MadVR in use with LG OLED Thread

[Asmodian]

:) I understand what you mean now, but is the end result proper 4:4:4 or not?

Yes, the screen has proper 4:4:4 in PC mode.

Other pixel artifacts do not mean it is not "proper 4:4:4" it just means it has other pixel artifacts. :p

There is no way to get PC mode to be smooth.

It is possible on the C9 but only in SDR. The behavior is different compared to my C7, and I think the C8 is like the C7.

[VBB]

That's at least some progress. Let's see how the C10 turns out. Too bad we don't have any Sony owners here. I'd like to know firsthand how those behave (the panels, not the owners) :)

[VBB]

"10 bit" is being sent as 12 bit by the GPU regardless of what it's telling you.

Just noticed that myself. Is this another Nvidia bug, or intentional? Visually, there is no difference, which makes sense now.

[leeperry]

Hey guys, about to finally jump on the OLED bandwagon and here (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1892858&postcount=58169) chros claims that even latest Pana's can't do proper 24p, I also read Asmodian here in this thread saying that only C9 can do 444 24p, so if I get a 8 series I'd have to go 422 huh?

Samsung TV's 444 is not manageable because it disables BFI and most post-processing, no such thing on LG OLED?

[SamuriHL]

Just noticed that myself. Is this another Nvidia bug, or intentional? Visually, there is no difference, which makes sense now.Unsure. I just noticed it with the integral 2 and thought I'd mention it. I think nvidia has always sent 12 bit. Maybe they're padding it I'm not sure.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[QBhd]

Hey guys, about to finally jump on the OLED bandwagon and here (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1892858&postcount=58169) chros claims that even latest Pana's can't do proper 24p, I also read Asmodian here in this thread saying that only C9 can do 444 24p, so if I get a 8 series I'd have to go 422 huh?

Samsung TV's 444 is not manageable because it disables BFI and most post-processing, no such thing on LG OLED?

My LG C8 will do 23,24,25,29,30,50,59, and 60 Hz at 4k out of the box with 4:4:4 in PC mode. I don't use PC mode due to color banding.

Also, you don't want BFI (Motion Pro) on the OLED, it's terrible.

I suggest going to RTings and looking up the TV you want, it has very detailed breakdowns on just about every facet of the TV

QB

[VBB]

Unsure. I just noticed it with the integral 2 and thought I'd mention it. I think nvidia has always sent 12 bit. Maybe they're padding it I'm not sure.

I just did another couple of hours of testing. Turns out for 4:2:2, Nvidia sends 12-bit regardless of the chosen bit rate. Even when set to 8-bit it sends a 12-bit signal. But, what is set in the driver does make a difference. 8-bit has lots of banding, much more than with 4:4:4 or RGB. There is also a very small difference between 10 and 12-bit, with 10-bit looking ever so slightly better when judging various gradients.

It also depends on what bit rate madVR is set to. That's what makes testing this tedious. There seems to be a bug in madVR still, where sometimes, when set to 10-bit, it switches to 8-bit, and once it does that you have to reboot Windows in order to get it back into 10-bit mode. Had me question my sanity until I realized what was going on, because only when in 10-bit does 4:2:2 look the absolute smoothest out of all combos.

Went through PC mode as well again tonight. I gotta say that YCbCr 4:4:4 8-bit throughout the chain actually looks fairly decent in HDR, and pretty smooth in SDR. Add dithering back in, and perhaps a bit of "reduce banding artifacts", and it's the best choice if you can't live without PC mode.

As Asmodian pointed out earlier, things might be (slightly) different with the newer LGs, so it's always best to do your own testing.

[huhn]

Hey guys, about to finally jump on the OLED bandwagon and here (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1892858&postcount=58169) chros claims that even latest Pana's can't do proper 24p, I also read Asmodian here in this thread saying that only C9 can do 444 24p, so if I get a 8 series I'd have to go 422 huh?

Samsung TV's 444 is not manageable because it disables BFI and most post-processing, no such thing on LG OLED?

no OLED can do BFI for 24p is technically impossible.

these panel run at 100 or 120 hz adn you can't BFI using a backlight because there is no backlight so you have to send real black frames.
i don't have to say more.

even if you get 4:4:4 working is far from optimal thanks to the WRGB used in these screen which can create interesting patterns...
that seems to be a bigger issue on the sony(defeat able) which supposed to have a relative good BFI and as always 4:4:4 for everything.

