Ateme H.264 Beta - Bug, Issues and Getting Started

[bobololo]

Originally posted by LostMP4
Well, I've got 3 files I can't delete in any way :rolleyes: Aren't you infected by a virus ?

-- bobololo.

[LostMP4]

Originally posted by bobololo
Aren't you infected by a virus ?

-- bobololo.

Excluding Microsoft and Norton software(now merged in the ultimate parasite, thanks to SP2 and Symantec updates), none :p
After its crash, mp4muxer.exe had this problem, I can't delete, move or rename it, but I can copy it, obtaining a new "locked" file :confused: (now I've in 4 folders 4 mp4muxers, 3 not-working and locked and 1 working freshly extracted from the archive)

[Andrey]

Generalizing results after full viewing 4 clips - Ateme H.264 has given more detailed picture from less artefacts than other codecs on 400kbit/s 720x352.
Inloop deblocking, I think.
BTW, the difference in water on last screenshot is really surprising.

One more question: if I kill codec process occasionally, the resulting file isn't playable (2nd pass, of course).
Is this the way things are ment to be ?

[Bulletproof]

Originally posted by LostMP4
About mp4muxer: it crashed muxing h264 video stream with a AAC.
Now the file is "locked" (mp4muxer), double-clicking on it says it isn't a valid win32 program, I can't use or delete it (I tryed restarting the PC, too)
I can copy it to another folder, obtaining another locked file that I can't delete :confused:
A "new" mp4muxer exctracted from the archive works well (audio in MP4, I don't dare to try aac anymore)
What's happened?

Try starting windows in safe mode and then delete the files.

[easyfab]

Originally posted by LostMP4
Excluding Microsoft and Norton software(now merged in the ultimate parasite, thanks to SP2 and Symantec updates), none :p
After its crash, mp4muxer.exe had this problem, I can't delete, move or rename it, but I can copy it, obtaining a new "locked" file :confused: (now I've in 4 folders 4 mp4muxers, 3 not-working and locked and 1 working freshly extracted from the archive)

ctrl+alt+suppr -> kill the explorer process and open a new explorer process, your files should be unlocked now.

[Andrey]

A bug, but I don't know if it is Atheme dshow filter or BSPlayer.
When playing at full screen, image is shown at the top, not centered...
EDIT:
I like how 630Kbit 512x304 encode of SW II looks in general with adaptive deblocking. Even better (subjectively) than XViD one with heavy preprocessing... (makroblocks in XViD are too ugly when dealing with myst, flying sand and so on)
When I will find how to create a screenshots, I will post them :)

[bobololo]

Finally we're going to release tonight a new beta that fixes most of the critical issues (last frame crash, mpc lock, etc.) we had so you can find out others ones ;) We hope this new one is more stable for your encodes !

In the Beta-2 you'll have :

- Last frame crash with bframes fixed (encavc.exe)
- CreateThread() error with Win98SE fixed (encavc.exe)
- new adaptive deblocking flag "-adaptdeblock" working in
association with -deblock <strength> (encavc.exe)
- 16 references issue fixed (encavc.exe)
- better RC for very low bitrate target (encavc.exe)
- Media Player Classic lock fixed (adf_srcmp4.ax)
- Insane memory usage of the decoder filter fixed (adf_dech264.ax)
- a new tool call mp4 tool box. It allows you to extract a part of
a mp4 file and save it to another one. You'll be able to upload
to us your files illustrating your observations.

About the new deblocking option, you'll be able to use the adaptive deblocking and adjust its working range depending on your preference. For instance you can set it as follow :

-deblock -2 -adaptdeblock

This will tell the encoder to adapt the deblocking strength around the -2 level.

Enjoy :)

-- bobololo.

[Sirber]

Any URL / email?

[bobololo]

Originally posted by Sirber
Any URL / email? You'll be notified by mail.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Blimey... a beta-2 already... You guys are really fast!

I'll have to get stuck in now!


Cheers

[virus]

Originally posted by bobololo
- CreateThread() error with Win98SE fixed (encavc.exe)

:D
(I managed to be useful encoding exactly 0 bytes...)

Thanks for the brand-new build bobololo, your efforts are very appreciated. The MP4 extraction tool is a great idea. :)

virus

[Soulhunter]

Ok, before getting the new version I gonna post my 1st speed results...


