Nero Releases FREE Reference Quality MPEG-4 Audio Command Line Encoder

[drew~y]

Hi, thanks for the encoder!

does it make use of dual core cpu's ?

[Inc]

The binary above imho only makes sense if we can make it work outputting 5.1 channels also for serving to the Nero aac binary.
No matter if using -o wav or -o wavdolby .... both do result in a wav of the same final size and channels (2).
PS: Yep, the Source was 5.1. ;)

[dohcmark8]

I am having trouble getting true CBR files out of the encoder.. I am using "-ignorelength -cbr 160000 -lc -if - -of %d" and when I play in Showtime it shows the bitrate constantly changing...

[Ivan Dimkovic]

AAC has bit-reservoir which is up to 12 kbits large for stereo files.

So even 'CBR' files can fluctate as long as fluctation does not violate the bit-buffer limits.

[fight2win]

what all files should i have in belight folder so that i can encode ac3 to aac using this new nero encoder?

[Kurtnoise]

BeSweet/BeLight doesn't support this encoder yet.

[fight2win]

ok, thanks.

[NWDaniels91]

I don't know who is correct, but at least there is some confusion that someone should clear up. From the Doom9 front page:

Nero has launched a free AAC audio encoder that does two pass encoding and supports all AAC extensions (HE, PS). The encoder is already supported in BeLight and will soon be integrated into MeGUI.

[FFWD]

Kurtnoise13 makes BeLight, not Doom9...

[Kurtnoise]

I think Doom9 has mixed up BeLight with BeHappy...;)

[cgrey]

* Support for Embedded Album Art (Covers, Booklets, Lyrics!)
* Store Entire Audio Album in a Single .mp4 File with all the Features of an Audio CD embedded inside, but at a fraction of the space!



Any documentation on these two features, and which player(s) support the second?

[zombi55]

I would like to know if there is a way to see the transcoding progress (the percentage or something as that) ?

[Rockaria]

@zombi55, if you integrate the encoder to foobar2k, as are quoted many times even in this thread, you will have a progress bar for 1(st) pass processing.

[Rockaria]

This earlier quoted new quality mode(-q) guideline :
Bitrate->Quality
15----->0.05
32----->0.15
63----->0.25
99----->0.35
146---->0.45
197---->0.55
248---->0.65
299---->0.75
350---->0.85
401---->0.95
is not representing the Pure Quality Grade which even a novice knows by instinct and won't expect it any longer.

The pure(100%) even quality mode should be unpredictable of the resultng bit rate(ABR == total bits/nSamples) or size at all, but can only be expressed as a 'ratio == target quality bitrate / perfect quality bitrate' when the perfect quality bit rate totally depends on the complexity of the stream.
For an example, over 90% of the fidelity of the voice clip can be attained with far less bit rate than that from the orchestra.
So my conclusion about the -q mode in this encoder is that it is a 'compromise' between the pure quality based VBR mode and pure ABR mode or in a word, bitrate based VBR mode.
I guess it's implemented as an extention of the pure ABR mode by extending the one second time frame(where we can apply the pure quality based VBR mode inside for the bit efficiency) to some bigger period(and we know this option/-period is touchable only by the coder).

If we extend the time frame, as an extreme, to the entire length of the clip, I guess that's what the encoder call -2pass -br.
And we also know the 2 pass mode is inevitable when the frame length is bigger than the buffer available for the smooth OS operation.
This is sort of a VBR mode deciding the target entire bit rate(ABR) first(bitrated based), then distributing the bits effectively for even quality inside.

So whatever reversed dialects we use, if the scenarios(policies) are similar to above, I guess the bit efficiency would look like : '-cbr<-br<(-q<)-br-longer frame<-br-2pass' for the similar bitrate. And I have no idea what the -2passperiod (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=225#entry390430) is used for.

