Guide: Trilight's UberGuide for FULL Disc Backups!

[student]

TRILIGHT thankyou very much for again answering my novice question. I can't appreciate much that how wonderfull your guides are. Its excellent. Its not your fault that i dont understand. I promise that i wont ask any more questions unless absolutely needed. But please understand that i am trying my best. Once i got one done under my belt i'll be ok. I didnt even sleep properly in the last 4 days. I think thats my problem. And on top of all that Cricket world cup is breaking my concentration. I'll have a break during the weekend and read afreash again and hopefully get the hang of it all. My main problem area now is Scenarist. I'll try to read the manual for that.

Eyes`Only thanks to you too. you couldnt have done better.

Thanks to you guys again. and dont let people like me put you off.

Thanks Heapes.

[TRILIGHT]

You're very welcome, student. It's not that you "put us off" either. Please do not take it the wrong way. It's that we don't have a lot of extra time outside of our jobs and what we do here on the forum and on the IRC channel, to walk someone through every step of their particular project. We do the best we can to guide people along and to answer specific questions.

It's when people start asking things like "I have this IFO with A, B, and C. Where do I put A, B, and C? Do I do one and then the other? Can you look at this IFO and tell me exactly what I should do?" We just don't have a lot of time to spend holding everyone's hands (no offense intended here) on every project they try. We try the best we can to point people in the right direction and to help them when they trip and fall. There just isn't enough time in the day to do everyone's projects for them. I certainly hope we did not come across as being rude.

[student]

Hey TRILIGHT . By no means either you or anyone else were or are rude. I can understand your concerns about all this. You have written the guides to make other people's life easier and still you have to put up with all those questions. But i think the very first project is the harder for everyone. Once i get one done then i'll be more confident and mature to do the rest without much help. Whats the IRC channel and server you talked about?
I have finished the Scenarist part(i think). Now i have to work on the ifoupdate part and the rest. I dont know that in which cases you have to rewrite (update) a particular ifo. That is if i didnt change anything in a particular vts except reencoding then also i have to use ifoupdate or not? Scenarist also creates VIDEO_TS files. Do i use these or the once on the original dvd? Also as i didn't touch the other 3 VTSs on the original dvd , do i just copy those straight from my original to the final dvd compilation?

Thanks.

[waldok]

You guys are being so gentle to each other you're going to make me cry :D

Waldok:cool:

[Piece]

got a problem with a buffy dvd.

there are 3 VTS on the disc:
1. scripts
2. 20th century fox intro
3. menu+4 episodes

dif4u extracts everything but the menus. vts 1+2 i'd like to use exactly how they are on the new authored dvd. i've already encoded the 4 episodes, looks great. but how do i integrate the menus now? they are inside VTS_03_0.VOB. the menus are not mentioned in ifoedit for vts_03. i'm a little stuck here now. plz help me someone. if u need any additional info, just tell me and i post it.


files on the dvd:

10.09.2002 17:28 14.336 VIDEO_TS.BUP
10.09.2002 17:28 14.336 VIDEO_TS.IFO
09.09.2002 21:25 212.992 VIDEO_TS.VOB
09.09.2002 21:25 28.672 VTS_01_0.BUP
09.09.2002 21:25 28.672 VTS_01_0.IFO
09.09.2002 21:25 0 VTS_01_0.VOB
09.09.2002 21:26 20.135.936 VTS_01_1.VOB
09.09.2002 21:26 14.336 VTS_02_0.BUP
09.09.2002 21:26 14.336 VTS_02_0.IFO
09.09.2002 21:26 0 VTS_02_0.VOB
09.09.2002 21:26 20.015.104 VTS_02_1.VOB
10.09.2002 17:05 116.736 VTS_03_0.BUP
10.09.2002 17:05 116.736 VTS_03_0.IFO
10.09.2002 16:58 51.367.936 VTS_03_0.VOB
09.09.2002 21:48 1.073.739.776 VTS_03_1.VOB
09.09.2002 21:55 1.073.739.776 VTS_03_2.VOB
09.09.2002 22:02 1.073.739.776 VTS_03_3.VOB
09.09.2002 22:04 290.709.504 VTS_03_4.VOB
09.09.2002 22:11 1.073.739.776 VTS_03_5.VOB
09.09.2002 22:20 1.073.739.776 VTS_03_6.VOB
09.09.2002 22:29 1.073.739.776 VTS_03_7.VOB
09.09.2002 22:33 602.671.104 VTS_03_8.VOB
22 Datei(en) 7.427.899.392 Bytes

greetz piece

[TRILIGHT]

Originally posted by Piece
but how do i integrate the menus now? they are inside VTS_03_0.VOB. the menus are not mentioned in ifoedit for vts_03.