System: Athlon XP 3000+ / 1024MB DDR400 / Windows XP


Source: 1024x576 @ 29.97fps

Results:

~ 07.4 fps @ -qual normal

~ 05.5 fps @ -qual good

~ 04.7 fps @ -qual best

~ 04.0 fps @ -qual extra



Source: 720x576 @ 25fps

Results:

~ 14.8 fps @ -qual normal

~ 11.9 fps @ -qual good

~ 08.8 fps @ -qual best

~ 08.2 fps @ -qual extra



Source: 640x480 @ 25fps

Results:

~ 18.7 fps @ -qual normal

~ 14.4 fps @ -qual good

~ 10.7 fps @ -qual best

~ 09.5 fps @ -qual extra


For a H.264 encoder its damn fast !!!

First visual impression -> Wow... :eek:

Btw, does someone know a tool to extract "wanted" frames from this encodes ???


Bye

[superdump]

Originally posted by Soulhunter
Btw, does someone know a tool to extract "wanted" frames from this encodes ???

Originally posted by bobololo
- a new tool call mp4 tool box. It allows you to extract a part of
a mp4 file and save it to another one. You'll be able to upload
to us your files illustrating your observations.

[Soulhunter]

@ superdump

Maybe I understood this wrong, but...

Think its a mp4 splitting/cutting tool !?!

I meant a single frame -> picture tool...


Bye

[Teegedeck]

I wish I had more precise findings to contribute right now - but I'm stuck with this 19'' Trinitron today; better view tomorrow on a TFT.

Let me just say; the codec is a jolly good piece of work. Psychovisuals and deblocking still are a no-no for my type of encoding (surprise, surprise...) but generally it seems possible to reach transparency at quite a reasonable bitrate. I still have to verify that on the TFT though.

Till tomorrow.

[bill_baroud]

my computer died on me just when i got the first beta, so i'll start testing with the beta 2 .... no i'm not dead, sorry for the delay :D

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by Soulhunter
For a H.264 encoder its damn fast !!! Nice one Soulhunter!

What did your 1024x576 encodes look like compared to the other codecs you've tested?

I'm interested because I'm hoping to use AVC for full frame HighDef encoding!


Cheers

[Krismen]

I've got one question: Is there anybody who can give a link to Ateme h.264 directshow decoder?

[Sirber]

beta1 has been removed from the server.

[guldukat]

Originally posted by Krismen
I've got one question: Is there anybody who can give a link to Ateme h.264 directshow decoder?

you received this filter by mail, IF you'Re a beta tester, else you have to wait for the final release in the nero package

[chilledoutuk]

I took the DiVX Bourne supremacy HDTV trailer from DiVX networks website which had 3500kbps bitrate and rencoded it to 2000kbps h.264 and the quality was almost transparent which is impressive.

I’m going to run some more tests on some HDTV sources and see how it performs.

[Jukke]

Hi,
I got strange file sizes from the muxer. Encoded as follows:
encavc.exe -i tv4.avs -o video.mp4 -qual normal -rcmode 2pass -br 600000 -clref bpred -psy 1
mp4muxer.exe -i video.mp4 -i audio.mp4 -f t:audio -o av.mp4
The avs is:
LoadPlugin("C:\Program\av\GORDIA~1\AviSynthPlugins\dgdecode.dll")
mpeg2source("C:\Scratch\Captures\ateme\tv4.d2v")
crop(6,6,714,564)
LanczosResize(608,480)
The muxer output is:
drv_mp4: video.mp4:3 opened (video(AVC): 608x480)
drv_mp4: audio.mp4:1 opened (audio, 48000 Hz, 2 channels)
muxing stream(s): [0] AU 4519 (Video), [1] AU 4238 (Audio)
stream[0]: muxing done (4520 AUs, 180.75 s)
stream[1]: muxing done (4239 AUs, 180.81 s)
mux completed
video.mp4 is 13314kb
audio.mp4 is 1496kb
and the muxed av.mp4 is staggering 36474kb!
Anybody finds this normal?

[Soulhunter]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Nice one Soulhunter!

What did your 1024x576 encodes look like compared to the other codecs you've tested?

