ffdshow tryouts project: Discussion & Development

[mark0077]

haruhiko thanks for the work on ff / rewind on dvd's. Just a question to ask if you have any plans to update the ffdshow colorspace / color conversion / resize code to work internally at higher bit depths. It seems madshi and his madVR renderer has pointed out not so great colorspace conversion especially when resizing in ffdshow. madshi is using 16-bit internally everywhere in his new decoder, and dithering down to the screens bit-depth at the very last stage.

Could ffdshow be brought upto scratch?

[ImAhNoBoDy]

I think it's a known issue. Vobsub support in ffdshow is very incomplete. But could you send us the samples? I would like to add them to my collection for the occasion I get time to fix.
(It's long term todo, and my "long term" is years.)

LOL, we know that. I think that's how you typed it up on the first page long ago. Anyways, here it is:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=1NRTBD51

I put readme files in them just in case you might forget. We'll all be waiting.

[haruhiko_yamagata]

LOL, we know that. I think that's how you typed it up on the first page long ago. Anyways, here it is:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=1NRTBD51

I put readme files in them just in case you might forget. We'll all be waiting.
Thank you for your patience.

[haruhiko_yamagata]

haruhiko thanks for the work on ff / rewind on dvd's.
It took longer than expected, 2 weeks.
Just a question to ask if you have any plans to update the ffdshow colorspace / color conversion / resize code to work internally at higher bit depths. It seems madshi and his madVR renderer has pointed out not so great colorspace conversion especially when resizing in ffdshow. madshi is using 16-bit internally everywhere in his new decoder, and dithering down to the screens bit-depth at the very last stage.

Could ffdshow be brought upto scratch?
I have a plan to implement dithering in RGB conversion.
As for resize, it needs a new internal color space YUV 8:8:8. I think it's a bit too much work. The gain of quality wouldn't be much enough to match the effort in real images.

[mark0077]

It took longer than expected, 2 weeks.

I have a plan to implement dithering in RGB conversion.
As for resize, it needs a new internal color space YUV 8:8:8. I think it's a bit too much work. The gain of quality wouldn't be much enough to match the effort in real images.

Thanks for all the work, greatly appreciated.

[STaRGaZeR]

I have a plan to implement dithering in RGB conversion.
As for resize, it needs a new internal color space YUV 8:8:8. I think it's a bit too much work. The gain of quality wouldn't be much enough to match the effort in real images.

This sounds amazing. It could be used with every renderer that accepts RGB32 input instead of relying on madVR. Do you know what's the current bit depth used for calculations, steps, etc. ffdshow is doing when high quality YUV to RGB is selected?

[haruhiko_yamagata]

This sounds amazing. It could be used with every renderer that accepts RGB32 input instead of relying on madVR. Do you know what's the current bit depth used for calculations, steps, etc. ffdshow is doing when high quality YUV to RGB is selected?
ffdshow calculates in higher than 10bit. Dithering is the one that makes his renderer special.
But please do not expect too much, I just have plan to do, as is usual my todo is... However it has higher priority than long term :D.

[STaRGaZeR]

Haha :D Well you know, your contributions are greatly appreciated, we don't care if you take any amount of time to do it.

[therealjoeblow]

haruhiko thanks for the work on ff / rewind on dvd's.

Sorry if I come across as dense here, but I read back several dozen pages, well back into March and can't find any discussion about ff/rw for DVD's, but am also having issues with it and wondering if it's something on the table for improvement. And if it's already been improved as would be implied by Mark0077's comment, can someone point me in the direction of the correct version please?

I tried the latest available build ffdshow_rev2874_20090413_dbt.exe and with Libmpeg2 it crashes in Zoom Player when loading a DVD - the screen goes black for a second on load, and then ZP crashes with the MS error report popup. Doesn't mater what renderer, this on XP-32 SP3. Libavcodec loads and plays DVD's fine in this version, but has the issues with FF/RW where I get screen corruption when in use and they just don't work smooth and fast as they should at all, just frozen frames and jumps in between, and not really responding to key presses, etc.

I also tried the next available build ffdshow_rev2871_20090409_clsid_sse_icl10.exe and in that one Libmpeg2 loads and plays DVD's fine, but FF/RW don't work very well at all, they do the same thing as all other previous builds.

Thanks for any help here,
The REAL Joe

[clsid]

Get build 2880 from sourceforge.

[therealjoeblow]

Get build 2880 from sourceforge.

Thanks clsid, that one loads fine with Libmpeg2, and FF/RW work nice and smooth!

