AMD, Intel and Nvidia driver issues and last recommended version

[onekmilesbehind]

@Filmgeek47 I have run into that issue on numerous driver builds with my 2070. Bit-depth settings seem to break, get fixed, then break again at various times. I don't have any specific record of what worked when on my end, but do know that the current 451.27 build preserves bit-depth settings across reboots.

Hopefully somebody running a build in that 420 series range can chime in if bit-depth is preserved across reboots. It's one of those pesky low-priority bugs that the HTPC crowd seems to have to deal with.

[Klaus1189]

Need info of new Nvidia SD driver of today regarding HDR passthough ... Thanks :)

@Filmgeek47 and @onekmilesbehind: If you found a driver that gets working 3D and 4K and doesn't loose bitdepth after restart, please let me know, I can pin that info. I personally do not use CRU, but isn't that a possible way to get/hack 12 bit output which survives restart?

Just a thought, but might a AMD card a choice for 3D and 4K?

[kostik]

NVIDIA Studio Driver Version 451.77 WHQL - same HDR behavior as other 451.X . Hope madshi's beta driver will fix this but I grew to like OS HDR but I am not sure what value I should use for Brightness sliders in windows HDR settings for my 65CX oled.

[Filmgeek47]

Need info of new Nvidia SD driver of today regarding HDR passthough ... Thanks :)

@Filmgeek47 and @onekmilesbehind: If you found a driver that gets working 3D and 4K and doesn't loose bitdepth after restart, please let me know, I can pin that info. I personally do not use CRU, but isn't that a possible way to get/hack 12 bit output which survives restart?

Just a thought, but might a AMD card a choice for 3D and 4K?

I was hoping for a solution relating to (or similar to) CRU, but so far I haven't been able to see a method for specifying bit depth, only display timings/resolution.

It sounds like my best bet is to test each of the drivers post 1660Ti launch and find one that does 3D and doesn't lose bit-depth. I'll post back if I'm successful.

@onekmilesbehind Thanks for the heads up.

I already have the Nvidia card so I'm stuck with it, but in any case I opted against AMD as I need the option to flag output as Bt2020 (it tells my HDfury device that I'm outputting 4k/HDR). I don't believe that check box works with AMD.

[Filmgeek47]

So I tested 425.31, 419.67, 419.35, and 419.17. All of those drivers fail to keep bit-depth settings on reboot. According to Toasty over at CRU, that program can't specify bit-depth. Sounds like this is an issue we're stuck with, unless you happen to have an older Nvidia GPU that can run even earlier drivers, where the issue may not occur?

The only other idea I had was if someone who knows how to script might be able to write something that manually sets the bit depth info in the driver, which could be assigned to run on startup. Sadly I'm not really code savvy, but if anyone following this is, this would be a really useful workaround if it's even possible.

[VBB]

I know you're also on AVS, so here's a link to a tool that allows you to do what you're looking for:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-oled-technology-flat-panels-general/3138274-2020-lg-cxa-gx-dedicated-gaming-thread-consoles-pc-14.html#post59699820

You could create a batch file with the settings you need and put it in the startup folder.

[mzso]

Hello!

How do I get full range videos like this to appear normally in the browser (Firefox) with an AMD GPU? It appears washed out...
With my old Nvidia GPU I had a setting that I could set to full range (0-255) and the videos appeared correctly after.

[Klaus1189]

Sample?

[huhn]

if the browser is using d3d11 or DXVA processing then you are doomed level (and lot's of other stuff) is broken for over a year now.

[Klaus1189]

@huhn: Could you make a full list of the broken things? To have a todo list for AMD and have a known issues list for users. I pin it at first post.

[huhn]

i stopped following them and the decoding bug got a workaround.

but here are some small one i just tested:
deint is generally bad not as bad as at the beginning(i guess) it's still very low quality it sometimes just stops working too.

wrong levels AMD is outputting limited range doesn't matter for madVR madVR ask for limited.

d3d11 processing is utterly broken 10 bit or more input/processing in mpcVR it produces something "special" with soem upscal magic (but levels are correct with 10 bit processing).

in general it's just GPU video processing. in the past the image was totally crushed with d3d11 processing and 10 bit.

there is no over write for video settings anymore i never needed it with nvidia and browser are not forced to use DXVA or d3d11 processing but i didn't really checked them.
maybe you can still find video overwrites in the registry custom currently has "brightness".

[DMU]

deint is generally bad not as bad as at the beginning(i guess) it's still very low quality it sometimes just stops working too.