[edit] related links
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=25#entry389216
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=824210&postcount=114
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44310
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=275#entry390684
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=825314#post825314
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=825612&postcount=193
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=300#entry391037

http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=823499&postcount=19
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=50#entry389236
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=75#entry389337
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=175#entry389869
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=225#entry390426

http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=823648&postcount=48
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=823923&postcount=99
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=823989&postcount=104
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=824236&postcount=118

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=100#entry389380

[menno]

Those bitrates were just given based on some tests over a set of files, to give an idea what kind of bitrate you can expect, on average.
The bitrate you will get on 1 file you encode depends only on the complexity of that 1 file. It IS pure quality based VBR.

[Ivan Dimkovic]

I am quite surprised by the ammount of wild speculations people could make, especially with regards to VBR :)

-q is a pure quality VBR mode - whoever doubts that, try compressing few tracks of different music nature with the same -q parameter, and you would notice that the bit-rate is quite different.

As Menno said - "average" bit rate per -q parameter is just a rough guideliness - measured on very large set of music, and the same guideliness exist for other quality-based VBR encoders, such as Ogg Vorbis and MPC.

Individual bit-rate could vary quite a lot, and in -q mode depends solely on psymodel

[FFWD]

Ivan, would you recommend 2-pass ABR or 1-pass VBR for feature length movie content? I am asking this because movies can contain large parts of speech and silence.

[Ivan Dimkovic]

I think this needs lots of testing - I would say that if movie contains lot of different passages, 2-pass would be definitely better than CBR/ABR.

Regarding the quality VBR vs. 2-pass - this will need some testing.

[zombi55]

@zombi55, if you integrate the encoder to foobar2k, as are quoted many times even in this thread, you will have a progress bar for 1(st) pass processing.

I don't use foobar2k. Anyway, it isn't well thinking from nero.

[shon3i]

Regarding the quality VBR vs. 2-pass - this will need some testing.Yes but we need test some real stuff like sound for movie not some short samples.

[Rockaria]

Glad Ivan is not using the ambiguous AVERAGES for the -2pass mode any more in this forum.:)

The reason for the 'speculations', 'FUD' or 'surprise' is quite obvious,
Although some knows(but obviously FUD in programming) want the majority to follow them without any doubt, blindedly, we cannot stop thinking and evaluating to find the best way to meet the individual needs with the tools where belongs the neroaacencoder.exe just as a candidate.

So the -q mode in this new encoder is same as old versions, then what is your feeling about the other stupid user speculations or Doubt on other options such as -br -2pass -2passperiod...

I couldn't find anywhere explaining them reasonably...

[Ivan Dimkovic]

So the -q mode in this new encoder is same as old versions, then what is your feeling about the other stupid user speculations or Doubt on other options such as -br -2pass -2passperiod...

I don't get :)

Quality-based VBR mode (-q) is of course not the same as in old AAC encoder, as now people have full freedom to specify any quality within the acceptable range, and not just few predefined presets (tape, radio, etc...) like in the old encoder.

Regarding -2passperiod - what is so confiusing there? -2passperiod tells encoder to average bit-rate in the user-specified time period, when the encoder runs in the 2-pass encoding mode

This option does not have any impact on single-pass quality-based VBR, as you can probably figure out by trying to enable it and observing the results.

Single-pass quality VBR (-q X) just allocates bits according to the psymodel - there is no "averaging" whatsoever - what was "averaged" in the HA guidelines is bit-rate for the large set of music material, just as the guideline how much you can expect a Q number to take bits, ON average (and certainly not per specific track).

Double-pass VBR (-br X -2pass) will average the bit-rate according to the user demand, specified by the -br switch

Double-pass VBR + -2passperiod (-br X -2pass -2passperiod Y) will do the same as above, but it will average the bit-rate in the specific period of time, that user can select

So encoding modes are:

1. CBR (or constant bit rate): -cbr XXXXXX bits/second
2. ABR (or average bit rate): -br XXXXXXX bits/second
3. Quality Based VBR (single-pass): -q X.XX (where X is the quality)
4. 2-Pass VBR which averages to user-specified bitrate: -br XXXXXX -2pass
5. 2-pass VBR which averages to user-specifiec bitrate over custom interval: -br XXXXXX -2pass -2passperiod YYYYYYY

As you can see - there are total 5 encoding modes of the new encoder - any other combination of the switches makes absolutely no sense - and if it works (e.g. -q and -2pass) it is a result of unpredictable behavior and will be disabled in the next release.

