LAV Filters - DirectShow Media Splitter and Decoders

[max79]

...If something doesn't work, test with and report to ffmpeg.
Nev, please have a look-
http://trac.ffmpeg.org/ticket/6534
http://trac.ffmpeg.org/ticket/6535
http://trac.ffmpeg.org/ticket/6536#comment:1
what can I do next to help get this resolved?

[DragonQ]

I don't know why nevcairiel don't want spend about 5 minutes to add h265 10bit hardware acceleration via CUVID in WinXP by implementing 100% working code in LAV Filters https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/145 and then officially stop WinXP support in LAV Filters. All people using WinXP (I often see here in the bottom of posts too) will know i.e. 0.70.3 is last fully functional in WinXP version of LAV Filters and if they have (or buy) GM206-based videocard h265 10bit hardware acceleration via CUVID must work in their old sweet WinXP. I believe that's right.
PS. May be nevcairiel affraid National Security Agency (NSA) prohibit using WinXP to easier watch for people all over the world? ;)
I don't understand the problem. If you've written the patch but nevcairiel has refused the pull request then just host a fork with that patch applied. You and anyone else with Windows XP can use it, at least unless/until the underlying code gets rewritten.

[RealSnoopyDog]

I don't know why nevcairiel don't want spend about 5 minutes to add h265 10bit hardware acceleration via CUVID in WinXP by implementing 100% working code in LAV Filters
Why don't you spend some of your free time to change the code so that it meets you personal requirements? LAV is open source, ffmpeg and libbluray also, so everyone can locally change the software. nev does not need to do anything because he also has a normal life like all of us... I think this is kind of unfair.

I i were nevcairiel i also would not waste my time to support Windows XP. XP is way deprecated and has many disadvantages - also for a multimedia platform.

And if you need to add workarounds, hacks, tweaks only for Windows XP, then this is not good for the code base

[clsid]

This contains that patch:
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1812598#post1812598

[VictorLS]

clsid
Thanks.

RealSnoopyDog
I believe while nevcairiel not stopped support WinXP he have to do some LITTLE (just insert some written by Aleksoid1978 strings of code) work to his LAV Filters to all people have more choice. I don't want to discuss with you disadvantages of Win7-10 in my case - if you want read my posts in this thread.
I have this patched decoder for a long time (so I'm personally not interested in this patch but we Russians usually take care about all world although many foreign people not understand how and why) and it work almost perfect in WinXP and I'm sure I'm not one on the planet Earth who need this (HW acceleration of h265 10bit i.e. from SATs in WinXP) feature, read i.e. fresh post here https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1810680#post1810680
I just want all people in the world who like WinXP (especially SAT amateurs as I am) use ready fresh solution not compiling anything.

[strumf666]

Why don't you go pester M$ support, to update winxp so it will work with LAV filters as it is.

[rock]

hi VictorLS, maybe you could get this feature from unofficial build, like codec pack (K-Lite, Shark007).

[stax76]

Sorry but what is SAT?

[VictorLS]

stax76
SAT is satellite. Most of ~20 4K channels are being translated from SATs in h265 10bit format and we can watch them in WinXP only with patched LAV Video Decoder.

rock
I hope get new versions of LAV Filters from MPC-HC by clsid now https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1812899#post1812899 (if vevcairiel wouldn't add this patch in LAV Filters in a future).

[stax76]

I hope your channels don't suck like where I live.

[VictorLS]

stax76
Most of 4K channels available (not encrypted) from SATs are demo (incl. Fashion 4K) now but I hope in a future watch 4K channels with good content.

clsid
I've taken files from x86 LAVFilters dir to KMPlayer in same manner as I do with patched by Aleksoid1978 files but h265 10bit file don't accelerated in WinXP - Active decoder avcodec in this case (
Same with mpchc_x86_1.7.13_20170717 version.
PS. h265 8bit are accelerated well as with non-patched decoder.

[clsid]

I can only test on Windows 7. I don't care much about XP and certainly not about kmplayer. Try with MPC-HC.

[VictorLS]

clsid
I've already written "Same with mpchc_x86_1.7.13_20170717 version." to mention cause in decocoder, not in your version MPC-HC.

[v0lt]

nevcairiel
I noticed a color distortion when converting YCgCo to RGB48. Conversion to RGB32 works fine.

[rack04]

Is there anything in LAV Filters that changed between LAVFilters-0.70.2-4 and LAVFilters-0.70.2-7 that would result in dropped frames and presentation glitches with madVR? When I installed LAVFilters-0.70.2-4 I get good playback with madVR but when I install LAVFilters-0.70.2-7 I get significant dropped frames and presentation glitches. Let me know what information I can provide to troubleshoot. Thanks.

[Asmodian]

I recently got a Creative AE-5 which supports 384 KHz audio modes (for some reason). However, when I enable any of them I don't get any audio from LAV Audio. Is this expected? I do get sound from other applications.

Win 10 Pro 1703, Zoom Player MAX v13.7.1, LAV Audio Decoder 0.70.2.

I do not consider this an issue, I am only reporting it. 32 bit, 192 KHz is fine for my use case. ;)

[LigH]

May depend on the audio output technology, and whether it allows drivers (or the "Wave Mapper") to upsample on their own, or requires provision of the audio in native sampling rate? ... Just guessing. In general, 384 kHz sounds a lot like "placebo for audiophiles" (similar to gold-plated digital cables) :sly:

[nevcairiel]

LAV just decodes the audio its given, it does not handle output or talking to the soundcard in any way - thats the job of the audio renderer.

[Asmodian]

I didn't even think to check the audio renderer. :o

Sure enough, after switching from "Default DirectSound Device" to "Speakers (Sound BlasterX AE-5)" I get audio even when set to 32 bit, 384 KHz. :)

[P.J]

Does Nvidia DSR have any effect in upscaling 1080p videos on 4k display?

[nevcairiel]

LAV just decodes the video to its native resolution, anything that happens beyond that is not quite related to LAV Video.

[el Filou]

Does Nvidia DSR have any effect in upscaling 1080p videos on 4k display?
It would make the video renderer upscale the 1080p video to more than 2160p, then the GPU would downscale it to your display's 2160p.
Juste a waste of GPU power when applying it to video playback IMHO.

[VictorLS]

nevcairiel, does not being registered in WinXP LAV Filters 0.70.2.1 from LAVFilters folder of 32bit MPC-HC 1.7.13.60 mean you stop support WinXP without h265 10bit patch?

[nevcairiel]

How mpc-hc builds their copy of LAV is unrelated to what I do. But I still have no plans to apply any such hacks, and as stated before LAV will quite likely also drop XP support in the next release.

[lvqcl]

MPC-HC doesn't support WinXP anymore, so their version of LAVFilters doesn't support it too.

https://github.com/mpc-hc/mpc-hc/commit/3e5afbc869f00f11d5b8349156185719814dbaf3

[VictorLS]

nevcairiel, I still hope you'll change your opinion and will implement h265 10bit 'hack' in your LAV Filters before you drop XP support and I (and many other SAT amateurs who use WinXP with GM206-based videocards) will use that last pre-release version of LAV Filters and will remember you with good words ;)

[lvqcl]

https://www.quora.com/How-do-I-deal-with-people-who-wont-take-no-for-an-answer

[ryrynz]

XP is dead, move on. EOD.

[rack04]

Is there anything in LAV Filters that changed between LAVFilters-0.70.2-4 and LAVFilters-0.70.2-7 that would result in dropped frames and presentation glitches with madVR? When I installed LAVFilters-0.70.2-4 I get good playback with madVR but when I install LAVFilters-0.70.2-7 I get significant dropped frames and presentation glitches. Let me know what information I can provide to troubleshoot. Thanks.

Just wanted to bump this post as I can reliably reproduce this between LAVFilters-0.70.2-4 and LAVFilters-0.70.2-7.

Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit
MPC-BE.1.5.1.2745.x64
madVR v0.91.11
LAVFilters-0.70.2-7
NVIDIA 385.12

Trying to play this file using DXVA2 (copy-back) results in dropped frames and presentation glitches in madVR. Works fine with NVIDIA CUVID.

General
Complete name : H:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB
Format : MPEG-PS
File size : 1 024 MiB
Duration : 34 min 48 s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 4 112 kb/s

Video
ID : 224 (0xE0)
Format : MPEG Video
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : Main@Main
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Custom
Format settings, GOP : Variable
Duration : 34 min 48 s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 3 583 kb/s
Maximum bit rate : 9 000 kb/s
Width : 720 pixels
Height : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Scan order : 2:3 Pulldown
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.432
Time code of first frame : 00:00:00:00
Time code source : Group of pictures header
Stream size : 892 MiB (87%)

Audio
ID : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Format settings, Endianness : Big
Muxing mode : DVD-Video
Duration : 34 min 48 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 448 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Bit depth : 16 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 112 MiB (11%)
Service kind : Complete Main

Text
ID : 189 (0xBD)-32 (0x20)
Format : RLE
Format/Info : Run-length encoding
Muxing mode : DVD-Video
Duration : 34 min 45 s
Delay relative to video : 867 ms

Menu

[NikosD]

@nevcairiel

Just see it as a last minute favor, before abandoning for good WinXP support, for all these people with poor incomes or great peculiarity who insist on that OS.

If it's not a great deal of work for you, it will be the last time involving with that Windows version.

[lvqcl]

for all these people with poor incomes

Poor people that want to watch 4K 10bit satellite video?

If it's not a great deal of work for you

clsid added (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1812899#post1812899) this patch to his build of MPC-HC and then VictorLS reported (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1813115#post1813115) that it doesn't work as expected. So probably it requires some debugging.

[nevcairiel]

Just wanted to bump this post as I can reliably reproduce this between LAVFilters-0.70.2-4 and LAVFilters-0.70.2-7.

[..]

Trying to play this file using DXVA2 (copy-back) results in dropped frames and presentation glitches in madVR. Works fine with NVIDIA CUVID.

That should hopefully be resolved.

[VictorLS]

Poor people that want to watch 4K 10bit satellite video?
If say more exact - people (mostly SAT amateurs) that don't want spend any extra money (for newer then WinXP version of Windows -> Hardware -> unlimited Internet -> Antivirus ->... -> World)) to achieve great results (if it's achievable at all) - Aleksoid1978 proves that h265 10bit hardware acceleration via CUVID works quite well in WinXP with this https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/145 patch code and he hasn't WinXP and GM206-based videocard as clsid too). So most of work was done.
So probably it requires some debugging.
May be you're right but I'm sure nevcairiel (if he'll wish) will workable implement that code from the first time.
@nevcairiel
If it's not a great deal of work for you, it will be the last time involving with that Windows version.
Thank you for support my idea - I believe it's so logical too so there isn't any risk - if some will be wrong people always can use pre-last WinXP version of LAV Filters.
Besides, nevcairiel has implemented h265 10bit hardware acceleration via CUVID and switching off DXVA processing (to remove artifacts on some streams) for Win7 and newer I'm talking about in last year but don't want implement for WinXP - it's not logical on my own.

[rack04]

That should hopefully be resolved.

Appears to be fixed in LAVFilters-0.70.2-8. Thanks!

[wanezhiling]

https://www.sendspace.com/file/dibo8i
blackscreen

[clsid]

That file seems broken:[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] Overread SPS by 8 bits
[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] SPS 0 does not exist.
[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] Overread SPS by 8 bits
[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] SPS 0 does not exist.
[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] PPS id out of range: 0
[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] Error parsing NAL unit #3.
[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] PPS id out of range: 0
[hevc @ 00000000004a3080] Error parsing NAL unit #0.
...

[FDisk80]

Just wanted to bump this post as I can reliably reproduce this between LAVFilters-0.70.2-4 and LAVFilters-0.70.2-7.

Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit
MPC-BE.1.5.1.2745.x64
madVR v0.91.11
LAVFilters-0.70.2-7
NVIDIA 385.12

Trying to play this file using DXVA2 (copy-back) results in dropped frames and presentation glitches in madVR. Works fine with NVIDIA CUVID.

Can confirm this.
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1814235#post1814235

I thought it was an issue after updating the nvidia drivers.

[nevcairiel]

This issue was not related to drivers and has already been resolved in more recent versions of LAV.

[FDisk80]

This issue was not related to drivers and has already been resolved in more recent versions of LAV.

Yes. I see, DXVA was fixed in latest version. :) Awesome!

[FDisk80]

This issue was not related to drivers and has already been resolved in more recent versions of LAV.

I'm not sure that it was completely fixed.
Was watching GOT last night and that small freeze happened again. But it was much shorter than before. About 1 or 2 seconds instead of 4 or 5 seconds like before.

- Windows 10 x64 v10.0.15063
- nVidia v385.12
- MPC-BE (64-bit) v1.5.1 (build 2363)
- madVR v0.91.11 [fullscreen exclusive mode, 1080p @23.976hz]
- LAV v0.70.2.12 [DVXA2 (copy-back)] [10-bit P010]

Tried with NVIDIA CUVID and didn't see that small freeze.

[nevcairiel]

The issue was that DXVA2 wasn't used at all, and that issue is resolved. If you're seeing anything else, its likely your setup.
There haven't been any changes other to how DXVA2 is started - which resulted in it not being used in a few rare cases - but once its setup it still behaves just like it did in 0.70.2 and before. So if you confirm that DXVA2 is actually in use, then there are no differences to before.

[FDisk80]

The issue was that DXVA2 wasn't used at all, and that issue is resolved. If you're seeing anything else, its likely your setup.
There haven't been any changes other to how DXVA2 is started - which resulted in it not being used in a few rare cases - but once its setup it still behaves just like it did in 0.70.2 and before. So if you confirm that DXVA2 is actually in use, then there are no differences to before.

It is active.
For now changing to NVIDIA CUVID solves the issue completely.
I'm not sure what could be wrong with my setup. It worked fine with DXVA2 before I updated nvidia driver, LAV and madVR to latest versions.

[nevcairiel]

Well if you upgrade 3 components in one go, then isolating the problem to one particular component should be the first step, instead of randomly guessing what might be to blame. :)
The NVIDIA drivers also sometimes reset their power management on upgrades, it should be Adaptive at least, Optimimum Power is too aggressive in power savings. CUVID can work around that particular issue by forcing the GPU into max power mode (which is a sideeffect of using CUDA).

[rack04]

What determines audio sync? I've noticed for the past couple of weeks that the audio and video become out of sync using the latest madVR, LAV Filters, and MPC-BE. If I skip to a place in the video the audio gets back in sync with the video. I'm not experiencing dropped frames with madVR. Which program would set this sync? I'm viewing retail Blu-ray and DVD. Thanks.

[ryrynz]

I haven't experienced anything recently although I did about a week or so ago but I'm always updating.. Not sure if it was the media or something else but it appears it's gone/fixed now. Grab the latest nightly lav and Mpc-be.

[AngelGraves13]

What determines audio sync? I've noticed for the past couple of weeks that the audio and video become out of sync using the latest madVR, LAV Filters, and MPC-BE. If I skip to a place in the video the audio gets back in sync with the video. I'm not experiencing dropped frames with madVR. Which program would set this sync? I'm viewing retail Blu-ray and DVD. Thanks.

Same here if I move the media player to another monitor/screen.

[nevcairiel]

Sync is generally provided by the timestamps and maintained by the audio and video renderers.

[Prinz]

I have a problem since version: LAVFilters-0.70.2-10

DTS Bitstreaming results in very choppy playback, MadVR says suddenly clock derivation 30 - 50% and it's visibility dropping frames every second. Installing LAVFilters-0.70.2-8 or previous everything works fine and i get only 1 frame drop every few hours and clock derivation is again ok in MadVR OSD.

AC3 Bitstreaming hasn't this problem and works fine in current LAV too.

Using Nvidia 1060 via HDMI to AVR/TV.

[nevcairiel]

DTS Bitstreaming results in very choppy playback, MadVR says suddenly clock derivation 30 - 50% and it's visibility dropping frames every second. Installing LAVFilters-0.70.2-8 or previous everything works fine and i get only 1 frame drop every few hours and clock derivation is again ok in MadVR OSD.

This should be fixed in the next build.
Thanks for testing and reporting. :)

[clsid]

Is the D3D11 hw decoder supposed to be working yet? If so, what are its requirements and benefits?

[nevcairiel]

It probably requires Windows 8 or newer, but should otherwise work. Its unclear yet if it can be made work on 7 properly. More details will be announced later.

[madshi]

I believe it will only work in Windows 8+, based on this:

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/bb173059(v=vs.85).aspx

DXGI_FORMAT_NV12

[...]

Direct3D 11.1: This value is not supported until Windows 8.
However, some of the things that used to only work on Windows 8, are working in Windows 7 after having installed the Platform Update, so it's not 100% clear just yet. But my guesstimate is that it won't work in Windows 7.

[clsid]

It doesn't work here on 7 (with platform update).

[nevcairiel]

To get it to work on 7 at all you can load the decoder through the d3d11 api with a DX 9.3 profile, the DX11.1 profile doesn't work on 7. Alas, this is not done. But I do not know if it would still break on creating NV12 textures, though.
In any case, I need to setup 7 on an actual hardware box to see about this at a later time.

[el Filou]

Hi nev, does that mean we'll be able to use that decoder to get bit exact quality chroma input with madVR without having to use DXVA2 Copy-Back?
DXVA2 Copy-Back suffers from much lower decode performance on my old system (can't watch 4K50/60), even with a modern graphics card, so that would be awesome news.

[FDisk80]

Well if you upgrade 3 components in one go, then isolating the problem to one particular component should be the first step, instead of randomly guessing what might be to blame. :)
The NVIDIA drivers also sometimes reset their power management on upgrades, it should be Adaptive at least, Optimimum Power is too aggressive in power savings. CUVID can work around that particular issue by forcing the GPU into max power mode (which is a sideeffect of using CUDA).

It was the 8-bit H264 -> 10-bit P010 output format conversion.
Enabling 8-Bit NV12 output format solved the DXVA2 (copy-back) issue.

[nevcairiel]

It was the 8-bit H264 -> 10-bit P010 output format conversion.
Enabling 8-Bit NV12 output format solved the DXVA2 (copy-back) issue.

That might do it. It would disable direct mode, which increases performance cost, on top of needing extra processing anyway.

Its always best to output as close to the original as you can (basically, don't turn stuff off).

[ryrynz]

DXVA2 Copy-Back suffers from much lower decode performance on my old system (can't watch 4K50/60), even with a modern graphics card, so that would be awesome news.

Grab the nightly and test.

[nevcairiel]

Clearly such a feature would require support in the renderer as well, so watch out for that. :) Without that, it only does copy-back, although it appears even to be a tad bit faster then DXVA2-CB, not that this would really matter in playback scenarios.

[DragonQ]

I currently have a Celeron G530 (2c/2t Sandy Bridge @ 2.4 GHz) in my HTPC, which is used pretty much only for HEVC playback since my GT 430 handles MPEG2, MPEG4, and AVC. I have a Celeron G1620 (2c/2t Ivy Bridge @ 2.7 GHz) in my file server. I also have a spare Core i3-3220 (2c/4t Ivy Bridge @ 3.3 GHz), which I want to put into one of those two systems, depending on where it'd be most useful. Would there be any benefit in terms of improved HEVC decoding ability if I put either the Core i3-3320 into the HTPC? For example, being able to handle higher bit rates or colour depths? I'm struggling to find benchmarks of software HEVC decoding using avcodec.

EDIT: If there's a better thread to ask this in please let me know.

[el Filou]

@DragonQ personally, I'd put the i3 in the HTPC. If the only thing your server is doing is serving files, then a faster CPU won't change much as it's pretty much only the storage subsystem and RAM that matters.

Grab the nightly and test.Minimum frame rate is better, but still no luck overall:
0.70.2: 36-41 fps
0.70.2-35: 39-41 fps

I think my chipset/RAM is really too slow.

(FYI, 0.70.2-35 DX11: 32-33 fps)

[nevcairiel]

For the real gain you'll need to wait for an updated madVR - which is scheduled for sometime this week. Note that you won't really be able to benchmark that mode, since only madVR will be able to understand it (for now), but you can of course do real-world tests to see if it works smoothly.
Performance wise I would expect it to be similar to DXVA2 native, without the quality drawbacks.

[DragonQ]

@DragonQ personally, I'd put the i3 in the HTPC. If the only thing your server is doing is serving files, then a faster CPU won't change much as it's pretty much only the storage subsystem and RAM that matters.
I think you're right that most of the stuff it does is I/O or bandwidth limited rather than CPU limited:

Serving files
Serving Windows Updates
Calculating FlexRAID parity nightly*
Backup files nightly
Running background downloads
Hosting a VPN
Hosting a web server (file sharing, SubSonic, WebMediaPortal, etc.)

The starred item would probably benefit from greater CPU power but it's rare that it has to do a long recalculation anyway. Whenever my girlfriend upgrades her gaming PC I'll be able to nab her Core i5-2500K too but that could be years away. I could even retire my X5650 system but that'd be a terrible server since it uses so much power!

[huhn]

is d3d11 headless mode also planned for the next release?

[DragonQ]

Using my AMD RX 480, when I attempt to play this sample file (https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwxFVkl63-lEdVBuZkltckdZZ0k/view) (2160p60, HEVC, 10b, 25 Mb/s) at 1440p using DXVA2 copy-back I get 100% GPU usage and it's nowhere near playable. Same for CPU decoding, even with 12 virtual cores. However, when I play it using DXVA2 native, I just get a black screen. The GPU is doing something since usage is around 50% and MadVR says frames are taking ~10 ms to render, but I can't see anything. Should I be able to play this file using DXVA2 native using this GPU?

I even tried turning everything in MadVR down to nearest neighbour but it made no difference to either the GPU usage or black screen.

[nevcairiel]

Should I be able to play this file using DXVA2 native using this GPU?

10-bit DXVA2-Native is rather broken on AMD in conjunction with madVR (driver bugs, i'm told).

You can try a nightly LAV and the latest madVR, and test D3D11 mode - assuming you are on Windows 8 or newer.

[aufkrawall]

Thx a lot for D3D11VA support, nev.
I did some tests and here are my conclusions vs. DXVA2 (copyback) regarding quality on a GTX 1070 with driver 385.28 on Windows 10 Creators Update 1 + madVR (deband off, dithered 8 bit output):

DXVA2 native doesn't show banding anymore (?) with HEVC 10 bit Rec.709 content
DXVA2 native shows most excessive banding with HEVC 10 bit Rec.2020 HDR content
It still shows nasty chroma blur with H.264 8 bit
I don't have a proper sample to test chroma blur with 10 bit content, so can't say if it would also show chroma blur with DXVA2 native (I personally would expect the worst)
It seems DXVA2 native doesn't increase banding anymore (?) of 8 bit H.264 sources
D3D11VA doesn't seem to show any banding at all with any of the mentioned content
D3D11VA also doesn't show any chroma blur
Both points also apply to DXVA2 copyback (of course we already knew that)


And now, a interesting point which has often been excluded: performance.

I assumed my graphics card's power consumption by multiplying the average percentage value of the reported power target with the card's measured 100% power target, which is ~180W for this MSI 1070 Gaming X. Nvidia Inspector and hwinfo64 can read out values in Watts, but they don't seem to be realistic for some reasons (way too high).
I again tested with a HEVC 10 bit Rec.2020 HDR 4k 60fps video, downscaled to 1440p with reasonable quality settings.

d3d11va: ~32% Power -> ~58W ~55% GPU usage @ 1.45GHz @ 2.3GB VRAM
dxva2-copyback: ~54% Power -> ~97W ~68% GPU usage @ 2GHz 2.5GB VRAM

So, copyback mode can have a huge impact on power consumption and performance, and even may prevent you from using better madVR quality settings.

-> D3D11VA seems to be golden.

[BetA13]

hmmm, just a quick question.
The DXVA11 mode doesnt work for win 7, does it?
cause it doesnt work for me, it uses CPU instead..i mean the GPU isnt listed and not used when using DXVA11..

sorry if this has allready been answered but i didnt find it..

greetz

[Zetti]

hmmm, just a quick question.
The DXVA11 mode doesnt work for win 7, does it?
cause it doesnt work for me, it uses CPU instead..i mean the GPU isnt listed and not used when using DXVA11..

sorry if this has allready been answered but i didnt find it..

greetz
Read nevcairiel's last post in post #22109

[nevcairiel]

D3D11 decoding is not supported on Windows 7, and after some testing it also seems like that won't change. The NV12 texture format is not available on 7, which makes the entire process impossible.
One could perhaps do a low-quality thing that outputs RGB directly, but we already have DXVA2-Native which operates on a similar concept.

I'll probably add a note about that in the LAV config. I thought about just hiding the option entirely, but perhaps its good to show people what they are missing (also, they might come here asking where it is since they heard about it)

[mitchmalibu]

Just wanted to say, really great stuff on the DXVA11 mode: it handles my hdr 60fps demo clips perfectly, which I wasn't able to do previously. Between you and madshi, the htpc world really made huge steps forward in a matter of months.

[DragonQ]

10-bit DXVA2-Native is rather broken on AMD in conjunction with madVR (driver bugs, i'm told).

You can try a nightly LAV and the latest madVR, and test D3D11 mode - assuming you are on Windows 8 or newer.
I'm running the latest MadVR and latest LAV Filters nightly but still get a black screen in DXVA2 native. I'm currently on the previous WHQL driver (17.4.4) due to severe game performance issues with the latest one (17.7.2), I wonder if that driver solves this problem?

However, D3D11 mode seems to work. I can play the sample clip in fullscreen with ~50% GPU usage using "ReconSoft" chroma and "Catmull-Rom AR" luma. :)

[ryrynz]

Why wonder? Take you a few minutes to know for certain.

[mogli]

I saw the video decoder showing D3D11 cb direct mode instead of native. How and why is that activated?

[madshi]

LAV auto switches to D3D11 copyback ("D3D11 cb") if the video renderer doesn't support the required communication interface for native D3D11 DXVA. So e.g. if you activate D3D11 decoding for EVR, or for an old (anything older than 0.92.0) madVR version, you'll get D3D11 copyback.

[mogli]

OK, but renderer was madVR 0.92.1 which generally uses D3D11 native. Maybe just a hickup.

[madshi]

If you can find a way to reproduce it somehow, please let us know how!

[nevcairiel]

Of course there also cannot be anything between LAV Video and madVR, ie. no ffdshow video processing or anyhting of that sort. native requires a clean direct connection.

[strumf666]

That includes ffdshow raw which is needed for SVP? And SVP?

[ryrynz]

Yes, as Nev said, nothing between LAV and madVR.

[strumf666]

No offense, I would like a confirmation from Nev or Madshi.

[rock]

sample
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3v0PVuQfH99TktaTHpBMWtNXzA/view?usp=sharing (got this sample from someone on CCCP forums)
this cut plays file with MPC-HC v1.7.13.65 (LAVFilters v0.70.2.1) and looks like capture below with MPC-HC v1.7.13.89 (LAVFilters v0.70.2.35)

capture
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3v0PVuQfH99WmNRejRCSkhaUHM/view?usp=sharing

[ryrynz]

No offense, I would like a confirmation from Nev or Madshi.

It's a direct interface, ffdshow hasn't been developed for years. Of course it's not going to support a new interface just recently developed. No lines to read between here..

[nevcairiel]

That includes ffdshow raw which is needed for SVP? And SVP?

"no ffdshow or anything" should have been pretty clear. Post-processing filters of any sort don't get access to the image when this is used.
Its the same limitation that DXVA2-Native had. It requires a direct connection between decoder and renderer, no intermediate steps.

[nevcairiel]

sample
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3v0PVuQfH99TktaTHpBMWtNXzA/view?usp=sharing (got this sample from someone on CCCP forums)
this cut plays file with MPC-HC v1.7.13.65 (LAVFilters v0.70.2.1) and looks like capture below with MPC-HC v1.7.13.89 (LAVFilters v0.70.2.35)

capture
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3v0PVuQfH99WmNRejRCSkhaUHM/view?usp=sharing

Old x264 4:4:4 predictive (lossless) encodes are not standards conformant, and if someone had the brilliant foresight to remove the x264 metadata that identifies them as such, then it cannot be helped.

Standards conformant decoding will always be preferred, for a simple reason: You can identify broken x264 encodes (if the metadata has NOT been removed), but you cannot do the opposite (ie. identify a file as being encoded properly, one has to assume that).

[sneaker_ger]

Best to decode these older lossless files with older ffmpeg and encode with recent x264 (add --no-8x8dct for best compatibilty with older ffmpeg). We discussed that in the x264 dev thread.

/edit:
Ah, the sample isn't lossless. With non-lossless 4:4:4 you are kinda fucked because you can't fix it losslessly.

and if someone had the brilliant foresight to remove the x264 metadata
Probably just because of the mkvmerge splitting. The metadata-SEI is only at the first GOP so only the first part will have it after splitting. No splitting, no problem.

[DragonQ]

Why wonder? Take you a few minutes to know for certain.

By a few minutes you mean about an hour (to upgrade, redo my GPU undervolt and overclock, do some testing, run DDU, reboot, reinstall old drivers, reconfigure monitor FreeSync range, redo GPU undervolt and overclock again). I've tried 17.7.2 driver twice already and both times had to revert due to gaming issues, I don't want to waste time again until they at least release a new version.

[ryrynz]

Create a restore point, upgrade, test and possibly restore back. Or will that not work? Skip the other things to test what matters, the driver.

[nussman]

Hi nevcairiel,

there seems to be a problem with "onthefly" format changes when using LAV DXVA D3D11 native with madVR.
I am using DVBViewer for LiveTV and the player freezes when I am zapping i.e from ARD HD (H.264 720p50) to ServusTV HD (H.264 1050i50).
DVBViewer (by default) does not rebuild the directshow graph if you zapping from h.264 to another h.264 channel, but you can force DVBViewer to do a rebuild on every channel Change and that fixes the problem (but increases zapping times a little bit ;) ).

By the way "onthefly" changes are working with EVR Renderer and DXVA D3D11 copyback.


P.S.
My system: Win 8.1, AMD RX 460
and thanks for the new version. :)

[nevcairiel]

I am using DVBViewer for LiveTV and the player freezes when I am zapping i.e from ARD HD (H.264 720p50) to ServusTV HD (H.264 1050i50).

Size changes are not fully supported yet, it appears madVR needs to change something to make that work still, but we're on it.
Note that deinterlacing of any sort is also not available with D3D11-Native mode quite yet, so for TV it may not be the best choice yet.

[madshi]

Size changes are not fully supported yet, it appears madVR needs to change something to make that work still, but we're on it.
Yes, that part is madVR's fault. nevcairiel already notified me about this problem before 0.92.0 release, but I decided to release 0.92.0, anyway, so users could already start testing...

[DragonQ]

I currently have a Celeron G530 (2c/2t Sandy Bridge @ 2.4 GHz) in my HTPC, which is used pretty much only for HEVC playback since my GT 430 handles MPEG2, MPEG4, and AVC. I have a Celeron G1620 (2c/2t Ivy Bridge @ 2.7 GHz) in my file server. I also have a spare Core i3-3220 (2c/4t Ivy Bridge @ 3.3 GHz), which I want to put into one of those two systems, depending on where it'd be most useful. Would there be any benefit in terms of improved HEVC decoding ability if I put either the Core i3-3320 into the HTPC? For example, being able to handle higher bit rates or colour depths? I'm struggling to find benchmarks of software HEVC decoding using avcodec.

EDIT: If there's a better thread to ask this in please let me know.

Replaced the Celeron G530 with the Core i3-3220. HEVC Benchmark Tool scores have increased by ~60% (surprised it wasn't higher since it has a 38% higher clock speed plus SMT). According to that it should be able to handle 1080p24 HEVC at all realistic bit rates and 2160p24 HEVC at up to ~10 Mb/s but I'm not sure if the benchmark is for Main or Main 10. Most 2160p sample videos I have are either AVC or 60 FPS (which it'll have no chance with)...will have to hunt down some more!

[aufkrawall]

With new nightlies, you can select the device for d3d11va. However, it doesn't stick yet and thus doesn't work.
Tested with Skylake IGP.

[mrcorbo]

With new nightlies, you can select the device for d3d11va. However, it doesn't stick yet and thus doesn't work.
Tested with Skylake IGP.

Is it because of this?

"The selected D3D11 device is only used in copy-back mode. In native mode the renderer determines the device used."

[nevcairiel]

With new nightlies, you can select the device for d3d11va. However, it doesn't stick yet and thus doesn't work.
Tested with Skylake IGP.

I didn't quite finish this last night, but the next build should properly save and load the setting. As mrcorbo said, it won't work in native mode however.

[aufkrawall]

"not in native mode" means it looks like software decoding to the renderer? Does that come with any drawback?
Edit: What comes to my mind is that probably no deinterlacing can be done on the GPU which isn't used for rendering.

Could d3d11va deinterlacing be faster than the current deinterlacing used by madVR and which also works with software decoding/copyback?

[nevcairiel]

"not native mode" means copy-back, just like with DXVA2.

[aufkrawall]

"not native mode" means copy-back, just like with DXVA2.
I thought so. Well, I don't think that's any problem since there has to be copying anyway and it probably won't load additional load on the dGPU, unlike copyback used on the same GPU for both rendering and decoding.
Or am I missing something?

[XinHong]

Is it possible to get D3D11VA without a D3D11 graphics card ?

Because I have an Intel HD3300 (DirectX 10.1) & MadVR 0.92.1 and I get a green screen. If I switch to the GT525M (DirectX 11) it's OK.

Thanks

[aufkrawall]

Yes, I tested it on a 9600 Gt on Windows 10. However, madVR isn't working with DX11 on this card, and with DX9, the decoder falls back to copy mode (and so it's also the case for EVR).
Edit: oh, you mentioned a green screen. That's the result I got as well.
So either it's not working in native mode without DX11 hardware, or madVR DX11 doesn't work with non-DX11 hardware (I'd probably bet on the latter one).

Edit: Windows 10 video app uses DX11, so it uses D3D11VA decoding as well. It works without a green screen on the 9600 Gt. Very likely a madVR issue then.

[madshi]

I'm not sure if that's my problem or LAV's problem? Could be that my D3D11 pixel shader is somehow not compatible with DX9 GPUs. Or could be that the D3D11 device created by LAV needs to be created with different flags? I don't know. nevcairiel, what do you think?

[nevcairiel]

No idea without any hardware at hand. I can go dig in my GPU bin to see if i still have something that old but yet still with decoding support.
Check with EVR if copy-back works, as one intermediate step? That'll tell you if decoding works.

The best, er.., worst, I can do is apparently a GTX 260-216, which is a DX10 GPU. Will test that tomorrow.

[Great Dragon]

Hello,

Is it OK that using NVIDIA CUVID decoder makes GPU to run on maximum performance (clock speed)?
While using regular DXVA renderer a GPU performs in regular Desktop Mode. I'm using GTX 1070.

Do I have some control over CUVID Renderer settings?
And what's the difference between CUVID and DXVA ?

[strumf666]

D3D11 native on intel HD2500 (I5 3470) works for me if that helps. Win 10 pro & Potplayer 64bit; intel drivers 10.18.10.4425
On a very quick test for H264, cpu utilization is a few % lower than on dxva2 copyback, but render times are much higher.

[aufkrawall]

Is it OK that using NVIDIA CUVID decoder makes GPU to run on maximum performance (clock speed)?

That's normal for all CUDA apps, CUVID unfortunately isn't an exception.
DXVA2/D3D11VA on the other hand will give you lower GPU clocks than even CPU decoding with madVR because the driver apparently chooses lower clock speeds when hardware decoding is going on than without.

I don't really see any reason to use CUVID anymore. imho both CUVID and QuickSync probably could even get removed out of LAV Filters in favor of the new D3D11VA decoding.
It's probably not too harsh when you say that CUVID and the used QuickSync decoder are end of life or even already dead.

[aufkrawall]

With new build, I can confirm that selecting IGP for decoding works with D3D11VA, great. :)
Buuut: Would it be possible to make copyback selectable like for DXVA2? Or do that automatically when a device is selected which is not the primary graphics adapter?
Kinda odd that it currently only works with renderers which refuse direct D3D11VA connection.

[AngelGraves13]

VC-1 playback doesn't work for me with DX11 LAV Video (0.70.2-45 nightly) and madvr 0.92.1b. Can someone else confirm this on their end? My GPU is a 1080 Ti. DXVA2 N and CB work fine. Also, software works fine too, as well as CUDA.

[nevcairiel]

Would it be possible to make copyback selectable like for DXVA2? Or do that automatically when a device is selected which is not the primary graphics adapter?

I didn't want a seperate entry in the decoder box because that doesn't allow seamless fallback between Native and Copy-Back.

However I have changed it now to only use Native when you select "Automatic" and updated the instruction hint to that effect. It probably makes the most sense to always obey user settings, and for testing purposes its probably a good thing as well.

VC-1 playback doesn't work for me with DX11 LAV Video (0.70.2-45 nightly) and madvr 0.92.1b. Can someone else confirm this on their end? My GPU is a 1080 Ti. DXVA2 N and CB work fine. Also, software works fine too, as well as CUDA.

VC-1 works just fine here. Make sure you don't use way too many buffers (ie. input queue size in madVR), it can sometimes cause decoding failures.

I should probably put an artificial limit in place for VC-1, it seems to be more affected by this then the others, but I would generally not recommend to use extremely large decoder queues in madVR either way.

[aufkrawall]

I think with native hardware decoding, it's safe to stick to a queue which is as short as possible on the GPU side (aka 4 frames with madVR).
With a short GPU/presentation queue, there are sometimes presentation glitches reported after the playback started, but I haven't yet seen any at a later time. + it also reduces input lag when e.g. changing volume via mouse wheel.
However, setting CPU queue (isn't it actually a D3D11VA queue in our case?) to only 4 frames as well gives me some weird intensive stuttering which is not detected by madVR's stats. It already seems to be gone with 5 frames, but for safety I set it to 8.

Only 12 more hours till next nightly build. :o

[nevcairiel]

4 is probably too short, especially because it also limits the GPU queues then, I would go with 8 or 16 at most personally.

I've been thinking about more strictly limiting the maximum number of surfaces in all cases to something reasonable like 32 (which is used for VC-1 now). There is a hard limit of 127 (ie. 7-bit), which is required for DXVA to function at all, but using that many buffers really has no advantages in native mode.

[AngelGraves13]

VC-1 works just fine here. Make sure you don't use way too many buffers (ie. input queue size in madVR), it can sometimes cause decoding failures.

I should probably put an artificial limit in place for VC-1, it seems to be more affected by this then the others, but I would generally not recommend to use extremely large decoder queues in madVR either way.

I have them both maxed in madvr. 24 for GPU and 128 for CPU. It looks better for smooth motion, but a limit should be put in place if it's a problem in DX11. Why does it work fine in every other mode with large queues except DX11? Is it a bug? Software, CUVID, DXVA2 Native and Copy-Back all work fine with 128 queue.

I also get random freezes if I pause and attempt to play a video with DX11, especially if I skip to a certain timecode and then pause. The player MPCH-HC locks up under DX11, but DXVA2 Native and Copy-Back have no issues.

[nevcairiel]

The CPU queue doesn't affect anything with smooth motion. Don't buy into snake oil explanations. :p
Such a huge CPU queue has zero benefit, just eats up your memory and makes seeking/startup slower.

[el Filou]

I watch a lot of DVB, and sometimes there are errors in the feed due to bad reception and I find that when this happens, having a bigger decoding queue smoothes things out a bit (i.e. the hiccup due to lost packets is less brutal), but nothing quite as big as 128 (I use 24).

[aufkrawall]

It works like a charm now, nev. Very cool tech, thanks for making it possible!
I thought my Skylake IGP wouldn't be able to decode HEVC 10 bit, but apparently it is (with high GPU usage, so likely hybrid).

[Goeggel]

No hardware acceleration with 4K videos

I have been looking around the web for possible solutions and have fiddled with the settings, but haven't had any luck so far. When playing 1080p videos, I get hardware acceleration and LAV shows my GTX 980 as active hardware device.

However when playing 4K videos (for example Exodus or Life of Pi HDR demos), no active hardware device is shown. Is this a known issue?

Windows 7 64bit
Nvidia GTX 980 384.94
LAV 0.70.2 / DXVA Copy-Back
madVR 0.92.1
Zoom Player 13.5 Max

[LigH]

Not every graphic chipset supports hardware accelerated decoding for every video format (AVC/HEVC, Profile@Level + several specific encoding complexity attributes) in every resolution. There are limits.

[nevcairiel]

The 980 doesn't have full HEVC decoding, and no HEVC 10-bit at all, which would be required for those HDR demos. Like LigH said, older hardware doesn't support all newer formats.

[huhn]

is d3d11 headless mode also planned for the next release?

so i take the nightly 0.70.2.49 as a yes.
fantastic feature very useful!

[aufkrawall]

One more observation regarding queue length + madVR:
DXVA deinterlacing really doesn't like a small GPU queue. When I set it to 4 and presentation queue is 4 frames as well, I'm getting framedrops. Setting GPU queue to 8 seems to be enough to avoid drops with DXVA interlacing.

[nevcairiel]

Yeah 4 might be too short, but 8 is fine, or even 16 if you must, with an absolute maximum of 32. Anything above that seems wasted.

[aufkrawall]

I noticed two issues with the current nightly:
-YADIF doesn't work for VC-1 interlaced (without software deinterlacing, LAV reports interlaced content properly to renderer).
-When changing the YADIF setting when LAV config is opened via MPC HC filter list, it makes the player invisibly hang in background after closing.

[VictorLS]

For people who still like WinXP - last working version of subj is LAVFilters-0.70.2-16 and it's a pity (as all non-modified LAV Video Decoders) it can't hardware decode H265 10bit via CUVID on nVIDIA's GM206-based videocards - it seems nevcairiel too hard understand how it was made working (but it's just few strings of code).
Next installer LAVFilters-0.70.2-29.exe says "This program does not support the version of Windows your computer is running."
Best regards.

[aufkrawall]

Btw: What's the reason for the brief corruption after seeking in HEVC 10 bit video? It happens with both software and hardware decoding, but not in the Windows 10 video app.

[sneaker_ger]

Container (TS?)? Sample?

The FFmpeg TS demuxer does not offer such functionality (it doesn't know what kind of frames are in the stream, since thats codec dependent information and mpeg-ts itself does not carry such flags), and I do not currently plan to work on this myself.
I could maybe hide the frames (like h264 does) if that makes you feel better? :) It would still start decoding a "proper" image at the same spot as it does now though.

MPEG-TS is generally not a format you should expect "perfect" seeking on, because the format itself has basically no seeking support. Even finding the appropriate timecode in the file is already a slow process, and with broadcast streams can even be really annoying (ie. with wrap-around).

[nevcairiel]

-YADIF doesn't work for VC-1 interlaced (without software deinterlacing, LAV reports interlaced content properly to renderer).


That should be fixed.


-When changing the YADIF setting when LAV config is opened via MPC HC filter list, it makes the player invisibly hang in background after closing.

I can't reproduce that. All settings changes are really quite equal, change the value, save it. It doesn't do anything special for those settings.

[aufkrawall]

Container (TS?)? Sample?
You nailed it, both tested files have TS container. Thanks.


I can't reproduce that. All settings changes are really quite equal, change the value, save it. It doesn't do anything special for those settings.
I can always provoke it by turning YADIF off in a paused video and then close MPC HC.

[nevcairiel]

Seems like an odd way to do things, but I've found a work-around for the issue.

[mitchmalibu]

Hey, great work on LAV filters. I did have a quick question though.

Using a youtube clip downloader (https://yd.3dyd.com/), I downloaded a 60fps 4K clip on youtube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArPP6_QXqyQ) and watched it with the latest LAV + madvr available using D3D11 hardware decoding. It worked perfectly, lav video reporting that the active decoder is D3D11 native and madvr OSD showing the DXVA11 flag. I also tried to download another 60fps 4K clip, but with HDR (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTGm7mye-_4). The file isn't hardware decoded, LAV video showing that avcodec is active. Both files are straight from youtube so encoded with VP9.

