Media Player .NET (MPDN) - D3D HQ GPU Video Renderer [v2.49.0/v1.31.0 27 Dec 2018]

[Shiandow]

Should be possible with a player extension, feel free to add it as a feature request on github.

[Zachs]

Yeah it's actually one of my todo items. Since you've done so much IQ comparisons, perhaps you might be the best person to help out in this regard?
I'd start with just uploading the different presets (from low quality to max quality) to pastebin and linking them on the OP.
I'd also take into account of the framerate since it dictates how much render time per frame you actually get.
I'm always tied up with higher priority stuff so would appreciate it if you could help out.

[Zachs]

Should be possible with a player extension, feel free to add it as a feature request on github.

Ah I was thinking we could just use existing the copy and paste feature.

[Shiandow]

Ah I was thinking we could just use existing the copy and paste feature.

That's also possible, but a dialog would also be nice. Of course that dialog could use the copy/paste feature internally.

[Zachs]

That's also possible, but a dialog would also be nice. Of course that dialog could use the copy/paste feature internally.

Agreed.

[ryrynz]

Zach, can you duplicate the seekbar issue I mentioned? Drag the seekbar to the end when 'play next file in folder' is set and quite often
it'll just sit there stuck on the last decoded frame but in a playing state. Dragging the seekbar once again to the right from it's current end of seekbar position will force it to progress to the next file.

[Zachs]

I did try to reproduce the issue but haven't had any luck. Does this still happen with the latest test build?

[ryrynz]

Updated to latest build & extensions and it's working fine now. Is it possible to prevent a previously displayed frame flashing up when switching from FSE to windowed mode?
This occurs most noticeably when seeking whilst paused and then right clicking.

[aufkrawall]

Dunno if it's the driver or MPDN update, but flickering for me when seeking in windowed or exclusive fullscreen is gone.
I btw. really like how MPDN feels when seeking, very responsive.
Would it be possible now to also add time information of the cursor's spot in windowed fullscreen when moving the cursor onto the seekbar? I'm still really missing it from MPC HC. :)

[cascardian]

Hi, I'm one of those normally silent users, because I'm usually not experiencing any problems. I thought I'd inform you that with the latest release (2.44.0/1.21.0) I'm suddenly getting continually desyncing audio as the videos continue to play. Seeking corrects it for an instant and then it begins drifting again seemingly at the rate set in the rate tuner.

I have tried all sorts of videos and all sorts of settings in both MPDN and LAVFilters. It's definitely fixable by disabling the rate tuner. It seems that the API upgrade this version messed with the rate tuner somehow so that the audio is not kept in sync with the video.

Can anyone else please confirm this? I've reproduced it on a clean install, too.

Thank you for your hard work, guys!

[diimaan]

The Audio Script is completely gone missing in the (2.44.0/1.21.0) Build

https://copy.com/6YoDZifQ3O7pxJcc

And XySubFilter is not getting initialized and running even though it is selected and installed. :(

https://copy.com/e0wnQw27jwGLSEyO

https://copy.com/RoJ3klsjUDEMUqPa

https://copy.com/aRe10ah6Q8DolryM

Reverted back to the previous release as of now...

[aufkrawall]

In the madVR thread, there was a debate about whether or whether not to choose BT.2020 for 10/12 bit 4k video.
Result was that it shouldn't be used unless the stream is explicitly flagged accordingly, since basically every encode in the wild isn't BT.2020 and isn't flagged either. So MPDN should use Rec.709 for such streams, unless explicitly told otherwise by splitter.

[aufkrawall]

Ok, I created three simple quality presets which I think make sense for different GPU performance classes:
http://pastebin.com/RNLyLk9a

Settings for main MPDN:
low end:
chroma and luma up: bicubic 100 (MPDN's bicubic is very soft)
chroma and luma down: softcubic 50 or bicubic 50 (I think it's really just a matter of taste, I suppose most people rather like a sharp image)
(enhanced chroma reconstruction off, although this probably is redundant due to render scripts)

mid range:
chroma and luma up: Sinc-Hann8 AR
chroma and luma down: Spline4 AR

high end:
chroma and luma up: Sinc-Hann8 AR
chroma and luma down: Spline4 AR
(maybe also reduction of XySubFilter aliasing turned on)

I'm happy for hearing your opinions. :)

Some comments for some settings:
I set deband strength to 0.3 as a compromise (same goes for its grain).
I think edge strength of 0.3 for super-xbr makes sense to reduce aliasing and I find the line boosting rather unwanted as well. Sharpness of 0.75 is a compromise regarding this and ringing.
There is not a huge performance difference between different tap counts for EWA scalers and low tap count clearly has aliasing issues. I didn't choose Jinc for chroma for mid range and high end GPUs because it can clearly look too soft in cartoons. I find Sinc-Hann8 AR (max) as a good compromise between ringing and sharpness for good sources.