Do you mean DXVA deinterlacing?
Take a look at the face and neck (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aOdmvI9-DUtptfWDInAjzpD6AGT1tJ1U/view?usp=sharing).

[huhn]

trust me it was worse. this is a massive improvement: https://abload.de/img/deint3hjhm.png
and it's kinda slow i'm pretty sure you can ignore the DXVA rendertimes completely but still.

[DMU]

Fixing the issue using software deinterlacing in LAV?

[huhn]

the problem is the deint from amd, intel and nvidia is on a different level then yadif well it was on a different level on amd.

[mzso]

Sample?

https://keepvid.works/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dg9ak928cKfE

[mzso]

the problem is the deint from amd, intel and nvidia is on a different level then yadif well it was on a different level on amd.

For me madVR deinterlancing is not engaged, even though the OSD shows enabled when I use SmartDVB. Any way I can fix this?

[Klaus1189]

For me madVR deinterlancing is not engaged, even though the OSD shows enabled when I use SmartDVB. Any way I can fix this?
Do a test: Don't use deinterlacing in madVR, instead use DXVA copyback in LAV Filters and select Yadif (50/60p of course) then deinterlacing is an a very good level, isn't it?

[mzso]

Do a test: Don't use deinterlacing in madVR, instead use DXVA copyback in LAV Filters and select Yadif (50/60p of course) then deinterlacing is an a very good level, isn't it?

LAV wouldn't even let me to enable HW deinterlacing with either of the HW decoder options...

[Klaus1189]

Not HW deinterlacing, we use copy back, so we can use software deinterlacing, see here what I am talking about:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jFZR2UIyMlyuTRRBzywUVGwYNR00eOe0/view?usp=sharing

[mzso]

Not HW deinterlacing, we use copy back, so we can use software deinterlacing, see here what I am talking about:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jFZR2UIyMlyuTRRBzywUVGwYNR00eOe0/view?usp=sharing

I don't want SW deinterlacing, that's not what my question was about.

[Klaus1189]

Why not? YADIF is far superior to any hw deinterlacer and you can still use hw acceleration for videodecoding.

[mzso]

Why not? YADIF is far superior to any hw deinterlacer and you can still use hw acceleration for videodecoding.

Not my experience. (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JNTd0AwlY4xEMRSQS124vAtMbfazOjWe/view)

I also don't want HW decoding. It's just slow and troublesome.

[Klaus1189]

I don't want SW deinterlacing.
You don't want software deinterlacing.
-> Ok, I got that.

I also don't want HW decoding.
You don't want HW accelerated video decoding.
-> Ok, I got that, too.
-> So you want software video decoding instead.

Wait... You don't want software deinterlacing when using Software decoding?
Do you want to watch interlaced video without a deinterlacer, or am I missing something?

:confused::confused::confused:

[Klaus1189]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JNTd0AwlY4xEMRSQS124vAtMbfazOjWe/view

Can I have the original file please? I know it will have some gigs.

[mzso]

You don't want software deinterlacing.
-> Ok, I got that.


You don't want HW accelerated video decoding.
-> Ok, I got that, too.
-> So you want software video decoding instead.

Wait... You don't want software deinterlacing when using Software decoding?
Do you want to watch interlaced video without a deinterlacer, or am I missing something?

:confused::confused::confused:

"or am I missing something"

Apparently. I don't want to use HW decoding because its inferior. As well as SW yadif, it seems. So HW deinterlacing and SW decoding.

[mzso]

Can I have the original file please? I know it will have some gigs.

Not much actually:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/12wO8NJbIrfa2MD4yVaA38RrBBdziCda8/view?usp=sharing

[Klaus1189]

please cut off "https://drive.google.com/file/d" from the link

[Klaus1189]

This file is MBAFF according to Medianfo. I did also some tests with my NLE. MBAFF means that some parts of the image is partly progressive and partly interlaced. In this case the moving parts are interlaced to preserve the motion of 50 "fps" but the deinterlacer deinterlaces also the progressive parts like the info bar which results in flickering.

Can I post this sample somewhere else for help of guys I know?

I played it with one of my VU+ses and it plays it perfectly.

[huhn]

yadif is not frame adaptive it's "inferior" to intel and nvidia deint and AMD was frame adaptive at one point too but up to this day the AMD driver claims to be frame adaptive while doing a simple bob or no deint at all

of cause you will find files where yadif will win but generally a frame adaptive deint algo is superior.

