGB24. You'll recognize it by looking at colorful edges and by RGB options not working :p

[tal.aloni]

However after some testing I'd suggest that if Auto is selected and Fraps is detected, BT.709 is always used regardless of resolution.

1. according to the wiki, and tooltips, standard is not 15-235, but a "semi-automatic" mode. I think it's easier for novice users, (if the reports of H.264 streams with wrong flag are true), so I'm not going to change it. (see the tooltip related to auto)

2. That's what I did, BT.709 will always be used for fraps on Auto, regardless of the resolution.

also, BT.601 will always be used for MJPEG on Auto, regardless of the resolution. (that's how it was so far)

the only thing left to do is to update the tooltip.

Thanks for testing,
Tal

[madshi]

if the reports of H.264 streams with wrong flag are true
They are definitely true, trust me on that.

[albain]

OK, dunno if it's helpful ? I mastered a new LPCM ISO but when i open it with debugger it crashes at the beginning. (PDVD9 on Vista 32 SP2)

Normally it gives 5.1 LPCM before forcing it to debugging. (That was the Vista trial, i'll add another one taken over 7/64 later and edit this post.)

http://www.mediafire.com/?2nwg0ym2jym


EDIT:

Here is the debug log created on 7/64; same thing: crash at the beginning but without debug i get 5.1 LPCM on my AVR. (Denon 1910) (PDVD9 on 7/64)

http://www.mediafire.com/?t2tmzlimkwl

BTW seems i don't need dpinpurr for 7; do i?

_ _ _ _

Great ! You got the structures in it : LPCM is sent as IEEE_FLOAT type (which is PCM 32 bits float)
Could you also make those tests on Vista for DTSHD and TrueHD with PDVD9 ?
This will tell us which structures to feed for bitstream support on Vista, which is the missing key to finish the job.
Let's continue this discussion on the other thread.
This is a very good news !:)

[STaRGaZeR]

1. according to the wiki, and tooltips, standard is not 15-235, but a "semi-automatic" mode. I think it's easier for novice users, (if the reports of H.264 streams with wrong flag are true), so I'm not going to change it. (see the tooltip related to auto)

2. That's what I did, BT.709 will always be used for fraps on Auto, regardless of the resolution.

also, BT.601 will always be used for MJPEG on Auto, regardless of the resolution. (that's how it was so far)

the only thing left to do is to update the tooltip.

Thanks for testing,
Tal

1. OK, then. MJPEG and JPEG use Full range if Standard is selected too? (EDIT: I see MJPEG uses Full range with Standard selected, so I assume JPEG does so too)

2. Thanks!

[tal.aloni]

1. yes.

You welcome,
Tal

[tal.aloni]

developers,
"High quality YV12 to RGB conversion" checkbox appears twice,
first in the "Output" section, and second in the "RGB conversion" section,

I suggest removing it from the output section, do you have any objection?

[clsid]

It is in two places for legacy reasons. Many online tutorials reference the one in Output. So I think it would be best to leave it there (for now).

[TFM_TheMask]

Am I correct that normal AC3 and DTS passthrough only works when liba52 and libdts are selected? When I select libavcodec for both then the output is not AC3 or DTS and is way to big.

I'm still using revision 3111 but in the svn revision I don't see that this is a fixed or a known issue.

[tal.aloni]

Am I correct that normal AC3 and DTS passthrough only works when liba52 and libdts are selected?

No, libavcodec works as well,
moreover, the process is exactly the same for passthrough whether libdts or libavcodec were selected.

[TFM_TheMask]

No, libavcodec works as well,
moreover, the process is exactly the same for passthrough whether libdts or libavcodec were selected.

That is strange. When I set the dts and ac3 registry setting (with my tool) to 1 (libavcodec) then it doesn't work and when I set them at 17 (libdts) and 15 (liba52) then it works. Could it be my older version (3111) then?

[tal.aloni]

TFM_TheMask,
No relevant changes have been made since 3111,
but please try the latest clsid build just to be sure,
maybe your build is broken somehow.

[TFM_TheMask]

TFM_TheMask,
No relevant changes have been made since 3111,
but please try the latest clsid build just to be sure,
maybe your build is broken somehow.

Ok, will try that.

:thanks:

[TFM_TheMask]

TFM_TheMask,
No relevant changes have been made since 3111,
but please try the latest clsid build just to be sure,
maybe your build is broken somehow.

Installed the latest 3154 revision and still the same issue. When I choose Libavcodec for DTS then the output is not DTS when DTSpassthrough.

[tal.aloni]

TFM_TheMask,
I reviewed the code, and have no logical explanation, sorry. (I already assumed you have tested a wide range of audio tracks)

[TFM_TheMask]

TFM_TheMask,
I reviewed the code, and have no logical explanation, sorry. (I already assumed you have tested a wide range of audio tracks)

Ok, thanks for looking. Will keep it on libdts then.

I also tested it in GraphStudio and I couldn't get s/pdif working for libavcodec. With libdts no problem.

[jmone]

I'm not sure if this is the correct thread as I don't know if it is FFDSHOW or another filter...but I have a problem with Subtitles stop being displayed after 10sec or so. If I deselect and reselect the subtitle it will be fine for another 10sec or so then stop displaying again. The video and audio play perfectly - the subs just stop displaying.

I'm not sure what diagnostic info to post but here is the info from the filter chain if that helps, and I'm using:
- ffdshow tryouts revision 3119 Oct 18 (edit - upgraded to 3154 and still the same)
- Haali Media Splitter 1.9.42.1
- ATI HD4550 - Lastest Catalyst - Win7x64 w/Aero Glass - JR Media Center

Thanks in advance!
Nathan

Filter Graph Info:

Filter 'Default DirectSound Device'
CLSID: {79376820-07D0-11CF-A24D-0020AFD79767}
Host: C:\Windows\SysWOW64\quartz.dll
Input Pin 'Audio Input pin (rendered)'
Connected to pin 'Output' of filter 'J. River Media Proxy Audio'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx

Filter 'Enhanced Video Renderer'
CLSID: {FA10746C-9B63-4B6C-BC49-FC300EA5F256}
Host: C:\Windows\SysWOW64\evr.dll
Input Pin 'EVR Input0'
Connected to pin 'Out' of filter 'ffdshow Video Decoder'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Video Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_YUY2, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2
Input Pin 'EVR Input1'

Filter 'J. River Media Proxy Audio'
CLSID: {A4207487-E7D8-406B-9882-B66370DE2492}
Host:
Input Pin 'Input'
Connected to pin 'Audio' of filter 'H:\Media4\Video\Movies\Letters from Iwo Jima (2006).mkv'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
Output Pin 'Output'
Connected to pin 'Audio Input pin (rendered)' of filter 'Default DirectSound Device'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx

