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Old 18th December 2015, 01:18   #181  |  Link
Asmodian
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Updated for madVR v0.89.18
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Old 23rd December 2015, 01:59   #182  |  Link
Nullack
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Thanks for the guide Asmodian

Can I suggest adding that Nvidia 3D Stereoscopic vision isnt compatible with madVR. This isnt just packed frames like you mention. madVR needs 3D vision disabled in the nvidia control panel.

Perhaps also stating what are the default settings for them all. Like auto FSE is default.

Thanks
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Old 23rd December 2015, 21:26   #183  |  Link
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Thank you very much for the guide!

Are you o.k. with recommended options questions in this guide or should I go somewhere else?
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Old 23rd December 2015, 23:22   #184  |  Link
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I am happy to answer questions for recommended options but I cannot put them in the guide without a lot of discussion of specific hardware.

Anything that is definite I do try to add but that is only a few things like do not turn off dithering.
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Old 23rd December 2015, 23:25   #185  |  Link
Asmodian
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Originally Posted by Nullack View Post
Thanks for the guide Asmodian

Can I suggest adding that Nvidia 3D Stereoscopic vision isnt compatible with madVR. This isnt just packed frames like you mention. madVR needs 3D vision disabled in the nvidia control panel.

Perhaps also stating what are the default settings for them all. Like auto FSE is default.

Thanks
This is a good idea, I will add both ideas when I get a chance. Thanks.
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Old 27th December 2015, 06:46   #186  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
I am happy to answer questions for recommended options but I cannot put them in the guide without a lot of discussion of specific hardware.

Anything that is definite I do try to add but that is only a few things like do not turn off dithering.
Thank you!

I've read through a lot of pages on the main madvr thread but the thread is really a little too ridiculous to catch up :/

I got some questions regarding the upscaling algorithms and filters:
For Luma:
The way I read it, NNedi3 and Jinc are still the overall best quality filters.
SuperRes got me some additional non-destructive sharpness, especially with SD sources. Is there any harm in doing it 4 times (highest option)? What are the advantages/disadvantages in doing it in LL?

For Chroma:
I've read a lot of people using Jinc or even NNEDI3 for chroma. Are those people talking anime? Because as far as I know the artifact hiding properties of SoftCubic (I use 80 softness) is desirable for chroma, as too sharp chroma can look unnatural (especially for SD sources, doubling the chroma with NNEDI first looks better though). Is SuperRes for chroma desirable?
Afaik chroma for anime/cartoon is a different story and behaves more like Luma.

Last edited by SpoCk0nd0pe; 27th December 2015 at 07:06.
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Old 27th December 2015, 11:54   #187  |  Link
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For Luma: you are right about Jinc and NNEDI3 in my opinion but comparing Jinc to super-xbr is hard. Important only if you don't have the performance for NNEDI3. Some do like xbr more than NEEDI3 though so best is hard to say for sure. Lanczos is sharper than Jinc too.

SuperRes has diminishing returns with more passes, less benefit for the extra performance hit. As I understand linear light for SuperRes emphasizes erorr in small light details while gamma light emphasizes small dark details. There difference is fairly subtle in my experience.

For Chroma: I agree, madshi added SoftCubic for chroma and it was the default at first. A very reasonable choice for filmed content. I also agree that anime is different and sharper chroma scaling is more beneficial. People do like sharp though.
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Old 27th December 2015, 16:34   #188  |  Link
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Thank you for your quick response!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
SuperRes has diminishing returns with more passes, less benefit for the extra performance hit. As I understand linear light for SuperRes emphasizes erorr in small light details while gamma light emphasizes small dark details. There difference is fairly subtle in my experience.
Just to make sure I got you right: You are saying that LL on is better for darker scenes while LL off is better for brighter ones? Which one do you prefer?
An SuperRes is mostly a case of more helps more? SuperRes seems to hide some SVP artifacts btw. Especially the halos on panning camera movements and bright background seem less agressive with SuperRes.
In what cases is SuperRes harming the image? Are those cases negligible?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
For Chroma: I agree, madshi added SoftCubic for chroma and it was the default at first. A very reasonable choice for filmed content. I also agree that anime is different and sharper chroma scaling is more beneficial. People do like sharp though.
I do think that NNEDI64 chroma doubling helps image quality if you also do luma doubling. Before doing SoftCubic upscaling that is.

What do you think about SuperRes for chroma upscaling refinement (for film content)? Does it improve the picture without the overly sharp look of Jinc? Do you use it and if yes, what settings do you use?
I would bet it is desirable for anime.
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Old 27th December 2015, 19:37   #189  |  Link
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Gamma light SuperRes is more correct when the image has been downscaled before in gamma light. But as we usually can't know how the material we feed madVR with has been downscaled, this doesn't really matter.
So, in practice you can say: LL SR is darker, GL brighter. LL SR often makes dark lines fat, that's why GL probably can be considered as better or at least the better default setting.
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Old 30th December 2015, 01:29   #190  |  Link
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Originally Posted by SpoCk0nd0pe View Post
Just to make sure I got you right: You are saying that LL on is better for darker scenes while LL off is better for brighter ones? Which one do you prefer?
An SuperRes is mostly a case of more helps more? SuperRes seems to hide some SVP artifacts btw. Especially the halos on panning camera movements and bright background seem less agressive with SuperRes.
In what cases is SuperRes harming the image? Are those cases negligible?
To be honest I do not use SuperRes or SVP (I cannot handle SVP's artifacts). I find SuperRes adds back minor aliasing which was present in the source and which NNEDI3 doubling removed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoCk0nd0pe View Post
I do think that NNEDI64 chroma doubling helps image quality if you also do luma doubling. Before doing SoftCubic upscaling that is.