[Zachs]

Hi, I'm one of those normally silent users, because I'm usually not experiencing any problems. I thought I'd inform you that with the latest release (2.44.0/1.21.0) I'm suddenly getting continually desyncing audio as the videos continue to play. Seeking corrects it for an instant and then it begins drifting again seemingly at the rate set in the rate tuner.

I have tried all sorts of videos and all sorts of settings in both MPDN and LAVFilters. It's definitely fixable by disabling the rate tuner. It seems that the API upgrade this version messed with the rate tuner somehow so that the audio is not kept in sync with the video.

Can anyone else please confirm this? I've reproduced it on a clean install, too.

Thank you for your hard work, guys!

Yeah I noticed this myself last night. I think it might be worth going back to the previous release for now until I get this sorted. (BTW the reclock audio script is also affected by the same issue)

The Audio Script is completely gone missing in the (2.44.0/1.21.0) Build

https://copy.com/6YoDZifQ3O7pxJcc

And XySubFilter is not getting initialized and running even though it is selected and installed. :(

https://copy.com/e0wnQw27jwGLSEyO

https://copy.com/RoJ3klsjUDEMUqPa

https://copy.com/aRe10ah6Q8DolryM

Reverted back to the previous release as of now...

I noticed that too. XySubFilter doesn't seem to get loaded when there's no embedded subs. Oh Audio Script isn't gone -- just moved to the "Audio Renderer" category (look at the very bottom of your screenshot).

In the madVR thread, there was a debate about whether or whether not to choose BT.2020 for 10/12 bit 4k video.
Result was that it shouldn't be used unless the stream is explicitly flagged accordingly, since basically every encode in the wild isn't BT.2020 and isn't flagged either. So MPDN should use Rec.709 for such streams, unless explicitly told otherwise by splitter.

From what I've read, every new 10/12 bit 4k encode in the wild is BT.2020.

[Zachs]

Dunno if it's the driver or MPDN update, but flickering for me when seeking in windowed or exclusive fullscreen is gone.
I btw. really like how MPDN feels when seeking, very responsive.
Would it be possible now to also add time information of the cursor's spot in windowed fullscreen when moving the cursor onto the seekbar? I'm still really missing it from MPC HC. :)

Is the request on GitHub? If not could you add it? We'll implement it when we get to it.

[Zachs]

Ok, I created three simple quality presets which I think make sense for different GPU performance classes:
http://pastebin.com/RNLyLk9a

Settings for main MPDN:
low end:
chroma and luma up: bicubic 100 (MPDN's bicubic is very soft)
chroma and luma down: softcubic 50 or bicubic 50 (I think it's really just a matter of taste, I suppose most people rather like a sharp image)
(enhanced chroma reconstruction off, although this probably is redundant due to render scripts)

mid range:
chroma and luma up: Sinc-Hann8 AR
chroma and luma down: Spline4 AR

high end:
chroma and luma up: Sinc-Hann8 AR
chroma and luma down: Spline4 AR
(maybe also reduction of XySubFilter aliasing turned on)

I'm happy for hearing your opinions. :)

Some comments for some settings:
I set deband strength to 0.3 as a compromise (same goes for its grain).
I think edge strength of 0.3 for super-xbr makes sense to reduce aliasing and I find the line boosting rather unwanted as well. Sharpness of 0.75 is a compromise regarding this and ringing.
There is not a huge performance difference between different tap counts for EWA scalers and low tap count clearly has aliasing issues. I didn't choose Jinc for chroma for mid range and high end GPUs because it can clearly look too soft in cartoons. I find Sinc-Hann8 AR (max) as a good compromise between ringing and sharpness for good sources.

It would be nice if you could make a script group that has 3 (or more) presets (i.e. low medium high) and assign hotkeys to it so users could toggle between the 3 different settings. Having had a look at your preset I think that probably belongs in the "low/mid" group?

[aufkrawall]

wth, something went wrong with copy&paste.

Edit: It was meant to look like this:
http://pastebin.com/4rK474Br

[ryrynz]

Zach, in windowed mode the seekbar is quite responsive and basically refreshes instantly, can the seekbar in FSE mode have the same responsiveness?