Filter 'ffdshow Video Decoder'
CLSID: {04FE9017-F873-410E-871E-AB91661A4EF7}
Host: C:\Program Files (x86)\ffdshow\ffdshow.ax
Input Pin 'In'
Connected to pin 'Output' of filter 'J. River Media Proxy Video'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Video Sub type Unknown GUID Name: {31435657-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2
Output Pin 'Out'
Connected to pin 'EVR Input0' of filter 'Enhanced Video Renderer'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Video Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_YUY2, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2
Input Pin 'In Text'
Connected to pin 'Subtitle' of filter 'H:\Media4\Video\Movies\Letters from Iwo Jima (2006).mkv'
Major type Unknown GUID Name: {E487EB08-6B26-4BE9-9DD3-993434D313FD} Sub type Unknown GUID Name: {F7239E31-9599-4E43-8DD5-FBAF75CF37F1}, Format type Unknown GUID Name: {F7239E31-9599-4E43-8DD5-FBAF75CF37F1}
Input Pin 'In Text 2'

Filter 'J. River Media Proxy Video'
CLSID: {A4207487-E7D8-406B-9882-B66370DE2492}
Host:
Input Pin 'Input'
Connected to pin 'Video' of filter 'H:\Media4\Video\Movies\Letters from Iwo Jima (2006).mkv'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Video Sub type Unknown GUID Name: {31435657-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2
Output Pin 'Output'
Connected to pin 'In' of filter 'ffdshow Video Decoder'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Video Sub type Unknown GUID Name: {31435657-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2

Filter 'H:\Media4\Video\Movies\Letters from Iwo Jima (2006).mkv'
CLSID: {55DA30FC-F16B-49FC-BAA5-AE59FC65F82D}
Host: C:\Program Files (x86)\Haali\MatroskaSplitter\splitter.ax
Output Pin 'Video'
Connected to pin 'Input' of filter 'J. River Media Proxy Video'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Video Sub type Unknown GUID Name: {31435657-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2
Output Pin 'Audio'
Connected to pin 'Input' of filter 'J. River Media Proxy Audio'
Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
Output Pin 'Subtitle'
Connected to pin 'In Text' of filter 'ffdshow Video Decoder'
Major type Unknown GUID Name: {E487EB08-6B26-4BE9-9DD3-993434D313FD} Sub type Unknown GUID Name: {F7239E31-9599-4E43-8DD5-FBAF75CF37F1}, Format type Unknown GUID Name: {F7239E31-9599-4E43-8DD5-FBAF75CF37F1}

[tal.aloni]

jmone,
I'm assuming that the problem you're experiencing is constant to all videos.
I'm reluctant to believe this is a bug in ffdshow,
please try another video player / another renderer.

[jmone]

Thanks tal.aloni.

* The issue is constant on other files (which were all created the same way from original discs)

I've tried different combinations of the following but it had not improvement:
* EVR, VMR 9, VMR 7, Haali
* Haali Splitter, Simple Splitter, Direct

MPC-HC played it correctly but that was not using FFDSHOW

I've also now posted on the JRMedia Center forum, but any other ideas would be great.

Nathan

[jmone]

I think I found it. Un-Installed CCCP, manually installed the latest FFDSHOW, Haali Splitter, and VSFilter (I seemed to have an old VOBSUB prior to the VSFilter branch).
Thanks
Nathan

[tal.aloni]

Glad you found it.

p.s.
codec packs are bad for your playback health.

[jmone]

Given the advance in FFDSHOW features, is there any plans to directly support native Blu-ray / HD-DVD SUP format to prevent the need to change them to SUB/IDX?
Thanks
Nathan

[jmone]

Sorry - Noob Q - I know FFDSHOW now supports more of the Blu-ray / HD-DVD HD Audio streams but are there any limitations in decoding:
- EAC3 (DD+)
- DTS-HD
- DTS-HD Master Audio
- Dolby True HD

Thanks
Nathan

[whurlston]

DTS-HD Master Audio still cannot be decoded, only the DTS Core. DTS-HD/MA can be bitstreamed however with the bitstream branch (soon to be merged with the trunk) and a Xonar, ATI 5xxx series, or Auzentech HomeTheater HD.

[albain]

Now merged !

About BR subtitles it is the responsability of the splitter/navigation filter to make the subtitles available to the decoder

However BR subtitles are in a new format similar to DVD subs (i.e bitmaps subtitles but in JPG format for BR) not supported by FFDShow. This has to be done : I think that opensource code already exists for this subtitle format

[VipZ]

Hi, I have found a bug with ffshow AAC decoding + 32bit float output selected, I get no audio with the audio info page showing nothing. This bug appears in both x86/x64 with the new HD bitstreaming update. Was fine with pre HD bitstream rev 3149
Thanks

Pin In
Filter : ffdshow Audio Decoder - CLSID : {0F40E1E5-4F79-4988-B1A9-CC98794E6B55}

- Connected to:

CLSID: {0A68C3B5-9164-4A54-AFAF-995B2FF0E0D4}
Filter: D:\test.mkv
Pin: Undetermined (Audio 1)

- Connection media type:

Audio: AAC 48000Hz stereo

AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Audio {73647561-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
subtype: Unknown GUID Name {000000FF-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
formattype: FORMAT_WaveFormatEx {05589F81-C356-11CE-BF01-00AA0055595A}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 256000
cbFormat: 23

WAVEFORMATEX:
wFormatTag: 0x00ff
nChannels: 2
nSamplesPerSec: 48000
nAvgBytesPerSec: 0
nBlockAlign: 0
wBitsPerSample: 0
cbSize: 5 (extra bytes)

pbFormat:
0000: ff 00 02 00 80 bb 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ÿ...€»..........
0010: 05 00|11 90 56 e5 00 ...�Vå.



Pin Out

Filter : ffdshow Audio Decoder - CLSID : {0F40E1E5-4F79-4988-B1A9-CC98794E6B55}

- Connected to:

CLSID: {18C16B08-6497-420E-AD14-22D21C2CEAB7}
Filter: Audio Switcher
Pin: test.mkv / Undetermined (Audio 1)

- Connection media type:

Audio: IEEE Float 48000Hz stereo 3072kbps

AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Audio {73647561-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
subtype: MEDIASUBTYPE_IEEE_FLOAT {00000003-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
formattype: FORMAT_WaveFormatEx {05589F81-C356-11CE-BF01-00AA0055595A}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 1
cbFormat: 40

WAVEFORMATEX:
wFormatTag: 0x0003
nChannels: 2
nSamplesPerSec: 48000
nAvgBytesPerSec: 384000
nBlockAlign: 8
wBitsPerSample: 32
cbSize: 22 (extra bytes)

pbFormat:
0000: 03 00 02 00 80 bb 00 00 00 dc 05 00 08 00 20 00 ....€»...Ü.... .
0010: 16 00|00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
0020: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........

- Enumerated media type 0:

Set as the current media type

- Enumerated media type 1:

Unknown

AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Stream {E436EB83-524F-11CE-9F53-0020AF0BA770}
subtype: MEDIASUBTYPE_None {E436EB8E-524F-11CE-9F53-0020AF0BA770}
formattype: FORMAT_None {0F6417D6-C318-11D0-A43F-00A0C9223196}
bFixedSizeSamples: 0
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 307200
cbFormat: 0

[albain]

Hi, I have found a bug with ffshow AAC decoding + 32bit float output selected, I get no audio with the audio info page showing nothing. This bug appears in both x86/x64 with the new HD bitstreaming update. Was fine with pre HD bitstream rev 3149
Thanks


Hi, can you provide me the sample, or better, debugview logs ?