[Asmodian]

Samsung TV's 444 is not manageable because it disables BFI and most post-processing, no such thing on LG OLED?

LG disables almost everything in PC (444) mode.

Add dithering back in, and perhaps a bit of "reduce banding artifacts", and it's the best choice if you can't live without PC mode.

Wouldn't you always have dithering on when testing? It seems weird to test with it disabled if you have it enabled for playback (of course, you always have it enabled for playback).

I have no idea how my TV looks without dithering, but if madVR dithering to 8 bit has less banding than sending the TV dithered 10 bit isn't that the better mode regardless of what it looks like with dithering disabled?

The results without dithering are very interesting when trying to understand the TV's video processing but what is important for watching is the results with dithering enabled.

[leeperry]

LG disables almost everything in PC (444) mode.

Figures, so what does it matter whether 24p isn't smooth? If anything, it prolly is because all post-processing is disabled duh.

444 is not manageable on TV's IME due to this constraint, I'll trade full chroma for post-processing anytime.

[huhn]

it's simple math you can't put 24 frames in 60.
and i can just repeat my self yet again sonys can do 4:4:4 even with frame interpolation so you can get 44.4: and ruin your image at the same time.

this shouldn't be something special PC screen can do that too.

[leeperry]

sonys can do 4:4:4 even with frame interpolation so you can get 44.4: and ruin your image at the same time.
What SONY's did you try? B8 is often on sale down to 850€, SONY's are much pricier and I'm not too keen on dropping extra benji's for 444

I'm also under the impression that improvements in the C/9 series are quite irrelevant for mVR use?

[huhn]

just ask rtings.

the 120 hz thing could be huge on the C9. at least madshi likes the idea of native 120 hz. he talked about madVR site adaptive BFI many years ago.

LG are well know to handle HDR sub optimal the panasonic is better there but has pretty much the same price as the sony. the sony is also known to handle banding better something the LG is not great at but i have my disbelieves in the sony too.

the 55 are usually a lot more price for the sonys in the 65 range they are not that far apart.

sonys are far from perfect to not having HDMI 2.1 for that price is a disgrace and i wouldn't be shocked if the next years model doesn't have it too. VVR support which is most likely something you are not interested in is something sony totally ignored. but custom 96 hz BFI is possibile with it

[svengun]

As for "Are you sure that it is the case? Did LG do it with a firmware upgrade?"

I have had that TV since 2016 , always had HDR (w/4K) via HDMI

[VBB]

Wouldn't you always have dithering on when testing? It seems weird to test with it disabled if you have it enabled for playback (of course, you always have it enabled for playback).

I have no idea how my TV looks without dithering, but if madVR dithering to 8 bit has less banding than sending the TV dithered 10 bit isn't that the better mode regardless of what it looks like with dithering disabled?

The results without dithering are very interesting when trying to understand the TV's video processing but what is important for watching is the results with dithering enabled.

That's what I was trying to do. And to me, it now looks like the combination of Nvidia YCbCr 4:2:2 10-bit, madVR 0-255 10-bit, TV Black Level low, non-PC mode, results in a smoothness that none of the other combos can match, regardless of what madVR's dithering is set to.

Would you be willing to confirm that with your C9? :D

[Asmodian]

Would you be willing to confirm that with your C9? :D

HDR or SDR? Both?

Dithering on or off? :)

[SamuriHL]

I just did another couple of hours of testing. Turns out for 4:2:2, Nvidia sends 12-bit regardless of the chosen bit rate. Even when set to 8-bit it sends a 12-bit signal. But, what is set in the driver does make a difference. 8-bit has lots of banding, much more than with 4:4:4 or RGB. There is also a very small difference between 10 and 12-bit, with 10-bit looking ever so slightly better when judging various gradients.

It also depends on what bit rate madVR is set to. That's what makes testing this tedious. There seems to be a bug in madVR still, where sometimes, when set to 10-bit, it switches to 8-bit, and once it does that you have to reboot Windows in order to get it back into 10-bit mode. Had me question my sanity until I realized what was going on, because only when in 10-bit does 4:2:2 look the absolute smoothest out of all combos.

Went through PC mode as well again tonight. I gotta say that YCbCr 4:4:4 8-bit throughout the chain actually looks fairly decent in HDR, and pretty smooth in SDR. Add dithering back in, and perhaps a bit of "reduce banding artifacts", and it's the best choice if you can't live without PC mode.

