----> CCE Crash. The quest continues <----

[Labersack]

I also don't know if this is the sollution, but I don't think the filesize is a sign for progess.
CCE is 'hanging' at the end of a pass, so the filesize don't have to change, it writes again from the begining of the file to its end, overwriting the changed bits but not appanding any bit.
Can this be true?

[dvd2svcd]

No that is not true, it starts from 0 between each pass.

[guru1968]

Just a little question:

How do You know, WHEN it's freezing?
isn't it so that You start the whole process and then do something else, e.g. sleeping?
- or do You just sit the whole time watching as it proceeds?
(I don't thing so...)

So when You notified the frozen window (probably the next morning) CCE has most probably finished encoding so You don't see any change any more in the mpv's size - since it's already finished...

For my friend this is true - I don't know since I don't have these problems...

If You don't even WANT to try this it's up to You, I just wanted to help!


guru

[dvd2svcd]

I do appreciate your help. But I have tested this extensively. I have a small vob file (about 11000 frames), which I do sit and look at. Besides, the freeze happen at any point, but more often than not it happens at the End Credits, and then the mpv file would seem to be finished.

[user57913]

...I know that vfapi 1.03 would solve the problems, but I never did give it much thought, considering the drop (quite a drop) in the encoding speed. But if you can live with that, maybe I should consider it...


Hi,

I always prefer a 100% working program, as a Software witch is little faster but unstably.
(Use CCE version 2.62, for 2.64 it not exist a really working cr***, the most have exactly with Multipass VBR problems!)

For get more speed with VFAPI, set the default multipass value to 3, more is unnecessary, because the CCE gets here the maximum at quality (I know not perfect, but better than nothing :))

[dvd2svcd]

@user57913:

You are right ofcourse. But I just wanted to try out every possible solution before switching (or adding) vfapi as a possibility. Besides, it seems that CCE 2.5 also works when using VFAPI 1.03. But you know, you are not the one who will be flamed, I am (and I know I will be), if I suddenly use VFAPI with the decreased speed.

[mrbass]

- 1800 min average
- 1800 max average
- 2450 max
- 300 min

ok I tried on two separate computers Henry V R1 DVD and it CCE crash/froze at 72% each time.

It crashed (twice) when I used the following bitrates:
Max 2450
Min 0
[ ]Min. avg. _____
Max. avg. 2230

It didn't crash when I used these bitrate settings:
Max 2450
Min 0
[X]Min. Avg. 1600
Max. avg. 2230

so for those who have crashes try checking [x]Min. Avg. 1600

28 sep. 2001 version 1.0.3 build 1
- The Min. Avg. can now be selected or deselected. If deselected dvd2svcd will use the bitrate calculated, no matter how low it gets.

[dvd2svcd]

Ok, I have now 99% confirmed my suspicion of bitrate overflow in CCE by using W32Dasm 8.93.
I let CCE run until it froze, and the I used W32Dasm to attach to the CCE process. And in
the debug window I suddenley got a lot of errors. Here's an excerpt of those errors

Ev0091 Debug String "CCE:***** Hi! Nice to see you. (Cinemacraft encoder ver:2.50 build:Aug 17 2000 21:02:49) *****
" @ eip:77e8f142
Ev0092 Creating Thread:00000228, sa:77e87532 @ eip:77f85f03
Ev0093 Creating Thread:00000234, sa:77e87532 @ eip:77f8224d
Ev0094 Creating Thread:00000244, sa:77e87532 @ eip:77f8a9c1
Ev0095 Creating Thread:0000023C, sa:77e87532 @ eip:77f8969f
Ev0096 Exiting Thread @ EIP:77f846a4
Ev0097 Exiting Thread @ EIP:77f846a4
Ev0098 Creating Thread:00000218, sa:77e87532 @ eip:004ba8e7
Ev0099 Debug String "CCE:***ERROR*** VBR 5772 ovf I 48072(23.5) max 47757.30(23.3) rel 314.70 1.01 qsv 2.81->2.56
" @ eip:77e8f142
Ev0100 Debug String "CCE:***ERROR*** VBR 5772 ovf I 24516(12.0) max 11376.84(5.6) rel 13139.16 2.15 qsv 11.16->10.92
" @ eip:77e8f142
Ev0101 Debug String "CCE:***ERROR*** VBR 5772 ovf I 13456(6.6) max -1447.62(-0.7) rel 14903.62 -9.30 qsv 96.00->62.00
" @ eip:77e8f142
Ev0102 Debug String "CCE:***ERROR*** VBR 5772 ovf I 13460(6.6) max -3212.08(-1.6) rel 16672.08 -4.19 qsv 96.00->62.00
" @ eip:77e8f142
Ev0103 Debug String "CCE:***ERROR*** VBR 5772 ovf I 13456(6.6) max -4980.53(-2.4) rel 18436.53 -2.70 qsv 96.00->62.00
" @ eip:77e8f142
Ev0104 Debug String "CCE:***ERROR*** VBR 5772 ovf I 13460(6.6) max -6744.99(-3.3) rel 20204.99 -2.00 qsv 96.00->62.00
" @ eip:77e8f142
Ev0105 Debug String "CCE:***ERROR*** VBR 5772 ovf I 13456(6.6) max -8513.45(-4.2) rel 21969.45 -1.58 qsv 96.00->62.00
" @ eip:77e8f142