Thank you

Damien

EDIT : damm it, I don't have a 32 bits float compatible equipment to test
You also have the issue with other bit depths ?
Which would help me a lot is a debugview log with a working build and another one without
To get logs, go to the following registry key
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\GNU\ffdshow
and add a DWORD key named "allowDPRINTF" and set to 1
You can disable the debug logs by setting it back to 0 after that

[VipZ]

@ albain, as requested, debugview logs.
I select all output formats and let ffdshow choose which to use. If I force to 24 or 32bit int the audio plays fine, so it seems its only 32bit float affected. 32bit float is also working for MP3.

rev 3156
http://www.mediafire.com/?ytmwzjyqoyd

rev 3160
http://www.mediafire.com/?gjmnajzmtzm

Thanks

[STaRGaZeR]

albain,

I've been using the lastest beta of the Haali splitter which has support for TrueHD in Matroska. However I'm having problems: if a MKV file has both AC3 (audio track 1) and TrueHD (audio track 2), when the file starts the AC3 audio plays fine. Then I change to the TrueHD track, it plays fine too. But if I go back to the AC3 track, all I get is silence. Info & CPU shows nothing, and in MPC-HC right click-->Filters-->ffdshow Audio Decoder-->the libavcodec truehd decoder is still used, this is probably why I can't hear any sound: ffdshow tries to decode AC3 with the TrueHD decoder. Maybe a bug in ffdshow's parser?

If you need a sample let me know.

[albain]

@ albain, as requested, debugview logs.
I select all output formats and let ffdshow choose which to use. If I force to 24 or 32bit int the audio plays fine, so it seems its only 32bit float affected. 32bit float is also working for MP3.

rev 3156
http://www.mediafire.com/?ytmwzjyqoyd

rev 3160
http://www.mediafire.com/?gjmnajzmtzm

Thanks

Thanks, this is fixed in revision 3161

@Stargazer : indeed, this is due to the limitation in the formats changes I added. If the codec changes more than twice, I don't take in account further changes.
This rule should be reset in case of a stream switching, but how to detect it ?
The problem is how to make the difference between a skip and a stream switching (resulting both in a newsegment call)
Maybe someone has a clue

[VipZ]

Thanks for the quick fix, as always awesome work :)

[rpm7200]

libavcodec vs libdts or libavcodec vs liba52 ? is libavcodec better?

[ikarad]

DTS-HD Master Audio still cannot be decoded, only the DTS Core. DTS-HD/MA can be bitstreamed however with the bitstream branch (soon to be merged with the trunk) and a Xonar, ATI 5xxx series, or Auzentech HomeTheater HD.

I have xfi titanium and 5.1 audio kit. Can I decode DTS-HD from blu-ray with ffdshow ?

Anybody can explain me what is hdbitstream branch ?

[STaRGaZeR]

@Stargazer : indeed, this is due to the limitation in the formats changes I added. If the codec changes more than twice, I don't take in account further changes.
This rule should be reset in case of a stream switching, but how to detect it ?
The problem is how to make the difference between a skip and a stream switching (resulting both in a newsegment call)
Maybe someone has a clue

Dunno, maybe an option to override that only-twice decision?

Also, when watching DVDs (AC3 decoded with liba52) with MPC-HC and random seeking in the movie the decoder sometimes changes to eac3. eac3 decoder works for AC3, but this should not happen. I notice this specially when I do a new seek after the change, since the eac3 decoder has the same "issue" the libav ac3 decoder has: high pitch sound for a short period of time after a seek.

[albain]

I have xfi titanium. Can I decode DTS-HD with ffdshow ?

Anybody can explain me what is hdbitstream branch ?

A development branch : I made the developements on a branch apart of the trunk (main development line). See subversion for more info

auzentech xfi ? No auzentech had the *good* idea to encrypt the stream between the software and the driver.
Unless we get to know the encryption key and algorithm (this is possible), there is nothing to do for them. I advise you to grab one of the new or future radeon card

[albain]

Dunno, maybe an option to override that only-twice decision?

Also, when watching DVDs (AC3 decoded with liba52) with MPC-HC and random seeking in the movie the decoder sometimes changes to eac3. eac3 decoder works for AC3, but this should not happen. I notice this specially when I do a new seek after the change, since the eac3 decoder has the same "issue" the libav ac3 decoder has: high pitch sound for a short period of time after a seek.

I guess this is due to a loss of sync where the ffdshow parser is looking for a syncword and finds something that looks like an EAC3 syncword whereas it is only data. This occurs often ? Because there are few chances you get into that situation

[STaRGaZeR]

Yes, you could say it happens often. Each time you seek you have that possibility. Pure luck.

[ikarad]

A development branch : I made the developements on a branch apart of the trunk (main development line). See subversion for more info

auzentech xfi ? No auzentech had the *good* idea to encrypt the stream between the software and the driver.
Unless we get to know the encryption key and algorithm (this is possible), there is nothing to do for them. I advise you to grab one of the new or future radeon card

no, I have creative xfi titanium, not auzentech.

Your branch, is it to allow decoding of DTS-HD because I don't understand?

if not isn't possible to allow to decoding dts-hd ?


To finish I won't buy a new radeon because I have a geforce gtx280.

[tal.aloni]

libavcodec vs libdts or libavcodec vs liba52 ? is libavcodec better?

IMO libavcodec is better. (by the way, I think it should be our default AC3 / DTS decoder)

[albain]

@rpm7200 : libavcodec decodes in 16 bits depth whereas liba52 can decode at 32 bits so with a better quality.
Actually this was the case last time I checked (2 months ago)

@ikarad : I was just explaining what a subversion branch is, but it has been merged to the trunk yesterday. So now revisions 3161 or greater will give you HD audio bitstream, but not with a xfi
You need a HDMI 1.3 output : a radeon 5xxx, one of the last nvidia series (don't know the reference), or an asus xonar
Also, there is no DTSHD decoder out yet (open source I mean) so only bitstream can get you DTS HD

[jmone]

Also, there is no DTSHD decoder out yet (open source I mean)....

Do you see adding DTSHD decoding as somthing that will happen in the short, medium, or long term?

Thanks

[Mark_A_W]

Do you see adding DTSHD decoding as somthing that will happen in the short, medium, or long term?

Thanks


As far as I understand, DTS has kept their intellectual property confidential (why wouldn't they..), so there isn't enough information for anyone to write a decoder.

(I don't know how plain DTS decoders "happened".)

[THX-UltraII]

where can I find the latest version Albain? I can only find beta 6 @ http://ffdshow-tryout.sourceforge.net/download.php

[albain]

Try this link but it is too fresh : nobody has posted any build yet

https://sourceforge.net/projects/ffdshow-tryout/files/

Otherwise this website that has daily builds :
http://www.xvidvideo.ru/ffdshow-tryouts-project-x86-x64

[XhmikosR]

THX-UltraII: You can find new builds here (http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=3f33c77c2cf9ce25ab1eab3e9fa335ca95e79d7d0540e1e1).

