Subtitle Edit

[Emulgator]

Is there some way I can bind a single keyboard key -- any key -- to run it via the following...
AutoHotKey (here an example for IrfanView Thumbnails Autoload if navigating focus through folders)
SetTitleMatchMode, 2
#IfWinActive IrfanView Thumbnails
SetKeyDelay, 0, 0
Down::
Send {Down}
Send {Alt}
Send o
Send u
return
Up::
Send {Up}
Send {Alt}
Send o
Send u
return

[markfilipak]

AutoHotKey...

You are a prince! I don't mean to disappoint you, but I don't need it now. You see, in the trial of my custom Edit profile (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=2012093#post2012093), I had to run Beautify about 700 times. But now that I've gained confidence in my custom Edit profile I'm only running Beautify twice, at the beginning and at the end of a session, I don't need a hot key for something I only run twice. Thank you, though. You are a prince.

[markfilipak]

This would be a real time saver. Instead of moving sub1's out-cue and then sub2's in-cue, move them both, simultaneously.

Click sub1's out-cue and drag it to the right and it will eventually hit sub2's in-cue. When it does, drag them both!

Click sub2's in-cue and drag it to the left and it will eventually hit sub1's out-cue. When it does, drag them both!

Reversing direction during the drag drops the 'carried' cue where it is, but continues to drag the clicked cue, but in the new direction. That opens a gap between them.

[markfilipak]

[_<_Previous_] [_Play_current_] and [_Next_>_] play about 100ms past their actual out-cues. That's unwanted behavior. Is there a way to stop it? I couldn't find a setting.

[markfilipak]

# signifies what appears to be a hex digit.
################-1.wav is a particular SE waveform file. SE _does_not_ reload it, so the prior waveforms _do_not_ appear.
If I rename it to
################-0.wav, SE _does_ reload it, so the prior waveforms _do_ appear.

This appears to be yet another off-by-one problem. I'm running SE 4.0.8 because I had too many problems with 4.0.9.

[markfilipak]

Nikse, If you're going to grant focus to the List area on mouse-over, I suggest you remove its focus on mouse-out. When I try to delete a searched item in the Text box, SE wants to delete the current List subtitle, instead.

Currently (4.0.8) both show focus (by highlighted text), but only the List actually has the focus, not the Text box, which is where the mouse cursor is.

[Emulgator]

The suffix -0, -1, -2... is the audio track index.
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=185943
(I have extended that post for the legacy case of non-suffixed waveforms)
If there is only one track (the first one), one should give index -0, pointing to -1 under these circumstances would be invalid.
My findings: The older than January 2023 files in my \Waveforms folder have no track index appended.
Within January 2023 I have both, track index and none; and the later ones have track index appended.
(Since I work from different SE versions and merge results there is no sharp border found)
Conclusion: SE versions before ~January 2023 seem to work on the first found audio stream, so do not append/respect any track index.
The later SE versions which can load more than one audio track would need to append/respect that track index.

[markfilipak]

The suffix -0, -1, -2... is the audio track index. ...
Thanks.

Track 0 was Dolby Digital stereo. Track 1 was DTS-HDMA 7.1, FC channel. This was yesterday, not 2023.

I suggest that Nikse save the wav as ################.wav and rely on the user remembering which index he/she extracted. Actually, the index is not important. Don't be anal compulsive.

[markfilipak]

... The later SE versions which can load more than one audio track would need to append/respect that track index.
Really?! How does one load more than one audio track (index, actually)? Why would one do that?

[markfilipak]

This has happened twice today. The MPV panel shows play-pause as paused and ready to play, while at the same time, the waveform panel shows play-pause as playing and ready to pause. The video will not play, no matter what I click. This appears to happen if I generate wavs _before_ beutification.

From experience, I do know that generating wavs _after_ beutification often malfunctions: The first attempt to generate wavs closes with no action.-- it has to be done a second time.

[markfilipak]

Operating these controls:
[_<_Previous_] [_Play_current_] [_Next_>_]
automatically moves the focus to the Text box. If I then move the mouse pointer to the wavs and press [_space_]...
What should happen: video play resumes
What does happen: the current subtitle text is replaced by a space.

These settings:
[x] Set focus on mouse enter
[x] Also set list view focus on mouse enter in list view
have no effect on this fault.

Workaround: click on the wav before pressing [_space_].

Verions 4.0.8.

