Ciao! (XviD-1.0-Beta2-05122003)

[mikeson]

@poochie2:
Can someone hint me where's the old chroma optimizer option, supposing that it's still there?

Yes, under zone control (select zone and click Edit).

using devapi3 or 4 am I allowed to make the first pass in VHQ 1 and the second one in VHQ 4?

No, do NOT change codec settings between passes.

[aaar9800]

You can change VHQ in between passes, of course bit allocation won't be as accurate, but it will never be higher than 1% off of what it should have been for a different vhq setting.

The only thing that is not bad to change is VHQ, all others are realy bad to change, afaik.

[sysKin]

I could probably add GMC to the list of options it's *reasonably* safe to change between passes - GMC doesn't change frame sizes too much (even less than VHQ).

Radek

[HarryM]

To stand-alone Koepi's 'XviD dev-api-4 prebeta3 decoder' - On win98se I must activate 'overlay mixer' or forced 'dvobsub', otherwise error in xvid.ax... :mad:

[Koepi]

Originally posted by HarryM
To stand-alone Koepi's 'XviD dev-api-4 prebeta3 decoder' - On win98se I must activate 'overlay mixer' or forced 'dvobsub', otherwise error in xvid.ax... :mad:

Can you enlighten me where the problem is? In plain setups this doesn't happen (else we would have gotten plenty of messages about that before as this is the decoder that ships with my XviD-1.0-betaX-builds....).

Seems somehow ....strange.... to me. Lemme guess, with your "modified decoder" this doesn't happen?

Koepi

[HarryM]

Originally posted by Koepi
Can you enlighten me where the problem is? In plain setups this doesn't happen (else we would have gotten plenty of messages about that before as this is the decoder that ships with my XviD-1.0-betaX-builds....).

Seems somehow ....strange.... to me. Lemme guess, with your "modified decoder" this doesn't happen?

Koepi

Problem is win98se and its default 'system renderer', as per usual...
Under VMR7(VMR9) at win2k/XP is all O.K., as per usual...
At evening I give here the coresponding windows error message.


Simple xvid.ax from beta2 plays fine, also under 'system renderer' on win98se. But it has other vice - when I have installed DivX decoder (divxdec.ax) and xvid.ax together(!), DivX decoder is using for decoding of 'XVID' 4CC.
Seems, that DivX decoder has paradoxly higher MERIT(?) than xvid.ax. If I uninstaling divxdec.ax, xvid.ax is used normally for decoding.

Note: Your newest prebeta3 decoder is O.K. at this problem.

[Yasu]

Koepi, thank you for your reply.

I checked my window's display propaties.
My setting is
-Display-
DPI setting:
Normal Size (96 DPI)

If I check wrong place, please tell me.

I captured my display image.
http://www.h7.dion.ne.jp/~alcadia/png/xvid-1.0-beta2-BVOPs.png


I will appreciate your advice.

Yasu

[Manao]

Just to confirm the bug in the two pass algorithm, using ratio instead of constant quants for the credit range.

I made the same encode, using this time fixed quants ( 16 ), and I got the size I was asking for. The credit size was finally 1 928 Kb ( which is less than what I got in the previous case, which means I didn't saturate in the credit when I was specifying 20% for the credits ).

I hope this will help to find the bug.

@Yasu : I can only confirm that you checked at the right place, and that indeed the checkbox is missing ( well, we can see only its top here on your screenshot ).

[Koepi]

Unfortunately I can't reproduce that :(

It must be something weird with chinese/korean/taiwanese/japanese windows versions :(

Regards
Koepi

[GolovachLena]

I must be missing something. It's about "Display aspect" option on your screenshot. Is it a feature of beta-3? I didn't notice it in Ciao.

[Koepi]

That's new and still being tested.

Regards
Koepi

[HarryM]

@Koepi: My partial mistake, sorry. Interest. ONLY ZoomPlayer (my best-loved player) has troubles with newest xvid decoder. :( Other players, e.g. WMP 6.4 or MPC plays fine, seems... :D

http://sgfan.ic.cz/download/ax1.gif

[symonjfox]

Originally posted by Koepi
That's new and still being tested.
Regards
Koepi
Finally my whishes are true! :D :D :D
I really hope it works; and I hope that future MP4 players (both hardware and software) will support it as well!

Thanks :D

[poochie2]

Originally posted by mikeson
@poochie2:
Can someone hint me where's the old chroma optimizer option, supposing that it's still there?