[leeperry]

IMO libavcodec is better. (by the way, I think it should be our default AC3 / DTS decoder)
liba52 decodes in 32float, libavcodec 16int only...from what this page says, you should always decode lossy audio with the highest accuracy to avoid roundings errors(especially if you post-process your audio afterwards): http://mp3decoders.mp3-tech.org/24bit.html

well, libdts is also 32float but it sounds terrible :scared:

[THX-UltraII]

THX-UltraII: You can find new builds here (http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=3f33c77c2cf9ce25ab1eab3e9fa335ca95e79d7d0540e1e1).

I see that people at this moment talk about version 54 beta of ffdshow. I still cannot find this build. Or does this link have the latest Albain integrated version? http://www.xvidvideo.ru/ffdshow-tryouts-project-x86-x64/

[tal.aloni]

THX-UltraII,
Albain has merged his changes into the main svn branch,
just use the latest build. (from xvidvideo.ru or XhmikosR link)

[THX-UltraII]

thxz!

I need the x86 version because reclock is not in x64 yet. However, I see two different versions: a 'normal' and a 'sse icl11' version. When do you pick the 'icl 11' version? I have a Intel Core2Quad 6600

[khagaroth]

I posted an updated custom_messages.iss file on the tracker as the new Unicode installer needs it to be in UTF-8 or else it doesn't display correctly. Can someone who understands Japanese and/or Chinese verify that the conversion went fine?

[Betsy25]

Can anyone take a look at the problems I have when using ffdshow to play .VOB files (MPEG2) with equally named .SRT subs.

The subs lose sync as soon as jump forward/backward is used.

It doesn't matter whether I set ffdshow to libavcodec or libmpeg2

I can only play it correctly (subs keep synced even when jumping back/forward) by forcing MPC-HC to use its internal MPEG Audio and MPEG PS/TS/PVA source filters.

http://rapidshare.com/files/308449631/VOB_01_1.rar (20MB)

[stumped]

sorry if this has been answered before, but i'm looking at getting a new receiver that support HDMI 7.1 audio. and i know that beofre, you couldn't pass DolbyHD or DTS-HD without first first converting to flac to do lcpm. In the new ffdshow, i saw you can "pass" DTS-HD and DolbyHD through HDMI. can someone please explain to me this, i am very intrigued because i have my blu-rays in .mkv right now and if i get the new receiver, i'd like to know if i can continue going mkv adding in the new DolbyHD and DTS-HD or if i'll have to use powerdvd and make my movies into AVCHD .iso's.

[mikelebron]

First page under setup:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=151151


sorry if this has been answered before, but i'm looking at getting a new receiver that support HDMI 7.1 audio. and i know that beofre, you couldn't pass DolbyHD or DTS-HD without first first converting to flac to do lcpm. In the new ffdshow, i saw you can "pass" DTS-HD and DolbyHD through HDMI. can someone please explain to me this, i am very intrigued because i have my blu-rays in .mkv right now and if i get the new receiver, i'd like to know if i can continue going mkv adding in the new DolbyHD and DTS-HD or if i'll have to use powerdvd and make my movies into AVCHD .iso's.

[horvathd]

Recently I updated ffdshow from rev. 2737 to 3154 and my problem is that the new version can't change the font weight to bold when I use a OpenType (.otf) font. As soon as I converted the font to TrueType (.ttf) with FontForge then it changes the weight to bold.

[fuzz!]

albain: I see you checked in "Created directory 'branches/DXVA'."

You just teasing or we gonna see that soon? :D

[Ger]

@fuzz!
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1355831#post1355831

[Sub-zero]

Hi gentlemen :d
Are there any near-in-future plans to add support for more override tags for the subtitle filter of ffdshow?

This is very great filter. the rendering is so light on cpu, actually it can perfect if more support for ass tags is added :o

Playing softsubbed HD h.264 footage with VSFilter is really painful for my p4 cpu. Even with CoreAVC its really eating out the cpu when playing subtitles with VSfilter.

Thanks very much :thanks:

[THX-UltraII]

In the 3167 release note I see Added option to disable jitter correction for audio decoder.

When do you choose this option?

[XhmikosR]

ffdshow Audio Decoder-->Decoder options-->Jitter correction.

[THX-UltraII]

ffdshow Audio Decoder-->Decoder options-->Jitter correction.

I know, but WHEN does someone needs to check or uncheck this?

[XhmikosR]

Oh, you are right, I misread your post.

[THX-UltraII]

Oh, you are right, I misread your post.

and do you have any thought why someone would need to disable this?

[tal.aloni]

and do you have any thought why someone would need to disable this?

apparently some people still uses an old DTS encoder that does not support 23.976 timecodes, so they use 24hz timecodes instead.
when they mux the 24hz DTS with 23.976 video, it may produce a jitter in the range of +-150 ms.
ffdshow starts correcting the jitter at >100ms, so the badly encoded audio track produces video stutter, if you have such an encode, and prefer a slight audio jitter over video stutter,
you would want to disable the jitter correction mechanism.

(I have a sample of such an encode, if somebody is curious)

AC3Filter offers this ability as well.

it can also be useful on some other scenarios, IMO, the ability of the audio decoder to modify the timecodes of (ultimately) the entire decoding chain is something that you want to be able to disable, even if it doesn't really matter for regular usage.

Tal

[73ChargerFan]

apparently some people still uses an old DTS encoder that does not support 23.976 timecodes, so they use 24hz timecodes instead.
Tal,
Do you know which DTS encoders do this?
Thanks.

[markanini]

Any chance of seeing more of the postprocessing video filters from mplayer like uspp and pp7? Regular pp also has options I don't see in ffdshow according to the mplayer manual. Would be nice to play with for some low quality sources...

[avivahl]

Quick question (and I'm sorry if it has been discussed in the passed 497 pages of this thread :P):
Is there a difference between the "High quality YV12 to RGB conversion" checkboxes in the "Output" page and the "RGB conversion" page?

[fastplayer]

Is there a difference between the "High quality YV12 to RGB conversion" checkboxes in the "Output" page and the "RGB conversion" page?
Nope.

[albain]

Hi all,

I am happy to announce that DXVA is now nearly working

I have finished the import from MPC-HC project (harder than I expected)

Now, I have the following, issues, Tetsuo55 or Casimir666 may have an idea :
1/ I have a green picture (although the input pin bih info from the EVR are identical between MPC and FFDShow). I think this could come from the libavcodec context ??
2/ It works only with MPCHC, not with WMP12

Merry christmas by the way :)

[Sebastiii]

Great news Damien :)
Merry christmas to you and your family :)
Seb.

[avivahl]

Hi all,

I am happy to announce that DXVA is now nearly working

I have finished the import from MPC-HC project (harder than I expected)

Now, I have the following, issues, Tetsuo55 or Casimir666 may have an idea :
1/ I have a green picture (although the input pin bih info from the EVR are identical between MPC and FFDShow). I think this could come from the libavcodec context ??
2/ It works only with MPCHC, not with WMP12

Merry christmas by the way :):goodpost:!!!

