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Old 16th September 2015, 12:43   #1  |  Link
pandy
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What is current status for hardware H.265 encoding.

I'm currently aware only of 2 relatively cheap technologies with H.265 HW encoding capabilities.
1. Nvidia NVENC http://developer.download.nvidia.com...09-001_v06.pdf
2. Intel QuickSync https://software.intel.com/sites/def..._06Apr2015.pdf

My goal is to have real time encoding of H.265 with 4k, 50fps, 10 bit per component.
(but 8 bit depth for component is also acceptable - depends on many factors)

Last edited by pandy; 17th September 2015 at 09:39. Reason: 10 and 8 bit per component.
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Old 16th September 2015, 13:27   #2  |  Link
nevcairiel
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AFAIK both NVENC and QuickSync are 8-bit only for HEVC encoding, at least on current hardware.
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Old 17th September 2015, 09:38   #3  |  Link
pandy
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Originally Posted by nevcairiel View Post
AFAIK both NVENC and QuickSync are 8-bit only for HEVC encoding, at least on current hardware.
Yep, NVENC seem to be limited to 8 bit, QSV is not clear to me as i have a bit confusing information's from Intel.

----
I will change conditions in my question to 8 and 10 per component.
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Old 17th September 2015, 13:00   #4  |  Link
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There is this:

https://communities.intel.com/commun...akes-its-debut


which is close to 2x realtime for UHD at decent quality apparently. Ittiam has ready solution which works with it.
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Old 17th September 2015, 16:14   #5  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pandy View Post
I'm currently aware only of 2 relatively cheap technologies with H.265 HW encoding capabilities.
1. Nvidia NVENC http://developer.download.nvidia.com...09-001_v06.pdf
2. Intel QuickSync https://software.intel.com/sites/def..._06Apr2015.pdf

My goal is to have real time encoding of H.265 with 4k, 50fps, 10 bit per component.
(but 8 bit depth for component is also acceptable - depends on many factors)
If you are looking for a GUI you can take a look at StaxRip, it supports H.265 hardware encoding using the command line tools QSVEncC and NVEncC.

H.265 encoding with QSVEncC requires Intel Skylake.

H.265 encoding with NVEncC requires NVIDIA Maxwell but I'm not sure if all Maxwell cards support it, it definitely works with GTX 960.
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Old 18th September 2015, 15:21   #6  |  Link
pandy
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Originally Posted by kolak View Post
There is this:

https://communities.intel.com/commun...akes-its-debut


which is close to 2x realtime for UHD at decent quality apparently. Ittiam has ready solution which works with it.
Thx for this - i saw this at IBC - Intel engineers says "is completely new solution only 2 day old"...
That's why i'm trying to collect all those puzzles - in case of Intel it is extremely difficult as they have different divisions talking about same product group.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stax76 View Post
If you are looking for a GUI you can take a look at StaxRip, it supports H.265 hardware encoding using the command line tools QSVEncC and NVEncC.

H.265 encoding with QSVEncC requires Intel Skylake.

H.265 encoding with NVEncC requires NVIDIA Maxwell but I'm not sure if all Maxwell cards support it, it definitely works with GTX 960.
GUI not needed if commands are sufficiently documented, from my perspective quality is also not so important - i would have available up to 40 - 50Mbps per stream and it will be used internally (so over 1GbE link).
More important is to accept some sources and provide basic ip streaming capabilities (ffmpeg/gstreamer looks like perfect tools from my perspective).

Last edited by pandy; 18th September 2015 at 15:24.
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Old 21st September 2015, 13:25   #7  |  Link
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Thx for this - i saw this at IBC - Intel engineers says "is completely new solution only 2 day old"...
That's why i'm trying to collect all those puzzles - in case of Intel it is extremely difficult as they have different divisions talking about same product group.

Development was lead by Polish developer, Tomasz Madajczak (I think). It's quite easy to find direct email
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Old 22nd September 2015, 11:57   #8  |  Link
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Development was lead by Polish developer, Tomasz Madajczak (I think). It's quite easy to find direct email
I've contacted with Fred Fan from Intel - He said that Intel VCA should be available from now on Intel distributors list...
Need to find one...


btw slightly ot but it will be appreciated to hear some opinions about Intel analyzer and conformance/stress bitstream library (and encoder).
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Old 22nd September 2015, 18:21   #9  |  Link
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I actually wrote the original Intel Pro Analyzer from scratch when I worked there, so my opinion is of course biased. However I think it's quite good, I designed it to address the issues I've always had with other tools I've had to use before. The competing product Parabola Explorer is quite nice too.
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Old 22nd September 2015, 19:02   #10  |  Link
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... Parabola Explorer is quite nice too.
Thanks Pieter! We saw the Intel analyzer at IBC and it looked nice on a large 4k screen. In many ways it now seems remarkably similar to our Parabola Explorer but Intel is asking an order of magnitude more $ for a license.

Regarding the conformance streams, consider also those from Argon Design (no connection). Also there is a freely available set of conformance streams on the ITU website. Parabola and others have found gaps in the coverage of the ITU set and contributed our own streams to cover specific corner cases.

I understand Intel's HEVC encoding is reasonably good too although I have not had a chance to try it.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 13:49   #11  |  Link
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Thx guys - my question related to analyzer will be easier to understand when You think MTS4xxx from Tek as a reference point (both capabilities and price) so in other words - searching something similar but more affordable from $$$ perspective.