Is this an expected behaviour ?

Thanks !

[sneaker_ger]

For HDR Youtube provides VP9 10 bit - for SDR only 8 bit. 1070 cannot decode VP9 10 bit. So if you downloaded the VP9 10 bit stream that should be the reason.

[LigH]

Not every graphic chipset supports hardware accelerated decoding for every video format (AVC/HEVC, Profile@Level + several specific encoding complexity attributes) in every resolution. There are limits.

Sorry for shameless self-quote :p – and yes, VPx is another issue, in relation to MPEG specified formats.

[mitchmalibu]

For HDR Youtube provides VP9 10 bit - for SDR only 8 bit. 1070 cannot decode VP9 10 bit. So if you downloaded the VP9 10 bit stream that should be the reason.

OK thanks, I knew there was a bitdepth difference, but couldn't find the exact decoding capabilities of the 1070.

[mitchmalibu]

Quick question: updating from nightly 45 to 49 and later, I loose DXVA11 native decoding, the active decoder now being D3D11 cb direct instead of D3D11 native. Is this normal ?

[mrcorbo]

Quick question: updating from nightly 45 to 49 and later, I loose DXVA11 native decoding, the active decoder now being D3D11 cb direct instead of D3D11 native. Is this normal ?

Did you select the active decoder instead of leaving it on automatic?

[mitchmalibu]

I did leave it on automatic. A settings reset solved it. Thanks

[Jasch]

Hi, a small info/bugreport.
with new Dxva11 +madvr deinterlacing is not working at all, dxva2native +copyback works fine.
Win10 Rx460 latest Madvr and Lav nightly

[sneaker_ger]

madshi hasn't implemented deinterlacing for D3D11 DXVA yet.

https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1815291&postcount=44714

[Sunspark]

In build 0.70.2.66-git I have made the observation that in video filters if you select DXVA2 (native), it will display the expected NV12, 8 bit, 4:2:0 (DXVA2).

However, if you then change it to None, it continues to display NV12, 8 bit, 4:2:0 (DXVA2) even though software decoding should be in use at this point.

If you change it to DXVA2 (copy-back), it will display NV12, 8 bit, 4:2:0.

Then changing it to None, it displays NV12, 8 bit, 4:2:0.

Repeating the process where you go back to DXVA2 (native) and then None, None once again holds on to (DXVA2).

[nevcairiel]

It doesn't change without re-starting playback.

[Sunspark]

You are right. It is not enough to just stop playback, you have to quit out of the player entirely and restart it.

[sneaker_ger]

In MPC-HC there is a hotkey to restart. ( ctrl + e ?)

[XMonarchY]

What is the advantage of D3D11 DXVA? Faster rendering for rigs that support it? Does it improve image quality?

[SamuriHL]

There shouldn't be a quality difference in any of the decoding types. It's likely the benefit is resource utilization.

[huhn]

DXVA native with nvidia cards can result in quality loss if it is used with madVR for example. D3D11 doesn't have this problem.

on top of it D3D11 supports headless mode which is very useful for PCs that have a iGPU with very good codec support and a dGPU with not that good codec support.

[SamuriHL]

Well that's good to know about headless. I see I've been away from these things too long. LOL. D3D11 support seems very good to me in my latest tests with my new 1060. I had no issues with 3D playback which is awesome.

[yukinok25]

Well that's good to know about headless. I see I've been away from these things too long. LOL. D3D11 support seems very good to me in my latest tests with my new 1060. I had no issues with 3D playback which is awesome.

I am sorry if its a stupid question, but I can't understand how can I enable the D3D11 support in LAV Filter, I have only DXVA2 (copy-back) and all the others except D3D11?

What I am doing wrong?

[FDisk80]

I am sorry if its a stupid question, but I can't understand how can I enable the D3D11 support in LAV Filter, I have only DXVA2 (copy-back) and all the others except D3D11?

What I am doing wrong?

You install the latest Nightly.

[yukinok25]

You install the latest Nightly.I thought I did! Which is the latest versions, just to make sure?

Thanks for the help by the way.

[FDisk80]

I thought I did! Which is the latest versions, just to make sure?

Thanks for the help by the way.

https://files.1f0.de/lavf/nightly/LAVFilters-0.70.2-66.exe

[yukinok25]

https://files.1f0.de/lavf/nightly/LAVFilters-0.70.2-66.exeThanks!!

[fakel]

D3D11 DXVA it is a miracle, just do not understand how deinterlacing algorithm qualitatively?

[huhn]

with D3D11 native deinterlancing is job of the renderer and madVR doesn't support deinterlancing with d3d11 yet.
d3d11 copyback should work with lavfilter software deinterlancer just select the GPU and you will get copyback.

[thomaz909]

i have a problem with cpu usage.

i use dvbviewer with lavfilters vid dec and ffdshow raw filter for subtitling.
when i playback x265 stuff (720p 10bit), cpu usage is normally around 20%.
but sometimes it goes up to 50%.
then i have to do a graph rebuild and it is @ 20% again.

with x264 i never had such a problem.

[LigH]

Sounds to me like at some point, an additional filter gets enabled which was not active before, or the rendering process was forced to switch to a compatibility technology from this moment on. Just guessing though...

[thomaz909]

i saw that "embedded subtitles" were enabled in ffdshow.
i think this was the reason.
now its disabled and will see if it happens again in the next days.

[mastan]

What is the advantage of D3D11 DXVA? Faster rendering for rigs that support it? Does it improve image quality?

From madVR 0.92 changes list https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1815291#post1815291


2) native D3D11 DXVA hardware decoding:

This is a new feature nevcairiel (thanks!) and I have been working on. Basically it "replaces" the old native D3D9 DXVA hardware decoding with a new D3D11 solution. (Well, D3D9 DXVA is still available.)

- image quality is now always identical to software decoding (unlike D3D9 DXVA)
- now AMD 10bit HEVC hardware decoding works, too
- might be ever so slightly faster (with potential for future improvements)
- self-made decoder<->renderer interface should be more stable
- probably requires Windows 8.1 or Windows 10
- I've not implemented DXVA scaling yet
- I've not implemented DXVA deinterlacing yet

Software decoding still has a small advantage, though: The madVR features "forced film mode" and "zoom control" currently only work with software decoding (or copyback).



5) support for AMD's private HDR switching API

AMD's private HDR switching API seems to work well, but it's more limited compared to Nvidia's API. AMD's API only works if there's active fullscreen D3D11 video playback (or gaming), which also has to be 10bit! Otherwise, the AMD API will do nothing. Consequently, madVR will switch to passthrough only in the moment when you go fullscreen, and only if you configured madVR to use 10bit D3D11.

Nvidia's API also works in windowed mode, and also with 8bit D3D11, even with D3D9.

[takenori]

From madVR 0.92 changes list https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1815291#post1815291

what about software deinterlacer?
i tried d3d11+software deinterlacer, and videos that plays60fps now plays at 30fps.
with dxva cb+software deinterlacer and cuvid, it plays 60fps

[nevcairiel]

You can't use software deinterlacing if you use D3D11 native mode. If you use d3d11 copy-back (by selecting a specific decode device), it should behave just like dxva2 cb.

[takenori]

ah, . i miss them. didnt know theres that option.
cheers.

edit: weird, after choosing hardware device, i play video and there they are, playing at 60fps, then screens blinking a couple of times and d3d11 revert back to automatic and fps turns back to 30fps.
edit2: it seems even without playing video, for instance, closing mpc-hc after applying the chance, revert them back to automatic

[clsid]

Playback is b0rked for this file (http://x264.nl/developers/Dark_Shikari/BBB444p10.mkv) if playback is started from a position other than the beginning. For example through a favorite in MPC-HC or when using remember position.

[sneaker_ger]

It's because of the bugs in x264 4:4:4 (incl. lossless profile). LAV has a compatibility mode for them but it needs to read the x264 custom SEI so it knows a) the file was encoded with x264 and b) which version was used. The SEI is usually only prepended to the first GOP and not in CodecPrivate so that's just how it is with those files. (Same if you split them.)

https://git.videolan.org/?p=x264.git;a=commit;h=d46a5a463f0de5ec479d256af72bba3de4ba2d1a
https://git.videolan.org/?p=x264.git;a=commit;h=79b36f27a57dd511eefead6d5422689220c767b5
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1809393#post1809393

[clsid]

Perhaps it could enable the workarounds by default like it did in the past. Not always, but just when first GOP was skipped.

[sneaker_ger]

The workaround breaks spec compliant files so that's a no-go.

[mparade]

Does anyone know what could be the reason for getting a LAV filters setting window with half of that hidden?
Both in Kodi itself and in Windows' tray most of the LAV settings windows are covered by part of the grey window inside of which the settings are located and hence cannot be modified.

I hope someone else also encountered with such a problem.

[sneaker_ger]

https://www.neunbeere.de/blog/2017/08/graphics-bug-in-windows-7-after-installing-august-2017-security-updates/
?
(wild guess)

[mparade]

Thank you. I will check today the workarounds recommended but I am a bit tremuolus because I am on Win10 64 bit OS.

[sneaker_ger]

The bug is only on Windows 7. If you are on Windows 10 just ignore my last post.

Both in Kodi itself and in Windows' tray most of the LAV settings windows are covered by part of the grey window inside of which the settings are located and hence cannot be modified..
Can you post a screenshot?

[nevcairiel]

It seems to happen sometimes if your Windows is running an Asian locale, for some reason that screws up font rendering of ordinary "western" fonts. Outside of that, I haven't really received much complaints about the settings page going wrong.

[mparade]

The bug is only on Windows 7. If you are on Windows 10 just ignore my last post.


Can you post a screenshot?

http://mammutmail.com/hu/download/c848292e95901626b4922e0c26dcada7

Only this way because on my HTPC there is no usable application exists other than wordpad.

Thanks for your help.

EDIT: solved by modifying some display settings in Windows.
Thank you again for your time.

[sneaker_ger]

Glad you have it solved. Care to tell what fixed it (for others with same problem)?

https://abload.de/img/lav_settings_-or8y9sue.png

[mparade]

The problem was solved on my Windows 10 System as follows:

in display settings window of the OS (entering by right-clicking on the desktop) under Display and "sizing and arrangement" part, "modifying the size of text, applications and other elements" should be set to a lower value. E.g. I had to set it to 150% from 300% to be able to modify the settings in LAV Video window inside Kodi Kripton. After the required modifications are done in LAV Video, you should set it back to the required value otherwise all your icons will use that smaller size (for me it was a big problem because I am currently using a 49' 4K TV as a display on which I prefer larger icons.)

[mparade]

@nevcairiel

In case of decoding main12 content is there no chance for GPU assistance? You stated through DXVA there isn't but what about CUVID? Whatever settings I use the active decoder is "avcodec" in LAV Video for such sources. Using DGDecNV it is possible to feed main12 content to an encoder without dithering using my GTX1060.

[P.J]

This video is interlaced but plays in progressive mode with LAV :confused:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8q1LB-YXE2hY2E0RUdfVDJ5TkE

[AngelGraves13]

This video is interlaced but plays in progressive mode with LAV :confused:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8q1LB-YXE2hY2E0RUdfVDJ5TkE

Set LAV Video deinterlacing to aggressive.

[el Filou]

I think what P.J. meant was "why isn't LAV correctly detecting the video as interlaced?" MediaInfo does.
Having to manually change a setting for specific videos isn't optimal.
I think this is an ffmpeg decoding problem, maybe submit a bug report there?

[nevcairiel]

If "aggressive" works, then the video is probably just encoded faulty. It happens all the time. Aggressive basically means that it was detected as interlaced at least once, but then went back to being flagged as progressive - which is generally a sign of bad encoding.

[P.J]

Set LAV Video deinterlacing to aggressive.

I reported this issue to MPC-BE decoder and they fixed it.
Hope Lav fixes it too =/

[DragonQ]

If "aggressive" works, then the video is probably just encoded faulty. It happens all the time. Aggressive basically means that it was detected as interlaced at least once, but then went back to being flagged as progressive - which is generally a sign of bad encoding.
Mixed 1080p/25 and 1080i/25 is valid for a UK HDTV broadcast over DVB-T2.

[nevcairiel]

Mixed 1080p/25 and 1080i/25 is valid for a UK HDTV broadcast over DVB-T2.

If it's encoded properly then that's not a problem. The progressive parts will be detected as progressive, and interlaced as interlaced. It's only a problem if it's not done properly.

[P.J]

Mixed 1080p/25 and 1080i/25 is valid for a UK HDTV broadcast over DVB-T2.

But it's not mixed.

[jaytrinitron]

Hi, so I am trying to use the LAV Audio mixer to mix down 6.1/7.1 audio to 5.1, preferably without losing audio information and just dropping channels. What do I need to set the center mix, surround mix, and LFE mix levels sliders to, and what exactly do these settings do? Can I ensure that all of the information in the 6.1/7.1 is folded down into the 5.1?
Also this may be a long shot here but for the ffdshow audio mixer, if I take 5.1 audio and mix down to 2.0, are all the channels in the 5.1 mix carried over to the 2.0 mix, including the LFE channel?

[el Filou]

The purpose of mixing is to "fold" all the audio channels into the ones to be output, so they won't be lost.

The channel levels settings do what is explained in the LAV GUI: they control the level of individual channels when downmixing. For example if you downmix to stereo and set one of the settings to 0, you won't hear that/those channel(s).

I suggest to test with this file: https://www.sendspace.com/file/ftt56e

[AngelGraves13]

Hi, so I am trying to use the LAV Audio mixer to mix down 6.1/7.1 audio to 5.1, preferably without losing audio information and just dropping channels. What do I need to set the center mix, surround mix, and LFE mix levels sliders to, and what exactly do these settings do? Can I ensure that all of the information in the 6.1/7.1 is folded down into the 5.1?
Also this may be a long shot here but for the ffdshow audio mixer, if I take 5.1 audio and mix down to 2.0, are all the channels in the 5.1 mix carried over to the 2.0 mix, including the LFE channel?

0.71 for all channels and LFE should be correct if doing 5.1. It's only Stereo where you (probably) don't want LFE.

[DragonQ]

0.71 for all channels and LFE should be correct if doing 5.1. It's only Stereo where you (probably) don't want LFE.

Yep, although I normally use 1.0 for centre just because so many films seem to be mixed with low and/or muffled voice tracks these days.

[Sunspark]

I have a 2.1 analog system, 2 satellites plugged into and receiving their feed from the subwoofer.

Because of this, I left center and surround at the default of 0.71 but changed LFE to 1.58.

[strumf666]

Input for a 2.1 system is usually stereo output, which would make changes to LFE level useless; unless I am missing something.

[e-t172]

strumf666: I believe you are confused. Sunspark is discussing downmix coefficients for a stereo output.

Sunspark: yes, this is correct. 1.58 is +4 dB, which is mixed into both channels, thus becoming +10 dB total after the sub downmixes it down to mono, pursuant to ITU-R BS.775. It checks out. (If you are using a cheap "PC" 2.1 system you might want to lower it though, as such levels are likely to overload your subwoofer. You need a system with high SPL output to be able to take full advantage of LFE.)

[Sunspark]

strumf666: I believe you are confused. Sunspark is discussing downmix coefficients for a stereo output.

Sunspark: yes, this is correct. 1.58 is +4 dB, which is mixed into both channels, thus becoming +10 dB total after the sub downmixes it down to mono, pursuant to ITU-R BS.775. It checks out. (If you are using a cheap "PC" 2.1 system you might want to lower it though, as such levels are likely to overload your subwoofer. You need a system with high SPL output to be able to take full advantage of LFE.)

This is the only PC speaker system I have ever bought, ACS-48.. 80 watts total.. they're old now but I think they still have lots of life left. https://www.cnet.com/products/altec-lansing-acs48-speaker-system-for-pc-wired-series/specs/

I set Windows volume to 65% and use the volume control on the speakers the rest of the way. Bass dial on the back is set to about 1/3 of turnable range I think.

You make a good point about other systems maybe having trouble.

[el Filou]

An alternative if you know the real specifications of your speakers is to use Windows' native Bass management (in "enhancements" tab in Sound control panel) to filter the low frequencies your subwoofer or full range speakers can't manage, that way you can include the LFE channel without worrying about it causing problems.

[jmone]

FYI - Latest Nightly includes a later version of libbluray which now supports (decrypted) UHD BD structures.

[De-M-oN]

Can it be used together with ffdshow? Or does it collide with it? Because I still have ffdshow installed since the past.

Can it be used as DirectShowSource for mkv files in avisynth?

While TMPGEnc 6 reads the mkv with frameaccurate audiosync, the reader of avisynth (ffms2, l-smash) all have 5 to 13 frames here and there difference in audiosync. I could reduce it to 5 frames by adding the fps of the video to the reader. But still: TMPGEnc reads them frameaccurate.
I think TMPGEnc's Intel Media SDK Decoder reads the timecodes of the MKV, while avisynth indexes the file which gives slightly wrong results?

Can I circumvate this with these filters maybe?

[huhn]

directshowsource is not know no be frame accurate but you could use this filter for it and you can use lavfilter to decode and ffdshow for processing this may not work under every situation.

[huhn]

i have a file that doesn't play correctly with avcodec using lavfilter but it is fine when i use "use microsoft WMV9..." or DXVA2 so should i bring it directly to ffmpeg or is this here the right place for a wrongly decoded file?

[ryrynz]

I'd post it here as many have done beforehand, sometimes Nev pulls some code from FFmpeg or submits his own patches, so here is a good place.

[nevcairiel]

The FFmpeg software VC-1/WMV3 decoder not being perfect is known. Why would you want to use it anyway? Thats what the Microsoft MFT is for.
As long as it works fine using DXVA2 (which uses parts of the FFmpeg decoder), its not something I'm really interested in.

[huhn]

well not every windows 10 version has a decoder and it is not a strange encode or something it is directly remuxed from a BD.

[P.J]

I reported this issue to MPC-BE decoder and they fixed it.
Hope Lav fixes it too =/

Still waiting for a fix :rolleyes:

[aufkrawall]

I notice some weird behavior with D3D11VA copyback: It roughly has twice as high CPU usage as DXVA2 copyback.
With EVR in MPC HC, this is just ~2% vs. ~4% CPU usage, but with madVR, it's ~6% vs ~12% (4k 50fps HEVC 10 bit video).

[Drakko01]

Hello first of all I want to thank Nevcairiel and all those who help in the development of lav filters, I use them a long time along with other programs like MPcBe, Madvr, Svp. Many of you know that achieving a perfect reproduction not only depends of the hardware, but also good software:), and last but not least, spend a good time to setting up all. This often provokes us headaches when a specific setting changes something that works or even when we not knows what setting made the change.That being said , I have a question to Nevcairiel or someone that can explaind, I use SVP generally for 1080p videos upscale to 4k, and playing around with lav settings , change to d3d11 option in hardware acceleration this improve so much the smoothness, and I really wanna know why or how , or even if that made the change.

[mzso]

Hi!

Did/does (doesn't have to be new) anyone make a build of LAV with a differing ID? I'm asking because I want two instances with different settings.

Or do I not need to do this?

Can I just register another LAV instance in a different folder and have different settings? It doesn't seem likely to me, even LAV 32 and 64 bit share the same settings...

[mzso]

Okay, so I tried some ugly tinkering: copied the LAV folder created registry keys for it with the new location and a changed CLSID. And then selected it in ProgDVB.

Well, my intention didn't happen, but something weird started happening: madVR started showing DXVA so I guess it started decoding itself somehow. Also deinterlacing started working.
Which are desirable, but I don't why it happens or how long will it work.
Does anyone have an idea what's happening?

[clsid]

It always stores in the same registry key.
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\LAV

MPC-HC stores the settings in a different key if you use the internal LAV Filters. It takes over settings management through API of LAV Filters.
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\MPC-HC\MPC-HC\Internal Filters

The change in behavior is purely because you changed/reset settings.

[mzso]

It always stores in the same registry key.
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\LAV

MPC-HC stores the settings in a different key if you use the internal LAV Filters. It takes over settings management through API of LAV Filters.
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\MPC-HC\MPC-HC\Internal Filters

The change in behavior is purely because you changed/reset settings.

Thanks.

Though something indeed happens. LAV is not loaded, but apparently the microsoft decoder does. But somehow deinterlacing doesn't break on channel switching either. (It breaks when I set the microsoft decoder to be used directly)

[Fabulist]

Hello everyone. I would like to ask if anyone can suggest to me what I should do: I mix the back and side channels together, therefore the output comes out as 32bit Float (PCM from WASAPI) instead of the one closest to the file's native.

My receivers support up to 24-bit according to Windows, but 32bit output (from files or mixing) plays properly. Should I disable 32-bit outputs on LAV or leave it be?

Thank you in advance.

[nevcairiel]

Generally, you should just leave everything on and let the audio renderer deal with it.

[Fabulist]

Generally, you should just leave everything on and let the audio renderer deal with it.

I see, thank you. Is there anything else I should pay attention to?

I have PotPlayer's WASAPI set to bitexact mode and the default speaker output to "Same as input" and "32-bit (floating point)" - which for some reason do affect audio even though I thought they would not with LAV enabled.

For example; setting 32-bit on PotPlayer for some reason makes the volume slightly higher and changing the speaker output from "Same as input" to 5.1 seems to change output type, but I assumed "Same as input" is best considering LAV is enabled.

Are there any "best settings" to set these in order to avoid interference with LAV?

[steakhutzeee]

Evening :) I'm using MPC-BE with Madvr and LavFilters. Now, i'm not an expert so this is my actual configuration of audio and video lav. Are configured properly?

I'm experiencing an issue with an mkv with audio track in 'eac3' format. When opening it, i hear no audio. In the filter list there is no lav audio but there is Microsoft DTV-DVD audio decoder. With other audio format, like 'aac' i've no problem and i hear audio and see the audio lav filter active.

Btw this is my configuration:

https://postimg.org/image/1b6bdckv97/
https://postimg.org/image/9s0px03ppn/

In MPC-BE Internal Filters i've all of them deselected in 'Source Filters', 'Video Decoder', 'Audio Decoder'.

[nevcairiel]

You may need to disable E-AC3 bitstreaming if that happens, perhaps it isn't supported on your setup - which would cause a fallback to another decoder.

[el Filou]

What does your AVR display if you check the audio stream info? Does it recognize the Dolby Digital Plus stream correctly?

In MPC-HC there is an option to add specific external filters which you can then set a merit for, or block, or prefer.
If you want to avoid the MS Decoder and there is the same option in MPC-BE, try to add LAV Audio Decoder and set it to Prefer.

Is this the only file with E-AC3 you have a problem with? If you don't have any other, there are some here: MPlayer samples collection - E-AC3 (http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/AC3/eac3/)
Play them to see if it works with other files.
If the problem is only with one specific mkv, post its MediaInfo output here (only the section for audio)

[steakhutzeee]

You may need to disable E-AC3 bitstreaming if that happens, perhaps it isn't supported on your setup - which would cause a fallback to another decoder.

Yep, disabled and now works :) What you mean for "not supported on my setup"?

What does your AVR display if you check the audio stream info? Does it recognize the Dolby Digital Plus stream correctly?

In MPC-HC there is an option to add specific external filters which you can then set a merit for, or block, or prefer.
If you want to avoid the MS Decoder and there is the same option in MPC-BE, try to add LAV Audio Decoder and set it to Prefer.

Is this the only file with E-AC3 you have a problem with? If you don't have any other, there are some here: MPlayer samples collection - E-AC3 (http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/AC3/eac3/)
Play them to see if it works with other files.
If the problem is only with one specific mkv, post its MediaInfo output here (only the section for audio)

Tried with others eac3 from link you posted and same problem, i've to disable the eac3 bitstream to hear them work.

I've all lav filters configured as Preferred yet.

How can i see the AVR btw?

Thanks!

[el Filou]

What are you outputting sound to? Is it an all-in-one kit? A receiver?
Probably as nevcairiel said, your sound system can't decode Dolby Digital Plus.

[steakhutzeee]

What are you outputting sound to? Is it an all-in-one kit? A receiver?
Probably as nevcairiel said, your sound system can't decode Dolby Digital Plus.

I simply have my headphones plugged into the pc :P

[nevcairiel]

I simply have my headphones plugged into the pc :P

Then you should probably disable all bitstreaming options.

[steakhutzeee]

Then you should probably disable all bitstreaming options.

Why this?

[nevcairiel]

Because headphones usually don't have bitstream decoders for those compressed formats.

[nussman]

Bitstream = output encoded (ac3, e-ac3, dts etc.) audio signal
So your headphones need a built in decoder for all this formats or otherwise you will hear nothing (i.e. your test with bitstream).

P.S. I would really like a fallback in LAV for not supported bitstream formats, because many users are running into this problem.
http://www.dvbviewer.tv/forum/topic/60624-kein-ton-bei-bbc-world-hd-auf-astra-192/
http://www.dvbviewer.tv/forum/topic/59210-keine-audioausgabe-bei-hd-sender/

[huhn]

https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/37

it would be better if people stop checking a check box because they can.

[steakhutzeee]

Well, of course i should have searched the solution because it's a well treated argument.

But after all i checked the option and then asked here, so i think this discussion is for help too, so i can learn and help others with same problem :)

[Mikounou]

Hello,

I have a problem with the lavfilters:
I can't bitstream DTS-HD HRA.

My reveiver (Onkyo RZ900) display only DTS but no sound.

No problem with other (Dolby Digital +, TrueHD, DTS or DTS-HD MA, DTS:X).

Even with latest nighly builds, same error...

I have tested many things, change all options in Lav Filters, but no luck :scared:

I am forced to uncheck each time the bitstream to activate the PCM conversion...

On some forums, they talk about a problem in the DTS header that would not be recognized on some amp.
Apparently when playing a DTS HD MA before the HRA track, the bitsream would work well (I did not manage to test)

Can you help me ? I have many BD with DTS-HD HRA tracks...

Thanks in advance

My config :
Windows 10 (latest update)
NVIDIA GTX 1070 (latest NVIDIA drivers)
Onkyo TX-RZ900 (latest firmware)
Latest MPC HC (nightly build)

[varekai]

Is it possible to have two versions installed?
I use BD-RB which requires LAVfilters 0.65 for avoiding audio sync issues.
Would like to use LAVfilters 0.70.2

[sneaker_ger]

What player do you use? MPC-HC comes with an internal LAV version.


(I know BD-RB users seem to stick to certain versions but I doubt using the latest will actually pose any problems.)

[nevcairiel]

Is it possible to have two versions installed?


No. DirectShow filters are registered in the system and as such only one can be installed/registered.

[mzso]

Is it possible to have two versions installed?
I use BD-RB which requires LAVfilters 0.65 for avoiding audio sync issues.
Would like to use LAVfilters 0.70.2

I tried doing this via registry tinkering for other reasons, but it failed. (LAV didn't load)
So I guess you need to compile your own version with a changed identifier/name from the 0.65 source.

[varekai]

@sneaker_ger
@nevcairiel
@mzso

OK, thanks for the info, appreciate it!
I use both MPC-HC and PotPlayer with madVR.
Compile my own version is way over my skills...
Gonna do some BD-RB testing with 0.70.2 installed.

[aufkrawall]

I notice some weird behavior with D3D11VA copyback: It roughly has twice as high CPU usage as DXVA2 copyback.
With EVR in MPC HC, this is just ~2% vs. ~4% CPU usage, but with madVR, it's ~6% vs ~12% (4k 50fps HEVC 10 bit video).
I noticed something similar with mpv.
Is D3D11VA somehow not as well suited as DXVA2 for copyback?

[mark0077]

Guys can I get a recommendation as to the best way to downmix content to 2.0 output. My cheap 5.1 system gave out on me so I have gotten a set of LS50 Wireless and plan to attach a sub to its sub output, as I normally don't really make a lot of use of the surround information anyways.

I'm wondering whats the consensus on the best way to downmix the likes of 5.1 to 2.0 without losing any of the LFE information. I want to send the full range of output to the speakers and decide from there how best to transfer the lower frequency content.

I have windows speaker configuration set to 2.0 and set that I have full range speakers (not that I think it even has any impact). I'm not sure which is best, to let windows mix whatever I throw at it, ie 5.1, down to 2.0, or use lav audios mixing to convert the 5.1 to 2.0. I know a lot of people use wasapi to try to avoid the windows mixer as its so bad. Is this still the case nowadays in Windows 10 and is using lav audio mixing + wasapi out from mpc still the best way to go?

Note: Whats throwing me off about bypassing lav audio decoder and just using mpc audio renderer, set to exclusive wasapi, is that the lfe channel in any surround sound test clips I have tried from say Dolby, still seems to be getting mixed into the 2.0.

[e-t172]

I'm wondering whats the consensus on the best way to downmix the likes of 5.1 to 2.0 without losing any of the LFE information. I want to send the full range of output to the speakers and decide from there how best to transfer the lower frequency content.

I don't know about the "consensus", but for me personally, I use the LAV Audio mixer with LFE set to 1.58 (=+4 dB, because ITU BS.775 LFE +10dB + two channels -6dB). That's the proper way to do it if you truly have a system that is capable of handling the full LFE output without overloading.

I have windows speaker configuration set to 2.0 and set that I have full range speakers (not that I think it even has any impact).

It doesn't. I have yet to find a scenario in which the "full range" setting in the Windows audio properties has any measurable effect.

I'm not sure which is best, to let windows mix whatever I throw at it, ie 5.1, down to 2.0, or use lav audios mixing to convert the 5.1 to 2.0.

I have measured the downmix coefficients that the Windows audio engine uses to downmix 5.1 to stereo. They are (for the left channel):

L = (L + -3dB*C + -10dB*LFE + -1dB*SL + -8dB*SR) * -10dB

These are weird coefficients that don't match the ITU BS.775 recommendation. I don't know why Microsoft decided to use these coefficients; maybe they're following different advice. As far as I know BS.775 is the standard to follow, which makes these coefficients wrong. This is the main reason why I use the LAV Audio mixer to downmix, not the Windows mixer.

I know a lot of people use wasapi to try to avoid the windows mixer as its so bad.

The Windows mixer is not "bad". Aside from the differences in downmixing coefficients that I've described above, you would be hard-pressed to find any perceivable difference in audio quality. Aside from very specific cases, most people who use WASAPI use it for dubious reasons (typically, an overparanoid obsession about getting "bit-perfect" output).

(The only case I know of where the Windows audio pipeline would degrade quality in perceivable ways is back in the days of Windows XP, where IIRC people had legitimate complains about the resampler not being good enough. The pipeline was completely revamped in Vista.)

Note: Whats throwing me off about bypassing lav audio decoder and just using mpc audio renderer, set to exclusive wasapi, is that the lfe channel in any surround sound test clips I have tried from say Dolby, still seems to be getting mixed into the 2.0.

I'm not sure what the problem is. If your sub is capable of handling it, then LFE should be included in the 2.0 downmix.

[mark0077]

Wow thanks for the replies e-t172, very informative. My only worry about LFE being detectable when using mpc audio renderer set to exclusive wasapi (lav mixer disabled), was that I thought in that case there was no mixer whatsoever involved, so I'm just confused as to whats mixing the LFE into the 2 channels in that particular case. Maybe its mpc renderer itself in this case (although i don't have it set to mix channels at all). I just want to know what pieces of software are involved in the various combinations. I'll use your approach of using lav audio to downmix and I'll use 0.71, 0.71 and 1.58 as recommended.

My main reason for trying to use wasapi in various cases (winamp / mpc) is so that I can play a mix of say 44.1khz and 48khz content, and my understanding is with wasapi there should be no conversion, where as without it, the mixer is converting to whatever I have set in windows sound settings.

Thanks again.

[el Filou]

I have yet to find a scenario in which the "full range" setting in the Windows audio properties has any measurable effect.It's used by the "Bass Management" feature available in the Enhancements tab in Windows' sound control panel.

[e-t172]

My only worry about LFE being detectable when using mpc audio renderer set to exclusive wasapi (lav mixer disabled), was that I thought in that case there was no mixer whatsoever involved, so I'm just confused as to whats mixing the LFE into the 2 channels in that particular case.

Maybe its mpc renderer itself in this case (although i don't have it set to mix channels at all). I just want to know what pieces of software are involved in the various combinations.

If you're playing 5.1 content using WASAPI Exclusive and a 2.0 output, and playback works (i.e. it doesn't fail to start), then something has to have downmixed it in some way. In WASAPI Exclusive Windows will not downmix; if an application tries to open an audio device in exclusive mode and the channel count doesn't match, Windows simply refuses to comply. LAV Audio will not downmix if you don't tell it to, so that indeed only leaves the MPC Audio Renderer as the only remaining step in the pipeline that could possibly have downmixed the audio.

My main reason for trying to use wasapi in various cases (winamp / mpc) is so that I can play a mix of say 44.1khz and 48khz content, and my understanding is with wasapi there should be no conversion, where as without it, the mixer is converting to whatever I have set in windows sound settings.

That's technically true, but I wouldn't bother. No-one can tell the difference.

It's used by the "Bass Management" feature available in the Enhancements tab in Windows' sound control panel.

Ah, that makes sense. I never used Windows Bass Management settings, so that explains why I couldn't tell what this option was for.

[mogli]

I have measured the downmix coefficients that the Windows audio engine uses to downmix 5.1 to stereo. They are (for the left channel):

L = (L + -3dB*C + -10dB*LFE + -1dB*SL + -8dB*SR) * -10dB

Interesting, how have you measured them? Did you account for phase changes?

Alot of people and companies suggested different mixing coefficients. Some switch phase for the surround channels or even apply adaptive loudness correction to some or all channels, e.g. have the surround channels louder in general but attenuate them when the front channels get loud.

So for now there's no reason to believe MS is doing anything wrong (here), they just use another method than the simplest one proposed by ITU.

Regarding WASAPI vs DirectSound the former is definitely much harsher here and the latter softer. Not saying this has anything to do with quality. Actually DS sounds more pleasing to my ear. I guess MS is doing some polishing of the sound with DS (not that I'm aware of having any effects activated) but not with WASAPI.

[e-t172]

Interesting, how have you measured them? Did you account for phase changes?

Alot of people and companies suggested different mixing coefficients. Some switch phase for the surround channels or even apply adaptive loudness correction to some or all channels, e.g. have the surround channels louder in general but attenuate them when the front channels get loud.

I measured them by playing a test tone through each input channel in turn and measuring the level as it comes out the other hand. I'll admit I didn't try to determine whether it's doing any "clever" stuff like phase manipulation or non-linear processing. I was just trying to determine what the coefficients looked like in the simple, naive case so that I could compare them to other downmixers. I did not spend much time on it.

So for now there's no reason to believe MS is doing anything wrong (here), they just use another method than the simplest one proposed by ITU.

Well, in my book not following the international standard qualifies as "doing it wrong", but I guess it's a matter of debate. Ideally it should default to ITU-R BS.775 and perhaps allow the user to select another approach in the settings.

Regarding WASAPI vs DirectSound the former is definitely much harsher here and the latter softer. Not saying this has anything to do with quality. Actually DS sounds more pleasing to my ear. I guess MS is doing some polishing of the sound with DS (not that I'm aware of having any effects activated) but not with WASAPI.

Assuming nothing is broken on your system (e.g. your audio drivers are not doing dubious things behind your back), I cannot accept such claims. By default, aside from downmixing, the only thing the Windows audio engine does is mixing, sample format conversion, and sample rate conversion (if required). These cannot make the sound "harsher", "softer", or have any other audible effect unless they are done in a badly broken way, and they're not. This can easily be verified by e.g. using a virtual audio device (like Virtual Audio Cable) and then making loopback measurements: you'll find that there is no measurable difference whatsoever as the audio goes through the Windows audio engine and back again, aside from the obvious benign stuff that anyone would expect, like dithering noise.

[littleD]

Hi nevcairiel
i know that dx11va just arrived, but did you happen to dig in dx12 video pipeline yet? :) Would be that anything useful or just bloat? Some header with video interfaces in win 10 SDK d3d12video.h

[nevcairiel]

DirectX 12 doesn't add anything useful for video.

[mogli]

I have measured the downmix coefficients that the Windows audio engine uses to downmix 5.1 to stereo. They are (for the left channel):

L = (L + -3dB*C + -10dB*LFE + -1dB*SL + -8dB*SR) * -10dB
LFE is off by -10dB, should be -20dB, rest is correct. When using back channels instead of surrounds it's -1dB*BL + -6dB*BR.

So one can see what MS tries to accomplish:

Include all channels, even LFE, but at a very low level to assure no overload occurs.
Lower the stereo separation for surrounds and back channels to place them between center and fronts to hopefully decrease the masking.
Not a bad idea, I guess.

[mclingo]

Hi, started getting an odd problem recently, it either LAV or MADVR causing it but I cant decouple these to diagnose further. There seems to be a problem where changing back and forth from 1080p to 2160p and 3D I get a loss of handshake and I have to use DEVCON reset to get it back.

This is what happens (both KODI and MPC)

I play a 3D movie, after a few seconds on a blank screen my TV switches 3D mode and plays the movies no problems. If I stop the movie the TV comes out of 3D mode and then I get black screen.

If I put my HTPC into 1080p resolution this doesnt work so its something to do with how MADVR and LAV filters are dealing with refresh rate and resolution switching.

Any ideas anyone?

[nevcairiel]

That is not an area LAV interacts with. Actual output is not touched in any way, only decoded frames are being send onwards.

[Pat357]

Hi, started getting an odd problem recently, it either LAV or MADVR causing it but I cant decouple these to diagnose further. There seems to be a problem where changing back and forth from 1080p to 2160p and 3D I get a loss of handshake and I have to use DEVCON reset to get it back.

This is what happens (both KODI and MPC)

I play a 3D movie, after a few seconds on a blank screen my TV switches 3D mode and plays the movies no problems. If I stop the movie the TV comes out of 3D mode and then I get black screen.

If I put my HTPC into 1080p resolution this doesnt work so its something to do with how MADVR and LAV filters are dealing with refresh rate and resolution switching.

Any ideas anyone?

What modes have you listed in Madvr settings ?
When your screen is black and you go to 1080p, does it matter if your 1080p mode has a different FPS ?
like 3D 2160p 23p -> stop -> 1080p24 or 1080p50 (does this work ?)

From my experience, Madvr does handle changes in FPS very well, but if only other things change, like (2160p -> 1080p) or (3D -> not 3D) changes, it doesn't switch.
What actually means no FPS changes -> no switching !

[huhn]

d3d11 native with VP90 isn't working properly for me the video is totally distorted. D3D11 copyback works fine DXVa too.

nvidia 385.69
1060
VP9 profile 0

[nevcairiel]

If copy back works and native doesn't, madshi will need to to investigate this. He'll likely want a sample.

[huhn]

http://filehorst.de/d/cJnymJbo

could someone else please confirm the issue?

[el Filou]

Plays fine for me using d3d11 native.

1050 Ti 385.69, Windows 1703 x64, LAV latest nightly and madVR 0.92.7.
I'm using 32-bit players only though.

[huhn]

i guess i found the issue.
it's the CPU queue if it is over 48 it will start to produce garbage frames. with h264 is only goes to 39-40 with vp9 is uses the full 128.

so i don't know if madVR or lavfilter should stop at 39-40.

[el Filou]

nevcairiel warned not to go above 32 or something. ;)

[huhn]

did he? that a bummer the 128 subtitle queue is very useful...

[nevcairiel]

I've been considering limiting the number of buffers for decoding all formats forcefully to 32, but HEVC and H.264 seem to be fine with up to 127 buffers (which is the hard-limit in DXVA/D3D11) - although with those more advanced codecs, not all buffers are available to the renderer, since the decoder internally needs a bunch as well for reference frames and whatnot.

I added a hard-limit of 32 for VP9 now anyway, just like VC-1 which seems to also have that issue.

[P.J]

It seems D3D11 is useless for Nvidia Optimus =/
Wish I could use 940MX's de-interlacer...

[huhn]

i personally only need/use a high CPU queue (ignoring the subtitle queue here) for live streams to get a bigger buffer.
but maybe it is better to buffer more of the decoded stream i guess the queue settings in lav source could be used for this but i have no clue what could be a possible improve and it is hard to test buffering issue of live streaming. and what is a packet is is a frame a gop is it different from codec to codec...

[nevcairiel]

LAV Splitters final output queue should be mostly packet=frame, it re-assembles those as best as it can, which for the modern codecs should be fine.

[huhn]

it set it to some unreasonable setting like 4096 mb and 3600 packets and my mpc-hc memory usages got down from ~240 to ~145 even pausing the stream doesn't increase the buffer.
i guess a reasonable buffer would be 3-5 secs so your default settings.

[aufkrawall]

i personally only need/use a high CPU queue (ignoring the subtitle queue here) for live streams to get a bigger buffer.

This basicially means half of the buffer size for doubled framerate, which is bad since higher framerate means higher bitrate.
A clean solution would be a buffer in seconds like mpv does.

A CPU queue of 8 in madVR should work for livestreaming with youtube-dl though.

[huhn]

with live streaming i mean >lives< streaming a stream with no end known end. not streaming a youtube video.

This basicially means half of the buffer size for doubled framerate, which is bad since higher framerate means higher bitrate.
what has the bit rate to do with this. bit rate is meaningless for livestraming you will never reach anything significant. and lav source has a buffer with a mb cap and a "frame" size.

[nevcairiel]

it set it to some unreasonable setting like 4096 mb and 3600 packets and my mpc-hc memory usages got down from ~240 to ~145 even pausing the stream doesn't increase the buffer.
i guess a reasonable buffer would be 3-5 secs so your default settings.

Enable the "Statistics" panel in MPC-HC (View -> Statistics), it'll show you queue size in both packets and memory use. If i set it high enough, it'll read entire files into memory no problem. Live streaming is different, although pausing *should* help to fill the queue.

[huhn]

yes works fine.

[aufkrawall]

with live streaming i mean >lives< streaming a stream with no end known end. not streaming a youtube video.

youtube-dl is for HLS in general and there can be also livestreams on YT.


what has the bit rate to do with this. bit rate is meaningless for livestraming you will never reach anything significant.

Try to play YT 4k 60fps in any player with what ever LAV Filters settings for more than five minutes, won't work.

[mclingo]

What modes have you listed in Madvr settings ?
When your screen is black and you go to 1080p, does it matter if your 1080p mode has a different FPS ?
like 3D 2160p 23p -> stop -> 1080p24 or 1080p50 (does this work ?)

From my experience, Madvr does handle changes in FPS very well, but if only other things change, like (2160p -> 1080p) or (3D -> not 3D) changes, it doesn't switch.
What actually means no FPS changes -> no switching !

I managed to resolved this in MPC-BE and MPC-HC by moving back to 0.69 LAV and 090 MADVR, however i could stop it simply by setting my TV to 1080p so it was defo something to do with the 1080p back to 4k switch.

This broke KODI though but I use portable so a clean install only takes to a couple of mins to install and copy over portable userdata. All working now. Cheers for the input though.

[huhn]

youtube-dl is for HLS in general and there can be also livestreams on YT.

yes and why should bit rate now matter for live streaming?
Try to play YT 4k 60fps in any player with what ever LAV Filters settings for more than five minutes, won't work.

that's not a live stream and well that a not easy with youtube DL. if it is not a dash video...

-o - youtube url | mpc.exe /play
plays a 720p dash video what youtube dl understands as "best quality".

and -f 315 -o - "youtube url" | mpc.exe /play
downloads the file and names it -.webm. sorry this is inconsistent i'm pretty sure it can be done but i'm not wasting my time with this tool.

[aufkrawall]

Is there actually any case where having an insanely large CPU queue in madVR does have a positive effect for streaming?

[Manni]

Quick question about installation on my Win10 x64 OS:

If I use the default options, both x86 and x64 versions are installed in the Program Files x86 folder. In the start menu, the shortcuts are to the x86 version.

Is there a way to know if the x64 versions are used with MPC-BE x64 and MadVR?