[markfilipak]

I have a suggestion how to speed up these controls.
[_<_Previous_] [_Play_current_] [_Next_>_]
[____Pause_____]

1 - Change [_Play_current_]
to [_Play_/_Pause_]
Behavior:
While playing, [_Play_/_Pause_] immediately pauses.
While paused, [_Play_/_Pause_] re-initializes repeat, but resumes playing at the point it left off.
When the end of the text is reached, it automatically resumes with the next repeat, if any.

2 - Remove [____Pause_____]
It is no longer needed.

That way, I could watch the Waveform and pause at a particular point without having to move my mouse to hit the lower button -- I'm not very good at that. Bonus: It would be great if I could 'split' exactly at that pause-point.

[markfilipak]

Alt+V : Jumps the waveform to the previous subtitle and runs it.
Alt+N : Jumps the waveform to the next subtitle and runs it.
They are not listed in 'Settings', 'Shortcuts'.

Can I change Alt+v to Control+Left?
Can I change Alt+N to Control+Right?

How?

Thanks!

[markfilipak]

Before beautification: 00:40:11.242..00:40:12.744 <-- CORRECT

After beautification: 00:40:11.242..00:40:11.326 <-- CORRUPT

All three times are on frames.

The preceding out-cue is at 00:40:09.240.

The next in-cue is at 00:40:13.411

I have no idea how to proceed investigating the cause. I need help with that.

--Mark.
Notation: File is '3-61 A Matter of Perspective.srt', which will be retained for future inspection. The fault is hard -- it survives restarting SE.

==EDIT==
To detect the corrupted subtitle, run "Apply duration limits" with these settings [note]:

[X] Min. duration, milliseconds [__100_]
[_] Max. duration, milliseconds [_8000_]

The result:
Apply Line# Before After
[X] 637 40:11,242 --> 40:11,326 - 0,083 40:11,242 --> 40:11,342 - 0,100

Manually fix any durations that have been corrupted -- you cannot use beautify to do that.

[note] My beautify settings set gaps to 2 frames (i.e., 83 milliseconds). Different beautify settings may result in different bad durations -- I have not tested to see whether that's true.

==AFTER NOTE==
In about 100 videos, I found 3 or 4 that had similarly corrupted end out-cues. In all of them, beautify had set the out-cues to the in-cues so that the subtitles had zero duration.

[VoodooFX]

Report that at GitHub, with the files to reproduce the issues.

[markfilipak]

Report that at GitHub, with the files to reproduce the issues.

Thank you,

Report which? My latest posting?

The facts: What I posted is the only difference in the SRTs. And, any further analysis is not possible without the video source. The video source is 2.7 GB. Plus, the source is copyrighted and cannot legally be distributed.

Perhaps there is a private way to handle this fault, eh?

[Yosho]

New update, 4.0.11 broke spacebar playing video for anyone else?
I changed play/pause in settings as well from Control+P to space only, and it is still broken for me.
I tried uninstalling, reinstalling. Didn't work. Uninstalled, restarted, reinstalled, restarted, still broken.
Uninstalled, then reinstalled 4.0.10 and can confirm it works on that version. For now, 11 is broken it seems like.

[markfilipak]

UPDATE

I previously reported that the beautifier is driving some durations to zero. It's more complicated than that.

The beautifier is deducting exactly 2 seconds from the durations of random subtitles -- at least, the victims seem random. If the duration is less than 2 seconds, the result is zero duration.

Only end times (out-cues) are affected. Start times (in-cues) are not affected.

I have no more information at this time.

[VoodooFX]

New update, 4.0.11 broke spacebar playing video for anyone else?

https://github.com/SubtitleEdit/subtitleedit/issues/9289

[Yosho]

https://github.com/SubtitleEdit/subtitleedit/issues/9289

Thanks! Hope it gets fixed sooner than later.
I'm not wise of Github lingo so maybe I'm imagining things, but it seems like the creator said that they can't replicate the issue.

[markfilipak]

New update, 4.0.11 broke spacebar playing video for anyone else?

Howdy. I just updated to 4.0.11. Spacebar works much better -- the text of the sub doesn't get wiped out, now.

Focus seems to have been fixed so that spacebar affects only the waveform panel. Thanks to whomever fixed it. Appreciated.

[markfilipak]

I need to see shot changes, but I don't want to snap to them. Snapping to frames is all I want -- simply seeing where the shot changes are is sufficient and allows me more freedom to move in- and out-cues to where I want them.