[Rockaria]

Surely you don't get.;)
The 'same' I meant for the -q is the basic mechanism not the more granular trivials.

.ABR (or average bit rate): -br XXXXXXX bits/second : it's a good progress, very clear.
.-2passperiod YYYYYYY : do you expect any benifit on this? and what's your guidelines?

Also don't you expect any benefit of the -period adjustment on the 1 pass -br? I have never been interested in -q -2pass, to be clear.

[Ivan Dimkovic]

As I said:


Regarding -2passperiod - what is so confiusing there? -2passperiod tells encoder to average bit-rate in the user-specified time period, when the encoder runs in the 2-pass encoding mode

So, -2passperiod has obviously no impact on any single-pass encoding mode.

Modes that work in the single encoding pass:

-cbr, -br, -q

Modes that work in the two-passes (1: analysis, 2: coding):

-br -2pass and -br -2pass -2passperiod

[Rockaria]

Hmm, thanks anyway. More user feedbacks will tell...
As I said earlier, I appreciated your contributions already.

[fakey]

what is so confiusing there?

...

So encoding modes are:

1. CBR (or constant bit rate): -cbr XXXXXX bits/second
2. ABR (or average bit rate): -br XXXXXXX bits/second
3. Quality Based VBR (single-pass): -q X.XX (where X is the quality)
4. 2-Pass VBR which averages to user-specified bitrate: -br XXXXXX -2pass
5. 2-pass VBR which averages to user-specifiec bitrate over custom interval: -br XXXXXX -2pass -2passperiod YYYYYYY

As you can see - there are total 5 encoding modes of the new encoder - any other combination of the switches makes absolutely no sense - and if it works (e.g. -q and -2pass) it is a result of unpredictable behavior and will be disabled in the next release.

I think that's the part which caused this confusion.

Let me try to clear things up in more easy-to-understand terms,

[-cbr] Constant BitRate mode with bit reservoir

[-br] ABR mode

[-q] quality based VBR mode
(something behaves like --crf mode of x264)

[-2pass -br] Bitrate based VBR mode
(VBR mode with target bitrate, just as 2pass mode in DivX, XviD or x264)

[-2passperiod] ABR mode with user specific averaging period

In this way, "-2pass -q mode doesn't make sense" statement makes sense, which is meant to do quality based 2pass encodings.

Is that right?

[Ivan Dimkovic]

Yes, correct and thanks for the clarifications :)

When you set encoder to -q mode (quality based VBR) you basically force the encoder just to look at psymodel and nothing else.

So, -q mode in conjuction with 2-pass does not make too much sense.

[obieobieobie]

Thank you, Ivan and Nero for this encoder. I just encoded a song for my mobile from a 4 MB MP3 to a 2.5 MB MP4.

Yeah, yeah, I know.. Lossy-lossy bad, but this is a mobile phone and it still sounded good. :)

[buzzqw]

@Ivan Dimkovic

i need (:thanks:) for a gui the max and min bitrate for cbr/br in combination with with lc/he/hev2 and for 2ch and 5ch.

THANKS !

BHH

[buzzqw]

@Inc

Will be possible to correct a52dec.exe or azid.exe to give a correct 5.1 stdout output ?

since lame/oggenc/neroaacenc support stdin this could be a quite fast way of encoding.

BHH

[Naito]

As the first I apologize for my bad English.

I made a Performance-Test aacenc32.dll 3.2.0.30 vs. CLI-Encoder 01.05.2006 (http://forum.gleitz.info/showpost.php?p=268361&postcount=34) in the Doom9 | Gleitz-Forum (Sorry, only into German available).

My English is too bad, but I already ask someone to the translating the results into English (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=826682#post826682). Up to then I hope that the results also understandable. Please to pay attention to the diagramms (completely diagramms available in the attachment).

Particularly interesting is the q-Setting, that lies between the q-Setting with HE force and the q-Setting with LC force. Maybe, the Setting did somewhat to merge HE and LC (I like to call it "Hybrid").