So it does indeed seem to be a bitrate overflow. Besides, this also confirms it to be a neverending loop.
The above messages is repeated over and over again with different values.

Now, I just need to find out how to debug CCE so that this Overflow doesn't happen. BTW, it fits well into
the other suggestion about setting the max. avg. lower than what I use as default in dvd2svcd. As before I
suggest by starting by 1800 and move up from there (if you have the time of course).

[mrbass]

just wanted to throw out more food for thought...probably way off on a limb. CCE manual it says:

"In MPEG, a group of pictures is handled as a GOP (Group Of
Pictures). The structure of GOP can be changed.
Picture type In MPEG-2, three picture types, that is, an I picture,
P picture and B picture, are defined.

P picture (Predictive-coded picture)
A P picture consists of motion vectors when previous (just before) I pictures or P pictures are used for reference and differential information between a picture comprised of these motion vectors and an original picture. To decode a P picture, pictures used for reference are required, but compression can be more
effcient than I pictures. In the case of a sequence where P pictures continue, however, picture quality may deteriorate as the P picture deviates from the reference I picture, since errors accumulate during decoding due to the difference in the IDCT2 calculation method between the encoder and the decoder."

so perhaps the bitrate overflow occurs due to the huge flucation of P Picture change (black scenes) compared to the previous P picture and bitrate calculations go haywire.

[dvd2svcd]

@mrbass: Yeah, that might explain why some have had success when changing the GOP Sequence in CCE. However a GOP Sequence that works on one movie fails on another. Sigh, this is hard.

[mrbass]

28 sep. 2001 version 1.0.3 build 1 changed it to allow unchecking it. Wasn't it back in those days CCE checksum errors mostly? Has the [x]Min. Avg. bitrate 1600 already been tested by those with CCE crashes and failed? (I can't remember)

[dvd2svcd]

The min. avg has no effect on CCE (unless ofcourse if the calculated bitrate is lower than min. avg.)

The Min. Avg. is not used in CCE anywhere.

And another thing. It seems that maybe my guestimation of the speed drop when using VFAPI 1.03 infact turns out not to be as much as I thought. I'm seriously considering adding it as a possibility for people to use. Thanks user57913.

[mrbass]

why did I successfully encode Henry V ...the ONLY thing I changed was to check min. avg. 1600 which it wasn't checked before.

[dvd2svcd]

I don't know. But I do know that it isn't used anywhere besides in my bitrate calculation. Trust me I know.

Did you delete the VAF file in between?

[mrbass]

yes I did delete the .vaf ...all files except the vobs

[dvd2svcd]

Well, I have no answers for that (except that when ever I test CCE it never freezes at the same spot, it's always a random frame number). Maybe you were lucky, but I really don't know.

[user57913]

@dvd2svcd

...I'm seriously considering adding it as a possibility for people to use...


That's the way, to make a very good program still better!

Integrate an alternate possibility;
Example: add an option 'CCE 2.62 over VFAPI' to the 'CCE' Tab :) ,all user's could select what they want - Speed or absolute functionality (with 5% - 15% less speed)

(I hope the value transfer from DVD2SVCD to CCE 2.62 is not different than DVD2SVCD to CCE 2.50 - sorry, but i think CCE 2.50 is simply full bugs)

[dvd2svcd]

Hmm, this is weird. I was testing VFAPI 1.03 on the vob file that always causes a freeze in CCE, and in 2.50 I got a CRC error, but 2.64 just completely died on me, when changing from VAF to MPV creation. I better investigate this a bit further.´


EDIT:
I reinstalled vfapi 1.03 and I installed the ReadAVS dll and now it works. Implementation imminent.

[DVDHack]

I had a weird thing the other day. I let DVD2SVCD run during the day and when I got back DVD2SVCD said 66% (Video encoding) but cce had shut down, on closer inspection I found that the mpv file was complete. I wonder if this is a case where DVD2SVCD thought cce had crashed but it had in fact finished in the background.

Any thoughts on that one.

I did mux and cut - the svcd is fine.