Is there a setting to disable snap to shot changes?

Right now, if I do not select 'Snap cues to shot changes', then shot change detection is not allowed to run and they are not shown. Alternatively, if I do select 'Snap cues to shot changes' so that shot change detection is run, then snap to shot changes is always active, even when I deselect 'Snap cues to shot changes' later.

[markfilipak]

If I click-drag a cue back and forth without releasing the click, When I do release the click and undo, I expect the cue to go back to its original place, immediately, but it doesn't. Instead, it takes several undo operations. Each of the several undo operations does moves to various places between the back-and-forth limits. This makes no sense at all.

Is this the way SE is supposed to work?

[markfilipak]

Snap to shot change is driving me crazy. How can I turn it off?

UPDATE:
Now, deselecting 'Snap to shot changes' is turning it off. That appears to be new behavior since I've tried that before and it didn't work. I'll do more experimenting and report back.

THOUGHTS:
It appears I have to have 'Snap to shot changes' selected in the first beautify. Otherwise, I cannot obtain visible shot-change points at all. Thereafter, I have to have 'Snap to shot changes' deselected. Is that the way SE is supposed to work?

UPDATE:
I revise about 2.5, 45-minute TV shows per day. In the latest, this morning, I ran 'Extract time codes', then turned 'Snap to shot changes' on, then ran 'Generate / import shot changes...', then turned 'Snap to shot changes' off, then clicked 'OK'. Turning 'Snap to shot changes' off before the first 'OK' seems to have no effect. Cues snap to shot changes and only to shot changes without regard to whether 'Snap to shot changes' is on or off and without regard to whether 'Snap to shot changes' is turned off before the first 'OK'. What I would prefer is that cues snap to frames, always, and never snap to shot changes -- that shot changes are shown but are treated like any other frame. Apparently, 'Snap to shot changes' is always on regardless of selection, and that 'Snap to shot changes' is, instead, a control that merely enables the 'Generate / import shot changes...' button. That behavior seems illogical to me. Certainly, 'Snap to shot changes' does not function as implied by its name because, once shot changes have been captured, the setting of 'Snap to shot changes' is ignored.

[markfilipak]

The waveform panel is wasting half it's vertical resolution.

Soft audio makes finding words more difficult than it needs to be.

NOW:

| |
||| || |||
||||| ||||| |||||
||||A|||||||B|||||||||C|||||||||||||||
||||| ||||| |||||
||| || |||
| |


BETTER:

| |
|| | |||
||| || |||
|||| |||| |||||
||||| ||||| |||||
|||||||||||||||| ||||||||| |||
||||A|||||||B|||||||||C||||||||||D||||

They have the same vertical height, but the bottom display with its higher resolution reveals that there's a 'D' utterance. That 'D' utterance is sorely needed to place cues during soft passages.

BEST:

There is another way that actually saves vertical space and would make the panel layout better -- more space for the video playback panel for example: Show volume by color or intensity instead of by height. That way the same information takes less vertical space, a thinner panel -- a single, intensity-modulated line could show all the information that is currently taking much vertical space. I can't show that with text, but use your imagination, eh?

[markfilipak]

These are the standard game controls. They work well in SE for navigating waveforms. ASDWX could be a 'canned' setup option.


+---+
| W |
+---+
+---+ +---+ +---+
| A | | S | | D |
+---+ +---+ +---+
+---+
| X |
+---+

SE_Shortcuts.xml

<GeneralGoToPreviousSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>A</GeneralGoToPreviousSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>
<MainVideoPlaySelectedLines>S</MainVideoPlaySelectedLines>
<GeneralGoToNextSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>D</GeneralGoToNextSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>
<WaveformGoToPreviousShotChange>W</WaveformGoToPreviousShotChange>
<WaveformGoToNextShotChange>X</WaveformGoToNextShotChange>


I want to use 'S' as a play-pause toggle. Any ideas how I can do that?

REVISION:
Actually, I'd prefer to make 'S' a 'drive' key: press to play, release to pause.

UPDATE:
I just added 'S' to the SE_Shortcuts.xml shown above -- it was formerly F5, I think. It is not a 'drive' key and is not what I want, but it's the best I know how to configure for now. So, all five keys function. Try it out, folks, and let me know what you think.

