Haali Renderer

[tekNerd]

Ya, the jagged image is still here too, but I was on impression that this is a hardware+driver issue. Was I wrong?

[KoD]

The jaggy edges usually happen when there are fast pans. Mostly visible on diagonal lines in the image (material like anime where there is a visible sharp distinction between objects is where this is easy to spot).

Visible with 640x480 or similar resolutions when resized to 1280xsomething and not with HD material. Fonts overlayed on top of the video by vsfilter are visibly blocky when such resizing is performed.

[tekNerd]

Using Haali Media Splitter with:

Haali renderer: big CPU load and this is the image sample with the jaggy stuff:
http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/388/010320071102tz4.th.jpg (http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/388/010320071102tz4.jpg)

VMR 9 rendereless renderer[use regular offscreen plain surfaces, Resizer: Nearest neighbor]: fair to big CPU load [spiking like hell] and image sample:
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6923/010320071104qm5.th.jpg (http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6923/010320071104qm5.jpg)

SPECS:

http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/2540/specsim7.jpg


If I am doing this tests all wrong please tell me and teach me. Thank u!

[Peuj]

SPECS:

http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/2540/specsim7.jpg


If I am doing this tests all wrong please tell me and teach me. Thank u!

well....

Originally Posted by Haali:
There is some incompatibility with gf5xxx, but I couldn't find any such card for testing so far.

...It seems it your case

[tekNerd]

Yes, you are right.
I read gf5xxx, but my mind just drove me to FX series and...the rest.
Oh well, too bad for me.
Anywho, thanks.

[Warpman]

There is some incompatibility with gf5xxx, but I couldn't find any such card for testing so far.
well not the perfect solution, just a suggestion....
could you make a build that uses the old long shader commands instead of multiple short ones? that worked with my 5900xt :(

because the bug appeared after you switched to that solution...

[Haali]

I've changed a few things that might fix the gf5xxx problem, please check http://haali.cs.msu.ru/mkv/mkx.I.4.exe

[Warpman]

great haali! it's fixed!
picture looks perfect!


some samll issues though... but not really importent... im glad my favorite renderer works again...
# one open file at the same time is allowed, else the second video returns a black image...
# a click on "Show osd" and then "apply" results in a memory access violation and mpc closes...


but on the other hand BEST sharpness ever, fast as hell on my 5900xt ^^
100x :thanks:

[tekNerd]

Yeesss! Works perfect!
:thanks: a bunch Haali, you are the best!

PS: Since I am here--Why the spliter is not recognizing the .hdmov? I mean, I can manually construct the graph, but in automated maner[render media file... from GraphEdit] it can't. If I rename the same file to .mov works perfect. Just wondering around, no pressure or anything.
One more time-- you are the best!

[Peuj]

# a click on "Show osd" and then "apply" results in a memory access violation and mpc closes...

I cannot reproduce the problem with OSD but I have a crash with MPC when a modify the sharpness level

AppName: mplayerc.exe AppVer: 6.4.9.0 ModName: dxr.dll
ModVer: 0.0.0.0 Offset: 000269a8


but on the other hand BEST sharpness ever, fast as hell on my 5900xt ^^
100x :thanks:

Well good news for you, for my part I still don't see the difference between sharpness 0 and -1. :(

but thanks anyway @ Haalli for the work.

[sidding]

man, i registered a nick here but forgot to post about this delay problem for 3 months, wonder if you guys still have it.

anyway, my ht 3.0 p4 got the same freezing problem when you open a new video or something like that too. i traced the problem back to my HAL and maybe kernel too.

i was fooling around at that moment and replaced my ACPI multiprocessors HAL with a MPS HAL and the freezing appears. if your HAL is not MPS then it's probably not what i'm talking about.

if you want to check your HAL, open device manager, the type of your HAL is under Computer. maybe the os kernel has something to do with it but that's probably not the case.

last words: please don't play with your HAL (hardware abstraction layer), it's dangerous and you can end up trashing your windows.

