BDSup2Sub - convert and tweak bitmap subtitle streams (VobSub,BD-SUP,BDN XML,HD-SUP) [Archive] - Page 9

0xdeadbeef

17th May 2009, 10:52

Some captions are colored but in the sub/idx-mode are all captions white.

I saw in SC you can choose different colors for the captions.

Is it possible to keep the Sup-color in the vobsub.idx-file?

Sometimes I wonder if anybody ever even had a look in the online help at all. Keep in mind that every minute of my life that I have to answer questions that could be easily answered by reading the manual and/or experimenting a little on your own, is a minute that is lost for BDSup2Sub development.
But yeah well:

When converting the 256 color palette of a BD/HD-DVD-SUP to a "4 out of 16" colors VobSub palette, BDSup2Sub looks for the brightest opaque color which is used for the most pixels. It then selects the closest color from the default VobSub palette than can be displayed and edited via the "Edit Vobsub Palette" menu entry.

In your example, the yellow is very light and thus closer to white than to the yellow in BDSup2Sub's default VobSub palette. You can edit the yellow color in the VobSub palette though as described in the online help. You can even save and load your own custom palettes.

There are some limitations however: due to the restriction to a 16 color palette and BDSup2Sub's (minimum) antialiasing approach for VobSubs which needs a light and a dark tone for each color, there are only 6 colors than can be adjusted (plus white/grays). So if there are more colors used in the SUP, some colors will be always wrong.
Besides, due to the limitation to 4 colors (where one is transparent) in one caption, having two primary colors in one caption will always lead to (at least partially) wrong colors.

hubblec4

17th May 2009, 11:06

SquallMX

17th May 2009, 17:08

sorry for wasting your time. but its not easy. some captions keeps the color other not.

yes the "help" is very usefull!
ok. its not so important for me this small issue....

Thanks for the new version. I love it.

hubble

I was having a similar problem using Windows 7 Build 7100, after using Windows XP SP3 everything works fine, but since BDSup2Sub is a Java program, the responsible for this problem seems to be Subtitle Creator+Windows 7, some captions are fine but others have diferent color, no transparency, or dont display at all.

I will post a few samples tomorrow, but I think the problem is not a BDSup2Sub bug.

:helpful:

Surf

18th May 2009, 05:46

Hello Ox,

Indirectly you've solved MY problem. I was using an old version of the SubtitleCreator, ver 2.0 !! Your last reply made me obtained the latest v2.23rc1 since 07/2008...voila!

You may want to update your 1st post to caution this similar pitfall...

Cheers!

0xdeadbeef

18th May 2009, 20:40

Another major (though it might not look like it) update. I changed even more things than in 3.6.0 and tested even less, so give it a try, but don't be surprised if I screwed up some things.

18.05.2009 3.6.0 -> 3.7.0

Changed: added free scaling factors (x,y) to resize captions independently of resolution changes.
Changed: all text fields react while typing and use background colors to give status feedback.
Fixed: when converting from HD-DVD-SUP to BD-SUP it was not guaranteed that each last palette entry was transparent.

deank

19th May 2009, 14:44

Hi again :)

Here (http://multiavchd.deanbg.com/tssubs.rar) is a pair extracted from .ts file.

I have no idea what format is inside - can you take a look when you find some spare time?

Dean

0xdeadbeef

19th May 2009, 16:53

I have no idea what format is inside - can you take a look when you find some spare time?

Well, even the IDX looks like crap:

id: xx, index: 0
timestamp: 4294967284:4223384455:4294967266:000, filepos: 000000000
timestamp: 4294967284:4223384455:4294967267:000, filepos: 000005800
timestamp: 4294967284:4223384455:4294967266:000, filepos: 000006000

First caption starts > 490293 years after the movie started. Hm, you have to be kinda patient and long-lived to enjoy this ;)

Anyway, even if we ignored this, the SUB seems to be completely corrupt as well. Obviously there's not a single valid control header offset in it and I couldn't find any sensible control header either. Instead, the whole file consists more or less of padding bytes. Each packet is only about 0x100 bytes long. So if there's an image encoded somewhere, it must be either very small or spread over a lot of packets without any obvious reason.

