Redfox (AnyDVD et all) appears to be gone

[kurkosdr]

I'm a little surprised no one has leaked a lifetime key for anydvd, its not like they are coming back and the key would be banned in future releases . Their java rewriting was 2nd to none and would be useful for older discs.
Because the AnyDVD HD license file is an encrypted binary file that includes the license holder's name and who knows what else?

If someone has an AnyDVD HD license file they bought with a fake name and an anonymous Bitcoin wallet (created directly on the blockchain, not via a crypto exchange), they might share it, but I bought my license using my real name and using Bitcoin from my Coinbase account, so I won't leak it.

[petran79]

There are plenty of fake AnyDVD licenses to unlock the program anyway

[kurkosdr]

There are plenty of fake AnyDVD licenses to unlock the program anyway
An important clarification: All of them unlock the program as AnyDVD, not as AnyDVD HD.

[spotter]

DVD decryption is basically a solved problem, especially if willing to live with ISOs, even with bad blocks, one doesn't need a good logic of how to avoid them, one can just create an iso (say with ddrescue to move past them) and then decrypt the css protected blocks in place. Heck, vlc will play such an iso without a problem and decrypt it in real time using decss.

[kurkosdr]

DVD decryption is basically a solved problem, especially if willing to live with ISOs, even with bad blocks, one doesn't need a good logic of how to avoid them, one can just create an iso (say with ddrescue to move past them) and then decrypt the css protected blocks in place. Heck, vlc will play such an iso without a problem and decrypt it in real time using decss.
Or, you know, use DVD Fab HD Decrypter (aka the freeware part of DVD Fab) or PassKey Lite (if you want on-the-fly decryption), which are still free:
https://www.dvdfab.cn/free.htm

Back in the day, I used DVD Fab HD Decrypter (without a license for the paid stuff) and it never let me down. And since they aren't making any new DVD copy protections now, it should be good for all DVDs. The only caveat is that I personally recommend disabling the Path Player feature (since it was caught removing playable stuff in the past) and only enable it when needed (aka when a DVD shows up as larger than 7.96GB in size). But otherwise, no problems with it.

This is why I added the important clarification above: AnyDVD HD unlocked as AnyDVD doesn't have much value unless you are really tied to the UI of the software or have some other special preference, the value of AnyDVD HD is in the "HD" part, for which no leaked license exists as far as I know.

[spotter]

I've actually had issues with dvdfab in the past where it messed up my DVDs by trying to be "too smart", which is why I simply went to the ISO mechanism for my backups with a small modification to the region code stored in the VMG_MAT. Go the simplest way that changes the minimal amount of data and everything just works as you dont try to change anything in ways that can actually break if you get it wrong.

[SeeMoreDigital]

DVD decryption is basically a solved problem, especially if willing to live with ISOs, even with bad blocks, one doesn't need a good logic of how to avoid them, one can just create an iso (say with ddrescue to move past them) and then decrypt the css protected blocks in place. Heck, vlc will play such an iso without a problem and decrypt it in real time using decss.Hmm... Good old fashioned DVD Decrypter (created by the same developer who brought us ImgBurn) would still be my go-to software for backing up DVD's. Not that I back-up DVD's anymore!

[spotter]

Hmm... Good old fashioned DVD Decrypter (created by the same developer who brought us ImgBurn) would still be my go-to software for backing up DVD's. Not that I back-up DVD's anymore!

yes and no. its what I used to decrypt ISOs (to produce ISOs) and I think its great for that, but its not as good anymore if a) one wants a file structure b) one has to deal with DVDs with purposefully corrupted blocks on disc. I was ok without "a" and worked around "b" by creating an ISO with ddrescue that dvd decrypter was able to decrypt.

as an aside, back in that day, if one mounted these encrypted ISOs with a mounting tool, had anydvd enabled and tried to use DVD Decrypter, it wouldn't result in a good time. AnyDVD wouldn't brute force these mounted encrypted DVDs (and this they refused to change, even though they had the ability to do it, as they needed it for cross region decryption), but (IIRC) they also modified the contents so that they removed the "flag" that denoted if each 2k byte block was aacs encrypted or not, so dvd decrypter wouldn't actually do anything. messed up a few rips that way/

[SeeMoreDigital]

So when it comes to backing-up new DVD releases, what's the problem using say, MakeMKV in 'back-up' mode?