With misunderstandings, ask please. I hope to answer then.

EDIT: False statement about the Hybrid! See below.

[Ivan Dimkovic]

I am sorry, but there is no "Hybrid HE+LC" mode - encoder either does LC, or it does HE - and there is nothing in between :)

[Skuto]

Particularly interesting is the q-Setting, that lies between the q-Setting with HE force and the q-Setting with LC force. Maybe, the Setting did somewhat to merge HE and LC (I like to call it "Hybrid").


You seem to seriously misunderstand something.

HE-AAC is an extension on top of LC-AAC. Every HE-AAC is hence also an LC-AAC encode. Every LC-AAC decoder (including the ones who have never heard of HE-AAC) can play back HE-AAC for this reason, although they will be missing the high frequency part if they don't understand the HE-AAC extension (if they fail, they are by definition broken and not AAC compatible).

There is no such thing as a "hybrid" mode. It's either LC-AAC, or LC-AAC+SBR (called HE-AAC).


Wenn die Datei als HE-AAC erkannt wird, müssten ständig die SBR-Frequenzen reproduziert werden, obwohl die im LC-Abschnitt schon vorhanden sind.


This is incorrect. The LC mode will never contain any frequencies which are reproduced by SBR. That would be entirely redundant and hence useless.


Ich hoffe, das Nero den Decoder als OpenSource freigibt.


Like this http://www.audiocoding.com/ ?

[Naito]

@ Ivan Dimkovic
Can you explain please how the reseluts "VBR (free)" in the diagram comes? I don't understand it.

[Ivan Dimkovic]

As I don't really undestand German that well - I don't really know what is questionable here.

In the current encoder (and that might change):

For q modes < 0.31 - we use HE-AAC
For q modes >= 0.31 - we use LC-AAC

There is nothing in between really :)

[Dark-Cracker]

is there a way to made it work with an avs input ? (pipe or somethink ?)

++

[Naito]

@ Ivan Dimkovic

Ok, I will correct my statements.

EDIT: Q: If the Encoder switch q > 0.31 from HE-AAC to LC-AAC, the "VBR (free)" and "LC (force)" must be identical. But it isn't. (Not on the same line, it It approaches on only.) Why?

[Skuto]

-q scale is different if you force the encoder to some mode.

If you look at your graph, it has to be, or there would be no way to encode at 200-400kbps....

[Naito]

So -q use encodertweaks, they are not used with force LC (-q -lc) or force HE (-q -he)? That could explain something.

[LoRd_MuldeR]

My first attempt to make a simple GUI for neroAacEnc.exe is here:
http://mulder.dummwiedeutsch.de/pub/downloads/testing/neroAacEncGUI.2006-05-10.7z

:)


http://img489.imageshack.us/img489/3484/neroaaacenc5xj.png

[tebasuna51]

is there a way to made it work with an avs input ? (pipe or somethink ?)
Maybe:

bepipe --script "Import(^Audio.avs^)" | neroAacEnc.exe -cbr 224000 -if - -of "output.m4a"

EDIT: Work also with 5.1 48 KHz 130 min. (wav equivalent > 4 GB), using -ignorelength switch.

[[)370|\|470!2]

Getting overbitrate when encoding 5.1 wav -cbr 448000
i get approx 490 kbps avg in resulting file.

[Rockaria]

I think that's the part which caused this confusion.

Let me try to clear things up in more easy-to-understand terms,

[-cbr] Constant BitRate mode with bit reservoir

[-br] ABR mode

[-q] quality based VBR mode
(something behaves like --crf mode of x264)

[-2pass -br] Bitrate based VBR mode
(VBR mode with target bitrate, just as 2pass mode in DivX, XviD or x264)

[-2passperiod] ABR mode with user specific averaging period

In this way, "-2pass -q mode doesn't make sense" statement makes sense, which is meant to do quality based 2pass encodings.

Is that right?
Finally, my familiar words...:goodpost:

I agree in general but with just some reminds :

. in order to be called as ABR the interval should be 1 sec, equal amount of allocated bits to distribute inside of each unit, by current definition, otherwise, I'd call it as VBR like CBR when it is technically ABR.