Dunno if it makes sense to look deeper into this. IMHO this looks like the export of a defective tool (no matter if it was the authoring tool or the demuxer). Both SubtitleCreator and VobSub SubResync crash on import. And really: this doesn't look like there's usable data in there anyway.

0xdeadbeef

19th May 2009, 17:37

19.05.2009 3.7.0 -> 3.7.1

Fixed: BD-SUP palette fix (when converting from HD-DVD-SUP) introduced in 3.7.0 didn't work reliably.

deank

19th May 2009, 18:15

Well, even the IDX looks like crap... First caption starts > 490293 years after the movie started. Hm, you have to be kinda patient and long-lived to enjoy this ;)

Sorry if it was a waste of time. :)

I extracted these "subs" from a .ts file, which mediainfo identified as "teletext". I used mencoder as I do for DVD extraction.

Thanks for the effort!

Dean

0xdeadbeef

19th May 2009, 18:26

Dunno too much about how teletext data is defined in a TS transport stream. I would be surprised though if if was encoded in a subtitle substream.
I would assume that e.g. the demuxer didn't know what to do with it and stuffed it into a subtitle stream, but then couldn't get the information to create a valid IDX file and the control headers inside the SUB.
Anyway, as far as I remember, I once extracted/converted a teletext subtitle stream from a DVB transport stream with ProjectX and then used it to create a DVD. So this would be worth a try.

deank

19th May 2009, 19:00

Yes, a user posted that he converted teletext-subs with ProjectX and then they can be used. I just tried the 'short cut' ;)

0xdeadbeef

21st May 2009, 19:22

Mainly improvements regarding import of VobSubs:

21.05.2009 3.7.1 -> 3.8.0

Changed: VobSub: added basic support for alpha fading detection (one LN_CTLI, one PX_CTLI per udpate, ignoring line&column).
Changed: VobSub: keeping existing palette is possible now if import and export format is VobSub.
Changed: VobSub: the active language index ("langidx:") is now parsed and only captions fitting this index will be used.
Fixed: VobSub: global offsets > 0 in IDX led to wrong image size (and wrong RLE decoding in some cases).
Fixed: target bitmap and palette where not updated at the same time leading to GUI redraw issues.
Fixed: erase patches were not updated correctly if free scaling was limited to screen size.

Mtz

21st May 2009, 21:59

This (http://www.sendspace.com/file/a2ep4l) is a TS with 4 audio and 8 subtitles. You can play this file and change the audio or subtitles in VLC. Do you think is possible to extract the DVB Subtitles (with some tool) and convert them with your program? I don't know any tool which can extract DVB Subtitles. DGAVCIndex "saw" them as AC3. CCExtractor cannot extract them because are not Closed Captions. Closed Captions can be found and extracted with this tool in several formats if the video is MPEG2 in TS.

enjoy,
Mtz

edit: PS: thank you for the implementation of "overlaped subtiles". Now the date and time from HD cameras are displayed OK without any gap. Will be nice if possible to move them on horizontal, not only vertical

0xdeadbeef

21st May 2009, 23:14

Well, this seems to be more or less exactly what I just discussed with deank: this is a DVB transport stream with embedded teletext.
So you need ProjectX or any other tool that can extract teletext subtitles from a DVB transport stream. AFAIK ProjectX only exports to SUP/IFO, so you need another tool to convert that to VobSub. SubtitleCreator or DVDSubEdit should do the trick.

Kurtnoise

21st May 2009, 23:17

ProjectX doesn't support h.264 streams...

Mtz

21st May 2009, 23:22

DVB Subtitles are teletext type (can be extracted in various formats with CCEXtractGui) or bitmaps (like in the sample).

enjoy,
Mtz

0xdeadbeef

21st May 2009, 23:23

The question was about extracting the captions and ProjectX can export the captions from that stream.
Besides: this is pretty offtopic, so please open a new thread if you wish to discuss extracting DVB transport streams any further.

