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26th January 2018, 11:13 | #48661 | Link | |
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I like the brand, I'd like to see it improve.. If need be I'll contact the support team here if you provide me with the right info, but chances are you could contact higher up just as easily. |
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26th January 2018, 11:53 | #48662 | Link |
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there support is not trained for this. which is not unusual.
the hotline gave me a email and that email said to me. a PC can't send UHD so you can't use the pure direct mode 4K so there is no issue. please by an panasonic UHD BD player. so they clearly not trained for this too. and this is as high as i could get. and trust me i tried. but if you want some info here you go: model: TX-55CXW704 serial number: ND 5640071 issue: 3:2 judder with pure direct mode. the TV doesn't add judder if it is not in pure direct mode. pure direct mode is Panasonic name for "PC mode" |
26th January 2018, 12:00 | #48663 | Link |
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Just some info for 60hz vs 23hz – MADVR / OLED users -
I use 23 hz to ensure i'm getting matched rates and zero stutter or drops, AMD cards do this really well with zero fuss as we all know. However with OLED, TVs panning shots can sometimes look pretty bad compared to LCD as LCD blurs the frames slightly on pans and OLED does not. With OLED you can sometimes see jagged edges as bright elements are panned across the screen, some people don’t noticed this, some do, this is a technology issue though, the screen response times on OLEDs are much quicker than LCDs, this is a known quantity. This initially didn’t bother me but over time I kept noticing it so I decided to have a play with a few tools. I tried MADVR and SVP, both worked well to deal with these issues but I couldn’t get rid of the odd frame stutter now and again, granted it was only maybe 2-3 per movie but this is still unacceptable to me. It was then I thought I’d try the TV’s own TRUMOTION, I’d been advised by many people not to go near this but I found it worked perfectly as long as I kept it on a low setting. I now have a very clean image with zero stutters and drops. I use position 3 out of 10 A good scene to test this on is Elysium at the beginning. This is a super long panning shot and at one point a very bright earth pans to one about 1:17. You can see the jagged edges on this and the the space station as that pans too, this looks pretty awful with no motion interpolation. With TRUMOTION its 95% free of issues. This is also why I dont use PC mode on this TV, I use bluray mode as PC mode disables trumotion. |
26th January 2018, 12:31 | #48664 | Link |
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ha the good old rubbish of OLED and perfect motion...
while in theory they can have the best they don't have it in practise the closest is the sony A1E with 60 HZ BFI for really good results you need 120 HZ BFI and the "strobing" is only 50 % which is not amazing at all. so that leaves the good old eye tracking motion resokution at 300-600p LCD can easily do 2160p. OLED got only one part correct and that's response time. which maeks them generally better than VA panels without BFI but that's it. and the screen with the best motion handle is an LCD http://i.rtings.com/images/reviews/m...-bfi-large.jpg 6 bit TN panel AKA the godfather of motion (CRT are better but what ever...) even the sony OLEd is clearly not up to the task but LG OLEd can't even reach this: http://i.rtings.com/images/reviews/t...-bfi-large.jpg |
26th January 2018, 12:48 | #48666 | Link |
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Opinions on motion interpolation seem to differ greatly.
When I got my LG Oled I played around with Truemotion alot, tried pretty much all settings but came to the conclusion that it just causes way to many errors for a enjoyable viewing experience, even at a low setting. It does a good job with simple panning shots, but whenever the scene is more complex and there is a lot of movement of smaller parts going on it often messes up really badly. Also LG's truemotion can absolutely not deal with flickering lightning, like if a scene is lit by fire or a torch it causes heavy artifacts over the whole picture. Game of Thrones was unwatchable with it enabled. Or just 2 people going past each other from different directions pretty much always causes visible artifacts. As much as I hate the slideshow that 24 fps is, motion interpolation with it's errors is even worse for me, I also tried SVP which isn't much better. Whats really sad is that the technology for smooth 60 fps content is there, as it's within UHD Bluray specs but nobody is making use of it. The only exception being billy lynn. |
26th January 2018, 13:17 | #48667 | Link |
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lets not get into an OLED VS LCD flame war please, its subjective, pointless and has been done to death, lets just agree that Micro LED is the way forward , we should all be able to agree on this.