. when the -2passperiod is possible, so should be -1passperiod logically for the -br, which is just adding/adjusting some more intervals on the units possibly to improve the distribution quality.

. the averaging(distributing) with the target bitrate actually happens on all the modes except the -q mode theoretically, which of course, does not fully qualify the mode to be ABR.

[SeeMoreDigital]

My first attempt to make a simple GUI for neroAacEnc.exe

http://img489.imageshack.us/img489/3484/neroaaacenc5xj.pngHey... It's not bad :)

How about starting a separate thread for it?


Cheers

[LoRd_MuldeR]

imcold already startet a thread for his tool.
Do we really need another one for mine?

// EDIT

Update:
http://mulder.dummwiedeutsch.de/pub/downloads/testing/neroAacEncGUI.2006-05-10.7z

[fakey]

. in order to be called as ABR the interval should be 1 sec, equal amount of allocated bits to distribute inside of each unit, by current definition, otherwise, I'd call it as VBR like CBR when it is technically ABR.

. when the -2passperiod is possible, so should be -1passperiod logically for the -br, which is just adding/adjusting some more intervals on the units possibly to improve the distribution quality.

. the averaging(distributing) with the target bitrate actually happens on all the modes except the -q mode theoretically, which of course, does not fully qualify the mode to be ABR.



Yeah, that's why I thought we would need some clarification in familiar words.

Here or at HA forum, nero guys seems like saying 2pass bitrate-based VBR as ABR*.

Actually Garf is referring to DivX/XviD 2pass thingie also as ABR.
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275&st=50&p=389236&#entry389236

This can be right in a way that average bitrate converges around some target bitrate, but does not agree to our convention or definition of what is VBR/ABR.

I'm not willing to claim they are totally wrong, but quite confusing at least.:confused:

I think this is just a small mistake in selecting the word.

OTOH I agree with you in technical definition.

But in AAC, even CBR has a bit reservoir bigger than MP3's thus quite often said to be a kind of ABR (in conventional point of view).

So, maybe it's time we need to expand or revise the definition of ABR (averaging) interval (1 second).

The encoder has already functions there.

And it's compliant to the MPEG Audio specification.

We can adjust the interval to be other than 1 sec and I think what we need is to understand and make decent use of the feature.

Anyway ABR was just compromise between VBR and CBR.

Things are that we can have more flexibility in AAC ABR(or neroAAC ABR).


In conclusion, VBR can distribute bits across the whole length, and ABR needs to average at some points.


*1pass ABR is no problem here.

[deets]

hmm, any wav i extract from my DVD (converted 5.1 ac3) say they cannot be parsed :(

wav extracted from audio cd works just fine

edit: seem to work if i use belight to convert the ac3 to wav and not virtualdub :)

[Rockaria]

I'm not willing to claim they are totally wrong, but quite confusing at least.
So, maybe it's time we need to expand or revise the definition of ABR (averaging) interval (1 second).
*1pass ABR is no problem here.I agree.:cool:

But the current modes are measured by bps. So as far as the Second(possibly streaming?) is engaged, unfortunately we are not gonna be free from this dialects confusions.

Anyway, I have no problem wearing a mapping table(interpreter). But watching themselves using different norms for the same thing had been really confusing (for the INTERESTS in the tiny/big tool)...

The trend I am reading is that the guys are trying to make it INTELLIGENT : Black Boxed : you choose the tool and we will move your focus entirely out of it, no worry...no AAC-HE-VBR but just ND.

I have been a person who failed to adapt myself to the adaptive programming..
Which is so sur/sub-realistic that awakening myself through the understanding the whole mechanism based on the five generic factors could have been far easier.

I don't believe the intelligence of codes too much as it will save us time significantly or free us from the worry at all.
Maybe it can help us, if it ever happens, eventually become totally neutralized : disarmed for being equipped, no toys.

My belief is : I plan, orgarnize and play with all the flexibility, the tools(components) do the simple things reliably, because it's simple, no big brother.