MORE:
Here's how an 'S' 'drive' key would work: Pressing and holding 'S' would play the current line. When 'S' is released, play is paused. If 'S' is pressed and held again, play resumes where it was paused (rather than looping back to the beginning of the current line). If the end of the current line is encountered, then play loops back to the beginning of the current line. While 'S' is held, the current line plays over and over, until 'S' is released.

CONTINUED UPDATE:
I've used ASDWX keyboard keys now for several sessions. They work great. Editing is much faster and easier. The [_<_Previous_] [_Play_current_] [_Next_>_] and [_Pause_] functions are no longer needed, so I've removed all the functions in the south-west section of Layout #1 -- the waveform display now stretches across the entire lower panel, a welcome bonus. Bogus focus during searches has complicated things a bit, but I've compensated by always double-clicking on the found line in the north-west panel prior to clicking any of ASDWX. Double-clicking on the found line puts the focus in the waveform panel so that ASDWX works as expected. Without the double-click, the ASDWX keys go into the text box, which of course is not desired.

[markfilipak]

The waveform panel has a blue line that separates the past, on the left, from the future, on the right. Time flows left-to-right, so most work is done to the right of the blue line as unedited texts scroll in.

Currently, the blue line divides the waveform 50-50%. The left (past) part is not much use. It would be helpful if the waveform was split 25-75% or perhaps 10-90%.

[markfilipak]

This keyboard mapping also works great and is better for touch typists.

+---+
| R |
+---+
+---+ +---+ +---+
| S | | D | | F |
+---+ +---+ +---+
+---+
| V |
+---+

<GeneralGoToPreviousSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>S</GeneralGoToPreviousSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>
<MainVideoPlaySelectedLines>D</MainVideoPlaySelectedLines>
<GeneralGoToNextSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>F</GeneralGoToNextSubtitleAndFocusWaveform>
<WaveformGoToPreviousShotChange>R</WaveformGoToPreviousShotChange>
<WaveformGoToNextShotChange>V</WaveformGoToNextShotChange>

[markfilipak]

MPV has a volume overdrive step function: Keyboard '0' -- the stepdown is keyboard '9'. It can go up to 130%. It's needed to easily hear in soft passages. Could that be implemented in the MPV panel in SE?

UPDATE: I discovered that SE has 'Settings' > 'Video player' > 'Allow volume boost". I tried it. Now, SE sporadically turns the whole Windows volume down, usually to zero, at random times. So, I turned it off. Now, SE still sporadically turns the whole Windows volume down, usually to zero, at random times.

Oh, dear.

[markfilipak]

I have a suggestion for speeding cue placement in the waveform panel.

Add a branch to GeneralGoToNextSubtitleAndFocusWaveform, which is currently unconditional, so that, if the current subtitle's cue has been moved, then instead of GoToNextSubtitle, it keeps the focus on the current subtitle and refreshes the waveform panel. Otherwise, if the current subtitle's cue has not been moved, then it goes ahead to the next subtitle as usual.

This would force a redraw of the current subtitle to confirm that the cue was moved to where the user wanted it. Otherwise, the user has to advance to the next subtitle and then go back to the subtitle of interest to get a redraw of it. That takes more time. Based on my experience, I estimate that would double the speed of cue-move operations.

[markfilipak]

When the mouse cursor is in the waveform panel and I click-drag to form a new subtitle, there's no good way to make the new subtitle "real".

I'm forced to right-click and select "Add text here". But that, unfortunately, automatically moves the focus to the textbox.

GOOD:
Please, either add a "Leave blank" selection, or don't move the focus and leave it up to users to click in the textbox to move the focus there to add text.

BETTER:
Click-drag, then click within the new subtitle = create and leave blank and focus on waveform.
Click-drag, then click textbox = create and focus on textbox.

The above requires one click: In the waveform, or in the textbox.
The current method requires two clicks (one to bring up the context menu plus one to select "Add text here").

[AYColumbia]

I posted this on the GitHub repo under discussions but thought I'd ask here too. I just started using SE to pull the forced subs out of SUP files into their own SUP file. At first it looked like it was working using this CLI command:
SubtitleEdit.exe /convert "D:\Media\full_eng.sup" Blu-raysup /forcedonly /outputfilename:"D:\Media\forced_eng.sup"

The result was low quality after I checked it (even when using the resolution switch with 1920x1080) and when I looked at the processing, SE was actually using OCR rather than just copying to the output. Can SE, currently, copy lines when source and target are the same format, e.g., SUP to SUP?