The only way I was able to make sure was to uncheck the x86 versions during install and install the x64 only in Program Files. In that case, it's the x64 shortcuts that appear in the start menu / installed progs.

Is there any downside in installing the x64 versions only? Is the x64 version always used with a x64 player when the x86 version is also installed?

Thanks!

[nevcairiel]

A 64-bit player can only use 64-bit components. You cannot mix 32 and 64-bit in the same process.

[Manni]

A 64-bit player can only use 64-bit components. You cannot mix 32 and 64-bit in the same process.

Great, thanks, so I'll install all the components.

[mparade]

Hello,

Decoding BD3D ISO files using LAV filters through JRiver doesn't seem to forward 3D information to madVR.
madVR recognizes the source as 2D (checked that by using the ctrl+J shortcut), consequently not the assigned "3D" profile is used.

"3D Blu-ray and MKV 3D decoding" is enabled in the Options menu of JRiver and have the latest JRiver and Nvidia drivers installed on my Win10 64 bit OS.

Could LAV filters/JRiver have problem with 3D content as ISO images?

Please help.

[nevcairiel]

ISO images cannot be played as such anyway, you need to mount them. And if you do, it should behave just fine.

[mparade]

ISO images cannot be played as such anyway, you need to mount them. And if you do, it should behave just fine.

Sure. JRiver does this job automatically (with some "window pop up problem" that could be avoided after installing VirtualClone Drive and AnyDVDHD). But, for me,
madVR still has no clue whether the source is 3D. It is played as 2D assigning my 2D madVR profile to it. Maybe some driver issue then.

[Heaud]

I am having issues getting this game recording to playback at 60FPS with the video decoder. It runs at the intended framerate with MPC-BE's internal decoder and uploading the video to YouTube has it running at the intended rate as well. Tool used to record was with the ingame video recording software.

clip: http://www113.zippyshare.com/v/d8BtOYNO/file.html

[el Filou]

What's your hardware, what's your renderer, and what decoder setting did you set in LAV config? What fps number is it reaching?

[Heaud]

Oh, right, I should mention my specs.

Radeon R9 380X
Ryzen 7 1700 OC 3.6ghz
LAV Filters 0.70.2 (default settings)
MPDN x64 2.49.0.3606 / MPC-BE x64 1.5.1 (built-in renderers)

What should be playing at a video rate of 60, it would run at 40 instead. With MPDN, it runs at 40 and needs to use LAV to decode. With MPC-BE, it runs as intended with the built-in filters and EVR (enabled by default) but disabling the internal filters and using LAV, the video would run at 40.

[el Filou]

I can't remember what the default LAV settings are.
Try to change "Hardware Decoder to use" in the LAV Video settings between None, DXVA2 (native), and DXVA2 (copy-back), to see if one works better.

Edit: this videos plays back at 60 fps with LAV on my system, but I noticed MediaInfo reports AVC High@L4, where 1920x1080x60 should be L4.2. Don't know if it could cause problems with some decoders.

[huhn]

try EVR CP with control+j it is played back at ~40 fps on mpc-hc and 60 on mpc-be

[el Filou]

Indeed.
And with system default EVR it is correctly played back at 60.

[el Filou]

@nevcairiel I may have found a bug: in 32-bit, LAV Video won't enable DXVA2 or D3D11 hardware decode for 8K (both HEVC and VP9), it always uses avcodec. (I use 32 bit for ReClock, and MediaPortal is 32-bit only too)
In 64 bit it does, and it also works in 32 bit with CUVID only.
I used this clip to test VP9 (downloaded from YT): https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2r1Nd4XdRcbNTdNTHRXWENuc00
and "8K_Ex_sample.mp4" in NikosD's benchmark samples to test HEVC.
1050 Ti driver 385.69, Windows 1703 64 bit.

Not really blocking but I thought I'd report anyway.

[nevcairiel]

@nevcairiel I may have found a bug: in 32-bit, LAV Video won't enable DXVA2 or D3D11 hardware decode for 8K (both HEVC and VP9), it always uses avcodec. (I use 32 bit for ReClock, and MediaPortal is 32-bit only too)
In 64 bit it does, and it also works in 32 bit with CUVID only.
I used this clip to test VP9 (downloaded from YT): https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2r1Nd4XdRcbNTdNTHRXWENuc00
and "8K_Ex_sample.mp4" in NikosD's benchmark samples to test HEVC.
1050 Ti driver 385.69, Windows 1703 64 bit.

Not really blocking but I thought I'd report anyway.

I'm not sure why, but the DXVA/D3D11 device just doesn't report a compatible configuration for those resolutions. Maybe its worried about running into memory limits.

[mclingo]

Hello,

Decoding BD3D ISO files using LAV filters through JRiver doesn't seem to forward 3D information to madVR.
madVR recognizes the source as 2D (checked that by using the ctrl+J shortcut), consequently not the assigned "3D" profile is used.

"3D Blu-ray and MKV 3D decoding" is enabled in the Options menu of JRiver and have the latest JRiver and Nvidia drivers installed on my Win10 64 bit OS.

Could LAV filters/JRiver have problem with 3D content as ISO images?

Please help.

Plays fine on my system even without manually mounting beforehand, i am using MPC-BE.

if you are not getting 3D check you have turned on "enable FULL screen exclusive mode" in general settings in MADVR.

Also check you have set your LAV filters as external as the internals in the your player may not have the 3D filter in them. also check you have set your player to use MADVR as renderer.

PS - if you have a 4k system this will only work with 1080p modes in MADVR so make sure MADVR is refresh rate switching and you player starts in full screen.

PPS 3D (MVC) only works on Win 8.1 / WIn 10

[mclingo]

ISO images cannot be played as such anyway, you need to mount them. And if you do, it should behave just fine.

Yes you can, if you right click the ISO and choose to play with your player it works, works fine with MPC-BE using external filters and MADVR.

[nevcairiel]

Yes you can, if you right click the ISO and choose to play with your player it works, works fine with MPC-BE using external filters and MADVR.

Something needs to enable it, and LAV has no such feature. I have not tested any other components interacting with it.

Likely it'll just mount it for you, otherwise LAV couldn't access it (or LAV isnt used).

[mclingo]

Something needs to enable it, and LAV has no such feature. I have not tested any other components interacting with it.

Likely it'll just mount it for you, otherwise LAV couldn't access it (or LAV isnt used).

maybe so, I never checked, the main thing is you dont have to manually mount it first so it plays straight from MPC-BE, havent tried with with KODI-DS though.

I'm think of switching back to ISO instead of ripping all mine to MVC MKV files, its much more convenient to keep the full bluray ISO even if it is a few gigs larger.

[mark0077]

Hi guys,

Facing a strange problem, maybe theres an explanation. I have been playing the Dark Knight blu-ray, and I notice when I use "Mixing" to Stereo, at certain scenes (I'm playing about 1:17:30 to 1:18:30 when they fight in the tunnel) the audio becomes extremely distorted and crackly. I have tried with normalize matrix both on and off, and clipping protection on and off. It doesn't help. I have reduced LFE mix to 0 also. Center and Surround Mix are at 0.71. The crackling remains until I turn off Mixing.

One other strange thing which is whats baffling me. It only happens if I pick the truehd track. If I choose the ac3 48khz 5.1 track the audio is perfect and mixing works fine. Is there some way that truehd decoding plus the use of "Mixing" cause this distortion?

I have temporarily disabled Reclock and went with the MPC Renderer and then the Default audio renderer but the problem remains. Using 0.70.2 of LAV filters.

[nevcairiel]

The Dark Knight Blu-ray is notorious for having bad LFE mastering - without it being lowpassed (which LAV doesn't support), you get distortions if its included in a downmix.

[mark0077]

Oh wow yes just saw other posts about it. Thanks very much. I guess it has that crackling actually built into the lfe track at higher frequencies ( as opposed to be an artifact of the mixing ) but nobody noticed as it was being played back where low pass filters were removing it. Bad :( I could swear I could still hear it when setting LFE mix to 0 though. I'll retest that to be sure anyways. Thanks

[nevcairiel]

Its on my list of things to do to offer LFE lowpass filters. I should really get to that some time.

[aufkrawall]

ffmpeg 3.4 lists D3D11VA as a new feature. Was that beneficial for the implementation in LAV Filters? A long time ago you said that D3D11VA support would require a huge amount of work.

[nevcairiel]

D3D11VA has been in the code for FFmpeg for quite a while, all thats new is that you can use it from the ffmpeg CLI tool now as well. It still was quite a bit of work, and its not done - eventhough much of the remaining stuff is on madshis side.

[P.J]

I reported this issue to MPC-BE decoder and they fixed it.
Hope Lav fixes it too =/

No fix yet? it has been fixed in MPC-BE decoder :rolleyes:

[kolak]

Clineform is now opens source (https://github.com/gopro/cineform-sdk), so I assume soon we may have better handling in ffmpeg. If not can LAV integrate original decoder?

[LigH]

IMHO: Patience ... LAV Filters just needs to update libavcodec when it was updated, and I would expect this to happen quite certainly.

[nevcairiel]

I don't plan to include the official SDK or anything like that. If any improvements to be had, they should be included in avcodec, and LAV will get them.

[kolak]

Ok, so we have to wait for avcodec updates. Original code is few times faster and "full".

[Siso]

Is it possible to add audio presets in the audio decoder? For example - loud, nighttime, etc. Something like AC3filter has.

[nevcairiel]

Features like that are not planned. You should use a dedicated audio processor, LAV aims to provide the essentials only, decoding and the minimum on processing needed to play audio anywhere.

[Siso]

Features like that are not planned. You should use a dedicated audio processor, LAV aims to provide the essentials only, decoding and the minimum on processing needed to play audio anywhere.

I see, thanks anyway :)

[aufkrawall]

It still was quite a bit of work, and its not done - eventhough much of the remaining stuff is on madshis side.
What's missing on decoder site? I'm not missing anything. :p

[slavanap]

I'm newbie in LAV Video Decoder, could you tell is there a way to increase number of buffered surfaces (highlighted on the screenshot)? I have huge about of RAM and can increase VRAM of the Intel Graphics device, if needed.
https://image.ibb.co/mwVUy6/stats.jpg

Some videos with VBR can't be played at constant FPS on my device, because there's moments where at least 1 second buffering is needed to overcome decoding slowdown.

UPDATE:
Found solution over here (option "EVR buffers"). With value of 60 video plays smoothly all the time (except one extreme action scene).

https://image.ibb.co/d734WR/Capture.jpg

[nevcairiel]

The overlay is not from LAV, its from your renderer.

[slavanap]

The overlay is not from LAV, its from your renderer.

Yeah, I've just understood that.
Thanks!

[mclingo]

any plans to upgrade or change the deinterlacing, been watching some older HBO shows like "from the earth to the moon" recently and MADVR/LAV makes a real mess of these compared to something like phosphor in VLC, obviously that's the only thing VLC has to offer. I'm aware this is subjective though.

[el Filou]

What card are you using? Or are you using yadif? Are you sure deinterlacing is active?

I just downloaded VLC again to try that "phosphor" deinterlacing as I was curious and I'm not convinced at all. Testing on sport (F1) I see massive aliasing on some lines and and flickering on some highly detailed content like grandstands, it's even worse than NVIDIA's hardware deinterlacing.
Plus of course it makes the output darker and it can't emulate a real phosphor response of a CRT due to the refresh rate so motion looks weird.

[mclingo]

I'm using an AMD RX 550 with a 4k TV, tried Yadif.

[Pat357]

any plans to upgrade or change the deinterlacing, been watching some older HBO shows like "from the earth to the moon" recently and MADVR/LAV makes a real mess of these compared to something like phosphor in VLC, obviously that's the only thing VLC has to offer. I'm aware this is subjective though.

First : are you talking about static image quality (in pause mode) or about judder/smoothness playback issues ?
Are you talking about hardware deinterlacing or about Yadiff ?
If you mean deinterlacing done by MadVR, this is hardware based DXVA deinterlacing, which can't be updated by software.
It's a fixed implementation on the GPU.
Because it's motion adaptive, you have to watch it when playing.
In pause mode it doesn't work to well and may look bad.

Yadiff on the other hand is pure software and runs on the CPU.
It works frame-based and the result can be seen both in playback and in pause mode.
I don't know phosphor, but I guess it's also just another pure software deinterlacer in VLC.

From what I understand you compared HW deinterlacing (can not be updated) in MadVR with some software implementation in VLC.

[amayra]

my problem start happening after i updated to nightly ver to test new D3D11VA and this give me incorrect colors in "native mode only"
i have :
Intel HD Graphics 4000 with latest driver and updated win10 and madvr
and this happend with MPC-HC/BE only MPDN work better with new D3D11VA for me

[gerarg96]

Any plans for enabling users to manually set a proxy and switch the user-agent that LAV uses? This is required in a lot of HLS streams due to geo-blocking and user-agent checking.

Otherwise we are forced to use web browsers which makes us unable to use, for example, Smooth Video Project and other post-processing tools.

[wushantao]

hi，nevcairiel

is there any zip versions from nightly builds？

[LigH]

I guess you could try to unpack the installers with 7-zip (did not test).

[nevcairiel]

Nightlies are only available as installers.

[wushantao]

I guess you could try to unpack the installers with 7-zip (did not test).
I've tried 7zip unpack and can't get the related files


Nightlies are only available as installers.
If don't take up too much your time, can you release a zip version pls:D?

[nevcairiel]

There are no plans to do that.

[sneaker_ger]

innounp (http://innounp.sourceforge.net/) should be able to extract the installers.

[wushantao]

There are no plans to do that.

Anyway, thanks for the software you developed

innounp (http://innounp.sourceforge.net/) should be able to extract the installers.

thx， i will try it:)

[wushantao]

innounp (http://innounp.sourceforge.net/) should be able to extract the installers.

thank you，it works perfect

[wushantao]

hi nevcairiel

maybe there is a bug for h/w decoder

lav 0.70.2.80 with evrcp

i set output format only RGB24(beacuse evrcp only 8bit)

play a 10bit file, D3D11&DXVA2(native) is NG, can not play

other decoder is ok

my gpu is iris 5200

[nevcairiel]

Don't disable any output formats. Also, 10-bit decoding requires quite new hardware, don't think a 2013 chip would be able to do that.

[VictorLS]

innounp (http://innounp.sourceforge.net/) should be able to extract the installers.
Thank you very much - innounp extracts great.

[cremor]

Small thing I noticed:
The LAV Splitter configuration GUI refers to http://1f0.de for advanced subtitle selection reference documentation, but the page on that site seems to be older than the information in the README. E.g. there is no mention of the ! operator and instead of comma and space it mentions semicolon and space as separators.

[Major_Dick]

innounp (http://innounp.sourceforge.net/) should be able to extract the installers.

Thanks for this, worked perfect.

[clsid]

Hi nev, can you add options to configure probesize and analyzeduration?

[Klaus1189]

I use LAV Filters for watching MXF-Files, but in MXF files the audiochannels are stored as single mono streams. My NLE detects the files correctly as stereo.
How do I configure LAV Filters to use left and right mono streams as one stereo stream?

[robl45]

hi guys, after something wonky happening with the computer where it would play nothing but dolby digital sound, I reinstalled all pieces with updated versions. Madvr, lav filters, mpc-be, intel video drivers, reclock. Now I was wondering with the latest lav video, what is the best hardware acceleration to pick? I have intel HD 530 graphics.

Specifically, I see these two lines in the change log

LAV Video
- NEW: D3D11 hardware accelerated decoding (native mode with madVR, Copy-Back otherwise)
- NEW: Support for hardware accelerated H.264 MVC 3D decoding on Intel GPUs

So what do I pick to be able to make use of that since I watch a lot of 3d and I use Madvr

[robl45]

maybe so, I never checked, the main thing is you dont have to manually mount it first so it plays straight from MPC-BE, havent tried with with KODI-DS though.

I'm think of switching back to ISO instead of ripping all mine to MVC MKV files, its much more convenient to keep the full bluray ISO even if it is a few gigs larger.

This works for me too, problem is if I don't rip to MKV, then I get no subtitles. Do you get subtitles?

[el Filou]

I have intel HD 530 graphics.

Specifically, I see these two lines in the change log

LAV Video
- NEW: D3D11 hardware accelerated decoding (native mode with madVR, Copy-Back otherwise)
- NEW: Support for hardware accelerated H.264 MVC 3D decoding on Intel GPUs

So what do I pick to be able to make use of that since I watch a lot of 3d and I use MadvrDepends on what madVR features you use. If you use black bars detection/zoom control or ivtc, those won't work with DXVA Native. If you don't use them then try D3D11 Native for the best performance.

[Soulnight]

I posted this message today in the Madvr thread but I noticed afterwards that this is actually off-topic for madvr and that it should be posted here. I apologize still for the double post.

Nevcairiel, I need you lights ;-)

Both random and ordered 10bits to 8bits dithering from Lavvideo generate very visible noise/structure, where Madvr "ordered" dithering is invisible to my eyes! :D But I can't use it. Here is why:

Hi,
would it be possible to make dithering in Lavvideo Decoder as good or close to the one in Madvr?

I am asking because currently I use Bluesky FRC with AMD Fluid Motion to use frame interpolation of 4K 10bits 4:2:0 24p signal to 60p.
And the output of bluesky FRC in Madvr is only 8bits, as it seems that AMD Fluid Motion itself does NOT support 10bits.
BlueskyFRC convert P010 to NV12 using driver's function, BEFORE entering AMD Fluid Motion.

My target would be to have a high quality dithering BEFORE entering AMD Fluid Motion: for example in LAVVideo Decoder.

Right now, I can see random noise generated by the dithering method used by BlueskyFRC.
I also tried to deselect 10bits output in LAVvideo decoder in order to dither before in LAVvideo decoder before even entering Blueksy FRC.
However, the result is still not near as good, as when I feed the 10bits 24p signal directly to Madvr with ordered dithering selected there.

Thanks for the help.
Florian
Thx!

[nevcairiel]

Dithering is as good as its going to get, more complex dithering on the CPU would be too expensive and far too rarely useful to warrant the complexity.
There is several reasons why dithering in madVR would look better, for one dithering as late as possible is always better, if you do it far earlier in the decoder already, you have added noise all the way through the processing chain, which only gets amplified.

[Soulnight]

Thank for taking time to answer me.
Why should dithering happen on the CPU?
Is it not GPU based?

Here a few Dithering algorithm:
http://www.tannerhelland.com/4660/dithering-eleven-algorithms-source-code/

What I don't really get is why "ordered dithering" from madvr looks perfectly clean while "ordered dithering" with Lavvideo looks very blocky with clear patterns.
I get that the further in the chain the better, but here the chain is very short --> lav-->madvr with no extra sharpness processing whatsoever.

Thx,
Florian

[nevcairiel]

Any image processing in LAV Video happens on the CPU. As such any advanced techniques are too expensive performance wise. The random or ordered dithering methods are as good as they can be, given the constraints.
If you convert a high-bitdepth image to ordinary 8-bit before the renderer, there will always be a loss, this cannot be avoided.

[Soulnight]

Ok. Well.
Now I have to hope that AMD will support AMD FLUID Motion with 10bits in the near future... :)
Is a i7 7700K that limited for a better dithering in Lavvideo? :rolleyes:
I mean right now, it's doing nothing and is letting madvr do all the heavy lifting with the GPU.

[ashlar42]

nevcariel, do you think there'll be a new supported release by the end of the year? Is there lots of worthy stuff in the nightlies?

[sneaker_ger]

Is there lots of worthy stuff in the nightlies?
https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/commit/12810c93c68641cb6b4da06ee960572060e534ca

Do you need them? We don't know.

[nevcairiel]

Hopefully I get some more time over the holidays to finish some things and make a release then.

[LigH]

Bad news from Microsoft: W10 Fall Creators Update removes HEVC codec (which is required to play e.g. Netflix 4K HDR); you could purchase it in the store if you need it ...

I don't know about Netflix. I don't know which combo of hardware and software it requires. Is it bound to MS Media Foundation decoders? Or would LAV Filters be a supported free alternative?

[nevcairiel]

Except its free and not for purchase.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/p/hevc-video-extension/9n4wgh0z6vhq

But nothing can replace that, since only it will support the required DRM for Netflix etc.

On that note, as of today there is also a second one for Vorbis/Theora, called "Web Media Extension"
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/p/web-media-extensions/9n5tdp8vcmhs

[sat4all]

hi nevcairiel,

when playing hdr movies my external .srt and .ass subtitles look blindingly bright while embedded bluray subs looks fine. tried to lower sub renderer primary colors but it have no effect with hdr files.
is it madvr fault or xysubf? anything to do with lav filters? sorry i dont know where to ask!
any idea?

[nevcairiel]

Definitely not LAV Filters.

[sat4all]

good to know, thanks.

[bcec]

YADIF deinterlacing is not working when DXVA is enabled as hardware decoder (native or copy-back doesn't matter). Is this expected?
- Using the latest nightly (0.70.2.80)
- 1080ti with 385.69
- tried nVidia settings deinterlacing inverse telecine checked on and off, no change.

EDIT: copy-back works! :D

[LigH]

Yadif is a pure software deinterlacer. You cannot make DXVA deinterlace with Yadif in the GPU.

Oh, wait, you expected Yadif to deinterlace after pure hardware decoding ... sorry, it is late already. :o

[bcec]

Oh, wait, you expected Yadif to deinterlace after pure hardware decoding ... sorry, it is late already. :o
yup, I am assuming after doing hardware decoding, software YADIF should be able to kick in. But it doesn't.

At least the way it is presented in the UI, I was expecting it to work because I can select software deinterlacing after enabling hardware decoding.

Is it not supposed to work?

[nevcairiel]

With Copy-Back YADIF should be working fine. With Native it cannot work.

The reason options dont grey out is simple: Not every clip can be hardware decoded, and for those all software options always apply.

[bcec]

you are absolutely right (why wouldn't you :))

copy back works fine. Thank you for the quick follow-up.

[ashlar42]

Hopefully I get some more time over the holidays to finish some things and make a release then.Thanks. I didn't want to put pressure on you in any way. Take all the time needed. :)

[mclingo]

Hi, can anyone tell me if FSE (full screen exclusive) is required for Full frame packed MVC playback using AMD cards, I cant get it to work without using MADVR with FSE turned on.

[nevcairiel]

This is not related to LAV Filters, it only performs decoding.

[Klaus1189]

I use LAV Filters for watching MXF-Files, but in MXF files the audiochannels are stored as single mono streams. My NLE detects the files correctly as stereo.
How do I configure LAV Filters to use left and right mono streams as one stereo stream?

Do not forget about me ... :)

[nevcairiel]

There are no plans to handle those.

[JEEB]

I use LAV Filters for watching MXF-Files, but in MXF files the audiochannels are stored as single mono streams. My NLE detects the files correctly as stereo.
How do I configure LAV Filters to use left and right mono streams as one stereo stream?

As long as the MXF file format contains no hints about its contents, I do not think it's a good idea to start implicitly poking around this unless we're having the user specifically mix it in some way. If you know of MXF providing this metadata, feel free to tell about it to ffmpeg-devel, but so far it has either been in a separate XML file (if even that!), or completely vendor-specific (we had some stuff from Vendor X that did it like this, and some stuff from Vendor Y that did it like this).

I have dealt with MXF files where you had 8 audio tracks and first two of them were used for stereo, as well as MXF files where the track had 8 channels (or 6) of audio, of which only first two were actually to be actively utilized for mixing.

[aufkrawall]

nev, is there something special about VP9 decoding on certain CPUs?
Decoding YT 4k 60fps VP9 video on a Haswell CPU shows very high CPU usage, while it is much lower with mpv.
Oddly, there is also such a difference between browsers. Like with mpv, CPU usage in Firefox is quite low, while it is much higher in Chrome and Edge.
This is only the case here with Haswell (4770k), with Skylake (6700k) the differences are much smaller.

[Megalith]

How does LAV Audio manage to send a Dolby or DTS signal when the audio renderer isn't set to allow bitstreaming?

I recently set up a new pre-processor and was disappointed with how long it took to lock onto a Dolby or DTS signal (seeking would result in a silence of three to four seconds) but did not realize until today that "allow bitstreaming" was unchecked in my audio renderer's (MPC-HC Internal Audio Renderer) settings. Doing so allowed my pre-processor to lock onto the bitstream almost instantly and there is no more silence when I seek to different positions, but I am still curious why I didn't just get silence when that option was unchecked.

[el Filou]

Decoding YT 4k 60fps VP9 video on a Haswell CPU shows very high CPU usage, while it is much lower with mpv.
Oddly, there is also such a difference between browsers. Like with mpv, CPU usage in Firefox is quite low, while it is much higher in Chrome and Edge.Do you have a discrete graphics card in that Haswell system?
Someone told me Firefox now used hybrid VP9 decoding on their system (Sandy Bridge + Radeon 290), maybe mpv is doing the same?

[Pat357]

How does LAV Audio manage to send a Dolby or DTS signal when the audio renderer isn't set to allow bitstreaming?

but I am still curious why I didn't just get silence when that option was unchecked.

If bitstreaming is unchecked, LAV decodes the Dolby or DTS stream to an uncompressed n-channel wav like stream. It can do this because ffmpeg supports decoding such streams to uncompressed n-channel wav-like stream.
No magic involved, just plain decoding ! :p

[clsid]

Intel specific DXVA mode for VP9:
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1827194

Might be worthwhile to add?

[nevcairiel]

If it has a specific mode, that usually means it also doesn't work like the normal mode.

[aufkrawall]

Do you have a discrete graphics card in that Haswell system?
Someone told me Firefox now used hybrid VP9 decoding on their system (Sandy Bridge + Radeon 290), maybe mpv is doing the same?
No discrete card. I think it's also entirely impossible that either a Sandy Bridge IGP or the R9 290 can do any VP9 decoding, Sandy Bridge IGP is garbage and so is the video decoder on Hawaii GPU.
hwdec=no in mpv also doesn't allow any doubts. ;)

[el Filou]

Note that I specified hybrid decoding, I know Hawaii's fixed-function decoder can't do VP9.

[mclingo]

remove

[nevcairiel]

You are once again the wrong thread. Also, you should really learn some patience.

[senseipiledrive2]

I'd like to get some help updating the LAV filters in MPC-hc (latest stable build) to the latest nightly build LAV filter. I install the nightly build just fine, but when I play a movie in MPC-hc it still shows 70.2.1 version in the system tray for splitter, audio and video filters. Any help please?

Side question: should my output range for my limited RGB TV set to TV output in Lav Video Settings if I use madVR and have it set to TV range in there already?

[sneaker_ger]

It's probably using the built-in LAV filters. Easiest is to simply delete the LAV Filters sub-folder from the MPC-HC folder. As a bonus you can go to the "External Filters" options and add all LAV Filters (Video, Audio, Splitter (Source)) and set them to preferred.

[sneaker_ger]

@nev:
MKVToolNix 19.0.0:
* mkvmerge, GUI's multiplexer: MIME types: added the `font` top-level media types from RFC 8081. This means that the following new MIME types for fonts can be used: `font/ttf`, `font/otf`, `font/woff` and `font/woff2`.
Relevant for splitter?

[clsid]

Side question: should my output range for my limited RGB TV set to TV output in Lav Video Settings if I use madVR and have it set to TV range in there already?That setting is only for when LAV converts to RGB, which should never happen if you use madVR. All output formats and settings should be left at default in LAV. It will automatically use the appropriate ones.
Only touch the output range settings of the driver and madvr:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1271416

[Gee]

are there any problems with "lav direct 3D 11 +yadif" + nVIDIA +madVR yet?

[AngelGraves13]

are there any problems with "lav direct 3D 11 +yadif" + nVIDIA +madVR yet?

Besides the fact that it doesn't work?

[huhn]

should work perfectly fine in copyback mode.

[el Filou]

Works on my system apart from dropping one frame every 1-2 seconds, but that's because my CPU can't handle YADIF.
What problems are you experiencing?

[jmone]

Here is a 40 sec sample (https://ufile.io/kjezf) from a UHD BD with Atmos Track (325MB) where at the 33sec mark the ATMOS track drops out when bitstreaming to an AVR. There is no issue when playing the original Disc using a HW Player (and others have reported that it also plays fine on a PC using PDVD). The issue is constant across several users all with different setups but one commonality is that it just seems to be SW players like JRiver and MPC-HC that has the issue.

Thanks for looking.
Nathan

Edit PS - you can not demux the sample with eac3to but with the full M2TS it reports no issues.

[nevcairiel]

Here is a 40 sec sample (https://ufile.io/kjezf) from a UHD BD with Atmos Track (325MB) where at the 33sec mark the ATMOS track drops out when bitstreaming to an AVR. There is no issue when playing the original Disc using a HW Player (and others have reported that it also plays fine on a PC using PDVD). The issue is constant across several users all with different setups but one commonality is that it just seems to be SW players like JRiver and MPC-HC that has the issue.

The actual layout of the Dolby MAT frame used to encapsulate TrueHD for HDMI transmission is unknown and undocumented, so unless someone finds the specification how to do this, I'm afraid there isn't even a starting point to start looking.

[jmone]

Thanks - I'm not sure how common the issue will be but it seems to be limited to 2 x Disney discs so far (and both report having a high audio bitrate). The majority of the sound track is fine, but you then hit these points and sound is dropped (the amount of the drop seems to vary by the users setup from a brief drop to my setup where it is 10 sec). We are just guessing it is ffmpeg related given the players that are affected but don't really know. Is it worth opening a Ticket at https://trac.ffmpeg.org/ or would it just be wasting everyone time (and also if so is the sample too large)?

[ashlar42]

Am I correct in assuming LAVfilters won't upmix stereo audio to 5.1 (or surround in general)?

[LigH]

No affirmative answer from me ... but I believe no. LAV Filters will surely not upmix any stereo with arbitrary parameters, and I believe it has no ProLogic decoder either. Leave that to an attached A/V receiver in your shelf...

[ashlar42]

No affirmative answer from me ... but I believe no. LAV Filters will surely not upmix any stereo with arbitrary parameters, and I believe it has no ProLogic decoder either. Leave that to an attached A/V receiver in your shelf...Yeah, that's what I do. I was asking for a fellow Kodi DSPlayer user.

[foozoor]

Is kodi dsplayer still working?
I thought this sh*t was unstable and no longer maintained.

[mclingo]

Is kodi dsplayer still working?
I thought this sh*t was unstable and no longer maintained.

Well, you'd be completely wrong on both counts thankfully, a lot of hard work has gone into this and dev is still going strong, your comments and not appreciated.

[ashlar42]

Hopefully I get some more time over the holidays to finish some things and make a release then.Hi! Any progress on this? Just an update request, no hurry or anything. All the best for your 2018. :)
:thanks:

[ashlar42]

Is kodi dsplayer still working?
I thought this sh*t was unstable and no longer maintained.Well... I'd say it's arguably the most advanced media center solution available, with the best video and audio quality available. Far from being "sh*t", unstable or no longer mantained.

[DragonQ]

Well... I'd say it's arguably the most advanced media center solution available, with the best video and audio quality available. Far from being "sh*t", unstable or no longer mantained.
Kodi DSPlayer is generally stable and maintained, but the MediaPortal TV-Server plugin is very buggy, which prevents me from moving from MediaPortal for live TV playback.

[foozoor]

I didn't know aracnoz continued the development.
I thought he was looking for a new owner.
It seems mediaportal works with madvr now.

[iSeries]

Hi, I get occasional audio dropouts when bitrstreaming atmos/truedhd. All other formats work fine. If I switch to decoding, also fine. Does anyone have any idea what could be causing the dropouts? (MPC-BE with internal renderer, MadVR, Win10)

[ryrynz]

Try a different HDMI cable.

[nevcairiel]

Atmos bitstreaming is not fully understood. If the bitrate exceeds a certain limit, it breaks apart, because its not known how to handle that. This was never a problem with ordinary TrueHD since the bitrate doesn't get high enough. Unfortunately the specifications for that are not available anywhere online (not even to buy), since its not part of the IEC standard that usually controls HDMI bitstreaming. So if anyone knows how Dolby MAT (Metadata-enhanced Audio Transport) works - the format used to wrap TrueHD and Atmos for HDMI transmission, please let me know. :)

[iSeries]

Thanks for the explanation Nev. I'll switch to software decoding for problematic tracks.

[VAMET]

Dear Friends

Hi, I get occasional audio dropouts when bitrstreaming atmos/truedhd. All other formats work fine. If I switch to decoding, also fine. Does anyone have any idea what could be causing the dropouts? (MPC-BE with internal renderer, MadVR, Win10)

Try a different HDMI cable.

Atmos bitstreaming is not fully understood. If the bitrate exceeds a certain limit, it breaks apart, because its not known how to handle that. This was never a problem with ordinary TrueHD since the bitrate doesn't get high enough. Unfortunately the specifications for that are not available anywhere online (not even to buy), since its not part of the IEC standard that usually controls HDMI bitstreaming. So if anyone knows how Dolby MAT (Metadata-enhanced Audio Transport) works - the format used to wrap TrueHD and Atmos for HDMI transmission, please let me know. :)

The problem exist for example in movie PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN: DEAD MEN TELL NO TALES [2017] [2160P], where Dolby Atmos is 9Mbps, there are lots of dropouts for 1 second long and then sound is playing OK. It occurs, when there are shooting, explosions etc. HDMI cable change do nothing at all, I have tested for the cheapest and the most expensive ones and everytime the same problem with audio. When I convert to LPCM or change to not bitrstreaming via LAV Filters, there is no problem. After changing to bitstreaming, the problem occurs.

Sincerely

[iSeries]

Nev is it possible to add an extra box in the audio decoding properties, for Atmos/truehd tracks? So I could choose to bitstream truehd tracks but software decode atmos/truehd tracks.

EDIT: Also, does anyone know why software decoding is so much quieter than bitstreaming?

[nevcairiel]

LAV doesn't currently know if a stream contains Atmos extensions.

[huhn]

EDIT: Also, does anyone know why software decoding is so much quieter than bitstreaming?

because your system and player audio are not at 100 %?
alternatively the mixing.

[iSeries]

Using wasapi exclusive so always 100% when sending lpcm (but regardless all are set to 100% anyway). I noticed this a bunch of years ago when I had a Yamaha avr and it's the same with my Denon now. Sending lpcm to my receiver is notably quieter than bitstreaming.

[Manni]

Using wasapi exclusive so always 100% when sending lpcm (but regardless all are set to 100% anyway). I noticed this a bunch of years ago when I had a Yamaha avr and it's the same with my Denon now. Sending lpcm to my receiver is notably quieter than bitstreaming.

It's simply because LPCM uses different levels. It has always been the case.

[huhn]

decode: lavfilter decodes it to lpcm = low volume
bitstreaming: the AVR decodes it to lpcm = high volume

no sorry doesn't make sense.

[iSeries]

If it made sense, I wouldn't be posting here. I'm not lying ;-)

[nevcairiel]

Its just how receivers work. They have different reference levels for HDMI input and decoding on their own. Maybe its intentional so that compressed formats are perceived "better" (since for most people louder is better), but who knows.

[bisse]

There are some new features of mpls playlists being used on some blurays. The german version of "Grand Budapest Hotel" uses multi-angle mpls files to select the different language versions (they differ by localized inserts and title cards). Unfortunately LAV only picks the first playlist-angle out of such a mpls playlist, without any option to choose the other (sub-playlist) versions. This is completely different from multi-angle video streams.

This purely a matter of an mpls feature. The playlist file contains all the "angles" - no bd-j logc necessary. At the moment LAV plays the first angle of such playlist files. It would be nice if it would expose a choice of which angle to play - just like LAV has chapter support. This is not hugely important and might not even be on the agenda of the LAV developers, but maybe its easy to implement. And even if not, then i hope its still interesting to see that such mpls files exist.

Even if it did allow switching of angles, there is no guarantee that there is any information which angle is which, so you would probably still have to guess which to play.

This would be no different from having to guess which subtitle track is for the hearing impaired, contains only forced subtitles or is the regular subtitle track. Also with audio tracks sometimes it's not obvious which track is which (due to wrong language flags, or multiple english tracks for SDH, commentary, music only etc.).

With "Grand Budapest Hotel" it would not involve much guessing as the first localized titlecard appears right after the credit sequence.

Anyhow - it's not a "crucial" feature or anything. But as LAV opens mpls files it would be nice if it also supported this feature. And as you are aware now (or have been all along) that these files exist my mission is complete - the rest it up to your judgement, mood and time.

Could this function quoted in these old messages above still be implemented?

I've just purchased a bunch of GKIDS BD's that uses the MPLS angle feature to differentiate between credit sequences. As of now I'm forced to watch them with English credits, but I'd strongly prefer the original Japanese credits. Very frustrating.

I've tried using the modded mpc-hc with dslibbluray (with madvr, navigating blindly through the BD menu), but the subtitles seems to have a life of their own. They don't follow the timecode. I've tried both XYsub and the built in subs renderer.
I've also tried using the seamless playback function in Potplayer by adding each corresponding m2ts file the playlist, but with this method there's loads of audio glitches/skippings and the audio always gets out of sync, regardless of which audio decoder/renderer I use.

Is there any other method I can use if madvr is mandatory? Ripping is not an option.

[chros]

decode: lavfilter decodes it to lpcm = low volume
bitstreaming: the AVR decodes it to lpcm = high volume

no sorry doesn't make sense.

Its just how receivers work.
If I remember correctly when I start to use wasapi exclusive mode in MPC-* (instead of any other output device) then all my low vol problem has gone that was there before with my Yamaha AVR.
And not to mention that e.g. dts-hd bitstream has metadata that the receiver can process differently than a raw stream.

[iSeries]

Whether it's additional metadata or whether it's just something my AVR does when processing bitstreamed formats, it definitely sounds different. Not even just a case of lower volume. Turning the volume up does not match the sound 'impact' of bitstreaming. It sounds fuller, a more natural 'enveloping surround' sound, with better bass. LPCM in comparison just sounds like 7 individual channels of audio, plus much lower sub output. Poor explanation I know, and I know some might be sceptical lol. Anyway, nothing to do with LAV, definitely my receiver.

[e-t172]

If you're having issues with sub levels it might be that the LFE channel is being mishandled, i.e. the standard +10dB gain is not applied in one scenario or the other.

[chros]

LPCM in comparison just sounds like 7 individual channels of audio, plus much lower sub output. Poor explanation I know, and I know some might be sceptical lol
:) No, I completely undertand what you mean! I had tge same observation back then. E.g. when you convert dts-hd into flac and try to compare how these 2 sounds.
Do you have any other filter in the audio chain than splitter/decoder/renderer?
If you want I can post my mpc-be related config options.
If you're having issues with sub levels it might be that the LFE channel is being mishandled, i.e. the standard +10dB gain is not applied in one scenario or the other.
It's different from this: it's like bitstreamed audio has more "life", more dynamic.
But as I mentioned, using wasapi exclusive mode (I think the shared mode is also fine) in internal filters in mpc* solved my issue.

[max79]

Problem with "LAV Splitter Source", it can't grab second wmv3 video stream from this 3D-video file example:
http://www.3dtv.at/Movies/Oldtimers.wmv

[nevcairiel]

Only MKV 3D files or Blu-ray 3D SSIF streams are supported. No plans for any other files at this time.

[Manni]

Only MKV 3D files or Blu-ray 3D SSIF streams are supported. No plans for any other files at this time.

Hi Nevcairiel,

Does this mean that a player such as MPC-BE can play a 3D ISO once mounted?

[fluffy01]

When I try to play a 3D Bluray, I just get a black screen in madVR.

My current setup is Windows 10 FCU, Radeon Rx 460, Intel 6700T Skylake, Latest LAVFilters nightly (0.70.2-83), MPC-BE 1.5.2.3285 nightly, madVR 0.92.10.

I included the MVC download, when I installed LAVFilters.

When I try to play a 3D Bluray, madVR goes into 3D mode, and opening the stats confirm that it is in 3D mode, and the audo starts playing. But I just get a blank screen, and looking in the stats screen, I can see that the decoder queue does not fill up, and stays at 1-1/16, and after a little while, MPC-BE freezes and needs to be killed from the task manager. Also, I can see that the CPU usage is stuck at 25% (2 threads running at 100%).

However, if I pause the video and point at the seek-bar getting the small preview window to show, then that one actually shows video (It shows 2 pictures in OU-mode, but it at least shows something).

If I look into the LAVFilters video status window, I can see that the active decoder is "msdk mvc".

Since the decoder queue in madVR does not fill up, I am guessing that the problem lies in LAVFilters, hence the reason I am asking here. Please forgive me, if this is not the case.

If I reencode the video using FRIM, then the video works fine, so at least I know that the Intel SDK is working properly.

Any help is apreciated. If you need any additional info, please don't hesitate to ask, and I will answer as good as I can.

[mclingo]

hi, it can be really hard to track down issues with 3d playback as there can be lots of variables, i currently have an AMD RX 550 but I had an RX480 before that and it worked perfectly.

1. Install MPC-HC (easiest to configure for testing)
2. add the latest LAV filters as external filters - 1x audio 1x video 2x splitter - set to prefer
3. untick internal source and transform filters
4. set madvr back to defaults, (you can dial in your own preferences for scaling etc once its working again)
5. turn on all stereo 3d options in MADVR - (4 ticks)
6. Turn on FSE (full screen exclusive mode) - this is always required for AMD card at the moment, not necessarily required for NVIDIA cards
7. AMD cards can already do 23.976 so no need to faff about with custom res but add 1080p23 to display modes for now on its own, this is assuming the 3D movie is a 3D MKV RIP at 23.976
8. Power cycle you TV and receiver, sometimes mine stops working, about once a month and i have to power cycle my TV.
9. Set MPC to open in full screen but make sure autochange monitor mode is unticked.
10. make sure you set the RX460 as you renderer in LAV filters (external)

try again.

[Manni]

6. Turn on FSE (full screen exclusive mode) - this is always required for AMD card at the moment, not required for NVIDIA cards


This is not correct. FSE is not needed by some, but is required by others with nVidia too. I and others nVidia GPU users have reported they can't get 3D without FSE, including on Windows 10.

Please refrain from making generic statements. There are very few things that are true for every one, even on the same platform (same OS version same GPU family) due to the many parameters involved in a HTPC.

[mclingo]

This seems to change depending on which forum you are on and who you are talking too but i have amended my statement for now.

Has anyone ever given a reason why some cards dont work and so do and which ones, is it a driver issue or setup?, certainly when I was asking this question on the MADVR forum several people where quite clear in stating I didnt need FSE for 3D MVC, I disputed that until I tried it and it worked without FSE on my 1050.

[Manni]

This seems to change depending on which forum you are on and who you are talking too but i have amended my statement for now.

Has anyone ever given a reason why some cards dont work and so do and which ones, is it a driver issue or setup?, certainly when I was asking this question on the MADVR forum several people where quite clear in stating I didnt need FSE for 3D MVC, I disputed that until I tried it and it worked without FSE on my 1050.

I posted this https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1827132&postcount=47727 a few posts after one of yours, but for some reason, you seem to only retain some of the information in the thread and bring everything back to your own personal experience as if what you experience on your system was true for everyone. In most cases, it's not.

I don't know why it works for some and not for others. I haven't seen a trend re GPUs or OSes. I just know that 3D doesn't work for me and others without FSE on nVidia.

[mclingo]

Well, its hard to keep track and make sense of what people say, often answers come out of context out of place or a few pages later and they get missed, also , everyone is always contracting each other, I said the same thing as you and as soon as I did a load of people came back saying FSE wasnt required for NVIDIA cards. Then you alone came back saying it was, I went with what seemed to be the majority and my own experience.

Sometimes you can really only rely on your own experience, especially when you are trying to advise someone with a similar setup to yourself.

[Manni]

Well, its hard to keep track and make sense of what people say, often answers come out of context out of place or a few pages later and they get missed, also , everyone is always contracting each other, I said the same thing as you and as soon as I did a load of people came back saying FSE wasnt required for NVIDIA cards. Then you alone came back saying it was, I went with what seemed to be the majority and my own experience.

