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Old 24th January 2013, 20:36   #41  |  Link
xooyoozoo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEEB View Post
HM will most probably not match the spec for quite a while I would guess, just like JM had issues years after ratification of the standard.
I don't know much about the the JCT's most recent meeting, but in the past, I've noticed that it sometimes took a couple months for changes adopted at a meeting to make their way into the repository.

I've also noticed in the draft text that they added grain flags as an option for the bitstream and that those flags also existed in AVC. Anyone know if there were ever any h264 products that took advantage of those flags? It seems that almost all of AVC's growing pains in the marketplace (plasticky encodes) would have been alleviated with some smart decoding action.
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Old 25th January 2013, 16:04   #42  |  Link
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Quote:
Anyone know if there were ever any h264 products that took advantage of those flags?
No. IIRC DarkShikary sayed that it useless. I suppose better to encode clean or filtred source and when playing add deband/grain filters on your taste.

Edit:
http://wiki.videolan.org/SoC_x264_2008
Quote:
An integral part of the standard... but supported by basically nothing despite its potential usefulness.
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Old 25th January 2013, 16:06   #43  |  Link
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Your quote doesn't really back up what you claim. It says "despite it's potential usefulness". If it was "useless" it wouldn't have "potential usefulness".
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Old 25th January 2013, 16:08   #44  |  Link
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Originally Posted by D3C0D3R View Post
No. IIRC DarkShikary says that it useless.

http://wiki.videolan.org/SoC_x264_2008
He doesn't says it's useless. He says that it's potentially useful but not supported.
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Old 25th January 2013, 16:15   #45  |  Link
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Originally Posted by paradoxical View Post
Your quote doesn't really back up what you claim. It says "despite it's potential usefulness". If it was "useless" it wouldn't have "potential usefulness".
Sorry. I didnt found better quote. But i've seen post explaining things like that added rather on behalf of patent holders.
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Old 25th January 2013, 16:16   #46  |  Link
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Originally Posted by D3C0D3R View Post
Sorry. I didnt found better quote. But i've seen post explaining things like that added rather on behalf of patent holders.
Yes, that is a bad quote. It says the opposite of your claim. Also:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Shikari View Post
Film Grain Modelling is a great idea but nearly nobody has implemented it (not even JM), so there's very little to go off of. We'd basically be starting from nothing, and we'd need to implement it in libavcodec too.
Now it's more than possible he's changed his mind since then, but I've found nothing from him through searching that has him saying it's useless.

Last edited by paradoxical; 25th January 2013 at 16:41.
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Old 25th January 2013, 17:13   #47  |  Link
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FGM wasn't useless indeed, but its implementation was so limited it was generally very hard to implement it and see if it worked at all. Now-dead HD-DVD did contain support for it, but I'm not sure if any discs actually used it, or if any decoders bundled with HD-DVD players supported it.

JM not supporting it was also a large thing against it, as it often is used to test an implementation. The fact that JM was broken with lossless encoding for ages (the newer thing in High 4:4:4 Profile), and the fact that the specification was (not on purpose) readable in a way that was not meant by the creators of the specification, were the reasons that led to the lossless encoding mode of x264 to be out-of-spec. It still is, and nothing will be done about it because everything else that implements it (libavcodec, CoreAVC etc.) implements it in the way that x264 implemented it (I think it was either in 2010 or 2011 that someone actually found out about the difference in implementation compared to the specification).
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Old 26th January 2013, 07:11   #48  |  Link
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ITU has approved this codec...

Quote:
Companies including ATEME, Broadcom, Cyberlink, Ericsson, Fraunhofer HHI, Mitsubishi and NHK have already showcased implementations of HEVC. The new standard includes a ‘Main’ profile that supports 8-bit 4:2:0 video, a ‘Main 10’ profile with 10-bit support, and a ‘Main Still Picture’ profile for still image coding that employs the same coding tools as a video ‘intra’ picture.

The ITU/ISO/IEC Joint Collaborative Team on Video Coding (JCT-VC) (formerly JVT) will continue work on a range of extensions to HEVC, including support for 12-bit video as well as 4:2:2 and 4:4:4 chroma formats. Another important element of this work will be the progression of HEVC towards scalable video coding. The three bodies will also work within the Joint Collaborative Team on 3D-Video (JCT-3V) on the extension of HEVC towards stereoscopic and 3D video coding.
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Old 26th January 2013, 11:54   #49  |  Link
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What are the use case for 10bit support? Doesn't x264 currently does internal 10bit encoding?

I really hope the Still Picture takes off. I have enough of Jpeg.