I'm interested because I'm hoping to use AVC for full frame HighDef encoding!


Cheers
The source for this encode was the 1080i space shuttle clip Ive linked @ the other thread !!!

Ive encoded it 12x times with bitrates between 500-10000 kbps...

Atm its too early to tell you something concrete !!!

But I will post back tomorrow... ;)


Bye

[Sagittaire]

- better RC for very low bitrate target (encavc.exe)

Yes RC 2 pass isn't very good: quality isn't constant and there are quality degradation for the end of encoding. It's a typical Rate Control problem: too much bit for the beginning and less bit for the end to respect the bitrate. It would be necessary to make the first pass with a higher quantizer to have better estimate for the second pass with high quantizer encodind (low compressibility encoding)

720*304 500 Kbps Matrix Reloaded encoding with 35 000 Frames

http://jfl1974.free.fr/Test/Comparatif/H264vsDivX5-500.JPG

http://jfl1974.free.fr/Test/Comparatif/H264vsXviD-500.jpg

http://jfl1974.free.fr/Test/Comparatif/H264vsVP6-500.JPG

http://jfl1974.free.fr/Test/Comparatif/H264vsWMV9-500.JPG

http://jfl1974.free.fr/Test/Comparatif/H264vsRV10-500.JPG

[superdump]

Originally posted by guldukat
you received this filter by mail, IF you'Re a beta tester, else you have to wait for the final release in the nero package The current NeroVision Express package will decode the files encoded here but there won't be any seeking.

[LostMP4]

Originally posted by superdump
The current NeroVision Express package will decode the files encoded here but there won't be any seeking.

Use Ateme's filters if you want to seek ;)

[Soulhunter]

Originally posted by Soulhunter

I meant a single frame -> picture tool...
Sorry, totally overlooked the easiest way... :o

Avisynth -> DirectShowSource -> VDubMod -> Snapshot source frame


Bye

[superdump]

LostMP4: Indeed, I was just making sure that that person knew they could use NVE to watch clips posted here if they weren't part of the beta test.

Originally posted by Soulhunter
Sorry, totally overlooked the easiest way... :o

Avisynth -> DirectShowSource -> VDubMod -> Snapshot source frameYou've managed to get DSSource() to work with the Ateme filters/AVC files? Interesting. As far as I know it doesn't work anywhere else bar decoding the first frame.

[Soulhunter]

Hmm, even @ 8000 kbps Ive spotted out some faults !!!


Blocks:

Source sample 1 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Source_654.png)

Ateme sample 1 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Ateme_654.png)


Source sample 2 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Source_665.png)

Ateme sample 2 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Ateme_665.png)


Source sample 3 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Source_1302.png)

Ateme sample 3 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Ateme_1302.png)


Gradients:

Source sample 1 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Source_987.png)

Ateme sample 1 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Ateme_987.png)


Source sample 2 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Source_999.png)

Ateme sample 2 (http://img86.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img86&image=Ateme_999.png)


Originally posted by superdump

You've managed to get DSSource() to work with the Ateme filters/AVC files?

Uhm, yes...

DirectShowSource("C:\Ateme\2.mp4")

Made the screenshots above this way !!!


Bye

[superdump]

SoulHunter: Nice shots. Or rather, useful shots. On the first one the blocks are noticable on the smoke cloud on the left, but AVC seems to introduce to some artificial lighting on the lower left and up the right hand side. Very strange. In fact, now I've looked at the rest there seems to be an ongoing pattern of light introduction.

EDIT: What settings were you using? Did you use -psy >0?

[Tommy Carrot]

I didn't experienced any similar blocks and artifacts in my tests. Are you sure they are there during playback too? Can't be possible that the opening via avisynth causes them somehow(as most of us cannot open MP4s in avisynth)?

[Soulhunter]

Originally posted by superdump
What settings were you using? Did you use -psy >0?
Saved all command lines Ive used...

C:\Ateme\encavc.exe

-i C:\Ateme\shuttle.avs

-o C:\Ateme\2.mp4

-qual best

-rcmode 2pass

-br 10000000

-psy 0

Note: Ateme was maxed-out @ around 8000 kbps !!!