[Naito]

lousy translation made by Redfox (no, I don't have an english spell-cecker installed on my machine)
Last weekend I (Naito) showed my AMD-Duron 800 how it feels to be a Calculator. Alltogetter, it had to encode 32h and 15min Audio into AAC. After Neros release of the AAC-CLI-Encoder I decided to make some exausive testing. The following Spreedsheds containing the results.

1. Testsystem

AMD Duron @ 832MHz with 512MB SD-RAM
Windows XP Professional incl. SP 2 (no Patches)
Nero aacenc32.dll 3.2.0.30 (from Nero 6.6.1.4)
Nero AAC-CLI-Encoder 01.05.2006
BeSweet 1.51 Beta31
foobar2000 0.9.1 with AC3-Plugin 0.7 (foo_ac3.dll)


2. Test Conditions

I used BeSweet to transcode with aaenc32.dll.
The Commandline locked like that:
"BeSweet.exe -core( -input AC3.ac3 -output Art-Profil.mp4 -logfile Art-Profil.log ) -bsn( -6chnew -vbr_Profil -codecquality_high -aacprofile_Art)"
'Art' means LC or HE. Profil reachs from Tape till Transcoding.
For transcoding of VBR with the AAC-CLI-Encoder I useed foobar2000.
- The commandline for 'forsed' LC or HE locked like this:
HE (force): "-ignorelength -he -q 0.xx -if - -of %d"
LC (force): "-ignorelength -lc -q 0.xx -if - -of %d"
- The commandline for 'free' VBR locked like this:
VBR (free): "-ignorelength -q 0.xx -if - -of %d"
Replace 'xx' with the certain values. The "-" tells foobar2000 to use a pipe.
For the ABR-Transcoding I converted AC3 with BeSweet into DD-WAV and feeded the AAC-CLI-Encoder with a Batch-File.
For 5.1@2.0 I used the DSP in foobar2000 activated and the same Commandlineparameter like for 5.1
The sourcefile was the german soundtrack of „Ghost in the Shell ~ Stand Alone Complex – Episode 01“.
bitrate = 448
codec = ATSC A/52
channels = 6
samplerate = 48000
----------
72388608 samples @ 48000Hz = 25:08.096 (Length)
File size: 84 453 376 bytes = 80,5 MB

