Blu-Ray~DVD Backup & Conversion

[mech61]

Are we talking blu-ray dvdr? cause ive only seen 25/50 gb discs which arent cheap.

[Wombler]

They're talking about re-encoding blu-ray to fit onto either single or dual layer DVD recordable.

If you read the rest of the thread all will become clear.


Wombler

[jdobbs]

Ive ordered my player a Panasonic DMP-BD35 , my burner is ready to install LG GGW-H20N/L , what size discs are we going to need. My experience so far is that for movie-only and disc without a huge amount of extras you can use a single layer DVD+-R. For those with extended content or a very long movie you may need dual layer to keep pristine quality.

I'm also looking at an option to split a disc into two BD-5s, one with extras and the other containing the feature. It probably won't be in the beta, but possibly later.

I'm amazed at how much SD content is on these discs... that part really compresses easily with AVC. Originally I was using total content (in hours) as a quide for whether to go BD-5 or BD-9 -- but with all this 720x480 content it just isn't a reliable determiner.

I have seen no need to bring the resolution down to 1280x720 on any of them as yet.

Development status: Just ran into a bug that is taking me down a lot of rabbit holes and I making me rethink one of my methods... not a big deal, but time-consuming. When I get past this one I may be able to post. The "paying job" has been eating into my development seriously...

[G_M_C]

[...]
The "paying job" has been eating into my development seriously...

Yep, but the paying job is more important, cause you have to eat ;)

Good to see that you're making good progress. Don't hasten things along, makeing it a "good one" is more important. We'll have patience untill then :)

[nwg]

I am amazed what I can fit on a single layer DVD when reencoding at 720p. I managed to get 32GB (original video and AC3 5.1) down to 4.36GB. It is hard to actually tell the difference with the original BD disc. The big plus for me is the disc can then play in my BD player as a AVCHD. The down side is the average disc takes 35 hours with my pc setup (1st pass 5-6fps, 2nd pass 1.5-2fps)

I would like to keep 1080p res and do a double layer disc but my pc spec does it at 0.5fps speed.

I have no intention in doing a BDR until they are a lot cheaper (plus the burner) and can do just a 1:1 copy. In the UK a single layer BDR is up to £10 and a double layer is up to £25. A BD burner (LG) is £160. I opted for the LG BD ROM drive at £60.

[laserfan]

I am amazed what I can fit on a single layer DVD when reencoding at 720p.I used the .bat file earlier in this thread to convert a longish actioner (live free or die hard) to 1080p DVD-5, and on my 1080p 10-foot screen I found absolutely no artifacts of any kind! I was amazed--no pixelation or blocking or posterization or jerkiness anywhere. Stunningly perfect. One almost has to ask: why do we need the blue-laser technology at all when such incredible PQ is available with the 264 codec.

[nashcity]

It's great to hear your plans for BD Rebuilder Jdobbs. Looking forward to checking it out.

DVD Rebuilder helped me create a library a high quality dvds. But I have since moved to a "digital" library using the PS3 as an interface and a network drive to hold all my video files. Since tsmuxer has an option for M2TS output, would I be correct in assuming that the output from BD Rebuilder could be used to create a "digital" copy for a PS3 or HTPC setup? Maybe it would be as simple as using the M2TS file in the STREAM folder of the BD structure?

[rack04]

jdobbs,

What is your experience with 1920x1080 on a DVD-5? Are all your encodes resized to 1280x720?

[Adub]

I have seen no need to bring the resolution down to 1280x720 on any of them as yet.

It helps to read.

[rack04]

It helps to read.

:thanks: I missed that.

[moviefan]

I used the .bat file earlier in this thread to convert a longish actioner (live free or die hard) to 1080p DVD-5, and on my 1080p 10-foot screen I found absolutely no artifacts of any kind! I was amazed--no pixelation or blocking or posterization or jerkiness anywhere.