[madshi]

apparently some people still uses an old DTS encoder that does not support 23.976 timecodes, so they use 24hz timecodes instead.
when they mux the 24hz DTS with 23.976 video, it may produce a jitter in the range of +-150 ms.
Not sure what you're talking about. A DTS/AC3 encoder takes a specific numbers of samples per frame (usually 48000) and compresses them into a DTS/AC3 frame. The DTS/AC3 encoder does not really care about the audio FPS, let alone change it. Usually the DTS/AC3 encoder does not even *KNOW* which FPS the audio source has. And it doesn't need to know...

[tetsuo55]

Hi all,

I am happy to announce that DXVA is now nearly working

I have finished the import from MPC-HC project (harder than I expected)

Now, I have the following, issues, Tetsuo55 or Casimir666 may have an idea :
1/ I have a green picture (although the input pin bih info from the EVR are identical between MPC and FFDShow). I think this could come from the libavcodec context ??
2/ It works only with MPCHC, not with WMP12

Merry christmas by the way :)We will have to wait for casimir for that issue

[flanger216]

Not sure what you're talking about. A DTS/AC3 encoder takes a specific numbers of samples per frame (usually 48000) and compresses them into a DTS/AC3 frame. The DTS/AC3 encoder does not really care about the audio FPS, let alone change it. Usually the DTS/AC3 encoder does not even *KNOW* which FPS the audio source has. And it doesn't need to know...

Agreed, based on my audio engineering experiences. DAW software (Sonar & Pro Tools) care about frame rates on import, but after that, fps and video timecodes completely fall out of the equation. I have seen issues in NLEs (especially Avid) where there's a mismatch between drop and nondrop timecodes between the audio and video tracks, but that just results in a slight pitch-shift when you conform them for render. Regardless, I've never rendered nor seen a render where timecode mismatches resulted in a constant, built-in jitter. Not that it couldn't happen; I've just never encountered it.

[clsid]

@Albain

I have some suggestions for the DXVA implementation in ffdshow.

1) Please make it a separate filter (new GUID and file). That way people can use it without having to register the standard ffdshow filter. It also keeps the ffdshow code cleaner, because there is no need for any DXVA related workarounds and special casings. The DXVA filter itself will also stay much simpler. Little code is shared between the DXVA stuff and the rest of ffdshow, to thing should be kept separate to avoid making the ffdshow code even more complex than it already is.
2) Don't reuse the presets code from ffdshow. That is too complex and user-unfriendly. Just a few checkboxes should be sufficient for the DXVA filter. For example, "Use DXVA if:" [x] executable equals [wmplayer.exe;mpc-hc.exe], [x]width >= [value], [x]height >= [value], and maybe a few others.

[SamuriHL]

I agree with clsid on this one. That would be an awesome implementation and far easier to maintain, as well.

[rsd78]

Hi all,

I am happy to announce that DXVA is now nearly working

I have finished the import from MPC-HC project (harder than I expected)

Now, I have the following, issues, Tetsuo55 or Casimir666 may have an idea :
1/ I have a green picture (although the input pin bih info from the EVR are identical between MPC and FFDShow). I think this could come from the libavcodec context ??
2/ It works only with MPCHC, not with WMP12

Merry christmas by the way :)

Thanks for all your great work Albain.

From what you can tell will it be possible to implement DXVA + subs within any directshow app (i.e. WMC)?

[tetsuo55]

@Albain

I have some suggestions for the DXVA implementation in ffdshow.

1) Please make it a separate filter (new GUID and file). That way people can use it without having to register the standard ffdshow filter. It also keeps the ffdshow code cleaner, because there is no need for any DXVA related workarounds and special casings. The DXVA filter itself will also stay much simpler. Little code is shared between the DXVA stuff and the rest of ffdshow, to thing should be kept separate to avoid making the ffdshow code even more complex than it already is.
2) Don't reuse the presets code from ffdshow. That is too complex and user-unfriendly. Just a few checkboxes should be sufficient for the DXVA filter. For example, "Use DXVA if:" [x] executable equals [wmplayer.exe;mpc-hc.exe], [x]width >= [value], [x]height >= [value], and maybe a few others.We decided on enabling DXVA exactly the same way as music bitstreaming (a checkbox), so its completely seperated from the codecs.

Is that in line with what you are suggesting?

[saint-francis]

@Albain

I have some suggestions for the DXVA implementation in ffdshow.

1) Please make it a separate filter (new GUID and file). That way people can use it without having to register the standard ffdshow filter. It also keeps the ffdshow code cleaner, because there is no need for any DXVA related workarounds and special casings. The DXVA filter itself will also stay much simpler. Little code is shared between the DXVA stuff and the rest of ffdshow, to thing should be kept separate to avoid making the ffdshow code even more complex than it already is.



I'm not sure I'm following you correctly here. If it were separate, what would the point of it be? Why not just use the MPC HC stand alone filter?

[STaRGaZeR]

I'm not sure I'm following you correctly here. If it were separate, what would the point of it be? Why not just use the MPC HC stand alone filter?

This. Also not using ffdshow presets is just silly IMO.

[albain]

@clsid

the current code is clean in my opinion as there are very few code insertions in the existing classes but rather a few new classes : a new decoder that derivates from TvidecodecLibavcodec (that won't appear in the codecs section because it is preset-based), the DXVA allocator, and the H264 and VC1 DXVA classes

I added a new dialog called "hardware acceleration" with 2 checkboxes to enable DXVA/H264 but maybe it will be better to put these in the output section has bitstream for audio but there may be a need of additional options : for example DXVA may require to select a video adapter.
MPCHC has the ability to detect it easily by associating the video window the right adapter but FFDShow does not

I will post when it will work a debug build to gather the opinions and the SVN patch

About the separate filter, I kindof disagree with your point of view because I am thinking about people who have lower CPU and who would use a preset with DXVA for high def videos, and another preset for lowres videos to get benefits of subtitles, postprocessing...
However I am totally opened to discussions ;-)

http://damienbt.free.fr/Capture.PNG

[saint-francis]

Albain, could you explain how this will all work? It is my understanding from MPC HC that the DXVA decoder needs to connect directly to the render. Is this still the case? If not then will we be able to use this with DirectShowSource for avisynth decoding? I'm kind of at a loss here since it has been stated in this thread that DXVA woudn't be implemented in FFDShow due to the aforementioned limitations.

[tetsuo55]

Albain, could you explain how this will all work? It is my understanding from MPC HC that the DXVA decoder needs to connect directly to the render. Is this still the case? If not then will we be able to use this with DirectShowSource for avisynth decoding? I'm kind of at a loss here since it has been stated in this thread that DXVA woudn't be implemented in FFDShow due to the aforementioned limitations.You will lose all post-processing options, just like mpc-hc

[leeperry]

apparently some people still uses an old DTS encoder that does not support 23.976 timecodes, so they use 24hz timecodes instead.
well, unchecking this option on 23.976 FLAC/h264 MKV files(@48.000Hz w/ Reclock) gives completely desynced audio...I think there's a hell lot of jitter in 23.976 MKV files(easy to see in HR), so I'm leaving it checked :p

[Mangix]

would this work in EVR under XP? It's only possible to do so within VMR9 and not EVR in MPC.