My guide clearly states what to do about menus. However, since you are working with IFOedit instructions, you can't possibly be following my guide for your backup so I'm at a loss for why you would bother posting on this thread. You should post your question in a new thread in the IFOedit forum. This thread is only in reference to the UberGuide mentioned. Thanks.

[waldok]

Hi Uber Trilight,

Maybe you saw my posts in Advanced authoring forum about strange Audio tracks in the ScoobyDoo DVD, one track having 2 different StreamIds, one being standard audio track and the other director commentary. I couldn't find this type of strange stuff in the uberguide, so I was wondering if maybe you already came across such a strange thing. DVDDecrypter won't extract these streams correctly (talked with Lightning UK about it already) so do you know anything about it ? I looked into your Insomnia advanced notes, but there was no such case. Any idea ?
(Can't PM you, so I posted this here, hope I don't bother)

Unter-Waldok:cool:

[TRILIGHT]

Usually it's just a matter of lining the audio up to where it was originally. I believe at least that much is listed in both guides. Other than that, you'd need to change stream ID numbers in the IFO files after you were done. I believe this is mentioned in at least one of the two guides as well as the "Tips and Tricks" section.

However, from the sounds of it, you've not even extracted the audio you want yet. What exactly do you mean when you say it "won't extract correctly"? What *does* it extract? How are you splitting it up? Does it write a file at all? If so, what does it name it and is there any sound in it? A ton of different things could be happening and I'm not quite certain where you're stuck at.

[Piece]

oh my goodness!

somehow i overread that ALL *_0.* files have to be copied to the final dir. my fault, sorry to have bothered ya.

but i got another question to that i didn't find an answer in your guide. are there any "dummy"-files for substreams? dif4u has extracted substrems 00,01,03. 02 is empty on the dvd, contains no subs. when i try to mux it with scenarist (with empty substream) it quit with an error. i included now a substream with just 1 picture, hope this makes no problems.

[Noldor]

Hi, I don't know if this is the right place for my problem but since I'm using Trilights Uber Guide I'll try it here.

I'm trying do do a FULL Backup of my X-Files Season boxes. Therefore I proceeded as described in Das Uber Guide to make a backup of disc one of season one. On this DVD for the first episode there are two deleted scenes which can be played during the episode by pressing enter/select on your remote. To find the positiones to press enter there is a subpicture stream which only contains an "X" on these positions and nothing more. According to IFOEdit the chapters in which the deleted scenes are to be optionally played are divided into 4 cells (all others having just one cell). The subpicture X is displayed during the shortest of these cells.

I rebuild that cell-structure in scenarist and everything seemed to work well. But when pressing enter in one of this particular scenes (where the X is correctly displayed) nothing happens. Maybe I have to add a jump command or something like this, but I have actually no clue how this function works. Perhaps some people have tried an full Backup of the X-Files seasons and has faced and solved this problem. Or maybe someone had another DVD with a similar deleted scenes functionality and could help me doing this.

Thank You

Noldor

[Eyes`Only]

This is called Button-Over-Video. There's a guide for it on Doom9. It can't be done with the uberguide in it's current state, I think. Perhaps Trilight will modify it for us later, but for now, you'll need the Button-Over-Video guide (and a lot of time and patience) to recreate that feature!

[Noldor]

:) I've found and read the Button-Over-Video Guide. This is what I actually was trying to do, but knowing what to do to be able to crate a highlight layer. I'll try this method :D

Thank You Eyes`Only for that hint

[Eyes`Only]

Glad to assist. It's always a pleasure to help those that are not part of the mindless-zombie community of one-button tools.

[Luper_PT]

My congratulations for TRILIGHT. Excelent guide.

However, I have a problem with subpictures (well, maybe the problem me).