[anonymez]

New release (http://haali.cs.msu.ru/mkv/):

07/03/2007

* New Features:
o Improved gdsmux.
o Added support for S_TEXT/ASCII subtitles to the DS muxer filter.
o Added support for H.264 in MPEG-PS.
o Improved support for DD+ in MPEG-PS.
o Added a bitrate graph to the renderer OSD (only active when the splitter is used as source).
o Added some support for PCM an ulaw audio in qt files.
o Added automatic linking of VOB files.
* Fixed items:
o Renderer: eliminated an incompatibility with geforce 5 hardware.
o Renderer: fixed a distroted picture with some VfW codecs.
o Fixed a problem with seeking in MPEG-PS/TS.


:thanks:

[SBeaver]

I have some issues with this.
hd dvd is being scaled down to 960x540, how do I change that?

Also, when I increase the buffer I lose video and have to put it back to 32megs to get it back.

[foxyshadis]

You're not the only one with the problem: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=123048

[SBeaver]

You're not the only one with the problem: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=123048

other renderers seem to be ok though, I think my problem is only with this renderer.

edit: or maybe they downscale and then upscale to fool me. I can't tell.
I can't see what else than haali could be responsible for my downscaling, I've tried both ffdshows decoder for vc1 and wmv DMO decoder and they both report that they give away a 1920x1080 size to the renderer and the haali renderer says its input is 1920x1080 and that it downscales.
Is this Vista playing tricks on me?

[foxyshadis]

Haali always rescales to fit your screen. If your input is the right size, you'll get it scaled from the original. Haali's renderer will never downscale and then upscale from that, a lot of people just get freaked out by the fact that it's smaller than full screen when they open it.

[Ghim]

I've been using Haali Renderer for some time now and I am very happy with the quality of the rendering and the processing time.

However, I have a small issue which stops me from using it all the time:

- I am using Haali Renderer with Zoom Player 5. When I watch a video in full screen, I sometimes use the zoom function of ZP to remove the black borders on the left and on the right of the videos which are sometimes present on DVDs. However, as soon as I try to zoom in (video window larger than screen), the renderer doesn't show anything anymore (black picture). As soon as I go back to a video display resolution smaller than my screen resolution, the video re-appears.

Here is my display configuration: Windows XP SP2, Geforce 6800GT, 1920x1200 resolution.

Also, I have an other quick request to make. It would be good to have a button in the configuration dialog to reset the settings to the default values.

[Haali]

- I am using Haali Renderer with Zoom Player 5. When I watch a video in full screen, I sometimes use the zoom function of ZP to remove the black borders on the left and on the right of the videos which are sometimes present on DVDs. However, as soon as I try to zoom in (video window larger than screen), the renderer doesn't show anything anymore (black picture). As soon as I go back to a video display resolution smaller than my screen resolution, the video re-appears.

This will be fixed in the next release.

[3ngel]

In this last version i have to say, that the things go good.
The critical freeze bug has been gladly corrected.
But... what does it cost to you to fix the HuffyYUV black screen bug? :( (what a pity the :cry: smile is not present)

[Ghim]

This will be fixed in the next release.

This is very good news !
This renderer is getting better and better ;-)

[hdboy]

well, just want to say a big THANKS to Haali for the renderer (using the one that comes with 07/03/07 splitter.

my setup: gigabyte 7600GT forceware 93.81, AMD X2 3800+ @2.5ghz, MPC celtic_druid latest build, 21" LCD PC monitor primary, philips plasma 1366x768 secondary, dualview, winXP SP2

I struggled a long time to get MPC to work with VMR9, but playback is never quite smooth. I can use overlay, but certain things don't work. In particular, some filters just don't want to output to 2nd monitor with overlay. So I keep switching renderer depending on what I'm playing.

Now with Haali, it's all good. Handles everything I throw at it -- ripped EVO and m2ts, 1080i mpeg2 ts, 1080p quicktime h264 trailer. Playback is as smooth as overlay, and no real difference in CPU usage. I haven't noticed the jaggies others talk about; I'll try to stare at it more closely.

Only bug so far I've found is when I set MPC to change res when going full screen, it freezes when I switches to full screeen (okay with overlay and vmr9). And I don't see any difference with sharpness 0 or -1 (is -1 sharpest or 0 sharpest?)