[spotter]

So when it comes to backing-up new DVD releases, what's the problem using say, MakeMKV in 'back-up' mode?

MakeMKV can't "backup" DVDs (as far as I remember, been awhile since I tried). It can only make MKVs out of them.

[SeeMoreDigital]

MakeMKV can't "backup" DVDs (as far as I remember, been awhile since I tried). It can only make MKVs out of them.Actually No... MakeMKV can indeed back-up DVD's (as .iso files) if you visit: File -> Backup.

Cheers

[spotter]

Actually No... MakeMKV can indeed back-up DVD's (as .iso files) if you visit: File -> Backup.

Cheers

if true, somewhat "new" - see thread

https://forum.makemkv.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=21524

as I said, based on memory, which I think is accurate, just might not be true to today.

edit: so tried with latest makemkv, and you're right, it now can create a decrypted iso, seemingly similar to what I described above I was doing manually. It still can't handle damaged DVDs though. Provided a suggestion to the XReveal author that if a user got the CSS keys cached, it be nice if XReveal could decrypt / deregion / demangle DVDs as well. Right now it treats encrypted ISOs as not encrypted as the mounting tools report it as non encrypted.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Perhaps you should give MakeMKV a try, especially as it's free ;)

[spotter]

Perhaps you should give MakeMKV a try, especially as it's free ;)

If you've paid attention to the use cases I've mentioned I care about, you'd realize its not sufficient for it. I've communicated back and forth with Mike over the past 15 years since MakeMKV's inception, and obviously he's taken some of my feedback to improve it, just some things are out of scope.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Out of interest...

What's the latest DVD you've had issues with?

[spotter]

Out of interest...

What's the latest DVD you've had issues with?

It's been a while sine I had to rip anything from my DVD collection (though i remember ABC TV shows, Lost, Fringe, Once Upon a Time come to memory as always being problematic that the rippers had to be updated for), but as I said, my issue was less with the mechanisms protecting DVDs (though that has played an issue in the past), and more with the fact that DVDs get damaged. In fact, the DVD I took out to test MakeMKV backup functionality right now was the first in a few years probably (and not damaged).

My method for backing them up when damaged was to use ddrescue to recover as much as I could from one dvd (and rereading bad sectors repeatedly, sometimes for days) or fill in the blanks from other DVDs of the same type (many times also damaged) that I could borrow from the library or buy cheap elsewhere.

This way I could get a complete "encrypted" copy and just have other tools to remove the encryption. DVD Decrypter was useful for this (though not to get a file system view, especially when the DVDs used the filesystem hacks that made it look like 80GB of data on a DVD), but I also built some of my own to do it. The other negative of DVD Decrypter is that it only works via the brute force method (for ISO images, for physical discs it computes the key normally) which is pretty good, but not 100% reliable, it be better to use CSS keys that are known to be good (i.e. computed from the physical disc). I should note that this method works great for BluRays with AnyDVD and Xreveal (using the cache precalculated key it got from the physical disc), just not for DVDs.

edit: Of course, the optical discs you are using to fill in the blanks have to be the same, but generally not that hard to find. The only time where I found it impossible (I think I mentioned) was with a manufactured on demand bluray where it was actually randomized for each individual disc (I managed to get 4 distinct copies from the library + my own and they were all different, but not different, once one remuxed the pieces of each disc into raw video / audio streams, one saw the content was identical).

[kurkosdr]

I've actually had issues with dvdfab in the past where it messed up my DVDs by trying to be "too smart", which is why I simply went to the ISO mechanism for my backups with a small modification to the region code stored in the VMG_MAT. Go the simplest way that changes the minimal amount of data and everything just works as you dont try to change anything in ways that can actually break if you get it wrong.
Disabling Path Player solves that. Path Player is a smart technology that defeats even the toughest copy-protections, since it mimics the actions of a DVD player (DVD copy-protections always add unplayable junk of some sort), but it has been caught removing playable content in the past (if that's what you mean by "DVD Fab messed up"). So, just keep it disabled until it's needed.