As Asmodian pointed out earlier, things might be (slightly) different with the newer LGs, so it's always best to do your own testing.

I've, for now, settled on 422 10 bit (in a 12 bit gift box LOL). It does look pretty good. Not without some issues, but, everything on these panels seems to be a compromise one way or the other. So for me, this is what I'll use for now.

[SamuriHL]

HDR or SDR? Both?

Dithering on or off? :)

Both.

Dithering on because that's what we use in real life. I get the whole wanting to test without dithering to see how badly screwed up the panels are, but, we know they're messed up. So you could test with both I suppose but ultimately the most useful is with it on.

[Magik Mark]

I have a C9 connected to RTX 2060. It seems the Nvidia control panel is stuck to 8bit @ 2160p. Is this a limitation of the GPU? Or maybe there's a better setting that would allow greater than 8bit settings?

[VBB]

Definitely test both SDR and HDR with both dithering off and on. Dithering will mask the worst banding, but why wouldn't you want to see what looks best before turning dithering back on? I did not come across a mode where dithering made it look better than another mode which already looked better without dithering? Does that makes sense?

[VBB]

@Magik Mark - At 60Hz, your choices for greater than 8-bit are limited to YCbCr 4:2:2 10-bit/12-bit or YCbCr 4:2:0 12-bit. At lower frequencies, you can also use YCbCr 4:4:4 or RGB 12-bit.

[Magik Mark]

@Magik Mark - At 60Hz, your choices for greater than 8-bit are limited to YCbCr 4:2:2 10-bit/12-bit or YCbCr 4:2:0 12-bit. At lower frequencies, you can also use YCbCr 4:4:4 or RGB 12-bit.

Oh! Thanks. I configured it at 60hz 2160p RGB full

[SamuriHL]

Yea, this is where HDMI 2.1 comes in....it can do 60Hz at higher bit depths. We lowly HDMI 2.0 users...can't. :D

[Magik Mark]

Yea, this is where HDMI 2.1 comes in....it can do 60Hz at higher bit depths. We lowly HDMI 2.0 users...can't. :D

Can Nvidia support this through software upgrade on its GPUs? 2060 Perhaps?

[SamuriHL]

That's not very likely and I'm not entirely sure it's even possible. Quite a few people (cough cough nevcariel LOL) are waiting for HDMI 2.1 cards before they even consider upgrading. Envy is said to be getting a hardware upgrade when 2.1 cards are available (it's based on the RTX 2080TI I believe). So, it's very unlikely that the current cards will be HDMI 2.1 upgradable in any real way.

[nevcairiel]

They can only offer new software features like HDMI VRR, or back in the day they added 4:2:0 support to HDMI 1.4 cards, but anything that requires a higher bandwidth will require new hardware.

Hopefully 2020 is the year of HDMI 2.1

[chros]

Yes, the screen has proper 4:4:4 in PC mode. Other pixel artifacts do not mean it is not "proper 4:4:4" it just means it has other pixel artifacts. :p
As you wish :)

I just did another couple of hours of testing. Turns out for 4:2:2, Nvidia sends 12-bit regardless of the chosen bit rate. Even when set to 8-bit it sends a 12-bit signal. But, what is set in the driver does make a difference. 8-bit has lots of banding, much more than with 4:4:4 or RGB. There is also a very small difference between 10 and 12-bit, with 10-bit looking ever so slightly better when judging various gradients.

It also depends on what bit rate madVR is set to. That's what makes testing this tedious. There seems to be a bug in madVR still, where sometimes, when set to 10-bit, it switches to 8-bit, and once it does that you have to reboot Windows in order to get it back into 10-bit mode. Had me question my sanity until I realized what was going on, because only when in 10-bit does 4:2:2 look the absolute smoothest out of all combos.
Interesting, thanks!

these panel run at 100 or 120 hz adn you can't BFI using a backlight because there is no backlight so you have to send real black frames.
LG's 2019 panels are running 240Hz (older 2018/2017 panels are 120Hz), but BFI only at 120Hz (that's supposed to be one of the key features of the 2019 models, but they didn't add it at the end, probably due to chrominance overshoot issue, that just got attention around that time).
Maybe next year models :)

444 is not manageable on TV's IME due to this constraint, I'll trade full chroma for post-processing anytime.
That means no PC mode for you on an LG.

just ask rtings.
Doesn't work all the time :) (E.g. they state that LG can do proper 4:4:4, not mentioning any pixel "artifacts".)

