BDedit - BD structure edit

[PurpleMan]

PurpleMan, SoniG:
Do you want to add/edit ATC delta entries manually with BDedit?

Regardless of what we're trying to achieve, the answer is yes :)
The more editable entries, the better.

Thanks for your hard work, Pelican9.

[crl2007]

You all have a fixation. You didn't even read what I've posted. You want to edit ATC delta entries. That problem is tsMuxer related. It does not join m2ts files properly, that's why you need to use ClownBD before.

You have a seamless branched disc which you convert to a normal disc and tsmuxer uses copy /b m2ts1+m2ts2+m2ts3...+m2tsn m2tsfinal and does not do corrections. ClownBD uses eac3to that does a better job for joining m2ts files and tsMuxer to recreate the BD structure. If you don't add another audio/subtitle track, you can let ClownBD to finish and you'll have a fully working Blu-Ray disc that doesn't freeze anymore at join spots.

A command for using eac3to only is: eac3to -demux main.mpls ( the big mpls for branched discs ). You will then have elementary streams to feed to tsMuxer. ATC Delta Entries have no part in this problem.

[PurpleMan]

You all have a fixation. You didn't even read what I've posted. You want to edit ATC delta entries. That problem is tsMuxer related. It does not join m2ts files properly, that's why you need to use ClownBD before.

You have a seamless branched disc which you convert to a normal disc and tsmuxer uses copy /b m2ts1+m2ts2+m2ts3...+m2tsn m2tsfinal and does not do corrections. ClownBD uses eac3to that does a better job for joining m2ts files and tsMuxer to recreate the BD structure. If you don't add another audio/subtitle track, you can let ClownBD to finish and you'll have a fully working Blu-Ray disc that doesn't freeze anymore at join spots.

A command for using eac3to only is: eac3to -demux main.mpls ( the big mpls for branched discs ). You will then have elementary streams to feed to tsMuxer. ATC Delta Entries have no part in this problem.

Thanks, but you're offering a workaround to the problem instead of a solution. We're not interested in joining and changing the original structure of the disc.We want to keep the original structure and still have our backed-up disc play without freezes, just like the original.

[chompy]

You all have a fixation. You didn't even read what I've posted. You want to edit ATC delta entries. That problem is tsMuxer related. It does not join m2ts files properly, that's why you need to use ClownBD before.

You have a seamless branched disc which you convert to a normal disc and tsmuxer uses copy /b m2ts1+m2ts2+m2ts3...+m2tsn m2tsfinal and does not do corrections. ClownBD uses eac3to that does a better job for joining m2ts files and tsMuxer to recreate the BD structure. If you don't add another audio/subtitle track, you can let ClownBD to finish and you'll have a fully working Blu-Ray disc that doesn't freeze anymore at join spots.

A command for using eac3to only is: eac3to -demux main.mpls ( the big mpls for branched discs ). You will then have elementary streams to feed to tsMuxer. ATC Delta Entries have no part in this problem.

The only downside using ClownBD to join m2ts files in a playlist is that sometimes it messes up the total movie duration (last time I saw this problem was with Sherlock Holmes), and in some players it makes searching an exact movie time erratic.

Greetings

[SoniG]

crl2007 : Thanks for you help but without being offensive, I already apply your workaround for a while. Of course the first thing I did when I saw this bug was to remux the whole movie from the mpls and rebuild my BD structure with it. But unfortunately as PurpleMan so well said it already, this is not a solution but just a workaround. First, in doing this you had to choose between one movie version and say bye bye to the other or just duplicate the nearly same movie, which is ridiculous. Secondly, it is very time consuming, a totally manualish crappy work, and that's the biggest annoying point. And to finish, some BD use this option for nothing or for new interactive reasons that is sometimes very difficult to bypass (James Bond BDs). So ok I heard you it's a TSMUXER issue. But the point now is to find the solution to edit/demux/remux or whatever, properly, in developing a new tool if it had to, to resolve this issue. And I do want to test the ATC values because if you never saw a multi-m2ts remuxed BD working properly, neither did I!

[crl2007]

It is not a workaround. If you want to keep the structure as is, you have to edit over 20+ m2ts files. As for the duration of the movie, that's why you need to edit the IN/OUT time. It's all in the guide. ATC Delta Entries are not related to this.