Mtz

22nd May 2009, 02:23

When I saw that ProjectX cannot decode H264 I supossed that subtitles can't be exported.
The resulted subtitles from ProjectX can be loaded in your program (loading the idx).

enjoy,
Mtz

jokeli

22nd May 2009, 05:23

Well I sure don't intend to add OCR to SupToSub, so all I could offer would be an export to an easy to implement format. E.g. a bunch of GIFs plus a text file similar to the IDX of VobSub. Then maybe someone could set up a scripting tools to convert this to SRT or whatever.

Contactless POS (http://www.mpos.net/s/p1.asp)|Fingerprint POS (http://www.mpos.net/s/p2.asp)|Credit Card Terminal (http://www.mpos.net/s/p3.asp)|Point of Sale (http://www.mpos.net/s/p4.asp) a good stat

0xdeadbeef

22nd May 2009, 17:24

Hm, pretty quiet here lately. Probably I scared'em all away ;)
Anyway, one last small update before I leave for the weekend.

22.05.2009 3.8.0 -> 3.8.1

Changed: VobSub/BDN XML: transparent colors are assumed black to avoid scaling artifacts (same handling now for all formats).
Changed: introduced CLI option "/acrop" to set alpha value for cropping and patching color values to black.
Changed: edit dialog's preview window better matches the target resolution for less scaling artefacts in preview.
Changed: reworked limitation of selection window. Now based on unscaled coordinates to guarantee accuracy to single pixels.

Mtz

23rd May 2009, 00:53

SquallMX

24th May 2009, 16:54

@0xdeadbeef The "Move All" option is not working properly in current release, some subtitles are moved, some are not.

:thanks:

0xdeadbeef

24th May 2009, 17:48

Yeah, I'm aware of this issue. Indeed I noticed it last Friday shortly before or after releasing 3.8.1, but I had no time to investigate this - maybe later today, but it's definitely the next thing on my list.
My impression was that this happened only on VobSubs though, not on BD-SUPs and HD-DVD-SUPs. My guess is that this is a problem that was introduced with cropping images - if so it would also exist for XML BDN, but not for SUPs. Then again, this is only a guess at this moment.

[EDIT]
As I assumed, this is a problem of cropping. So I know the problem and I think I know how to fix it, but this will not happen today and maybe not even tomorrow. If this is a blocking point right now, you could export VobSub to VobSub, then re-import the cropped VobSub and use "move captions" on it.

0xdeadbeef

24th May 2009, 18:20

OK, I'm prepared to be scared again: here (http://www.sendspace.com/file/ktzc52) is another TS sample with sub which can be extracted and the subtitle can be viewed in VLC.
After I extracted the DVB Subtitle with ProjectX and loaded the IDX file, for SUP conversion I have strange grey colors and I don't know how to modify these coloros to look the same way if I want IDX+SUB. For this subtitle is nice to see how the filters are acting.
I don't know how are working the colors for SUP subtitles but can be made some option to have some colors like: white subtitle, dark grey antialias and black outline? I think the most used subttiles are white with black borders, and sometimes yellow instead of white. Of course, the white to be a little grey.

The problem here seems to be that ProjectX simply writes wrong palette and alpha info. E.g. if you look at the first decoded frame (verbatim mode):
Palette: 0, 1, 4, 5
Alpha: 0, 2, 9, 13

The colors 1,4,5 in the palette from the IDX are all 1f1f1f, which is some kind of dark grey. Even worse, the transparency values seem to be wrong as well. E.g. "2" is nearly completely transparent, "9" is only about 56% opaque. So the only nearly opaque entry is the forth one.

Now even if I could somehow patch this frame to look ok, the next frame would need a completely different handling:
Palette: 0, 1, 3, 4
Alpha: 0, 2, 4, 9

And so on and so on.

In a nutshell: I don't really feel responsible to work around the bugs in other tools. Besides, it's not as easy as it might seem to you as the color information is simply lost and can't be easily restored if at all.
I'd strongly suggest to ask the authors of ProjectX to simply fix the VobSub export.

0xdeadbeef

25th May 2009, 19:04

25.05.2009 3.8.1 -> 3.8.2

Changed: VobSub: alpha of completely invisible captions is patched.
Fixed: alpha/luminance comboboxes were disabled since 3.8.0 when switching to VobSub output mode and palette mode was "keep existing"
Fixed: "move all captions" didn't work correctly for BDN/XML and VobSub imports (since 3.6.0) if a bitmap was cropped.