MBAFF is just an encoding trick you can ignore it it doesn't tell you if a file is interlaced PsF hybrid or what ever.

and well you can't use lav filter hardware deint with AMD. quicksnyc is intel only and cuvid is nvidia only. you don't need them anyway because the video renderer can access the hardware deint.

no clue why a hardware decoder should be "slow" that happens from time to time but generally they are in there only league but they have nothing todo with hardware deint so what ever.

[Klaus1189]

Hmm ... psf = progressive segmented frames. Isn’t that something different, since psf is true progressive but stored in fields? In this case it would be real 25p but the file would be encoded as interlaced, but to play it properly you only need weaving which only presents both fields at the same time. For true interlaced content you don‘t want that since the fields should be presented alternating. I can not describe it better. Bear me me ;)

[huhn]

a decoder outputs a interlaced 30i stream as 30"p" images if it is PsF, interlaced or hybrid doesn't matter. it's the job of the deint algo to turn this into 60 fields and then to 60 frames.

or with other words a decoder isn't outputting fields. while this is technically not impossible it's simply not done practically. well there was/is even a "bug" with HEVC interlace while the file was encoded in fields and ffmpeg didn't output the file as full weaved frames.

there is also soft telecine but i'm not going into that.

[Klaus1189]

I found the wiki page and it is decribed exactly like I thought it is.
Although it is german:

Progressive segmented Frame (PsF) ist ein Videoformat, das Vollbildmaterial als Halbbilder speichert.

Jedes Vollbild wird dabei in zwei Halbbilder ohne Phasenverschub der einzelnen Zeilen innerhalb eines Halbbildes geteilt (segmentiert). So lassen sich aus den im Zeilensprungverfahren gesendeten Halbbildern durch Weaving die ursprünglichen Vollbilder vollständig und verlustfrei rekonstruieren, ohne dass eine Interpolation vorgenommen zu werden braucht oder der für das Zeilensprungverfahren typische Kammeffekt auftritt.
Source: https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_Segmented_Frame

[mzso]

Can I post this sample somewhere else for help of guys I know?

I played it with one of my VU+ses and it plays it perfectly.

Sure.

What's VU+ses?

[huhn]

that's not the point the deint algo doesn't know that.

and the encoder doesn't have to know that too.

[mzso]

yadif is not frame adaptive it's "inferior" to intel and nvidia deint and AMD was frame adaptive at one point too but up to this day the AMD driver claims to be frame adaptive while doing a simple bob or no deint at all


Up to which point did the AMD drivers had a decent deinterlacer?
So I guess this means that MadVR enables deinterlacing but it does nothing?

and well you can't use lav filter hardware deint with AMD. quicksnyc is intel only and cuvid is nvidia only. you don't need them anyway because the video renderer can access the hardware deint.
So I guess it was disabled at one point?

Any good directshow deinterlacing filters around? Either SW or HW?

[Klaus1189]

Thanks :)

defective plural of "VU+" :D

It is a manufacturer of Enigma2-Receivers .
I've set it to 1080p50/2160p50, so the TV only receives a progressive signal and all deinterlacing is done in VU+ box.

[Klaus1189]

Here is a 25 psF file straight from a Camcorder which I remember to be psf:
http://www.aktiv-verlag.com/~webvideos/testvideos/2010/sony/Sony_HDR_AX2000.MTS

MediaInfo will tell you Interlaced TFF, but it is 25p stored as 50i or 25i, whatever you like to call it.

[huhn]

@mzso
they break it with a driver update and then forget about it.
i know the "last" CCC version has frame adaptive deint. and i know the first new driver "experiences" crimson or what it's name was doesn't have it working. there are some crimson driver where it works too.

they break this stuff all the time and now is been broken for a long long time.

so yes you could get combing and yes you could get wobbling with AMD.

i'm not aware of a frame adaptive deint algo that matches hardware deint but this is considered as a good deint algo: https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=174544&highlight=qtgmc

[Ejziponken]

So assuming madVR won't get an update anytime soon to fix the latest Nvidia drivers and the new HDR API changes, what's the best option?
Because I play games on the same PC as Im watching movies, and I want to run the latest GRD drivers while still being able to watch 4k HDR movies.

Currently Im using MPC-BE + madVR beta + LAV

[mzso]

@mzso
they break it with a driver update and then forget about it.
i know the "last" CCC version has frame adaptive deint. and i know the first new driver "experiences" crimson or what it's name was doesn't have it working. there are some crimson driver where it works too.

they break this stuff all the time and now is been broken for a long long time.

so yes you could get combing and yes you could get wobbling with AMD.

i'm not aware of a frame adaptive deint algo that matches hardware deint but this is considered as a good deint algo: https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=174544&highlight=qtgmc

It would be nice is if I could get the latest that had decent deinterlacing (Maybe it would be worth a try.), but it would require a great amount of testing it seems.