Sometimes you can really only rely on your own experience, especially when you are trying to advise someone with a similar setup to yourself.

Not with HTPCs. Please stop giving any advice to people if you based that advice simply on your personal experience and dismiss other people's experience to make general statements. Your experience, or the experience of the majority, doesn't mean that the issues experienced by a minority are not real.

More experienced people in the thread, such as Madshi or Nevcairiel, can make general statements because they infer their advice from all the personal experiences they have collected in the past, which adds to their vast knowledge and expertise in the tools they have created.

If you don't pay attention, don't remember, please refrain from giving unsolicited advice on all matters. Leave other more experienced people offer their advice first, and learn from it. You don't need to comment on everything. It adds noise and confusion.

There are only limited areas of discussions where I think I might be able to help. Half the time, I'm wrong or have forgotten something. So I try to post less to help more, and I would say I am significantly more experienced than you. :)

[fluffy01]

Thanks for the advice, but the only thing on your list that I haven't tried is the FSE part, but I am not sure that is the problem.
It goes fine into 3D mode. I have to use the glasses to see the stats, and they pop out at me.
The problem is that the decoder queue does not fill, and it is stuck on 1.

If it matters, the computer is connected to an Integral, which is connected to my Denon AVR, which is in turn connected to my Optoma 1080p projector.

[mclingo]

[QUOTE=Manni; ...... So I try to post less :)[/QUOTE]

by all means try to post even less.

[mclingo]

Thanks for the advice, but the only thing on your list that I haven't tried is the FSE part, but I am not sure that is the problem.
It goes fine into 3D mode. I have to use the glasses to see the stats, and they pop out at me.
The problem is that the decoder queue does not fill, and it is stuck on 1.

If it matters, the computer is connected to an Integral, which is connected to my Denon AVR, which is in turn connected to my Optoma 1080p projector.

yeah, there could be more than one issue here but AMD card must have FSE turned on in MADVR, this cant be disputed, although I bet someone will :)

[fluffy01]

I just tried activating FSE, but it didn't do any difference, so I deactivated it again.

My biggest problem with FSE is that it causes the system to renegotiate the HDMI-handshake every time it enters and leaves FSE, and my projector is VERY slow at reaquiring the HDMI signal (10+ secs). So since we got FS Windowed mode, I haven't used it.

[fluffy01]

If there is an easy way for me to test the 3D output directly from LAV, without using the player or madVR, then I can test if it is indeed a problem with LAV, or it lies somewhere else.

Does anybody know if this is possible?

[mclingo]

Hi, dont think its possible, its MADVR which triggers 3D mode in this setup, not LAV, Lav just does the decoding. why dont you plug you PC directly into your projector to rule out any issues with your chain.

The files you are playing have you encoded them youself, are you sure they are ok, try this, I always use this for testing.

Is 3D turned on in windows in display settings, are you definitely outputting 1080p?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwxFVkl63-lETWMzM1dRZF9XMDA/view

[fluffy01]

The movie is a 3D Bluray played directly from the media (With AnyDVD HD). The 3D is definitely turned on. It is running in frame-stacked 3D 1080p23.
And like I said before, the entire system is definitely running in 3D mode. The only thing missing is the picture of the video.
And it is the same whether I am running in full screen windowed or in regular windowed. The system is running in 3D mode, video is just blank. Everything else works.

Hmm. Almost missed your link to the mkv clip. I downloaded it, at that one works flawlessly!!! So I guess that for some reason LAV just wont play my 3D Blurays?!? I tried 2 different Bluray 3D disks, and neither of them worked, but your clip did.

So at least now we know, that my 3D is working after all, and now we need to figure out why it will not play my 3D Bluray disks.

[nevcairiel]

If there is an easy way for me to test the 3D output directly from LAV, without using the player or madVR, then I can test if it is indeed a problem with LAV, or it lies somewhere else.

Does anybody know if this is possible?

You can temporarily use another renderer, and check that LAV is still using "msdk mvc" as a decoder. You'll only get a 2D image, but as long as "msdk mvc" is used in LAV, it does 3D decoding.

Note however that the MSDK decoder is quite a blackbox, and if it just doesn't work, there isn't that much anyone can really determine remotely.

[fluffy01]

Thank you nev. Just testet with default EVR-Custom presenter, and LAV is still using "msdk mvc" and the screen is still black, and after a while the entire player freezes and needs to be killed with the task manager.

But as you can see by the comment I posted a few seconds before yours, mclingo's clip works flawlessly here, so it apparently works if you remux the entire disk into mkv, but not when played directly from the 3D Bluray.

I haven't tried remuxing the disk here by myself, as I am not aware of a free tool that can do this. As far as I know, MakeMKV is not free, right?

[nevcairiel]

MakeMKV is free while in beta. How long that'll last is anyones guess, but so far its been quite a long while. For that matter if you use it regularly, its always nice to recognize the work of others and actually pay. :)

Actual 3D Blu-rays should also work though, I just tried one and it still seems fine here. Which version of LAV are you using? Latest release or a nightly?

[SamuriHL]

Not to turn this into a tool thread, but, CloneBD is also free for the use case you're looking to do. As long as you don't require compression, you can use CloneBD to repackage into an MKV.

[fluffy01]

Ok. I have no problems paying for software that I regularly use, but I was hoping that I didn't have to use it at all and just play the disks directly without having to mux them to my harddisk first.

I am using latest nightly (0.70.2-83).

[nevcairiel]

Do you have an active Intel GPU? Or, more helpful, does it work with build 0.70.2-70 or earlier?

[fluffy01]

I posted my specs in my first post about this problem. My CPU is a Intel 6700T Skylake CPU, and if I use FRIM through AviSynth to decode the bluray, then it works fine.

I will test older versions of LAVFilter later. I am currently watching a movie with my wife.

[nevcairiel]

The CPU alone doesn't necessarily indicate if the GPU is actually enabled and installed in Windows - it usually requires some additional steps to setup multi-gpu mode with the integrated GPU and a dedicated one. But lets see first if the old version works or not, that might rule out that particular topic anyway.

[fluffy01]

I just tested the official 0.70.2 build, and it works! :D

I will do some more testing and see if I can pinpoint the nightly build that makes it stop working.

I installed the Intel GPU drivers on the system, but I do not have any displays connected to it. But all versions after Windows 7 should allow the use of the GPU even if there is not display attached to it, right?

[fluffy01]

I just finished testing, and 0.70.2-71 is the last working version. 0.70.2-74 and forward all fails.

[nevcairiel]

Sounds about right. Those newer versions try to use GPU-accelerated decoding if available. Apparently something fails there. My main dev box doesn't have an Intel GPU, so i'll have to poke it on another box again.

[fluffy01]

Ok. If you want me to try out some test builds with some extended logging, so perhaps it can be easier to see what is going wrong, then I can do that for you.

On a related note: Have you considered using DXVA decoding of MVC content? Maybe that will solve the problem, and also remove the dependency on the Intel SDK, for those with a GPU capable of decoding MVC.

[nevcairiel]

DXVA decoding basically requires having a software decoder for MVC (because a lot of stuff still needs to be handled in software), so until such a time when FFmpeg adds MVC decoding, unfortunately using DXVA for that is not easily possible.

[bisse]

@nevcairiel: In case you missed my earlier post, could I get a yes or no on this feature request quoted below? Thanks.

Could this function quoted in these old messages below still be implemented?

I've just purchased a bunch of GKIDS BD's that uses the MPLS angle feature to differentiate between credit sequences. As of now I'm forced to watch them with English credits, but I'd strongly prefer the original Japanese credits. Very frustrating.

I've tried using the modded mpc-hc with dslibbluray (with madvr, navigating blindly through the BD menu), but the subtitles seems to have a life of their own. They don't follow the timecode. I've tried both XYsub and the built in subs renderer.
I've also tried using the seamless playback function in Potplayer by adding each corresponding m2ts file the playlist, but with this method there's loads of audio glitches/skippings and the audio always gets out of sync, regardless of which audio decoder/renderer I use.

Is there any other method I can use if madvr is mandatory? Ripping is not an option.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are some new features of mpls playlists being used on some blurays. The german version of "Grand Budapest Hotel" uses multi-angle mpls files to select the different language versions (they differ by localized inserts and title cards). Unfortunately LAV only picks the first playlist-angle out of such a mpls playlist, without any option to choose the other (sub-playlist) versions. This is completely different from multi-angle video streams.

This purely a matter of an mpls feature. The playlist file contains all the "angles" - no bd-j logc necessary. At the moment LAV plays the first angle of such playlist files. It would be nice if it would expose a choice of which angle to play - just like LAV has chapter support. This is not hugely important and might not even be on the agenda of the LAV developers, but maybe its easy to implement. And even if not, then i hope its still interesting to see that such mpls files exist.

Even if it did allow switching of angles, there is no guarantee that there is any information which angle is which, so you would probably still have to guess which to play.

This would be no different from having to guess which subtitle track is for the hearing impaired, contains only forced subtitles or is the regular subtitle track. Also with audio tracks sometimes it's not obvious which track is which (due to wrong language flags, or multiple english tracks for SDH, commentary, music only etc.).

With "Grand Budapest Hotel" it would not involve much guessing as the first localized titlecard appears right after the credit sequence.

Anyhow - it's not a "crucial" feature or anything. But as LAV opens mpls files it would be nice if it also supported this feature. And as you are aware now (or have been all along) that these files exist my mission is complete - the rest it up to your judgement, mood and time.

[nevcairiel]

I don't have any plans to do that anytime soon. I don't believe I even have any disc which uses that. Most discs with localized video I have seen used different titles instead of Angles.

[nevcairiel]

Ok. If you want me to try out some test builds with some extended logging, so perhaps it can be easier to see what is going wrong, then I can do that for you.


I could reproduce the problem on a disc with an Intel GPU, unfortunately it appears to be a long-standing Intel issue that can result in the GPU reporting a "busy" state infinitely, causing decoding to just die. So for the time being, i've turned off hardware accelerated decoding again.

[fluffy01]

Ok thanks. I will test it as soon as the next nightly is up.

[bisse]

I don't have any plans to do that anytime soon. I don't believe I even have any disc which uses that. Most discs with localized video I have seen used different titles instead of Angles.

Yes I know. I have a large Bluray library and these from GKIDS are the first ones I've come across that uses this feature. Unfortunately I've already purchased 14 of them. I suppose the only solution right now is to rip all the corresponding mt2s into a single MKV. It just feels wrong seeing names like Gillian Anderson and the Fanning sisters in the credits of a Studio Ghibli film.

Does anyone know of any other solution? My only requirement is madvr.

[fluffy01]

Just tested the new nightly, and it works again :) Thank you.

[runner]

hi, I would like to know if lavsplitter supports parsing bduhd, thanks

[sneaker_ger]

Next version will have (limited) UltraHD Blu-ray support. You can already test it if you install the nightly build.

[BDFan]

Hi nevcairiel!

1. D3D11 doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus on Intel GPU if in the control panel nVidia selected GPU nVidia.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/f4/a1bdb331af6c6d7538b483fb41dc2bf4.jpg
DXVA Checker shows that d3d11 enable on Intel GPU if in the control panel nvidia selected GPU nVidia.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/1e/bf52f2ca8fc9e36416f5de8582c9261e.jpg

2. nVidia CUVID doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus if in the control panel nvidia selected any GPU.

3. After install LAV 0.70.2.88 mvc (software mode) doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus if in the control panel nvidia selected any GPU.

Windows 10 1709, Intel i5-4200M, Intel(R) HD Graphics 4600 (20.19.15.4835), NVIDIA GeForce 840M (23.21.13.9065)

[madshi]

I hate Optimus.

[nevcairiel]

Optimus is generally just not supported. Use it at your own discression, but don't expect anything to work. I do not provide support for such setups because they are impossible.

[BDFan]

I hate Optimus.
madVR works great with Optimus, but only in 2D ;)
On Intel GPU - 3D is slide show and later crush Intel driver.
On nVidia GPU - 3D doesn't work.
madVR or LAV Filters bugs?

[P.J]

Hi nevcairiel!

1. D3D11 doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus on Intel GPU if in the control panel nVidia selected GPU nVidia.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/f4/a1bdb331af6c6d7538b483fb41dc2bf4.jpg
DXVA Checker shows that d3d11 enable on Intel GPU if in the control panel nvidia selected GPU nVidia.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/1e/bf52f2ca8fc9e36416f5de8582c9261e.jpg

2. nVidia CUVID doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus if in the control panel nvidia selected any GPU.

3. After install LAV 0.70.2.88 mvc (software mode) doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus if in the control panel nvidia selected any GPU.

Windows 10 1709, Intel i5-4200M, Intel(R) HD Graphics 4600 (20.19.15.4835), NVIDIA GeForce 840M (23.21.13.9065)

Wish I could use Optimus too...

[nevcairiel]

LAV has no control over what hardware is available. It'll just try to use it. If its unavailable due to Optimus, there is nothing I can do about that.
Just leave DXVA2-CB or D3D11 in "auto" mode and let it pick the device, it'll try to find one that works, I hope.

[SamuriHL]

I have optimus, too, and I can get it to work well enough for 2D. It's not a well implemented technology so any issues you have with it are not going to be things LAV and madvr are going to solve. Bug MS, nVidia, and Intel. :)

[BDFan]

Wish I could use Optimus too...
Intel Quick Sync works...

[BDFan]

Just leave DXVA2-CB or D3D11 in "auto" mode and let it pick the device, it'll try to find one that works, I hope.
Only on Intel GPU works (if in the nVidia control panel selected Intel GPU).
But Intel GPU is slow for madVR :(

[hubblec4]

I suppose the only solution right now is to rip all the corresponding mt2s into a single MKV. It just feels wrong seeing names like Gillian Anderson and the Fanning sisters in the credits of a Studio Ghibli film.

Does anyone know of any other solution? My only requirement is madvr.

The first way is like you said, an mkv. With my chapterEditor is it an easy task and should be done in less then 15min(depend on your hardware).

The second way: You can manipulate the mpls with BDEdit. Make a copy before!

Multi-Angle mpls works similar to Multi-Edition BDs, different m2ts files are used for different Angles/Editions.
Find out which m2ts files belongs to the Angle you want.
I'm not an expert in BDEdit but it should be possible to change the "main" playlist of an Angle-mpls.

[yukinok25]

I hate Optimus.You have no idea how much I would like to scream this to Intel! [emoji23]

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

[el Filou]

Only on Intel GPU works (if in the nVidia control panel selected Intel GPU).
But Intel GPU is slow for madVR :(If you select the NVIDIA GPU for MPC-HC and then choose DXVA2 Copy-Back or D3D11 and select the HD 4600 in LAV, what happens? madVR still uses the Intel for rendering?

[BDFan]

If you select the NVIDIA GPU for MPC-HC and then choose DXVA2 Copy-Back or D3D11 and select the HD 4600 in LAV, what happens?
Read my first post.
D3D11 should theoretically work (see image DXVA Checker).
madVR still uses the Intel for rendering?
No. NVIDIA GPU active.

[chros]

You have no idea how much I would like to scream this to Intel! [emoji23]
Btw, does any laptop exist nowdays with only nvidia card that doesn't have this sh*t? :)

Read my first post.
D3D11 should theoretically work (see image DXVA Checker).
No. NVIDIA GPU active.
It works for me (see my signature), but I switched back to dxva2-cb, because there's no black-bar-cropping implemented with it in madvr yet.

[clsid]

With Optimus only one GPU is active from the perspective of the application. So if you select the NVIDIA GPU, then you can't use any functionality from the Intel one and vice versa.

[BDFan]

With Optimus only one GPU is active from the perspective of the application. So if you select the NVIDIA GPU, then you can't use any functionality from the Intel one and vice versa.
No. Intel Quick Sync active.

[el Filou]

Read my first post.
D3D11 should theoretically work (see image DXVA Checker).OK, I didn't really get what you meant. My bet is that the system calls DXVA Checker use to get the device capabilities are independent of the Optimus setting in NVIDIA Control Panel.
D3D11 video decode probably doesn't respect that Optimus setting either, that's why I was suggesting to use copy-back if you want to use the Intel D3D11 decode. I understand if you'd prefer native mode, but does it work with copy-back?

Also, QuickSync decoding is a private Intel API and not a DirectX one so I guess it's not impacted by the Optimus setting in NVIDIA control panel either.

[BDFan]

OK, I didn't really get what you meant. My bet is that the system calls DXVA Checker use to get the device capabilities are independent of the Optimus setting in NVIDIA Control Panel.
Depends!
DXVA Checker image №2 (if in the nVidia control panel selected Intel GPU).
http://i102.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0118/58/0265e80e7be6790a8a53a63c53928658.jpg

D3D11 video decode probably doesn't respect that Optimus setting either, that's why I was suggesting to use copy-back if you want to use the Intel D3D11 decode. I understand if you'd prefer native mode, but does it work with copy-back?
DXVA CB image
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0118/e1/ea6ffa6f8a0bbc780e15892929dfeee1.jpg

[varekai]

Using LAVFilters-0.70.2 and nightly build LAVFilters-0.70.2-88 with PotPlayer 1.7.7150.
When playing BD (mpls) or mkv's no subtitles show up.
Also using madVR v0.92.10
Perhaps this is a PotPlayer issue?
If not are there some settings in LAVFilters I'm missing?

With this setting I can view subtitles both embedded BD (PGS) and .srt, I can also load .sup and .srt.
https://s17.postimg.org/5eh5lihwv/LAV-_OK.png

With this setting there is no way to view any subtitles.
I can add them but they doesn't show up.
https://s17.postimg.org/n4iu6ldi7/LAV-_NO.png

Regards

[el Filou]

Isn't the source filter the one responsible for selecting and 'sending' subtitles to the renderer?
In both your screenshots you're using Potplayer's built-in source (BDMV) filter. Is there an option to use LAV source filter instead?
Edit: what I mean is, also use LAV's own source filter if you're using its video decoder. Maybe that's where the problem is coming from.

[varekai]

@el Filou
Do you mean the tick at "Use Built-in DXVA Video Decoder?
If I disable that there is no change, no subtitles.
I'm not shure what you mean "Potplayer's built-in source (BDMV) filter."
I can't find that inside PotPlayer.

[el Filou]

Sorry, I mean the 'Built-in HDMV playlist source'.
Maybe that filter and madVR can't agree on a way to exchange subtitle data?

[varekai]

@el Filou
I can't find "Built-in HDMV playlist source" inside PotPlayer.
Looked att all possible settings but can't see where to change that.

[el Filou]

I think maybe you'd find better help asking in a PotPlayer forum, because personally I don't have any problems with PGS subs using LAV and madVR both in MPC-HC and MediaPortal, and that 'Built-in HDMV playlist source' you see in the filter drop down menu is PotPlayer's own.

[varekai]

OK, MPC-HC is no problem. PGS and srt works.
Strange thing is their not working in PotPlayer after adding LAV Filters...

[el Filou]

As I said, MPC-HC built-in Blu-ray playback uses a bundled version of LAV's own splitter to demux streams and manage the subtitles:
https://s9.postimg.org/ni73u0obj/MPC-_HC_Blu-ray_subs_LAV.jpg

I don't know what software PotPlayer's own 'Built-in HDMV playlist source' is based on, but maybe it's not "collaborating" with LAV and/or madVR in the same way as LAV's own source filter does. You need to ask PotPlayer's developer.

Edit: is there an option in PotPlayer to force it to use an external filter, like this one in MPC: https://s9.postimg.org/bt346i027/image.png ?
If yes then try adding LAV splitter source and LAV splitter.

[sneaker_ger]

Yes, in PotPlayer you select LAV Splitter (Source) here:
https://wiki.mikejung.biz/images/b/b6/Pot_player_how_to_set_ffmpeg_as_source_splitter_filter.jpg

But I don't know if it works for BD if you select MPEG2 TS or if that is extra.

Could be that the PotPlayer internal splitter has some custom connection to the PotPlayer video decoder that passes the subtitle. LAV Video does not do that, in the LAV "ecosystem" the splitter is supposed to pass the subtitles to the subtitle renderer (e.g. AssFilterMod or XySubFilter) and that one passes to the video renderer (e.g. madvr). (Except maybe DVD buttons or something...)
Best to ask in the PotPlayer forum.

[varekai]

@el Filou

Tried again and again but no subtitles... :\
https://s17.postimg.org/7wto138rj/LAV.png

The Fall is a lovely movie! :D

Regards

[varekai]

@sneaker_ger

Thanks for your input.
PotPlayer forum is not very active, I'll make a post there.

[PCU]

how to deblock bink video with lav filters?

[sneaker_ger]

LAV Video doesn't have any post-processing filters like that. Try madvr artifact removal features.

[el Filou]

The Fall is a lovely movie! :DIndeed! :) Its Digital Intermediates were done in 4K too, and I think it's one of the rare movies I would buy a second time on UHD BD.

Tried again and again but no subtitles... :\
https://s17.postimg.org/7wto138rj/LAV.pngSorry I can't see what else could interfere there and I never use PotPlayer so don't know about its potential quirks. :(
Last idea: if you click on LAV Splitter in that menu, can you check if you have a "[Out] Subtitle" entry like this: https://s9.postimg.org/cvw4qxb7j/image.png and what next filter it is connecting to?
I'm using MPC-HC's internal subtitle renderer so I guess that's what 'TextPassThru' is on my screenshot, but on yours it should probably connect to madVR directly? Or does PotPlayer have an internal sub renderer?

[arrgh]

I could reproduce the problem on a disc with an Intel GPU, unfortunately it appears to be a long-standing Intel issue that can result in the GPU reporting a "busy" state infinitely, causing decoding to just die. So for the time being, i've turned off hardware accelerated decoding again.

I'm having the Problem described here:
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1827545#post1827545
I tried the nightly .88. Unfortunately now I have a picture in the "black-screen-movies" of before but they are now jerky and also those who worked with .83 are jerky too…
Went back to .83…..
Maybe there is a way to override the “busy” flag of the hardware?....
(samples of working/not working movies are still available for download via PM link I have sent you)

[nevcairiel]

If you don't have enough CPU power to decode MVC in software, you're probably out of luck for the time being. I don't currently have the free time to spend multiple days of research on an obscure Intel hardware decoding bug. Bugs that entirely break playback and even lockup the entire player are not acceptable under any circumstances.

The behavior has now returned to how it always was since MVC support was introduced, and how it was in in the 0.70.2 release, so its not exactly a "change".

[Klaus1189]

What is the difference between LAV Splitter Source and LAV Splitter?

[LigH]

I believe the Source filters (in general) read the media files and analyze their container formats, and the actual splitter separates their content streams... so the splitter could work with a different source filter as long as it signals all required information about the container.

No guarantee for a correct and complete answer.

[Klaus1189]

So I simply use both as external filters? The filters are not "arguing", because they do different things?

[sneaker_ger]

LAV Splitter Source opens the file (via OS/file system API, maybe via streaming protocol) itself, LAV Splitter gets the file from another DirectShow filter. They don't compete against each other.

[Undead Sega]

Hi guys, long time me coming back to the forums!

I've recently switched to LAV Filters since it was recommended as I've been using ffdshow for years, however it lacked HEVC/H265 decoding. Also it was great to configure which software or applications you can use it for decoding, in my case Premiere Pro and After Effects.

Now these days a lot of things is trending towards the newer codec however LAV Filters doesn't seem to decode the video in the aforementioned softwares and more so it doesn't have the configuration feature on where you would like the decoding to take place.

Is there any possibility to have such a feature on the filters? More importantly, isn't there any way to direct the filters to decode HEVC/H265 video in Premiere and After Effects??

[poisondeathray]

Hi guys, long time me coming back to the forums!

I've recently switched to LAV Filters since it was recommended as I've been using ffdshow for years, however it lacked HEVC/H265 decoding. Also it was great to configure which software or applications you can use it for decoding, in my case Premiere Pro and After Effects.

Now these days a lot of things is trending towards the newer codec however LAV Filters doesn't seem to decode the video in the aforementioned softwares and more so it doesn't have the configuration feature on where you would like the decoding to take place.

Is there any possibility to have such a feature on the filters? More importantly, isn't there any way to direct the filters to decode HEVC/H265 video in Premiere and After Effects??

Is this an old version ? PP/AE can decode HEVC natively now

[nevcairiel]

LAV is just a plain DirectShow filter, it doesn't have any specific support for any specific applications. Any app that can use DirectShow filters can also use LAV Video for decoding. I have no idea what Premiere or After Effects use for decoding, but I would honestly be a bit surprised if they actually used DirectShow.

[varekai]

@el Filou

I've been going through all settings that have references to "Built-in" inside PotPlayer.
I changed/removed all that I could find.
Enabling or disabling "Use Built-in DXVA Video Decoder" makes no difference.
I just can't get subtitles to show! :\

As you can see here I don't have the "Pin Info" tab:
https://s17.postimg.org/e1w7bgo9b/LAV-_Splitter-_Source-1.png
https://s17.postimg.org/upnpe13m7/LAV-_Splitter-_Source-2.png

[mclingo]

Warning - Dont click on those images if you are viewing this web site form work.. NSFW images.

[varekai]

Warning - Dont click on those images if you are viewing this web site form work.. NSFW images.
What!!?

[LigH]

I wonder too; I see the posted images only, just screenshots of the user interface. But maybe for some they load wrapped in ad-bloated websites with naughty content?

[mclingo]

was covered in adverts of scantilly clad women, not suitable viewing at work

Gone now though, odd.

[mclingo]

now back, but they've changed, not so NSFW any more but not ideal.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ifos6uw7m7ivz7e/woman.png?dl=0

[sneaker_ger]

Oh, I just noticed I posted something very wrong:
Could be that the PotPlayer internal splitter has some custom connection to the PotPlayer video decoder that passes the subtitle. LAV Video does not do that, in the LAV "ecosystem" the splitter is supposed to pass the subtitles to the video renderer (e.g. madvr) directly.
LAV Splitter doesn't pass the subtitles directly to madvr. It passes it to a subtitle renderer like e.g. AssFilterMod or XySubFilter and that subtitle renderer passes the video to madvr.

Sorry for the confusion.

[LigH]

So...

@mclingo: For you, the request to "display the image" has been redirected to "display the image inside an advertizing website". Seems this does not happen to everyone. You may want to try to install browser add-ons which block known advertizing content and redirections (e.g. "uBlock Origin") and possibly even unwanted JavaScript (like "NoScript", but that can get a bit complex to handle).

@ varekai: There are also completely ad-free image hosters, e.g. https://frupic.frubar.net

[nevcairiel]

In any case discussions about image hosters are entirely off-topic here.

[varekai]

@ mclingo
Ahh... good catch, 'cause I never see the adverts.
Probably because I use NoScript and Adblock Plus.
You should harden your web browser with these two, their free, regullary updated and very good.

@ LigH
Thanks for the tips, will use that service next time.

@ sneaker_ger
Thanks for the info, I'll dig deeper into the subtitle issue I'm having.

[el Filou]

As you can see here I don't have the "Pin Info" tab: https://s17.postimg.org/upnpe13m7/LAV-_Splitter-_Source-2.pngTry checking the 'Enable System Tray Icon' option, then an icon for LAV Splitter should appear in the taskbar during playback. Click that icon and see if the 'Pin Info' tab appears then.

[nevcairiel]

"Pin Info" is something the player adds (ie. its something MPC-HC/BE do, other players may not have it).

[Undead Sega]

Is this an old version ? PP/AE can decode HEVC natively now

It is, I am using CS6, the version(s) before they went Subscription and Cloud based :(

LAV is just a plain DirectShow filter, it doesn't have any specific support for any specific applications. Any app that can use DirectShow filters can also use LAV Video for decoding. I have no idea what Premiere or After Effects use for decoding, but I would honestly be a bit surprised if they actually used DirectShow.

So you saying there is absolutely no way for it to be used in other software as a decoder? it seems to do very well with Windows Media Player, being able to play non-standard files with subs with a restrictive player is pretty awesome! :)

[nevcairiel]

So you saying there is absolutely no way for it to be used in other software as a decoder? it seems to do very well with Windows Media Player, being able to play non-standard files with subs with a restrictive player is pretty awesome! :)

Its a DirectShow filter, it can be used in any software which uses DirectShow for video decoding - which WMP is one of. Software which doesn't use DirectShow also cannot use a DirectShow filter. See how that works? :D

[varekai]

Hahaha... after all testing various settings and searching for a solution it all comes down to this...

• Display Subtitles on Overlay/VMR/EVR Surface

F*** me... :D

https://frupic.frubar.net/shots/36370.png
https://frupic.frubar.net/shots/36371.png
https://frupic.frubar.net/shots/36372.png
https://frupic.frubar.net/shots/36373.png

Subtitles are now showing perfectly in PotPlayer!! LAV Filters working! All is good! Perseverance furthers... :D

Edit:
I'm lost... now what to do...? :/

Here is PotPlayer fullscreen where LAV and showing subs work:
https://frupic.frubar.net/shots/36381.png
The subs look really bad.

Here is PotPlayer fullscreen without LAV:
https://frupic.frubar.net/shots/36382.png
The subs look great.

[Bozotheclown]

Question:

The Vulkan API can be adopted for video decoding like D3D11 or OpenGL?

[nevcairiel]

Question:

The Vulkan API can be adopted for video decoding like D3D11 or OpenGL?

Vulkan has no benefits for video decoding. Neither does OpenGL.

[Klaus1189]

I beg to add WEBVTT subtitles support in LAV Filters. More and more YT videos have subtitles and it would be nice to play the videofile with subtitles of this kind. If you are interested and need a sample, let me know.

[mkver]

Are you sure that it is LAV Filters (and not your subtitle renderer or something else) that needs to be updated for this? Because if I look at the input formats that LAV Splitter handles I see webvtt among them.

[sneaker_ger]

In what form do you have them, anyways? Just a raw file on the HDD, trying via http or muxed in a container?

[nevcairiel]

There is still no subtitle renderer which even remotely supports any WebVTT features, so any such endavour would be rather fruitless.
I could add it, but then nothing would show it. Yay? Guess its not my problem anymore then =p

[Klaus1189]

What subtitle renderer is actively developed nowadays? Asking their Devs doesn‘t hurt.

[arrgh]

I'm having the Problem described here:
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1827545#post1827545
I tried the nightly .88. Unfortunately now I have a picture in the "black-screen-movies" of before but they are now jerky and also those who worked with .83 are jerky too…
Went back to .83…..
Maybe there is a way to override the “busy” flag of the hardware?....
(samples of working/not working movies are still available for download via PM link I have sent you)

If you don't have enough CPU power to decode MVC...

I hope/think you are wrong...
I flashed back an image from 8/2017 of a Win10x64 setup on this machine. Upgraded to Intel-driver .4901 (new style) and downgraded later to .4849 (old style).
LAV .88 played with both drivers with "LAV Hardware decoding" "None" and "D3D11" both types of MVC-files.
(the shut down of the player MPC-BE was with the difficult files a little bit tricky but in the end possible.)
LAV .83 played the good files without Problems (with both drivers), the bad ones gave a black screen, like in Win8.1x64.

In the Win8.1x64 setup I'm using .4860, which is in between the 4849 and the 4901, still LAV .88 does not work.

That tells me that my hardware is not "too weak", but the software has an issue... driver mainly but to some extend also the decoder and OS are involved.
I would hate to be forced to move back to Win10 because this system is constantly doing things behind my back I don't want...
On top comes that Madshi is advertising Win8.1 as the prefered media system. It would be a pity if modern CPU/Graphics like Kaby Lake would not be fully suported in Win8.1.

[nevcairiel]

The hardware decoding option has no impact on MVC decoding, it was always used when appropriate hardware was present, so your testing does not tell you what you think it tells you.
Anyhow as mentioned before, I do not have enough spare time right now to waste on trying to figure out whats wrong with weird Intel GPUs. So I will not work on this further. It functions now exactly like it did for all LAV releases before.

PS:
Intel/Microsoft does in fact only officially support Kaby Lake on Windows 10.

[arrgh]

The hardware decoding option has no impact on MVC decoding, it was always used when appropriate hardware was present, so your testing does not tell you what you think it tells you.
...it still stands : LAV .88 decodes both file-types ok, so the Hardware is not the problem...

Anyhow as mentioned before, I do not have enough spare time right now to waste on trying to figure out whats wrong with weird Intel GPUs. So I will not work on this further. It functions now exactly like it did for all LAV releases before.
I know, also from these posts... I will live with it...
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1831126#post1831126
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1831168#post1831168


PS:
Intel/Microsoft does in fact only officially support Kaby Lake on Windows 10.
I know... doesn't make it OK....

[nevcairiel]

...it still stands : LAV .88 decodes both file-types ok, so the Hardware is not the problem..

So everything is fine then. LAV decodes the files properly, and thats that.

Software decoding is independent of the OS you use, or the drivers you have installed, so if you're seeing issues on one OS and not on another, its far more likely that this is caused by the rendering - which is outside of LAVs control.
As a test, you should run it in SBS mode instead of frame-packed 3D, this avoids a lot of weirdness with 3D in the drivers, and could point you into the direction of whats going on.

PS:
You should really not speculate about peoples motivations. It'll only result in people getting pissed off and ignoring you in the future. Just sayin'
I didn't even like 3D before I ever implemented 3D MVC decoding, and yet its still something that exists. Weird, huh?

[runner]

the parsing of the ISO BDUHD with the LAV splitter unfortunately still does not work, will it be usable with the stable version?

[LigH]

How exactly does it "not work", can you provide useful details to tighten the scope?

[nevcairiel]

From what I'm told from other users, the latest nightlies should be working fine for UHD BD.

[huhn]

What subtitle renderer is actively developed nowadays? Asking their Devs doesn‘t hurt.

libass is in development but it is for ASS subs...
https://github.com/libass/libass

or assfiltermod which uses libass for ass
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=173573

[jmone]

From what I'm told from other users, the latest nightlies should be working fine for UHD BD.

Yes works great. The only thing not working (at least with JRiver) is that there is no title selection.

[Klaus1189]

libass is in development but it is for ASS subs...
https://github.com/libass/libass

or assfiltermod which uses libass for ass
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=173573

Does it make sense to ask the devs of this project for WEBVTT?

[Klaus1189]

I could add it, but then nothing would show it. Yay? Guess its not my problem anymore then =p

Do you please add support for WebVTT, so it is left on subtitle renderer to support it?

[huhn]

Does it make sense to ask the devs of this project for WEBVTT?

sorry no clue.
if they cares about it i guess so.
at least i don't see a reason why it should be out of scope for assfilter_mod but i guess yet PGS is more important.

[nussman]

Does it make sense to ask the devs of this project for WEBVTT?
Does it make sense to ask this here?
Why not just asking in the assfiltermod thread?

[PCU]

when i play h.265 format with dxva 2 ticked, mpc-hc (x64, latest official version) freezes & must end task the process.
intel hd 6000 gpu. win 8 pro x64.

[Bozotheclown]

Why D3D11 is supported only under win8 and newer?
I try to activate it under Win7_64. DX11 is working under Win7.

[nevcairiel]

Windows 7 does not support D3D11 decoding, its as simple as that. You can search the thread for when D3D11 was first introduced in LAV for more detailed explanations which features are unsupported in 7.

[Bozotheclown]

Thanks, but is not as simple as it looks like because it's module from DXv11 and DX11 is supported by Win7. Anyway it looks like now Win8.1 is the best option, and its time for next step.

ps. I Think that "Platform Update for Windows 7 SP1" solve this issue.

[clsid]

No, platform update does not make a difference.

[nevcairiel]

You basically need 11.1, which is not available until Windows 8.

For reference:
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/bb173059 - look for DXGI_FORMAT_NV12

Direct3D 11.1: This value is not supported until Windows 8.


You can play games on Windows 7 with D3D11, but you cannot use the video decoder.

[PCU]

so h.265 hardware acceleration is not supported in dxva2 for hd 6000?

[nevcairiel]

I don't memorize every single generation of hardware. Its quite possible that it is not. I believe Skylake was the first to add full HEVC/H265 hardware acceleration (8-bit only, 10-bit hybrid), so that would be a no then.
This page seems to agree: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Quick_Sync_Video

[PCU]

I don't memorize every single generation of hardware. Its quite possible that it is not. I believe Skylake was the first to add full HEVC/H265 hardware acceleration (8-bit only, 10-bit hybrid), so that would be a no then.
This page seems to agree: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Quick_Sync_Video


:thanks:

[arrgh]

You should really not speculate about peoples motivations. It'll only result in people getting pissed off and ignoring you in the future. Just sayin'
I didn't even like 3D before I ever implemented 3D MVC decoding, and yet its still something that exists. Weird, huh?
the intention was not to "piss-off", but to indicate that I'm aware of the fact that your patience with Intel and/or MVC is limited...


Software decoding is independent of the OS you use, or the drivers you have installed, so if you're seeing issues on one OS and not on another, its far more likely that this is caused by the rendering - which is outside of LAVs control.
As a test, you should run it in SBS mode instead of frame-packed 3D, this avoids a lot of weirdness with 3D in the drivers, and could point you into the direction of whats going on.

...and that was a very helpful hint! Indeed, madVR .11 set in "devices/.../properties/3D format" to "side-by-side" presents with LAV .88 two squeezed pictures (D3D9 is used for this); the TV signals: "3D detected"; when I push the 3D-button on the TV-remote I get a smooth 3D picture !
https://frupic.frubar.net/36394

So, I moved back to Win8.1x64 and there the outcome was the same. Even with Intel driver .4821.
(Later I even set madVR back to Auto; if I just start the film and do nothing, it runs ok; but as soon I "FF" or go with the mouse over the seek-bar everything breaks down)

So, my question is : is qualitywise the outcome of the “side-by-side” trick in madVR the same as with “auto” (are 2 full HD pictures sent to the TV which it combines to a 3D)?
---
Then I followed a different thought : basically all MVC-files should be the same (right?) – a H264 base video and the ssif-stream are muxed with audio and sups to an mkv… why are some played and others not…?
Of my 65 3D-movies 28 work with LAV .83 (using hardware decoding) the others not. What’s the difference? Since my expertise is limited in this area, I simply used MediaInfo…
The differences MediaInfo reports are only in:
“Multiview layout laced” (present or not present)
ReFrames : 2, 3 or 4
GOP : M=1, with N= 5, 7, 10, or 12; or: M= 3, with N=9, 12 or 24
https://frupic.frubar.net/36395

Generally said the outcome was unfortunately inconclusive; this are the trends :
Of the working files 2/3 had Reframes=2 and GOP =M1, with N=5 or 9 or 10; or it was not set at all;
Some had Reframes=4, mostly with GOP = M=1, N=12 or M=3, N=24; very few has Reframes=3;
Of the not working Files 78% had
ReFrames : 3 with GOP : M=1, N=12 (70%; only one exception : N=7) or GOP not set at all (30%);
…maybe there is something completely different one could look for but I don’t have the knowledge and tools…?

But bottom line is : I should move back to the madVR thread, right?

[amayra]

Does Hyper-Threading make a difference for LAV Filters ?

[Aleksoid1978]

Maybe you upload short sample of "bad files" for testing.

[arrgh]

Maybe you upload short sample of "bad files" for testing.

have sent you a PM
Thanks

[P.J]

You do realize that even if this was supported, that LAV wouldn't actually do any cropping, but just forward these values to the renderer, so the renderer does the cropping, right?
Since SVP uses ffdshow, and ffdshow is dead and buried, nothing would change there. :)

But MPC Video decoder supports it perfectly :rolleyes:

[runner]

From what I'm told from other users, the latest nightlies should be working fine for UHD BD.

I tried with different ISO of BDUHD and I can not start the main movie using mpchc and mpcbe set with external filters

[huhn]

But MPC Video decoder supports it perfectly :rolleyes:

your quote is from 2013

[P.J]

your quote is from 2013

Yes, but still not fixed =/

[nevcairiel]

Container cropping is an obscure niche case and not likely to ever be supported.

[P.J]

Container cropping is an obscure niche case and not likely to ever be supported.

But it's very useful =/
Check this: https://www.sendspace.com/file/sjgj65

[PCU]

soom ffmpeg will support .usm (container) file format:
https://trac.ffmpeg.org/ticket/6995

[huhn]

Container cropping is an obscure niche case and not likely to ever be supported.

madVR has basic support for it now.
madVR v0.92.3
* added (limited) support for cropping through the DirectShow pin info

but if i'm not mistaken it reads it from the video stream not the container.
but this is just a fix for a bad encoded video...

[clsid]

P016 is still broken on Win10 build 16299 for at least some recent Intel drivers. So the current workaround needs some adjustment.

[clsid]

I tried with different ISO of BDUHD and I can not start the main movie using mpchc and mpcbe set with external filtersBluray requires the internal MPEG source filters to be enabled.

Use MPC-HC 1.7.14, which includes latest LAV Filters:
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=175209

[nevcairiel]

P016 is still broken on Win10 build 16299 for at least some recent Intel drivers. So the current workaround needs some adjustment.

It was disabled because of general failure in EVR with >8 bit formats, not driver issues. Those issues have been resolved.

[onur]

Hi, i have a Problem with mp4 Video Export and Powerpoint 2016.

Exported Powerpoint Video is flickering when playing with DXVA2 Video Player.
Flicker occurs on Page Change.

Steps to reproduce:
Open Powerpoint 2016, Empty Project, make 2 Pages (first with white background, second black background).
Export Video as mp4.
Play video with MPC-HC - with enabled DXVA2.


tested with MPC-HC(LAV) and VLC with DXVA2 enabled (nativ and copy back).
tested with Intel HD Graphics, and Nvidia Graphics.
Flickering only occurs when exporting mp4 - no problems with wmv.

Flickering only occurs with Powerpoint 2016 - no problems with Powerpoint 2010+http://skp.mvps.org/videotools.htm

Flickering only occurs with DXVA2 Playback - no Probs with Software Decoder.

is this a Powerpoint or LAV and VLC Bug?

regards, onur

[Aleksoid1978]

Hi, i have a Problem with mp4 Video Export and Powerpoint 2016.

Exported Powerpoint Video is flickering when playing with DXVA2 Video Player.
Flicker occurs on Page Change.

Steps to reproduce:
Open Powerpoint 2016, Empty Project, make 2 Pages (first with white background, second black background).
Export Video as mp4.
Play video with MPC-HC - with enabled DXVA2.


tested with MPC-HC(LAV) and VLC with DXVA2 enabled (nativ and copy back).
tested with Intel HD Graphics, and Nvidia Graphics.
Flickering only occurs when exporting mp4 - no problems with wmv.

Flickering only occurs with Powerpoint 2016 - no problems with Powerpoint 2010+http://skp.mvps.org/videotools.htm

Flickering only occurs with DXVA2 Playback - no Probs with Software Decoder.

is this a Powerpoint or LAV and VLC Bug?

regards, onur

Upload short sample.

[onur]

attachment is now in original post.
mp4 and powerpoint file.

[LigH]

Attaching the files to your post was no perfect idea; this forum requires moderators to approve attachments, that may take a while...

[ajp_anton]

I have a question regarding the advanced subtitle selector. What happens if the preferred subtitle language doesn't exist? If one speaks multiple languages, can I set a "priority list" of subtitles that I prefer to activate?
For example: If audio is japanese, activate finnish subtitles. If it doesn't exist, then swedish subtitles, and if that also doesn't exist, "fall back" to english subs.

[sneaker_ger]

The priorities are from left to right.
jpn:fin;jpn:swe;jpn:eng

[ajp_anton]

Thanks. So even if it matches the audio language, it moves on to the next one if it can't match the audio:subtitle pair. I finally got it working with MPC-HC, but I was first testing with Jriver, where I couldn't get it working. Will ask in their forums.

[el Filou]

@nevcairiel : would it be possible to add an option to choose a different deinterlacing type for SD and HD resolutions?
For HD I find the hardware deinterlacing to be more pleasing to the eye and also my CPU can't handle YADIF, but for SD YADIF looks better than hardware and no problem for the CPU.