LE: @SoniG There is a solution for this, as I've stated here, clownbd + tsmuxer. eac3to as a demuxer. AND IT IS NOT A CRAPPY MANUALISH WORK, IT IS THE WAY IT HAS TO BE.

So let's not polute bdedit topic with issues that you reject solution to. And I saw a fully working branched edited disc, I've made it. Look all over google and everybody will tell you to use clownbd because it uses eac3to. I've done so many tests to find the perfect edit solution, that I don't have hairs on my head.

You two clearly don't know what you want and what you need either, so it's a waste of time for me to try to explain you.

[PurpleMan]

@Pelican9:

Some other useful feature requests:

1) The ability to edit the number of play items in a playlist (add/remove lines, and not just edit the content of existing ones).

2) What would be useful (especially when looking to remove certain mt2s files, maybe because they were merged into one) is to either A) search option for an m2ts filename and have BDEdit check if it's referenced anywhere (playlist or otherwise), or B) a button to 'check references' which will verify that all referenced files actually exist on disk.

Thanks :)

[PurpleMan]

It is not a workaround. If you want to keep the structure as is, you have to edit over 20+ m2ts files. As for the duration of the movie, that's why you need to edit the IN/OUT time. It's all in the guide. ATC Delta Entries are not related to this.

LE: @SoniG There is a solution for this, as I've stated here, clownbd + tsmuxer. eac3to as a demuxer. AND IT IS NOT A CRAPPY MANUALISH WORK, IT IS THE WAY IT HAS TO BE.

So let's not polute bdedit topic with issues that you reject solution to. And I saw a fully working branched edited disc, I've made it. Look all over google and everybody will tell you to use clownbd because it uses eac3to. I've done so many tests to find the perfect edit solution, that I don't have hairs on my head.

You two clearly don't know what you want and what you need either, so it's a waste of time for me to try to explain you.

That's a good idea. I mean the idea of you not wasting (our) time to explain your WORKAROUND.

We want to get the disc working IN ITS ORIGINAL structure. BD-Rebuilder reencodes an original disc to fit a BD-25 backup and it outputs the exact same structure as the original disc, only reencodes the files, But since it uses tsMuxer to mux the m2ts's, we end up with the problem of stutters and freezes between file transitions. We do realize that BDEdit doesn't cause this problem, but it IS a tool to help us fix it (by editting the values).

To make things even simpler for you -

Our problem: Make multiple files (that were remuxed with tsmuxer) work without stutters and freezes.
Your offered solutions: "Don't use multiple files".

So thanks, but no thanks.

[crl2007]

YOU CAN HAVE ALL OF THEM. DID YOU BOTHERED TO READ THE GUIDE ? It is easier to make one big file and that's it, but you can have them all too. YOU'LL HAVE TO MANUALLY EDIT WITH TSMUXER ALL THE M2TS FILES, AND THEY USUALLY ARE 20+.

Read from ADDING SUBTITLE TO A SERIES BLU-RAY KEEPING THE ORIGINAL MENU and you'll discover Atlantis. The same method applies for branched discs ( those with multiple files ).

BDEDIT CAN'T HELP YOU WITH THIS CERTAIN PROBLEM. UNDERSTAND ONCE AND FOR ALL.

[deank]

.CPI???
I thought .CLP...

Fixed.

I guess you didn't update the download-link, because I still get:

Reading .CLP and an error.

I can confirm that the problem indeed exists. In my experience, all my BD-RB backed up copies which contain multiple m2ts files suffer from a slight freeze during transitions (notable Disney titles).

I posted (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1397559#post1397559) in BD-RB thread.

Let's keep the friendly tone, guys.

Probably we can discuss it in a separate thread in BD-RB's section...

Dean

[SoniG]

crl2007 : In hoping you will not get excited much, I already tested this method too, and it didn't work. I did bothered to read your post, and about bother to apply it, I already answered! What you don't understand is that you took time (and hairs extractions) to find a workaround solution at the TSMUXER bug in using other tools and waste your week-ends at fixing. we are here talking about fixing tsmuxer bug or integrate another solution to continue to use our backup softwares, as BDRebuilder to backup/shrink our BD with ONE BUTTON PUSH! Fix/get compliant the process is our goal. Fix/get compliant each backup are yours. That's what we are talking about. And I'm not using tools to get help, I use tools to test or do!

[crl2007]

Try and post only here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=143716&page=405). I posted too, to use eac3to as a demuxer instead of tsmuxer and recompile with tsmuxer. And you will see that you'll have ONE M2TS.