LG are well know to handle HDR sub optimal the panasonic is better there but has pretty much the same price as the sony. the sony is also known to handle banding better something the LG is not great at
This is (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-oled-technology-flat-panels-general/3037908-oled-tvs-hit-severe-blocking-flashing-problems-poll-18.html#post58938384) on the overpriced Panasonic GZ2000.
Sony has other issues as well, just watch Vincent's recent comparison (https://youtu.be/AuVw4oEMDgA).

[huhn]

interesting i'm not even aware of a internal connector that can send 240hz UHD.

[leeperry]

the 120 hz thing could be huge on the C9. at least madshi likes the idea of native 120 hz. he talked about madVR site adaptive BFI many years ago.

Apparently even C9 won't accept 2160p120 over HDMI: https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/c9-oled

It seems that C8 was already able to do 120Hz FI: https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/c8-oled

BFI calls for much faster refresh rates AFAIK so this is kind of a moot point I think.

So basically the diff between B & C is a better upscaling engine? Kinda pointless with mVR?

That means no PC mode for you on an LG.

So what's an OLED that does 444 w/ postprocessing please? Hopefully from 2018 so I can get it on sales :)

[Asmodian]

Doesn't work all the time :) (E.g. they state that LG can do proper 4:4:4, not mentioning any pixel "artifacts".)

I am still confused why you connect these? Of course RTings does not mention pixel artifacts as part of chroma subsampling, they are not related in anyway. :confused:

These kind of pixel artifacts are the result of the panel, not the processing chip that is responsible for processing chroma. Turning off PC mode does not make them go away. These artifacts are not chroma subsampling artifacts. They are simply unrelated to chroma sampling.

Really, why are these connected in your mind?

[huhn]

Apparently even C9 won't accept 2160p120 over HDMI: https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/c9-oled

It seems that C8 was already able to do 120Hz FI: https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/c8-oled

BFI calls for much faster refresh rates AFAIK so this is kind of a moot point I think.

So basically the diff between B & C is a better upscaling engine? Kinda pointless with mVR?
the C9 has HDMI 2.1 which can do 120 hz. but there is no player or GPU with HDMI 2.1 to test it.
all oled have at least an 120 HZ panel all highend LCDs too.
60 HZ source has the best motion quality with 60 Hz BFI with 120 you will get ghosting. 23p will always have ghosting with BFI.
i have a screen that can do 240 HZ + BFI trust me you don't want this...

So what's an OLED that does 444 w/ postprocessing please? Hopefully from 2018 so I can get it on sales :)
supposedly all not entry sonys in graphic or game picture mode.
you should always double check this with someone that owns a device is at least similar and that will not be me because i wait for HDMI 2.1.

[leeperry]

the C9 has HDMI 2.1 which can do 120 hz. but there is no player or GPU with HDMI 2.1 to test it.

Truth is I can't be hassled upgrading my GPU as even a RX580 is only 100% faster than my HD7870, if AMD ever come up with a $200ish monster GPU that warrants a serious speed increase I shall consider it..so in the meantime I do plan on using one of those dongles to output 2160p60 over DP: https://www.amazon.com/s?k=Club+3D+Mini+DisplayPort+HDMI&rh=p_85%3A2470955011%2Cp_89%3AClub3D&s=price-asc-rank&dc&qid=1576347616&rnid=2528832011&ref=sr_st_price-asc-rank

Shame even newest ones can't do @120 and I don't think I care much for HDR at this point.

supposedly all not entry sonys in graphic or game picture mode.
you should always double check this with someone that owns a device is at least similar and that will not be me because i wait for HDMI 2.1.

Well yah, that's what I'm doing here but I stil feel that highest bang/bucks would be a 850€ish B8, possibly B9 if I get lucky.

[huhn]

a HD5870 is a 10 year old card so i guess you mean the RX 5700 which more then double the speed.

even just the paper numbers it is 4x as fast and this ignore IPC gains and the feature set.

even an RX 5500 XT for 190 is at least 2x the speed of your card.
not that i can recommend these broken cards my RX 5700 xt good example.

madshi hints heavily on features that use turing exclusive processing power this is not confirmed. but he is recommending turing cards.