One last issue with DVD playback now, when I enable "Set interlace flag in output media type" (Auto and Auto for method and field order), If I either manually change positions in the video uwing the time-bar, or simply chapter skip, the picture gets overall resized to about 1/2 normal, and on top of that, squashed in the vertical direction too (looks like 15-20%ish). If I toggle resize on and back off, then it resets the picture to normal size and aspect ration, but skipping ahead or back reinstates the distortion again.

If the interlace flag option is not enabled, then this behavior does not occur.

Is this a known issue, or an anomaly that can be corrected?

Many thanks

[haruhiko_yamagata]

Thanks clsid, that one loads fine with Libmpeg2, and FF/RW work nice and smooth!

One last issue with DVD playback now, when I enable "Set interlace flag in output media type" (Auto and Auto for method and field order), If I either manually change positions in the video uwing the time-bar, or simply chapter skip, the picture gets overall resized to about 1/2 normal, and on top of that, squashed in the vertical direction too (looks like 15-20%ish). If I toggle resize on and back off, then it resets the picture to normal size and aspect ration, but skipping ahead or back reinstates the distortion again.

If the interlace flag option is not enabled, then this behavior does not occur.

Is this a known issue, or an anomaly that can be corrected?

Many thanks
Which video card, video renderer, output color space? Please update your video driver.

[therealjoeblow]

Which video card, video renderer, output color space? Please update your video driver.

Sorry haruhiko, here are the details:

WinXP (32bit) SP3
ATI Radeon HD3200 (IGP on Gigabyte ma78gm-s2hp_rev.2.0 motherboard w/780G chipset)
Using the latest Catalyst v-9.4 driver
Overlay Renderer
YUY2 output colorspace (when I enable this feature YV12 is greyed out and not available; without this feature, YV12 normally gets used)

It doesn't do this with VMR9 renderers, but with VMR9, I get a black screen most times when stopping and restarting video play, and have to chapter skip to get the picture to show again. In any case, I can't use any of the VRM modes without serious tearing problems, and FS Exclusive mode disables OSD and other ZP menus, so it's not wife and kid friendly anymore :-( so I need overlay for user friendly functionality.

It also does this exactly with my Dell laptop that has an Intel Mobile 965 IGP graphics adapter, so I don't think it's specific to the video card or driver.

ANOTHER ISSUE,

I just noticed that DVD menu navigation seems to be broken, at least with the current rev 2880 clsid build. I can get to the menu, and use the cursor keys to move from item to item, but when I hit enter or mouse click to select an item, it freezes and I need to use taskman to kill ZP. It does not do this with the theatertek (nvidia) decoder or pdvd decoders, only ffdshow.

[mark0077]

ffdshow calculates in higher than 10bit. Dithering is the one that makes his renderer special.
But please do not expect too much, I just have plan to do, as is usual my todo is... However it has higher priority than long term :D.

Here is a link which seems to nicely show the improvements possible with madVR vs ffdshow for conversion. I am not sure if this increased quality is due to the dithering alone, or dithering, 16-bit internal repsentation, or all of those plus the higher color depth used during resize. A nice comparison though.

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1274551#post1274551

[EpsilonX]

I just noticed that DVD menu navigation seems to be broken, at least with the current rev 2880 clsid build. I can get to the menu, and use the cursor keys to move from item to item, but when I hit enter or mouse click to select an item, it freezes and I need to use taskman to kill ZP. It does not do this with the theatertek (nvidia) decoder or pdvd decoders, only ffdshow.

I can confirm this...
rev2874 is fine...
rev2877 and rev2880 from XvidVideo.ru crashed ZP...
Vista+EVR...

[leeperry]

ah...the latest ICL10 build from xvidvideo.ru still asks me what video decoders I want to enable, and whether I'd want to reset ffdshow...it worked in the earlier builds, but now the problem is back again :o

[therealjoeblow]

The crop tools don't appear to be able to autocrop a 2.35:1 movie down to 1.778:1 (ie, pan-and-scan a super widescreen down to regular widescreen in lay-man's terms) unless I'm missing something?

Would it be possible to add a feature request to do so, ie, use the same algorithm that autocrop uses to find the actual picture dimensions when removing black bars, but discard the horizontal dimension and crop to 1.778x the vertical dimension?

Or if I missed it, could someone kindly point me in the right direction?

Many thanks!

[mark0077]

haruhiko, not sure if its due to the last few builds or not, but using build 2880, I am having terrible trouble getting reliable movement through dvd menus again.