Originally posted by Tommy Carrot
I didn't experienced any similar blocks and artifacts in my tests. Are you sure they are there during playback too? Can't be possible that the opening via avisynth causes them somehow(as most of us cannot open MP4s in avisynth)?
Yes, its definitely visible while playback !!!

The two other sources Ive used are ok... :confused:

Think I gonna encode it again !!!

Need to sleep now... ;)


Bye

[bobololo]

A new beta of the encoder is ready for download. You should receive the link by mail in a few minutes. The change log was posted previsouly.

I strongly suggest you to use the new filters provided in this package as they should be more stable (just run reg.bat).

Also the jumping blocks in bframes issue isn't addressed in this version yet. So if you intend to test low bitrate encodes, it is recommanded to disable the bframes.

-- bobololo.

[bobololo]

Originally posted by Jukke
drv_mp4: video.mp4:3 opened (video(AVC): 608x480)
drv_mp4: audio.mp4:1 opened (audio, 48000 Hz, 2 channels)
muxing stream(s): [0] AU 4519 (Video), [1] AU 4238 (Audio)
stream[0]: muxing done (4520 AUs, 180.75 s)
stream[1]: muxing done (4239 AUs, 180.81 s)
mux completed
video.mp4 is 13314kb
audio.mp4 is 1496kb
and the muxed av.mp4 is staggering 36474kb!
Anybody finds this normal?

Nice, you find a little glitch in our file handling. You may have a previous file using the same name. Delete av.mp4 and try again. It should be better then. Let me know.

-- bobololo.

[virus]

:rolleyes:

this time I'm unable to render the file... I'm unable to register the filters. I run the .bat and regsrv32 does not give any error ("succeded"...). But the filters are not successfully registered and I cannot open/decode the file (the render fails, checked with GSpot, too). I've tried to build a graph manually using Graphedit but when I select the Ateme filters (both filters) from the list and hit "Insert filter" I get the following:

"The filter could not be created. Resources used by this filter may already be in use. Interface not registered (return code: 0x80040154)"

I've tried re-registering. No luck. :(
What can I do?

[superdump]

Originally posted by virus
:rolleyes:

this time I'm unable to render the file... I'm unable to register the filters. I run the .bat and regsrv32 does not give any error ("succeded"...). But the filters are not successfully registered and I cannot open/decode the file (the render fails, checked with GSpot, too). I've tried to build a graph manually using Graphedit but when I select the Ateme filters (both filters) from the list and hit "Insert filter" I get the following:

"The filter could not be created. Resources used by this filter may already be in use. Interface not registered (return code: 0x80040154)"

I've tried re-registering. No luck. :(
What can I do? I know it's the suckiest method ever, but have you tried rebooting? :)

[bobololo]

Originally posted by Andrey
One more question: if I kill codec process occasionally, the resulting file isn't playable (2nd pass, of course).
Is this the way things are ment to be ?

Yes, the mp4 file headers are written when the file is closed. If you kill the process while the encoding is running, the resulting file will miss these headers which makes it unusable.

-- bobololo.

[superdump]

You guys running beta 2 will most likely need the msvcrtd.dll (http://www.dll-files.com/dllindex/dll-files.shtml?msvcrtd) file available from that page to run the MP4 Tool Box program.

Here are a few nifty screenshots of what it can do:

http://www.swains.plus.com/superdump/MP4TB-01.png

http://www.swains.plus.com/superdump/MP4TB-02.png

http://www.swains.plus.com/superdump/MP4TB-03.png

http://www.swains.plus.com/superdump/MP4TB-04.png

http://www.swains.plus.com/superdump/MP4TB-05.png

[bobololo]

Originally posted by virus
:rolleyes:

this time I'm unable to render the file... I'm unable to register the filters. I run the .bat and regsrv32 does not give any error ("succeded"...). But the filters are not successfully registered and I cannot open/decode the file (the render fails, checked with GSpot, too). I've tried to build a graph manually using Graphedit but when I select the Ateme filters (both filters) from the list and hit "Insert filter" I get the following:

"The filter could not be created. Resources used by this filter may already be in use. Interface not registered (return code: 0x80040154)"

I've tried re-registering. No luck. :(
What can I do?

Maybe try unreg the filters from beta-1, then re-register those from beta-2. Is that still with win98se ? Maybe you could consider upgrading to 2k/xp ?