[leeperry]

a HD5870 is a 10 year old card so i guess you mean the RX 5700 which more then double the speed.

even just the paper numbers it is 4x as fast and this ignore IPC gains and the feature set.

even an RX 5500 XT for 190 is at least 2x the speed of your card.
not that i can recommend these broken cards my RX 5700 xt good example.

madshi hints heavily on features that use turing exclusive processing power this is not confirmed. but he is recommending turing cards.
my bad but RX580 Vs HD7870 is barely +100% : https://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-RX-580-vs-AMD-HD-7870/3923vs2161

and FWIR mVR provides higher performance/watt on 78xx than 5x0, Moore Law's just isn't true anymore.

I couldn't care less for nvidia graphic cards so I'll wait for AMD to catch the bullet I guess.

[huhn]

userbenchmarks is not trust worthy.
and yes polaris is a bad choice for madVR i instantly reported back in the days with my RX 480 which got outperformed by my R9 270.

NAVI doesn't have this problem. the driver is the fun part.

[chros]

i have a screen that can do 240 HZ + BFI trust me you don't want this...
Interesting, reviewers have high hopes about this, I guess we have to wait and see how it goes.

supposedly all not entry sonys in graphic or game picture mode.
you should always double check this with someone that owns a device is at least similar
"Supposedly" :) , but yes, someone has to check it: e.g. the "entry" level Sony AG8 (that has the same price as C9) doesn't even have CMS controls (let alone 1dlut/3dlut/etc.)! :D

that will not be me because i wait for HDMI 2.1
Good news, hopefully they release the next lineup with it. We will be waiting for you :)

I am still confused why you connect these? Of course RTings does not mention pixel artifacts as part of chroma subsampling, they are not related in anyway. :confused:

These kind of pixel artifacts are the result of the panel, not the processing chip that is responsible for processing chroma. Turning off PC mode does not make them go away. These artifacts are not chroma subsampling artifacts. They are simply unrelated to chroma sampling.

Really, why are these connected in your mind?
:) It's not just me, but the question is why they aren't not connected for You? :)

But seriously, these are *not* "pixel artifacts are the result of the panel", but result of picture processing. Try it with 60Hz, it should be proper 4:4:4.
I refer to black box testing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black-box_testing) (since we don't know much about the different stages of the internal processing chain, and even if we would know we still wouldn't be able to do much about it), all I/we care about is:
input 4:4:4 -> TV -> no 4:4:4 output :)

So what's an OLED that does 444 w/ postprocessing please? Hopefully from 2018 so I can get it on sales :)

Not LG, not Panasonic, not Philips, I don't know much about Sony, HiSense, Toshiba, etc.
But Xiaomi and Huawei will also jump into the oled TV business (http://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.html?idxno=38031) (with LG panels) next year, hopefully making the competition way more interesting! :)

If the price does matter for you, then go ahead with the cheapest LG Oled at a given size (I also have the B8), none of them are perfect. :) But don't buy a used one or one without warranty! :)

[chros]

that's supposed to be one of the key features of the 2019 models, but they didn't add it at the end, probably due to chrominance overshoot issue, that just got attention around that time

Btw, here's a good explanation (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-oled-technology-flat-panels-general/3037908-oled-tvs-hit-severe-blocking-flashing-problems-poll-18.html#post58974872) how the fix for the chrominance overshoot impacted the planned BFI in 2019 LG Oleds.

[huhn]

Good news, hopefully they release the next lineup with it. We will be waiting for you :)

not going to be an OLED.
you guys are doing to much good work in showing there dreadful flaws.
and i'm prude to say that i managed to burn in an LCD in my live.

[chros]

not going to be an OLED.
Oh, noooo ... :) Then what are you doing here?! :D

[Asmodian]

input 4:4:4 -> TV -> no 4:4:4 output :)


I do get 4:4:4 output with 60 Hz PC mode, every pixel obviously has its own chroma value and if I use alternating chroma values every other pixel is different. There is no blending of chroma values between pixels. That is what 4:4:4 means. :confused:

[mark0077]

I'm surprised nobody else here is reporting the issue when in YCbCr 444 8-bit mode, when going fullscreen windowed (10-bit) mode with HDR content, the screen goes a very strong tinge of green. I am seeing many posts on nvidias forums over the past 2 years. I don't see any good solution though apart from things like restarting the graphics driver which sometimes kicks it into working mode. Everything from DDU / clean install of drivers, to Windows re-install doesn't fix it.