DiRTDOG

25th May 2009, 20:19

0xdeadbeef

25th May 2009, 21:06

Hi I just tried your app to create a new .srt file to work with my Popcorn hour. I need to go from Sup to Srt. Your app worked great to make the sub/idx files but when I convert your sub to srt with SubResync to make the srt file there are space gaps in between the letters. Other srt files made with other programs do not do this so I think it has something to do with your program is there a way to adjust this so it doesnt happen?

This is a pretty strange request as you seem to suggest that I change BDSup2Sub in some magic way to make a third party OCR tool work better. Even if I was able to do this (which I ain't of course), I wouldn't really consider this to be my task.
Anyway: as I already pointed out before, it's generally a bad idea to OCR a scaled down version of the bitmap. I'd suggest (and not the first time in this thread) to use SupRip on the BD-SUP directly or to persuade someone to write a script/tool/whatever that uses a real OCR approach on the PNGs exported by BDSup2Sub.

PassThePeas

25th May 2009, 21:58

This is a pretty strange request as you seem to suggest that I change BDSup2Sub in some magic way to make a third party OCR tool work better. Even if I was able to do this (which I ain't of course), I wouldn't really consider this to be my task.
Anyway: as I already pointed out before, it's generally a bad idea to OCR a scaled down version of the bitmap. I'd suggest (and not the first time in this thread) to use SupRip on the BD-SUP directly or to persuade someone to write a script/tool/whatever that uses a real OCR approach on the PNGs exported by BDSup2Sub.

I understand DiRTDOG's request (as every PCH user that wants to play BD-Rips with it) but I have to agree with 0Xdeadbeef's answer. You can't ask him to improve his tool in that way.
I would even suggest (if it's not already done) that you go the NMT Forums and find the thread that asks for PGS support in m2ts file and add your vote (as I've already done myself ;)) so that we could all (PCH users) enjoy that functionnality on the PCH.

Peas

Thunderbolt8

27th May 2009, 23:52

would it be possible to modify this tool that it can also output as .srt?

PassThePeas

27th May 2009, 23:59

would it be possible to modify this tool that it can also output as .srt?

modify ... like in "turning into an OCR" ???

Well, you can wait for 0xdeadbeef answer, but I'd bet on a negative one. There are other tools that do it more or less (read posts just above) ... but don't forget we're talking about OCR ... not an instant and automatic process ...

Peas.

0xdeadbeef

28th May 2009, 00:00

Adding any kind of OCR support is highly unlikely to say the least.

Mtz

28th May 2009, 01:15

25.05.2009 3.8.1 -> 3.8.2

Changed: VobSub: alpha of completely invisible captions is patched.
Fixed: alpha/luminance comboboxes were disabled since 3.8.0 when switching to VobSub output mode and palette mode was "keep existing"

Thank you! Loaded the IDX subtitle from the canal plus sample. Playing in BDSup2Sub with SUP and SUB conversions and the Palette I observed this"
- if I'm using the IDX and create new palette the result is in white (grey) subtitles outlined with black
- if using the SUP setting, the subtitles are grey
So if I want SUP white subtitles outlined with black, first I'm exporting to SUB, then load again the resulted SUB and now is possible to convert it to SUP as desired: white with black outline.
Can be this done in one step? I found the workaround but maybe for other users will be hard to make it.

Regarding the changing of colors maybe I'm dumb, but I don't understand how is working. Maybe I need to learn more. But I saw in DVDSubEdit changing the colors is easy and I understand from the first time how to change the colors. I know the SUPs are more complex.

enjoy,
Mtz

0xdeadbeef

28th May 2009, 11:25

As I already explained, the color and alpha values exported by ProjectX are plain wrong in this case. When either converting to BD-SUP/BDN-XML or when converting to SUP/IDX in "keep existing" palette mode , BDSup2Sub will keep the original (wrong) colors and alpha settings.
In SUB/IDX "create new" mode, BDSup2Sub creates a new 4 color frame palette as explained in the online help. Indeed only 2 colors are really chosen while two are predefined, as are the 4 alpha values per frame.
While this might lead to correct colors in this case, this is more or less coincidental here as it's not the intention of the algorithm to fix wrong colors, but to find a primary text color and chose the other colors to get a bit of anti-aliasing, a black border and a transparent background.

turbojet

28th May 2009, 15:54

Are exporting dvd sup's off the table?