Streams - this is slightly more complex than just $$$ (but reference is of course Allegro where company i work is close to buy - i'm not convinced if with this kind of money this most optimal solution - don't get me wrong - i know that this is very niche product and due of this high price) as i need fit inside particular distribution chain where short streams looping very bad (have no clue why - i have no access to system, can't verify or change anything) - that's why Intel configurable encoder where i can generate long time sequence with particular stress will be very nice to have - stress not only to decoder but also to remain part of system, also to measure power consumption and thermal signature...

Last edited by pandy; 23rd September 2015 at 13:54.
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Old 23rd December 2015, 10:07   #12  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pandy View Post
I'm currently aware only of 2 relatively cheap technologies with H.265 HW encoding capabilities.
1. Nvidia NVENC http://developer.download.nvidia.com...09-001_v06.pdf
2. Intel QuickSync https://software.intel.com/sites/def..._06Apr2015.pdf

My goal is to have real time encoding of H.265 with 4k, 50fps, 10 bit per component.
(but 8 bit depth for component is also acceptable - depends on many factors)
From the Intel PDF the SDK is not available on Apple OSX AGAIN!

Any one could take a guess why Intel / Apple are disallowing the use of 3rd party QuickSync on OSX.
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Old 30th December 2015, 03:02   #13  |  Link
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So even if my HDTV is using 12bit output and the game I am recording uses deep color, like Alien: Isolation (10bit+), then will I still only get 8bit with NVENC?
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Old 4th January 2016, 11:46   #14  |  Link
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So even if my HDTV is using 12bit output and the game I am recording uses deep color, like Alien: Isolation (10bit+), then will I still only get 8bit with NVENC?
Seem that yes - also QSV is 8 bit limited, for 10 bit seem CPU work in kind of hybrid mode...

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From the Intel PDF the SDK is not available on Apple OSX AGAIN!

Any one could take a guess why Intel / Apple are disallowing the use of 3rd party QuickSync on OSX.
Isn't this tightly coupled with Apple business model?
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Old 13th April 2016, 01:46   #15  |  Link
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I'm surprised with how good NVENC HEVC is! I encoded my usual 1080p24 test clip in 4 Mbps VBR (15 Mbps peak) and it looked surprisingly good.

The encode ran at 150 fps on my GTX 960 / 4 Ghz quad core Skylake.
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Old 13th April 2016, 04:48   #16  |  Link
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I'm surprised with how good NVENC HEVC is! I encoded my usual 1080p24 test clip in 4 Mbps VBR (15 Mbps peak) and it looked surprisingly good.

The encode ran at 150 fps on my GTX 960 / 4 Ghz quad core Skylake.
......Be ready to cry with Nvenc HEVC lack of b-frame, SAO, 64 CTU size.

4Mbps FOR 1080P24? Use adaptive quantization and use twopass mode (VBR2Pass is really slow)

Note: I am not sure about skylake hevc encoding standard support because I don't have one.

Last edited by JohnLai; 13th April 2016 at 04:52.
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Old 14th April 2016, 18:46   #17  |  Link
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Note: I am not sure about skylake hevc encoding standard support because I don't have one.
I believe that Skylake is the first chipset to support 10-bit HEVC decode, so perhaps it's the first that might support 10-bit encode. But I don't actually know if it does.

I don't see any near-term change in the fundamental rule that HW and GPU based encoding can be great to get decent quality quickly or with low power, but that high-quality/efficiency encoding is primarily going to be done on CPU. There are some things about HEVC that may make GPU accelerated encoding more feasible than with H.264, but there are also lots more logical choices between the many more different ways to do things that need to be made, which happen on the CPU.

I'm more excited about AVX-512 to improve encoding speed (and thus allow higher quality with the same performance). It won't do much for H.264, but should be quite helpful with HEVC.
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Old 14th April 2016, 18:55   #18  |  Link
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Skylake only does hybrid 10 bit HEVC decoding. Kaby Lake will bring fixed function 10 bit decoding. Don't know about encoding.

AVX-512 is really complicated. Some chips will have it but only partially. It seems we won't get widespread AVX-512 for end users until Cannonlake.
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Old 14th April 2016, 23:23   #19  |  Link
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Only high-end Skylake Xeons will have it (2017), Cannonlake will be the first consumer generation with AVX-512, at least thats rumored so far.
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Old 15th April 2016, 04:07   #20  |  Link
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I believe that Skylake is the first chipset to support 10-bit HEVC decode, so perhaps it's the first that might support 10-bit encode. But I don't actually know if it does.

I don't see any near-term change in the fundamental rule that HW and GPU based encoding can be great to get decent quality quickly or with low power, but that high-quality/efficiency encoding is primarily going to be done on CPU. There are some things about HEVC that may make GPU accelerated encoding more feasible than with H.264, but there are also lots more logical choices between the many more different ways to do things that need to be made, which happen on the CPU.

I'm more excited about AVX-512 to improve encoding speed (and thus allow higher quality with the same performance). It won't do much for H.264, but should be quite helpful with HEVC.
Well, for some, it is all speed and quality regardless of file size (how much does 4TB HDD cost anyway?)

The only problem I have with hardware based encoder is the standard support. I was planning to buy new budget Skylake CPU to replace my old Pentium Dual Core E5700. But after reading Intel response about B-frame.......I kinda hesitate...

https://software.intel.com/en-us/for...k/topic/623600

So, what is Low Delay B-frames (LDB) or Generalized P/B (GPB) ???
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