[Labersack]

My last encoding hang at 2/3 of CCE. 5 hours later I shut down DVD2SVCD and CCE, set the dvd2svcd project position to 31 and did a crash recovery. All went fine till the end. I watched 20min. of the resulting movie without any errors. Maybe now it is not a 3pass VBR but a 2pass VBR, don't know.
Tomorow I will watch the whole movie to see if it's good till the end.

[dvd2svcd]

Maybe now it is not a 3pass VBR but a 2pass VBR, don't know

That is exactly what it is.

[Spark]

Please correct me if I'm wrong:

..but will using VFAPI v1.03/v1.04 -only to be able to use a newer version of CCE eg. v2.64/v2.62- solve anything? In other forums -the CCE- it is said that CCE 2.64 also crashes when coding VBR. Is this true or am I mistaken?
If I'm right the only proper way would be to debug the overflow in CCE v2.50 and patch it... Any news -good or bad- dvd2svcd?

Au revoir
/Spark

[dvd2svcd]

It seems that CCE works well with vfapi 1.03 (albeit slower). I am testing 1.04 right now.

[user57913]

CCE 2.64 crashes only because it not exist a working cra**, (the most of this cra**'s let the 2.64 version freeze exactly in the multipass VBR mode)
CCE 2.62 works always correctly when using Tsunamis CCE Pat**er 2.0

____
I think that VFAPI 1.03b and 1.04 use the same reader codec, only the
file converter has changed - the 1.04 can not convert AviSynth Script's

[dvd2svcd]

I think that VFAPI 1.03b and 1.04 use the same reader codec, only the file converter has changed - the 1.04 can not convert AviSynth Script's


Well, I can convert AVS files with 1.04, all you have to do is installing the ReadAVS.dll

[user57913]

...Oh - ok :)

[Mephesto]

To you people who experience freezes when the CCE process is going on: Does your whole computer crash, or does only CCE freeze? I have to reset the computer, since the mouse etc. won't react. Keep up the good work, DVD2SVCD!

[ozone]

on both of my systems (p3 800, 512MB, 440BX Chipset running Win98SE dvd2svcd 1.0.5 b4; p4 1,8 512MB, 850 Chipset on Win2k dvd2svcd 1.0.6 b1) CCE seems to stuck in a loop at 30% with 3 pass VBR since i can move my mouse and click on cancel to go back to the DVD2SVCD window. But this happens only on the PAL-version of "saving grace". 2 other movies worked right for me.

im trying "saving grace" a third time on the p4 now with the following settings:

max 2350
min 0
min. avr. (checked) 1600
max avr. 2200

thx dvd2svcd for this wonderful frontend, keep up this nice work if you have the time..

[itimpi]

I have several DVD's where I was getting freezes between the VBR passes. I have tried reducing the Max Ave bit rate to 2100 (rather than the value of 1800 that was mentioned by DVD2SVCD in an earlier post). After making this change they have all gone through without any problems - and as far as I can see no noticeable reduction in quality. Other than this change all other settings are at default values.

[dvd2svcd]

@Itimpi, I didn't mean that 1800 was the only value that worked. As you can see in another post I say start from 1800 and move up from there. Anyway, I'm glad that 2100 is working for you :)

[itimpi]

@dvd2svcd, I didn't mean that 1800 was the only value that worked. As you can see in another post I say start from 1800 and move up from there. Anyway, I'm glad that 2100 is working for you :)

I realized that. I was just intending to add further weight to the fact that the bit rate is the problem. In fact I have just got home and found that a conversion of "LA confidential" (NSTC->PAL) has failed after the first pass with the Max Ave value of 2100 so it is obviously not an universal fix even for me.

Hopefully one of the other avenues that you have mentioned as being investigated will provide a more reliable fix.

[dvd2svcd]

Ok, here's another fix for the CCE crash you can try.

In the frameserver tab, select "Edit Avs as part of CCE Encoding".

Start the conversion as usual. When it comes to the AVS edit window add this as the last line:


ConvertToRGB24


It will reduce the encoding speed, but I have had success with it to day on both my hardcases.

[Coentjo]

The use of DVD2SVCD to start CCE results in the freeze of CCE.
Loading the .avs file (with ResampleAudio(44100) as the last line) works without any problem.

What I'm wondering about is if the fact that the .avs file created by DVD2SVCD is "missing" the ResampleAudio line could be releated to the CCE freezes?

I'm going to try a conversion by dvd2svcd with "Edit .avs as part of CCE encoding" I will add the ResampleAudio line and see what happens

[NixZ]

LOL @ ----->(Location: Denmark, you know, the capitol of Sweden.) Im from Sweden. :D

[Coentjo]

Hmmmm. CCE still freezes after creating the .vaf file with the ResampleAudio added.