Yes, under zone control (select zone and click Edit).

using devapi3 or 4 am I allowed to make the first pass in VHQ 1 and the second one in VHQ 4?

No, do NOT change codec settings between passes.

Got it!

[leo_fischer]

@Koepi, Yasu
The fonts used for western characters on japanese windows versions are a bit larger than the default fonts for western windows versions. This can lead to the kind of problems yasu is seeing.
Unfortunately, the only solution is for the window to calculate the proper size based on the font or control sizes, or to make the window resizable (or bigger)

[chemmajik]

Some how XVID just sucks for 1 pass HQ someone needs to fix it, my sheet has worked fine for the last 2 year until the latest builds... Specifically the compression is fried, as u see I am not a newbie I have been here before most except doom9 & a few. I just never did regain my stats from the prior forums... Someone screwed up 1pass somewhere... The priority takes over the whole system makes it crawl... Thats with debug disabled... On a Tbred System well near 2Ghz... Anyways there is a problem Houston...

[Koepi]

Weird post.

How about setting your vdubmod priority to idle(or whichever encoder you use). That's what i do.

Koepi

[mikeson]

@chemmajik:

You proclaim you've been here since beginning (on forum.doom9.org) but you post worse than newbie. You should now how to report bug. If you don't I suggest using Search button and reading FAQs and Stickies... :rolleyes:

[Yasu]

Manao ,Koepi and leo_fischer, thank you for your reply.

It must be something weird with chinese/korean/taiwanese/japanese windows versions.
No, probably only Japanese Window's version.

I reproduced this.

Control Panel ->
Day, Time, Area and Language Options ->
Area and Language Option ->
Area Options ->
Standard and Forms ->

Default Japanese

If I change it for:
English(US) - Ok I can see it.
Korean - I can see it.
Chinese(China) - I can see it.
http://www.h7.dion.ne.jp/~alcadia/png/xvid-1.0-beta2-BVOPs-USENG.png

But
Japanese - I can't see it.
The image is in a former post.

I called Microsoft support but they could't solved this matter.
Only they admitted it.

I found a temporary solution.
When I encode my avis with XviD-1.0-Beta2, I will change Japanese for
English(US).

I appreciate your advices.
Thank you very much.

Yasu

[gino25]

Does vhq work only with p-frames or with p and b frames?

[HarryM]

Originally posted by gino25
Does vhq work only with p-frames or with p and b frames?

What I keep in mind, VHQ works without problems with use of b-frames, but VHQ is applied _only_ for P-frames.
Syskin said at one time, that VHQ algorithm can be principially modified for B-frames too, but VHQ isn't efficient for B-frames.

[Teegedeck]

But that doesn't mean that you shouldn't use it with B-frames, of course.

[gino25]

thank you

[m0rtal]

small GUI tweak:
if chroma optimizer and grayscale can't work together, why don't change checkboxes to radio buttons?
to make sure people don't use them together :)

[HarryM]

Originally posted by m0rtal
small GUI tweak:
if chroma optimizer and grayscale can't work together, why don't change checkboxes to radio buttons?
to make sure people don't use them together :)

I am not big programmer, but I know (I use Delphi and VB at one time), that you can programing 'smart dependencies' of check boxes with help of their attributes (checked=ON/OFF, alowed(state)=ON/OFF, etc.) a relations between them. It is very simple for programming.


e.g.

If (grayscale_checkbox.checked==true) then chromaoptimizer_checkbox.checked=false

etc.

[m0rtal]

Originally posted by HarryM
If (grayscale_checkbox.checked==true) then chromaoptimizer_checkbox.checked=false
good example!

EDIT: this is even better because in this case you can turn either option off, which is impossible using radio buttons ;)

[cypher_soundz]

very nice build , i have some strange results to do with speed. I hope this does not belong in the newbies section :o. Encoding DVD TV episodes (22-29min long) i get around 20/25fps. while encoding a movie i get ~53fps. The first time i installed this build i encoded a episode and i got around 60fps, i just uninstalled xvid and reinstalled and now i am encoding a movie at 53fps.This i find strange , my rig is below in my Sig.
Regards
cyph

EDIT: i'm using b-frames , trelis, luma masking (or what ever the new name is).

[mf]

Originally posted by Yasu
I captured my display image.
http://www.h7.dion.ne.jp/~alcadia/png/xvid-1.0-beta2-BVOPs.png
Looks like the checkbox is there, but it doesn't fit. How about Clicking packed bitstream twice, then press TAB on your keyboard and then spacebar. That should fix it.