My requests: have the "show OSD" box be sticky so it doesn't have to be set each time (good for testing). also, have some kind of version # in the renderer dialog.

again, a big thanks. Oh, and the latest splitter is great for HD too :)

[foxyshadis]

It doesn't actually sharpen, it only performs softer or sharper resizing. Since it seems your video is mainly as larger or larger than your screen resolution, you won't really be affected by the sharpness parameter. (Downsize modes are barely differentiable.) When upsizing DVD or smaller you'd see it right away.

[sundansx]

I am using Zoomplayer 5 with the newest Nvidia Decoder and the Haali Video Renderer (HVR 1.7.100.18).
Details:
AMD X2 4200
Nvidia 7800GT video card
2Gig memory
Nvidia Video Drv 93.71
NVidia 223 Decoder (HW accel, Automatic DELCont, Best Available DIL mode, 1 tick on edge sharp, adp pix del on)
Zoomplayer 5
Bad movies showing this problem: A scanner darkly, Alien Vs. Predator

When playing a DVD to HVR in this setup, and moving back to the main menu of the DVD. There is no video displayed. When I select root menu again, it is displayed. Tried this on my HTPC (6600GT with Purvideo decoder v185, Zoom4) with older drivers...same thing. Tried both computers with overlay and VRM9..no problems.
I also noticed some intermittant zoom crashes (really a freeze), while playing DVDs, but I will consider that a seperate problem that needs more investigation to quantify it.
For S&G I tried the 7800GT setup with intervideo and powerdvd decoders and it doesn't seem to have a problem with HVR.

Have others run into this? Is the cause of this known?
thanks for any help, and thanks to Haali for your generous contributions. Great work.

[aydc]

Feature Request: Brightness, Gamma and Saturation controls. Shouldn't be too hard to add, and it's absolutely needed since Haali Renderer disables VMR color controls found in most players.

[Haali]

Btw, if you force AA in your drivers, the renderer can fail to work properly, so don't do that and force AA only in specific apps that don't support the setting.

[Keepitsimple]

haali how about adding the option of using different resizers :).

what does the sharpening 0-1 do? As I understand you use bicubic resizing at the moment. How do you make bicubic sharpen in so many steps?

[aydc]

After a quick comparison of ffdshow's resizing with lanzcos method to Haali's resizing (I don't know what method it uses), I can see that lanzcos is a bit sharper by default. If you select maximum sharpness with ffdshow lanzcos, it is much much much sharper than Haali Renderer's maximum sharpness.

So much sharpness isn't good for low and middle quality DivX movies, so Haali's maximum is good enough there. In high quality DVD's however, maximum sharpness resizing with Lanzcos gives an incredible image quality that looks very close to HD movies. So I use ffdshow resizing + VMR9 with DVDs, and Haali for everything else.

[Egh]

After a quick comparison of ffdshow's resizing with lanzcos method to Haali's resizing (I don't know what method it uses), I can see that lanzcos is a bit sharper by default. If you select maximum sharpness with ffdshow lanzcos, it is much much much sharper than Haali Renderer's maximum sharpness.

So much sharpness isn't good for low and middle quality DivX movies, so Haali's maximum is good enough there. In high quality DVD's however, maximum sharpness resizing with Lanzcos gives an incredible image quality that looks very close to HD movies. So I use ffdshow resizing + VMR9 with DVDs, and Haali for everything else.

Haali renderer uses Bicubic resizing, which is by default in ffdshow is much blurier than Lanczos. Also take note that Lanczos can use different number of taps, which affects it's quality (and artefacts). Bicubic in theory can be done very sharp (and very bad in quality :)). Note that Haali uses one combined parameter (A), similar to vdub implementation, whilst e.g. AVS version uses both vars a and b, so you can easily oversharpen in avs using bicubic rezisor (it is recommended that 2*a+b=1, else you over- or under- sharpen video, with with equation >1 or <1 respectively).