There are many PGC's with only 1 PGC in main movie but using 2 diferent VOB-IDs, 1 for layer 1 and 1 for layer 2.

PGC_1 (program chain): [Titke (TTN):1] [01:56:35.05 /25 fps] (Program:12) (Cells: 13) (uses VOB-IDs: 1,2)
[Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id: 1/1] : time: 00:06:57.01 /25 fps [Pos: 00:06:57:01] [Frames: 10426]
[Ch 02] [Pg 02] [Cell 02] [V/C Id: 1/2] : time: 00:07:31.22 /25 fps [Pos: 00:14:28:23] [Frames: 121723]
...
[Ch 10] [Pg 10] [Cell 10] [V/C Id: 1/10] : time: 00:04:02.21 /25 fps [Pos: 01:31:49:10] [Frames: 137735]
[Cell 11] [V/C Id: 2/1] Layer Br.: time: 00:08:32.05 /25 fps [Pos: 01:40:21:15] [Frames: 150540]
[Ch 11] [Pg 11] [Cell 12] [V/C Id: 2/2] : time: 00:11:06.03 /25 fps [Pos: 01:51:27:18] [Frames:167193]
...

The result is when I extract by PGC I get 2 equal subpicture streams in folder SUB like if there are 2 subs in PGC. Now, what to do with them?

[TRILIGHT]

Glad you like the guide, Luper. As for your problem, are you sure there is only one sub stream? What are the names of the files you are referring to?

[aquabubble]

@luper: You're not confusing the .forced.SST as a second stream are you?

[Luper_PT]

@TRILIGHT

Thank you Trilight for your reply and your time,

My title is Chocolat, Portuguese edition. But I think this problem is common to other titles. These are the files I get in SUBS folder:

VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues.forced.sst
VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues.sst

VTS_01_VSUB_P1-02-Portugues.forced.sst
VTS_01_VSUB_P1-02-Portugues.sst

VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0001.bmp
...
VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0966.bmp

VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0001.bmp
...
VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0966.bmp

More,
VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0001.bmp = VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0001.bmp
...
VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0966.bmp = VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0966.bmp

Sorry my bad English

[aquabubble]

@luper: you're English is fine matey ;)

Firstly, is only one subpicture stream listed in the IFO? Is it mapped to two different stream IDs (i.e. 0x20, 0x21)?

Also, if you look in the VTS_01_VSUB_P1-02-Portugues.sst, what do the start times look like for the individual subpictures? Are they from the beginning of the movie or half-way through?

[Luper_PT]

@AQUABUBLE

Thank you AQUABUBLE for your reply, but I think I'm not confusing nothing, as you can see im my prev reply.

[Luper_PT]

@Aquabuble,

Onse again, Thank You AQUABUBLE,

In fact when I play "Chocolat" there is only 1 sub, when I open IFO I get 2 ID: 0x21, 0x22.

Both .sst are equal, both have 0966 .bmp associated

1st .sst:

0001 00:00:51:24 00:00:55:12 VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0001.bmp
...
0966 01:52:32:10 01:52:36:02 VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_0966.bmp

2nd .sst:

0001 00:00:51:24 00:00:55:12 VTS_01_VSUB_P1-02-Portugues_0001.bmp
...
0966 01:52:32:10 01:52:36:02 VTS_01_VSUB_P1-02-Portugues_0966.bmp

More:

VTS_01_VSUB_P1-01-Portugues_n.bmp = VTS_01_VSUB_P1-02-Portugues_n.bmp

Thank You again AQUABUBLE

[TRILIGHT]

You most likely have one stream associated with Letterbox and one associated with Widescreen. Usually, I just use one for both when I reauthor. (You'll see the "W" and "L" boxes to the left of the stream when you import it into Scenarist.) There may be a slight difference in text positioning in the different BMP files.. At any rate, you can most likely safely ignore one or the other.

[Luper_PT]

Thank you Trilight,

All OK now. :-)

[Eyes`Only]

Trilight to the rescue!

[atreides93]

Trilight, I was reading your latest "uberguide" and you're using scenarist now?? don't you use maestro anymore? I think your older guide used maestro...