Hmm... Good old fashioned DVD Decrypter (created by the same developer who brought us ImgBurn) would still be my go-to software for backing up DVD's. Not that I back-up DVD's anymore!
DVD Decrypter has been obsolete for 20 years now, it won't defeat most DVDs with "structure protection" (where the disc has corrupted sectors on purpose). Sure, you can always wait until your DVD drive slogs through the corrupted sectors, but this is extremely time-consuming and painful on the DVD drive mechanically. Encountering such a DVD was what drove me to DVD Fab HD Decrypter back then. I originally thought it was physical damage, but the disc was perfect when viewed under bright light and DVD Fab HD Decrypter breezed through it. Also, some DVDs have a fake TOC that makes the DVD appear as dozens of GB in size, don't know how DVD Decrypter works on such DVDs.

Then again, some DVDs made recently don't have "structure protection" or fake TOC, just plain ol' CSS, so you may get lucky, but just be warned DVD Decrypter won't work on some discs.

[spotter]

Disabling Path Player solves that. Path Player is a smart technology that defeats even the toughest copy-protections, since it mimics the actions of a DVD player (DVD copy-protections always add unplayable junk of some sort), but it has been caught removing playable content in the past (if that's what you mean by "DVD Fab messed up"). So, just keep it disabled until it's needed.

mostly agreed, except even for DVDs that need it, it can still be imperfect, in a way that iso based decryption is not.

DVD Decrypter has been obsolete for 20 years now, it won't defeat most DVDs with "structure protection" (where the disc has corrupted sectors on purpose). Sure, you can always wait until your DVD drive slogs through the corrupted sectors, but this is extremely time-consuming and painful on the DVD drive mechanically. Encountering such a DVD was what drove me to DVD Fab HD Decrypter back then. I originally thought it was physical damage, but the disc was perfect when viewed under bright light and DVD Fab HD Decrypter breezed through it. Also, some DVDs have a fake TOC that makes the DVD appear as dozens of GB in size, don't know how DVD Decrypter works on such DVDs.

Then again, some DVDs made recently don't have "structure protection" or fake TOC, just plain ol' CSS, so you may get lucky, but just be warned DVD Decrypter won't work on some discs.

yes, but thats only if you use DVD Decrypter to read the physical disc. If you use another tool, like ddrescue, to read and just skip bad blocks, and use the iso it generated to feed into dvd decrypter to decrypt (to an iso), it's much less of an issue, which was part of my workflow (but with the 2 small weaknesses I mentioned previously). DVD Decrypter is still an important tool (IMO) all these years later even without updates.

I'd also note, that at least for TV shows (which were my main source of dvd ripping until I mosrtly stopped in 2020), it seemed the "bad block" protection mechanism became less and less common on DVDs. (I also noticed it being very predictable, if one looked at the block layout of the files, the bad blocks were generally in between files, not within files themselves. i.e. you'd see

file1 - blocks 1-10
file2 - block 19-30
...

and you would see the bad blocks in the 11-18 range (perhaps the entire range). In general they had to cover an entire DVD ECC block (which if memory serves me correct was 16 blocks, so one would see the errors in blocks of 16/32k bytes). This was useful for eyeballing this in ddrescue's output log/map file if your errors fit that pattern. though its been a long time so my emory might be faulty.

[kurkosdr]

mostly agreed, except even for DVDs that need it, it can still be imperfect, in a way that iso based decryption is not.
Out of curiosity, can you tell me how it messed up? (for example what playable content it removed or other mess-up it did and on what title) My experience with Path Player is that it's only needed on relatively new DVDs that don't have too many extras (since they started adding those only on Blu-rays after a while), so the chances of Path Player removing playable content are very low, but that's only my anecdotal personal experience.

yes, but thats only if you use DVD Decrypter to read the physical disc. If you use another tool, like ddrescue, to read and just skip bad blocks, and use the iso it generated to feed into dvd decrypter to decrypt (to an iso), it's much less of an issue, which was part of my workflow (but with the 2 small weaknesses I mentioned previously). DVD Decrypter is still an important tool (IMO) all these years later even without updates.
It doesn't matter if you use ddrescue or DVD Decrypter to slog through the purposely corrupted blocks, you are still slogging through the purposely corrupted blocks, which means you are still wearing out your DVD drive prematurely. This is why I am questioning the purpose of ddrescue in the chain: you can simply set up DVD Decrypter's "software read error retries" to 1 (or 2, or whatever you use for ddrescue) and enable the "ignore read errors" option:
https://www.doom9.org/images/dvddecrypter/dvddec-advoptions.png
Of course, you are free to use any tool you like, I am asking in case I am missing something.