[huhn]

i can't i don't have a polaris card i'm using terrible navi.

AMD has a better out of the box sync then nvidia and better control over the output signal then nvidia the "rest" like hardware decoder and processing are buggy slower or simply years behind nvidia.

i can only say avoid. i have a navi card for a year now and it was a not been funny i have seen to much... i mean my 240 hz freesync screen didn't work with it correct (still has issue) but it's flaw less with nvidia. nvidia has better freesync support then AMD.

[pistacho]

So assuming madVR won't get an update anytime soon to fix the latest Nvidia drivers and the new HDR API changes, what's the best option?
Because I play games on the same PC as Im watching movies, and I want to run the latest GRD drivers while still being able to watch 4k HDR movies.


You may be interested in trying Kodi v19 HDR

https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=355800

It works fine with the latest NVIDIA 451.77 studio drivers or GRD 451.xx (with default / clean install settings).

[littleD]

You may be interested in trying Kodi v19 HDR

https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=355800

It works fine with the latest NVIDIA 451.77 studio drivers or GRD 451.xx (with default / clean install settings).
Thanks for the info.
Player plays all demanding stuff on intel, so dxva is quite well optimized.
[PS. Nah, found some particular problems]

However it treats brightness differently to other players. Some samples looks like not so colourful when played in other players. On the other hand HDR videos are not completely pale, i think player tries to preserve most black/white tonal range upon saturated colours.
But im on internal laptop screen so, maybe will check more options available.

[Ejziponken]

You may be interested in trying Kodi v19 HDR

https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=355800

It works fine with the latest NVIDIA 451.77 studio drivers or GRD 451.xx (with default / clean install settings).

I really don't like the whole library thing kodi has going on. Its actually driving me nuts with all that crap built in. You have any other suggestions? I rather just have a stand alone media player like mpc or something..

[Klaus1189]

So assuming madVR won't get an update anytime soon to fix the latest Nvidia drivers and the new HDR API changes, what's the best option?
Because I play games on the same PC as Im watching movies, and I want to run the latest GRD drivers while still being able to watch 4k HDR movies.

Currently Im using MPC-BE + madVR beta + LAV

Set up a dedicated HTPC which uses last recommended driver regarding madVR. Don‘t need to be highend hardware. Just take a look at 3300X. Not expensive and should be enough.

Use a dedicated gaming PC for gaming and always use latest GRD.

[Magik Mark]

You may be interested in trying Kodi v19 HDR



https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=355800



It works fine with the latest NVIDIA 451.77 studio drivers or GRD 451.xx (with default / clean install settings).How's the video quality in kodi 19 compared to dsplayer with madvr?

Sent from my SM-G988B using Tapatalk

[pistacho]

For HDR passthrough it should be the SAME because a player should not alter the video data (in passthrough mode).

[el Filou]

I've seen strange interactions between video decoders and hardware deinterlacing. For example, for a long time after I bought my NVIDIA I thought the deinterlacing was inferior to my old Radeon (HD 4650) because it had really obvious artifacts with 576i, but I discovered by chance that it only happened with DXVA copyback. Using DXVA2 native, the artifacts are gone and deinterlacing is same quality as my previous very old Radeon.
So now I have to switch between DXVA2 native (when I want best deinterlacing quality), DXVA2 copyback (only for black bars detection), and D3D11 native (for best performance).
It's a bit of a pain really. Tahnk god I don't have an HDR TV yet or I would be pulling my hair out.So I guess this means that MadVR enables deinterlacing but it does nothing?At long time ago a SmartDVB user reported a bug with madVR where it didn't enable deinterlacing even though it was enabled in settings, even forced it didn't work (I tested and confirmed). Maybe it was you? Anyway maybe that bug still hasn't been fixed.For HDR passthrough it should be the SAME because a player should not alter the video data (in passthrough mode).It's only the HDR metadata that is passed through, the other parameters affecting picture quality (chroma upscaling, debanding and other image enhancements, internal processing and dithering, etc.) are still dependent on the renderer.

[chros]

So now I have to switch between DXVA2 native (when I want best deinterlacing quality), DXVA2 copyback (only for black bars detection), and D3D11 native (for best performance).
It's a bit of a pain really. Tahnk god I don't have an HDR TV yet

:D You don't need black bar detection with a TV if you can use d3d11 native. And stop watchong old DVDs and problem will be solved :D