[Bluedan]

A few things:

I.
I like to come up again with an error reported by Leak in the beta 1 thread.
It's about the target filesize which will be outranged as soon as you set min I-frame intervall other than 1-3.

So I don't believe it's got anything to do with changing settings after entering the target filesize, as I only entered it once and everything was okay while I didn't touch the min. I-frame interval *and* everything went back to normal after setting it back to 1, but not touching anything else.

This is only an excerpt.please have a look for more detail on page six of this thread (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=65913&perpage=20&highlight=target%20size&pagenumber=6).

I cannot confirm that setting min I frame interval to 2 is safe for beta 2!
My first encode ended up with aprox 1,2 GB as 2nd pass output with quant being constantly 2 (_not_ intended or capted quants)!
I did then some unreasonable harmless changes in curve compression settings and voilà it worked.
Or maybe it was the sequence of boxes that I opened ..or not? I cannot see an obvious dependency.
Obviously no changes in the dialogue boxes which reflect the "mis"-setting.
At this point I should offer extensive testing as Leak did, but... lack of computing power ATM.

As there's no more need for external curve compression (i.e. statsreader linear scale) it has been stressed out in doom9 guide that now actually all required data for two pass encoding could be entered in toto before beginning with the first pass: Make two queues in VDubMod and let them run one after the other.
For now with the above error occuring I have to check 2nd run while in process!

II.
When I hit the replacement button (...) for the calculator next to the filesize entry and then return to previous window the filesize still shows the number entered. Here it differs from beta 1.

III.
Though cosmetic it might be confusing for the not so experienced users:
When referring back to first pass stats file in 2nd pass setting dialogue the pop up window asks for "save as" filename instead of "Load".
The description here should be more explicit.
Not every former dev-api3 user was always sure about choosing the right stats files in "2pass ext. scaling"-mode.

I start getting used to the new interface.
And also not to forget, I really appreciate the huge step in development for this release! Great thing!

[sysKin]

Originally posted by Bluedan
I cannot confirm that setting min I frame interval to 2 is safe for beta 2!But beta2 doesn't have min i-frame interval at all :confused:

Radek

[Bluedan]

But beta2 doesn't have min i-frame interval at all

You're right. It's not precise. What I refer to is the sequential I-frame treatment:

I-frames closer than...frames

...are reduced by ...%

Though Leak used that term as well he surely refers to it, too.
Whereas he wrote about min.I-frame under advanced options, where I can only find max I-frame interval in beta2 GUI.

[Yasu]

mf, thank you for your reply.
Originally posted by mf
How about Clicking packed bitstream twice, then press TAB on your keyboard and then spacebar. That should fix it.

1.Click the "packed bitstream"; "Packed bitstream" was checked.
2.Click the "packed bitstream"; "Packed bitstream" was unchecked.
3.Press 'TAB' on my keyboard;
4.Press 'Spacebar' on my keyboard.
There is the screeshot.
http://www.h7.dion.ne.jp/~alcadia/png/xvid-1.0-beta2-mf.png

I see selection moved to unseen "Closed GOV" and now I think "Closed GOV" is unckecked.

mf, your method can't fix it.
I appreciate your advice.

Yasu

[mf]

Originally posted by Yasu
mf, thank you for your reply.
1.Click the "packed bitstream"; "Packed bitstream" was checked.
2.Click the "packed bitstream"; "Packed bitstream" was unchecked.
3.Press 'TAB' on my keyboard;
4.Press 'Spacebar' on my keyboard.
There is the screeshot.
http://www.h7.dion.ne.jp/~alcadia/png/xvid-1.0-beta2-mf.png
I see selection moved to unseen "Closed GOV" and now I think "Closed GOV" is unckecked.
mf, your method can't fix it.
I appreciate your advice.
Yasu
When you click "Load defaults", "Closed GOV" is on. So if you follow my instructions, "Closed GOV" will be off. The only nasty thing is that if you forget what you last set "Closed GOV" too (on or off), you won't be able to see if it's on or off.
But let's set this straight, you wanted to be able to change the setting, right? My method allows to.

[GolovachLena]

Is anybody encoding with "Discard 1st pass" option checked off ? I'm constantly getting absolutely silent VirtualDub's crash on the second pass near the end of movie. The first pass goes ok, and the movie looks pefrectly fit into the size/quality i need, but the second pass crashes everytime. How could it be?

[Manao]

GolovachLena : I'm making a lot of test with 'discard first pass' uncheck, and I have no problem at all. Check if you have enough spacedisk to make two passes. The other reason which can make VDub crash silently, is when having another process which has a higher priority than Vdub's. But in that case, enven if VDub is crashing, you're getting your movie just fine. Anyway, I don't think it's the codec.