[madshi]

Just ripped my "Despicable Me" UHD Blu-Ray disc (German), worked fine. Then I tried making it play with MPC-HC, using latest LAV Nightly build. It's a seamless branching disc. The auto-selection of the right playlist doesn't seem to work. If I drag "index.bdmv" into the media player, nothing happens. However, using eac3to to identify the movie playlist and then dragging the playlist file into the media player works fine.

Is this something that would need to be fixed in MPC-HC or in LAV?

[nevcairiel]

Works fine for the UHD disc I have. Make sure to disable the internal MPEG TS/PS/PVA demuxer so that the external LAV can fully take over. Probably something in MPC-HC that doesn't like the increased version number in the Blu-ray files?

[madshi]

Just checked, it works with MPC-BE, but not with MPC-HC, so not your fault.

[PhantomF]

I'm having a strange issue with LAV Video Filter. I have my Radeon 7870 GPU clocked at 1200/1350 core/memory and when idle the clocks sit at 300/150. Whenever I use LAV Video filter with DXVA2 hardware decoder enabled the GPU clocks go to 1000/1200 and after stopping the video playback the clocks sit at 450/1200 when idle and max out at 1000/1200 in all other applications/games from then on. I need to restart my PC in order to reset them so they return to normal. If I disable DXVA2 in the video filter settings this doesn't happen and GPU clocks are normal after stopping video playback.

This happens in both MPC-HC and NextPVR where I use the LAV Video filter. I've tried a few different LAV builds including the newest nightly with same results as well as a few different video card drivers. Any idea what is causing this issue as it is extremely annoying having to restart the PC after watching TV or videos and before playing games. I'm running the latest build of Win10 Pro 64bit and I'm using the 32-bit version of the LAV filters as that's required for MPC-HC/madVR and NextPVR playback.

[Khaled1323]

I have been using Lav for a long time and just passed a comment where he mentioned using Graphstudio to check if it's working or not. Surprisingly It doesn't look like it working on me. Does this look right? I'm using madvr with mpp and Lav fillters
https://image.prntscr.com/image/6uOS22rzRHS3e9AA-BGc8Q.png

[mkver]

LAV Filters isn't used for decoding in that graph at all (instead Microsoft's default decoders are used). Just delete the MS filters and insert desired LAV Filters manually (via Graph -> insert filter). Afterwards you have to make the right connections.

[Khaled1323]

Can you show me an example I have no idea how it should be

[nussman]

Imho this is the graph built by directshow. Players build their own graph with LAV, madVR etc.
So nothing wrong here, most players can show the active filters during playing Media files.

[sneaker_ger]

^this.
And if a player doesn't show filters (what player is "mpp"?) you can activate LAV tray icons. Then you will see if they are loaded.

[el Filou]

I have my Radeon 7870 GPU clocked at 1200/1350 core/memory and when idle the clocks sit at 300/150. Whenever I use LAV Video filter with DXVA2 hardware decoder enabled the GPU clocks go to 1000/1200 and after stopping the video playback the clocks sit at 450/1200 when idle and max out at 1000/1200 in all other applications/games from then on. I need to restart my PC in order to reset them so they return to normal.The DXVA video decoder has no control over the GPU clocks, the hardware driver is responsible for that. Here's how you can confirm: with MPC-HC, go to Options => Internal Filters => Transform Filters, and uncheck H264/AVC. Then go to External Filters => Add Filter => Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder, and click Prefer. Open a file with H264 video, make sure the Microsoft decoder is used (right click => Filters) and check your clocks again. If the same thing happens, then it's an AMD driver bug.

[takenori]

hiya there, i need some help please.
previously i use mpc-hc+lav+madvr, they work great. (pc is i7 7700k stock, 16gb ram, gtx 1080ti, 1080p monitor)
i set lav video to dxd11cb plus software deinterlacing

recently i switch to a 1440p hdr monitor and trying some 4k hdr stuff.
but they plays very laggy, so i use dxd11native to play hdr content
the problem is now with dx11native's, with interlaced videos i cant use software deinterlacing of lav, and videos that previously play smooothly, interlaced to 59 fps, now plays at 29fps with many vertical line during movement.

so basically what i want to ask is.
1. is it possible to play 4khdr content with dx11 copyback? (at least on my current setup?)
2. is it possible to get deinterlacing to work with dx11native?

[Megalith]

Is it normal to experience clipping even when the mixer is set to default levels (.71 for center mix and surround mix levels)? This post (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1792907#post1792907) suggests that those values should be set to .29 to eliminate any potential instance of clipping, but is that correct?

My understanding is that "Normalize Matrix" reduces the natural dynamics of a track, so I do not want to use that.

[nevcairiel]

My understanding is that "Normalize Matrix" reduces the natural dynamics of a track, so I do not want to use that.

It does nothing of that sort. It only reduces the mixing coefficients to avoid any potential of clipping - ie. it reduces the overall volume, the dynamic range remains untouched.

[el Filou]

1. is it possible to play 4khdr content with dx11 copyback? (at least on my current setup?)No idea. I don't have any device capable of handling more than HD with copyback.2. is it possible to get deinterlacing to work with dx11native?Not yet, we need to wait until madshi implements it in madVR, and it's quite a lot of work according to him, so no ETA for that feature.

I have resorted to manually switching to D3D11 Native in LAV settings when I want to watch 4K (which is not that often).

[huhn]

uhd playback work in copyback mode with dxva CP or d3d11 CP. matter.

there could be a lot of possible issues why it is not working but hard to address like this and i don't see a single reason why lavfilter has anything todo with that.

[PhantomF]

The DXVA video decoder has no control over the GPU clocks, the hardware driver is responsible for that. Here's how you can confirm: with MPC-HC, go to Options => Internal Filters => Transform Filters, and uncheck H264/AVC. Then go to External Filters => Add Filter => Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder, and click Prefer. Open a file with H264 video, make sure the Microsoft decoder is used (right click => Filters) and check your clocks again. If the same thing happens, then it's an AMD driver bug.


You're correct it does it using the Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder as well. Wonder if this affects all AMD video cards or just a bug with mine. Like I said I have tried different drivers. Thanks!

[Megalith]

It does nothing of that sort. It only reduces the mixing coefficients to avoid any potential of clipping - ie. it reduces the overall volume, the dynamic range remains untouched.

I understand. It was the tool-tip description that was confusing me: it says that the feature ensures a consistent volume level and that the volume level in one file will not change, so I assumed that the dynamics were affected in some way.

[takenori]

thanks for the input.
so i try a few things and apparently, i still use x86 mpc-hc.
after switching to x64, all 4k and 4khdr works with dxd11cb.

[pson80]

Sorry for being a total noob about this and sorry again if I'm posting my question at the wrong place.
But all of a sudden and without any changes on my part mp4-files have issues with the sound. When opening the file in MPC-HC all I get is this warning that says I don't have the right codec installed. The files have worked before but could it be some stupid update to Win10 that has changed things?

I have Win10 build 16299 and when the problem was noticed I ran MPC-HC x64 1.7.13 with LAV 0.70.2.88 and tried with a clean install without change and then tried MPC-HC 1.7.14 with no change.

The text in the warning window is this if it's to any help.

LAV Splitter Source (internal)::Audio
LAV Audio Decoder (internal)::Output
Audio Switcher::Out

Media Type 0:
--------------------------
Audio: IEEE Float 44100Hz stereo 2822kbps

AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Audio {73647561-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
subtype: MEDIASUBTYPE_IEEE_FLOAT {00000003-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
formattype: FORMAT_WaveFormatEx {05589F81-C356-11CE-BF01-00AA0055595A}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 8
cbFormat: 18

WAVEFORMATEX:
wFormatTag: 0x0003
nChannels: 2
nSamplesPerSec: 44100
nAvgBytesPerSec: 352800
nBlockAlign: 8
wBitsPerSample: 32
cbSize: 0 (extra bytes)

pbFormat:
0000: 03 00 02 00 44 ac 00 00 20 62 05 00 08 00 20 00 ....D¬.. b.... .
0010: 00 00 ..


Media Type 1:
--------------------------
Audio: PCM 44100Hz stereo 1411kbps

AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Audio {73647561-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
subtype: MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM {00000001-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
formattype: FORMAT_WaveFormatEx {05589F81-C356-11CE-BF01-00AA0055595A}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 4
cbFormat: 18

WAVEFORMATEX:
wFormatTag: 0x0001
nChannels: 2
nSamplesPerSec: 44100
nAvgBytesPerSec: 176400
nBlockAlign: 4
wBitsPerSample: 16
cbSize: 0 (extra bytes)

pbFormat:
0000: 01 00 02 00 44 ac 00 00 10 b1 02 00 04 00 10 00 ....D¬...±......
0010: 00 00 ..


And this is what MediaInfo says about the file
Audio
ID : 2
Format : AAC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
Format profile : LC
Codec ID : mp4a-40-2
Duration : 4 min 52 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 126 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 44.1 kHz
Frame rate : 43.066 FPS (1024 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 4.38 MiB (9%)
Default : Yes
Alternate group : 1

[clsid]

You need to re-install your sound driver.

[pson80]

Guess I could have tried that but didn't think that was the problem since sound worked in general, it was just MPC-HC.
What gave it away that this was what was needed? Cause it worked so thanks for that :)

[clsid]

Based on the error message and lots of experience. Decoding was working ok, it was connection to audio renderer that failed.

[Ironclad]

Is there any interest in adding plugin support for external video manipulation such as Vapoursynth? All development of ffdshow has basically discontinued in favor of LAV, but this is one feature that I haven't been able to find a new solution for.

[NikosD]

I'm using latest DXVA Checker v4.0.0 with Windows 7 x64 SP1 with all updates installed.

My CPU/GPU is a SandyBridge Core i3-2100 - latest driver v4229- and using the MF64 Microsoft's H264 MFT decoder, the app allows me to benchmark the "Decoding Performance" using D3D11.

Playback mode for MS MFT D3D11 is disabled and all the other decoders like MS DS/LAV/Intel MFT can't be used with D3D11 even in "Decode Performance" mode.

So, only Ms MFT decoder can leverage D3D11 and only in "Decode" mode but:

How is that possible using Windows 7 ?

[nevcairiel]

It probably uses DXGI_FORMAT_420_OPAQUE, which is the only supported D3D11 decoder output format on Windows 7, but you can't really do much with it. You can decode it, and display it somehow (although I dont think EVR itself even supports that), but you cannot access the data "untouched", as such it really doesn't work well for what LAV wants to do with it.

The problem on Windows 7 is not that the decoder doesn't work, because it technically does - the problem is that NV12/P010 are not supported in D3D11. You need Windows 8 for that. But without NV12/P010, the decoder is mostly useless for most use-cases.

[nevcairiel]

LAV Filters 0.71

General
- LAV Filters now requires Windows Vista or newer, Windows XP is no longer supported

LAV Splitter
- NEW: Preliminary support for UHD Blu-ray parsing

LAV Video
- NEW: D3D11 hardware accelerated decoding (native mode with madVR, Copy-Back otherwise)
- Fixed: HDR metadata was not properly communicated to madVR in DXVA2-Native mode
- Fixed: Anamorphic WMV9/VC-1 videos were not being played back with the correct aspect ratio in all cases
- Fixed: Changing certain settings while playback was paused could result in a deadlock
- Fixed: Playing severly corrupted HEVC streams with hardware decoding could result in playback failing entirely, instead of skipping over the corruption

LAV Audio
- NEW: Basic support for AAC 960 streams (common in DVB radio streams)


Download: Installer (both x86/x64) (https://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.71.exe) -- Zips: 32-bit (https://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.71.zip) & 64-bit (https://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.71-x64.zip)

Its been long overdue to release this, so I can start working on some new things without breaking the release!

D3D11 Decoding

The main motivation behind offering D3D11 decoding is the ability to be able to process the resulting image on the GPU without any loss - something that was not always possible on DXVA2.
To be able to actually leverage this, you'll need a renderer which also supports D3D11 input from a decoder - currently this is only madVR. This allows full performance on-GPU decoding and processing without any quality loss.

D3D11 also offers a Copy-Back mode, however it should probably be quite similar in performance then DXVA2.

Note that the way you select Native/Copy-Back for D3D11 is different than DXVA2. D3D11 will use Native-mode when its set to "Automatic" device choice, and the renderer supports Native mode. If you select a specific device, that forces Copy-Back mode (because for Native to work, the renderer basically selects the device).

There are still a few limitations on using D3D11-Native with madVR, most notably deinterlacing is not supported yet. This is a feature madVR will have to implement in the future.

[Schwartz]

Thanks for the update!

Native D3D11 caused a 'driver stopped responding' error for me. Using a R9 270X and the 18.2.2 drivers released 2 days ago. I assume this is a driver issue? I also didn't change any settings in madVR or disable deinterlacing.
D3D11 CB mode works fine and the load looks similar to DXVA2.

[manolito]

LAV Filters now requires Windows Vista or newer, Windows XP is no longer supported

Can somebody please tell me which is the latest 0.70.2 nightly version which still supports Win XP?


Cheers
manolito

[LigH]

Just as "anchor":

Officially, the last stable release supporting XP was v0.70.2 (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1811365#post1811365)...

There was a link to Aleksoid1978's diff to 0.70.2.1 (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1812127#post1812127) with experimental CUVID H.265 10-bit decoding.

And clsid published MPC-HC 1.7.13.1 incl. a patched LAV Filters 0.70.2.3 (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1812899#post1812899).

From there, the thread kept derailing over and over.

[lvqcl]

I just searched for "WinXP" in this thread and the result is:
For people who still like WinXP - last working version of subj is LAVFilters-0.70.2-16 [...]
Next installer LAVFilters-0.70.2-29.exe says "This program does not support the version of Windows your computer is running."

[LigH]

Well, knowing the perfect search term matters... :o

[manolito]

Thanks guys... :thanks:

[lvqcl]

on the other hand...
I have a problem since version: LAVFilters-0.70.2-10

DTS Bitstreaming results in very choppy playback, MadVR says suddenly clock derivation 30 - 50% and it's visibility dropping frames every second. Installing LAVFilters-0.70.2-8 or previous everything works fine

...0.70.2-16 can have some problems.

[jaju123]

Hi all,

So if I'm using LAV filters with MadVR, would it make more sense to use D3D11 or CUVID mode? I'm struggling to figure out the differences or find any documentation.

Thanks!

[ryrynz]

Short answer D3D11, CUVID is basically dead.

[PCU]

why when i select d3d11 decoder, hardware deinterlacing is inactive? is deinterlacing is auto in d3d11 mode?

[el Filou]

madVR doesn't support D3D11 deinterlacing yet, it's in the release notes.

[PCU]

i forgot to say: i'm using evr-cp (mpc-hc).

[nevcairiel]

With any other renderer you would get the same deinterlacing as you would with any other decoder. Its not performed by LAV.

[strumf666]

Thanks for the update!

Native D3D11 caused a 'driver stopped responding' error for me. Using a R9 270X and the 18.2.2 drivers released 2 days ago. I assume this is a driver issue? I also didn't change any settings in madVR or disable deinterlacing.
D3D11 CB mode works fine and the load looks similar to DXVA2.

Same with vega64, probably broken amd drivers.

[Sebastiii]

Thanks :)

[Zulithe]

D3D11 broken in latest nightly? (LAVFilters-0.71.0-5.exe)

*edit* if you select a specific device it works, automatic shows no video for me

[sneaker_ger]

And native D3D11 works if you go back to 0.71.0 (stable)?

Note that the way you select Native/Copy-Back for D3D11 is different than DXVA2. D3D11 will use Native-mode when its set to "Automatic" device choice, and the renderer supports Native mode. If you select a specific device, that forces Copy-Back mode (because for Native to work, the renderer basically selects the device).

[nevcairiel]

I would expect more things to be broken in the current nightly. Unless you have a reason to, one really shouldn't use in-development versions on a daily basis. :)

[DragonQ]

Two questions:

1) Is there a reason 0.71 isn't listed in the first post of this thread?
2) Does D3D11 mode support deinterlacing yet?

Thanks.

[sneaker_ger]

2) Not with native.
There are still a few limitations on using D3D11-Native with madVR, most notably deinterlacing is not supported yet. This is a feature madVR will have to implement in the future.

[amayra]

D3S11 give me incorrect colors in native mode only in my IGPU but copypack mod work fine

[el Filou]

Does that happen with DXVA2 Native too? If yes then it could be some video image 'enhancements' of the graphics driver haven't been turned off.

[amayra]

only in D3D11 i try to reset graphics driver with "Display Driver Uninstaller " but didnt help

[Ironclad]

Hi nevcairiel!

1. D3D11 doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus on Intel GPU if in the control panel nVidia selected GPU nVidia.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/f4/a1bdb331af6c6d7538b483fb41dc2bf4.jpg
DXVA Checker shows that d3d11 enable on Intel GPU if in the control panel nvidia selected GPU nVidia.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/1e/bf52f2ca8fc9e36416f5de8582c9261e.jpg

2. nVidia CUVID doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus if in the control panel nvidia selected any GPU.

3. After install LAV 0.70.2.88 mvc (software mode) doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus if in the control panel nvidia selected any GPU.

Windows 10 1709, Intel i5-4200M, Intel(R) HD Graphics 4600 (20.19.15.4835), NVIDIA GeForce 840M (23.21.13.9065)

I know a couple workarounds for Optimus to get some programs running on your preferred GPU, but Optimus is a nightmare so I can't guarantee it working well. You can use Inspector to force render device for applications but that's glitchy and resets whenever drivers update. Easier solution is to create a copy of your video player .exe and assign your preferred render device in your graphics control panel. That's the Nvidia Control Panel under Manage 3D Settings and Program settings. On my own Optimus laptop I can assign my video player to use my preferred GPU (GTX 860m) this way and when I select HW acceleration the iGPU is not listed and QuickSync is unavailable, the 860m is listed as connected for DXVA2 (copy-back) and CUVID is supported even though this laptop connects the display directly through the iGPU.

http://codecs.forumotion.net/t1692-how-to-play-using-nvidia
http://www.guru3d.com/files-details/nvidia-inspector-download.html

Also, D3D11 is currently supported on Windows 8 or newer. Are there any big limitations preventing Windows 7 from being supported? Madvr supports Windows 7 for D3D11.

[huhn]

the d3d11 version of windows 7 doesn't support the needed surface to make this work.
directx 11 is at version 11.3 and most new feature are not backported to windows 7 or even 8.

[ajp_anton]

About LAV Splitter's subtitle selection... Is it possible to remove unnecessary subtitle languages, and to re-order the ones left? Or to just remove everything except the chosen language? Just asking because Jriver doesn't care what subtitle LAV chooses, and their support won't answer my question, so I'm looking for a workaround.

[steakhutzeee]

I use lav audio video and splitter. Is possible to use lav splitter reproducing a DVD disc?

Why instead is running DVD Navigator?

And, also, why that Audio Switcher is loaded? I should use lav audio or splitter instead.

All my internal filters are disabled. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180219/20c81792303a370891c3563d37df4a23.jpg

[clsid]

DVD Navigator is required for parsing the DVD content and handling menus. It is not possible to change that.

Audio Switcher can be disabled in MPC-HC settings. It is not a decoding filter and does not interfere with LAV Audio. It is a processing filter that offers some optional extra functionality, such as volume normalization.

[steakhutzeee]

DVD Navigator is required for parsing the DVD content and handling menus. It is not possible to change that.

Audio Switcher can be disabled in MPC-HC settings. It is not a decoding filter and does not interfere with LAV Audio. It is a processing filter that offers some optional extra functionality, such as volume normalization.Thanks [emoji5]

So lav splitter is not loaded because dvd use dvd navigator?

I use mpc be, where I can disable audio switcher? All my internal filters are disabled [emoji848]

[LigH]

If you talk about a "DVD Video media", you always have to know the whole structure of the \VIDEO_TS directory content, most of all, the logical structure defined by the content of all IFO files. This goes beyond the purpose of LAV Splitter. Be glad the MS DVD Navigator does it.

[el Filou]

@nevcairiel Could you tell me what you think about this behaviour with DVD: https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1834170#post1834170 ?
To summarize: LAV Video apparently does not change the interlace output flag to progressive when it changes during playback.
If I start playing a (PAL) DVD that has interlaced flag at the beginning of the feature (e.g. a studio logo clip) it doesn't switch to progressive afterwards, but if I stop playback and use the resume function of MediaPortal to play from where I left, LAV then correctly flags the output as progressive.
I split the start of the 1st VOB of Zodiac in two files of 20 MB to illustrate: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1dJ5Cw3-Bev7UAEt85WoybMefNuisQ0NU

001_(interlaced-then-progressive).VOB : MediaInfo says interlaced, playback starts as interlaced but it should switch to progressive after the Warner Home Video clip but it doesn't
002_(progressive).VOB : this is the next segment, MediaInfo says progressive and LAV correctly plays as progressive because the stream is progressive from the start

huhn says LAV is using Microsoft's decoder for DVD, does that have an impact here? Is it LAV that detects the frame flags, or the MS decoder?

I know DVD is old and it's a niche issue, but thanks anyway if you can have a quick look some time. :o

[LigH]

huhn says LAV is using Microsoft's decoder for DVD, does that have an impact here? Is it LAV that detects the frame flags, or the MS decoder?

Not decoder, but source filter. The MS DVD Navigator is responsible for understanding the logical DVD structure by reading the set of IFO files in a DVD Video media structure. It is responsible for following the logical "red thread" through the DVD navigation, from the Video Manager domain through the VTS Menus and Video Titlesets.

Decoding MPEG-2 video and AC3 or MPEG-2 or LPCM audio can be forwarded to LAV Filters' video and audio decoders. But signalling the decoder that the attributes of the video may change when switching between domains or title sets is indeed an interesting part of playing DVD Video content properly... :rolleyes:

[el Filou]

But interlace/progressive flags are in the MPEG2 video stream itself, not in the title set files, right?
Because if I play VOB files directly, LAV switches the interlaced/progressive output type depending on the type of frame detected at the start, as reported by MediaInfo too. It only fails to do that when the frame flags change during playback.

[nevcairiel]

To summarize: LAV Video apparently does not change the interlace output flag to progressive when it changes during playback.


The important thing to know is that the global setting in the type is only of secondary importance, every single frame is accurately marked as interlaced or progressive when it leaves LAV.

Now, most streams do not contain a flag if they are all progressive or all interlaced. MPEG-2 actually has a flag called "progressive_sequence" which would indicate an all-progressive stream, but its rarely set on DVDs because it can often switch between interlaced and progressive. Without such flags, its impossible to know if a stream would keep switching between progressive or interlaced all the time, and changing the output type can disrupt fluid play. So as a consequence, LAV will only switch to a full progressive type when "progressive_sequence" is set, not everytime a single progressive frame is observed.

If we look at DirectShow, the flags for interlaced that LAV uses actually don't necessarily mean "the stream is always interlaced":
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/dd407326(v=vs.85).aspx (See Remarks at the bottom)

There is a specific combination of flags thats officially documented as follows:
"The video stream varies between progressive and interlaced content. Each media sample contains either a progressive frame or two video fields. Flags on the media sample indicate the correct way to display the contents."

And thats what LAV does if it cannot be sure a stream is full progressive, which it just cannot be sure of on a DVD.

[mkver]

I have some DVDs that are actually progressive, but use interlaced encoding. With default settings they would be deinterlaced by the renderer so I tried to remux them to Matroska and set them to progressive via Matroska's header elements in order to override the information at the stream level. ffmpeg shows that it is progressive in its list of streams, but LAVFilters still flags the samples as interlaced. The description "Auto: Frame flags are used to determine content type" says that this is intentional. Is it? Is there really no way to let LAV flag such content as progressive other than flagging everything as progressive?

[el Filou]

Thanks for the answer and detailed explanation nevcairiel, appreciate it!

[Wackyphill]

When using LAV to decode H265 video and have NVIDIA CUVID set as the hardware decoder it use the nVidia PureVideo H265 decoding capabilities of a GTX1080Ti to do decoding or just use generic hardware acceleration on the video card?

[huhn]

CUVID is just another way to access the hardware decoders so yes they should be all the same and avoid CUVID if possibile.

[jaytrinitron]

Does the new ability of LAV splitter 0.71 to parse UHD Blu-Ray mean that I can play a UHD Blu Ray in my disk drive in MPC-HC using LAV? Will I still get the HDR, Atmos/DTS:X decoding, 4k, 10 bit, etc.?

[Aleksoid1978]

There is no Atmos/DTS:X decoder. ffmpeg can decode only TrueHD/DTS.

[jaytrinitron]

There is no Atmos/DTS:X decoder. ffmpeg can decode only TrueHD/DTS.

Oh yeah I had forgot there was nothing for PC that decodes that. But Atmos and DTS:X have a DTS-HD MA and TrueHD core right? And what about on the video side? Can I still put a UHD disc in and have MPC-HC play it, with HDR, 4k, 10 bit and all the rest (using LAV)?

[nevcairiel]

Oh yeah I had forgot there was nothing for PC that decodes that. But Atmos and DTS:X have a DTS-HD MA and TrueHD core right? And what about on the video side? Can I still put a UHD disc in and have MPC-HC play it, with HDR, 4k, 10 bit and all the rest (using LAV)?

If you have a way to decrypt the disc, it should work.

[PCU]

i don't know why, but the quality of d3d11 hardware acceleration is so much better than intel quicksync.

[Klaus1189]

I use latest versions of MPC-BE x64, LAV Filters and madVR and MPC-BE crashes when I play a file recorded with my STB. Going back to 0.71.0-5 works fine.

EDIT: reinstalled latest LAV 0.71.0-8, now it is fine. I don't know what it was.

[P.J]

Why does AYUV use about twice more CPU rather than RGB32 for 4:4:4 10bit videos? :confused:

[neno]

Hi, nevcairiel. I use lav 0.71 with latest madVR in D3D11 native mode, and the picture is always(no matter what video) split into the top and bottom part. The top part is the picture content turned into a flat size, and the bottom part is often a green image.
While D3D11 CB can just play normally.
I use WIN10 and a RX480.
Is there any idea about the problem?
Thanks.

[nevcairiel]

Sounds like a driver problem to me. But you'll probably want to talk to madshi instead, since madVR handles the processing of "native" frames.

[JarrettH]

Did anything change with the audio mixing or DRC since the last stable version?

I can't decide now whether to use software or D3D11. Versus software, D3D11 is a bit faster on native 1080p movies and slightly slower when upscaling (for example 720p) is involved.

[steakhutzeee]

Hi, can you give me details about this?

D3D11 hardware accelerated decoding (native mode with madVR, Copy-Back otherwise).

Can't update lav/madvr now. This means in madvr there is a new D3D11 option?

Just curious, btw I'll update these days. Thanks :)

[sneaker_ger]

https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1833761&postcount=22604

[kolak]

PCs cannot stay in YUV. Its always RGB at some point. Basically you always have to feed RGB to the GPU, even if the GPU then outputs YUV again (which should therefor be avoided, if possible).

What about OpenGL?

[nevcairiel]

The final frame buffer is always RGB.

[kolak]

Thank you.
Is it really a problem assuming we convert YUV<=>RGB at high precision? All high-end grading/finishing tools operate on GPU so on RGB (even if source is YUV based) and no one really questions this.
I assume this is not end of the world (if done accurately) as at the end signal will became RGB anyway (at the display).

If we talk about pure transcoding then this should be avoided (as in this case it's much easier).

[nevcairiel]

No, its perfectly fine. There is just a bit of loss in every YUV<->RGB conversion due to potential rounding, so if you do something like YUV (file) -> RGB (frame buffer) -> YUV (HDMI) -> RGB (display), thats a lot of conversions. Best would of course be to do YUV (file) -> RGB (everywhere else), but a lot of things don't necessarily support that.

[kolak]

So in case of a player if you can send RGB over HDMI it's better to set output to RGB to limit number of conversions.

In the same time if you use e.g. DisplayPort 1.2+ connection to your "end monitor", which supports RGB for "all" signals (at least up to UHD 60p 10bit) then you don't really loose quality at all compared to some pro equipment which can send YUV data "as is" to monitor. In both cases you end up with 1x YUV->RGB conversion for YUV based source (assuming your player path is well designed). The difference is that conversion happens at different stage.
For high-end work which is RGB based (from source) you are actually gaining quality and reducing delay which is always present with additional pro cards (data has to go from GPU to the card).

[pkirill]

Hello Hendrik, thanks for the great project.
We are making an educational application (CoSpaces) and we need to be able to play mp4 and m4a audio in our app.
We have many target platforms: WebGL, iOS, Android, and Windows.
All we know that on Windows DirectShow stack does not support playing m4a out of the box.
So I have two questions here:

Is it possible to include you binaries into our app ?
Is it possible to use you binaries inside the app (in our process) without COM registration on the admin level, having only user level rights.
To build a FilterGraph over a m4a with you splitter in the process.

Thanks
-Kirill

[LigH]

LAV Filters is a DirectShow interface for the libavcodec / libavformat libraries, the kernels of the ffmpeg project. To create platform independent software, you may better focus on using the kernel libraries, rather than subtracting DirectShow from this one, I believe... mplayer derivates and VLC may be the more useful places to start from, IMHO.

[pkirill]

LAV Filters is a DirectShow interface for the libavcodec / libavformat libraries,

That is exactly what I need.
I need only windows implementation, all other plaforms has build in playing capabilities.

[LigH]

But you don't want to install them as DirectShow filters system-wide?

MPC-HC uses LAV Filters as "internal splitter/decoder", and the AviSynth plugin DSS2Mod (to be found e.g. in the Xvid4PSP project, or in the AviSynth Wiki) can do that as well. If you have developers who are able to read their C/C++ sources, you will most probably find how they do that directly, bypassing DirectShow automatic graph building.

[clsid]

Windows has native support for .m4a playback through Media Foundation.

[manolito]

Windows has native support for .m4a playback through Media Foundation.

Not WinXP... :D:D

[pikaczu]

I am using the mpc hc 1.7.15 program, I have given the aac file for the rehearsal, and there is such a thing, it's about time:

[Klaus1189]

I am using the mpc hc 1.7.15 program, I have given the aac file for the rehearsal, and there is such a thing, it's about time:

better use google drive or similar for posting pics, I cannot view your jpg right now, for example. It is still pending ...

[LigH]

https://frupic.frubar.net (sorry for suggesting this over and over, groundhog day again)

[pikaczu]

better use google drive or similar for posting pics, I cannot view your jpg right now, for example. It is still pending ...

good, please

https://images83.fotosik.pl/1019/e29588f59d353a85m.jpg (https://www.fotosik.pl/zdjecie/e29588f59d353a85)

[LigH]

It displays a playing time of 28:32:59; which other value would you have expected instead?

And BTW, this is a play time of an MKV, according to the window title, what do you mean with AAC? Did you try to load an external audio file in parallel? Missing details.

[pikaczu]

this is the time, after loading aac file.

[nevcairiel]

I have no plans to work on that. You should wrap your audio into an actual container if you are about its duration being accurate.

[LigH]

AAC has a variable bitrate. To estimate the playing time accurately, an application would have to collect statistics about the whole audio; a DirectShow decoder will not be able to do that until you have played the whole media already.

[pikaczu]

It is a pity that there will be no amendment.

how?

[pkirill]

Windows has native support for .m4a playback through Media Foundation.

It can not render it using FilterGraph.

But you don't want to install them as DirectShow filters system-wide?

I do not have an option to register it system wide.

MPC-HC uses LAV Filters as "internal splitter/decoder", and the AviSynth plugin DSS2Mod (to be found e.g. in the Xvid4PSP project, or in the AviSynth Wiki) can do that as well. If you have developers who are able to read their C/C++ sources, you will most probably find how they do that directly, bypassing DirectShow automatic graph building.

Thanks, will look at this.

[LigH]

No, Media Foundation is not DirectShow.

[pkirill]

No, Media Foundation is not DirectShow.

Right, i support what i need, looking at this now.
It seems that it is something I need.
Thanks

[nevcairiel]

You can do what you ask with LAV Filters, several other projects load it without registration, and bundling with apps is allowed within what the license allows.

[tyrindor]

Is there anyway to have advanced splitter mode ignore all subtitles labelled as "Signs"?

Right now I have it set to: "jpn:*|d;jpn:eng;*|f" but many releases flag "signs" as the default subtitle track for anime, and put english subtitles on track 2.

[LigH]

With "signs", they possibly mean "scene subtitles" (translations of readable signs only) in contrast to complete translations of the whole audible speech?

[tyrindor]

With "signs", they possibly mean "scene subtitles" (translations of readable signs only) in contrast to complete translations of the whole audible speech?

Yes, that's correct. I'd like to ignore them and select the next another english subtitle track if possible.

[sneaker_ger]

Is there anyway to have advanced splitter mode ignore all subtitles labelled as "Signs"?

Right now I have it set to: "jpn:*|d;jpn:eng;*|f" but many releases flag "signs" as the default subtitle track for anime, and put english subtitles on track 2.
Not really. I think the "!" operator doesn't work on track names (@nev: feature request?). Maybe you could do e.g.:
jpn:eng|!d jpn:eng
Then it would select the non-default English track first and only if that doesn't exist the first English track regardless of default/forced flagging.

[tyrindor]

Not really.

You could do e.g.:
jpn:eng|!d jpn:eng
Then it would select the non-default English track first and only if that doesn't exist the first English track regardless of default/forced flagging.

Well at least I can do that while watching shows that do this. Thanks.

I've been trying forever to get my subtitles to work automatically but there's so many releases with flagged "default" english subtitle tracks on english language content throwing me off. I can't get my anime to play well with them.

For example:
*|d;eng:*|f;jpn:eng

I would read this as "First set default track, if english is found enable english forced subs instead, if Japanese is found enable english subs instead. This doesn't work though, english audio content still has default subs selected. Putting *|d at the end instead has the same effect.

So what's the best way to achieve this in one command?
- If japanese audio is found enable english subs, if no english subs enable default subs.
- If english is found enable forced subs.
- If unknown language (or simply not english) enable default subs. <-this seems impossible without overwriting everything else.

Greatly appreciated...

[sneaker_ger]

For example:
*|d;eng:*|f;jpn:eng

I would read this as "First set default track, if english is found enable english forced subs instead, if Japanese is found enable english subs instead. This doesn't work though, some english audio content still has default subs selected.
Priority is from left to right. It stops after the first match. If "*|d" (which I assume is the same as "*:*|d") is there it will match any audio, any subtitle language as long as there is a track marked as "default". Nothing after that is considered anymore when such a match is found.

So what's the best way to achieve this in one command?
- If japanese audio is found enable english subs, if no english subs enable default subs.
- If english is found enable forced subs.
- If unknown language enable default subs. <-this is what I am struggling with, it always overwrites everything else.
If I strictly go by your description:
jpn:eng jpn:*|d eng:*|f *:*|d

But I also assume you want subtitles to be off for English audio unless there is English forced subs. You need an extra rule for that so it doesn't match the last rule which is basically a wildcard:
jpn:eng jpn:*|d eng:*|f eng:off *:*|d
And mostly you don't want any forced subtitles for English audio but also the English ones first:
jpn:eng jpn:*|d eng:eng|f eng:*|f eng:off *:*|d

You have to be exact.

[tyrindor]

Man you are a lifesaver, I've been tweaking it for days trying to figure it out. Just tested like 20 various problematic MKVs and it did them all correctly.

Thanks!

[chros]

@sneaker_ger: thanks for the detailed info, I didn't even know that feature exists :)

[Grimsdyke]

@ Nev. When using D3D11 and Automatic/Native I am getting sometimes green screens in MPC-BE (+ MadVR) especially on lower resolution files !! The file keeps playing and I hear the sound.
The only way to fix this seem to be to select the GPU in LAV video decoder settings. Please let me know if you need more details.

[pkirill]

You can do what you ask with LAV Filters, several other projects load it without registration, and bundling with apps is allowed within what the license allows.

Do you have any Idea how to do that ? In terms of C++.

[LigH]

As already mentioned...

MPC-HC uses LAV Filters as "internal splitter/decoder", and the AviSynth plugin DSS2Mod (to be found e.g. in the Xvid4PSP project, or in the AviSynth Wiki) can do that as well.

The amount of source code in DSS2Mod may be more manageable for reading and searching.

[pkirill]

Well I managed to get it working, at least on my local machine:
I looks like that

LAVSplitterClassID = "171252A0-8820-4AFE-9DF8-5C92B2D66B04";
HMODULE hDLL = loadLibrary("LAVSplitter.ax");
LPFNGETCLASSOBJECT pFactory = GetProcAddress(HMODULE(hDll), "DllGetClassObject");
IClassFactory * pFactory = pFactory(LAVSplitterClassID, _uuidof(IClassFactory));
IUnknown *filter = pFactory.CreateInstance();
IBaseFilter *pfilter = filter->QueryInterface<IBaseFilter>();
graphBuilder->AddFilter( pfilter, L"LAVSplitter");


That`s it. Thanks.
And I un-registered the filters before tests.
Next I will try to add Media Foundation based playback.

[anas]

Well I managed to get it working, at least on my local machine:
I looks like that



That`s it. Thanks.
And I un-registered the filters before tests.
Next I will try to add Media Foundation based playback.

man, can you put dll file here?
i used DSS2mod before, but i need DSS load lav without reg because DSS2mod has some issues and admin system permissions don't allow me reg or install lav
thanks ..

[LigH]

A current set of LAV Filters is included in MPC-HC; you can direct DSS2Mod to load it from there. I believe...

[anas]

A current set of LAV Filters is included in MPC-HC; you can direct DSS2Mod to load it from there. I believe...

it doesn't support avisynth+ x64?
is there any one can build dss2 64 bit?

[LigH]

Already available via AviSynth Wiki: AviSynth+ x64 plugins (http://avisynth.nl/index.php/AviSynth%2B_x64_plugins) in the Web Archive. And I uploaded an own archive (http://www.ligh.de/software/DSS2mod.7z) as well...

[anas]

Already available via AviSynth Wiki: AviSynth+ x64 plugins (http://avisynth.nl/index.php/AviSynth%2B_x64_plugins) in the Web Archive. And I uploaded an own archive (http://www.ligh.de/software/DSS2mod.7z) as well...

man!
too much thanks.. i'll give it try and back..
cheers

[anas]

@Ligh it's work good..
thanks

[LigH]

Good to know, thanks for sharing.

[kuchikirukia]

LAV 0.71.0 has broken seeking when using linked mkvs with a Hi444PP video. Works in 0.70.2. It will also play just fine if you don't try to seek.

Yes, this is the most obscure thing ever.

[richardpl]

No, that is not obscure at all, it is about bug in previous encoder and mkvs creators stripping usefull info from AVC encodes.
If you haven't strip those you would get still working videos.
There is option in libavcodec though to enable old behaviour.

[MrGlasspoole]

Hi,

i have problems playing 60fps 8bit on a Core i5-6600 Skylake-S.

No matter what hardware acceleration i choose the sound is stuttering.
For example this two HEVC videos:
http://4kmedia.org/sony-surfing-uhd-4k-demo/
http://www.4ktv.de/sony-camp-2016-sdr-version-download/

But also Big Buck Bunny H.264-AVC MPEG-4 [60.000fps][8-35Mbps][8bits] does not play.

There are no dropped frames but Sync Offset is avg -529ms, dev: 450 ms

The videos play fine in this player:
https://mirillis.com/en/products/splash-free-hd-video-player.html

[sneaker_ger]

LAV 0.71.0 has broken seeking when using linked mkvs with a Hi444PP video. Works in 0.70.2. It will also play just fine if you don't try to seek.

Yes, this is the most obscure thing ever.
No, that is not obscure at all, it is about bug in previous encoder and mkvs creators stripping usefull info from AVC encodes.
If you haven't strip those you would get still working videos.
There is option in libavcodec though to enable old behaviour.

Yes, some old 4:4:4 profile x264 encodes are broken. Old ffmpeg matched old behavior, new ffmpeg matches new/fixed behavior. If LAV sees x264's old custom SEI (the one you see in MediaInfo with the x264 info) it falls back to the old behavior.

For lossless files: simply re-encode with e.g. old ffmpeg decoder but newest x264 (in the future you may activate --no-8x8dct for compatibility with old and new decoders, but currently it is forced off anyways).

[sneaker_ger]

Hi,

i have problems playing 60fps 8bit on a Core i5-6600 Skylake-S.

No matter what hardware acceleration i choose the sound is stuttering.
For example this two HEVC videos:
http://4kmedia.org/sony-surfing-uhd-4k-demo/
http://www.4ktv.de/sony-camp-2016-sdr-version-download/

But also Big Buck Bunny H.264-AVC MPEG-4 [60.000fps][8-35Mbps][8bits] does not play.

There are no dropped frames but Sync Offset is avg -529ms, dev: 450 ms

The videos play fine in this player:
https://mirillis.com/en/products/splash-free-hd-video-player.html
What renderer are you using? If it has an OSD (ctrl+j) show it to us. You tried D3D11 native? What OS?

[MrGlasspoole]

Sorry i did forget some info's.

Win 8.1 - but for testing i did install 10 with the same result.
It's a fresh installation...
EVR custom presenter...

I did forget the renderer and tried EVR and there it seems to work.
I moved the board and CPU from my HTPC into my workstation.
On the HTPC i use madVR but the workstation has no dedicated graphics card.

I thought EVR custom presenter is the first choice?
Does it make sense to use madVR without a dedicated graphics card?

[sneaker_ger]

I thought EVR custom presenter is the first choice?
It's default. Doesn't mean it will always be better than other renderers.

Does it make sense to use madVR without a dedicated graphics card?
You can try madVR with native(*) D3D11 decoding. Just can't use any complex algorithms. I don't know how much sense it makes for you. One of the biggest things missing from vanilla EVR is the support for MPC-HC's internal subtitle renderer.



(*):
Note that the way you select Native/Copy-Back for D3D11 is different than DXVA2. D3D11 will use Native-mode when its set to "Automatic" device choice, and the renderer supports Native mode. If you select a specific device, that forces Copy-Back mode (because for Native to work, the renderer basically selects the device).

[clsid]

The main reason why EVR gives better performance than EVR-CP is because it uses DXVA scaling.

You could try this setting for EVR-CP:
Options > Playback > Output > Resizer > Bilinear (PS 2.0)

Then it will use the GPU for scaling instead of CPU.

[MrGlasspoole]

Bilinear (PS 2.0) makes no difference.

Nobody using a Skylake-S (HD 530)?
The settings should be the same for everybody, shouldn't it?

This is just a workstation and all i need is that the videos play smooth without to much CPU usage. Video quality (madVR) is not that important on this machine.
Oh and it's a 1080p Dell monitor...

Edit:
I tried the "madVR low-end preset for low-end GPUs such as Intel built-in GPUs" settings from LAV Filters Megamix (https://anime.my/tutorials/watching-h264-videos-using-compute-unified-device-architecture-cuda/#checklist) - which should be madVR default anyway.
Dropped frames all over the place...
Even on 4K H.264-AVC MPEG-4 [29.970fps][19Mbps][8bits]...

[sneaker_ger]

I tried the "madVR low-end preset for low-end GPUs such as Intel built-in GPUs" settings from LAV Filters Megamix (https://anime.my/tutorials/watching-h264-videos-using-compute-unified-device-architecture-cuda/#checklist) - which should be madVR default anyway.
Dropped frames all over the place...
Even on 4K H.264-AVC MPEG-4 [29.970fps][19Mbps][8bits]...
I answered in the madvr thread:
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1837634#post1837634

[kuchikirukia]

Yes, some old 4:4:4 profile x264 encodes are broken. Old ffmpeg matched old behavior, new ffmpeg matches new/fixed behavior. If LAV sees x264's old custom SEI (the one you see in MediaInfo with the x264 info) it falls back to the old behavior.

For lossless files: simply re-encode with e.g. old ffmpeg decoder but newest x264 (in the future you may activate --no-8x8dct for compatibility with old and new decoders, but currently it is forced off anyways).