[aufkrawall]

Is the request on GitHub? If not could you add it? We'll implement it when we get to it.
Alright, will do. Nice to see more things moving into render scripts, as they are open source.

[Zachs]

Zach, in windowed mode the seekbar is quite responsive and basically refreshes instantly, can the seekbar in FSE mode have the same responsiveness?

Fixed in the next release.

EDIT: Fixed in v2.44.1.

[Zachs]

wth, something went wrong with copy&paste.

Edit: It was meant to look like this:
http://pastebin.com/4rK474Br

Very nice, mate!
I'll add your post as a link in the OP.
Perhaps a few words to describe to newbies how to use the presets with screenshots?
e.g.
Copy and paste into Script Group.
Set hotkeys.
etc.

I'd imagine those who don't know much about render scripts won't know how to use the presets either, so a few lines of straight forward instructions + screenshot would probably do the trick.

[diimaan]

Oh Audio Script isn't gone -- just moved to the "Audio Renderer" category (look at the very bottom of your screenshot).


Oops my bad! Sorry about that! :)

[THX-UltraII]

does this player support frame-packed 3D Blu-Ray .ISO movies?

[Zachs]

Seeking corrects it for an instant and then it begins drifting again seemingly at the rate set in the rate tuner.

And XySubFilter is not getting initialized and running even though it is selected and installed. :(

Both issues have been fixed in v2.44.1.

[Zachs]

does this player support frame-packed 3D Blu-Ray .ISO movies?

Not sure. Haven't looked into it.

[Dlget]

wth, something went wrong with copy&paste.

Edit: It was meant to look like this:
http://pastebin.com/4rK474Br

This can be more tuned if you use fps in condition.
As for 23fps video rendering time should be less than 41ms & for 29 fps video rendering time should be less than 33ms.


I'll post my scrip later.
I liked that u used scaling factor instead of resolution.That makes things a lot easier.

I would like to hear about your opinion on scaling for anime related material

[aufkrawall]

Yep, it could be much more sophisticated. It would also make sense to additionally use source resolution information as well, e.g. to always force NNEDI3 chroma scaler for very low-res content, despite of the target resolution. But I wanted to keep it really simple and just discuss if people are ok with the chosen scaling settings. :)
(Now I think it might be better to choose super-xbr for second quadrupling pass for high end preset, as there is just little of a difference when doing NNEDI3 doubling before.)

Btw: Zachs, please check 2.44.1. It gives me lots of dropped frames, even without luma scaling. Queues are full, really weird. I reverted back to 2.44.0 and everything's back to normal.

[diimaan]

I get this when I try to use conditional script.

https://copy.com/GcNuBtpoZDUJXjTy

Are there any requisites to be installed? I am in Windows 10 64 bit pro. I have the requited dot net version installed. Only conditional script fails.

I can use script chain.

[huhn]

Not sure. Haven't looked into it.

can lavfilter even decode/handle MVC?

[Zachs]

I get this when I try to use conditional script.

https://copy.com/GcNuBtpoZDUJXjTy

Are there any requisites to be installed? I am in Windows 10 64 bit pro. I have the requited dot net version installed. Only conditional script fails.

I can use script chain.

It's likely something you've installed has removed ProcessDebugManager from the registry which is required by ClearScript (the library that enabled Conditionals). It is part of Windows and shouldn't be removed. If you do a clean Win10 install you won't encounter this problem (you can try doing a clean install in a VM just to see if Conditionals work).

[Zachs]

Btw: Zachs, please check 2.44.1. It gives me lots of dropped frames, even without luma scaling. Queues are full, really weird. I reverted back to 2.44.0 and everything's back to normal.

That's weird. Must've been something I changed. I'll check.

[diimaan]

It's likely something you've installed has removed ProcessDebugManager from the registry which is required by ClearScript (the library that enabled Conditionals). It is part of Windows and shouldn't be removed. If you do a clean Win10 install you won't encounter this problem (you can try doing a clean install in a VM just to see if Conditionals work).

Is it possible to install that component alone? Or dll?

[Zachs]

Is it possible to install that component alone? Or dll?

'pdm.dll' should be in your Windows\System32\F12 directory. You could try registering it with regsvr32 to see if it works.

[Zachs]

Btw: Zachs, please check 2.44.1. It gives me lots of dropped frames, even without luma scaling. Queues are full, really weird. I reverted back to 2.44.0 and everything's back to normal.