Oh, and one last thing, perhaps the issue is wiht the first pass, and you're missing a part of the filestat because VDub crashed before closing it. But the most plausible cause is still a disk full.

[Yasu]

mf, I'm sorry.
I misunderstood what you wrote.
When I read your post, I guessed I could see the "Closed GOV".
That is why I wrote my former post that your method could't fix it.

Why I reported this matter is that nobody had reported it.
By the time I read Doom9's XviD guide, I had hardly guessed what I
could't see.

In WindowsXP Japanese version, This happens.
When I called Microsoft support, he used WindowsXP Professional.
He downloaded XviD-1.0-Beta2-05122003.exe and installed it.
On his WinXP Professional version(of cource, Japnanese Edition) this happened.
I found a temporary solution.
I wrote it in my former former post.

I appreciate your advice.

Yasu

[Chainmax]

Do bframes still have to be set at 0/whatever if you don't want to use b-frames but do want to activate syskin's I/P/B frames thingy (can't remember exactly what it was)?

[sysKin]

Originally posted by Chainmax
Do bframes still have to be set at 0/whatever if you don't want to use b-frames but do want to activate syskin's I/P/B frames thingy (can't remember exactly what it was)? It was 0 and it's your only option now. Old -1 b-frames with old keyframe decision is gone.

Radek

[olnima]

Is there any difference between setting B-frames to 0 or disable them?

Greetz Olnima

[Nibor]

Hi!

So here's the first odd thing I've seen so far in beta2 which I think nobody already reported...

The movie is The Lord Of The Rings - The Two Towers (Special Extended DVD Edition), so it's quite a long movie (3 hours 45 minutes)...
I'm doing a first pass with 'Discard first pass' turned off.
I run the encode and everything is just fine, output is ok and the resulting file is around 3GB.

But the status window at the end of the encoding looks like this:

http://niborvisions.gmxhome.de/files/XviD-1.0-beta2_StatusWindow.png

What's strange here is obvious ;)
I mean the screwed average P-VOP frame size, which seems to be causing all the other odd values!

Has anybody spotted something like this before?
Is it already fixed in beta3?

.: Nibor :.

PS: 340 MBit/s :p

[fps]

Originally posted by olnima
Is there any difference between setting B-frames to 0 or disable them?

Greetz Olnima
Setting B-Frames to 0 turns off B-frames(the only way you can do).

[LigH]

The only way? Does disabling the whole BVOP group not deactivate B frames?!

[bond]

you have to set b-frames to -1 to disable them

[Seiby]

Originally posted by LigH
The only way? Does disabling the whole BVOP group not deactivate B frames?!

Uncheck the BVOP box deactivate bframes. There is no need to set the bframes to -1 to disable them in 1.0 beta for me...

[Soulhunter]

[EDIT: Removed... See here !!! (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=415627#post415627) ;)]

[Manao]

@Soulhunter : you may have made some mistakes while copying the numbers : sizes / PSNR for MPEG with or without treillis are exactly the same. It should not ( afaik )

Else, very interesting tests. Astonishing that higher VHQ lowers the PSNR, but since it drastically lowers size, that's OK with me. Seems that VHQ4 is more useful than some were saying. I'm glad not using anything else than VHQ4, else I would find it too slow :)

[Soulhunter]

you may have made some mistakes while copying the numbers : sizes / PSNR for MPEG with or without treillis are exactly the same. It should not ( afaik )
I thought the same, so I run the PSNR test twice on this files !!!

But result was again the same... :(

Only thing I could imagine is that Ive encoded with the same settings twice... :confused:

But I'm 99% sure I haven't done this... :rolleyes:

I gonna check this tomorrow !!!

PS: Here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=412191#post412191) are the results with DivX 5.1.1

Bye

[Manao]

Damn, even as an XviD addict, I would not have thought XviD would give such high PSNR compared to DivX 5 :D

For the Treillis thing, I didn't test with MPEG matrix, only with HVS_GOOD, and size / SSIM values were different when Treillis was activated / deactivated.

[Soulhunter]

Damn, even as an XviD addict, I would not have thought XviD would give such high PSNR compared to DivX 5
Yeah... XviD v.1 rocks !!! :D

Bye

[Seimour]

I downloaded the first beta of XviD, and I couldn't find the credits tab, I'd like to know it won't be no more on the following releases of this codec. Thnx & bye