What do you think about SuperRes for chroma upscaling refinement (for film content)? Does it improve the picture without the overly sharp look of Jinc? Do you use it and if yes, what settings do you use?
I would bet it is desirable for anime.
I agree that there is something nice about using NNEDI3 chroma doubling when using luma doubling but I generally do not like NNED3 chroma upscaling. I always use Jinc AR for image upscaling and I do not consider Jinc very sharp.

I normally use Jinc AR for chroma upscaling except for very low resolution sources when I sometimes use NNEDI3 64. I never use SuperRes for chroma. I also quite like Mitchell-Netravali without AR for chroma upscaling, when testing I tend to pick one or the other depending on the source (and mood? ). SoftCubic is a bit too soft for me unless the source is very low quality.

I have never found universal settings for upscaling refinement, my optimal settings are entirely source dependent.
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Old 31st December 2015, 14:41   #191  |  Link
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Thanks for the guide Asmodian
Where is the guide? Is it the first page?
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Old 1st January 2016, 00:10   #192  |  Link
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The first two posts. It is not really a guide, more of a reference to make it easier to pick your own settings.

MadVR does not lend itself to a complete guide in my opinion. To much is dependent on personal preference, the particular display, the computer's hardware, the content, etc.
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Old 1st January 2016, 05:14   #193  |  Link
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How can I use IVTC to decimate a video fps 59.940 to fps 24.970?

As I remembered, I've done it with success once.
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Old 1st January 2016, 05:35   #194  |  Link
Asmodian
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All you should need is to enable IVTC.
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Old 1st January 2016, 15:30   #195  |  Link
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All you should need is to enable IVTC.
Well, problem is, I cannot find the shortcut to enable IVTC now.

Could someone confirm the ways of enable it has been changed for latest version of madVR?
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Old 1st January 2016, 15:34   #196  |  Link
huhn
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control +shift + alternative +d = deinterlancing
than control +shift + alternative +t to switch to film mode.
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Old 2nd January 2016, 16:41   #197  |  Link
SpoCk0nd0pe
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Quote:
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I find SuperRes adds back minor aliasing which was present in the source and which NNEDI3 doubling removed.
Yes, I see that too. It is really very minor though and imho worth the overall improvements in image quality.

I do not like overly sharp chroma, even with HD content. SoftCubic 80 is the sweet spot for me personally. But scaling too much with just soft cubic makes the chroma too burred imho, so doing doubling first is nice.

Thanks a lot for the input!
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Old 8th January 2016, 09:44   #198  |  Link
Nullack
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rendering

general settings:
enable windowed overlay (Windows 7 and newer): Only available on Nvidia and Intel GPUs. Uses a low level overlay method which bypasses the GPU LUT (monitor profile) so madVR emulates it when using this option, this is done in 16-bit so madVR can provide better quality than the GPU. Overlay also bypasses the OS to a large extent; screen-shots are not possible.
use Direct3D 11 for presentation (Windows 7 and newer): Use Direct3D 11 instead of D3D9. Requires a restart of madVR to take effect. Required for >8 bit output. Overrides windowed overlay.
present a frame for every VSync: when disabled madVR only presents new frames when needed, relying on D3D11 to repeat frames for each VSync. Disabled may improve performance but may also cause presentation glitches.
Hi

So even if I have enable window overlay set to on, if I have DX11 also set to on, the window overlay is disabled? The UI settings allow both to be on.

Since DX11 is required for >8bit output thats the option Im interested in. Is there any general commentary on the DX11 setting in practical use?

Testing on Win 10 x64 is showing many presentation glitches if the present frame for each Vysnc is not enabled. This is with my setup being Nvidia GTX 960, UHD 4K display through HDMI 60 FPS.

Thanks
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Old 8th January 2016, 09:50   #199  |  Link
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disable desktop composition (Vista and Windows 7): Disables Aero which has its own v-sync that can conflict with madVRís.
Is this setting not applicable for Windows 10 installations?
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Old 8th January 2016, 09:54   #200  |  Link
Asmodian
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Hi

So even if I have enable window overlay set to on, if I have DX11 also set to on, the window overlay is disabled? The UI settings allow both to be on.

Since DX11 is required for >8bit output thats the option Im interested in. Is there any general commentary on the DX11 setting in practical use?

Testing on Win 10 x64 is showing many presentation glitches if the present frame for each Vysnc is not enabled. This is with my setup being Nvidia GTX 960, UHD 4K display through HDMI 60 FPS.

Thanks
Yes, if you enable DX11 overlay is never used. You can verify this in the OSD.

DX11 works well on my system, slightly more responsive than DX9 or overlay with similar performance (I am also using Win10 x64 but with a Nvidia GTX 980 Ti). I also need present frame for each Vsync enabled. Both DX11 and full screen exclusive are required for 10 bit output. Don't forget to change the bit-depth in the display's properties as well.

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Is this setting not applicable for Windows 10 installations?
Yes, it does not apply for Windows 8 or 10. Desktop composition cannot be disabled on Windows 8 or 10.
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