I am using the Queen Greatest Hits Menu that I uploaded to you before. Sometimes I get a freeze at the DTS Entertainment advertisement. Sometimes I get as far as the DVD Menu, can click on "Options", then highlight and click on "DTS 5.1" find and then the player just doesn't move, ends up freezing (vista saying its not responding etc).

Maybe you could check it out, something isn't right with dvd menu's still.

[therealjoeblow]

haruhiko, not sure if its due to the last few builds or not, but using build 2880, I am having terrible trouble getting reliable movement through dvd menus again.

I am using the Queen Greatest Hits Menu that I uploaded to you before. Sometimes I get a freeze at the DTS Entertainment advertisement. Sometimes I get as far as the DVD Menu, can click on "Options", then highlight and click on "DTS 5.1" find and then the player just doesn't move, ends up freezing (vista saying its not responding etc).

Maybe you could check it out, something isn't right with dvd menu's still.

EpsilonX and I reported same just a few posts above... Which player are you using for interest sake?

[mark0077]

mpc-hc beliyaal's build, version 25. I had some menu navigation slowness / pausing in recent builds but no complete freezes like I get now. Still not as good as my hardware dvd player in the living room but almost there. :D

[haruhiko_yamagata]

Sorry haruhiko, here are the details:

WinXP (32bit) SP3
ATI Radeon HD3200 (IGP on Gigabyte ma78gm-s2hp_rev.2.0 motherboard w/780G chipset)
Using the latest Catalyst v-9.4 driver
Overlay Renderer
YUY2 output colorspace (when I enable this feature YV12 is greyed out and not available; without this feature, YV12 normally gets used)

It doesn't do this with VMR9 renderers, but with VMR9, I get a black screen most times when stopping and restarting video play, and have to chapter skip to get the picture to show again. In any case, I can't use any of the VRM modes without serious tearing problems, and FS Exclusive mode disables OSD and other ZP menus, so it's not wife and kid friendly anymore :-( so I need overlay for user friendly functionality.

It also does this exactly with my Dell laptop that has an Intel Mobile 965 IGP graphics adapter, so I don't think it's specific to the video card or driver.

I can't reproduce. Please make sure no other filter is inserted between ffdshow and video renderer.

ANOTHER ISSUE,

I just noticed that DVD menu navigation seems to be broken, at least with the current rev 2880 clsid build. I can get to the menu, and use the cursor keys to move from item to item, but when I hit enter or mouse click to select an item, it freezes and I need to use taskman to kill ZP. It does not do this with the theatertek (nvidia) decoder or pdvd decoders, only ffdshow.
I have fixed this.

[mark0077]

I can't reproduce. Please make sure no other filter is inserted between ffdshow and video renderer.

I have fixed this.
Thanks :D

EDIT: DVD Menu's very responsive and look perfect for me in this latest version. SWEET

[therealjoeblow]

I can't reproduce. Please make sure no other filter is inserted between ffdshow and video renderer.

I went thru the entire graph, there's only the renderer, ffdshow audio and video decoders, and the dvd navigator (m$). I checked that all of ffdshow's settings are reset to defaults. There is no other software of filters inserted in the graph.

It does this (the weird resize and aspect ratio scrunch) *only* with the OVERLAY mixer, it does not do this with VMR7, VMR9 or Haali renderer, but it is assuredly doing it with overlay on both of my (very different) machines, and only when the "set interlace flag" is turned on.

I tried both ZP6 and MPCHC_x86_svn1044_beliyaal_25 and it does the same thing on both, so I don't think it's specific to the player.

EDIT: Also, it does not change the size or aspect ratio (in overlay mode) if I simply drag the VTS_01_1.VOB file from the DVD into the player, then it plays the file fine even if I jump around back and forth in the file, but when I open anything in DVD mode with the interlace flag on, it does the weirdness. And I don't get any of these issues with nvidia or pdvd decoders in hardware mode, only with ffdshow.

??? not sure what else the problem could be...

[Mark_A_W]

I was just wondering if there is any hope for DTS-MA decoding?

It depends on FFmpeg right? And I guess that depends on getting the right info to write a decoder...

[fastplayer]

I was just wondering if there is any hope for DTS-MA decoding?
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ffmpeg_05_interview&num=2

[leeperry]

DVD Menu's very responsive and look perfect for me in this latest version. SWEET
even in HR?

[mark0077]

I don't use HR, it won't let me play DVDs... macrovision error lol
evr-cp is what I use

[tetsuo55]

With all these changes,

What is now the recommended DVD/Bluray Mpeg2 settings(including audio) settings?