[hoborg]

would this work in EVR under XP? It's only possible to do so within VMR9 and not EVR in MPC.

No. Rules are simple to make DXVA working:

WinXP - VMR9
Vista/Win7 - EVR

[ikarad]

Albain, one question:
Is it possible to add support of PGS (subtitle form blu-ray) subtitles in a new version of ffdshow because subtitles form blu-ray aren't recognized by ffdshow?

[clsid]

@clsid

the current code is clean in my opinion as there are very few code insertions in the existing classes but rather a few new classes : a new decoder that derivates from TvidecodecLibavcodec (that won't appear in the codecs section because it is preset-based), the DXVA allocator, and the H264 and VC1 DXVA classes

I added a new dialog called "hardware acceleration" with 2 checkboxes to enable DXVA/H264 but maybe it will be better to put these in the output section has bitstream for audio but there may be a need of additional options : for example DXVA may require to select a video adapter.
MPCHC has the ability to detect it easily by associating the video window the right adapter but FFDShow does not

I will post when it will work a debug build to gather the opinions and the SVN patch

About the separate filter, I kindof disagree with your point of view because I am thinking about people who have lower CPU and who would use a preset with DXVA for high def videos, and another preset for lowres videos to get benefits of subtitles, postprocessing...
However I am totally opened to discussions ;-)

http://damienbt.free.fr/Capture.PNG
None of the options in ffdshow video decoder configuration apply to DXVA, so it would be silly to add DXVA to it, and deactivate (grey out) all those options whenever DXVA is active.

The decoders share little code, as you have said so yourself, so please make them separate filters. That will keep things much cleaner and maintainable. Do it as a favor to me. Keeping things simple and flexible will benefit the end-user.

With regard to presets, I am not saying that this functionality shouldn't be there. I am suggesting a simpler solution, that can still do EVERYTHING that you want it to do. Instead of "presets", I call them "loading rules".

How I envision everything to work:

filter X: ffdshow video decoder
filter Y: ffdshow video decoder (DXVA)

filter Y has a merit that is slightly higher than filter X, so that DXVA will get tried first by any DirectShow app.

When the DXVA filter gets loaded, it determines whether DXVA can be used and should be used based on the users hardware/software/loading rules.

If the result of the above is YES, then the filter will decode the video using DXVA. If the result is NO, then the filter will deny the graph connection, and the player will use the next available DirectShow decoder instead. That can be ffdshow, CoreAVC, DiAVC, or any other decoder that a user has installed.

User defined loading rules can be implemented very easily with a couple of checkboxes and value fields. As an example based on your preset idea:
[x]Use DXVA when video width >= [720]
This basically mean: use DXVA only for HD video, fallback to using another decoder otherwise.

I hope things are more clear now.

[tetsuo55]

Sorry but that sounds a million times more complicated then

[]Enable DXVA for all compatible h264 videos (fallback to software decoding otherwise)
"Repeat for all bitstreamable formats"

If what you suggest gets implemented it should be the same for the audio codecs that have a bitstream option.

Overall, ffdshow probably already is overly complicated for average joe users that just want to wacht a video.

[clsid]

You can not compare audio bitstreaming with DXVA. The audio stuff in ffdshow requires parsing to determine the true format. That is not required for H.264 and VC-1. And just because audio bitstreaming happens to be integrated into ffdshow is no valid argument at all for doing the same with video.

My goals are to make things more simple for the average joe. Keeping unrelated things separate is one of the ways to achieve that goal. Your argument for making a bigger mess because something is already a mess is just stupid.

[dann23]

hello. about this thing with dxva separated from normal ffdshow, I want to tell that average joe is not stupid :D
many are already familiar with this interface and know what those options do. I think separating dxva make things worse because this options is not there with the others. I think it's more usefull if dxva is on the same window with the other options for video decoding.

[albain]

@clsid : I understand your point, I won't argue with it but there are still 2 things I didn't mention or I wasn't clear enough

1/ First the code won't be cleaner because
The DXVA implementation uses the same code path as regular codecs.
The different thing is in the videocodec classes : instead of calling the processing function to apply filters, I don't call it at all.

So using a different codec won't necessarily bring cleaner code


2/ DXVA postprocessing : DXVA postprocessing is possible such as subtitles, OSD... and so reusing the existing FFDshow filters. Wouldn't it be better to make it transparent for our old friend joe ?


Also please let's remain constructive on this subject although I know that relationship with MPC team is sometimes "intense"

Anyway, I will make it in a separate filter if this is your final wish, I don't think that would be a big problem for anyone, even for you guys from MPC team.
But first let's focus on making it work, I am stuck with this green picture, and I will post a patch+working build then, and then we will make the final decisions, ok ?

[SamuriHL]

@albain - Is this green screen situation happening with an ATI card by chance? It sounds VERY similar to the crap I'm dealing with on PDVD9 which is why I ask.

[albain]

@albain - Is this green screen situation happening with an ATI card by chance? It sounds VERY similar to the crap I'm dealing with on PDVD9 which is why I ask.

Yes but I don't have this issue with MPCHC in DXVA mode.

I think this is a wrong colorspace issue but DXVA works in NV12 mode and the structures look similar between ffdshow and mpc, so...

It shouldn't be very difficult to fix....

[SamuriHL]

Can you provide the fix to Cyberlink when you're done? :p

[73ChargerFan]

My set is 1080p. I'd like to use software decoding if the video is <1080p with filters to make the scaling look better, and DXVA with different filters (e.g. color space conversions) if video is 1080p.

[_xxl]

2/ DXVA postprocessing : DXVA postprocessing is possible such as subtitles, OSD... and so reusing the existing FFDshow filters.
I would like to know which of ffdshow filters can be used in combination with DXVA?
Thanks for the improvement of ffdshow's audio code and I hope that a simple solution will be found for DXVA & ffdshow...

[tetsuo55]

I would like to know which of ffdshow filters can be used in combination with DXVA?
Thanks for the improvement of ffdshow's audio code and I hope that a simple solution will be found for DXVA & ffdshow...all filters that put some effect over the image could work. Any filter that requires the decoded video image as input wont.

[STaRGaZeR]

I think clsid wants this separate filter because if not he'll get loads of complaints in this and other forums where he's helping joe's out. I can understand his positon but this is just stupid: you already have what you want, and it's included in the MPC standalone filters. What's the logic behing making another MPC Video Decoder with just DXVA and "with a couple of checkboxes and value fields"? Because I can't find any. You can just add these to the MPC Video Decoder dialog box (something a lot of people including me have been suggesting for a long time with no response from the devs), it'll be MUCH simpler and would do everything you want.