[Pelican9]

I guess you didn't update the download-link, because I still get:

Reading .CLP and an error.


I haven't released the new version yet... :rolleyes:
If the 'Get new version' button is inactive then no new version.

I think I put this ATC delta stuff and everybody cool down... :)


@Pelican9:

Some other useful feature requests:

1) The ability to edit the number of play items in a playlist (add/remove lines, and not just edit the content of existing ones).

2) What would be useful (especially when looking to remove certain mt2s files, maybe because they were merged into one) is to either A) search option for an m2ts filename and have BDEdit check if it's referenced anywhere (playlist or otherwise), or B) a button to 'check references' which will verify that all referenced files actually exist on disk.

Thanks :)
1. OK.
2.A. Done in v0.28. :) Press Find on CLIPINF...
2.B. OK.

[crl2007]

Yeah, that's what I was going to say now. :lol: It is better to be there, and we don't argue anymore. :)) We are like little children. :)

[SoniG]

I think I put this ATC delta stuff and everybody cool down... :) And I will be grateful to you for this.

[Pelican9]

Changes for 0.33

- Insert/delete ATC delta entries in ClipInfo
- Find function in CLIPINF checks all m2ts file referenced by mpls files
- Bug fixes

Uploading... ETA in 20-30 minutes

[PurpleMan]

Changes for 0.33

- Insert/delete ATC delta entries in ClipInfo
- Find function in CLIPINF checks all m2ts file referenced by mpls files
- Bug fixes

Uploading... ETA in 20-30 minutes

Thank you! :)

[PurpleMan]

In BDEdit's clipinf tab you can see in the ATC_delta_entries section that the table has 3 columns. I can figure out the "following" and "clipcodec" columns, but can anyone understand what the value in the "ATC_delta" value represents and how I can fill it out myself (figure out what the value needs to be)?

[crl2007]

http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20100046926 Read here.

[PurpleMan]

Thanks, I've read it already.

I still find it difficult to understand how the value needs to be calculated manually. Is there an easy way to do it?

[deank]

If the connection to the second (next) clip is clean and the playback starts from the beginning of the m2ts file you can safely put 0. All camcoders use delta 0 for the connection to the next m2ts.

If the connection is to a different offset then it is not so easy.

@Pelican9: Thanks for the update. .CPI works now. I believe it will be much easier if you auto-set the 8.3 flag depending on INDEX.BDM vs index.bdmv. If one loads .BDM then use the 8.3. Also a drag/drop of BDMV or index.bdmv/bdm to BDedit will be very helpful. :)

[PurpleMan]

If the connection to the second (next) clip is clean and the playback starts from the beginning of the m2ts file you can safely put 0. All camcoders use delta 0 for the connection to the next m2ts.

If the connection is to a different offset then it is not so easy.

@Pelican9: Thanks for the update. .CPI works now. I believe it will be much easier if you auto-set the 8.3 flag depending on INDEX.BDM vs index.bdmv. If one loads .BDM then use the 8.3. Also a drag/drop of BDMV or index.bdmv/bdm to BDedit will be very helpful. :)

Hmm, when you say "playback starts from the beginning of the m2ts file", do you mean the first frame, or timecode 00:00:00:00 ?

Because if it's first-frame, well, then that's what is currently set in BD-Rebuilder (using tsMuxer), and it still freezes/stutters in transition.

[deank]

Yes, from 00:00:00.000. Have in mind that the presence of ATC delta flag itself and 1 entry prepares the player for the seamless connection.

The preparation and the delta-entry information is what makes it different.

[Pelican9]

@Pelican9: Thanks for the update. .CPI works now. I believe it will be much easier if you auto-set the 8.3 flag depending on INDEX.BDM vs index.bdmv. If one loads .BDM then use the 8.3. Also a drag/drop of BDMV or index.bdmv/bdm to BDedit will be very helpful. :)

D&D and Auto 8.3 done.
You will see in the next version.

[PurpleMan]

Yes, from 00:00:00.000. Have in mind that the presence of ATC delta flag itself and 1 entry prepares the player for the seamless connection.

The preparation and the delta-entry information is what makes it different.

In that case, since tsMuxer muxes at a starting timecode of 00:00:10.000, that needs to be compensated in the ATC delta flags. Is that correct?