[leeperry]

I don't use HR, it won't let me play DVDs... macrovision error lol
evr-cp is what I use
they play fine in KMP on XP SP3 w/ HR, too bad the damn menus buttons don't work...ah well

[therealjoeblow]

First of all, a BIG THANK YOU to all of the developers!! I don't know how you guys find the time to deal with all of these issues, in most cases on a day by day basis, but, really, it is *very* much appreciated.

@haruhiko_yamagata,

Thanks for the DVD fixes, menus are working great now, and so is the fast-forward and rewind. Again, much appreciated!

SUSPECTED AUDIO BUG REPORT (DTS):
--------------------------------------

Can someone please take a look at DTS passthru over SPDIF? I was going nuts trying out every video setting and driver update to try and get over a judder problem, when I read on another forum that someone thinks it's ffdshow's handling of DTS passthru, and that AC3Filter doesn't do this. I installed AC3Filter and can now confirm that there is something wrong with the way FFDShow does passthru. I tried on 2 very different machines and it does exactly the same thing on both. I never noticed it before because I only just started using SPDIF a few months ago, before that I always had DTS simply decoded and played on the soundcard.

Almost exactly every 6 seconds, there's a slight frame jump/judder. It's most apparent when the camera is panning, and in scrolling credits, etc.

It doesn't do this with AC3 at all, nor when decoding DTS, only when passing thru DTS to SPDIF.

Many thanks once again!

[haruhiko_yamagata]

I went thru the entire graph, there's only the renderer, ffdshow audio and video decoders, and the dvd navigator (m$). I checked that all of ffdshow's settings are reset to defaults. There is no other software of filters inserted in the graph.

It does this (the weird resize and aspect ratio scrunch) *only* with the OVERLAY mixer, it does not do this with VMR7, VMR9 or Haali renderer, but it is assuredly doing it with overlay on both of my (very different) machines, and only when the "set interlace flag" is turned on.

I tried both ZP6 and MPCHC_x86_svn1044_beliyaal_25 and it does the same thing on both, so I don't think it's specific to the player.

EDIT: Also, it does not change the size or aspect ratio (in overlay mode) if I simply drag the VTS_01_1.VOB file from the DVD into the player, then it plays the file fine even if I jump around back and forth in the file, but when I open anything in DVD mode with the interlace flag on, it does the weirdness. And I don't get any of these issues with nvidia or pdvd decoders in hardware mode, only with ffdshow.

??? not sure what else the problem could be...
I have tested this with Intel 82865G on Xp and it works for me.
Thank you for your detailed info, but it doesn't mean it's a bug of ffdshow. I still think it's a bug of overlay mixer + your video drivers. Other decoders just do not trigger the bugs for some reason.

[nijiko]

Is there any chance to improve COOK audio (RA8 32K Stereo) ?

[arestarh]

Hello!
I updated Russian translation and uploaded to the tracker:
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=173941&atid=867362
Sorry for my bad English!

[travolter]

hi guys!! Fantastic proyect!!

I miss VC-1 multithread support.
I have a 9550 cuad core cpu and its not enough to play 1080 VC-1 files + ffdshow filters (sharp.. etc).

Multicore support for VC-1 would be nice to improve HD videos with ffdshow filters

[clsid]

We do not make the VC-1 decoder. We use the code from the FFmpeg project. They have a branch (ffmpeg-mt) for multi-threaded decoding, but it is still in early development. You'll have to be very patient and wait.

[STaRGaZeR]

hi guys!! Fantastic proyect!!

I miss VC-1 multithread support.
I have a 9550 cuad core cpu and its not enough to play 1080 VC-1 files + ffdshow filters (sharp.. etc).

Multicore support for VC-1 would be nice to improve HD videos with ffdshow filters

Why not use wmv9 instead? It's multithreaded.

[leeperry]

is there a way to change b and c for bicubic resize? so the negative parameter is c? and b is automatically calculated so b+(2*c)=1?

[Eragon4ever]

Hello!
I updated Russian translation and uploaded to the tracker:
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=173941&atid=867362
Sorry for my bad English!

Thank you very much. Commited by clsid at r2886.

[Gleb Egorych]

Bug in LPCM decoder: cracking sound just after rewind. Tried Panasonic Blu-Ray demo disk, there are tracks with 2ch and 8ch LPCM, same bug for both. There are also tracks with DTS audio, no problem for them.

ffdshow r2886 from "ffdshow_rev2886_20090420_clsid.exe", MPC-HC MPEG splitter 1.2.908, ZP6.

In MPC-HC 1.2.1056 with internal TS splitter (v1.2.1056 I guess) the situation is better, but cracking noise still present.

