Mpeg 4 Aac Plus

symonjfox · 8th April 2003, 20:17

Hi, Ahead is releasing their new software for MPEG4.
http://nerodigital.com/press120303.html

I have a simple question: why ahead has the only one AAC and AAC Plus encoder? (I know about FAAC and Psytel, but nero AAC is an evolution of them since the author is the same, also has better speed and better quality).

Aren't there any other (maybe freeware or opensource) implementation of such codecs?

Thanks for the replies.

tiki4 · 9th April 2003, 11:58

I don't think so at the moment. FAAC is an open source AAC encoder developed at Sourceforge, but the author Menno is also working for Ahead now (together with Ivan). Some people at HA say, that quality has very much improved the last months. So maybe you try that for yourself. Of course it cannot do AACplus as this would involve SBR which is patented by Thomson. However Ahead said they will release a capable encoder (but there is no decoder as far as I know). Other encoders are Quicktime Pro but the quality is worse than FAAC I think. However the Nero plugin is pretty well (bought it last week) and it's a natural evolution of Psytel AAC. I'm pretty much interested in AAC multichannel but there's still no DirectShow decoder and Nero Plugin manager can't handel multichannel WAV files as input

Regards,

tiki4

rjamorim · 9th April 2003, 20:57

Quote:

Originally posted by symonjfox
I have a simple question: why ahead has the only one AAC and AAC Plus encoder?

So far! Wait some time, and other implementations will appear.

AAC+ has just recently been standardized. Ivan was able to deliver the codec so soon because he and Menno were working since last year, based on MPEG drafts.

Quote:

Aren't there any other (maybe freeware or opensource) implementation of such codecs?

Hopefully soon. It's too soon to expect anything, really.

rjamorim · 9th April 2003, 21:03

Quote:

Originally posted by tiki4
I don't think so at the moment. FAAC is an open source AAC encoder developed at Sourceforge, but the author Menno is also working for Ahead now (together with Ivan). Some people at HA say, that quality has very much improved the last months. So maybe you try that for yourself.

Actually, FAAC quality is still bad. It's even worse than well tuned MP3 encoders, like Lame and FhG.

Quote:

Of course it cannot do AACplus as this would involve SBR which is patented by Thomson.

Well, nearly all technologies in AAC are patented by someone.

It doesn't do AACplus yet because it's still to early. Probably someone will come up with a SBR encoder for FAAC soon. All you need to do that are the specifications, and some reference sources from MPEG.

Quote:

However Ahead said they will release a capable encoder (but there is no decoder as far as I know).

They will release the decoder along as part of Nero Digital.

Quote:

Other encoders are Quicktime Pro but the quality is worse than FAAC I think.

No. QuickTime has very good quality, but it's still worse than Psytel/Ahead and FhG, because it's the FhG code tweaked for speed by Dolby.

Quote:

I'm pretty much interested in AAC multichannel but there's still no DirectShow decoder and Nero Plugin manager can't handel multichannel WAV files as input

Ivan is always promising a fix to that "in next release", but it seems things inside Ahead don't go that fast. :-P
(He isn't in charge of dealing with the plugin manager, so there's not much he can do besides begging to the guy in charge)

About the DS filters: There's NIC's "crappy beta" available at my site. I think it can decode multichannel.

Regards;

Roberto.

tiki4 · 10th April 2003, 08:10

Hi Roberto,

Nic's DS filter is maybe working with multichannel (didn't test that), but seeking is definitely broken. I put an AAC stream into OGM container recently, you can't seek in the movie as audio / video get out of sync. By the way, it's the same problem with 3ivx DS filters and MP4 container ;(

tiki4

rjamorim · 10th April 2003, 19:58

Hello, tiki4

Quote:

Originally posted by tiki4
Nic's DS filter is maybe working with multichannel (didn't test that), but seeking is definitely broken. I put an AAC stream into OGM container recently, you can't seek in the movie as audio / video get out of sync. By the way, it's the same problem with 3ivx DS filters and MP4 container ;(

That sucks. Maybe that's why his filter is called "Crappy beta".

ChristianHJW · 11th April 2003, 02:43

Quote:

Originally posted by tiki4 I put an AAC stream into OGM container recently

How may i ask ? Is there a tool to add a WAV header to an AAC stream ? Maybe also done by Nic ? Did i miss that ?

BoNz1 · 11th April 2003, 04:27

I believe koepi's oggmux allows for this at least I remember seeing .aac when you open a audio file to mux.

tiki4 · 11th April 2003, 08:12

No,

Koepi's OggMux doesn't allow to mux AAC though it is shown in the supported formats. There is no AAC DS source filter AFAIK.

Putting AAC in OGM is quity easy: You take AAC2WAV from Nic's 'crappy beta' package and give that thing a WAV header. Then you can mux that file with ogmuxer on the command line (maybe that's also possible with VirtualDubMod by now). Alternatively you should also be able to add the WAV header with latest BeSplit (-addriff). Decoding is done by Nic's AAC DS filter.

tiki4

bond · 19th June 2003, 17:21

great news for everyone who waits for aac+ (or officially called "High Efficiency AAC"):
AAC+ (High Efficiency) from Ahead will be released on 18 July (included in Nero 6)!
for more information look here

here are the results of a first small listening test:

more information about the test on hydrogenaudio

bond · 22nd June 2003, 09:55

although nobody really seems to be interested there are great news also on the aac+ decoding side:
the ahead sbr decoding source will be included in a new faad2 2.0 so everybody can be sure that he/she can use aac+ sound in their matroska (and maybe .ogm in the future) files (of course together with updated coreaac)!
read more here

symonjfox · 22nd June 2003, 12:13

It's a very good news

Let's wait 1 month so ...