What does ffmpeg have to do with this? I don't use it and all my encodes are broken.

[sneaker_ger]

LAV Filters are based on ffmpeg.

[kuchikirukia]

So how is it fixed if it was working before but now it's broken?

[nevcairiel]

Your files do not conform to the H.264 standard, because x264 4:4:4 lossless encoding was buggy, so you have to re-encode them if you want it truely fixed.

[kuchikirukia]

These aren't lossless. It's bugging out on ordered chapters/linked mkvs.

[sneaker_ger]

Lossy 4:4:4+CABAC is also affected.

[nevcairiel]

Hi444PP is a lossless profile, but I suppose one could use it without using lossless coding? But all the same anyway, you need to re-encode them to fix it forever.

[kuchikirukia]

Why does it only break if ordered chapters/linked mkvs are used? If I take those out it plays fine.

[sneaker_ger]

Every part plays fine for itself?
Provide sample.

[nevcairiel]

Try with tomorrows nightly build (in ~3 hours or so), maybe that helps. Although you're screwed if you mix old and new files in one timeline, but who would ever do that.

[kuchikirukia]

https://nofile.io/f/NbE7BTMX2ZY/New+folder.torrent

That has ordered chapters. The OP and ED play fine since they don't have chapters, and the main plays fine if you remove the chapters.

Though I just noticed that attempting to split the mkvs ruins what comes after the split.
So it works fine with no ordered chapters, it'll stay fine through a complete remux, but if you add ordered chapters or split it it's now screwed.

[sneaker_ger]

If you split the file using mkvtoolnix only the first part will have the information about the x264 encoder revision used because x264 stores it in the front. That's why only the first part will play fine if you attempt that.

The other thing should hopefully be fixed with the nightly as nevcairiel said. I could also reproduce the issue - it was a bug after all.

[kuchikirukia]

If you split the file using mkvtoolnix only the first part will have the information about the x264 encoder revision used because x264 stores it in the front. That's why only the first part will play fine if you attempt that.

The other thing should hopefully be fixed with the nightly as nevcairiel said. I could also reproduce the issue - it was a bug after all.

Ah, so if any 4:4:4 ordered chapter encode was made by splitting the output h.264 instead of encoding them in separate pieces then it would be screwed?
I don't think I've ever done that so I should be good there.

[sneaker_ger]

Ah, so if any 4:4:4 ordered chapter encode was made by splitting the output h.264 instead of encoding them in separate pieces then it would be screwed?
No, as long as the very first mkv file has the x264 information even the splitted parts should work fine as a part of ordered chapters with the upcoming nightly. But if you try to play the splitted parts by themselves (without the very first part/without ordered chapters) then it will not work correctly because LAV has no way of knowing an old x264 version was used.

[kuchikirukia]

The fix worked. Thanks.

[mclingo]

Hi, i've recently noticed when the sound I get when I play a movie back using plex on my TV through my reciever amp sound loads better than when I play the same movie through any app on my HTPC, this isnt strictly a LAV filter issue I dont think but all my players are using LAV.

The sound coming from my TV is PCM DOLBY 5.1 PCM, from my PC its full digital bitstreamed and all shows up correctly on my amp dialog. I'm using standard HDMI audio from my AMD RX card. To me the audio sounds thinner, has quite a bit less weight as it far less immersive, I can hear my rears much more through plex and my TV, it all just sounds loads better.

Can anyone hazzard a guess whats going on here, is there anything i'm missing using standard audio renderers in MPC-BE / HC / KOD?

i'm defo getting proper 7.1 as I have test files and each speaker calls out, its just the mix PLEX is providing seems fuller and better.

[nevcairiel]

Usually stuff is just louder and misleads you. But in any case thats not a LAV concern, its a decoder that generates perfect decoded PCM to the specifications of the codecs, anything that happens after that is not in its control.

[mclingo]

doh... found it. I'd turned my dialog level on my receiver up to 9 for some reason at some point, feeling pretty silly now :)

[pkirill]

man, can you put dll file here?
i used DSS2mod before, but i need DSS load lav without reg because DSS2mod has some issues and admin system permissions don't allow me reg or install lav
thanks ..

I took the original build of LAV here:
https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/releases

[anas]

I took the original build of LAV here:
https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/releases

thanks for reply,
i mean dll file of DirectShowSource to load lav filters without register
now i use DSS2 but it didn't load audio..
if you have directshowsource that load lav filters like dss2 with audio, please put it here..
:thanks:

[LigH]

No, that is one of the main flaws of DSS2Mod: It supports only video. Sorry I forgot this detail. You may need additional plugins to load audio streams.

@anas: For your needs, FFMS2 or L-SMASH Works may be recommendable, they use libavcodec/libavformat libraries just like LAV Filters, but with native AviSynth API. In contrast, pkirill had different needs than you, uses the DirectShow API without AviSynth.

[anas]

No, that is one of the main flaws of DSS2Mod: It supports only video. Sorry I forgot this detail. You may need additional plugins to load audio streams.

@anas: For your needs, FFMS2 or L-SMASH Works may be recommendable, they use libavcodec/libavformat libraries just like LAV Filters, but with native AviSynth API. In contrast, pkirill had different needs than you, uses the DirectShow API without AviSynth.

thanks man,
now i used DSS2 it's okay, i managed to load the audio file..

i pushed to use avisynth just for vsfilter :(
i just wonder if someone can make port for vsfilter to get work with ffmpeg without avs

x264 cli can use vsfilter without avs in tmod version, through patch
https://gist.github.com/1462458
i can make donate for who do it for me..

[zaemon]

Hi!

I tried D3D11 in native mode with madVR but videos don't play, I got a black screen. When using copy-back, it works but performance is horrible (dropped frames where when I'm using DXVA2 copy-back it's fine). I'm using the latest build of madVR and latest Nvidia drivers (GTX 1080). Any idea? Thanks.

[nevcairiel]

If copy-back works and native does not, this is best reported to madshi.

[pkirill]

thanks for reply,
i mean dll file of DirectShowSource to load lav filters without register
:thanks:

Here is what I did to load filter into an IGraphBuilder instance(CLSID_FilterGraph):

LAVSplitterClassID = "171252A0-8820-4AFE-9DF8-5C92B2D66B04"L;
HMODULE hDLL = loadLibrary("LAVSplitter.ax");
LPFNGETCLASSOBJECT pFactory = GetProcAddress(HMODULE(hDll), "DllGetClassObject");
IClassFactory * pFactory = pFactory(UuidFromStringW(LAVSplitterClassID), _uuidof(IClassFactory));
IUnknown *filter = pFactory.CreateInstance();
IBaseFilter *pfilter = filter->QueryInterface<IBaseFilter>();
graphBuilder->AddFilter( pfilter, L"LAVSplitter");



After that the graphBuilder is able to playback all supported audio formats, exactly what I need.

[LigH]

@pkirill+anas:

But that works only if you write an own application in C/C++. This is no recipe for an AviSynth user.

Using "DirectShowSource" or "DSS2" in AviSynth to access LAV Filters requires LAV Filters to be registered in the system.

"DSS2Mod" can use LAV Filters without registering LAV Filters in the system, but supports only the video decoders.

To use libavcodec video and audio decoders and libavformat splitters natively in AviSynth, L-SMASH Works and FFMS2 are recommendable; e.g. MeGUI supports them via "File Indexer" in its AVS Script Creator.

[zaemon]

If copy-back works and native does not, this is best reported to madshi.



Thanks.

[mclingo]

found a bug with D3D11, on my system anyway. I have an issue with MADVR where when you play a 3D movie (1080p) and you stop it I lose HDMI handshake going from 3D 1080p back to 4k 2160p. It does this every time. The workaround is to disable MADVR refresh rate switching and use your movies players switching instead, i've had this working for ages and its been fine up until recently.

recently I switched from DXVA copy back to D3D11 decoding as I found it was about 20% faster than DXVA on my system, what I had forgotten to test was 3D though which I tested today. Whats happening now is the same as what happens in MADVR, when I stop a 3D movie I get HDMI loss which cant be gained back easily without resetting it, I use HDMION.

If I switch back to DXVA copyback the problem goes away, I think its interesting that now both MADVR refresh rate switching and now D3D11 with MPC or KODI DS refresh rate switching causes the same problem, HDMI loss coming from out of a 1080p 3D connection back to a 2160 2d desktop.

Its very possible its connected issues with FSE which is required on most systems for 3D playback.

Both issues happen with with AMD RX cards, i havent tested my NVIDA 1050 but this also had HDMI handshake issue coming out of 3D for me too.

Another workaround would be to run your PC desktop in 1080p but who wants to do that when you've got a 4k display, this also explains why most people dont see this, there are still fewer people with 4k displays than 1080p ones.

I'll post this on both MADVR and LAV forums as the issues seems to be connected now.

[nevcairiel]

3D decoding is not hardware accelerated, neither mode is involved when you play a 3D file.

[mclingo]

3D decoding is not hardware accelerated, neither mode is involved when you play a 3D file.

I know but its still makes up part of the processing chain, something in D3D11 is causing handshake loss in both MPC and KODi DS, when I switch back to COPY BACK mode all is well, so something D3D11 is doing is breaking handshake when the media player is switching back from 1080p to 4k.

[nevcairiel]

Like I said, the hardware acceleration option in LAV Video has absolutely no effect on 3D movies. Those are decoded with an entirely different component.
The only way it might even be remotely involved is when you manually open the configuration page, because that probes the hardware for support. This does not happen when you don't open the settings page.

[mclingo]

i'm only reporting whats happening mate, i'm not changing anything else, If I set LAV to COPYBACK its fine, if I set it to D3D11 the movie plays fine but when I stop it I get black screen HDMI loss, if I set it back to COPYBACK again, start and stop the movie no problem, I did this several times in a row to see if it was fluke or intermittent, every single time D3D11 is used I get HDMI loss when movie is stopped.

this is exactly the same behavior I get with MADVR when I used refresh rate switching, this is why I use KODI DS and MPC refresh rate switching, what ever is causing the MADVR problem is also causing the D3D11 problem this cant be a coincidence.

if I run my desktop at 1080p all problems disappear, its simply an issue of resolution switching somewhere.

I get what you are saying though, D3D11 cant be directly responsible but it must be indirectly responsible. MADSHI wont look at it either has he feels MADVR is not a fault, I feel it is indirectly responsible in the same way as if I make no other changes and take MADVR and D3D11 out of the equation all problems are solved.

If you two dont look into it then it will never get solved :(

[foxyshadis]

A situation like that sounds more like a display driver bug is being triggered. Interesting that it might be triggered due to 3D bypassing acceleration; what happens with normal 1080p if you turn off HW acceleration entirely?

That, or it's triggering a bug in your TV.

[huhn]

you could try a 3D computer game and see if the same happens.

[pikaczu]

please correct the time for the aac file

[LigH]

You still don't understand the problem of variable bitrate audio streams?

AAC has no header field telling the playback duration. And guessing the playback time by extrapolating the bitrate of only the first audio block is inaccurate because the bitrate will probably change during the following playback.

The only way to calculate the playback time accurately would be to scan the whole audio stream from the beginning to the end. But a decoder won't do that because there are usage cases (live streaming) where the audio stream is only accessible once: When you are at the end of the stream to collect statistical data, the stream is gone and you can't play it anymore.

[pikaczu]

It is a pity, will it be just as well as it will be the same time? I understand correctly

[mclingo]

A situation like that sounds more like a display driver bug is being triggered. Interesting that it might be triggered due to 3D bypassing acceleration; what happens with normal 1080p if you turn off HW acceleration entirely?

That, or it's triggering a bug in your TV.

Hi, I only get this with 3D, no loss off HDMI in any decoding mode with 1080p or 4k stuff.

I guess I could accept its an issue with my particular setup but i'm not convinced yet, there arent many AMD RX/4k/HDR 3D Tv owners out there so the lack of issues reported here could simply be that.

I only own one 3D tV so I cant test this, I have bypassed the receiver though and it still happens.

I also suspect its something to do with WIN10 and Full Screen Exclusive mode and how that interacts with MADVR refresh rate switching and D3D11.

[mclingo]

you could try a 3D computer game and see if the same happens.

I might look into that, my crapp RX 460 will really struggle with any 3D game

[nevcairiel]

This is all outside the scope of LAV Filters, it has no control over your video output or your drivers. So please debug your problem elsewhere. :)
As said above, the hardware acceleration code is never executed with 3D decoding, since that all goes through the Intel decoder, not the typical hardware-accelerated path.

[mclingo]

I wouldnt no where do go with this, it only affects D3D11, which forum deals with how that interacts with media players and refresh rate / resolution changing?

[nevcairiel]

All I know: Its not in this thread.

[LigH]

I would suggest a separate thread in Software players (https://forum.doom9.org/forumdisplay.php?f=15) if there isn't already an existing one with similar topic.

[mclingo]

I would suggest a separate thread in Software players (https://forum.doom9.org/forumdisplay.php?f=15) if there isn't already an existing one with similar topic.

good idea, i've posted there, I've also posted on MPC-BE thread in case this issue rings a bell with anyone there.

Cheers.

[LigH]

"Also" is "cross-posting" and not very appreciated. One thread per issue is enough.

[Grimsdyke]

@ Nev. When using D3D11 and Automatic/Native I am getting sometimes green screens in MPC-BE (+ MadVR) especially on lower resolution files !! The file keeps playing and I hear the sound.
The only way to fix this seem to be to select the GPU in LAV video decoder settings. Please let me know if you need more details.

Tested with the latest build (26) and this issue still occurs !! Is this on your radar or unfixable ??
To maybe clarify - with 'sometimes' I meant that not all files are affected but the ones that are always turn 'green'. Thx

[nevcairiel]

Issues like that which are exclusive to Native D3D11 mode you should report to madshi, if it happens only with certain files make sure to include one. madVR directly processes the textures in Native mode, so only he has access to see whats going on.

[fireattack]

I have a question about downmix mix level default parameters.

According to the previous reply from nevcairiel (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1616895&postcount=14241), the default setting should match with Rec. ITU-R BS.775 (http://www.itu.int/rec/R-REC-BS.775-3-201208-I/).
If I read it correctly, the formula seems should be something like

Lo = 1.0 * L + 0.7071 * C + 1.0 * Ls;
Ro = 1.0 * R + 0.7071 * C + 1.0 * Rs;

I.e.

Center mix level = 0.7071,
Surround mix level = 1

If that's still the case, why the current default value is

Center mix level = 0.71,
Surround mix level = 0.71

But again, that discussion was very long time ago, so something could be changed afterwards (tried to search, but can't find any).

Thanks!

[brazen1]

Can anyone help me with settings for AAC audio? I've been converting AAC 7.1 ( which only plays in stereo) to AC3 (DD surround) through FFmpeg and CMD commands using my Denon S720W. I recently discovered that KODI has a setting that will transcode to AC3 on the fly using its internal player and produces DD surround. I would like to play AAC in surround using MPC-HC/BE if possible also. Currently they only produce stereo. I am using LAV Filters with the players and have deselected all the internal filters. Is there a specific combination of settings in the player(s), LAV splitter, and LAV audio 71.0.28 that will do this without affecting other formats negatively. I want to set and forget. Using HDMI.

[sneaker_ger]

LAV should only output stereo with e.g 5.1 input if:
1.) you have activated mixing to stereo in LAV Audio or
2.) you have set Windows'/your audio driver's mixer settings to stereo

[brazen1]

Thank you for the quick reply. I have not mixed anything to stereo in LAV audio. Mixing is not enabled. I have Windows configured as 7.1 and tests good for all my speakers. However, in KODI I have always used Wasapi and configured for 7.1 which produced AAC stereo. Recently I discovered configuring KODI for 2.0 reveals a new passthrough setting - Enable DD AC3 transcoding which works. Any other suggestions?

[sneaker_ger]

I have not mixed anything to stereo in LAV audio.
Are you sure you have looked at the correct LAV instance? Start playing a file in MPC-HC, then while it plays go "Play"- >"Filters"->"LAV Audio [...]" and look again.

[brazen1]

Yes. Mixing is not enabled. I do see the status tab. It shows all the channels outputting? I selected APPLY. This made no difference either. Still stereo at AVR.

[sneaker_ger]

Are any other filters active? (Play->Filter->Copy filter list ..)

Try to search for other mixer settings in Windows/driver settings. Remember that HDMI may be running through Nvida/AMD/Intel driver settings, not your onboard Realtek or whatever.

[brazen1]

Filters currently loaded:
- Default DirectSound Device
- madVR
- LAV Audio Decoder
- LAV Video Decoder
- LAV Splitter Source

Yes, I use NVidia High Def Audio. I have nothing else onboard I know of and I built the HTPC. Nothing else in device manager either except the MS high def controller. Should I be using some other onboard Realtek or whatever? I never have and my audio has always been perfect, except AAC.

[sneaker_ger]

Is your sample really good? Try this one (https://mega.nz/#!MwcRGAKZ!8UqNvSCow8UwgoSKwnvmGubp-MfcG9BcR8O8YcpwgXM) to be sure.

Btw, MPC-HC also has wasapi. In Options->Playback->Output->Audio Renderer->Internal Audio Renderer. Then to enable wasapi exclusive Options->Internal Filters->Audio Renderer->Exclusive mode. It should not be necessary but you can at least test it or use as a workaround.

[brazen1]

Your DD+ (AAC) file plays in stereo too. Thank you for taking interest in trying to help me. Seems so simple yet.......

DD+ is an encoded format Windows audio properties reports fwiw.

[sneaker_ger]

Ignore the video content. The sample is AAC, not DD+.

[brazen1]

Is your sample really good? Try this one (https://mega.nz/#!MwcRGAKZ!8UqNvSCow8UwgoSKwnvmGubp-MfcG9BcR8O8YcpwgXM) to be sure.

Btw, MPC-HC also has wasapi. In Options->Playback->Output->Audio Renderer->Internal Audio Renderer.

I already tried this instead of default. Still Stereo. Put back to default.

Then to enable wasapi exclusive Options->Internal Filters->Audio Renderer->Exclusive mode. It should not be necessary but you can at least test it or use as a workaround.

Have always used this.

[sneaker_ger]

Not according to what you said earlier:
Filters currently loaded:
- Default DirectSound Device

[el Filou]

Just tried a 7.1 AAC file and it plays in 7.1 with MPC-HC 1.7.15 and LAV 0.71.0, be it with ReClock, MPC-HC's own renderer, or the default system DirectSound device (after setting the audio device to 8 ch in Windows Control Panel for this last case).

Are you sure your AVR isn't setting some different mode when it's receiving 7.1 PCM? I once had an issue like this and it happened I had pressed the 'Stereo' button by mistake so the Denon was downmixing multichannel PCM to stereo. (Edit: though this should still show 7.1 input on the Denon if that was the problem)

[brazen1]

Not according to what you said earlier:

My reply did not post correctly so I see the confusion.

Btw, MPC-HC also has wasapi. In Options->Playback->Output->Audio Renderer->Internal Audio Renderer.

In the past I toggled through all these options and nothing changed including this time following your instructions just to be certain.

Then to enable wasapi exclusive Options->Internal Filters->Audio Renderer->Exclusive mode. It should not be necessary but you can at least test it or use as a workaround.

I have always had Exclusive and Allow bitstreaming checked and turning them off makes no difference for AAC.


My AVR is on AUTO. I can play all types of audio formats and it auto switches correctly, except AAC unless transcoding via KODI. The only time I ever see stereo is Windows desktop and AAC. As soon as I start a video/audio, it switches to the appropriate audio, except AAC.

I manually intervened and selected DD while the audio was playing. Then quit the video, toggled the AVR on/off and started the audio again. Stereo. Then played a DTS:X and it switched proper. So I know it isn't a maladjustment.

I'm certain AAC multi ch works for you and others. Thank you for confirming it isn't one of the components we use in common. Now I have ruled out blaming and I don't know where else to turn except NVidia high def audio driver which is probably another wild goose chase.....

Is there anything else you might suggest without derailing this thread now that we've determined LAV isn't the culprit and again I appreciate your diagnosing more than words can express.

[lvqcl]

I manually intervened and selected DD while the audio was playing. Then quit the video, toggled the AVR on/off and started the audio again. Stereo. Then played a DTS:X and it switched proper. So I know it isn't a maladjustment.

It looks like your system sends undecoded DD/DTS to your receiver (bitstreaming). But it cannot bitstream AAC, so player decodes it into multichannel WAV. Then for some reason multichannel is downmixed to stereo, and the reciever gets stereo WAV.

[el Filou]

If you go to Windows Control Panel / Sound / Playback / device Properties / Advanced, and click Test, do you hear the test tones in 7.1 ?

[brazen1]

Yes, I confirmed Windows audio properties test a few posts ago. All my speakers and my sub play test tones. I googled yesterday for hours about Denon and AAC multi ch only stereo and couldn't find anything constructive. No idea if anything is documented that Denon can't do AAC but honestly I'd be surprised if of all brands it didn't. I couldn't find anything.

[brazen1]

I don't quite understand what I just did but I did exactly this and nothing more or less and I'm positive. I think it is working! Can you confirm for me?

I just enabled WMA, WMA Pro, and WMA Lossless in LAV Audio formats. I think these are off by default and have never changed anything in here. In my W10, I disabled Windows Media Player when I built this HTPC. Perhaps this has something to do with it? So, I got to thinking maybe this is a difference from others who have no problems with AAC and why those settings were disabled? Maybe someone can confirm if they are on or off default.

I played the AAC and it didn't report stereo anymore. Now my AVR reports M InDDS. I assume this means Multichannel Dolby Digital Surround on a Denon? Yippy! I toggled the Denon off/on and tried the AAC again. It went to stereo. Bummer. Unchecked WMA, WMA Pro, and WMA Lossless in LAV and still do not have WMP installed. Played the AAC and it reported M InDDS again this time? WTF?

So I turned the Denon and my display off/on. Tried a few different titles, all different audios, and AAC continues to report M InDDS. I cold booted the entire system, which I do daily, and it survived the reboot. I know it doesn't make much sense, at least to me, but this is the result simply toggling those LAV settings on/off when WMP is uninstalled. I don't know how or why but does this sound (pardon the pun) like its straightened out now?

Now to find out how to get AAC 7.1 multi ch back from the AC3's I converted to 5.1. Anyone know commands for FFmpeg using command prompt? Oh, and thank you all for the replies. Sometimes hearing from others gets the ol' brain kicked into gear to try what I thought was exhausted.

[e-t172]

I have a question about downmix mix level default parameters.

According to the previous reply from nevcairiel (https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1616895&postcount=14241), the default setting should match with Rec. ITU-R BS.775 (http://www.itu.int/rec/R-REC-BS.775-3-201208-I/).
If I read it correctly, the formula seems should be something like

Lo = 1.0 * L + 0.7071 * C + 1.0 * Ls;
Ro = 1.0 * R + 0.7071 * C + 1.0 * Rs;

You didn't read BS.775 correctly. The relevant part is Annex 4.1, Table 2 (page 11 of the PDF). That's the section on downmixing. You can see in that table, on the line about downmixing to stereo (2/0), that surround channels have a coefficient of 0.7071, not 1.0.

LAV should only output stereo with e.g 5.1 input if:
1.) you have activated mixing to stereo in LAV Audio or
2.) you have set Windows'/your audio driver's mixer settings to stereo

Technically, in case (2) LAV is still outputting 5.1. It's the Windows audio engine that takes care of downmixing to stereo in that case.

[mzso]

Hello!

How does atmos decoding work these days? I'm particularly interested in properly processed audio for headphones. I guess LAV at least can decode the lossless audio.
But do I need to use dolby stuff (I heard vague mentions) in conjuction to get proper spatial audio?

[huhn]

there is no atmos decoder yet and i'm not even sure if someone works on it because you need to bitstream it to make it work and only something a like a HRTF would benefit from it.

[sneaker_ger]

Yes, I confirmed Windows audio properties test a few posts ago. All my speakers and my sub play test tones. I googled yesterday for hours about Denon and AAC multi ch only stereo and couldn't find anything constructive. No idea if anything is documented that Denon can't do AAC but honestly I'd be surprised if of all brands it didn't. I couldn't find anything.
LAV Audio doesn't do AAC bitstreaming so the AAC capabilities of your receiver should be irrelevant.

[mclingo]

I don't quite understand what I just did but I did exactly this and nothing more or less and I'm positive. I think it is working! Can you confirm for me?

I just enabled WMA, WMA Pro, and WMA Lossless in LAV Audio formats. I think these are off by default and have never changed anything in here. In my W10, I disabled Windows Media Player when I built this HTPC. Perhaps this has something to do with it? So, I got to thinking maybe this is a difference from others who have no problems with AAC and why those settings were disabled? Maybe someone can confirm if they are on or off default.

I played the AAC and it didn't report stereo anymore. Now my AVR reports M InDDS. I assume this means Multichannel Dolby Digital Surround on a Denon? Yippy! I toggled the Denon off/on and tried the AAC again. It went to stereo. Bummer. Unchecked WMA, WMA Pro, and WMA Lossless in LAV and still do not have WMP installed. Played the AAC and it reported M InDDS again this time? WTF?

So I turned the Denon and my display off/on. Tried a few different titles, all different audios, and AAC continues to report M InDDS. I cold booted the entire system, which I do daily, and it survived the reboot. I know it doesn't make much sense, at least to me, but this is the result simply toggling those LAV settings on/off when WMP is uninstalled. I don't know how or why but does this sound (pardon the pun) like its straightened out now?

Now to find out how to get AAC 7.1 multi ch back from the AC3's I converted to 5.1. Anyone know commands for FFmpeg using command prompt? Oh, and thank you all for the replies. Sometimes hearing from others gets the ol' brain kicked into gear to try what I thought was exhausted.

my sound has not been quite right with DD formats too, playing over plex sound loads better than with MPC-BE, i checked all my settings and ATMOS and DTS were all playing fine so I assumed my setup was fine and just lived with it. Preiously I found i had myt dialog turned up too high but this time it was different.

I just played that file which was posted, it was in stereo. Here is the odd thing. What I noticed was that my windows audio had defaulted to stereo, it does that sometimes with driver updateds and I hadnt noticed. I changed it back but it still played in stereo. I then played my ATMOS test and they played ok, I went back and played the clip again and it was working this time.

not sure whats going on there, I also have a Denon, seems switching to one format and back again sorted it.

[mzso]

there is no atmos decoder yet and i'm not even sure if someone works on it because you need to bitstream it to make it work and only something a like a HRTF would benefit from it.

I imagined there could be something like the dtsdecoderdll.dll that lav could load for DTS-HD decoding. Maybe some proprietary app that could apply whatever dsp is required to proper spatial audio.

[huhn]

you need to support this type of decoded audio too.
it's not impossible but i don't think we will get that anytime soon.

[brazen1]

my sound has not been quite right with DD formats too, playing over plex sound loads better than with MPC-BE, i checked all my settings and ATMOS and DTS were all playing fine so I assumed my setup was fine and just lived with it. Preiously I found i had myt dialog turned up too high but this time it was different.

I just played that file which was posted, it was in stereo. Here is the odd thing. What I noticed was that my windows audio had defaulted to stereo, it does that sometimes with driver updateds and I hadnt noticed. I changed it back but it still played in stereo. I then played my ATMOS test and they played ok, I went back and played the clip again and it was working this time.

not sure whats going on there, I also have a Denon, seems switching to one format and back again sorted it.

Yep, just when you think everything is perfect, you find out it isn't. When that file is playing proper, it plays an individual tone for all speakers in 5.1. In stereo it won't.

W10 and NVidia have had a Windows audio quirk for months. I doubt they even know it. The Windows audio properties should switch to stereo with the AVR off. This allows audio/video to open in youtube and the likes. It should switch to 5.1, 7.1 etc. when the AVR is turned on. 6 months of new drivers don't. Only old ones. I've wondered if AMD has the bug too? Maybe you can confirm? More details here and maybe reply in that thread instead of here https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=229692&pid=2721301#pid2721301

[el Filou]

Oh right you didn't mention in your previous posts that you were using HDMI standby passthrough.
Anyway, even if Windows sound config is set to stereo (voluntarily or by a bug in AVR on/off detection), an audio renderer that uses WASAPI Exclusive should be able to dynamically set the speaker output config it needs depending on the number of audio channels in the source file, at least that's what ReClock and MPC's renderer do on my system (I keep Windows sound config in stereo because otherwise I get 4 useless silent channels with 2-channel web videos).
So even with the NVIDIA/Windows bug you're describing, you should still be able to play 7.1 AAC in 7.1 with a correctly configured Exclusive renderer.

[brazen1]

Yes, when I say toggle the AVR off/on, I should say toggle the AVR into standby passthrough and On. To me it's just on and off but I suppose details are everything. My bad not clarifying that here too.
On my system, if I keep the Windows audio config set to stereo, my audio was terrible. The second I switched to 7.1, all is well. I could leave it at 7.1 but then youtube etc. would not even begin playback. It presented an error. So, I'd change to stereo and immediately youtube would play. I shouldn't have to do this manual change and never did it in the past. Rolling back my NVidia driver solved it by dynamically switching stereo and 7.1. Now it survives a toggle from AVR standby passthrough to On. It also survives a reboot which is another factor that crept in using newer drivers.

With that out of the way with since it is now functioning proper using an older driver, and the screwy fix in LAV that enabled AAC 7.1 to play in DD surround instead of stereo, I have no problems. I do not require the Exclusive renderer. I'm simply using the default for the output and the default for the audio renderer as I always did. All is well. The conversation has now switched to mclingo having similar problems. We have established NVidia's problem on one front and my own regarding WMP uninstalled which may have led to the entire AAC stereo dilemma. Not sure but it is definitely working perfect at this time. Now curious if it translates to AMD as well as that is what he uses. Have not heard back from him though.

[mclingo]

Ive never been able to set my PC to stereo and have multichannel bitstreeming, I've always used AMD cards though, didnt know this was even possible. To get around windows dropping into stereo when it feels like it I have had to export the registry component for MMDEVICES and create a batch file that runs at logon just to ensure my PC remains in surround mode all of the time.

This is a windows issue though, not LAV related.

[Aleksoid1978]

nevcairiel
Hello. Question about DXVA2/DX11 8K video - i have 1030 and it's support HEVC/VP9 up to 8k. But what's strange - DXVA2 decoder fail, your DX11 decoder fail, but Win10 "Movies & TV" playback with GPU accelerated(it's use DX11 engine for it).
Any idea ??

[nevcairiel]

I heard you need to use 64-bit for 8K to work.
In fact, just tried, works in 64-bit on my 1080Ti (doesn't work in 32-bit).

[Aleksoid1978]

I heard you need to use 64-bit for 8K to work.
In fact, just tried, works in 64-bit on my 1080Ti (doesn't work in 32-bit).
Ok - thanks.

[fireattack]

You didn't read BS.775 correctly. The relevant part is Annex 4.1, Table 2 (page 11 of the PDF). That's the section on downmixing. You can see in that table, on the line about downmixing to stereo (2/0), that surround channels have a coefficient of 0.7071, not 1.0.

Indeed. No idea why did I read such obvious thing wrong. Thanks for the reply.

[Flexy]

Hallo nevcariel,

I asked that on the Jriver support forum already but the forum seems pretty dead.
Is there a way to load LAV audio decoder *and* AC3filter (AC3filter for mixing/post processing) in MC23? (Using the custom video filters setting)

I have no problems doing this in any other app that supports DirectShow (w/ AC3filter only accepting PCM and have LAV do the decoding).
But I can only load *one* audio decoder in MC23, not load both. (If I load LAV A.D. it doesn't load AC3filter, and vice versa)

Thanks!!

[nevcairiel]

This is not the place for Media Center support, lets not start something that everyone might start abusing. Only questions directly about LAV are on-topic here.

[AngelGraves13]

Can we expect Dolby Vision support sometime soon or is it still unclear if/when that will happen.

[nevcairiel]

There are no plans to work on that right now. Its a closed format for a closed ecosystem, which would take a lot of effort to get working and maintain, so motivation is not very high.

[Leader]

Hello, nevcairiel. After the release of the release version of "LAV Filters 0.71", starting with the first nightly build "0.71.0-5", became incorrectly reproduced "HTTP Live Streaming". During playback, there are periodic jumps in the frame rate, as well as a "torn" picture ("torn" frames) resembling tearing, which occurs almost instantaneously, with the loss or loss of some of the audio data periodically, i.e. the end of words simply simply drop out, and sometimes even whole words.

[Asmodian]

More information is likely required to make sense of your bug report.

What became incorrectly reproduced? All HTTP Live Streaming? How did you test it? Do you have an example we could test with to reproduce the issue? What player, hardware, OS, and driver versions are you using?
:thanks:

[nevcairiel]

Try with the latest nightly version, https://files.1f0.de/lavf/nightly/LAVFilters-0.71.0-32.exe, it may solve HTTP related issues.

[Leader]

Asmodian

What became incorrectly reproduced?
After the release of version 0.71, the "Youtube HLS" was incorrectly reproduced.
All HTTP Live Streaming?
Yes, all HLS.
How did you test it? Do you have an example we could test with to reproduce the issue? What player, hardware, OS, and driver versions are you using?
:thanks:
Just opened a link to the "YouTube HLS" in the "MPC-BE Player".

I can give an example and a playback algorithm for you:

1. Opened the YouTube HLS link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvdXkHuV0DE
2. Opened the properties of the "EVR-CP Video Renderer"
3. I found the following problems, look at the screenshot: http://ibb.co/giwRSS

It is these problems with HLS that arise in all subsequent night builds, after the release of version 0.71.

[Leader]

Try with the latest nightly version, https://files.1f0.de/lavf/nightly/LAVFilters-0.71.0-32.exe, it may solve HTTP related issues.
I checked this build. Unfortunately, there were problems with the HLS in it, they did not improve.

[lvqcl]

Not sure about those numbers, but if I press Ctrl+J ("Display Stats") I sometimes see drops in the graph like this: https://i.imgur.com/mxp07Tq.png (MPC-BE x64 1.5.2 build 3544, if it matters, and LAV 0.71.0-32)

[Leader]

Not sure about those numbers, but if I press Ctrl+J ("Display Stats") I sometimes see drops in the graph like this: https://i.imgur.com/mxp07Tq.png (MPC-BE x64 1.5.2 build 3455, if it matters, and LAV 0.71.0-32)

All right. These graphs just the same and indicate jerks of frames, during playback. And they are just the same and appear at the time of the jump in frame rate.

What does it mean to jump frames? This means that the frame rate is unstable and varies, for example, instead of 30 constant FPS, a jump to 31.5, or 32 and back to 28, which is already below 30. And this is naturally wrong. So it turns out some kind of warping, some interval (range) [~ 28 FPS -> ~ 32 FPS].

[Schwartz]

I can confirm that this happens since the version following 0.70.2.1-git. This, along with freezing. I made an issue about the other thing on GitHub and forgot about the weird frame stutter.

[lvqcl]

So, is it fixed on current nightly (0.71.0-34) ?
At least I can't see any stuttering on that Youtube HLS video.

[ryrynz]

Well you can tell us that, but those fixes do look to be directly related to this discussion, so..

[nevcairiel]

It would make it easier to just keep discussion of that HLS issue in the GitHub ticket:
https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/199

As far as I can tell, the latest nightly (0.71.0-34) should greatly improve the situation.

[pikaczu]

Is LAV Filters fully compatible with x265 10bit? because I'm filming a film, scrolling with arrows on the keyboard.

[Leader]

nevcairiel

As far as I can tell, the latest nightly (0.71.0-34) should greatly improve the situation.

Yes, indeed, there are improvements, those problems, about which I wrote to you earlier, are no more. But there are still the following problems:

1. After switching to any video quality format, let's say from 720p to 480p, etc. and back, during streaming, the video starts to play jerky, correspondingly there are skipped frames, during playback.

2. After switching to any video quality format, let's say from 720 to 480, etc. and vice versa, the reproduction itself does not begin, i.e. switching occurred, and the video itself, the video frames themselves simply do not exist, they are on the spot. If you wait a while, they can appear and continue to play, but again the playback will be intermittent with skipping frames.

[nevcairiel]

LAV does not allow you to switch the variant during playback, so however you do that is probably outside of LAVs control and just ends up confusing it.

[sneaker_ger]

Is LAV Filters fully compatible with x265 10bit?
It can play the output of x265 10bit fine. If you want to seek within the file you should mux it properly so it has an index (e.g. using mkvmerge).

[pikaczu]

It can play the output of x265 10bit fine. If you want to seek within the file you should mux it properly so it has an index (e.g. using mkvmerge).

I have such movies. where to improve?

[Klaus1189]

Just remux the file(s) with MKVToolNix, nothing more. After that, you can seek properly. Issue done.

[mzso]

Hello!

I just noticed (In Potplayer and MPC-HC) that the embededded WebVTT subtitles show up empty, I get nothing. Doesn't LAV Splitter support this format? The subtitles show up in MPV, and potplayer's internal matroska splitter.

Update:
I also tried the latest nightly. Didn't change things.

[lvqcl]

Doesn't LAV Splitter support this format?

https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/80

[mzso]

https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/80

Thanks for the link.
Doesn't look encouraging. Though I'd say seeing a subtitle is still better than having nothing at all. (Not sure where "directshow formats" com into play. The containers/players certainly support this format)

[nevcairiel]

The containers/players certainly support this format

No DirectShow player that I know of supports it properly.

[mzso]

No DirectShow player that I know of supports it properly.
I don't know about other players, but potplayer can certainly show vtt subtitles, even if the subs are embedded if I use its internal splitter. And I'm quite sure it used to work with internal subtitles also. I reported some bug with it more than a year ago. (And I've been using LAV for many years, so I would have noticed if it wasn't working then. I don't know hat happened in the meanwhile.)


For what it's worth I'm fine with it being treated as a simple text subtitles, it only has positioning as a notable extra anyway (which is rarely used on youtube ) which I explicitly don't want, because I usually have the text outside the image frame.

To me it's much more of a problem that I don't get any subtitles. ( and the subtitle appears to be empty/broken)

(I even have ASS/SSA formatting disabled, even though it's supported by the player.)

[LigH]

According to the installer, LAV Filters support AviSynth scripts. Does that also include pseudo AVI files created with makeAVIS, using the FourCC 'AVIS'? The video configuration does not expose a format option related to AviSynth. Just checking if it can completely substitute ffdshow for applications which don't support AviSynth scripts directly (e.g. by analyzing the file for supported container formats first), but possibly DirectShow decoders for AVI.

[lord_muad_dib]

hello, i'm new about lav filters, so, sorry if it's a rather stupid question, i searched for answers in this forum and found nothing about it.
i use the filter under wine, and all works great, really. but when i tried to edit settings with the lav panels (start menu links) it doesn't seem to save anything and the apply button is also grayed out. is it a normal behavior? do i need a 3rd party app to edit options?
i can edit stuff using regedit in H/C/U/software/lav but it is not practical of course and i didn't find a full list of keys i can add/edit

thanks for any help

[nevcairiel]

I'm sorry, but running under wine is neither tested nor supported. LAV is designed for Windows, you can probably find much easier options on Linux then running DirectShow codecs on Wine.

[pikaczu]

Is LAV Filters fully compatible with x265 10bit? because I'm filming a film, scrolling with arrows on the keyboard.

[lord_muad_dib]

I'm sorry, but running under wine is neither tested nor supported. LAV is designed for Windows, you can probably find much easier options on Linux then running DirectShow codecs on Wine.

oh, it's ok, fact is, wine supports the host media outputs and codecs to play videos on windows games but there's not a viable way to add codecs on the list in mac os (at least in the newer ones, perian worked in ancient osx versions).. so i'm stuck using filters inside wine itself. oh well, it's not a big deal. at least i can report that lav works great under wine(no noticeable lag in most video/audio formats, it's robust) as is so, i'll just keep editing the registry for now :) is there a list of registry keys of lav?
thanks for all your work, if you'll ever want to venture in wine support you'll have a tester :D

[aufkrawall]

To be on the safe side you could set up LAV Filters in a Windows VM and simply export its registry keys.

[steakhutzeee]

Hi :)

I'm trying to configure Lav Splitter. For example i've this file with two audio tracks, one japanese and one english.
Starting the player, the english track is selected, even if i specify that jpn language goes first. Why this? What i'm missing?

https://s17.postimg.cc/jly13bylb/lav.jpg

Thanks!

[nevcairiel]

Some players override LAVs stream choices. In that case there is nothing it can do.

[steakhutzeee]

Some players override LAVs stream choices. In that case there is nothing it can do.

I'm using MPC-BE. Is this the case?
Posted a screen in my previous post.

[Aleksoid1978]

I'm using MPC-BE. Is this the case?
Posted a screen in my previous post.

MPC-BE - go Options -> Playback and uncheck "Default track preference".

[steakhutzeee]

MPC-BE - go Options -> Playback and uncheck "Default track preference".

Thanks, but it's unchecked yet :(

https://s17.postimg.cc/eto7rx6i7/mpc.jpg

[LigH]

Furthermore, there are containers where you can flag streams to be the default among several (or even force their use, e.g. for subtitles); MKV supports such flags, here you would have to edit their header.

[Pat357]

According to the installer, LAV Filters support AviSynth scripts. Does that also include pseudo AVI files created with makeAVIS, using the FourCC 'AVIS'? The video configuration does not expose a format option related to AviSynth. Just checking if it can completely substitute ffdshow for applications which don't support AviSynth scripts directly (e.g. by analyzing the file for supported container formats first), but possibly DirectShow decoders for AVI.

I guess a makeAVIS AVI can only be opened if ffdshow is installed.
What you can do is create a virtual AVI using the PISMO plugin (both AVS and Vapoursynth).
This virtual file can be opened by anything using a AVI VFW from the system.
It will not use LAV.

[steakhutzeee]

Furthermore, there are containers where you can flag streams to be the default among several (or even force their use, e.g. for subtitles); MKV supports such flags, here you would have to edit their header.

I've no experience on this. How can i do?
Thanks.

So i can't use lav splitter "in automatic" with mpc be?

[rizukitomi]

hey, mind testing this video sample... because it's seek weirdly in my player...

i use LAVf 0-71-34... for player, i use MPC-BE... at first i thought it was player bug, but when i try it with potplayer, it's still seek weirdly...

when i uninstall LAVf splitter from 0-71-34 and reinstall LAVf splitter from 0-71, it's seek smoothly... and when i change the container to mkv, it's seek smoothly too... but when in mp4 container, it's seek weirdly... may i ask why ? is this bug ?

note :
# video sample i provide is : 720p h264 in mp4 container, i get it from some fansubs forum...

this is the sample : https://drive.google.com/open?id=18edu0WCzOLOelgR1M4NEe9SR84SGz6Ft

[sneaker_ger]

What does "weirdly" mean? Are you using LAV Video as well? If so, what decoder (software, D3D11, DXVA etc.)? Can you pinpoint the exact nightly version it was introduced? (I don't see anything weird with 0.71.0.34 and MPC-HC nor MPC-BE.)

[steakhutzeee]

Yep, as I can see, the preferred languages doesn't work with mpc be.

Can someone confirm this? So I'm sure I'm not doing something wrong.

[sneaker_ger]

No, I cannot confirm. Works fine here with LAV 0.71.0.34 and MPC-BE x64 v1.5.2 build 3586. I have "default track preference" ("Options"->"Playback") NOT ticked.

[steakhutzeee]

No, I cannot confirm. Works fine here with LAV 0.71.0.34 and MPC-BE x64 v1.5.2 build 3586. I have "default track preference" ("Options"->"Playback") NOT ticked.That's strange, I never had that option ticked and it doesn't works.

[sneaker_ger]

Filter list? ("Play"->"Filters" during playback.)

[steakhutzeee]

Lav splitter is loaded, in fact I manually select the audio and subs I want.Filter list? ("Play"->"Filters" during playback.)

[sneaker_ger]

Are you using the same MPC-BE build as me?