I can't seem to reproduce the issue here so I need more info.
Does this happen with all sources regardless of FPS?
Does it continually drop frames or does it do it in bunches?

[diimaan]

'pdm.dll' should be in your Windows\System32\F12 directory. You could try registering it with regsvr32 to see if it works.

WoW! it worked :):thanks:

[Zachs]

WoW! it worked :):thanks:

That's good but you might want to find out what third party software corrupted your registry (and probably other parts of Windows) to begin with.

[aufkrawall]

I can't seem to reproduce the issue here so I need more info.
Does this happen with all sources regardless of FPS?
Does it continually drop frames or does it do it in bunches?
Fluid Motion is the culprit. When playing e.g. 1080p 29,7fps video@75Hz with it enabled, it's constantly dropping frames.
Without FM (or with 2.44.0.), everything's fine.

[Zachs]

Fluid Motion is the culprit. When playing e.g. 1080p 29,7fps video@75Hz with it enabled, it's constantly dropping frames.
Without FM (or with 2.44.0.), everything's fine.

Ah found the problem. One of the bug fixes in 2.44.1 exposed another bug.

[ryrynz]

Zach if I select FSE whilst in paused windowed mode the seekbar disappears.
Also when I right click whilst in FSE mode the resolution and the frame changes giving me this.

http://i.imgur.com/x6vsjH8t.jpg

[Zachs]

Already fixed in the next release. I noticed it myself too yesterday just as I uploaded 2.44.1.

[trandoanhung1991]

This is weird. On my system, whenever I try to use NNEDI3 Chroma doubling, it causes a render script error. Both normal and OpenCL versions. Any idea how I can start to debug? Using GTX 970 with 355.98

[Zachs]

Well it would help if we know what the error message is.

[trandoanhung1991]

Well it would help if we know what the error message is.

That's the thing, I don't know. I just see "<!> Error in render script" when I enable Statistics OSD. I don't know where to dig in further.

[Zachs]

Did you use the installer or the source code from github?

[Zachs]

Hi guys,

If you follow our development on GitHub, you'd have noticed there's been quite a few recent changes to the Reclock audio script.

The new Reclock should work very well now, at least on the machines that I have tested on. If you guys could give it a proper test I'd appreciate it. What you'll find is your video frame rate (ref clock) will creep towards your display refresh rate until it eventually converges. As usual, Reclock will only be active when your source is within 3% of your display refresh rate.

Cheers.

[Shiandow]

That's the thing, I don't know. I just see "<!> Error in render script" when I enable Statistics OSD. I don't know where to dig in further.

I think that means that DirectX11 isn't available.

That said, I'm not sure why NNEDI3 still uses "Renderer.FallbackOccurred" and doesn't display the actual error message, might be a good idea to change that.

[Zachs]

Hmm fallback doesn't actually show up as "<!> Error in render script". This particular error message only comes up when an exception has occurred in the render script system.
@trandoanhung1991 You can try running dbgview to get hold of the detailed errors.

[Zachs]

Fluid Motion is the culprit. When playing e.g. 1080p 29,7fps video@75Hz with it enabled, it's constantly dropping frames.
Without FM (or with 2.44.0.), everything's fine.

Should be fixed in v2.44.2.

[trandoanhung1991]

Did you use the installer or the source code from github?

I think that means that DirectX11 isn't available.

That said, I'm not sure why NNEDI3 still uses "Renderer.FallbackOccurred" and doesn't display the actual error message, might be a good idea to change that.

This is from using OpenCL NNEDI3 Chroma Doubler. What's interesting is that it also seems to lock my GPU's clock speed to a low power state. Must be a bug with OpenCL and NVIDIA drivers?

[1708] System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
[1708] at Mpdn.Extensions.Framework.RenderChain.RenderChainScript.Render()
[1708] at Mpdn.D3D9VideoRenderer.VideoRenderer.A(Int64 , C , C )
[1708] at Mpdn.D3D9VideoRenderer.VideoRenderer.A(Int64 , IList`1 , IList`1 )


Normal NNEDI3 Chroma Doubler works normally, weird. I remember it having the same issues. Must be my memory playing tricks on me.

[aufkrawall]

Should be fixed in v2.44.2.
No apparent problems with this build/render scripts so far, nice.

What's interesting is that it also seems to lock my GPU's clock speed to a low power state. Must be a bug with OpenCL and NVIDIA drivers?

To what clock speed does it lock your GPU?
P2 is normal for OpenCL/Cuda, as it can't run stable with maximum VRAM clock.