If so, could support for exporting 1 of 2 types of pgcedit palettes (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?jtmnxdvmkdd) be a possibility at least?

It would save me and whoever else is doing BD to DVD quite a bit of hassle trying to find the correct colors to use in the palette when doing . I can manage doing bdsup -> vobsub -> dvdsup with subtosup fairly easily just a little loss in quality and one extra step.

0xdeadbeef

28th May 2009, 18:26

Are exporting dvd sup's off the table?
This was actually never on my list and chances are very, very low that I will ever add support for DVD SUPs.

If so, could support for exporting 1 of 2 types of pgcedit palettes (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?jtmnxdvmkdd) be a possibility at least?

Well, especially the text format looks simple enough. I'm not quite sure though why a program would prefer importing a palette from a text file instead of the IDX. Besides, I'd guess you'd need about 5 lines of code to write a Perl (or whatever) script that converts the palette from the IDX into this format.

It would save me and whoever else is doing BD to DVD quite a bit of hassle trying to find the correct colors to use in the palette when doing . I can manage doing bdsup -> vobsub -> dvdsup with subtosup fairly easily just a little loss in quality and one extra step.
Well, I'm converting BDs to DVDs all the time and I never needed it. Also I'm a little puzzled why converting VobSub to DVD-SUP (or vice versa) should introduce a loss in quality. Both formats seem to share the exact same control header structure which controls display of the image including frame palette and alpha values.

turbojet

28th May 2009, 19:44

This was actually never on my list and chances are very, very low that I will ever add support for DVD SUPs.

Well, especially the text format looks simple enough. I'm not quite sure though why a program would prefer importing a palette from a text file instead of the IDX. Besides, I'd guess you'd need about 5 lines of code to write a Perl (or whatever) script that converts the palette from the IDX into this format.

I'm not sure but vobsub has never had much to do with dvd authoring in the past. I'll see if PGCedit will add it though.

Well, I'm converting BDs to DVDs all the time and I never needed it. Also I'm a little puzzled why converting VobSub to DVD-SUP (or vice versa) should introduce a loss in quality. Both formats seem to share the exact same control header structure which controls display of the image including frame palette and alpha values.

How are you doing BD to DVD subs?
Nevermind about the dvd sup vs vobsub quality. I'm used to using MPC-HC evr/directvobsub for rendering vobsubs and powerdvd/tmt3/standalone players for sups. The latter generally renders subs at noticably higher quality. Under the same renderer they look pretty much identical.

0xdeadbeef

28th May 2009, 22:31

I'm not sure but vobsub has never had much to do with dvd authoring in the past. I'll see if PGCedit will add it though.
AFAIK, a DVD SUP file contains exactly the same information as a VobSub SUB. Just the packet headers and structure are a little different. My main issue with DVD SUPs is the separate IFO though.

How are you doing BD to DVD subs?
What would you think? This is actually what I wrote BDSup2Sub for in the first place. As I'm doing the conversion only for family and friends which don't share my high quality demands ;), I'm using ConvertXtoDVD for creating the DVD.

Nevermind about the dvd sup vs vobsub quality. I'm used to using MPC-HC evr/directvobsub for rendering vobsubs and powerdvd/tmt3/standalone players for sups. The latter generally renders subs at noticably higher quality. Under the same renderer they look pretty much identical.
They should look absolutely identical (on the same renderer) as they share the same internal representation and format limitations.

turbojet

28th May 2009, 23:33

AFAIK, a DVD SUP file contains exactly the same information as a VobSub SUB. Just the packet headers and structure are a little different. My main issue with DVD SUPs is the separate IFO though.

Would creating a new ifo be useful for loading color palettes? PGCedit dev seems up to adding idx color import that might be a more logical way then to have an output pgcedit palette option when exporting idx\sub.