Also, I've been wondering:

How does multiavchd use tsMuxer to mux two audio streams and have the result muxed with non-following PID numbers (like removing audio track #2 but keeping #1 and #3 and the same PID number they had on the original m2ts)?

[crl2007]

1. In that link that I've offered you were some values for different situations and a formula to calculate yourself. And tsMuxer does not do 00:00:10.000, it puts 00:10:00.000.

2. It is based on replacing #2 stream with a small ac3 file, not deleting the stream.

[Pelican9]

Thanks, I've read it already.

I still find it difficult to understand how the value needs to be calculated manually. Is there an easy way to do it?

It's a 27 MHz unit. I can display it in time format but that would be less accurate.
In nut shell it's the difference of the STC when the first byte of the first source packet of CLIP2 is arrived at the input of one of transport buffers and the STC when the last byte of the last source packet of CLIP1 is completely entered to one of transport buffers (+188/Rec.rate).
I thought you know more than me if you want this feature... :-)

[deank]

In that case, since tsMuxer muxes at a starting timecode of 00:00:10.000, that needs to be compensated in the ATC delta flags. Is that correct?

IN_TIME has nothing to do with it. I meant that the 2nd m2ts file is used from the beginning (frame/time whatever). And let's not continue the off-topic here... If you wish - open another thread.

There you can post what kind of player/media you use and what titles cause stuttering.

[crl2007]

I thought you know more than me if you want this feature... :-)

:) As I thought too. But some users request something that they know nothing about.

[PurpleMan]

:) As I thought too. But some users request something that they know nothing about.

Actually, it's SoniG who requested the feature, not me, I only supported his request. He has a good theory (which is supported by both deank and jdobbs as of now) that the discussed issue is a result of bad/missing ATC values in comparison to the original disc.

I assume he knows how to test it, I'm here to learn. Either way, it's a very good thing that it can now be edited.

[SoniG]

:) As I thought too. But some users request something that they know nothing about.And thinking I know nothing is my prefered virtue!

Thanks Pelican for your update, however I don't seem to be able to add any entry in ATC delta. I can edit an already entered value in original BD for example, but in clpi that have nothing, I check ATCd, right click a field to enter in 'Edit mode', try to type something in the fields but my characters are not input. Do I miss something? By the way, most of multiversion BluRays use 2, 3 and more followings. Is it possible to add new lines. Thanks for your answer!

[deank]

Just click the [Insert] key on your keyboard :)

***

Probably a good way to help jdobbs with the problem is to enter the same ATC delta entries as found in the original CLPI files. Then check if stutter occurs and let him know.

[SoniG]

Just click the [Insert] key on your keyboard :) lol, ok! :) And how I delete one, print screen? :)
Probably a good way to help jdobbs with the problem is to enter the same ATC delta entries as found in the original CLPI files. Then check if stutter occurs and let him know.That's what I plan to do.

[Pelican9]

Thanks Pelican for your update, however I don't seem to be able to add any entry in ATC delta. I can edit an already entered value in original BD for example, but in clpi that have nothing, I check ATCd, right click a field to enter in 'Edit mode', try to type something in the fields but my characters are not input. Do I miss something? By the way, most of multiversion BluRays use 2, 3 and more followings. Is it possible to add new lines. Thanks for your answer!

Yep, as deank suggested it (:thanks:) just press the Insert for insert and Shift-Delete to delete.
And if you figure out something then share your experiences about the ATC delta values.

[deank]

You delete with Shift+Del. It is the same as all other insert/remove operations in BDEdit.

You may also try with delta 00000000 after you check the original delta offsets.

// too late :)

[Pelican9]

lol, ok! :) And how I delete one, print screen? :)

Try again! :)

[SoniG]

In fact my first intent is to deconstruct original Delta entries... :sly:

[mikeylikess99]

Hi there, is anyone able to explain to me, why some h.264 mkv files i convert to blu ray structure using TSRemux, play in my stand alone blu ray player, while others i have to use an encoder such as nero 9 to be able to watch them? This perplexes me greatly. anyone?

[Guest]

Hi there, is anyone able to explain to me, why some h.264 mkv files i convert to blu ray structure using TSRemux, play in my stand alone blu ray player, while others i have to use an encoder such as nero 9 to be able to watch them? This perplexes me greatly. anyone? Are these MKV files ones you encoded yourself? If so, what were your encoding parameters? If not, where did you get them?

