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Old 15th July 2020, 12:53   #1  |  Link
YaBoyShredderson
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Staxrip, HDR, 4K Blurays, NVenc HEVC??????

This is my first time posting in these forums, so I apologize if this is in the wrong place.

When I encode 1080p SDR blurays, I use handbrake, as its perfectly adequate for my needs. Those needs are to compress my movies to save space, but remain high quality as to be indistinguishable from the source.

With handbrake, all the videos are 1080p SDR h.264, so I use x264 CRF 18 veryslow high profile level 4.1 with the film tune. Other settings I may adjust on a case by case basis but that's the jist of it.

I heard staxrip is the best GUI encoder for HDR content, but I have no idea how to use it, and it also takes an absurd amount of time with x265. I did a little testing with nvenc hevc with my very limited knowledge and it seems to be faar too soft, at a qp of 18, but its miles faster.

any help? I have the same goals with 4k hdr as 1080p sdr, a transparent encode. I also plan on getting a new CPU when ryzen 4000 is released, which could help with speed, but if nvenc can be used for my goals, that would be even faster.

what's the hdr ingest thing? what settings do I need to change and how do I save that custom preset to be loaded by default? so I don't have to keep setting up every time I want to do something. I don't know anything when it comes to all these setting like look ahead or cu size or whatever, so if someone can tell what to change/tick or untick in all the menus, and then save it as default, something that will work with everything, that would be great. even if I have to adjust certain settings on a case by case basis, that would be miles easier than adjusting the whole thing.

I'm a big noob when it comes to x265, hdr, and staxrip, so sorry if I've been a bit rambly.
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Old 15th July 2020, 17:41   #2  |  Link
LeXXuz
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I can't tell you much about StaxRip, as I don't use it.

But I can tell you if you want the best ratio between speed, filesize and visual quality, there are not many alternatives to x.264/x.265 encoders.

And don't get your hopes up too high with the upcoming Ryzen 4000 series.

HEVC encoding takes time, especially with 4k content IF you want to have a decent quality.

I have two rigs running 24/7 with an AMD Ryzen 9 3900 and a Ryzen 9 3950. With 4k material I usually end up somewhere between 1-4FPS (custom "slower" preset) for HEVC encoding, depending on source material and filter settings. 1080p somewhere between 5-15 FPS (again, custom "slower" preset).

x.264/AVC is a different story. 1080p at x.264's "very slow" preset ends up with 50FPS and beyond.

(You see there is a huge difference between HEVC and AVC when it comes to encoding speed.)

Even if Ryzen 4000 would be like 50% faster than 3000 Series (which is a very very optimistic guess) you'll still end up with speeds somewhere between 2-6 FPS.

I'm just talking about consumer CPUs. Threadripper may be a total different story. But you'll have to spend a lot of money for CPU, board and RAM...

Long story short: IF you want a decent quality you have to be patient with your encodes.
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Old 15th July 2020, 18:50   #3  |  Link
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And unless there are specific HDR presets, you'll also want to change some parameters. --hdr10-opt tunes chroma QPs to be better for HDR-10, for example. Maybe share your whole command line?

An essentially free minor speedup can be gained from using --selective-sao 2. x265 has gained a lot of new parameters since the presets were last refactored, which should be used in presets but aren't yet.

If you have lots of unused cores, which seems likely, --pmode can improve fps some at the cost of way more compute/heat/watts.

And don't use --tune film with x265 unless it's particularly grainy content. The default tune is better for most content, and I think would be somewhat faster as well due to rskip being used, and having lower bitrates overall.