[virus]

Originally posted by bobololo
Maybe try unreg the filters from beta-1, then re-register those from beta-2. Is that still with win98se ? Maybe you could consider upgrading to 2k/xp ?
Yes, Win98SE. The filters from beta-1 have been unregistered and deleted right after you annunced the beta-2 release, I've even rebooted after deleting them. Oh, and I've also rebooted after installing the beta-2 ones. No luck.

And of course upgrading is out of question... I've got dozens of DS filters installed (some of them manually with regsrv32) and they all work pretty fine. Do you want me to buy a copy of WinXP just to beta-test a filter? ;)

[Sirber]

encavc.exe -i test.avs -o test.mp4 -qual extra -rcmode vbr -br 600000 -psy 1 -maxb 3 -cartoon -ref 2

Encoder encode at 3mbps, regardless what BR I set :confused:. Also, the output is unplayable.

http://www.detritus.qc.ca/test.mp4

[superdump]

Originally posted by bobololo
Maybe try unreg the filters from beta-1, then re-register those from beta-2. Is that still with win98se? Maybe you could consider upgrading to 2k/xp?Lol! Fantastic suggestion. :) I guess as M$ aren't supporting Win98SE anymore I guess Ateme might not need to. But still, it might be nice.

From my testing of the new adaptive deblocking with base level setting it's looking good. I would now recommend using this method over fixed and choose your level.

[bobololo]

Originally posted by Sirber
encavc.exe -i test.avs -o test.mp4 -qual extra -rcmode vbr -br 600000 -psy 1 -maxb 3 -cartoon -ref 2

Encoder encode at 3mbps, regardless what BR I set :confused:. Also, the output is unplayable.

Our VBR means constant quantizer, so the specified bitrate is just ignored. Try "-rcmode 2pass" instead.

[Sirber]

ha! encoding now at correct bitrate.

Thx!

[edit]

Output is still unplayable, with ffdshow or your filter. MPC uses 70% CPU though...

About encoding:
FPS is about 7-10 on my 2000+.

[bobololo]

Originally posted by Sirber
Output is still unplayable, with ffdshow or your filter. MPC uses 70% CPU though...

Are you using beta-2 filters ? have you try graphedit with the following graph ?

Ateme MPEG-4 Parser (your_file.mp4) -> Ateme H.264 Decoder -> Video Renderer

If this works, check at your mpc filter overrides and make ateme's prefered and block some eventual filters able to split mp4 and decode H.264.

-- bobololo.

[virus]

Originally posted by superdump
I guess as M$ aren't supporting Win98SE anymore I guess Ateme might not need to. But still, it might be nice.

Absolutely wrong. Support for the Win9x kernel has been extended until June 30, 2006 (link (http://tech-report.com/onearticle.x/6099)) due to the still relevant diffusion of this family of OSs. Also, Nero is fully Win9x-compliant (or at least, it runs well on my PC... together with XviD, VP6.2, DivX, 3ivX, ffdshow/ffvfw and many other stuff)
Do you really think that Ahead is going to buy an NT-only codec?

(but where's bond with his WinME box anyway? :))

[Sirber]

Works in GraphEdit, does not in MPC.

The only filters used are:
WMR7 (windowed)
Nero Video Decoder
my file

:confused:

Also, from what I've seen in Graphedit, Q is jumping and very squary. You can check with the file on top of this page.

[superdump]

Originally posted by Sirber
Also, from what I've seen in Graphedit, Q is jumping and very squary. You can check with the file on top of this page. This is probably almost all down to bskip being too aggressive at the moment. But a clip as stressful as that at that low a bit rate would probably look similar with any codec, no? Try disabling b-frames and maybe turn up the deblocking a bit.

[JohnV]

Originally posted by Sirber
Works in GraphEdit, does not in MPC.

The only filters used are:
WMR7 (windowed)
Nero Video Decoder
my file

:confused:

Also, from what I've seen in Graphedit, Q is jumping and very squary. You can check with the file on top of this page. Try this: Goto MPC options -> Filters -> Overrides, and make Ateme h264 decoder preferred.

[Sirber]

I did that, Ateem H264 is being used. No frames is displayed also. I know this is very stressfull for a codec, but RV10 and VP6 can manage to have good to medium quality on that test clip.