converting subs frm pal to ntsc

[Dvd@Best]

Hi ,
I am converting my pal dvd in to ntsc 1:1 which means all menus and all subtitle i am going to keep so i will need to convert everything to ntsc i-e 23.976fps
so far i am done with video,audio and menus.

I am stuck at subtitle conversion i have DIF4U created .sst , but subtitle workshop does not like that .sst , somehow which little manual inreaction in .sst i manage to load it in subtitle workshop saved as 23.976 frames.
Now when importing to scenarist it say bmp is too big :

Error This image size is too big. [maximum=720x480(NTSC)]
Error Dimensions dump:
DisplayArea: X1=0, Y1=2, X2=719, Y2=479
PixelArea: Top=0, Bottom=477
SubTitleImage: Width=720, Height=574

All i want to know is there any proper way to convert the subtitle including non-english subs , like arabic etc , into NTSC (23.976fps) synced.

Because i know i can do that by ripping subs as OCR text , but thats only effect english , frm where i will bring the arabic text on my keyboard :p

Any idea would be appreciated.

Sorry for my english ,and sorry for big post, if i am unclear ask me i will repeat again and again

Regards

DVD@BEST

[Matthew]

You said you've fixed the timecodes so I'll assume that is the case.

You can resize the images (although you will lose some quality).

e.g. using convert.exe from ImageMagick
FOR %%A IN (*.bmp) DO (convert.exe %%A -sample !720x478 %%A > nul)

Also, be sure to change the sst header if required so that it matches up with the NTSC format.

[Dvd@Best]

Thank u for the reply.

I have downloaded the app u mentioned , but i wanna ask do i need to manually resize image one by one? or it has batch kinda thing as well?

Regards

Dvd@best

[E-Male]

Originally posted by Dvd@Best
do i need to manually resize image one by one? or it has batch kinda thing as well?Originally posted by Matthew
FOR %%A IN (*.bmp) DO (convert.exe %%A -sample !720x478 %%A > nul)

[violao]

I believe this thread (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=82605) answers the original question.

There is no need to resize the images. You just need to crop extra background (transparent) pixels. Use Subrip -> Save To Bitmaps. Here's command sequence I would use:

1. Vobsub Configure (to extract subtitles from the VOB)

2. SubToSup (to extract sup streams from vobsub subtitles)

3. dvdsuphtml -bitmap SubTitle-ID_en_0x20.sup (to check subtitles with browser, these are obviously english, ID 20)

4. Subrip save to bitmaps, use SubTitle-ID_en_0x20_0 for basename ( this will overwrite bitmaps saved in step 3), allow bmp cropping, use custom colors: black, blue, grey white

5. dvdsupdecode to create text file needed by dvdsupencode:
dvdsupdecode -fr:25 SubTitle-ID_en_0x20.sup (for PAL -> NTSC)
dvdsupdecode -fr:23.976 SubTitle-ID_en_0x20.sup (for NTSC -> PAL)6. rename SubTitle-ID_en_0x20.txt to SubTitle-ID_en_0x20.new.txt

7. notepad edit SubTitle-ID_en_0x20.new.txt and
- change FrameRate=25 to FrameRate=23.976 (for PAL -> NTSC)
- change FrameRate=23.976 to FrameRate=25 (for NTSC -> PAL)
- add line: Indent=40 (number of pixels from the bottom)
- optional: edit Palette= and Alpha= lines
8. dvdsupencode SubTitle-ID_en_0x20.new.txt

9. mux with Ifoedit

I have never had any problems with this procedure converting NTSC subtitles to PAL.

[Matthew]

Originally posted by violao
There is no need to resize the images. You just need to crop extra background (transparent) pixels.

Cropping has it's own problems. Aspect ratio is off as a result, although whether it is noticeable is another matter.

I haven't tried the method you use but when I tried cropping, if subtitles were at the top of the screen (e.g. during start credits) then they could be cut off. Hence I opted for resizing.