[dumbuser]

I tried the newest Haali splitter today (7/3/2007 version 1.7.100.18). I find that the seeking issue in MPEG TS is still unresolved. Seeking within a standard MPEG 2 format leaves the audio way in front of the video. As long as you don't seek the sinc between audio and video is normal.

I also tried h.264 in a MPEG TS container using x264 and still don't have recognition of these files (the Haali splitter for TS shows no video pin output). The audio (ac3) is normal.

Graph Edit and WMP 11 was used for the tests. Not my favorite players :) but allows realistic results. The decoders on my system are CoreAVC 1.1.0.5 and WinDVD 7.

MPC (using Gabest's internal TS splitter) continues to play these files properly.

[3ngel]

I have to signal another bug.
With latest version Mkv + x264 + audio + subtitles, MPC after opening the .mkv freezes.
What does it happen?
Using vsfilter for subtitles.

[Unearthly]

Hello. First I'd like to say that I really like Haali's renderer so far. The resizing is very good and the IQ overall looks better than what I usually use (VMR9).

However, I have encountered a bug and I wondered if anyone else has any idea as to it (I searched this thread but was unable to find anything).

When I do a resize using either FFDShow filter Resize or using the AVISynth filter and using one (I used Lanczos), Haali zooms in on the picture rather than resize. It seems that it is only rendering the original amount of pixels rather than increasing the render size. So if I resize something from 640x480 to 1280x960 I see 640x480 of the new 1280x960 image. This happens whether the resize is default when loaded or changed during playback.

It does, however, work if I put the avisynth filters into a avs script and then load that with MPC. However, that is less convenient than using FFDShow as I need to rewrite the script for every video I want to watch.

Anyone have any ideas behind this behavior?

[roflrofl]

Hoping someone can help me with this bug I'm experiencing..

My setup:

Amd X2 4200
1gb DDR
7900gs 256

Dual Display : 19" CRT and 32" LG 32LC2DB HDTV

MPC
Nvidia Purevideo
CoreAVC
Haali's Renderer
FFDshow

Basically when watching HD .TS files with Haali's renderer and any decoder, eg ffdshow or purevideo..when I try to watch them on my LCD tv the "jitter" in MPC shoots up and keeps going until the audio and video is horribly out of sync..the annoying thing is that if I watch them on my CRT monitor with the same codecs and settings the sync is fine.

Anyone else have this bug?

[3ngel]

Basically when watching HD .TS [....] the audio and video is horribly out of sync
Same here and already signalled. Sometime it shows up even in DVD with BOB deinterlacing.

EDIT:
@Haali
Even if i'm always critic i think you're doing a good job :)

[Seb.26]

Hi world ! :)

I have saw a strange thing yesterday : I've got a video file ( .IFO ) that everytime I try to play it, the max frames number is blocked to 4 ( the minimum ) ... if I change it, and them re-open the HR properties page, it's back to 4 ... but all other files are OK ( I use 50 as setting ) ...

:confused: :confused: :confused:

Is this a known bug ?! ...

[Haali]

In DVD graphs queue size is limited to the minimum, otherwise interactive menus are impossible to use.

[roflrofl]

Haali,

Is there any way of fixing the bug where the audio will gradually lose sync with the video on .TS files

[Haali]

A/V sync does not really depend on the renderer. In DShow framework A/V sync is achieved by using Presentation TimeStamps (PTS) that are attached to each frame. When the renderer receives a frame, it calls a DShow supplied function to wait until the frame PTS occurs, and then displays the frame. These PTS are produced by the splitter filter, and are possibly augmented by decoder filters, so if A/V sync is wrong, then it is caused by wrong PTS in most cases (In other cases the renderer simply can't keep up and lags behind real time). If you have a sample that reliably reproduces improper A/V sync, please send it to me, I'll try to figure what's wrong with it.

[Vepar]

I discovered very strange thing.

Playing any movie with mpc+ffdshow+haali_r frozes my entire PC. It is not BSOD or restart just everything freezes after random play time. This only happens with haali renderer while vmr7/9 works just fine.