What settings do you use for x264? I really wonder about your experience concerning quality for 1080p content on DVD5 since I have considered even a ~2h movie on DVD9 with 2x AC3 640kbit/s audio movie only very critical... I would appreciate a lot if you could post your command line.

Regards

[rack04]

What settings do you use for x264? I really wonder about your experience concerning quality for 1080p content on DVD5 since I have considered even a ~2h movie on DVD9 with 2x AC3 640kbit/s audio movie only very critical... I would appreciate a lot if you could post your command line.

Regards

Here is what I use:
@SET X264_PATH=
@SET WORKING_DIRECTORY=
@SET FILENAME=
@SET AVS_INPUT=
@SET DESIRED_BITRATE=
"%x264_PATH%" --pass 1 --bitrate %DESIRED_BITRATE% --stats "%WORKING_DIRECTORY%\%FILENAME%.stats" --level 4.1 --keyint 24 --min-keyint 2 --bframes 3 --b-adapt 2 --weightb --direct auto --filter -1:-1 --subme 2 --partitions none --ipratio 1.1 --pbratio 1.1 --vbv-bufsize 40000 --vbv-maxrate 40000 --qcomp 0.5 --me dia --threads auto --thread-input --sar 1:1 --progress --no-psnr --no-ssim --output NUL "%AVS_INPUT%" --mvrange 511 --aud --nal-hrd
"%x264_PATH%" --pass 2 --bitrate %DESIRED_BITRATE% --stats "%WORKING_DIRECTORY%\%FILENAME%.stats" --level 4.1 --keyint 24 --min-keyint 2 --ref 3 --mixed-refs --bframes 3 --b-adapt 2 --weightb --direct auto --filter -1:-1 --subme 7 --trellis 2 --partitions p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct --ipratio 1.1 --pbratio 1.1 --vbv-bufsize 40000 --vbv-maxrate 40000 --qcomp 0.5 --me umh --threads auto --thread-input --sar 1:1 --progress --no-psnr --no-ssim --output "%WORKING_DIRECTORY%\%FILENAME%-output.h264" "%AVS_INPUT%" --mvrange 511 --aud --nal-hrd
PAUSE

[mech61]

Ok so I only really needed to keep my PIONEER BDC-S02BK reader and didnt need to buy a blu-ray burner?

[laserfan]

I really wonder about your experience...I used the very first .bat jdobbs posted earlier in this thread, with x264 build r955 IIRC. Worked perfectly, looks fantastic. So good I'm hard-pressed not to use it again, even without the keyint and minkeyint changes, or with a newer x264 build.

[GZZ]

what does the --mvrange 511, specially the 511 comes from ? in the help for x264 it says:

--mvrange <integer> Maximum motion vector length [-1 (auto)]

But why 511 and not 1000 or -1 for auto ?

[oRBIT]

What really bothers me with some blu-ray titles is that the movies can't be resumed if you once have stopped playback. I've imagined this has something to do with Java-menus could it be correct? My blu-rays that starts quickly also seems to be able to resume but discs with very advanced menues doesn't seem to be able to resume.
So my questions is, how will this work with BD-Rebuilder? I guess the resume-problem still might be there as you copy the entire disc but how about movie-only mode?

[jdobbs]

If you make a full backup, it will work exactly like the original. If you make a movie-only, it will resume.

[magic144]

@oRBIT - I too have seen the no-resume feature on my BD discs. From what I've read and seen, this inability to resume discs' playback positions is attributable to some Java functionality on the discs in question... Obviously, if you strip these discs down to movie-only reencodes without menus or attendant control features, you will once more have a basic movie file which will be resumable in your player.

[oRBIT]

I've learned that BD-Rebuilder in it's current (beta) stage will recode audio to AC3.. Will I be able to recode the audio to 2-channel AC3 aswell within the application?

[Rectal Prolapse]

Will BD-Rebuilder have an option to not re-encode the video and audio?

I assume there will be an option to also re-encode for BD-25, or re-encode extras-only while leaving the movie (video and audio format) intact.

I apologize if this has been answered already - it's hard to search for any mention of the above.