[Mephesto]

What does the fact that my whole computer crashes during the CCE process tell you guys? My first ever movie (The Waterboy) was ripped perfectly. After that, all movies I've tried have crashed the computer...

[chainsaw135]

Well without your system "specs" that description tells me your running 1 of 3 operating systems "WINDOWS 98, 98 SE, ME" which would give me reason 2 say you might wanna switch 2 a more stable operating system like 2000, or XP.

[Mephesto]

These are my system specs:

Athlon XP1700+
512mb SDRAM
Lots of harddrive space
64mb graphics card
OS: Win2000 SP 2

Does that tell you any more?

[chainsaw135]

Thanks well yes that tells me more have you tested ram modules?

I have windows 2000 and xp if cce crashes it does not crash the whole system. So i'm just wondering if there might be another reason behind your crash besides the issues of cce have you done testing like memory tests and other system tests?

Tho if i run cce with 98 or ME the whole system crashes..But it doesnt take much 2 crash 98 or ME specially ME.

[Fantastic]

If your system freezes and you cannot move the mouse or activate the task manager (ctrl alt +del) anymore it is obviously not the bug we are talking about in this thread.

These symptomes seem to be hardware related. Mostly it´s a cpu-cooling problem (especially on AMD Athlon cpus). That´s also the reason why you should not overclock you´re computer - even if it seems to be running smoothly with all applications - when you want to run an mpeg-encoder. For the cpu converting an DVD into an SVCD means a few hours of continous and hard mathematic operations (peremantent calculating). So the cpu might be getting too hot after a while. Try to run a tool in the background that checks your cpu- and sysmtem-temperature every few seconds and writes it down in a log-file (e.g. dr. hardware 2002). If the freezing-problem occurs again you can check the log-file to see how hight the last cpu- and system-tempeerature was.

Btw: The problem could also be related to your ram-modules or your motherboard. Just to make sure it is not any software turn off all programs that are running in the background. But it most probably is your cpu that causes the problem.

Bye

Fantastic

[mkanar]

DVD2SVCD Quote:

"...ConvertToRGB24..."

Just out of curiosity, has anyone else with trouble tried 'unclicking' the 'Try decoding in 32-bit RGB Format" in CCE?

Well, it was the first thing that worked for me, although after that it worked either way, as documented in a prior message of mine in this thread.

Thanks,
MKanar

[dvd2svcd]

@mkanar: I have tried that, but :( that didn't work on my hardcase. Thanks for the suggestion, as it might help others.

[cadbury]

CCE freezed at 99,99 % of encoding :eek: !!!
CPU usage stayed at 100% until I stopped CCE. Only CCE freezed, not my computer.
I check the encoded mpv and it seems complete to me (when it freezed, it remains only 20 seconds of encoding !).
Is there a way to make dvd2svcd restart the process after video-encoding ? When I try the crash recovery, it always try to reencode the whole thing.

I use dvd2svcd 1.0.6b1 under win2000pro.

Thanks for your help.

[kiro]

How many passes did you set?
What name of movie?

[kiro]

Movie "Shrek"
Win 2000
Pentium III 1G
128 RAM
DVD2SVCD 1.0.6 bild 1
CCE 2.5 SP (with logo)
4 pases
bitrate defaullt

CCE freezed at 24% casting of
______________________________________________
the same like above +
256 RAM
CCE 2.5 SP (without logo!)
CCE freezed at 24% casting of
______________________________________________

By hand with DVD2AVI I've made AVI file of last minute of "Shrek".
Encoded with vfapi 1.03b and 1.04; Had checked bouth files with CCE.
Bitrate and multipasses like default in DVD2SVCD - bouth files encoded without problem.

________________________________________________
win 2000
Movie "Shrek"
Pentium III 1G
256 RAM
DVD2SVCD 1.0.6 bild 7
avisynth of 05.01.02
CCE 2.5 SP (without logo)
4 pases
Bitrate: 2350 300 x1800 1800

at the very this moment 50% of casting done.
.mpv file again starts gain waight from 0KB, looks nice....

But!

In window task manager:

DVD2SVCD_________________________________Running
Cinema Craft Encoder SP__________________Not responding:angry:
50%/CCE_Encoded_Video_PAL.mpv____________Running

?????????????????????????????????
:confused:

[dvd2svcd]

DVD2SVCD_________________________________Running
Cinema Craft Encoder SP__________________Not responding
50%/CCE_Encoded_Video_PAL.mpv____________Running


That is how it should look.

[kiro]

Let us see:)

[dvd2svcd]

What is that supposed to mean! Looking in the task manager, then that is the way it is supposed to look!

[kiro]

Let us see the end.
I did not see it yet.

Sorry my Eng.