[steakhutzeee]

I'm using 1.5.2 build 3445 beta.
And lav filters 0.71 stable.

I checked yesterday for updates but I think it search on sourceforge.net where the latest version is the one I use :/

Are you using the same MPC-BE build as me?

[sneaker_ger]

I got mine from https://www.videohelp.com/software/MPC-BE . Not saying that is the cause, just checking to make sure you aren't using some 3 year old build but yours is pretty recent ..

[steakhutzeee]

I got mine from https://www.videohelp.com/software/MPC-BE . Not saying that is the cause, just checking to make sure you aren't using some 3 year old build but yours is pretty recent ..

In lav splitter i selected No Subtitles, but when i open a file, subtitles are loaded. So it's of course not working, but i can select audio e subtitles i want from the icon in the sys bar.

This is very strange, what could be the cause? :confused:

I don't understand, i disabled la splitter source and lav splitter but when i load a file lav splitter is loaded...

EDIT: ^This because i think lav starts automatically with mpc be. Now in fact i unistalled lav and reinstalled the latest nightly build, and without adding lav to external filters in mpc be, they starts automagically. Is this behavior normal?

So with the clean installation of lav i tried to select No Subtitles in Lav Filters but still subtitles are loaded. So i don't know...

[mclingo]

got an odd problem with LAV audio.

I cant bit stream for some DTS movies if I use LAV as external filters, doesnt seem to be any reason for this, ive tried several versions all the the same issue, some DTS movies play fine which is odd.

To give an example. If I install MPC-HC with stock settings and set it to bit stream using internal filters 0.71.25 everything plays ok

if I then use LAV filters externally, regardless of version I lose sound on some movies, just cant work whats going on.

Same happens in MPC-BE and KODI DS so its defo something with my PC or LAV filters.

I've dropped back a few AMD RX driver versions and this made no difference either, no idea whats going on, anyone any ideas?, here is the media info of one of the movies that wont play.


Audio
ID : 2
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 2 h 14 min
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 509 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 93.750 FPS (512 SPF)
Bit depth : 24 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 1.42 GiB (13%)
Language : English
Default : Yes
Forced : No


I've also tried currently nightly.


EDIT - I should also say that I can play these movies fine with VLC /bitstream so its just LAV filters.


here is demo, I cant play this either -


https://we.tl/rbkIeKMHj6

[steakhutzeee]

got an odd problem with LAV audio.

I cant bit stream for some DTS movies if I use LAV as external filters, doesnt seem to be any reason for this, ive tried several versions all the the same issue, some DTS movies play fine which is odd.

To give an example. If I install MPC-HC with stock settings and set it to bit stream using internal filters 0.71.25 everything plays ok

if I then use LAV filters externally, regardless of version I lose sound on some movies, just cant work whats going on.

Same happens in MPC-BE and KODI DS so its defo something with my PC or LAV filters.

I've dropped back a few AMD RX driver versions and this made no difference either, no idea whats going on, anyone any ideas?, here is the media info of one of the movies that wont play.


Audio
ID : 2
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 2 h 14 min
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 509 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 93.750 FPS (512 SPF)
Bit depth : 24 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 1.42 GiB (13%)
Language : English
Default : Yes
Forced : No


I've also tried currently nightly.


EDIT - I should also say that I can play these movies fine with VLC /bitstream so its just LAV filters.What's difference of using external filter lav or "internal?".

I have installed lav and noted that without adding it to external filters, it runs on its own when I play something. How possible?

[mclingo]

i suspect this wasnt LAV at all as I found several other issues also came back, I was getting HDMI loss coming in and out of 3D mode and blown out reds again with MADVR on 23p material. All issues now fixed with system restore.

suspect my GFX driver install got corrupted or something, I had a few pc crashes in the week caused by a faulty power adapter, I'm betting that caused it, I hadnt watched anything for a few days so I only spotted it today.

[mclingo]

@nevcairiel - i've found an issue i'd like your advice on. As stated I lost DTS bitstream playback on half my DTS collection, on further inspection it was all non DTS HD stuff which made me think of LAV filters again. I can reproduce this problem by ticking use DTS HD framing for all DTS types, i'm sure I usually have this ticked.

Should this be ticked, is this a bug, i've tried several LAV versions and all have the same issue, I also tried a few AMD drivers, of course this could be something wrong with my receiver or PC maybe.

What do you think?

[nevcairiel]

Never tick that checkbox, it usually does only bad things. The next version already has it renamed and a warning attached. As a general rule, only change default settings if you actually know what it does :)

[mclingo]

many thanks for your quick reply.

[pikaczu]

are you sure LAV Filters, is compatible with x265 10bit?

[huhn]

x265 is an encoder but yes lavfilter can decode h265 10 bit.

[pikaczu]

good :)

[el Filou]

As a general rule, only change default settings if you actually know what it does :)People should read the help tooltips in LAV settings more often, imo they offer pretty good descriptions, e.g. "if you do not experience any problems, it's recommended to leave this setting untouched" for this one. :D

[rizukitomi]

What does "weirdly" mean? Are you using LAV Video as well? If so, what decoder (software, D3D11, DXVA etc.)? Can you pinpoint the exact nightly version it was introduced? (I don't see anything weird with 0.71.0.34 and MPC-HC nor MPC-BE.)

i'm using LAV Video, Audio, and Splitter from 0.71-34... and i'm using software decoder mode... but the problem is the splitter... when i'm using LAV Splitter from 0.71 or MPC-BE internal Splitter (Version 1.5.1) it's seek smoothly, there's no lag whatsoever... but when i use LAV Splitter from 0.71-34, there's a little lag... can you reproduce the problem ? or is it only me that have this problem ?

another sample... is this youtube video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2Lz2AeEnZE

[steakhutzeee]

What you mean for internal mpc be splitter? What's the name? i'm using LAV Video, Audio, and Splitter from 0.71-34... and i'm using software decoder mode... but the problem is the splitter... when i'm using LAV Splitter from 0.71 or MPC-BE internal Splitter (Version 1.5.1) it's seek smoothly, there's no lag whatsoever... but when i use LAV Splitter from 0.71-34, there's a little lag... can you reproduce the problem ? or is it only me that have this problem ?

another sample... is this youtube video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2Lz2AeEnZE

[sneaker_ger]

i'm using LAV Video, Audio, and Splitter from 0.71-34... and i'm using software decoder mode... but the problem is the splitter... when i'm using LAV Splitter from 0.71 or MPC-BE internal Splitter (Version 1.5.1) it's seek smoothly, there's no lag whatsoever... but when i use LAV Splitter from 0.71-34, there's a little lag... can you reproduce the problem ?
I cannot reproduce with the Infinity.Challenge.E498.mp4 sample (https://drive.google.com/open?id=18edu0WCzOLOelgR1M4NEe9SR84SGz6Ft) (md5 9b479c56f334fdfda11bb36a31d9d3e8) you uploaded the other day.

Again: which nightly introduced the problem? There were 13 nightlies between 0.71 and 0.71.0.34.

another sample... is this youtube video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2Lz2AeEnZE
Don't post links to youtube as samples. Youtube provides like 30 different streams depending on the upload/client pc/browser/connection speed.

[mclingo]

noticed a bug with D3D11, sorry is this is already known, i get a frame repeat every 10 mins with 23hz 3d MVC playback, with dxva copy back its hours/days before I get a frame repeat.

:(

[nevcairiel]

We've been over this before - hardware acceleration settings have absolutely zero impact on 3D MVC playback.

[mclingo]

no but setting a different accelerator may cause a player to act differently for some reason, after further investigation its only doing it KODI DS both MPC-BE and HC are fine, HC is using onboard filters and BE ive set to use external like DS does.

i'll maybe move this to the DS forum as its clearly not a LAV issue.

cheers.

[lord_muad_dib]

To be on the safe side you could set up LAV Filters in a Windows VM and simply export its registry keys.

indeed that's a way to do it, thanks

[huhn]

nev did you look at the atmos decoder in windows and if it can be used for headphone user?

it's supposed to work with netflix so there has to be a decoder even through it's only useful for headphone user.

[Asmodian]

There is also an atmos decoder for home theater, I think it costs 15 USD or something, "Dolby Access" in the play store. The headphone decoder is also only available through this app, as far as I can tell, though it is free. :p

[el Filou]

There is also an atmos decoder for home theater, I think it costs 15 USD or something, "Dolby Access" in the play store.Is it an decoder, or an encoder? I thought it was used to encode dynamic 3D sound - like in games - into Atmos for decoding with your AVR.

[huhn]

it's a atmos decoder for headphones or with other words it get atmos in and outputs "stereo".

decoding atmos is currently only useful for headphones. for speaker you need a measuring device and a audio renderer that can understand decoded atmos.

and if this page is correctly there has to be a decoder: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/p/dolby-access/9n0866fs04w8

could be a bad joke too i'm mean you can use dolby atmos headphone for 7.1 which is about as bad as dolby headphone...

for games and AVR it needs an encoder not sure how this encoder could be of any use for lavfilter.

[mzso]

could be a bad joke too i'm mean you can use dolby atmos headphone for 7.1 which is about as bad as dolby headphone...


Why do you say such nonsense? Dolby headphones is great. It's the best commercial multi channel virtualization technology. (Not as good as the free stuff (https://1drv.ms/f/s!AnbO8YLUAW6Jh1XaISDxGiV5Mlym)someone threw together from free HRIR datasets (http://audiogroup.web.th-koeln.de/ku100nfhrir.html), but still better than all others (https://sourceforge.net/p/equalizerapo/discussion/general/thread/3a03d8df/).)

"Dolby Access" in the play store. The headphone decoder is also only available through this app, as far as I can tell, though it is free. :p

How does this work? Is some sort of system level DSP? Or I need to use a dshow codec in the player?

[richardpl]

There is nothing special about those stuff it is basic convolution and can be done with ffmpeg already.

[huhn]

Why do you say such nonsense? Dolby headphones is great. It's the best commercial multi channel virtualization technology. (Not as good as the free stuff (https://1drv.ms/f/s!AnbO8YLUAW6Jh1XaISDxGiV5Mlym)someone threw together from free HRIR datasets (http://audiogroup.web.th-koeln.de/ku100nfhrir.html), but still better than all others (https://sourceforge.net/p/equalizerapo/discussion/general/thread/3a03d8df/).)

sorry i'm not going into detail with dolby headphone and the bad implementation of dolby atmos headphone with 7.1 input.
dolby headphone has major processing issue which can easily clip this alone is enough.

if you compare a native atmos implementation and a dolby atmos 7.1 to phones there is nothing to compare the quality just bad.

[mzso]

There is nothing special about those stuff it is basic convolution and can be done with ffmpeg already.

Well there are no effects in LAV so it does little good to me.

(Even if it's basic convolution, the availability of a decent surround virtualization is lacking, particularly in foss software. )

[Asmodian]

How does this work? Is some sort of system level DSP? Or I need to use a dshow codec in the player?

I think it is a system level DSP and am not sure what it requires for decoding.

[foxyshadis]

Well there are no effects in LAV so it does little good to me.

(Even if it's basic convolution, the availability of a decent surround virtualization is lacking, particularly in foss software. )

Don't even get me started, I've never seen a single inclusion of even a good limiting amp in free video software in all the years people have been asking for better volume control. Every music player has a half-dozen plugins or settings to do it with no fuss, and it's implemented for ac3 decoding, so I have no idea why it's impossible to get it into a directshow filter or MPC-BE in a generic fashion. Even Audacity, of all things, has nothing similar, and at best has a two-step limit-then-amplify (manually calculating how much), and of course, Audacity is still stuck on a 4-year-old build of ffmpeg, so good luck opening Opus or Tak.

[chros]

so I have no idea why it's impossible to get it into a directshow filter
There was at least one: DynEQ (formerly known as DeDynamic), I think it was a link (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=71860) on doom9.
It was the best for me for 2ch output.

[LigH]

Don't miss the point that (IIRC...) Dolby Digital (AC3) decoders are able to use metadata in the bitstream to know immediately recommended values already stored by the encoder. May they just be the exponent of a floating point representation of loudness or DialNorm values, or even respect acoustic room models set up in the AC3 encoder, I am not sure; but there is definitely an advantage over dynamic range control for unexpected miscellaneous audio which requires a look-ahead window and introduces a latency.

[foxyshadis]

Don't miss the point that (IIRC...) Dolby Digital (AC3) decoders are able to use metadata in the bitstream to know immediately recommended values already stored by the encoder. May they just be the exponent of a floating point representation of loudness or DialNorm values, or even respect acoustic room models set up in the AC3 encoder, I am not sure; but there is definitely an advantage over dynamic range control for unexpected miscellaneous audio which requires a look-ahead window and introduces a latency.

That's handy when you're in a living room, but for instance, watching Lawrence of Arabia on a road trip some years back was an exercise in frustration, as nothing I could do could get the level of the dialogue up above the road noise with the headphones I had, short of badly distorting the music. It's also only applicable to AC3, which I try to never use. A decent hard limiter only needs about 10 ms or so of latency, well below the usual decoding queues, and again, it'd be a tradeoff the viewer could make.

[LigH]

Well, I programmed one with 0 latency (BeSweet's "booster"), but audiophiles will complain that it distorts the sound. :devil:

[3421]

LAV for XP, as for Vista -10 i don't know. https://uploadfiles.io/9ke45

[Plutotype]

Hi folks, Im on MPC-HC 0.71.25, Windows 7, GTX960 (391.35). Playing back HEVC UHD videos with DXVA Copy back and GTX960 as active decoder, I get 120ms rendering times with hundreds of dropped frames. Madvr is set to low quality algorithms (Lanczos).

Is the Nvidia driver faulty? Playback worked a couple of weeks ago.

[ryrynz]

Perform a system restore to a couple of weeks ago then and work it out from there.

[mclingo]

if your system hasnt changed much in two weeks that might be good advice, its worth a quick reinstall of MADVR first though to see how it plays with default settings. If that doesnt work then a reinstall of the NVIDIA driver.

I'd also check to see what MS updates you've pickup up, I have mine disabled as I'm avoid the latest big update like the plague.

[TheElix]

Hello. Using D3D11 decoding I have a black screen on some videos. Statistics included. DXVA2 works fine.

Video 1 (Works)
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings : CABAC / 2 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1 h 46 min
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 24.4 Mb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.490

Video (Doesn't Work)
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 2 h 1 min
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 33.1 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate : 35.5 Mb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.665

Video 3 (Doesn't Work)
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings : CABAC / 2 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames
Format settings, GOP : M=1, N=10
Muxing mode : Container profile=@0.0
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1 h 42 min
Bit rate mode : Variable
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Title : MPEG-4 AVC 32145 kbps 1920*1080p / 23,976 fps . 16:9. High Profile 4.1
Default : No
Forced : No

Video 4 (Doesn't Work)
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1 h 24 min
Bit rate : 9 567 kb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 040 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 1.85:1
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.200
Stream size : 5.66 GiB (81%)
Writing library : x264 core 146 r2538 121396c
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=4 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=umh / subme=8 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.00 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=0 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=12 / lookahead_threads=2 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / bluray_compat=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=2 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / weightb=1 / open_gop=0 / weightp=2 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=23 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=40 / rc=2pass / mbtree=1 / bitrate=9567 / ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=0 / qpmax=69 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Language : English
Default : Yes
Forced : No

Video 5 (Doesn't Work)
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1 h 39 min
Bit rate mode : Variable
Maximum bit rate : 37.0 Mb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709

Video 6 (Doesn't Work)
ID : 4113 (0x1011)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : VC-1
Format profile : Advanced@L3
Codec ID : 234
Duration : 1 h 58 min
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Compression mode : Lossy
format_identifier : VC-1
Source : 00001.m2ts

MPC-HC (64-bit)
---------------

Build information:
Version: 1.7.16 (40904c4ad)
Compiler: MSVC v19.13.26129
Build date: Apr 4 2018 00:13:21

LAV Filters:
LAV Splitter: 0.71.0.25
LAV Video: 0.71.0.25
LAV Audio: 0.71.0.25
FFmpeg compiler: MinGW-w64 GCC 7.3.0

Operating system:
Name: Windows NT 10.0 (build 17134)
Version: 10.0 (64-bit)

Hardware:
CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3770K CPU @ 3.50GHz
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060 6GB (driver version: 24.21.13.9764)

[huhn]

can you make a sample from one of these files that give you a blackscreen a couple sec should be enough.

[TheElix]

can you make a sample from one of these files that give you a blackscreen a couple sec should be enough.Can you please suggest a program to do this? I'm so rusty right now.

Okay, that's weird. Now it's working on my primary display (which is a monitor). It doesn't work on secondary display (projector). The projector was working as a single device (no shared screen) when I tested. It seems I need to do more tests.

[foxyshadis]

Is the monitor on the Nvidia and the projector on onboard? Or vice versa? Sounds like an issue where it's being decoded on one and not able to be transferred to the other.

[Mercury_22]

Bug: wrong black levels with (MPC-BE's) EVR-CP with some files. Sample (https://ufile.io/pwizl)

MPC-BE's internal video decoder outputs correct black levels with all EVR, EVR-CP and madVR
LAVVideo decoder outputs wrong black levels with EVR-CP, but correct black levels with EVR & madVR

LAVFilters-0.71.0-35 MPC-BE 1.5.2.3648 Windows 7 x64

[nevcairiel]

That file is pretty ordinary yuv420p h264 with NV12 output, its in no way that I can tell special.

If it works with multiple renderers, but not with one, what is the most logical conclusion to take? :)
Either your configuration is bonkers or the renderer is faulty.

[Mercury_22]

That file is pretty ordinary yuv420p h264 with NV12 output, its in no way that I can tell special.

If it works with multiple renderers, but not with one, what is the most logical conclusion to take? :)
Either your configuration is bonkers or the renderer is faulty.

OK but then why MPC-BE's internal video decoder + EVR-CP (or EVR or Sync or madVR) outputs the correct black level ?

Or even when using LAV + EVR-CP + other files I get correct black levels

[huhn]

did you change any output settings in lav?

[Mercury_22]

did you change any output settings in lav?

Nope tested with default settings for both MPC-BE and LAV and just changed HW decoder to Native or Copy-back or software or D3D11 and the renderer to EVR or Sync or EVR-CP or madVR

[huhn]

the file doesn't have range information and hardware decoding is used so what ever is done to it in term of range is done by the renderer.

[isidroco]

No matter what I do, LAV pickup subtitle in alphabetical order. (Running MPC-HC from last xp version of kliteMegaCodecPack for winxp, LAV splitter v0.70.2.17-git). I'm trying to have SPA subtitles, but even putting spa alone, or in advanced "*:spa", it always chooses first alphabetical (renaming subtitle to xxxxxx.ara.srt will make that the first picked up subtitle). Is there a way to pickup desired subtitle instead?

[nevcairiel]

External subtitles in .srt files are not controlled by LAV, you would have to convince MPC-HC to honor a language preference.

[mclingo]

ok, so i'm going to ask a question I feel I should know the answer too but I dont, please forgive my ignorance.

I've recently purchased some wireless headphones to watch movies late night with, I have two sets, I have some RF Sony Platinums which I can also use for gaming but I also have a pair of bluetooth.

Neither will play any sound when i'm set to bitstream, with these being digital headphones I would have thought this would have worked, clearly my understanding of bitstreaming is massively lacking.

Am I doing something wrong, completely misunderstanding bitstreaming in LAV or both, or am I just a massive numpt-o-noob or all three?

[nussman]

You need a decoder (ac3, dts etc.) somewhere. Seems like your headphones dont have decoders onboard => no sound with bitstream output.

[mclingo]

You need a decoder (ac3, dts etc.) somewhere. Seems like your headphones dont have decoders onboard => no sound with bitstream output.

thats obvious now you've said that, my brain just needed a nudge in the right direction.

Thanks.

[nussman]

Would be greate if LAV could fallback to PCM if the renderer doesnt support bitstreaming, but I think we have discussed this issue in the past and there was no solution to do this properly.

[mclingo]

yeah that would be really nice, must be possible but i'm sure Nev has lots of other priorities. For now i've just setup a seperate player for phones.

cheers.

[isidroco]

No matter what I do, LAV pickup subtitle in alphabetical order. (Running MPC-HC from last xp version of kliteMegaCodecPack for winxp, LAV splitter v0.70.2.17-git). I'm trying to have SPA subtitles, but even putting spa alone, or in advanced "*:spa", it always chooses first alphabetical (renaming subtitle to xxxxxx.ara.srt will make that the first picked up subtitle).
PS: As an exception, if: "Two and a Half Men - 5x01 - Large Birds Spiders and Mom.avi"
With an extra space "Birds Spiders" will show .spa instead.

[clsid]

The settings in LAV Splitter are only for embedded subtitles, not for external subtitle files.

You can configure it here for external ones:
MPC-HC options > Playback > Default Track Preference

The K-Lite installer even has options to select your preferred language(s), which configures everything automatically.

[nevcairiel]

I've been working on improving TrueHD bitstreaming, and posted a test version on GitHub:

https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/208

If you've been encountering issues with TrueHD bitstreaming, primarily drop-outs on high bitrate TrueHD+Atmos streams from UHD Blu-rays, give this version a try and leave feedback on GitHub.

[jmone]

Changes look good and seemed to have solved the high bit rate dropouts - FYI, the changes are also in the latest LAV Nightlies - https://files.1f0.de/lavf/nightly/

[fireattack]

Hi everyone, I have a small question about decoding video that is hybrid (film and NTSC interlaced).
The video is remuxed using MakeMKV from a DVD. The first part of the video is film, and the second part is NTSC interlaced.

I play the video in MPC-HC (tried other players, some result) and open MadVR OSD to show stats.

It initially shows "deinterlacing off (says upstream)" when playing first film part, and automatically changes to "deinterlacing on (says upstream)" when it enters part 2.
You can even drag the progress bar to part 2 and it will immediately change to "deinterlacing on (says upstream)" as well.

However, the problem is: once it start to show "deinterlacing on (says upstream)", drag the progress bar back to part 1 will NOT change it back to "deinterlacing off (says upstream)".

So, my question is:

1. is it just an OSD problem (even could be MadVR's problem)?
2. If not, will it affect actual playback? Like, it may cause unnecessary deinterlacing downstream on the film (progressive) part.

Thanks.

[Orf]

Hi nevcairiel,
I'm experimenting a bit with BDA live source graphs and encounter an issue where LAV Video decoder deadlocks with MS MPEG-2 Demultiplexer. Deadlock only happens when graph is running and when Demux performs a dynamic media type change on LAV Video decoder.

Here's stack trace:
77e0ef34 +044 ntdll.dll RtlEnterCriticalSection
62d54173 +093 LAVVideo.ax dshowutil.cpp 393 +16 FindPinIntefaceInGraph
62cd9378 +118 LAVVideo.ax lavvideo.cpp 629 +31 CLAVVideo.CreateDecoder
62cd9a0f +00f LAVVideo.ax lavvideo.cpp 781 +4 CLAVVideo.SetMediaType
62d571dc +02c LAVVideo.ax decssinputpin.cpp 381 +2 CDeCSSTransformInputPin.SetMediaType
62cdbd07 +117 LAVVideo.ax lavvideo.cpp 1461 +16 CLAVVideo.Receive
62d57180 +060 LAVVideo.ax decssinputpin.cpp 375 +2 CDeCSSTransformInputPin.Receive
62d51098 +038 LAVVideo.ax amfilter.cpp 3041 +7 CBaseInputPin.ReceiveMultiple
75258482 +022 KERNEL32.DLL BaseThreadInitThunk

Is there anything I can do to avoid this behavior instead of stopping the entire graph?

[nevcairiel]

The interesting question would be what is holding the other side of that lock, that its apparently hanging on?

[Manni]

I've been working on improving TrueHD bitstreaming, and posted a test version on GitHub:

https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/issues/208

If you've been encountering issues with TrueHD bitstreaming, primarily drop-outs on high bitrate TrueHD+Atmos streams from UHD Blu-rays, give this version a try and leave feedback on GitHub.

Hi Nev, I posted on Github as well, but it's solved here (testing with GotG Vol2 in Atmos), thanks! 1080Ti to Denon X8500H. Same results with the lastest nightly (42).

[Orf]

The interesting question would be what is holding the other side of that lock, that its apparently hanging on?
Ah, sorry not to mention that. "MS MPEG-2 Demultiplexer" does. It's stuck inside the IMPEG2PIDMap::MapPID call. And I suppose that's the place from where it calls Receive on LAV Video decoder input pin

[KoD]

@nevcariel

I've been using LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 for a long time now. I just updated to LAVFilters-0.71.0-30, but started noticing right away random audio pops and cracks. They're not loud, but they're there. Very easy to notice on dtshd-ma 24 bit integer 48KHz BluRay soundtracks which decode to 24bit integer 48Khz, but it's there on AC3 that decodes to 32 bit float too. Tried LAVFilters-0.71.0-35, and it's the same. Tried playing on both an external audio receiver (digital optical out), as well as over HDMI, and it's the same. Went back to LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 again and the sound is free of these cracks and pops. I have not tried any intermediate versions.

Later edit: well, I just noticed the cracks are there with LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 too.

Even later edit: yes, they're in LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 too, but not as often than in LAVFilters-0.71.0-35; with the latest version of the filters it's so often it's impossible not to notice it and is very distracting.

Later later edit: forgot to say that the cracks and pops are not there when playing the same m2ts or mkv file with PowerDVD and letting it decode the audio.

[nevcairiel]

This sounds more like an issue on how the audio gets output then how it gets decoded, because decoding has been bitexact for several versions, and if there was a fundamental problem across all audio formats, I'm sure someone would've reported it before as well.
Thats something always to keep in mind, decoding is independent of the setup of your system. It gets audio data in and gives you decoded data back. So any fundamental decoding problem would easily manifest for a lot of people.

The output to the hardware however is entirely dependent on the hardware. And your particular issue sounds like using bigger output buffers might help, but thats not something LAV controls - thats the Audio Renderer (a part that would also be different in something like PDVD).

[pikaczu]

when new wersion?

[LigH]

"When It's Done" ™

[pikaczu]

good.

[foxyshadis]

@nevcariel

I've been using LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 for a long time now. I just updated to LAVFilters-0.71.0-30, but started noticing right away random audio pops and cracks. They're not loud, but they're there. Very easy to notice on dtshd-ma 24 bit integer 48KHz BluRay soundtracks which decode to 24bit integer 48Khz, but it's there on AC3 that decodes to 32 bit float too. Tried LAVFilters-0.71.0-35, and it's the same. Tried playing on both an external audio receiver (digital optical out), as well as over HDMI, and it's the same. Went back to LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 again and the sound is free of these cracks and pops. I have not tried any intermediate versions.

Later edit: well, I just noticed the cracks are there with LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 too.

Even later edit: yes, they're in LAVFilters-0.70.2-83 too, but not as often than in LAVFilters-0.71.0-35; with the latest version of the filters it's so often it's impossible not to notice it and is very distracting.

Later later edit: forgot to say that the cracks and pops are not there when playing the same m2ts or mkv file with PowerDVD and letting it decode the audio.

USB audio? That's the biggest culprit for pops and crackles; Win10 is a huge improvement for USB audio dropouts (as in, I've never had them) compared to Win7. Aside from that, the only thing you can do is keep your audio and video drivers updated, increase audio buffers in applications, and experiment. Unfortunately, MPC-BE is pretty limited in audio options; even BE doesn't give you control over audio buffers. You could try an ASIO driver, which will give you more knobs to twiddle, or ffdshow, with did expose buffer size, iirc. Aside from that, changing applications, as you have, is the only way to go.

[gfxnow]

Which players use LAV filters as default internal filters? I know kodi dsplayer uses it. I am currently using mpc-hc but would prefer switching to a player that is being actively developed/updated. I don't think mpc-be is using LAV.

[ryrynz]

It doesn't need to be "using LAV" because you simply disable the internal filters and install LAV filters. You don't need any player to come with LAV for it to be up to date or run perfectly the same as if it came built with LAV.

[clsid]

As long as MPC-HC does what you need, then there is no reason to switch. And there still are minor updates for it occasionally.

[jkauff]

Kudos to clsid for building those minor updates. He tries to keep current with stable LAV filters releases, so no reason to shy away from MPC-HC.

[gfxnow]

Thanks guys, happily installed MPC-HC v1.7.16. Kudos to clsid indeed!

[Orf]

@nevcariel
I want also to report that despite of what read-me says that it was fixed, LAV video decoder (D3D11 mode only, other modes are not affected) often stops working after media type changes. This is not happens always, occasionally it might work once or several times, but in most cases it didn't. After that point decoder starts sending frames with garbage content to renderer, and any further media type changes didn't work too

[Thunderbolt8]

I want to get the best possible sound from my internal sound card, using LAV audio and the mpc-hc internal audio render (without the ability to use bitstreaming). Im trying to play a 5.1 96kHz 24-bit TrueHD file using a 2 speaker setup. so I know the playback cant be 100% bit-perfect anyway due to channel mixing, but I want it to be as perfect as it can get aside from that.

in windows settings I ticked the box for allowing apps to take exclusive mode (and also the priority box) and set the default format to 24/96.

in the internal audio renderer of mpc-hc settings device is set to system default, the box for exclusive mode is ticked as well as the "ignore system channel mixer" box.

in LAV audio decoder settings, I enabled mixing with output configuration set to stereo, changed LFE mix level to 0 (dont want heavy bass in the night) and also ticked the box for clipping protection. status box says TrueHD --> PCM; 6 channels --> 2 channels; 24-bit integer --> 32-bit float.

now, when I play back the file, the internal audio renderer status tab says format: float --> PCM-24 (padded) and Processors: limiter.

when I untick the boxes 32-bit integer and 32-bit float in LAV, then LAV status says 24-bit int --> 24-bit int and internal audio renderer status PCM-24 --> PCM-24 (padded) and processors: -

so Im wondering whether keeping the 32-bit boxes in LAV ticked gives me the better/more original sound presentation or unticking the boxes. the input format is only 24-bit and not 32-bit. does channel changing from 6 --> 2 need some float headroom/dithering for sound quality? in LAV audio it says "enabling all formats will allow untouched/bitexact output" and "the best format is used automatically". what does "best" here mean? best quality? most fitting/suitable format?

[lvqcl]

It doesn't matter IMHO.

[Asmodian]

does channel changing from 6 --> 2 need some float headroom/dithering for sound quality? in LAV audio it says "enabling all formats will allow untouched/bitexact output" and "the best format is used automatically". what does "best" here mean? best quality? most fitting/suitable format?

Yes, channel muxing from 6 -> 2 generates 32-bit float. Do not disable any formats in LAV, it will pick the optimal format for quality.

[KoD]

@nevcariel, @foxyshadis

I am using Win10, indeed. It's build 1703 (so, April last year I guess) with all updates until now, as I have the Pro version and can delay feature updates, and there were quite a few people complaining about issues with the nvidia drivers in 1709. 1803 also seems to be having teething problems, so I'm not eager to update to it either.

I am playing audio using either:
- motherboard optical out (external DAC + amplifier)
- or via HDMI (on the TV audio speakers)

I either case:
- having LAVaudio decode audio: random (but quite seldom) pops and clicks;
- using PowerDVD to play: no audio issue;
- using the Microsoft audio decoder (even for AC3 audio): no audio issue.

Once upon a time, the Cyberlink PowerDVD decoders were also available as DirectShow filters and could be used by players like MPC-HC, but this does not seem to be the case anymore, neither as 32bit nor as 64bit filters, so I can't use them in 3rd party media players to test this scenario as well.

I've switched between several video drivers (nvidia), and audio (realtek), and there was no difference.
I'm playing using either MPC-HC (with internal filters disabled), or ZoomPlayer. Tried all audio options: DirectSound wrapper around the audio device, or directly the audio device (I guess WaveOut ?). It makes no difference.

Regardind the pops and clicks I'm having when using LAVaudio decode audio, if I rewind back and play the same fragment again, the pop does not happen again. I guess it's either an issue of some errors that accumulate in time and then you get the click, or maybe some sync issue where lav filters try to keep the video and audio in sync and this happens? I don't experience audio and video getting out of sync in time, though. I toggled the "Auto A/V Sync correction" on and off in the Lav audio filter configuration, but it did not have any effect. The pop/click resembles what one would get when "normalize matrix" is enabled in the Mixer, but I don't have the Mixer enabled in LAV audio, so it's not that. And with it enabled to mix audio to stereo, I still got the pops and clicks.

These issues did not happen in the past, but I could not say when they started. There was quite a long stretch of time where my HTPC was left unused due to lack of time.
At this point, I don't know what else it could be. Since out of three audio decoders, it only happens with LAV audio, my guess was that LAV audio must have something to do with it.

Unfortunately, for some audio formats there is no option other than LAV audio, so using something else is not possible.

[e-t172]

I want to get the best possible sound from my internal sound card, using LAV audio and the mpc-hc internal audio render (without the ability to use bitstreaming). Im trying to play a 5.1 96kHz 24-bit TrueHD file using a 2 speaker setup. so I know the playback cant be 100% bit-perfect anyway due to channel mixing, but I want it to be as perfect as it can get aside from that.

You would be better off spending your time on other things. There is no evidence whatsoever that a "perfect" "bit-perfect" audio pipeline will make any kind of audible difference compared to a normal audio pipeline using default options. It will be more trouble than it's worth. If it does make a difference, it just means that your audio system is broken.

(Also, trying to build a "perfect" pipeline while downmixing to stereo and setting LFE to zero is a bit nonsensical.)

[Thunderbolt8]

(Also, trying to build a "perfect" pipeline while downmixing to stereo and setting LFE to zero is a bit nonsensical.)as perfect as possible considering the given conditions

Yes, channel muxing from 6 -> 2 generates 32-bit float. Do not disable any formats in LAV, it will pick the optimal format for quality.so basically audio would be truncated if I choose to output at 32-bit float? apparently the 32-bit float then get changed to 24-bit padded by the MPC audio renderer afterwards. is this done via dithering?

[lvqcl]

as perfect as possible considering the given conditions

Two things that can really affect audio are:
1) surround -> stereo downmixing
2) no LFE channel

[el Filou]

so basically audio would be truncated if I choose to output at 32-bit float? apparently the 32-bit float then get changed to 24-bit padded by the MPC audio renderer afterwards. is this done via dithering?No, 32-bit float can represent 24-bit int without losing precision.
Anyway if you uncheck 32-bit float in LAV's output formats, the conversion from it back to 24 int is going to be done by LAV itself instead of MPC's renderer.

[gfxnow]

Posted this in MadVR but realized it might be more relevant here, should I force enable my onboard Intel GPU (HD Graphics 630) in BIOS to use it as a D3D11 CB device in LAV? The logic being that it might free up resources on my GTX 1070 allowing me to further crank up MadVR settings.

[mclingo]

i'd be interested to know what difference this would make as I could set LAV to software and use my CPU for LAV and GPU for MADVR.

Although, I doubt my CPU could handle HEVC.

[sneaker_ger]

Systems and files are so different it's best if you simply give it a try and compare. Note that video decoding is usually on an extra part of the chip not used by madvr and that copying uncompressed frames via PCIe has overhead so often D3D11 native should have the performance advantage (without quality loss DXVA2 native may introduce).

[huhn]

it's not that simple.

the only part that is simple is that the performance differences for madVR are mimimal if not zero on a proper working system.

if you think d3d11 native is the fastest mode for madVR it has to copy the data to dx9 after getting them this is not the case with dxva2 or software decoding.

if transferring big data or doing this copy process is using more processing power is hard to check because it is so little and inconsistent.

in term of rendertiems d3d11 clearly looses on the madVR OSD what ever that is worth i never encountered any real world differences.

i get 1.5 to 3 ms in the madVR OSD just for the d3d11 interop while for software decoding i can't find a reliable number or performance impact.

[aufkrawall]

Artificial statistics data don't prove anything. With my GTX 1070, the decoder performance with DXVA2 was too slow for 8k VP9, while D3D11VA worked.

madVR uses an interop for D3D11 presentation as well, and it doesn't really cost performance. Less guessing, please.

[huhn]

good job missing the point...

[aufkrawall]

Well, just partially. ;)

[nevcairiel]

LAV Filters 0.72

LAV Video
- Changed: Enabled CineformHD decoding by default, since the decoder has much improved
- Fixed: Decoding Matroska files with Linked Segments which used old x264 4:4:4 encodes could result in corruption

LAV Audio
- NEW: Blu-ray Dolby Digital Plus 7.1 decoding and bitstreaming support
- NEW: LAV Audio will fallback to audio decoding if bitstreaming is not supported by the audio renderer/hardware
- Fixed: DTS-HD HRA bitstreaming did not work properly with many A/V receivers
- Fixed: TrueHD bitstreaming could result in drop-outs on high bitrate TrueHD+Atmos streams

Download: Installer (both x86/x64) (https://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.72.exe) -- Zips: 32-bit (https://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.72.zip) & 64-bit (https://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.72-x64.zip)

Audio and Bitstreaming Improvements

A lot of work went into this release for bitstreaming improvements, including doing a lot of research and reverse engineering to figure out how the TrueHD bitstreaming is really supposed to work, so that high bitrate streams (as found on UltraHD Blu-rays with Atmos) no longer cause drop-outs during playback.

Some newer receivers also had trouble receiving DTS-HD HRA streams, which should hopefully be resolved as well - even though my own receiver accepted the previous format just fine, but testing by other users has yielded quite positive results.

And last but not least, LAV Audio finally supports handling Dolby Digital Plus 7.1 as found on Blu-ray discs properly, both in decoding and bitstreaming. This format has not seen very wide use on Blu-ray discs, but the usage seems to be increasing lately.

Outside of those improvements, LAV 0.72 of course comes with a newer version of FFmpeg.

[mclingo]

yikes, some great stuff there Nev, specifically the fallback we asked for, fantastic work again, wonderful.

Thanks.

[zaemon]

Great, thanks. I had the dropout issue.

[Manni]

Thanks for the great work, as usual!

[hubblec4]

Hi nevcairiel

Many thanks for fix the issue with Matroska Linked Segments.
I have tested my Blu-ray Thor 3 which has audio Dolby Digital Plus 7.1, all works fine now.

[chros]

Thanks for the new release and your work!

[nussman]

Thanks nevcairiel for the new Version and especially for the fallback feature.

[iSeries]

Hi, my AVR is 7.1 capable, however, I have a 5.1 setup. If I were to send PCM to my receiver instead of bitstream, for 7.1 tracks should I send the full 7.1 channels and let the AVR do the downmixing, or set LAV to output 5.1?

Also, not starting a PCM vs bitstreaming debate, but is there any advantage to bitstreaming? Don't the lossless codecs have downmixing metadata in them whereas PCM would not have this?

[huhn]

bitstreaming is less accurate in term of A/V sync.
lav or an audio render could use the meta data to down mix not sure if there is a render with support for that or if lavfilter is reading it.

i can't tell you if PCM can be send with meta data.

[jmone]

Thanks Nevcairel for the work on TrueHD/ATMOS bitstream changes. Working well.

[ryrynz]

Hi, my AVR is 7.1 capable, however, I have a 5.1 setup. If I were to send PCM to my receiver instead of bitstream, for 7.1 tracks should I send the full 7.1 channels and let the AVR do the downmixing, or set LAV to output 5.1?

I would let the amp take care of it. Grab a 7 channel test file and see which you prefer, but I'd rather let hardware deal with a process like this.

[SamuriHL]

It depends on the AVR but yea, I let mine do the same thing. Then again, I've got a massive speaker upgrade en route so I'll be fully 7.1 shortly. WOO HOO!

[Aleksoid1978]

nevcairiel
Hi. Fallback to audio decoding is not working if some audio processor present in graph, "ffdshow Audio Processor" as example.

[nevcairiel]

Thats probably ffdshows fault, its extremely inflexible in changing its types. Also, why would an audio processor ever accept a bitstreaming type in the first place?

[clsid]

Works here with ffdshow, except if I enable bitstreaming during playback.

[phoenixxl]

Hey Nevcairiel,

Just mentioning the top post desc still says 0.71, the link to the fille is ok though, it links to v 0.72

Binaries for the most recent version are available here:
Version 0.71: Installer (both x86/x64) -- Zips: 32-bit & 64-bit
Download 3D Plugin: 32-bit & 64-bit


Thank you for the new filters !