I hope there is an x265.
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Old 26th January 2013, 12:23   #50  |  Link
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Yeah, I just read this as I woke up. And here I thought they'd only decide after it was officially ratified (after the FDIS ballot). I guess not. This just means that I can't tell people not to call it H.265 any more, as it now (finally) is officially set to that number (it used to be called ITU-T H.HEVC before).
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Old 26th January 2013, 12:34   #51  |  Link
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Quote:
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That's great news... I wonder how quickly we'll see hardware decoding (and encoding) support?
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Old 26th January 2013, 13:08   #52  |  Link
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According to Golem.de devices with Broadcoms HEVC decoder chip are planed for mid 2014.
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Old 26th January 2013, 17:56   #53  |  Link
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Nearly ratified then Lets hope that nvidia and AMD add decoding support into the programmable areas of their gpus like they did with h264 before they created dedicated silicon in their gpu's for h.264. I reckon intel will probably have dedicated silicon in their chips within 18 months as they have a lot of cash to throw at it.

Now someone go do an in-depth test on how good it's compression is at 720x400, 1280x720, 1920x1080

Last edited by hajj_3; 26th January 2013 at 18:07.
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Old 26th January 2013, 18:24   #54  |  Link
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Before you can run useful tests you need a good implementation for the new codec. Perhaps x264 will be extended to support the new codec.
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Old 28th January 2013, 10:13   #55  |  Link
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Looks like x265 project (not related to x264 though) has been updated few days ago...

Quote:
--- Status ---
The final version is 201209, these source will upload at Q3 2013.
The latest source is 201206.

Currently, the project is suspend.

I will working on my commercial version(GPU based) late, and I will come back after the Chinese New Year of 2013.
My attempt of GPU Intra failed, the NVidia Kepler GPU switch so slower, I will continue try it.


Excuse me, I am busy now, so the executeable is up to date, but the source have delay released about 6-9 months.
The SDK will upload after HM-N.0 has released, the latest SDK match to HM-9.0


I am wait a week, but there are no HM-9.2, so I sync to HM-9.2rc1

The code is develop on my x86 platform.
The x64 platform is not office support now
If you use the x64 system, please change UInt32 and Int32 from "int" to "long" in file config.h by youself.

I will decide next year's whereabouts during January, I have no more time to wasting.
I guess it comes down to a simple choice: Get busy living, or get busy dying.

Last Update: 26th Jan, 2013
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Old 28th January 2013, 10:32   #56  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEEB View Post
hm_9.2_r3282_release built and added (contains the configuration files for that revision as well)
The TAppDecoder.exe does not work to me. I did tried it on Win8/Win7 x64 .


Code:
hm_9.2_r3282_release>TAppDecoder.exe -b ChinaSpeed_1024x768_30_qp37.bi
n -o 123.yuv

HM software: Decoder Version [9.2rc1][Windows][VS 1600][32 bit]
Assertion failed: uiCode == 3, file ..\..\source\Lib\TLibDecoder\TDecCAVLC.cpp,
line 657
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Old 28th January 2013, 14:12   #57  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edison View Post
The TAppDecoder.exe does not work to me. I did tried it on Win8/Win7 x64 .
WorksForMe with a HM 9.2-encoded stream.

Code:
TAppDecoder.exe -b zeroma_HM9.2.hevc -o zeroma_HM9.2.yuv

HM software: Decoder Version [9.2rc1][Windows][VS 1600][32 bit] 
TDecCavlc::parsePPS():	m_bUseWeightPred=0	m_uiBiPredIdc=0

POC    0 TId: 0 ( I-SLICE, QP 20 ) [DT  0.006] [L0 ] [L1 ] [:,,,(unk)]
...
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Old 28th January 2013, 20:46   #58  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edison View Post
The TAppDecoder.exe does not work to me. I did tried it on Win8/Win7 x64 .


Code:
hm_9.2_r3282_release>TAppDecoder.exe -b ChinaSpeed_1024x768_30_qp37.bi
n -o 123.yuv

HM software: Decoder Version [9.2rc1][Windows][VS 1600][32 bit]
Assertion failed: uiCode == 3, file ..\..\source\Lib\TLibDecoder\TDecCAVLC.cpp,
line 657
You have to match the decoder revision with whatever was used to encode the bitstream.
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Old 29th January 2013, 13:57   #59  |  Link
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Except the reference decoder and the libav experimental branch, is there a free decoder available yet ?
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Old 29th January 2013, 19:41   #60  |  Link
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No idea about exact details, but smarter did note that the OpenHEVC folk were also making their own decoder, and using HM + smarter's decoder to test results against.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IRC
...
< JEEB> openhevc
< JEEB> some french project of some uni
<@BBB> they're doing an encoder?
< JEEB> they're just using HM as far as I can see
< JEEB> using it as a lib
<@BBB> so what are they using his code for then?
< JEEB> they're using it as the decoder it seems
<@BBB> maybe hm is too slow
< smarter> nop, they're doing a decoder for http://orcc.sourceforge.net/
...
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