[TRILIGHT]

I've used Scenarist for quite some time now. I wrote that old single-PGC Maestro guide about a year ago. I pretty much use Scenarist exclusively now. I only use Maestro when it comes to my TiVo material since I am able to "trick" Maestro into believing the DirecTV MPEG stream is DVD compliant. Maestro is a good tool and certainly has it's place but I do not feel it is flexible enough for DVD backups.

[atreides93]

Hmm, well maybe one of these days I'll learn how to use Scenarist. It seems a bit more complex than Maestro, but I guess once you get past the learning curve its not so bad. I just have so little time these days for my hobbies since becoming a dad.

By the way, that guide you wrote a year ago works really well today, I'm going to use it for all my backups now. The quality you get using CCE instead of instantcopy or dvd2one is definitely worth it. Especially on 3 hour movies :)

[waldok]

Atreides, congratulations for joining the "Doom9-former-DVD-hobbyists-united-dads-crew".
I don't want to worry you, but I'm afraid you won't get as much time as before for DVD stuff from now on (believe me, I've got 2 children ;)

Now, concerning Scenarist, even a dumbass like me was able to use it (at least in its basic functionality). I can tell you it rules and I never wanted to go back to Maestro ever since. I was a bit afraid at the beginning, due to all screenshots showing multiple boxes and arrows everywhere, but thanks to the brilliant Trilight guides and lots of help from other "heads" here, it became really easy. Go for it, you won't regret it.

(And have good nights now that you've got your own little night-screamer home :p )

Waldok:cool:

[atreides93]

thanks waldok.

trilight i had a question about a step in your uberguide.
you mention editing the CCE ecl file to include chapters. i can see how you'd need that to precisely match the chapters with where they belong...but i've never done this and it seems to work fine in maestro. i wonder if maestro automatically just assigns the chapter to the nearest I frame? is this step required just to make it a perfect match? or does scenarist have problems importing a chapter list if it points to a frame that isn't an I frame?

[Eyes`Only]

Both Scenarist and Meastro attach chapters to the nearest I-frame. Putting your chapters in CCE just ensures accuracy as to the exact I-frame they were originally at. CCE puts periodic I-frames on it's own, so you'll get decent accuracy (a frame or two off) if you don't.

For VobID demuxed video, CCE chapters are required, because the accuracy is much more neccessary.

There's nothing Maestro can do that Scenarist can't :D

[atreides93]

ah ok, thanks for the info :)

by the way guys, i noticed in trilight's older guide he was using subrip, but now you and trilight seem to suggest that vobsub is more accurate? I'm using subrib 1.15 which is newer than the one trilight mentioned in his guide from last year. maybe the new version works better now? have you guys tried it?

[Eyes`Only]

Actually I liked subrip 1.14 a lot. Then 1.15 came out, and the author did some stuff to it that I did not agree with, and when I asked Zuggy about them, he wasn't very responsive to my/our needs, so I looked elsewhere. Subrip seems to concentrate more on non-dvdr related stuff, which is entirely unneccessary in my world.

I contacted Gabest, and he was amiable and helpful. He modifies vobsub for me constantly, and even created some apps for me to use to make DoItFast4U even more helpful for us. When I need a feature, I consult him and we decide if it's 'doable'. If a user finds a bug, I talk to him and we work together to diagnose/fix it. His devotion to my app has been more than invaluable. You'll notice newer versions of DoItFast4U even make the .ssts for you automatically now, because of his ability/support!

So in closing, I really liked Subrip 1.14. And yes, it was accurate. It didn't have automation that allowed CLI interaction though. When 1.15 came out, it had CLI by Doom9's requests, but several things were changed that made it worse than 1.14 (IMO, as well as many others).

Accuracy is not really the issue though. Both apps rip subs quite accurately.

[atreides93]

Thanks for the info.

I tried scenarist finally. Ok I admit initially I was really frustrated by it. hey there's no "save" button? and save as seems to erase the project somehow. ok after those initial annoyances, i guess i like it well enough :)

i successfully authored a simple 2 pgc dvd with it last night.
i'm going to try importing chapters and subtitles soon.

[Eyes`Only]

Glad to see you're finally making the switch! Yeah there's no save, changes are made on-the-fly, and when you close all changes are saved.
Work with it a bit longer and you'll realize the power you have at your fingertips now though!