But no way around 4K being slow. I've got dual Xeon Gold 6240 CPU @ 2.60GHz, 18/36 cores, and high-quality encodes can still run below 1 fps for 4K HDR. Even a more balanced speed/quality tradeoff is maybe 3 fps.
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Old 15th July 2020, 19:07   #4  |  Link
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So nvenc is out of the question then? Tbh my main problem with speed isnt so much the amount of time it takes to encode, more so how long for 1 file. Im not the only one using my computer, at least at the moment so i often have to stop encoding after the current one is complete, and as they are mainly series, its never any longer than an hour or so. My 4k content is movies though, so a 20 hour long encode is out of the question right now. I guess i would have to wait until i have it to my self to encode.
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Old 15th July 2020, 20:08   #5  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YaBoyShredderson View Post
So nvenc is out of the question then?
That really depends on what your goal is.

Again:
-If time is your most concern than a 'hardware' encoder like nvenc is probably the fastest way to encode your files.
-If quality is your concern you should use a software encoder like x26x family.
-If quality AND filesize is your concern than there is no way around software encoders like x26x family.

Last edited by LeXXuz; 15th July 2020 at 20:12.
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Old 15th July 2020, 21:00   #6  |  Link
YaBoyShredderson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeXXuz View Post
That really depends on what your goal is.

Again:
-If time is your most concern than a 'hardware' encoder like nvenc is probably the fastest way to encode your files.
-If quality is your concern you should use a software encoder like x26x family.
-If quality AND filesize is your concern than there is no way around software encoders like x26x family.
So with nvenc, its obviously going to be less efficient, but can it maintain transparency at say half the file size still? Even if software can do the same at at one third or whatever, like x264 can with my 1080p blurays.

All im looking for is half the size thereabouts, as long as i can do that, im good. But quality is more important so if software is the only way i guess thats what ill have to do.
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Old 15th July 2020, 21:41   #7  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YaBoyShredderson View Post
So with nvenc, its obviously going to be less efficient, but can it maintain transparency at say half the file size still?
Well, there is no way to give you a straight answer to that.
That highly depends on your source material and of course on what your eyes would consider as a transparent encode.

You may achieve this goal with very clean sources, although other nasty things like banding will probably show up on your encodes.

Encoding an old/grainy movie is much more of a challenge. Doing a transparent encode and reducing file size in half is a next to impossible task with NVenc from my experience.

I'd say do a couple of encodes and see if those suit your personal demands.

I did some tests with NVenc a couple of month ago. And my personal conclusion was: nice to have if you are pressed for time and need a quick encode but no alternative to encodes with x264/x265.

But to be fair, my eyes are very picky and after 20 years of working with digital video I know exactly where to look for flaws in a video encode.
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Old 15th July 2020, 21:46   #8  |  Link
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Fair enough, software it is then i suppose, as i have a little bit of an eye for quality to.
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Old 18th July 2020, 20:33   #9  |  Link
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If u understand German, i have wrote a little PDF Document for StaxRip HDR to SDR converting.
You can send me a message, if u need it.
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Old 21st July 2020, 13:17   #10  |  Link
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I want to retain HDR not convert to SDR
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Old 25th July 2020, 22:23   #11  |  Link
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Try Cine Encoder 2020 SE, but there is only a Linux version

https://www.pling.com/p/1406740/
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Old 28th July 2020, 02:36   #12  |  Link
BobbyBoberton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YaBoyShredderson View Post
I want to retain HDR not convert to SDR
Might want to take a look at my thread in this sub-forum on conservation of HDR10 info. I was mainly talking about handbrake and DaVinci Resolve to begin with but realized all I really needed was the correct ffmpeg/x265 commands and then learn how to apply those settings in staxrip. It won't tell you everything you need to know but one thing you may or may not already know about HDR is that you have to check each source file for its max-cll (max-cll and FALL are done in the same variable) and make sure your luminance values are correct and that you are using the correct 'master-display' parameters (P3 or BT2020, P3 is most common but still its worth checking). So a lot more work goes into running a batch encode of HDR content than SDR as each files HDR specs have to be incorporated into the encoding command, unless they have the same max-cll and luminance and master-display I suppose.

Here is a link to that thread so you don't have to find it yourself:

https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=181570

Last edited by BobbyBoberton; 28th July 2020 at 21:47. Reason: link to my thread on Doom9
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