[Emulgator]

SUP to SUP ? Demux using tsMuxeR or DGDemux.

[markfilipak]

It would be very helpful if the focus was moved to a span in the waveform panel by simply clicking (once) on the span.

PS: What I'm trying to do with all these suggestions is to make working in the waveform panel more like playing a guitar -- fast, easy.

PPS: SE is two machines, joined. There's the text edit machine, and the waveform edit machine. They are 'joined' by a ragged collection of focus operations that don't have clear methods -- focus is a bit of a tangle.

[markfilipak]

More vertical space means a larger MPV panel. I think everyone would welcome that.
https://forum.doom9.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18863&stc=1&d=1739852212
OTHER BENEFITS:
-Tick marks are always visible, they cannot be obscured by cue lines or the blue line.
-Waveform has twice the height, twice the resolution, so soft speech is easier to see.
-Horizontal lines forming squares with the vertical lines serve no function -- remove them.
-The status line shows only subtitle number (e.g., "166"), but that is redundant -- remove it.

[markfilipak]

... The result was low quality ...

Hey AYColumbia. What is the current frame size of D:\Media\full_eng.sup? Are you trying to rescale?

[AYColumbia]

Hey AYColumbia. What is the current frame size of D:\Media\full_eng.sup? Are you trying to rescale?
It's from an HD blu-ray source so it should be 1920x1080.

[AYColumbia]

SUP to SUP ? Demux using tsMuxeR or DGDemux.
I'll take a look and see if these can pull the forced subs via CLI. I use txmuxer for certain processes via CLI but didn't think it can pull just the forced. Thanks.

[markfilipak]

I'll take a look and see if these can pull the forced subs via CLI. I use txmuxer for certain processes via CLI but didn't think it can pull just the forced. Thanks.

I'm confused. You say "forced subs". Burned in? But how can that be? -- because you say the input is a SUP file. A SUP file should be just a stream of subtitle images. That can't have burned in subs, can it?

[light bulb] Run
ffmpeg -i D:\Media\full_eng.sup
That will list the streams. Paste the list here.
PS: You can use MediaInfo to list the streams if you prefer.

[markfilipak]

It's from an HD blu-ray source so it should be 1920x1080.

I don't work with SUP, or with PGSSUB (which is what's on Blu-ray) but my understanding is that the subtitle images are not full, but only cover part of the video frame.

[von Suppé]

I'm confused. You say "forced subs". Burned in? But how can that be? -- because you say the input is a SUP file. A SUP file should be just a stream of subtitle images. That can't have burned in subs, can it?

Forced subtitles can be authored in different ways on BD. It's possible that within one PGS stream some subtitles are flagged as forced. Or there is a separate subtitle stream that is authored as forced. Depending on player's settings and/or chosen disc-menu options the player will be dictated to show which forced subs or none.

I don't work with SUP, or with PGSSUB (which is what's on Blu-ray) but my understanding is that the subtitle images are not full, but only cover part of the video frame.

Depends how the images were created. Not common, but full screen SUP is theoretically possible. The whole video resolution is then used as transparent background.

[markfilipak]

Forced subtitles can be authored in different ways on BD. It's possible that within one PGS stream some subtitles are flagged as forced. Or there is a separate subtitle stream that is authored as forced. Depending on player's settings and/or chosen disc-menu options the player will be dictated to show which forced subs or none.

Ah, yes, "forced", not "burned-in". Forced are generally used for mandatory translations. My mistake. A whole video of forced subtitles? Really? Every subtitle is forced? But, who cares about that? Does that have any relevance to AYColumbia's issue? I think not.

Depends how the images were created. Not common, but full screen SUP is theoretically possible. The whole video resolution is then used as transparent background.

It seems to me that AYColumbia is assuming that his/her PGS/SUP is 1920x1080. That's unlikely. I don't use SE as a CLI, so I can't comment, but it sure looks to me that AYColumbia is asking that the output be 1920x1080. And why SUP-to-SUP? AYColumbia doesn't say. It appears that AYColumbia doesn't have a clear idea of what the input is, or of what he/she wants. Ah, well.

[Yosho]

Subtitle Edit downloading things VERY SLOWLY.
Any idea how to speed up these downloads?

[markfilipak]

Settings, Shortcuts has this:
'Go to previous line and focus waveform'.

That goes to the previous subtitle's in-cue, not the current subtitle's in-cue.

What I need is this:
'Go to previous in-cue and focus waveform'.