[nwg]

I just done my first 1080p encode (I, Robot) with x264 to a single layer dvd instead of the usual 720p. Despite taking around 40 hours instead of the usual 30, the result is still impressive.

It would be good if this BD Rebuilder can work with the original Blu Ray subtitles without having to use SRT ones.

[jdobbs]

Just an update to everyone: I've been assigned to a special project in my "real job" that has pulled me away for awhile. I'll get back to the beta as soon as I can. Sorry for the delay, but I really don't have an option.

[jdobbs]

I've learned that BD-Rebuilder in it's current (beta) stage will recode audio to AC3.. Will I be able to recode the audio to 2-channel AC3 aswell within the application?I hadn't thought of that -- but it is very easy to add.

[jdobbs]

Will BD-Rebuilder have an option to not re-encode the video and audio?

I assume there will be an option to also re-encode for BD-25, or re-encode extras-only while leaving the movie (video and audio format) intact.

I apologize if this has been answered already - it's hard to search for any mention of the above. Not in the first beta release, but later certainly. I assume this would be simply to remove some audio, but retain the remaining audio/video.

It already has an option to reencode to BD-25.

[rendez2k]

jdobbs, maybe if you get a chance you could list the features it will have at release and the ones you plan to add in the future?

[Fishman0919]

Ok. Here is the .BAT, it is placed in the same directory as the .AVS file and you have to set the file name and bitrate before running (first two lines). The bitrate is calculated based upon the size (in frames) of the input. Note that for readability I've broken the X264 commands into multiple lines here but in the .BAT file the entire command is on one line.

@SET IN_TITLE=FILETITLE
@SET IN_BITRATE=5240
TIME /T
"E:\X264\x264.exe" "%IN_TITLE%.AVS" --bitrate %IN_BITRATE% --level 4.1 --sar 1:1
--aud --vbv-bufsize 14745 --vbv-maxrate 17500 --filter 0,0 --bframes 3 --direct auto
--keyint 24 --min-keyint 1 --subme 2 --analyse none --me dia --threads auto --thread-input
--progress --no-psnr --no-ssim --stats "stats2.log" --pass 1 --output NUL
TIME /T
"E:\X264\x264.exe" "%IN_TITLE%.AVS" --bitrate %IN_BITRATE% --level 4.1 --sar 1:1 --aud
--vbv-bufsize 14745 --vbv-maxrate 17500 --filter 0,0 --ref 3 --mixed-refs --bframes 3
--keyint 24 --min-keyint 1 --b-rdo --bime --weightb --direct auto --subme 6 --trellis 1
--analyse p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct --me umh --threads auto --thread-input
--progress --no-psnr --no-ssim --stats "stats2.log" --pass 2 --output "%IN_TITLE%.264"
TIME /T
PAUSE
Comments from any X264 experts out there who could improve the command lines are certainly welcome.


[Edit - 09/03/08] Updated to limit key interval to 24 -- due to 1 sec limit on BD.



@SET IN_TITLE=Full - 720p
@SET IN_BITRATE=3600
TIME /T
"d:\X264\x264.exe" "%IN_TITLE%.AVS" --bitrate %IN_BITRATE% --level 4.1 --sar 1:1 --aud --vbv-bufsize 16500 --vbv-maxrate 17500 --filter 0,0 --bframes 3 --b-pyramid --direct auto --b-adapt 2 --aq-mode 2 --aq-strength 1.0 --keyint 24 --min-keyint 2 --subme 2 --trellis 1 --analyse none --me dia --threads auto --thread-input --progress --no-psnr --no-ssim --stats "x264HQ2pass.log" --pass 1 --output NUL
TIME /T
"d:\X264\x264.exe" "%IN_TITLE%.AVS" --bitrate %IN_BITRATE% --level 4.1 --sar 1:1 --aud --vbv-bufsize 16500 --vbv-maxrate 17500 --filter 0,0 --ref 3 --mixed-refs --bframes 3 --b-pyramid --aq-mode 2 --aq-strength 1.0 --keyint 24 --min-keyint 2 --weightb --direct auto --subme 7 --trellis 1 --analyse p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct --me umh --merange 20 --mvrange 511 --threads auto --thread-input --progress --no-psnr --no-ssim --stats "x264HQ2pass.log" --pass 2 --output "%IN_TITLE%.h264"
TIME /T
PAUSE

