RealVideo 9 Information Thread Discussion

[damrod]

lol

sometimes i shutdown my computer.. windaube need some reboot to work correctly ;-))

and my pc is also my tv so...

btw i'm not a geek ;-))

[karl_lillevold]

kilg0r3: Maybe the reason you did not find constant quality in the docs is that it is called vbrQuality. In any case, here is an audience snippet showing what you need in the <videoStream> section:

<videoStream>
<pluginName type="string">rn-videocodec-realvideo</pluginName>
<codecName type="string">rv10</codecName>
<encodingComplexity type="string">high</encodingComplexity>
<encodingType type="string">vbrQuality</encodingType>
<quality type="uint">85</quality>
<maxStartupLatency type="double">60</maxStartupLatency>
<maxFrameRate type="double">30</maxFrameRate>
<maxKeyFrameInterval type="double">10</maxKeyFrameInterval>
<enableLossProtection type="bool">false</enableLossProtection>
</videoStream>

In this case, avgBitrate is ignored, but remember to set maxBitrate to a very large value (9999999999) so it does not affect the constant quality.

The settings in RealVideo that approximate the ones you mention for XviD, would be what I use for the 1st (reference) pass in the new 2-pass curve compression scheme, that is quantizers 6 and 10. The quality level that corresponds to this is 85.

My computer case is always closed.. What you see is the passive VGA heatsink sticking out (http://www.lillevold.com/files/cube/P3232464%20(Medium).JPG). I wanted to make it as silent as possible, and installed a passive heatsink on the video card, i.e. one without a fan. This is very large, and did not fit inside the XPC (small form factor PC), so I had to make a hole in the case for it :)

[karl_lillevold]

There is finally a separate Helix DNA Codecs (https://helixcommunity.org/beula/download/) section in the file sharing section of the 'distribution' project on helixcommunity.org. This is where I will make available previews, updates, fixes, etc. Note that you need to sign up and agree to the binary EULA to have access to these. If you already have an account, you need to reset your password (since we moved the site to a completely new structure). Follow instructions on the site. There is also a convenient link to subscribe to be notified of any new updates :cool:

Currently, the following files are available:

RealVideo 10 'Elysian'
HE-AAC (racp) fix for RealPlayer 10 Beta
rmeditor update for raac and racp

[kilg0r3]

:stupid: I encoded a sample clip in order to compare it to an xvid clip (fixed quant 2 etc.). Well, it was about three times larger than the xvid file. Why? I need only a few words to explain: ffdshow with avih's noise algo at 32. How could I possibly have known that the helix producer uses directshow ;)!

Anyway, thank you Karl, for the snippet.

BTW: Which switch of producer gives me an fps indication during the encode?

[karl_lillevold]

Originally posted by kilg0r3
Is it just me or ist it still impossible to get to the binaries and the producer documentation on helixcommunity.org? I'd like to read up on the 1 pass quality mode but I don't have a producer distor on the box.
All the binaries incl Helix Producer 10 Preview (which includes documentation) are now back online:

Helix Binary Downloads (https://helixcommunity.org/beula/download/) : Binary file distribution (Codec Previews, Updates, Fixes, Producer Apps & SDK, Server)

Re FPS in Producer: I am afraid this is still a feature on the TODO list.

[damrod]

euhh i try using ativeX dll

when i show the versionstring i got 9.2.0.0...are you sure the zip is those of producer10sdk??

btw i can't startjob....

i filed jobfilename value but the startjob always crash...but the jobfile is good.. producer.exe launch it...

[stevemc]

There was a bug for a while regarding the version returned by GetVersionString. This was fixed but probably not in the build you have. I suggest you get the 10.0 preview SDK at either of the following locations:
https://helixcommunity.org/beula/download/

Or Here:
http://forms.helixcommunity.org/helix/producersdk/index.html

Regarding the StartJob, I'm not sure what is wrong. I suggest you catch the error (On Error with VB6 or Catch with vb.net) and see what the error message is. If that does not give you any clues, send me a code snippet to stevemc@real.com and I'll see if I can find anything.

[damrod]

i dwld the zip today but i will try again...

[stevemc]

Hmmm. Make sure you get the Producer 10 preview version.

I forget when we fixed that version string issue - maybe it was after the 10.0 preview build was released. Rest assured its fixed though.

Let's still try to figure out your crasher issue.

[Sirber]

Would be nice now to have our own forum for RealVideo / Real Audio, since it's popularity gained a lot and is a lot discussed.

[damrod]

yes !!!

with me as Moderator !!! :-))

the devil is back ;-)

[Sirber]

We should start a poll a gain...