If you were ever to add dvd sup export with pgcedit color palette it would be very useful for some and it could open the possibility of exporting other dvd author software that supports external color palettes if any exist.

What would you think? This is actually what I wrote BDSup2Sub for in the first place. As I'm doing the conversion only for family and friends which don't share my high quality demands ;), I'm using ConvertXtoDVD for creating the DVD.

I don't have any experience with ConvertXtoDVD but it allows vobsub as input?

I really don't have much experience with dvd authoring/encoding outside of muxman, ifoedit, cce, hcenc and their frontends like DVD-RB and AVStoDVD.

They should look absolutely identical (on the same renderer) as they share the same internal representation and format limitations.

They probably do, I didn't find any noticeable differences in the few minutes I spent comparing. But it seems that sup > vobsub > sup isn't bit for bit identical to the source sup, bunch of changes, so I used nearly identical.

0xdeadbeef

29th May 2009, 12:41

Would creating a new ifo be useful for loading color palettes?
Well, for a DVD-SUP, the info missing in the SUP is usually stored in/read from the IFO (as the IDX files is used for SUB/IDX). I would suppose that this includes not only the palette, but also the video size. At least info about the video stream is part of the IFO.

If you were ever to add dvd sup export with pgcedit color palette it would be very useful for some and it could open the possibility of exporting other dvd author software that supports external color palettes if any exist.
I wonder where the sceen size would be stored then. How would an application that reads the SUP + palette know if the captions are meant for PAL or NTSC? Beside: more or less all the applications that import DVD-SUP need the IFO and won't accept anything else.

I don't have any experience with ConvertXtoDVD but it allows vobsub as input?
Yep. It's commercial and has some other drawbacks though, mainly lack of proper scaling (aliasing artefacts when scaling down due to lack of lowpass filtering) and only single pass encoding. Still, it's good enough for my purposes and I only need three tools in the whole process: EAC3TO, BDSup2Sub and ConvertXtoDVD. Besides, the version 4.x is said to implement better scaling filters and multi-pass encoding.

They probably do, I didn't find any noticeable differences in the few minutes I spent comparing. But it seems that sup > vobsub > sup isn't bit for bit identical to the source sup, bunch of changes, so I used nearly identical.
Most probably only the RLE buffers differ due to slightly different encoder implementation on different tools.

Anyway, I had a quick look at the IFO format and it might be easier to implement writing a fake IFO and reading colors/fps/resolution from the IFO then I originally thought. So let's say I consider importing/exporting SUP/IFO. This doesn't mean that you can expect it to be implemented any time soon, but it's kinda likely that this will be the next (and probably) last major feature that I will add. Might take a while though.

turbojet

29th May 2009, 17:04

Well, for a DVD-SUP, the info missing in the SUP is usually stored in/read from the IFO (as the IDX files is used for SUB/IDX). I would suppose that this includes not only the palette, but also the video size. At least info about the video stream is part of the IFO.

I wonder where the sceen size would be stored then. How would an application that reads the SUP + palette know if the captions are meant for PAL or NTSC? Beside: more or less all the applications that import DVD-SUP need the IFO and won't accept anything else.

This type of ifo would be helpful for DVDSubEdit. However for authoring I don't know of a program that could use it. I know muxman, ifoedit, dvdlab, dvdauthor can't. This responsibility lies in the dvd editor such as pgcedit/dvdremake. PGCedit can change colors through either of those 2 files I mentioned. I can't find out how to change sub colors in DVDRemake demo.

Yep. It's commercial and has some other drawbacks though, mainly lack of proper scaling (aliasing artefacts when scaling down due to lack of lowpass filtering) and only single pass encoding. Still, it's good enough for my purposes and I only need three tools in the whole process: EAC3TO, BDSup2Sub and ConvertXtoDVD. Besides, the version 4.x is said to implement better scaling filters and multi-pass encoding.

Oh ok I think I will stick to what I've been doing for now even with the extra few steps.

Anyway, I had a quick look at the IFO format and it might be easier to implement writing a fake IFO and reading colors/fps/resolution from the IFO then I originally thought. So let's say I consider importing/exporting SUP/IFO. This doesn't mean that you can expect it to be implemented any time soon, but it's kinda likely that this will be the next (and probably) last major feature that I will add. Might take a while though.