bond · 22nd June 2003, 15:19

Quote:

Originally posted by symonjfox
Let's wait 1 month so ... [/B]

26 days

tiki4 · 23rd June 2003, 08:39

Thanks to Ahead, now it comes really in handy that I bought a Nero serial number just a few days before the announcement of Nero 6.0 and that all people who bought 5.5 after 1st of May will get a serial for the new for free. That's really good news. Now maybe I really start to like Matroska...

tiki4

8th April 2003, 20:17	#1 \| Link
symonjfox IUUULEEEENZ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Italy Posts: 452	Mpeg 4 Aac Plus Hi, Ahead is releasing their new software for MPEG4. http://nerodigital.com/press120303.html I have a simple question: why ahead has the only one AAC and AAC Plus encoder? (I know about FAAC and Psytel, but nero AAC is an evolution of them since the author is the same, also has better speed and better quality). Aren't there any other (maybe freeware or opensource) implementation of such codecs? Thanks for the replies. __________________ PC1:AMD Athlon II x4, 4GB DDR2, Ati Radeon 4830, 4 hard disks

19th June 2003, 17:21	#10 \| Link
bond Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 9,770	great news for everyone who waits for aac+ (or officially called "High Efficiency AAC"): AAC+ (High Efficiency) from Ahead will be released on 18 July (included in Nero 6)! for more information look here here are the results of a first small listening test: more information about the test on hydrogenaudio __________________ Between the weak and the strong one it is the freedom which oppresses and the law that liberates (Jean Jacques Rousseau) I know, that I know nothing (Socrates) MPEG-4 ASP FAQ \| AVC/H.264 FAQ \| AAC FAQ \| MP4 FAQ \| MP4Menu stores DVD Menus in MP4 (guide) Ogg Theora \| Ogg Vorbis use WM9 today and get Micro$oft controlling the A/V market tomorrow for free Last edited by bond; 19th June 2003 at 18:00.

22nd June 2003, 09:55	#11 \| Link
bond Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 9,770	although nobody really seems to be interested there are great news also on the aac+ decoding side: the ahead sbr decoding source will be included in a new faad2 2.0 so everybody can be sure that he/she can use aac+ sound in their matroska (and maybe .ogm in the future) files (of course together with updated coreaac)! read more here __________________ Between the weak and the strong one it is the freedom which oppresses and the law that liberates (Jean Jacques Rousseau) I know, that I know nothing (Socrates) MPEG-4 ASP FAQ \| AVC/H.264 FAQ \| AAC FAQ \| MP4 FAQ \| MP4Menu stores DVD Menus in MP4 (guide) Ogg Theora \| Ogg Vorbis use WM9 today and get Micro$oft controlling the A/V market tomorrow for free Last edited by bond; 22nd June 2003 at 15:19.

22nd June 2003, 12:13	#12 \| Link
symonjfox IUUULEEEENZ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Italy Posts: 452	It's a very good news Let's wait 1 month so ... __________________ PC1:AMD Athlon II x4, 4GB DDR2, Ati Radeon 4830, 4 hard disks

9th April 2003, 11:58	#2 \| Link
tiki4 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Who Knows? Posts: 929	I don't think so at the moment. FAAC is an open source AAC encoder developed at Sourceforge, but the author Menno is also working for Ahead now (together with Ivan). Some people at HA say, that quality has very much improved the last months. So maybe you try that for yourself. Of course it cannot do AACplus as this would involve SBR which is patented by Thomson. However Ahead said they will release a capable encoder (but there is no decoder as far as I know). Other encoders are Quicktime Pro but the quality is worse than FAAC I think. However the Nero plugin is pretty well (bought it last week) and it's a natural evolution of Psytel AAC. I'm pretty much interested in AAC multichannel but there's still no DirectShow decoder and Nero Plugin manager can't handel multichannel WAV files as input Regards, tiki4

10th April 2003, 08:10	#5 \| Link
tiki4 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Who Knows? Posts: 929	Hi Roberto, Nic's DS filter is maybe working with multichannel (didn't test that), but seeking is definitely broken. I put an AAC stream into OGM container recently, you can't seek in the movie as audio / video get out of sync. By the way, it's the same problem with 3ivx DS filters and MP4 container ;( tiki4

11th April 2003, 04:27	#8 \| Link
BoNz1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Great White North Posts: 522	I believe koepi's oggmux allows for this at least I remember seeing .aac when you open a audio file to mux.

11th April 2003, 08:12	#9 \| Link
tiki4 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Who Knows? Posts: 929	No, Koepi's OggMux doesn't allow to mux AAC though it is shown in the supported formats. There is no AAC DS source filter AFAIK. Putting AAC in OGM is quity easy: You take AAC2WAV from Nic's 'crappy beta' package and give that thing a WAV header. Then you can mux that file with ogmuxer on the command line (maybe that's also possible with VirtualDubMod by now). Alternatively you should also be able to add the WAV header with latest BeSplit (-addriff). Decoding is done by Nic's AAC DS filter. tiki4

23rd June 2003, 08:39	#14 \| Link
tiki4 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Who Knows? Posts: 929	Thanks to Ahead, now it comes really in handy that I bought a Nero serial number just a few days before the announcement of Nero 6.0 and that all people who bought 5.5 after 1st of May will get a serial for the new for free. That's really good news. Now maybe I really start to like Matroska... tiki4