3.1 Results: 5.1-Test (the interesting stuff is at the bottom)

| aacenc32.dll 3.2.0.30 | CLI (free) : CLI (force) | CLI |
| Profil HE LC LC/HE | VBR Hybrid : VBR HE LC LC/HE | ABR 2pass Abw. |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Tape 109 155 1,42 | 0.10 not : 0.10 81 165 2,04 | 100 104 1,04% |
% | 24,3% 34,6% | possib. : 18,1% 36,8% | HE 23,2% |
Size (MB) | 19,74 28,23 | : 14,68 29,98 | 18,80 |
Speed | 0,85 0,84 | : 1,41 0,88 | 0,82 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Radio 129 203 1,57 | 0.15 101 : 0.15 117 224 1,91 | 125 126 1,01% |
% | 28,8% 45,3% | HE 22,5% : 26,1% 50,0% | HE 28,1% |
Size (MB) | 23,33 36,80 | 18,33 : 21,16 40,52 | 22,82 |
Speed | 0,85 0,80 | 1,13 : 1,23 0,87 | 0,81 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Internet 140 307 2,19 | 0.20 145 : 0.20 153 286 1,87 | 150 150 1,00% |
% | 31,3% 68,5% | HE 32,4% : 34,2% 63,8% | HE 33,5% |
Size (MB) | 25,34 55,44 | 26,19 : 27,69 51,78 | 27,10 |
Speed | 0,85 0,72 | 1,18 : 1,19 0,82 | 0,74 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Streaming 172 381 2,22 | 0.25 190 : 0.25 191 347 1,82 | 175 176 1,01% |
% | 38,4% 85,0% | HE 42,4% : 42,6% 77,5% | HE 39,3% |
Size (MB) | 31,10 68,75 | 34,25 : 34,52 62,57 | 31,82 |
Speed | 0,81 0,68 | 1,25 : 1,16 0,82 | 0,73 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Normal 190 485 2,55 | 0.30 234 : 0.30 228 405 1,78 | 200 198 0,99% |
% | 42,4% 108,3% | HE 52,2% : 50,9% 90,4% | HE 44,2% |
Size (MB) | 34,31 87,51 | 42,17 : 41,10 73,17 | 35,78 |
Speed | 0,79 0,58 | 1,19 : 1,16 0,84 | 0,73 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Extreme 273 625 2,29 | 0.31 263 : 0.31 235 417 1,77 | 225 219 0,97% |
% | 60,9% 139,5% | LC 58,7% : 52,5% 93,1% | HE 48,9% |
Size (MB) | 49,26 112,61 | 47,53 : 42,43 75,27 | 0,32 |
Speed | 0,76 0,44 | 0,73 : 1,12 0,81 | |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Audiophile 308 646 2,10 | 0.35 320 : 0.35 264 470 1,78 | 250 242 0,97% |
% | 68,8% 144,2% | LC 71,4% : 58,9% 104,9% | HE 54,0% |
Size (MB) | 55,58 116,36 | 57,82 : 47,64 84,70 | 43,71 |
Speed | 0,79 0,46 | 0,82 : 1,32 0,83 | 0,74 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | Transcoding 339 744 2,19 | 0.40 390 : 0.40 299 528 1,77 | 275 274 1,00% |
% | 75,7% 166,1% | LC 87,1% : 66,7% 117,9% | LC 61,2% |
Size (MB) | 61,00 134,09 | 70,42 : 53,92 95,19 | 49,61 |
Speed | 0,77 0,55 | 0,79 : 1,23 0,84 | 0,50 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | | 0.45 465 : 0.45 334 586 1,75 | 300 293 0,98% |
% | | LC 103,8% : 74,6% 130,8% | LC 65,4% |
Size (MB) | | 83,93 : 60,21 105,57 | 52,91 |
Speed | | 0,81 : 1,26 0,85 | 0,51 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | | 0.49 521 : 0.49 362 633 1,75 | 325 315 0,97% |
% | | LC 116,3% : 80,8% 141,3% | LC 70,3% |
Size (MB) | | 93,92 : 65,26 114,08 | 56,83 |
Speed | | 0,84 : 1,28 0,81 | 0,51 |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-----------------------:-------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | | 0.50 535 : 0.50 not 644 | 350 337 0,96% |
% | | LC 119,4% : possib. 143,8% | LC 75,2% |
Size (MB) | | 96,39 : 116,14 | 0,31 |
Speed | | 0,84 : 0,84 | |
----------------|---------------------------------------|-------------------------------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | ; . | 375 348 0,93% |
% | ; . | LC 77,7% |
Size (MB) | ; . | 0,31 |
Speed | ; . | |
----------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | ; . | 400 367 0,92% |
% | ; . | LC 81,9% |
Size (MB) | ; . | 0,31 |
Speed | ; . | |
----------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | ; . | 425 389 0,92% |
% | ; . | LC 86,8% |
Size (MB) | ; . | 0,31 |
Speed | ; . | |
----------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|-------------------------------|
kbps | ; . | 450 410 0,91% |
% | ; . | LC 91,5% |
Size (MB) | ; . | 0,31 |
Speed | ; . | |
----------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|-------------------------------|
. . . .
. . . .
aprox. Speed/ kbps 0,81 0,63 2,07 . 0,96 . 1,24 0,84 1,85 . 0,59 .
standartdevation 0,04 0,15 0,38 . 0,20 . 0,09 0,02 0,10 . 0,20 .
aprox. overhead 0,19% 0,35% . 0,26% . 0,20% 0,35% . 0,28% 0,97% .