[mikeylikess99]

Are these MKV files ones you encoded yourself? If so, what were your encoding parameters? If not, where did you get them? Hi Neuron, i didnt encode them my self, theyre from file on line. Tyvm in advance

[Guest]

Hi Neuron, i didnt encode them my self, theyre from file on line. Tyvm in advance You are not allowed to discuss downloaded files here. Please read and follow our forum rules or strikes will follow.

@all

Do not respond to this issue.

[crl2007]

In fact my first intent is to deconstruct original Delta entries... :sly:


Why don't you just copy the ones from the original clpi files ? It would go much faster and IF this stops the stutters you must report to jdobbs to know how to approach the BD-RB update.

[SoniG]

crl2007 : Why the hell I would have asked to be able to edit Delta entries if I just could stupidly copy original clpi to rebuilded ones. You know you why? What I'm sure is that doing yourself what you think and report it as well would be far more useful and interesting! Isn't it?

[crl2007]

Do you even know what ATC means ? Arrival Time Clock and I don't think that a clip arrival time value is changed when you backup your disc.


Probably a good way to help jdobbs with the problem is to enter the same ATC delta entries as found in the original CLPI files. Then check if stutter occurs and let him know.

Now I have seen that deank suggested the same thing.

And if you would have read my post, I suggested it as a TRY. Does it hurt to give it a try before you start working for a solution to calculate the values yourself ?

And maybe you didn't understand what I have said: to copy the original ATC VALUES, not the original clpi.

[SoniG]

crl2007 : Read my last sentence and apply it. Don't bother what I think, know or do!

[deank]

@Pelican: You may add one out-of-spec value to the Application Type drop-down:

tappl[0]:='res.';
tappl[1]:='Main TS for a Movie';
tappl[2]:='Main TS for a Time based slide show';
tappl[3]:='Main TS for a Browsable slide show';
tappl[4]:='Sub TS for a Browsable slide show';
tappl[5]:='Sub TS for a Interactive Graphics menu';
tappl[6]:='Sub TS for a Text subtitle';
tappl[7]:='Sub TS for a one or more elementary streams path';

tappl[10]:='Main TS for a Movie (AVCHD 1080p50/60)';

It is found in the 2010 Panasonic HD camcoders (models after March 2010), which shoot in 1080p50 and 1080p60fps (which is both Blu-ray and AVCHD out-of-spec recording format, although spectacular).


48 44 4D 56 30 31 30 30 00 00 00 EC 00 00 01 06 00 00 01 5C 00 00 01 A0 00 00 01 A4 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 B0 00 00 01 0A 00 00 00 00 00 35 67 E0 00 01 35 E0 00 00 00 00

:)

[Pelican9]

Changes for 0.34

- Drag and Drop support

deank:
The new application type included.

[PurpleMan]

Hey Pelican.

I think I've found a new bug - if you add subtitle (or audio) streams to a playlist (using the "+" button) then hit the button to apply changes to the CLPI, the changes of the added streams are not being applied. Only those for existing streams.

Worth taking a look into.
Thanks,
-PurpleMan

[Pelican9]

Hey Pelican.

I think I've found a new bug - if you add subtitle (or audio) streams to a playlist (using the "+" button) then hit the button to apply changes to the CLPI, the changes of the added streams are not being applied. Only those for existing streams.

Worth taking a look into.
Thanks,
-PurpleMan

:thanks:
I know that. The apply function works only when the nth stream in the mpls and the nth stream in the clpi has the same PID.
So if you add a new stream it will not work from that point.
The reason is, the clpi has more info of a stream then the mpls, so I cannot create new stream entry in the clpi.
This function makes only property changes can not change the whole structure.
It doesn't make sense to make bigger changes on clpi because the clpi strongly depends from the m2ts. If the clpi differs strongly from the m2ts then there is a problem about the m2ts and clpi creation.
I'll make editable the whole clpi sometimes, but I think nobody wants to edit thousands of EP fields in the CPI or manually add all the streams.
Maybe get info from the m2ts would be better, but that is a lot of work to parse all kind of elementary stream.

(Maybe an 'Apply to mpls' would be useful too...)

[PurpleMan]

:thanks:
It doesn't make sense to make bigger changes on clpi because the clpi strongly depends from the m2ts.

It does if you remuxed the m2ts with an additional subtitle stream that wasn't on the original disc :)