[khagaroth]

A fix for the installer, as it now displays garbage instead of all the custom messages after you switched to (Unicode) Inno 5.3.x - sourceforge tracker (http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=2914331&group_id=173941&atid=867362)

[tetsuo55]

I think clsid wants this separate filter because if not he'll get loads of complaints in this and other forums where he's helping joe's out. I can understand his positon but this is just stupid: you already have what you want, and it's included in the MPC standalone filters. What's the logic behing making another MPC Video Decoder with just DXVA and "with a couple of checkboxes and value fields"? Because I can't find any. You can just add these to the MPC Video Decoder dialog box (something a lot of people including me have been suggesting for a long time with no response from the devs), it'll be MUCH simpler and would do everything you want.The basic idea here is to make ffdshow feature complete as a codec, and then use it instead of the mpc video decoder, that way we only have to maintain one codec-tree instead of 2

[albain]

I think clsid wants this separate filter because if not he'll get loads of complaints in this and other forums where he's helping joe's out. I can understand his positon but this is just stupid: you already have what you want, and it's included in the MPC standalone filters. What's the logic behing making another MPC Video Decoder with just DXVA and "with a couple of checkboxes and value fields"? Because I can't find any. You can just add these to the MPC Video Decoder dialog box (something a lot of people including me have been suggesting for a long time with no response from the devs), it'll be MUCH simpler and would do everything you want.

We are not talking about the interest of bringing DXVA support to ffdshow versus MPC standalone filters but rather implement it inside a separate filter or not.
I understand clsid's position and I will follow his request at the end of the discussion which is not closed in my opinion

About MPC standalone filters, few people use them in standalone release.
Lastly, this support is also a benefit for MPC team but I will let them give more details about it

EDIT : okay, parallel posting

[rica]

EDIT : okay, parallel posting

Sometimes it is needed even posted involuntary or accidentally :)

[STaRGaZeR]

We are not talking about the interest of bringing DXVA support to ffdshow versus MPC standalone filters but rather implement it inside a separate filter or not.
I understand clsid's position and I will follow his request at the end of the discussion which is not closed in my opinion

About MPC standalone filters, few people use them in standalone release.
Lastly, this support is also a benefit for MPC team but I will let them give more details about it

EDIT : okay, parallel posting

Neither am I, I want DXVA in ffdshow. Inside ffdshow. I'm just saying what's the logic behind a separate filter, since we already have a separate DXVA filter that does the same thing you want accomplish. Or am I missing something?

[Keiyakusha]

Or am I missing something?

DXVA is the only "unique" thing in MPC-HC codecs set. Everything else is the same as in ffdshow (however some ffdshow filters is faster for me). As I understand from what tetsuo55 said, they will port DXVA to FFDShow and then drop support for all MPC-HC's filters.

EDIT: By the way, what about splitters? Maybe they will be fine in ffdshow as separate filter set (or how should I call this...)? Then it will be truly complete ^_^

[clsid]

Even when the DXVA filter is separated from the ffdshow filter, it should still be possible to re-use code from ffdshow, since most functionality is divided in their own source files. For example font rendering and subtitle stuff. Just the GUI needs to be redone. But considering that most GUI elements in ffdshow do not apply to DXVA, that will result in a small and simple GUI for the DXVA filter. Plus we don't need to disable stuff in the GUI when DXVA is active. For example, suppose the DXVA decoder will eventually be compatible with subtitles, then we can't just blindly re-use all the current subtitle options available in ffdshow. Things like letterboxing are obviously not possible with DXVA.

@STaRGaZeR
Making the filter separate will not in any way reduce functionality. I do not understand why people always insist on getting things integrated when it holds no benefits at all. The ffdshow filter suite will replace the (internal) decoders of MPC. Then the MPC devs can focus on the core of the player, like making it more stable and secure.

@dann23
Many here on this forum even do not fully understand the limitations that DXVA has or what all the options in ffdshow do. I have years of experience helping people with video playback, so I have a very good understanding of what is best for the people that use ffdshow.

[albain]

No, FFDShow is not (and will never be) a splitter

It has been a long time one said that ffdshow is too messy and should be splitted up into smaller parts.

Also another thing that should be done is direct media foundation support, but another layer to the code.

About different filters, one should also ask the question about the future : which DXVA filters could be added apart subtitles.
If may be smart to have only the list of available internal filters wether you are in DXVA or not.

For me this is more work to do so I am gonna think about the right implementation to do if we decide to go on that way

EDIT : parallel posting again :)

[STaRGaZeR]

@STaRGaZeR
Making the filter separate will not in any way reduce functionality. I do not understand why people always insist on getting things integrated when it holds no benefits at all. The ffdshow filter suite will replace the (internal) decoders of MPC. Then the MPC devs can focus on the core of the player, like making it more stable and secure.

So THAT's your final intention, replace MPC's internal decoders with ffdshow. You didn't say this in any of your previous post (or did I miss it?). Now everything is clear. I fully support this movement, I've always wondered why, being the same thing and ffdshow having a lot more options, they were separated.

[tetsuo55]

No, FFDShow is not (and will never be) a splitterIndeed.

It has been a long time one said that ffdshow is too messy and should be splitted up into smaller parts. i have not looked at the code myself, but its probably just as bad as mpc-hc

Also another thing that should be done is direct media foundation support, but another layer to the code.I agree, adding this shouldnt be too difficult if you turn ffdshow into a mediafoundation codec with directshow fallback (each codec registering 2 filters)

About different filters, one should also ask the question about the future : which DXVA filters could be added apart subtitles.
If may be smart to have only the list of available internal filters wether you are in DXVA or not.Filters that will surely work with DXVA are: OSD, Subtitles and bitmap overlay.
If you update the dxva decoder to a DXVA2 implementation (casimir has a POC for this), all filters would work, but it would completely stop working on xp.

For me this is more work to do so I am gonna think about the right implementation to do if we decide to go on that waycannot wait to hear what you come up with :)

[_xxl]

I think that splitting ffdshow's video, audio, processing and subtitles, DXVA support in standalone filters is a good solution.
If you update the dxva decoder to a DXVA2 implementation (casimir has a POC for this), all filters would work, but it would completely stop working on xp.
Supporting Win7 is more important than XP.

[clsid]

Windows XP still has a 50%+ market share. But compared to Vista/7 it will more often be running on systems without DXVA support. So one day we could decide to drop DXVA support for XP. But I don't think now is the right time yet. We must also consider the fact that XP users are more likely to depend on DXVA from a performance perspective. For example many netbooks use XP.

It would be cool if we could transform the filters in ffdshow into a plugin based system. But I am not sure how difficult that will be considering that it is not unlikely that there are many nasty workarounds and hacks in the current filter chain.

[MatMaul]

VLC 1.1 supports hardware decoding using DXVA2.
moreover it uses directly the hardware decoding architecture of ffmpeg (which supports VDPAU/VA-API on linux and DXVA2 with this patch (http://git.videolan.org/?p=vlc.git;a=blob;f=extras/contrib/src/Patches/ffmpeg-dxva2.patch)). it would be good to use it to avoid hacking of ffmpeg like in the MPC decoder.