The Deviation of the Bitrate is around 2%.
0.00 <= 0.15 is HEv2; 0.16 <= 0.30 is HE; 0.31 <= 1.00 is LC
ABR: 100kbps = 100.000bps

Note that the standartdevation is the root from the vary, but Excel calculates them wrong. So better be carefull with those values. I didn't corected those results because they don't matter statisticly. The are just for your orientation. The avertage Overhad is calculated by the percentage part of the filesize minus the percentage of the bitrate(You can find the values in an attachment at the original posting)

3.2 Results: 5.1@2.0

| CLI (free) | CLI (force) |
| VBR Hybrid 5.1/2.0 | VBR HE 5.1/2.0 : LC 5.1/2.0 ' LC/HE |
----------------|-----------------------|-------------------------------------------------------|
kbps | 0.10 24 not | 0.10 22 3,68 : 40 4,13 ' 1,82 |
Size (MB) | 4,50 possible| 4,03 3,64 : 7,46 4,02 ' |
Speed | 4,51 | 3,41 : 2,54 ' |
----------------|-----------------------|-------------------------------------------------------|
kbps | 0.20 42 3,45 | 0.20 44 3,48 : 79 3,62 ' 1,80 |
Size (MB) | 7,64 3,43 | 8,00 3,46 : 14,40 3,60 ' |
Speed | 2,86 | 2,87 : 2,11 ' |
----------------|-----------------------|-------------------------------------------------------|
kbps | 0.30 69 3,39 | 0.30 68 3,35 : 113 3,58 ' 1,66 |
Size (MB) | 12,60 3,77 | 12,33 3,33 : 20,61 3,55 ' |
Speed | 2,80 | 2,89 : 2,12 ' |
----------------|-----------------------|-------------------------------------------------------|
kbps | 0.40 109 3,58 | 0.40 86 3,48 : 140 3,77 ' 1,63 |
Size (MB) | 19,87 3,54 | 15,59 3,46 : 25,41 3,75 ' |
Speed | 2,16 | 2,97 : 2,12 ' |
----------------|-----------------------|-------------------------------------------------------|
kbps | 0.50 141 3,79 | 0.50 102 not : 186 3,46 ' 1,82 |
Size (MB) | 25,71 3,75 | 18,51 possible : 33,69 3,45 ' |
Speed | 2,07 | 2,83 : 2,10 ' |
----------------|-----------------------|-------------------------------------------------------|
. . ' .
. . ' .
average (kbps) 3,55 . 3,50 . 3,71 ' 1,75 .
standartdeviation (kbps) 0,18 . 0,14 . 0,26 ' 0,09 .
average (MB) 3,62 . 3,47 . 3,67 ' .
standartdeviation (MB) 0,17 . 0,13 . 0,22 ' .

4.Appraisal of Results

The optinization is most noticeable with LC at multichannel. While 3.2.0.0.30 LC is aprox. 2,1-times bigger then HE, the improvement with the CLI-Encoder is stronger noticeable (aprox. 1,85).
It is interesting that an 5.1 encode is aprox. 3,5 times bigger then an similer 2.0. This might indicate an insufficient channelcuppling.
HE is only posible till „-q 0.49“, with values above Nero displays an error and refuses to encode.
The 'free'-VBR-Modus (-q 0.xx without -lc or -he switch)is quite interesting. The bitrates here are very differend then with forced switchs (internal encoder-optimasions around the psychacusic-model, please note this! (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=44275&view=findpost&p=391037)) We have to use liesening-tests to figure out what modus offers the best Audio quality) But you shuldnt force the switchs without an good reason.


http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/1640/neroaaccliencoder01052006gerad.th.png
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/3734/neroaacenc32dll320303mm.th.png

Bysides, if somebody asks hiself „Why is he doing this?“. Plain simple, its fun for me.

The attachment (in german) contains screenshots, grafics, spreadsheets, batch-files and logs. (foobar2000 was 'handmade')
Attachment (http://forum.gleitz.info/attachment.php?attachmentid=78390&d=1147181169)

_____

Many thanks to Redfox for translation.

[elmimmo]

* Support for Embedded Album Art (Covers, Booklets, Lyrics!)
* Store Entire Audio Album in a Single .mp4 File with all the Features of an Audio CD embedded inside, but at a fraction of the space!Any documentation on these two features, and which player(s) support the second?I concur. Ivan, could you please expand on how that works?