When in madVR windowed mode, there is no issue at all with YCbCr 444 8-bit 60hz (nor non direct X 11 full screen mode). I'm quite suite at this point that its not HDMI limitation as it also happens at 23hz.

Is anyone able to reproduce this strong green tinge when going fullscreen windowed mode in madVR, with an up to date nvidia driver, up to date Windows 10 on their C9 or any display for that matter?

[cyberscott]

I'm surprised nobody else here is reporting the issue when in YCbCr 444 8-bit mode, when going fullscreen windowed (10-bit) mode with HDR content, the screen goes a very strong tinge of green. I am seeing many posts on nvidias forums over the past 2 years. I don't see any good solution though apart from things like restarting the graphics driver which sometimes kicks it into working mode. Everything from DDU / clean install of drivers, to Windows re-install doesn't fix it.

When in madVR windowed mode, there is no issue at all with YCbCr 444 8-bit 60hz. I'm quite suite at this point that its not HDMI limitation as it also happens at 23hz.

Is anyone able to reproduce this strong green tinge when going fullscreen windowed mode in madVR, with an up to date nvidia driver, up to date Windows 10 on their C9 or any display for that matter?
I have a C9, 2080 Ti, latest drivers for nivida and latest Windows 10 version and have never seen a green tint as you have described when in YcbCr 444 8 bit mode, using madVR and HDR.
Are you directly connected to to C9 or going through a receiver first?
Also, HDMI cable could be a factor as well. Are you using HDMI 2.0b Premium Certified cables? A loose connection on either end or internal short in the cable can cause issues too. If possible, change the cable out and see if it is repeatable. Also, try a different HDMI port on TV or different HDMI on your video card, if available.
I've had perfectly working HDMI cables suddenly go bad on me in the past, causing the picture to go into a 16 bit like color scheme when pushing a high bit rate content. I always keep a couple of known good 2.0b cables for troubleshooting or replacement.

[SamuriHL]

I've not seen that issue, either. That would suck.

[mark0077]

No problem, thought some of you may have seen it. Maybe its the cable although I have tried a few (all non certified), or maybe its my GTX 980. Seemed because in DX9 windowed mode its fine, and in DX11 fullscreen its not, i thought it was back to being an nvidia bug. Cheers for the inputs anyways guys.

[chros]

I do get 4:4:4 output with 60 Hz PC mode, every pixel obviously has its own chroma value and if I use alternating chroma values every other pixel is different. There is no blending of chroma values between pixels. That is what 4:4:4 means. :confused:
Yes, but we don't get the same result @ 23/24p, do we? :) What does it tell you?

[Asmodian]

On my C9 I get exactly the same results at 23/24p as I do at 60p. I can switch band and forth between 23 and 60 Hz and I notice no change in the image even when close enough to resolve individual pixels in the ChromaRes test image.

What differences do you notice?

[chros]

What differences do you notice?
I just checked it, and there's no difference between 23/24p and 60p at 2160p.
Maybe we don't talk about the same thing? Take look at the first section "Chroma 4:4:4" of this post (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1871836#post1871836).

[SamuriHL]

Chros and others that have and use calman on OLED. Calman was just updated with a new 3dlut algorithm that handles OLED panel drift better. It's a fixed point lut with 9 17 or 21 points. The 9 point does nearly 800 measurements the 17 point is over 9000 etc. I ran the 9 point last night and while my results weren't what I necessarily wanted and I need to redo it today, I can definitely see where this is going to be awesome for us.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[leeperry]

Oh and to be perfectly clear ABL and ASBL have become non-issues on B8 and later models? Asking because ABL was completely unbearable on older 1080p models but max brightness was in the 100 cd/m2 region IIRC, newer 4K models are >150 so no nasty visible compression at work? I've looked really hard at 4K models and couldn't notice anything when OTOH it was instantly jumping to my eyes on 1080p's which got me to wonder whether buyers are blind :o

I also read that ASBL would trigger in movies with little movements?

And how can they boast about HDR when max brightness is 150 cd/m2 anyhow :confused:

[huhn]

simple they have a stable brightness in the ~150 region they can be far brighter for a smaller part of the screen.

even the old 1080p model could reach more then 300.

AFAIK ASBL is defeatable in the LG service menu.