The most strange thing is that it worked fine on my previous machine which was athlon 2600 + gf 660gt agp while the new system have athlon64 x2 3800 + gf 7600gt pci-e.


any ideas anyone? :confused:

[MatMaul]

your renderer seems to do not support AR changing in a middle of a stream.
I join a TS capture (http://www.etud.insa-toulouse.fr/~mvelten/test.ts) where you can see the problem.

[anonova]

Is there a way to get the Haali Renderer to work with video acceleration with the PureVideo decoder?
In VMR9, PureVideo states this.
Decoder Format
DirectX VA mode A (idct)
Video mixing (DirectX 9)
With the Haali Renderer it states this.
Decoder Format
Software Mode YUY2
Undefined Renderer
Would this also be the cause of MPC crashing when I try to load a single vob by itself using the Haali Renderer?

[KoD]

MPC hangs for me too on opening a file if I choose Halli's video renderer. Amazingly, the behavior is like follows:
- first file opens fine
- second file, if it uses haali's splitter (is a mkv or ogm), the player hangs on opening; if the file is an avi file (haali's splitter is not enabled to handle avi files), the player doesn't hang on opening
This has happened for the last two or three versions, I believe.

ZoomPlayer doesn't have this issue, so I don't know if Haali's filters are to blame on this one.

[CiNcH]

I have also tried to enable DXVA for Elecard and nVIDIA. It did not work. Does DXVA require special support by the renderer?

[Seb.26]

In DVD graphs queue size is limited to the minimum, otherwise interactive menus are impossible to use.
Ok, but how does the render known it's interactive menu ?

... I have take one of my DVD, copy the main title to my HD with DVDFabDecrypter ... then when playing VIDEO_TS.IFO the maxFrame is 4, but when openning the VTS_0x.IFO, the maxFrame is OK ...

And the VIDEO_TS.IFO doesn't contain anything exept a link to the VTS_0x.IFO ...

So, is the maxFrame limit is activated by checking a flag ?

[Haali]

No, DXVA is not supported, you need to use VMR9 for that, because VMR9 _is_ the official MS API for using DXVA.

[Haali]

Graphs are treated as DVD when there is a DVD Navigator filter in them.

[Seb.26]

Graphs are treated as DVD when there is a DVD Navigator filter in them.
Ok, thanks :) ...
... I will try to understand why the navigator came in my graph ... :confused:

[CiNcH]

No, DXVA is not supported, you need to use VMR9 for that, because VMR9 _is_ the official MS API for using DXVA.

Thanks Haali for answering. Hope you allow me another question concerning your renderer...

Deinterlacing seems to be pretty good, pretty much looks like a motion adaptive algorithm. Did you program this pixelshader yourself?

[Haali]

It's a simple algorithm that chooses between weave and interpolation based on a motion threshold. Nothing advanced there.

[aydc]

W00t!!
New version on http://haali.cs.msu.ru/mkv/

28/03/2007

* New Features:
o The installer now shows a warning if you try to overwrite a newer version of the splitter.
o Added support for TRACKSETEX tags, they work much like TRACKSET ones below, with one addition: first word in the tag's value specifies the edition ID that is linked to this trackset. If that edition is activated from the UI, the trackset is also activated.
o Track numbers instead of track IDs can be specified in TRACKSET(EX) tags by using #num syntax.
o Added support for 'h264' fourcc to the muxer.
o The splitter will now register m2ts and evo extensions when MPEG TS/PS support is enabled.
* Fixed Items:
o Some code rearrangement in the renderer that allows it to work on Intel GMA950 graphics devices (onboard graphics commonly found in laptops). Also it might reduce tearing on some other chipsets (Intel driver doesn't like to be called from multiple threads, it's possible that there are more drivers like that).
o The splitter no longer removes extra H.264 SPS and PPS NALUs from the stream, since there are transport streams where SPS and PPS do change in the middle of a stream.

[Kaonashi]

Something weird has been happening to me. I'm using the latest Haali (28/03/2007) and when I select it in MPC to be the Output, the high-resolution files I have get resized.

Example: an XviD encoded file, in the Matroska container gets resized from 1280 x 720 to 640 x 360.

Is there any option in MPC or in Haali that I can use to disable this?