Any ideas how I can make that happen?

[AYColumbia]

I'm confused. You say "forced subs". Burned in? But how can that be? -- because you say the input is a SUP file. A SUP file should be just a stream of subtitle images. That can't have burned in subs, can it?

[light bulb] Run
ffmpeg -i D:\Media\full_eng.sup
That will list the streams. Paste the list here.
PS: You can use MediaInfo to list the streams if you prefer.
SUP files can have lines marked with a forced flag. Some blu-rays use burned-in subs for forced like they do on TV shows. Some use a separate subs file specifically just for forced subs and some just use a file that contains ALL lines but the forced ones are flagged. The blu-ray players know how to deal with them when they're flagged as such. This creates an issue when you use these in an MKV, for example, because you can only flag a file as forced or not. So if you have an SUP file with forced subs, the only way to see them is to turn on subtitles. I wanted to extract just the flagged lines so I can flag it as forced in the MKV container.

If you use SE or a program like SupRip, you'll notice an option "forced only" which is how they can only use the forced files. SE is perfect for this actually if it can use a "copy" mode since OCR is NOT needed for this type of situation.

I hope this makes sense. :)

[markfilipak]

SUP files can have lines marked with a forced flag.

I believe SUP files contain bitmaps, not lines of text. FFmpeg says: "SUP raw PGS subtitles".

Some blu-rays use burned-in subs for forced like they do on TV shows.

? I don't have very many TV shows, but the ones I do have PGS subtitles and they are not burned in.

Some use a separate subs file specifically just for forced subs and some just use a file that contains ALL lines but the forced ones are flagged.

Separate subs file? On a Blu-ray? I've never seen that.

The blu-ray players know how to deal with them when they're flagged as such. This creates an issue when you use these in an MKV, for example, because you can only flag a file as forced or not.

I avoid MKV. What I do is convert M2TS to MP4 via FFmpeg, convert PGS to SRT via SE, and mux via FFmpeg. I can give you the command lines and 'factories' I use. Private message me if you like.

[AYColumbia]

I get that image part. I just mean, by lines of text, that each presentation of the lines. How do you think tools like SubtitleEdit and SupRip, for example, can determine that some "lines of text" are forced? Like I already mentioned, SE already is capable of this, but needs a "copy" option so it doesn't OCR when not necessary.

[markfilipak]

... needs a "copy" option so it doesn't OCR when not necessary.

It is apparent to me that SE is not intended to "copy" PGS subtitles. It is intended to make textual subtitles, such as SRT, via various tools, such as OCR, and then support editing of the textual subtitles via text and waveform-timing tools. You would help yourself by clearly stating what is it that you are trying to do and by deciding for yourself whether SE is the right tool.

[AYColumbia]

I thought I clearly explained it in my original question. Also, if SE is supposed to only output text type files, then it shouldn't offer a feature that produced an image-based output like SUP. It didn't make sense to me to read a PGS file, OCR it and then produce a PGS (SUP) output file. Since it CAN do that, I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for a "copy" feature since OCR isn't required in this condition. Please keep the conversation civil and on track. At this point the SE author/contributors can decide what to do.

[markfilipak]

SE's behavior changed today for no apparent reason -- I did _nothing_.

Yesterday: Sub2's in-cue could be moved left to abut sub1's out-cue.

Today: Sub2's in-cue can be moved left but only to sub1's out-cue plus 2-frame gap.

Yesterday: Sub1's out-cue could be moved right to abut sub2's in-cue.

Today: Sub1's out-cue can be moved right but only to sub2's in-cue less 2-frame gap.

The 2-frame gap (i.e., 83ms) is now enforced when moving cues whereas yesterday it was not. (Note: That gap was always enforced during beautify, as expected.)

The behavior change (i.e., enforcing the gap) actually makes positioning cues harder and more tedious because it's removed the 2-frame 'wiggle room' that allowed me to move cues by up to 2 frames and rely on beautify to recreate the gap. Now I have to actually move both cues.

Also, now that the gap is enforced, I can no longer hear what's in the gap. That makes determining exactly where to position the gap (i.e., the cues) a lot harder.


PS, Note: When I wrote this: suggestion for simultaneously moving both cues (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=2012125#post2012125), it was based on yesterday's behavior. With today's behavior, things are different. I'm currently using the "Shift" key to coax the mouse-drag to float 'over' the opposing cue. It works.