[kuchikirukia]

Can someone tell me what's going wrong here? I'm trying to do make an encode with ordered chapters, but I'm finding that if you seek to the inserted section in MPC-HC and switch audio tracks, you get no audio after it goes through the transition. There are a couple episodes where it does work but several where it doesn't. It works in mpv and VLC, though in VLC the seek bar does some funky shit.

https://nofile.io/f/erMJ2hnpvXV/Main.zip

[Emulgator]

For systems that can not be updated beyond WinXP32SP3:
Which version is the last known to be working on WinXP32SP3?
0.70.2.80
0.70.2.82
0.70.2.83
0.70.2.88

[kral2008]

Guys,
Is there any way to decode 50 FPS streams in 25 FPS? I mean for ex. just forget about the half of the frames, and just select them once amoung.
This is because old PCs who haven't GPU/CPU accelerated H/W decoding, independent from bit-rate of HEVC streams, have problem with FPS. My experiments show that my old i7 740 QM laptop could play smoothly the following stream:

General
Unique ID : 146683291928339036295978944671459269582 (0x6E5A2CA738E21066867829611AD35BCE)
Complete name : F:\2018.2160p.UHD.BluRay.x265-.mkv
Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 4 / Version 2
File size : 16.2 GiB
Duration : 1 h 57 min
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 19.7 Mb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2018-06-13 22:48:25
Writing application : mkvmerge v24.0.0 ('Beyond The Pale') 64-bit
Writing library : libebml v1.3.6 + libmatroska v1.4.9

Video
ID : 1
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Commercial name : HDR10
Format profile : Main 10@L5.1@High
Codec ID : V_MPEGH/ISO/HEVC
Duration : 1 h 57 min
Bit rate : 14.1 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 1 608 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.40:1
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.095
Stream size : 11.6 GiB (71%)
Writing library : x265 2.8+16-03dcb3457b7e:[Windows][GCC 6.3.0][64 bit] 10bit
Encoding settings : cpuid=1111039 / frame-threads=5 / numa-pools=36 / wpp / no-pmode / no-pme / no-psnr / no-ssim / log-level=2 / input-csp=1 / input-res=3840x1608 / interlace=0 / total-frames=169496 / level-idc=51 / high-tier=1 / uhd-bd=0 / ref=4 / no-allow-non-conformance / repeat-headers / annexb / aud / hrd / info / hash=0 / no-temporal-layers / no-open-gop / min-keyint=1 / keyint=24 / gop-lookahead=0 / bframes=4 / b-adapt=2 / b-pyramid / bframe-bias=0 / rc-lookahead=25 / lookahead-slices=4 / scenecut=40 / radl=0 / no-intra-refresh / ctu=64 / min-cu-size=8 / rect / no-amp / max-tu-size=32 / tu-inter-depth=1 / tu-intra-depth=1 / limit-tu=0 / rdoq-level=2 / dynamic-rd=0.00 / no-ssim-rd / signhide / no-tskip / nr-intra=0 / nr-inter=0 / no-constrained-intra / no-strong-intra-smoothing / max-merge=3 / limit-refs=3 / limit-modes / me=3 / subme=3 / merange=57 / temporal-mvp / weightp / no-weightb / no-analyze-src-pics / deblock=-3:-3 / no-sao / no-sao-non-deblock / rd=4 / no-early-skip / rskip / no-fast-intra / no-tskip-fast / no-cu-lossless / no-b-intra / no-splitrd-skip / rdpenalty=0 / psy-rd=2.00 / psy-rdoq=1.00 / no-rd-refine / no-lossless / cbqpoffs=0 / crqpoffs=0 / rc=crf / crf=17.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpstep=4 / stats-write=0 / stats-read=0 / vbv-maxrate=160000 / vbv-bufsize=160000 / vbv-init=0.9 / crf-max=0.0 / crf-min=0.0 / ipratio=1.40 / pbratio=1.30 / aq-mode=1 / aq-strength=1.00 / cutree / zone-count=0 / no-strict-cbr / qg-size=32 / no-rc-grain / qpmax=69 / qpmin=0 / no-const-vbv / sar=1 / overscan=0 / videoformat=5 / range=0 / colorprim=9 / transfer=16 / colormatrix=9 / chromaloc=1 / chromaloc-top=2 / chromaloc-bottom=2 / display-window=0 / master-display=G(8500,39850)B(6550,2300)R(35400,14600)WP(15635,16450)L(40000000,50) / max-cll=2971,112 / min-luma=0 / max-luma=1023 / log2-max-poc-lsb=8 / vui-timing-info / vui-hrd-info / slices=1 / no-opt-qp-pps / no-opt-ref-list-length-pps / no-multi-pass-opt-rps / scenecut-bias=0.05 / no-opt-cu-delta-qp / no-aq-motion / hdr / hdr-opt / no-dhdr10-opt / no-idr-recovery-sei / analysis-reuse-level=5 / scale-factor=0 / refine-intra=0 / refine-inter=0 / refine-mv=0 / no-limit-sao / ctu-info=0 / no-lowpass-dct / refine-mv-type=0 / copy-pic=1 / max-ausize-factor=1.0 / no-dynamic-refine / no-single-sei
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : PQ
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color primar : BT.2020
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0050 cd/m2, max: 4000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 2971 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Le : 112 cd/m2

Audio #1
ID : 2
Format : TrueHD
Format profile : TrueHD+Atmos / TrueHD
Codec ID : A_TRUEHD
Duration : 1 h 57 min
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 3 214 kb/s
Maximum bit rate : 5 520 kb/s
Channel(s) : Object Based / 8 channels
Channel positions : Object Based / Front: L C R, Side: L R, Back: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : / 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 1 200.000 FPS (40 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossless
Stream size : 2.64 GiB (16%)
Language : English
Default : Yes
Forced : No

Audio #2
ID : 3
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Format profile : MA / Core
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 1 h 57 min
Bit rate mode : Variable / Constant
Bit rate : 2 328 kb/s / 1 509 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 93.750 FPS (512 SPF)
Bit depth : 16 bits
Compression mode : Lossless / Lossy
Stream size : 1.92 GiB (12%)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No

Text
ID : 4
Format : PGS
Muxing mode : zlib
Codec ID : S_HDMV/PGS
Codec ID/Info : Picture based subtitle format used on BDs/HD-DVDs
Duration : 1 h 56 min
Bit rate : 20.6 kb/s
Count of elements : 2244
Stream size : 17.2 MiB (0%)
Title : SDH
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No

Menu
00:00:00.000 : en:00:00:00.000
00:13:13.251 : en:00:13:13.251
00:24:04.234 : en:00:24:04.234
00:31:57.999 : en:00:31:57.999
00:39:57.061 : en:00:39:57.061
00:50:31.070 : en:00:50:31.070
01:04:49.844 : en:01:04:49.844
01:13:58.100 : en:01:13:58.100
01:20:17.396 : en:01:20:17.396
01:27:41.131 : en:01:27:41.131
01:38:41.624 : en:01:38:41.624
01:51:17.421 : en:01:51:17.421



But can't decode smoothly a recording TS from TRT 4K with this characteristics:

General
ID : 30801 (0x7851)
Complete name : C:\Users\abcdefghi\Downloads\20180626-212911_TRT 4K.ts
Format : MPEG-TS
File size : 1.03 GiB
Duration : 5 min 37 s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 26.0 Mb/s

Video
ID : 4855 (0x12F7)
Menu ID : 16300 (0x3FAC)
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L5.1@Main
Codec ID : 36
Duration : 5 min 38 s
Bit rate : 24.5 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 50.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.059
Stream size : 987 MiB (94%)

Audio
ID : 4955 (0x135B)
Menu ID : 16300 (0x3FAC)
Format : E-AC-3
Format/Info : Enhanced Audio Coding 3
Codec ID : 6
Duration : 5 min 37 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 256 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 187.500 FPS (256 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Delay relative to video : -524 ms
Stream size : 10.3 MiB (1%)
Service kind : Complete Main

Using LAV filter. This shows the problem is not the bitrate, but the framerate. So the possible solution could be skipping the half of the frames ?

[LigH]

@ Emulgator: Bad news (if correct)...

For people who still like WinXP - last working version of subj is LAVFilters-0.70.2-16

as quoted when manolito asked in Feb. 2018 (https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1833765#post1833765).

[kuchikirukia]

Guys,
Is there any way to decode 50 FPS streams in 25 FPS?

Yes, an avisynth script with selecteven().
Though if you have old hardware I doubt you have a 4k monitor, so why not just reencode to 1080p?

[Emulgator]

Many thanks, Ligh, just confirmed. 0.70.2.16 installs on XPSP3.
From 0.70.2-29 on the installer stops, window pops up:
"This program does not support the version of Windows you're running."

[kral2008]

Yes, an avisynth script with selecteven().
Though if you have old hardware I doubt you have a 4k monitor, so why not just reencode to 1080p?

could you explain more about Avisynth ? and how I can use it.
Re-encoding is not a good option as the Hardware is weak!

[nussman]

If decoding is the problem then avisynth or a skip fields deinterlacer wont help because this step is after the decoder.

[LigH]

Skipping the decoding of every second frame is not a valid solution anyway, because modern video formats have complex dependencies between many frames, and simply not decoding one frame will cause decoding artifacts in all frames using just this skipped frame as a reference. In the best case, the skipped frame was a B frame in the middle of a dependency pyramide, using other references but not being reference itself; in the worst case, it was an IDR (or similar) frame, a start of a whole GOP.

[kral2008]

Skipping the decoding of every second frame is not a valid solution anyway, because modern video formats have complex dependencies between many frames, and simply not decoding one frame will cause decoding artifacts in all frames using just this skipped frame as a reference. In the best case, the skipped frame was a B frame in the middle of a dependency pyramide, using other references but not being reference itself; in the worst case, it was an IDR (or similar) frame, a start of a whole GOP.

This's a very precise answer.
Thank you so much. Yeah, I didn't consider this. yeah. This can cause serious problems. You are right.

[Snowknight26]

nevcairiel, with the recent TrueHD changes you released in 0.70.2, I've noticed that every now and then, pausing playback makes TrueHD bistreaming stop working. Resuming playback results in no sound and my receiver no longer recognizes the TrueHD stream as being passed through. The only way I can fix it is to stop/start playback (I presume this unloads/reloads all the DirectShow filters).

Is there some kind of logging or debugging I can enable to determine the culprit?

Edit: actually, resuming the playback after it was paused for several minutes (right after I noticed the issue) seemed to have fixed it. However, would still like to get to the bottom of this as it has been happening frequently with the latest version.

[nevcairiel]

Pausing bitstreaming is always a bit of an issue, because the AVR loses the bitstream sync no matter what you do, and specifically in DirectShow as well, because the audio decoder doesn't really control any of that. The renderer might still be buffering data, so even if the decoder tries to reset the bitstream on un-pause, there is no guarantee that it would work.

[glith]

Isnt it possible to continue sending empty bitsteam packets during pause to keep the sync?

[Aleksoid1978]

nevcairiel, with the recent TrueHD changes you released in 0.70.2, I've noticed that every now and then, pausing playback makes TrueHD bistreaming stop working. Resuming playback results in no sound and my receiver no longer recognizes the TrueHD stream as being passed through. The only way I can fix it is to stop/start playback (I presume this unloads/reloads all the DirectShow filters).

Is there some kind of logging or debugging I can enable to determine the culprit?

Edit: actually, resuming the playback after it was paused for several minutes (right after I noticed the issue) seemed to have fixed it. However, would still like to get to the bottom of this as it has been happening frequently with the latest version.

Can you try MPC-BE with internal filters ?

[nevcairiel]

Isnt it possible to continue sending empty bitsteam packets during pause to keep the sync?

Thats something the audio renderer would have to do, a decoder like LAV Audio cannot do this, because the audio renderer no longer accepts data in pause mode.

[Snowknight26]

Can you try MPC-BE with internal filters ?

Latest stable didn't seem to have any issues, latest nightly produced no sound.

[BDFan]

Hi nevcairiel!

D3D11 doesn't work with the nVidia Optimus on Intel GPU if in the nVidia control panel selected nVidia GPU.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/f4/a1bdb331af6c6d7538b483fb41dc2bf4.jpg
DXVA Checker shows that D3D11 enable on Intel GPU if in the nVidia control panel selected nVidia GPU.
http://i99.fastpic.ru/big/2018/0117/1e/bf52f2ca8fc9e36416f5de8582c9261e.jpg

Optimus is generally just not supported. Use it at your own discression, but don't expect anything to work. I do not provide support for such setups because they are impossible.
LAV has no control over what hardware is available. It'll just try to use it. If its unavailable due to Optimus, there is nothing I can do about that.

PotPlayer internal D3D11 Copy-Back video decoder works great with Optimus.
Proof.
http://www.hostpic.org/images/1807192328340103.jpg (http://www.hostpic.org/view.php?filename=1807192328340103.jpg)

LAV video decoder bug.
Please fix it!

[VictorLS]

All
Is any way (incl. using not LAV Filters but another video decoder - I tried Cyberlink, Elecard and Mainconcept with no success - or/and may be splitter) to watch properly (as TVsets does) h265 50(60)fps with normal horizontal resolution 720 in case of SD and 1920 in case of HD but half vertical resolution (so each frame is just field but not full frame) - in SD it's 288 instead of 576 and in HD it's 544 instead of 1088?
For example Zee TV20180716-203544.ts (24MB) https://disk.yandex.ru/i/5iZbCc3LRL8SKw - logo of the channel is blinking now when I set correct aspect ratio - important thing - it's realy 4:3 channel because of circle over ZEE TV (same channel in h264 broadcasting by another Russian provider is 4:3 too and logo is monolith).
I think must be such Force weave option somewhere - am I wrong?

[LigH]

Seems you want to have only either the odd or the even fields displayed, skipping the opposite field.

[VictorLS]

LigH
No, because vertical sharpness and fluent playing will be lost. I want get from ZEE TV example 720x576p50 without flickers - maximum quality on PC as on TVsets.

[LigH]

Sorry, I got confused by you even mentioning "half vertical resolution" at all. Now that I see the sample video, I understand the issue: This video has been encoded with fields like frames, but they are not handled like fields of interlaced video, instead like completely separate frames.

H.265 should be broadcasted as progressive content only. The original specs did not even mention interlacing, I believe to remember ... HEVC wanted to make it obsolete. Some encoders may still create "interlaced HEVC" treating fields separately. But these fields should still be organized as pairs making a whole frame. This is not the case in your sample. It looks like a result of AviSynth's SeparateFields() function.

Decoders like LAV Filters don't recognize these frames as pairs of fields, so they won't offer a weave feature. This may require to process the video separately in e.g. AviSynth with Weave(), and then you should not re-encode the result as HEVC (H.265), instead as interlaced AVC (H.264) – if it is truly interlaced at all (I did not check that).
_

Remark: 720 lines is still HD. SD is only up to 576 lines (conventional PAL).

[VictorLS]

This video has been encoded with fields like frames, but they are not handled like fields of interlaced video, instead like completely separate frames.
You're quite right.
About 720 lines - if you read more carefully I meant not lines but columns ;)
Most of PAL channels has 720 horizontal resolution but I saw 768 and 544 to (anamorph or non-square pixels).
Writing must be such Force weave option I meaning ~ AviSynth with Weave() but I want still have hardware acceleration of such files. I think one of the possible ways to get what I want is add ffdshow raw filter between decoder and renderer? Or may be nevcairiel just add one more Deinterlacing mode in LAV Video Decoder...

[LigH]

The number of pixels per line is not really helpful. Depending on the aspect ratio common for the medium (e.g. DVD, SVCD, DVB, or deskewed), you can have PAL with 576 lines and 352 / 480 / 544 / 704 / 720 and even 768 or 1024 pixels. But you always need 576 lines for PAL, it might be interlaced.

Deinterlacing options will process pairs of fields to make frames. But it will not process pairs of frames.

[huhn]

the file is 50 FPS it can't be interlanced there is no spec for it.
an intelranced file needs 30 or 25 frames per sec.

and the file is progressive flagged anyway a deintelrancer has nothing todo with it.
and the file reports a AR of 40/11.

so the file is incorrectly encoded
or the file is incorrectly stored in the container.

using WAEVE() turns an progressive file into an interlanced file why should lavfilter ever do this even more important why should an interlancer be added as an deinterlancer...

[foxyshadis]

You just need to use Avisynth/Vapoursynth/Virtualdub2 to re-encode this horribly butchered encode. No one is going to add support for this. I have no idea why they didn't just use H.264 if they wanted interlaced; it would probably have been more efficient with MBAFF anyway.

[sneaker_ger]

the file is 50 FPS it can't be interlanced there is no spec for it.
HEVC specs do allow interlacing. But AFAIK LAV+MPC-HC don't support it correctly. (Irregardless of whether or not his file is or isn't violating specs.)

[clsid]

There is a ticket on the FFmpeg bug tracker about such HEVC files:
http://trac.ffmpeg.org/ticket/4141

[clsid]

PotPlayer internal D3D11 Copy-Back video decoder works great with Optimus.The NVIDIA driver contrains profiles for various games/apps that specify which GPU is used. You can use NVIDIA Profile Inspector (https://ci.appveyor.com/project/Orbmu2k/nvidiaprofileinspector/build/artifacts) to customize/add profiles.

[huhn]

HEVC specs do allow interlacing. But AFAIK LAV+MPC-HC don't support it correctly. (Irregardless of whether or not his file is or isn't violating specs.)

lovely is doesn't output 25 fps frames per sec with that it would be ok because the last step of decding is skipped?

and i just said there is no spec for 50 FPS 100 fields yet and hopefully never will be.

[VictorLS]

and i just said there is no spec for 50 FPS 100 fields yet and hopefully never will be.
I didn't say about 100 fields - I said about 50 full frames which must be get from "50 half vertical resolution frames" = "50 progressive fields" with same deinterlacing method like ordinary (352,480,544,704,720,768,1024)x576i50fields SD TV video from SAT :)

[huhn]

sorry but i'm not going to discuss the basics of interlancing here. progressive fields...

the file is wrongly decoded or still wrongly created.
it may get fix for software decoding but for hardware decoder not sure if anyone else than the GPU producer can fix this mess.
i there even a spec for hardware interlanced HEVC decoding?

[VictorLS]

sorry but i'm not going to discuss the basics of interlancing here.
OK.
still wrongly created.
Perhaps because I believe answer on your question
is there even a spec for hardware interlanced HEVC decoding?
is NO, there isn't so SAT provider has to translate interlaced SD and FullHD video as serial "progressive half vertical resolution frames"=fields. And several people has modern TVset with internal SAT tuners (even with CI+) said all good with channels h265 like ZEE TV but nobody said PC plays that file well (with solid circle around ZEE TV logo) even if aspect ratio is right = 4:3...Why computer worse than TVsets?

[nussman]

SAT provider can translate interlaced SD and FullHD (fields) to HEVC (frames) by using a (good) deinterlacing filter.
"Reverse Deinterlacing" for "bad" deinterlacing" by Sat providers is not supported by GPU's nor LAV software.

[huhn]

clsid already postet everything we need to know: https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1846662&postcount=22970

[VictorLS]

SAT provider can translate interlaced SD and FullHD (fields) to HEVC (frames) by using a (good) deinterlacing filter.
I agree - i.e. Vector Adaptive Deinterlacer - it's best way but one SAT provider decided to put more channels in one transponder, so we must to work with it as is...

[Arm3nian]

PotPlayer internal D3D11 Copy-Back video decoder works great with Optimus.


LAV video decoder bug.
Please fix it!

With UHD AVC, neither iGPU or nvidia GPU decoding works with any of the methods.

But with UHD HEVC (4k bluray) everything works.

Optimus is broken in general. Doesn't even work with RemoteFX in Hyper-V. The whole idea of rendering on a separate gpu, then passing the data to the iGPU is disgusting.

[BDFan]

Optimus is broken in general.
Good developers have no problems.
All players works, madVR works (window and exclusive mode), PotPlayer internal D3D11 decoder works, only LAV Filters fail.


With UHD
I dont have 4k TV. I dont know.

[nevcairiel]

I have no interest in supporting Optimus. Feel free to contribute patches if you think it's so easy and have access to such hardware.

[hobbs1]

Hey Nev, getting an insecure connection warning from your site.

files.1f0.de uses an invalid security certificate.

The certificate expired on Monday, July 23, 2018 7:08 AM. The current time is Monday, July 23, 2018 10:35 AM.

Error code: SEC_ERROR_EXPIRED_CERTIFICATE

[VictorLS]

https://ffmpeg.zeranoe.com/builds/ ffplay.exe x64 from ffmpeg-4.0.1-win64-static.zip plays Zee TV20180716-203544.ts (24MB) https://disk.yandex.ru/i/5iZbCc3LRL8SKw - from previous page https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=156191&page=1149 plays (without sound) that ts well using ffplay.exe -vf weave,yadif=1 "Zee TV20180716-203544.ts" string was given me by clever Russian guy so I hope it'll be not very hard to implement right decoding of such files in LAV Filters.

[LigH]

Implementing a weave is not too hard, I believe. But implementing the logic to detect incorrectly interlaced HEVC may be. And you won't want to manually enable forced weaving for every video separately.

[VictorLS]

LigH
Usually I like automation (as I wanted to force switch off high quality deinterlacing on some "bad interlaced streams" for hardware decoder in nVIDIA's videocards - but it wasn't implemented even in manual mode immediately by nevcairiel so I switch it off forever after implemented by Aleksoid1978, some time later I think after many asks by another users of LAV Filters nevcairiel implemented too but not automatic) if it works correctly but if it's too hard to implement or it can works incorrectly I'd like have just manual control i.e. Force weave as I mentioned at first post on previous page.

[sirhaden]

I'm using multiple instances of the DirectShow LAVVideo decoder to decode several streams simultaneously. The video is H.264 and is in MKV, MP4 and a proprietary container format files. The H.264 in the MKV and proprietary container are both Annex-B prefixed and the decoders run simultaneously without issue. No frame drops or decoder errors. The H.264 is the MP4 files is not Annex-B, the only known difference, and decoding with multiple instances causes the decoders to throw many NAL parsing errors. The result is that frames are dropped randomly from these simultaneous decoder instances.

[mkver]

Actually, H.264 in Matroska mustn't be annex B; it must use the same length-prefixed mode that mp4 uses as well.

[nevcairiel]

I'm using multiple instances of the DirectShow LAVVideo decoder to decode several streams simultaneously. The video is H.264 and is in MKV, MP4 and a proprietary container format files. The H.264 in the MKV and proprietary container are both Annex-B prefixed and the decoders run simultaneously without issue. No frame drops or decoder errors. The H.264 is the MP4 files is not Annex-B, the only known difference, and decoding with multiple instances causes the decoders to throw many NAL parsing errors. The result is that frames are dropped randomly from these simultaneous decoder instances.

There is no global state in decoding that i'm aware of that would ever cause one instance to influence another one. Are you sure those errors don't happen when decoding single files, which might indicate something is wrong with how the files are being send to the decoder?

[sirhaden]

Actually, H.264 in Matroska mustn't be annex B; it must use the same length-prefixed mode that mp4 uses as well.

Both work in the MKV container.

[sirhaden]

The decoder error messages are such:

[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Invalid NAL unit size (24584278 > 2879).
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Invalid NAL unit size (28985 > 28748).
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Invalid NAL unit size (598628684 > 3370).
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Invalid NAL unit size (22491 > 21484).
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Invalid NAL unit size (-1019633513 > 94).
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Invalid NAL unit size (-545420300 > 3047).
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Invalid NAL unit size (-1424184330 > 22).
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Invalid NAL unit size (24977 > 20414).
[h264 @ 03d4dec0] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Invalid NAL unit size (1875228973 > 4829).
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Error splitting the input into NAL units.
[h264 @ 2146bf80] Invalid NAL unit size (22326 > 21586).

[nevcairiel]

Those errors usually happen if you try to pass off AnnexB as MP4-style H.264, or the media type indicates a wrong size of the length field.

[sirhaden]

Those errors usually happen if you try to pass off AnnexB as MP4-style H.264, or the media type indicates a wrong size of the length field.

The MP4 video frames are all length prefixed.

The length prefixed IDR video frames do have length prefixed Access Unit Delimiters, SPS and PPS NALUs preceding them.

The non-IDR video frames contain only a length prefixed Access Unit Delimiter following by the length prefixed video frame.

[nevcairiel]

If you're certain the video is fine, then you may still be delivering it to the decoder wrong. I assume you use your own source filter, and not LAV Splitter?
My guess would be that the media type doesn't match the video contents.

[sirhaden]

If you're certain the video is fine, then you may still be delivering it to the decoder wrong. I assume you use your own source filter, and not LAV Splitter?
My guess would be that the media type doesn't match the video contents.

I am my own source and splitter filters.

I made changes to the MP4 parsing to remove all NALUs from non IDR video frames and updated the output media sample size. For IDR frames, changes were made to only send the PPS NALU followed by the IDR NALU with an updated output media sample size.

The output media sample type is:

MEDIASUBTYPE_AVC1
FORMAT_MPEG2Video

with:

pVIH2->bmiHeader.biCompression = MKTAG('a', 'v', 'c', '1');

Which is the same as when delivered from the proprietary format container.

Unfortunately, the issue is still occurring.

[ca]

I tested two nightlies: 0.69.0-43 and 0.69.0-73. Everything seems to work fine except that i can not playback Blu-Rays anymore using the DLLs libaacs.dll and libbdplus.dll. When media playback should start it says "Can not render Video/Output pin, error: 0x80004005 unknown error".

With the last official LAV release 0.69 this still works.

Aacs still doesn't seem to be working a year later. Can anyone else confirm this?

[clsid]

ProcessMonitor might reveal if it still tries to load those DLLs.

[sirhaden]

Resolved the issue related to a different DirectShow filter, not the LAV filters. :thanks:

[DTL]

Addition posts of VictorLS:
If feeding LAV Splitter with interlace HEVC stream we see HEVC VUI-> field_seq_flag = 1 and frame_field_info_present_flag = 1, but VIDEOINFOHEADER2 -> dwInterlaceFlags = 0x00000000 that confuses renderer. Also at the output of LAV decoder also VIDEOINFOHEADER2 -> dwInterlaceFlags = 0x00000000 that indicates progressive frames. I think if LAV splitter-decoder operates with such HEVC bitstream it must set dwInterlaceFlags |= AMINTERLACE_IsInterlaced | AMINTERLACE_1FieldPerSample in the VIDEOINFOHEADER2
of output decoded samples and feed it to the renderer. Also for each sample the LAV Decoder must pass through field placement data and set dwTypeSpecificFlags member of AM_SAMPLE2_PROPERTIES: if pic_struct member of picture timing SEI = 1, then dwTypeSpecificFlags |= AM_VIDEO_FLAG_FIELD1; if if pic_struct member of picture timing SEI = 2, then dwTypeSpecificFlags |= AM_VIDEO_FLAG_FIELD2. May this helps.

Some info about streaming interlaced content using h.265 as sequence of fields: http://www.ramugedia.com/interlace-support-in-hevc

"But implementing the logic to detect incorrectly interlaced HEVC may be. "

The input h.265 bitstream to LAV Filters do properly marked as field-based in the VUI. So to detect this the LAV Filters must process VUI data in the input h.265 bitstream and use it in the internal processing or pass this data to renderer for correct visualization on progressive electro-optical devices.

To show VUI data in graphstudio the source .ts was remuxed to .mp4 using ffdshow.

[nevcairiel]

There will be no support for interlaced HEVC unless FFmpeg properly supports decoding them like any other interlaced format. I recommend inquiring there.

[DTL]

But ffmpeg Do properly decode sequence of pictures that handle interlaced h.265 field-based video. Generally users do not ask ffdshow and LAV to output weaved frames or perform deinterlace for such h.265 streams. But LAV must parse h.265 stream VUI data and mark output DirectShow stream samples properly at least.

Now it marks them as non-interlaced so all further renderers fails to display it properly.

Also field-based stream is completely valid DirectShow stream marked with flags AMINTERLACE_IsInterlaced | AMINTERLACE_1FieldPerSample in the VIDEOINFOHEADER2. As well as more common interlaced-frames stream. So I hope if LAV splitter-decoder will correctly pass-through the metadata to the next to decoder renderer it may do all required work for displaying it correctly.

Ofcourse if LAV-software is too high-level wrapper around ffmpeg that it can not go low-level into VUI of h.265 data processed so it really no way to do it. Sadly in this case.

[nevcairiel]

But ffmpeg Do properly decode sequence of pictures that handle interlaced h.265 field-based video

No, it does not. If it did, there would be no discussion because it would just work. It decodes it like a progressive half-height video. It decodes any other interlaced format as weaved fields into one frame and exports metadata about interlaced status and field order, which is required for both software and hardware deinterlacing. It does not do that for HEVC. Hence, it is not supported. There will be no manual hackery for HEVC interlaced, or trying to get separate fields to work. Either it adopts standard decoding, or it won't be supported.

PS:
Just because something is theoretically valid in DirectShow, it does not mean that it would actually be supported by whatever renderer one cares about.

[mclingo]

Hi, @nevcairiel - i'm using some Playstation Platinum wireless headphones for late night viewing but finding i'm having to turn off bitstreaming to get sound, shouldn't these be working now RE changelog: LAV Audio will fallback to audio decoding if bitstreaming is not supported by the audio renderer/hardware

[nevcairiel]

That depends if the driver actually refuses bitstreaming. Maybe it doesn't.

[mclingo]

any way to test whats going on here, I also have a pair of arctis 7's plugged in, they also work over a wireless dongle, they work, however i'm getting too much latency on those so i'm probably going to send them back and keep the Sony's as I dont want to constantly have to change latency settings.

!!! caution, off topic !!!! - finding some wireless headphones just for movies is a total nightmare, none of them seem to be able to do everything well :(

[mclingo]

Hi, I might have solved the latency issue on my artis 7's so dont bother with platinum issue. Thanks.

[VictorLS]

No, it does not.
Why you so sure?
I'm not sure you've tried ffplay.exe -vf weave,yadif=1 "Zee TV20180716-203544.ts" because only blind man not see the difference between ffplay and any players on ZEE TV logo - with ffplay it's normal but in players vertically stretched x2 it flickers like old Bob deinterlacing on ordinary SD MPEG2 or H264 interlaced streams.
There will be no manual hackery for HEVC interlaced, or trying to get separate fields to work. Either it adopts standard decoding, or it won't be supported.
I repeat - many modern TVsets already support streams like Zee TV20180716-203544.ts well so it's de facto standard for H265 interlaced video even if you don't know and/or it isn't on paper - so when such (mostly SD) videos will be often in Internet you'll have to return to this question in a future (like it was with "bad streams for nVIDIA DXVA" and you did CUVID for that working as I said but for Win7 and newer only) so why don't you do it now and question i.e. http://trac.ffmpeg.org/ticket/4141 (thanks clsid) will be closed?

[nevcairiel]

I'm so sure because I actually know how LAV and FFmpeg works. I could entirely repeat the previous post, but it would not make a difference. FFmpeg needs to properly support HEVC interlaced without custom filtering to fix it, there is nothing for LAV to do. I will most definitely not implement work-arounds that are slow and also just don't work with hardware decoding.

[VictorLS]

This is more clear - as I understand correctly you don't want do anything with it while ffmpeg not improved for correctly Zee TV20180716-203544.ts decoding without any "external" filters like weave?
I will most definitely not implement work-arounds that are slow and also just don't work with hardware decoding.
But interlaced are just SD and HD (as minimum from SATs) so even my old three-core AMD AthlonII x3 460 decodes them without hardware acceleration easily in MPEG2, H264 and H265.
May be implementing -vf function with automatic turning off hardware acceleration [i.e. rectangle where people can write any working ffmpeg filter (or comma-separated filters) in with check near it to activate and prefer it over other settings] in LAV Video Decoder will solve present (and may be many future various) issue?

[foxyshadis]

This is more clear - as I understand correctly you don't want do anything with it while ffmpeg not improved for correctly Zee TV20180716-203544.ts decoding without any "external" filters like weave?

But interlaced are just SD and HD (as minimum from SATs) so even my old three-core AMD AthlonII x3 460 decodes them without hardware acceleration easily in MPEG2, H264 and H265.
May be implementing -vf function with automatic turning off hardware acceleration [i.e. rectangle where people can write any working ffmpeg filter (or comma-separated filters) in with check near it to activate and prefer it over other settings] in LAV Video Decoder will solve present (and may be many future various) issue?

Dude, it's not going to happen, how many times do you need to be told it's not going to happen? Use ffplay with custom filtering to watch these and beg ffmpeg to support it, not nev, because he doesn't care. And for the most part, neither does anyone else outside of India; ZeeTV chose to use a backward format versus the entire rest of the world, so it won't get fixed until someone personally affected by it fixes it.

[VictorLS]

foxyshadis
How much time I have to say it's from SAT so I and many SAT amateurs need decoder (not player) - to watch such streams in maximum possible quality directly from SAT - not record from SAT (as it was with "bad streams")? And so h265 becomes standard de facto (SAT providers use it for ~ two times less bandwidth with comparable quality in h264) and not support interlaced streams in right way like h264 but SD and HD from SATs still interlaced for a long time ( so support such Zee TV streams (there is more than 20 channels from several Russian SAT providers and it grows up day by day) is question of the time. Besides it's very easy (compared to NVIDIA CUVID 10bit support was implemented too as I said but for Win7 and newer) to implement - "history is just spiral" )
As I told give people choice and they choose best.

[lvqcl]

How much time I have to say it's from SAT so I and many SAT amateurs need decoder (not player)

How much time people have to say to you that it doesn't matter.

[el Filou]

Victor, you just don't understand nev's position, do you?
LAV has to 'just work', and this exceptional case would not be compatible with that without a lot of work that is beyond LAV development philosophy, which is to just use ffmpeg 'as is' for software decoding.
While a lot of stuff used interlacing with AVC, including Blu-rays, interlaced HEVC is just too rare and for a reason because it's less efficient as it cannot use the interlace optimised coding tools AVC had. This is a mistake from your SAT provider, just because something is technically possible does not mean it is recommended, sometimes it's just an inefficient dirty trick, which this is. I doubt they're really getting the same quality for half the bandwidth with those interlaced-as-progressive HEVC streams.
So go ask ffmpeg to make the changes so that their HEVC software decoder outputs this particular case of HEVC as 1080i50 instead of 540p50, and then it will 'just work' with LAV in software decoding.
The ideal way to broadcast material that originated in 1080i50 with HEVC is to deinterlace it to 1080p50 before broadcasting it. You can ask your SAT provider to fix this.

Edit: here's the ticket you're interested in: https://trac.ffmpeg.org/ticket/5514

[YGPMOLE]

Hi folks!

Maybe I'm writing something stupid but, or I found a bug in LAV Video decoder and/or Pin Info, or I didn't understand how it works and I'll be glad if someone would explain to me.

On Windows 10 64 Bit I'm using MPC-BE with LAV Splitter/Video/Audio Decoder, madVR and (only for SD and HD resolution) FFDshow by SmoothVideo Project for frame rate conversion. The output resolution is 1920x1080@59.970 that madVR automatically change to 3840x2160 in case of UHD files.

Playing an HEVC 3840x2160@23.976 file with DXVA D3D11 in hardware decoding, the Pin Info shows the correct resolution both for input (from LAV Splitter) and output (to madVR). Changing to software decoding, the output Pin Info shows a resolution of 4096x2160@23.976 (that means 4x1024 and not 2x1920) to madVR.

I made the same try with a 1920x1080@23.976: Pin Info shows the same correct input/output resolution in hardware decoding, in software decoding the output file passed to FFDshow (using the frame Rate conversion of SmoothVideo Project) become 2048x1080@23.976 (2x1024 and not 1920x1080@59.970).
Without the frame rate conversion, the Pin Info shows an output file resolution of 1024x1080@23.976.

Seems that in software decoding the output file is based on multiplies of 1024 instead of 1920 (or the Pin info shows it). Am I wrong?

P.S. Sorry for the bad english and the possible mistakes (I'm not translating with Google, but learning to write).

Best Regards. Leo!

[huhn]

you are missing an important part of info here is the file displayed correctly or not.

having a bigger resolution (usually multiplier of 1024)shown in outpin is totally normal.

[YGPMOLE]

The images on video are ok, I have not problems.

But I was wondering (if what outpin shown it's true) why madVR have to do an extra unwanted scaling for everything that comes at 1024 (or multiplier) to 1920 (or multiplier), expecially when sources and display matches (i.e. blu-rays at 1920 and UHD at 3840). I though that LAV should leave the resolution untouchedÂ…


Another question, if you can help me: assuming that madVR does the resize and color space conversion in the best way it's possible (at least that's what I understood from madVR thread), what color space output I should set in LAV Filters to avoid multiplies conversions? I mean, I would like that everything goes to madVR untouched (both resolution and color space) and it does it's magic!

[nevcairiel]

There is no scaling. Its just a technical detail on how the image is transported to madVR.

[huhn]

Another question, if you can help me: assuming that madVR does the resize and color space conversion in the best way it's possible (at least that's what I understood from madVR thread), what color space output I should set in LAV Filters to avoid multiplies conversions? I mean, I would like that everything goes to madVR untouched (both resolution and color space) and it does it's magic!

defaults are fine you can tick AYUV for rare files that are decoded to that format and risk other renderer not working correctly. but 8 bit 4:4:4 is 8 bit 4.4:4 so YV24 should be perfectly fine.

[Megalith]

What are the benefits of "headless mode"?

Also, is it just me, or does deinterlacing not work with D3D11?

[huhn]

madVR doesn't support deinterlancing with d3d11 native and that's why i personally say don't use it.

the benefit of headless mode is you can use a GPU that is not correct to a display(headless) like a iGPU this is not possible with dxva.

[mclingo]

do we think D3D11 will ever support it?

[Snowknight26]

Pausing bitstreaming is always a bit of an issue, because the AVR loses the bitstream sync no matter what you do, and specifically in DirectShow as well, because the audio decoder doesn't really control any of that. The renderer might still be buffering data, so even if the decoder tries to reset the bitstream on un-pause, there is no guarantee that it would work.

Any possibility of debugging this? The latest release version of LAV Filters pretty much guarantees that when I pause the content, bitstreaming cuts out even after resuming. Sometimes takes up to 10 tries pause/resumes for my receiver to pick up the audio again.

[nevcairiel]

Any possibility of debugging this? The latest release version of LAV Filters pretty much guarantees that when I pause the content, bitstreaming cuts out even after resuming. Sometimes takes up to 10 tries pause/resumes for my receiver to pick up the audio again.

I can't reproduce that, and anything I tested that might theoretically make a difference just broke it here.

I would recommend trying a different audio renderer.

[SamuriHL]

do we think D3D11 will ever support it?

It's on madshi's list of things to do for madvr.

[Siso]

I'm sorry if it has been asked before, but when using reclock should the "Auto A/V sync correction" be on or off?

[nevcairiel]

You should basically never turn that off.

[Siso]

You should basically never turn that off.

Thank you, sir.

[mzso]

Hello!

I have long standing choppy playback, framedrop issues with specific channels using different DVB software (ProgDVB and SmartDVB) the same streams are affected. In SmartDVB's case changing to Microsoft's decoder fully fixes the problems. When I use LAV the problem is only avoided when I use CUVID, with every other decoder option I get the butchered video. (But I want to use cpu decoding)
Playing back recorded streams with MPC or Potplayer doesn't show any issues, but playing back with SmartDVB does. (here are some samples: https://drive.google.com/open?id=122xP_XrNB5zAewKrqbIl-IZi_qOFzF6H )

I'm at a loss as to why this happens. And so far the SmartDVB dev seems to be also. Any ideas?

[mkver]

The two sports videos switch between frame-MBAFF and individiual fields; two fields are in one PES packet in the transport stream and share the same timecode (in other words, only every second field has a timecode of its own (and ffmpeg is unable to make timecodes up)). The National Geographic video meanwhile uses field coded video. Two fields share the same timecode, too, but the bitstream contains dpb_output_delay information so that ffmpeg can infer the missing timestamps. Given that LAV is based upon ffmpeg, it, too, can probably infer the timestamps. So it seems that the only thing that these three files have in common is that part of them is field-encoded which is the likely suspect.
The sports channels use MBAFF-frames when the video is quite static and switch to field-based encoding when not. Given that you said (http://www.smartdvb.net/bb/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1673) that this only happens when the picture is un-static this confirms my above hypothesis that it is somehow the field-based nature of the source.

[el Filou]

When I use LAV the problem is only avoided when I use CUVID, with every other decoder option I get the butchered video. (But I want to use cpu decoding)What GPU?
This is strange because that would imply it's a video decoding problem, but you say using other splitter filters like MPC's or Potplayer's fix it.

I tried your samples with MediaPortal (which uses its own splitter for MPEG TS, not LAV) and an NVIDIA Pascal in DXVA2 copy-back, and playback is perfect.

Can you try forcing the use of SmartDVB's or ProgDVB's MPEG TS splitter filters in MPC or Potplayer to see if the problem happens too in that scenario?

[mzso]

What GPU?
This is strange because that would imply it's a video decoding problem, but you say using other splitter filters like MPC's or Potplayer's fix it.

I tried your samples with MediaPortal (which uses its own splitter for MPEG TS, not LAV) and an NVIDIA Pascal in DXVA2 copy-back, and playback is perfect.

Can you try forcing the use of SmartDVB's or ProgDVB's MPEG TS splitter filters in MPC or Potplayer to see if the problem happens too in that scenario?

Actually I meant that I use LAV (splitter, video, audio) with both mediaplayers and that way the playback is fine.
But now I realize that SmartDVB doesn't use LAV splitter (the icon doesn't appear) so maybe it's the issue with pdvb/sdvb splitter and LAV.

(Not sure if I can use their splitters from other apps, but I'll have a look.)

So it seems that the only thing that these three files have in common is that part of them is field-encoded which is the likely suspect.
The sports channels use MBAFF-frames when the video is quite static and switch to field-based encoding when not. Given that you said (http://www.smartdvb.net/bb/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1673) that this only happens when the picture is un-static this confirms my above hypothesis that it is somehow the field-based nature of the source.

Interesting. Seems like it, that switching to MBAFF borks something.
(So, if you monitor that forum you might have commented there then.)

[mkver]

Actually, both your sports samples are always MBAFF. MBAFF allows two types of coded pictures: Coded fields and coded frames; the latter can be coded with field or frame macroblocks on a per-macroblock basis. If your content is interlaced, but fairly static, then it is advantageous to use MBAFF frames. So there is no switch to MBAFF. And in case of the National Geographic documentary, there are no coded frames at all, just fields. So if this sample is also acting weird, then it is not really the switch that is the culprit, but just the usage of coded fields.
PS: I don't monitor said forum, I just searched and read the thread you refered to.

[Edit]: If you don't use LAV Splitter then it might be that the splitter keeps the two fields in the same packet, while LAV Decoder expects the two fields to be in separate packets. You could test this by remuxing your National Geographic video with ffmpeg to another transport stream.
[Edit2]: But actually, if one uses a splitter different than LAV Splitter, then the decoder is supposed (https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/blob/master/decoder/LAVVideo/decoders/avcodec.cpp#L320) to parse the packets again.

[mclingo]

hi, could do with some help, just lost surround sound on my arctis 7 headset and I cant work out why, the odd thing is its only affecting LAV audio. If I play a surround test file I only get left and right audio front and front height, i get silence from all other channels, center, surround left and right, happens with DTS and Dolby.

if I play the same file with VLC it summs everything fine to stereo as it should.

happens in both MPC and MPC-BE regardless of whether i'm bitreaming or not, cant work it out at all.

[mclingo]

probably an issue with the latest firmware, i've logged a ticket with steelseries, just odd its a LAV issue only, windows media player and VLC are working fine.

[huhn]

can you make a screen from lav audio status.

[mzso]

[Edit]: If you don't use LAV Splitter then it might be that the splitter keeps the two fields in the same packet, while LAV Decoder expects the two fields to be in separate packets. You could test this by remuxing your National Geographic video with ffmpeg to another transport stream.
[Edit2]: But actually, if one uses a splitter different than LAV Splitter, then the decoder is supposed (https://github.com/Nevcairiel/LAVFilters/blob/master/decoder/LAVVideo/decoders/avcodec.cpp#L320) to parse the packets again.

Hi!

So the conclusion of this is what?

[el Filou]

You need to keep trying combinations of splitters and video decoders.
Did you try adding the SmartDVB/ProgDVB splitter in Preferred mode to MPC's external filters (you need to uncheck the MPEG TS internal source filter first) to see if the same happens?

As I said, your samples play just fine with MediaPortal's own TS splitter and LAV, so if they don't with SmartDVB/ProgDVB it may be a problem with their splitters.
The source for MediaPortal's TS splitter is here, if it's of any interest to the developers of SmartDVB/ProgDVB (open source license terms apply of course...)
https://github.com/MediaPortal/MediaPortal-1/tree/master/DirectShowFilters/TsReader/source
(Edit: I tried attaching the .ax to the post so you can try it but it exceeds the file size limit even compressed in 7z. You can install MediaPortal 1 to try it, it registers the filter with the OS)

[mclingo]

can you make a screen from lav audio status.

Hi, what do you mean by lav audio status, which screen is this you want a shot of?

I think whats happening here is that windows is seeing the headphones as a 7.1 device correctly, the engineer3 sofware is then supposed to sum these channels into virtual 7.1 and then them to the headphones as a stereo feed as there are only two drivers, this bit is failing so i'm only getting the non summed audio, front stereo channels.

[huhn]

you play a file with 7.1 audio.
you open the filter lav audio
you go to status.

[mclingo]

ok, I hadnt realised. I was using MPC BE with MPC audio so no LAV status, this is what threw me, this also has the same problem so its not a LAV issue, again its odd though that VLC works fine.

I played it through MPC with external LAV filters and turned off bitstreaming so you can see the channels are full, just the headphones arent receiving them.


https://1drv.ms/u/s!AgvFafeelEBigP5VZ9WlXROVpqJ62g

[huhn]

it can now be assumed lavfilter has nothing todo with that.

so i will now point you out to the next part that can be the issue the audio renderer.

so feel free to make a thread about that.

[mclingo]

it can now be assumed lavfilter has nothing todo with that.

so i will now point you out to the next part that can be the issue the audio renderer.

so feel free to make a thread about that.

yeah, i'm going to wait to here back from steelseries first, hoping i can rollback the firmware or something, there are other issues with this headset and DTS mentioned on their reddit forum too so it must be connected to that.

cheers for your help.

[mclingo]

found a workaround, if I enable mixing and set LAV to stereo LAV sums everything, not ideal but it will do for now.

[mzso]

You need to keep trying combinations of splitters and video decoders.
Did you try adding the SmartDVB/ProgDVB splitter in Preferred mode to MPC's external filters (you need to uncheck the MPEG TS internal source filter first) to see if the same happens?

As I said, your samples play just fine with MediaPortal's own TS splitter and LAV, so if they don't with SmartDVB/ProgDVB it may be a problem with their splitters.
The source for MediaPortal's TS splitter is here, if it's of any interest to the developers of SmartDVB/ProgDVB (open source license terms apply of course...)
https://github.com/MediaPortal/MediaPortal-1/tree/master/DirectShowFilters/TsReader/source
(Edit: I tried attaching the .ax to the post so you can try it but it exceeds the file size limit even compressed in 7z. You can install MediaPortal 1 to try it, it registers the filter with the OS)

I can't seem to get MPC to use SmartDVB's filter (my best guess is that it's Smart AV Source Filter), but it would just keep on using the internal filter. (all source filters are unchecked in MPC)