I think it would be OK to just support DXVA2 with ffdshow, since people using XP could still use the "legacy" MPC DXVA standalone decoder.

here is the source code for the VLC decoder :
http://git.videolan.org/?p=vlc.git;a=blob;f=modules/codec/avcodec/dxva2.c

[73ChargerFan]

How about adding to video profiles the choice of which h264 renderer & VC1 renderer to use. DXVA2 can be shown as unavailable on XP. VC1 can include the option to use MS. Also it would contain a list of compatible filter types, e.g. subtitles, all, overlay_only, etc.

[tetsuo55]

VLC 1.1 supports hardware decoding using DXVA2.
moreover it uses directly the hardware decoding architecture of ffmpeg (which supports VDPAU/VA-API on linux and DXVA2 with this patch (http://git.videolan.org/?p=vlc.git;a=blob;f=extras/contrib/src/Patches/ffmpeg-dxva2.patch)). it would be good to use it to avoid hacking of ffmpeg like in the MPC decoder.

I think it would be OK to just support DXVA2 with ffdshow, since people using XP could still use the "legacy" MPC DXVA standalone decoder.

here is the source code for the VLC decoder :
http://git.videolan.org/?p=vlc.git;a=blob;f=modules/codec/avcodec/dxva2.cWoah, i was not expecting that to happen so quickly, that code was only finished a few weeks ago

[albain]

Very interesting indeed, this could autosolve my green picture issue by the way

However, is this DXVA2 support only (vista/7) ?

We have to think about it : I'd rather take the ffmpeg over the MPC patching solution but we may have to drop DXVA1 support

@clsid : do you think you could update libavcodec with those latest APIs ?

[dann23]

However, is this DXVA2 support only (vista/7) ?



http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc307941(VS.85).aspx

[MatMaul]

Very interesting indeed, this could autosolve my green picture issue by the way

However, is this DXVA2 support only (vista/7) ?
Yes, and I think the main reason is that DXVA2 seems to support the retrieving of picture from GPU memory to the main memory (so no need for a specific renderer) which is needed to work with VLC because it doesn't support any standard directshow renderer.

[MatMaul]

I should add that I think there are some hacks needed because of bad DXVA drivers (*cough* ATI *cough*) that doesn't seem implemented in the current VLC. I am thinking of the raster vs zigag order which is triggered with files using custom matrices.
It also seems that people who write this ffmpeg patch are clever because they add a variable "workaround" (currently unused) in the context for this kind of hacks :D
I will send a report to vlc-devel to let them know of this awful implementation bug ^^

[albain]

Yes, and I think the main reason is that DXVA2 seems to support the retrieving of picture from GPU memory to the main memory (so no need for a specific renderer) which is needed to work with VLC because it doesn't support any standard directshow renderer.

Are you sure about that ?

Because I read DXVA 2 docs a while ago and they didn't mention this possibility. Also the DXVA (1 or 2) APIs take an encoded picture and returns nothing

If it was possible to grab a decoded picture back from the GPU memory (which I doubt), then ffdshow internal filters could work

EDIT : the patch you mentioned is from VLC team, not ffmpeg. The benefit I see is that APIs are finally all included into ffmpeg but there are still some stuff that have to remain into directshow layer (so ffdhow code) such as the DXVA allocator...
But afterwards it is not very different from MPC patch, maybe cleaner, I don't know yet

[tetsuo55]

Are you sure about that ?

Because I read DXVA 2 docs a while ago and they didn't mention this possibility. Also the DXVA (1 or 2) APIs take an encoded picture and returns nothing

If it was possible to grab a decoded picture back from the GPU memory (which I doubt), then ffdshow internal filters could work

EDIT : the patch you mentioned is from VLC team, not ffmpeg. The benefit I see is that APIs are finally all included into ffmpeg but there are still some stuff that have to remain into directshow layer (so ffdhow code) such as the DXVA allocator...
But afterwards it is not very different from MPC patch, maybe cleaner, I don't know yetthats the whole idea with dxva2, completely independent, you can renderer it to a dx surface and then take that image into the ffdshow postprocessing chain

[MatMaul]

EDIT : the patch you mentioned is from VLC team, not ffmpeg. The benefit I see is that APIs are finally all included into ffmpeg but there are still some stuff that have to remain into directshow layer (so ffdhow code) such as the DXVA allocator...
But afterwards it is not very different from MPC patch, maybe cleaner, I don't know yet
I think it is still a lot cleaner since you can directly use the public ffmpeg API and not some exported functions.

[NiFa]

Is there any plans to add DTS encoding support to ffdshow?
Sorry if this was asked earlier.

[73ChargerFan]

No freeware dts encoder has been written, they are all commercial.

[NiFa]

How come, that no one have written freeware or open source dts encoder? I so hope that someone would do it, but I can't do anything 'bout it if no one is willing to do it. :(

[SamuriHL]

The specs aren't available afaik.

[tetsuo55]

How come, that no one have written freeware or open source dts encoder? I so hope that someone would do it, but I can't do anything 'bout it if no one is willing to do it. :(the company that owns DTS is very willing and able to sue anyone who dares to try. But the main reason is that they keep all their technoligy secret, reverse engineering from nothing is very difficult.

[NiFa]

Ok, now I understand, thanks to making this clear.

[markanini]

I agree Support for <Vista is more important than WinXP. It's an outdated OS with some issues in media support compared to later Windows versions. Maybe detecting Windows version and applying DXVA1/2 accordingly would be feasable?

[Keiyakusha]

Isn't AC3 with the same bitrate as DTS gives twice better quality?

[SamuriHL]

AC3 is limited to 640kbps. DTS can do up to 1.5mbps.

[Keiyakusha]

AC3 is limited to 640kbps. DTS can do up to 1.5mbps.

Yes, but AC3 640 kbps gives the same quality as DTS 1.5mbps.
Can anyone confirm or deny?

[SamuriHL]

Yes, but AC3 640 kbps gives the same quality as DTS 1.5mbps.
Can anyone confirm or deny?

That's not my feeling on it, no. Back when I was doing DVD regularly, DTS always sounded much better for a variety of reasons. One of which is the higher bitrate, but, there are others, too.

[Keiyakusha]

But higher bitrate doesn't mean higher quality if we talking about different formats

[SamuriHL]

http://www.audioholics.com/education/surround-sound/dolby-digital-vs-dts-a-guide-to-the-strengths-of-the-formats

I don't want to take this thread further off topic, but, that should help.

[Snowknight26]

The tooltip for Auto under Input Levels in ffdshow's video config is a bit misleading. It doesn't say whether ffdshow will disregard the flag or not.

[tetsuo55]

DTS is should be better, but i doubt it really matters for realtime encoding

[_xxl]

There is a soc project for dca encoding here:
svn://svn.mplayerhq.hu/soc/dcaenc
This source is based on code from here:
http://roundup.ffmpeg.org/roundup/ffmpeg/file153/edts-20080207.tar.gz

[SamuriHL]

DTS is should be better, but i doubt it really matters for realtime encoding

I would completely agree with that.