[violao]

Originally posted by Matthew
Cropping has it's own problems. Aspect ratio is off as a result, although whether it is noticeable is another matter.
AFAIK subpictures are not being resized, therefore there should not be any difference in aspect ratio between source subtitles and cropped ones. For 16:9 anamorphic you should of course calculate indent from the bottom of the screen, not the bottom of the squeezed picture.

[Matthew]

NTSC and PAL have different pixel aspect ratios though. I remember doing a test a while back on cropping bmps versus resizing, and it was the latter which resulted in correct positioning/AR. I'm not saying that resizing is the only way to go, just that cropping has its problems too in my experience.

[Pyocola]

violao, I've tried your method and for the life of me I cannot get it work. I've tried different sizes, colours, cropping vs. resizing, transparencies and just about every combination of options available in DVDSupEncode and no matter what the subtitles won't display during playback. I've tried both IfoEdit and ReJig and the result is the same. The DVD player registers that there is a subtitle track, however when turning it on nothing is displayed on screen. When loading the finished/produced ifo in SubRip the subtitles do show up correctly, so they are definitely there hidden somewhere.

I've tried to just demux the original sub, convert to sup, and then mux it back with IfoEdit/ReJig and it works, however as soon as I use the DVDSupTools to extract the bitmaps and encode them again, it no longer works (even if it's PAL -> PAL without any changes). And when decoding sup-files I always get some lines like "{2345}{0}" instead of maybe "{2345}{2445}" meaning they are displayed until the end of the file??? Don't know if that could have anything to do with it, but I would appreciate any help available.

[violao]

Originally posted by Pyocola
And when decoding sup-files I always get some lines like "{2345}{0}"
This is definitely wrong. The lines should read:
{2840}{2930}{SubTitle-ID_en_0x20_000001.bmp}
{2935}{2991}{SubTitle-ID_en_0x20_000002.bmp}
or something like that. How did you convert to sup? Are you using latest dvdsuptools?

[Pyocola]

Ripped the subs with DVD decrypter, loaded the ifo in Vobsub Configure to extract idx/sub and then sub2sup 0.9b to get the sup-file. As I said if I at this point mux back the sup-file with IfoEdit/ReJig it works. But if I use DVDsuptools (1.6) to decode them and then encode them again it no longer works, and I get the "{2345}{0}" problem maybe every fifth line or so (I've also manually tried to alter all the 0's to reasonable numbers, but it still doesn't work). Is DVDsuptools incompatible with the sups created from sub2sup or something?

[violao]

Originally posted by Pyocola
Is DVDsuptools incompatible with the sups created from sub2sup or something?
Shouldn't be, at least according to my experience. I ran into similar problems with one vobsub subtitles from net. It had both overlapping and {1234}{0} problem. Here is the solution:

If you find overlapping in txt file produced by dvdsupdecode:

4.a) In step 4 (SubRip) don't discard text file created by SubRip but choose OutputFormat->Set Output Format and convert to srt. SupRip will complain but never mind. Save .srt file.

4.b) Create custom format for SubtitleWorksop and put it into SubtitleWorksop\CustomFormats directory:

[Information]
Name=dvdsuptools
Extension=*.sub
Time structure=hh:mm:ss,zzz
Time=False
FPS=25
New line char=|

[Format text]
{RepeatSub}
{{swStart}}{{swEnd}}{{swText}}
{EndRepeat}


4.c) Load .srt file in SubtitleWorkshop, chose Tools->Information and Errors and fix overlapping subtitles. Choose SaveAs->Custom Format->Load Project and load your custom format file from 4.b. Save.

5.a) After 5 (dvdsupdecode) load saved file in text editor and replace all subtitle lines with those from your custom file saved in 4.c. Replace only subtitle lines and leave all other intact.

Proceed with encoding. This should fix overlapping. Why subtitles don't appear I can't tell. Perhaps there is a problem with colormap and transparency?