OK thanks, even with just the dvd sup export it would take out one step in my process, pgcedit file export would take out another. I could not use the ifo export at all. Ifo import could be quite a benefit for those doing DVD to BD conversions taking out 2-3 steps.

shon3i

31st May 2009, 10:26

0xdeadbeef

31st May 2009, 12:36

Well VobSub format is usless for DVD Authoring, because none of DVD Authoring apps not suport it, we allredy talk about it, and only software (Subtitle Creator) which can convert bettwen SUP<->VobSub not work like should. btw ConvertXtoDVD is not DVD Authoring tool just like fast and easy bad quality MPEG2 Transocder
For real DVD authoring (i.e. creating DVD from scratch), VobSub is as useless as SUP/IFO, so that is no valid point. E.g. DVD-Lab (Pro) supports neither VobSub nor SUP/IFO. The only image based format it supports is SON/BMP, which however is a pretty crappy format that I don't intend to support. Moreover, SON/BMP import doesn't seem to work correctly in DVDLab anyway. As SUP/IFO is a proprietary format introduced by IfoEdit, support by commercial tools is and will be limited if at all.

Besides, your definition of a DVD authoring tool is worthy of discussion to say the least. I'm not gonna put a gloss on ConvertXtoDVD as I mentioned its shortcomings already, but calling it a MPG2 transcoder is simply bollocks (for a couple of reasons). Indeed, a real authoring tool typically doesn't even have an internal video encoder as it's just responsible for creating a valid DVD structure from video/audio/subtitle streams etc.

Anyway, I don't really get the intention of your posting, as I already said I'd look into implementing SUP/IFO support. If at all, pointless postings like this waste my time and surely don't motivate me to implement new stuff.

shon3i

31st May 2009, 23:15

Please don't get me wrong, really appreciate your effort and work, this is a great application for processing subtitles, and really would be good to get another very useful thing if it is technically possible. Not just for me, here on the forum a lot of people who know what i am talking about

Besides, your definition of a DVD authoring tool is worthy of discussion to say the least. I'm not gonna put a gloss on ConvertXtoDVD as I mentioned its shortcomings already, but calling it a MPG2 transcoder is simply bollocks (for a couple of reasons).Ok, there is no real Authoring tool which support of any format, but still many DVD Muxers support only SUP/IFO. ConvertXToDVD maybe have little authoring (custom menu) but is far away from quality.

Surf

1st June 2009, 01:06

Hello Ox,

Please don't get bullish...relax...we all appreciate your program tremendously.

Any self-respecting member here use HCenc & Muxman combo which requires the sup format.

So far we have to go around in circles to create that...

So, take your time, we patiently await thy implementation.

TIA

avivahl

1st June 2009, 02:55

+1 on that DVD Sup request. Will help many users, including me.
Thanks for all your wonderful work.

0xdeadbeef

1st June 2009, 10:29

Guys, I already said I'd look into it. There's no need to convince me after posting #439.
Then again, the IFO format is pretty complex and although I only need to fill out a few fields, it will be some kind of a trial and error game to figure out which application relies on which fields when importing SUP/IFO.
IMHO, it was a really bad idea to use IFO just for the palette and frame size/rate info and it's really beyond me why a program that imports SUP/IFO doesn't also import SUB/IDX where the same information is stored in a text file.

hubblec4

1st June 2009, 13:23

hello

there is a small step to convert sub/idx to dvd.sup.
use SubtitleCreater, there you can load the sub/idx and save it to dvd.sup.

hubble

0xdeadbeef

1st June 2009, 13:31

It doesn't seem to export the IFO though - so use lose palette, video size and frame rate.

turbojet

1st June 2009, 18:55

But how useful would exporting an ifo be?

Outside of DVDSubEdit I don't know of any use for such an ifo and DVDSubEdit could just as well work with an authored DVD. One of the two PGCEdit color files I linked to last week would be much more useful in every situation I can think of.

I'm not saying ifo output wouldn't be nice eventually. I'm just trying to justify the time it would take to do it.