Adds --b-adapt 2 (to 1st pass), --b-pyramid, --aq-mode 2, --aq-strength 1.0

For better B frame handling and Adaptive Quantization Mode for better distribute of available bits between all macroblocks in the video.

Nice info page on x264 settings LINK (http://mewiki.project357.com/wiki/X264_Settings)

[GZZ]

I will try it out. But can you please explain what the
--mvrange 511 option is good for ?

[Fishman0919]

I will try it out. But can you please explain what the
--mvrange 511 option is good for ?

Nice info page on x264 settings LINK (http://mewiki.project357.com/wiki/X264_Settings)

All about the settings.

...or

mvrange

Default: 511.75

Set the maximum range of any one motion vector. The default value is the maximum specified by the h264 standard. It is not level or profile dependant, so don't touch it.

511.75 is not accessed as a value, so the max setting would be 511

[GZZ]

I dont see a reason to change it.

The default value is the maximum specified by the h264 standard. It is not level or profile dependant, so don't touch it.

When its default, I think its default on. When the text says Default: Not Set. Then its not turned on, except if you use the option. Alot of the commands are default set, because they are needed and the default value is the best.

[Fishman0919]

I dont see a reason to change it.



When its default, I think its default on. When the text says Default: Not Set. Then its not turned on, except if you use the option. Alot of the commands are default set, because they are needed and the default value is the best.

Better sure that .75 will not make a noticeable difference in quality. I did play with this setting to see what effect on quality and speed it has.

Odd the x264 will not access the default value in the command line.

[GZZ]

well - you could try 0 instead, because if it dont use the default value, what value should it then use ?. So setting it to zero (0) will let you know. :D

[DVD Maniac]

Just an update to everyone: I've been assigned to a special project in my "real job" that has pulled me away for awhile. I'll get back to the beta as soon as I can. Sorry for the delay, but I really don't have an option.

jdobbs,
Looks very exciting stuff, I have been focused on other projects myself recently hence lack of posts! Any chance of a beta tester status please!

[Sophocles]

jdobbs left a massage a few posts back regarding Beta progress.

Just an update to everyone: I've been assigned to a special project in my "real job" that has pulled me away for awhile. I'll get back to the beta as soon as I can. Sorry for the delay, but I really don't have an option.


I hear you loud and clear when it comes to the "real job."

[DVD Maniac]

Just wondered whether he was releasing betas to try before "official" release ala original Rebuilder. :):)

[Sophocles]

Just wondered whether he was releasing betas to try before "official" release ala original Rebuilder.



RB done right can never leave beta status since it is an ongoing effort to keep pace with a format's architecture.

[writersblock29]

@Jdobbs

It sounds like we're getting roughly the same encoding speeds. I'm using a Phenom 9950, and currently chugging Black Hawk Down at 7.66fps, 2nd pass. I've noticed that it depends on what the source used for compression (MPEG2, VC-1, or AVC) as to how fast it goes... but even then, it's dickering over maybe an extra frame per second.

Still, it's not as bad as the really early days of DVD conversions. Remember ReMPEG2? :rolleyes:

I'm following this thread with a lot of interest. It's good to see you plugging away at Blu ray now!

[laserfan]

I've noticed that it depends on what the source used for compression (MPEG2, VC-1, or AVC) as to how fast it goes... but even then, it's dickering over maybe an extra frame per second.These different sources are being Decoded by different Decoders in your PC, and so their different decoding speeds may account for this.