(also, I personally would try DVD Fab with Path Player disabled on DVDs with purposely corrupted blocks before either ddrescue or DVD Decrypter, since I don't want to prematurely wear out my DVD drive when there is a way not to, but I like having multiple ways of doing things)

---

Also, does ddrescue fix the fake TOC issue where the DVD appears as dozens of GB in size? Assuming you've ever encountered DVD with a fake TOC, otherwise ignore the question. The only times I've had to enable Path Player in DVD Fab were (https://forum.dvdfab.cn/forum/software-support-english/dvdfab-dvd-copy/17519-dvd-fab-thinks-a-dvd-has-51gb-of-data-pirates-of-the-carribean-on-stranger-tides) to defeat the fake TOC. So, if ddrescue can't defeat the fake TOC, then you will have to use DVD Fab with Path Player enabled (imperfections or not).

[spotter]

Out of curiosity, can you tell me how it messed up? (for example what playable content it removed or other mess-up it did and on what title) My experience with Path Player is that it's only needed on relatively new DVDs that don't have too many extras (since they started adding those only on Blu-rays after a while), so the chances of Path Player removing playable content are very low, but that's only my anecdotal personal experience.

as I said, it's been a very long time.

It doesn't matter if you use ddrescue or DVD Decrypter to slog through the purposely corrupted blocks, you are still slogging through the purposely corrupted blocks, which means you are still wearing out your DVD drive prematurely.

my experience is that it doesn't have much of an impact. ddrescue will touch each bad block once, fail to read, and never touch it again, if that's what you want (but as you said, can do something similar with dvd decrypter), but that's not primarily why my workflow used ddrescue. I used it to recover damaged DVDs. I sometimes had it run for days retrying bad blocks (and many times eventually getting a good read), hence my statement that it didnt' seem to break my drives prematurely (i.e. even my optical drive in a circa 2000 era thinkpad (t21) was still working fine under this usage model in 2020, but as I said, haven't really ripped many DVDs since, so its been sitting in a closet(. What I will say is I found some drives to be better at handling damage than others (i.e. moving past damaged sectors quickly). So yeah, it may have made some drives last less long, but I can't say it really impacted me.

This is why I am questioning the purpose of ddrescue in the chain: you can simply set up DVD Decrypter's "software read error retries" to 1 (or 2, or whatever you use for ddrescue) and enable the "ignore read errors" option:
https://www.doom9.org/images/dvddecrypter/dvddec-advoptions.png
Of course, you are free to use any tool you like, I am asking in case I am missing something.

ddrescue lets me fill in the blanks of bad discs (and many DVDs have problems, and sometimes attempts at cleaning discs can make the problems worse). So as a simple example, DVD1 has a scratch or is dirty. I read it as much as I can with ddrescue, but not all blocks are able to read due to scratch/dirt. I clean, and am able to read more (perhaps all, or just more), but i also risk making the scratch worse (not highly likely if care is taken, but there's always a risk that one makes a mistake and doesn't realize that the microfiber cloth one is using has something stuck in it).

Also, does ddrescue fix the fake TOC issue where the DVD appears as dozens of GB in size? Assuming you've ever encountered DVD with a fake TOC, otherwise ignore the question.

fake TOC only matters if you want the VOBs. If you are ok with it as an ISO (i.e. want it as a full disc only, so a VIDEO_TS folder or ISO is effectively equivalent), there's no "issue" to fix. i.e. it will maintain the fake to and the ISO wont be any bigger. Also noting, that if you were ok with just playing with vlc, it would play the encrypted (ddrescue generated) iso without a problem if you had libdvdcss installed.

now thinking about it and going back to your first Q, it could possibly have been user error / incompatabilty with my ddrescue method that caused problems. i.e. I'd ddrescue a damaged disc, use dvd decrypter to remove the css (and output an iso) and then mount the iso and have dvd fab use path player to remove that structural protection. It's possible it didn't always like getting a mounted decrypted ISO (but I had no choice, as damaged disc wasn't going to be easily read by dvdfab otherwise).

TLDR: ddrescue workflow is useful for recovering damaged discs to create an iso, which you can then use other means of decrypting.