[bond]

sirber, this was discussed already and doom9 decided that there will not be an own rv forum...

but to satisfy yourself, simply see the new a/v codecs forum as rv9 forum ;)

[kilg0r3]

@ karl

it really is a shame that I do not have time to do proper tests. Anyway, I just wanted to let you know. I have been doing some encodes of the Potter Trailer at full resolution and ultra high bitrates, ie. vbr constant quality 82-90. I am sorry to say that IMHO Rv10 underperformed xvid and Vp6 showing considerable blocking and flickering. The listed settings below do not exhibit the correct syntax because I put in the alternative values. The audience file looked different of course

<encoderComplexity type="uint">85</encoderComplexity> <enableAutoKeyFrames type="bool">true</enableAutoKeyFrames> <maxConsecutiveBFrames type="uint">0,1,3</maxConsecutiveBFrames> <exactPreview type="bool">true,false</exactPreview> <inloopCutOffQuant type="uint">1 or 12</inloopCutOffQuant> <inloopCutOffCompatible type="bool">always false</inloopCutOffCompatible> <inloopCutOffBUseRefQuant type="bool">always false</inloopCutOffBUseRefQuant>

<encodingType type="string">vbrQuality</encodingType> <quality type="uint">82,85,90</quality>

Properties of one example clip extracted with rmvbext:

Stream number : 0
Maximum bitrate : 47263000 bits/s
Average bitrate : 2417851 bits/s
Maximum packet size : 16009 bytes
Average packet size : 5872 bytes
Time offset : 0 ms ( 00:00:00.0 )
Prebuffering : 1037 ms ( 00:00:01.037 )
Duration : 122960 ms ( 00:02:02.960 )
Stream name : Video Stream
MIME type : video/x-pn-realvideo
Video resolution : 688x428
I suspect that Rv10, understandably, might not be optimised for Dvd-like bitrates.

Cheers, kilg0r3

[karl_lillevold]

kilg0r3: I rarely use fixed quality, but I think something must have gone wrong with your encode or settings, if you are seeing considerable blocking and flickering at such a high fixed quality. I have been doing some very high bitrate full anamorphic encodes with the new rate control, and those look very nice.

Thanks for the feedback, but you really need to provide some more information for it to be very useful, for instance rmeditor a few seconds of the resulting RM file and send to me, along with the job file you used.

[kilg0r3]

Hm, hm, I will see, if I get around to check the encoding chain, cut out a piece and probably do some further testing. Sorry for kicking up dust.

[karl_lillevold]

No problem, if there is a bug, I would definitely like to fix it. Please take a look in this XviD post on how to report a potential bug: XviD: What You Must Do When Posting Bugs/Problems! (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=24924) Not all applies to RealVideo bugs, but much of the same information is useful for us.

Other useful tools to be aware of are the visualization support in the RealVideo 10 'Elysian' decoder DLLs. With strength set to 1 and visualizations to 2, you get a useful display when playing back the video of which quants were used for each frame. If they appear too high, compared to the fixed quality you were using, there is for instance a problem. And of course, the rv9log.txt file from the encoder, since it contains both quants and PSNR for every frame.

Thanks!

[bond]

in accordance with karl_lillevold i now splitted the whole discussion behind the rv9 sticky and moved it to a separate thread
we think that it doesnt make much sense to have a 29 page long discussion as a sticky cause you are not able to find any info there you are searching for anymore anyways.
different discussion points should be discussed in extra threads and not packed into a single one

i also ask you guys for not using the rv9 sticky anymore for any discussions, the sticky should be a point where newbies can have a look at when they are searching for quick info or for the old ones which are too lazy to use search ;)

thanks for your understanding
bond

[Sirber]

Why not making a new forum since there is lots of threads related to RV9?

[karl_lillevold]

I am happy with the current state of things; I would prefer to stay in the New A/V Formats - Codecs forum, and not have a separate forum. For one, I like to keep track of everything else going on there, but I also do not think there is enough discussion on Real formats to support a whole new forum..

[Sirber]

Things will be different once YS RealAnime will be out :)

[Sirber]

Describes the type of presentation (if it is audio only or
audio and video). This setting allows different audio streams, one
that uses a higher bit rate for audio-only presentations and one that
uses a lower bit rate for audio-video presentations, to be assigned
in an audience. The setting is used at runtime to determine what
audio codec to use.

Default:
audio-video

Values:
audio-video, audio-only

Type:
string

Example:
<presentationType type="string">audio-video</presentationType>I don't uderstand the codec selection thing they talk about. What if I use audio-video and I encode only audio? What if I encode video only and no audio?

[Marcel]

Hum, if I got it right, it is this way:
You can specify four different audio codecs in an audience file:
(A) presentationType audio-video, audio mode voice
(B) presentationType audio-video, audio mode music
(C) presentationType audio-only, audio mode voice
(D) presentationType audio-only, audio mode music

If you feed the producer with an audio-only file, it will choose (C) or (D), regarding the command line option "-am <voice|music>", else (A) or (B), and will encode no audio at all (even no silence), when the source file contains no audio (but will, if the source file contains a silent audio stream).
IIRC, if you provide an incomplete audience file to the producer, it won't encode anything, but cancel with an error message.

Or am I telling you nuts you already have in your pocket?

[Sirber]

Thanks. Everything is clear now :D