[Sn8kbordin]

I am using MEgui BluRay disc profile and I am getting 2-2.5fps on Opteron 185 OCed a bit w/ 2GB RAM. :( My laptop's XPS1530 Core2Due (I think it is fastest they offer) w/ 4GB RAM and vista I can do 2.5FPS on 2nd pass
Gotta jump on the quad core wagon soon.

[jdobbs]

These 1920x1080p sources are just huge and I don't think even a decent dual core has enough "oomph" for it. Luckily, though, as we saw in the DVD world -- the processors improve fast. I can still remember back in 2004 when it wasn't unusual for some people to see 16 hours for a DVD to be reencoded.

[Sn8kbordin]

Guess where my X-mas bonus is being spent at?
New motherboard, Quad CPU (once I research them to see which one I want), RAM and 2 10K RPM WD HDDs in RAID0.

[jdobbs]

From what I've heard the Intel Quads seem to be a better choice than the AMDs... my Phenom is ok -- but I'm hearing the Q6600 overclocked is significantly faster.

[Fishman0919]

I have both an Intel Q6600 and an AMD 9950 Black Editon. Both are great. It really depends on what you are doing and what software you are running.

For me the AMD 9950 Black Edition OC's better but then it's multiplexer is unlocked.... so as long as you can keep it cool... you can run it very high.... I have my 9950 at 3.8 stable with water cooling.

[jdobbs]

Wow. My Phenom is a 9500, so it's significantly lower in the AMD chain than the black editions. It also was manufactured prior to the fix they put in the 9550s. I haven't tried to overclock it (my motherboard sucks for overclocking) -- but I've heard that the 9500 isn't greate for overclocking like the Q6600s (which are similar to the 9500 in price).

3.8GHz on a quad? Wow. That has to kick butt, even with HD AVC encoding...

[Fishman0919]

The AMD 9950 Black Edition or Reg ver runs at 2.6 norm.... The Black Edition lets you set the multiplexer up to 6.4.

I had it running at 4.0 but was have issues runing x264 and CCE.... backed it down to 3.8 and works fine.

[Fishman0919]

A compare of different encoders with Mainconcept Reference 1.5.1 LINK (http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/desktop-cpu-charts-q3-2008/Mainconcept-Reference-1-5-1,832.html)

[Wombler]

From what I've heard the Intel Quads seem to be a better choice than the AMDs... my Phenom is ok -- but I'm hearing the Q6600 overclocked is significantly faster.

Have you heard anything in relation to the new i7's yet?


Wombler

[Fishman0919]

Have you heard anything in relation to the new i7's yet?


Wombler


A friend at work just built one... Intel Core i7 940... very close to his old Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 but takes advantage of DDR3 mem.

He said it has it pluses and minuses.

The new AMD AM3 cpu do the same thing... have better handling for DDR3 mem. LINK (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_AM3)

[laserfan]

A friend at work just built one... Intel Core i7 940... very close to his old Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650...
I know that wasn't a joke, but Ha, ha! Some of us are still running Pentium P4s! :o

What is giving him pause/heartburn about his upgrade? When *I* finally commit to upgrading from my P4 3.2GHz I was thinking i7 and DDR3, the whole-nine-yards, myself.

[Fishman0919]

I know that wasn't a joke, but Ha, ha! Some of us are still running Pentium P4s! :o

What is giving him pause/heartburn about his upgrade? When *I* finally commit to upgrading from my P4 3.2GHz I was thinking i7 and DDR3, the whole-nine-yards, myself.

He was hoping for a little more I think... being it's DDR3.

The Intel Core i7 940 is a tad slow then the Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 (2.93GHz vs 3.0GHz) but he was hoping with it being DDR3 it would be lot faster. He said it does seem faster but not what he was hoping for.

[Sn8kbordin]

He was hoping for a little more I think... being it's DDR3.

The Intel Core i7 940 is a tad slow then the Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 (2.93GHz vs 3.0GHz) but he was hoping with it being DDR3 it would be lot faster. He said it does seem faster but not what he was hoping for.

Any benchmark numbers to show?