[flanger216]

Hi!

I'm having a problem with bass management in the ffdshow audio decoder.

When enabling "LFE Crossover", all audio that is already present in the discreet LFE channel of a DD5.1 ac3 signal is muted. Hence the ".1 channel" is completely lost!
Correct would be to maintain the LFE signal and simply add the bass from the other 5 channels to it.

I'm also getting this problem in the latest builds. The 'LFE crossover' function works great on sources with no .1 channel. However, for sources with an .1 channel, it sounds like the crossover is actually replacing the LFE channel. Obviously, this kills the bass. Preferably, we should be able to specify whether to add crossover to the .1 channel, or whether the crossover is simply to be ignored when a .1 channel is present.

There wasn't anything in the bug tracker about this, so I went ahead and added it.

[clsid]

What is the last known working revision? That info is always useful for us to pinpoint where the bug was introduced.

[arestarh]

Hello!
I updated Russian translation and you committed it at r2886. Thank you!
But, during the translation some strings are missing (don't load because of
buggy code):
1)http://s39.radikal.ru/i086/0904/65/f623270f8bc7.png
2)http://s61.radikal.ru/i171/0904/b6/deaa7cf85fac.png
3)http://s47.radikal.ru/i117/0904/83/c822fa89dcf5.png

Some strings I can not translate at all(in translate mode):
1)http://s46.radikal.ru/i111/0904/26/a33cda9cbb37.png
2)http://i073.radikal.ru/0904/b6/fe2d65695de2.png
3)http://i045.radikal.ru/0904/9a/1fc0aa58e1f4.png
4)http://s56.radikal.ru/i151/0904/ff/faf501eefb49.png
5)http://i028.radikal.ru/0904/48/3bc78c9cd172.png
6)http://i031.radikal.ru/0904/4a/386c8275ffb5.png

Is it possible to correct/fix this?

[STaRGaZeR]

fix DVD timestamps calculations (libavcodec wrapper)

Thanks Haruhiko, I was going to report it. libavcodec played DVDs at ~20fps :p

[travolter]

Why not use wmv9 instead? It's multithreaded.

cause I want to use the ffdshow filter collection with my videos ;)

Thanks Clsid and STaRGaZeR for the replies!!!

Ill wait to ffmpeg-mt :)

[Mark_A_W]

cause I want to use the ffdshow filter collection with my videos ;)

Thanks Clsid and STaRGaZeR for the replies!!!

Ill wait to ffmpeg-mt :)

Pick wmv9 as the decoder for VC-1, from the fddshow codecs section, instead of libavcodec (from memory).


Then you get both.


(Or you could load ffdshow after the microsoft decoder in the filter chain, but that is not as elegant - I do this for CoreAVC.)

[travolter]

Pick wmv9 as the decoder for VC-1, from the fddshow codecs section, instead of libavcodec (from memory).


Then you get both.


(Or you could load ffdshow after the microsoft decoder in the filter chain, but that is not as elegant - I do this for CoreAVC.)

hey pal!!! big thanks for the tip! I Installed VC1 codec and its working better! ;)

[clsid]

I just discovered another weird issue with DVD playback.

"Movie FPS" on the Info&CPU page shows a wrong value. If I play a 25fps DVD, then it starts at around 19 or 20fps and the value continually increases, converging to 25fps. At the beginning it increments fast, gradually slowing down, like a parabolic function. MPC osd stats show the correct fps.

[LSudlow]

That sounds like it's doing a cumulative average FPS rather than a rolling average...

[her34]

wmv crash with ffdshow

2895, 2886, 2880 crash with wmv files

2857 works

sample file:
http://www.gametrailers.com/player/48326.html
pick HD version, click the download button to choose format

[therealjoeblow]

It's likely that the Subtitle filter in ffdshow was never intended to allow external subs to be used with DVD's, and I'm not sure if it's possible to do so technically, but I'll ask anyway.

I am able to point the subtitle filter to an external .srt file while a DVD is playing, and if I play it from the beginning without jumping around in the file, then the timecodes in the .srt match up with the proper time the subs are expected in the video, but I guess the subtitle filter isn't able to read the actual timestamp from either the video stream or the player like it can for a normal media files, so when I chapter slip or even just jump ahead a minute or two, the subs get out of sync with the video.

Is it possible to modify the behavior so that external .srt files could be loaded and read the proper timecode and display at the correct time when playing DVD's, the same way they do for other media files? This would save a lot of hassle when watching foreign films that don't have english subs on the disc itself.

Many thanks!