I dont see any artifacts at all and its not just a bit better it loads better on panning shots, I do get artefacts above 3 though so maybe knock it down a notch until they disappear - not sure about later OLED though, mine is first gen and I genuinely have a really crisp clear picture. NOTE - there have been some firmware related issues with motion on LG OLEDs, mine did have problems at one point but current FIRMWARE is spot on. |
26th January 2018, 15:33 | #48668 | Link |
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@mclingo: MicroLED is not the way, it's signage tech brought down into rich man's batcave to replace a projector...they will never be able to bring it down to the PPI required for normal screen sizes...when you disabled all processing, did you do that with Clear LED option (i.e BFI) as well? When you bring the brightness all the way up, is motion any worse?
@huhn: I may be wrong but I don't see how response time that is less than a frame's duration can attribute to motion blur...it's this misconception that led people to conclude that OLEDs should have great motion because they have minimal response time while in reality they still exhibit motion blur because of sample-and-hold technique....that TN panel you linked iz 144 Hz, so 144 fps motion should be pretty good,but how's with 24 or 60 fps? The photo is taken with BFi on, so motion is sharp because of BFI, not because it's repsonse time is 1 ms Last edited by mytbyte; 26th January 2018 at 15:50. |
26th January 2018, 16:11 | #48669 | Link | |
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lol, I know someone would disagree, Samsung have claimed they will have a home sized / priced microled TV sometime in the next 1-9 years, yes this maybe vaporware, we'll just have to see, i'm personally confident they'll manage it. I always have TRUMOTION on manual, i've not experimented with brightness, however I have the same settings on my 3D profile which has brightness set to 100, no motion issues at all, its just as perfect. However, if you move to "4" with 3D you get 3D artifacts around moving figures in the scene, these completely disappear for me on 3 and below. |
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26th January 2018, 16:45 | #48670 | Link |
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@mclingo:
Download this youtube video so you can play it through madvr or whatever and turn truemotion on. My C6 can't even interpolate the moving square on the left side without artifacts, It basically breaks apart when it hits the edge, even with dejudder set to 1. Same result when playing it directly to the TV through usb. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVtoxUohG5E No artifacts? |
26th January 2018, 16:48 | #48671 | Link | |
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is this the same one? https://www.dropbox.com/s/ghuz4qpt8v...0test.mp4?dl=0 |
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26th January 2018, 16:55 | #48672 | Link | |
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AFAIK, DXVA's ivtc only works in DXVA Native, and maybe also only with EVR.
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HTPC: Windows 10 22H2, MediaPortal 1, LAV Filters/ReClock/madVR. DVB-C TV, Panasonic GT60, Denon 2310, Core 2 Duo E7400 oc'd, GeForce 1050 Ti 536.40 |
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26th January 2018, 17:16 | #48675 | Link | |
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- IFC (renamed '24p Smooth Film') at Min: the squares are pretty much OK, but distracting artefacts on the bigger circle, smaller circle fine - at Medium: the artefacts on the bigger circle strangely become less obvious, but now the squares especially the left one start showing distracting artefacts - at High, which switches the panel to 60 Hz instead of 96 Hz: the squares and the bigger circle now are pretty much free of distracting artefacts which is impressive, however the smaller circle now produces massive ghosting artefacts! Also this level gives an awful soap opera effect to everything so it's useless for me anyway. Back to IFC off.
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HTPC: Windows 10 22H2, MediaPortal 1, LAV Filters/ReClock/madVR. DVB-C TV, Panasonic GT60, Denon 2310, Core 2 Duo E7400 oc'd, GeForce 1050 Ti 536.40 |
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26th January 2018, 17:44 | #48676 | Link | |
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Intel Media SDK is necessary to correctly decode 3D video. Madvr was not the problem, it works perfectly. |
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26th January 2018, 18:09 | #48677 | Link | |
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Fortunately, AFAIK relative colorimetric is the default in most tools (and is the suggested choice in the ArgyllCMS video docs for example), so I believe most people are getting this right. |
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26th January 2018, 18:34 | #48678 | Link | |
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26th January 2018, 18:44 | #48679 | Link |
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Yes, I somehow missed the link to sony OLED...the difference must be in the implementation of BFI, not response time (OLED is better than TN)...also I am a bit sceptic of the precision of how Rtings take those photos, I've seen them match the camera move with the onscreen moving logo by hand
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26th January 2018, 20:05 | #48680 | Link | |
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If that's really the case then that test is of no value whatsoever.
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HTPC: Windows 10 22H2, MediaPortal 1, LAV Filters/ReClock/madVR. DVB-C TV, Panasonic GT60, Denon 2310, Core 2 Duo E7400 oc'd, GeForce 1050 Ti 536.40 |
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Tags |
direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling |
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